Question:
As mentioned before, Creation and evolution go hand in hand. Do you mean the word creation …. well maybe. If you mean biblical creation – nonsense! Biblical Creation and evolution can go hand in hand by a scientific stand point to tie up the "theory of evolutions" loose ends that scientists cannot explain. All one has to do is to use all knowledge of mankind at his disposal, without throwing out a vast amount of it, dismissing it as fairy tales and fallasies.
Creationism and ToE can go hand in hand, but wont be accepted by any one with a scientific mind. You don’t supply answers for the holes. YOU SEARCH FOR THE TRUTH not what makes you feel complete. Scientists are comfortable with the holes, more to work on. Scientists aren’t comfortable with half- assed answeres to questions with realy truth behind them. One cannot be truthfully explained without the other. Science has done quite well explaing things without needing (or finiding evidence for) a god! Science is as baffled at this Creation and evolution thing today as it was a hundred years ago. Many scientists, who are Christian, are turning to the Bible for answers to loose ends in the "theory of evolution".
Because those "scientists" are cowards — can’t accept reality (that we are still ignorant). Not having answers to all of the questions does not make creationism true. It means more must be discovered, not fabricated. If it were so, then one or the other would have overtaken the world with little or know question whatsoever. Bull shit! Science has answers — plenty of them. Science has many loose ends that cannot be explained without God or the Biblical history.
Can not be explained by ignorant fearfull theists who *need* god inorder to live a good life. Science does not have ALL the answers, and never will.
Does that make god or you religion true? NO!!!!!!! Because it dismisses too many facts leaving a lot of unanswered questions and loose ends that cannot be explained any other way except with God.
How did earth form? — god. How did Columbus find the americas? — god. How does my computer work? — god. How did I find my keys this morning? — god. Just because I may not know how my computer works, the earth formed, or how I found my keys doesn’t mean that god did it. It means that I am not knowledgable or rational enough to conclude an intelligent answer. And the same goes for humanity in general. We can’t explain everythign (as you pointed out many times) and the reason is because we are still too ignorant and have not found the answers, not that god is responsible. Science is STILL based in reality, facts and evidence; creationism is still based in fables and fairy tales. With a mentality like this, it is a wonder you made it out of Kindergarten.
Rather than ridculing, point out where his logic is wrong. And, by the way, his logic is not wrong. Creationsim has no evidence, it has NEVER been witnessed anywhere, ever. It has less credibility than evolution. (here is the point where you respond with one of your pointless pseudo- insults rather than addressing the issue)
Response:
Why, my friend, are you waiting for your next athesistic laugh? You appear to live and devote your entire life to making jokes, so I would guess that you are.
Don’t try to make judgments about someone’s "entire life" based on a few USENET posts. It makes you look ridiculous. Jon
Response:
You obviously don’t understand human nature very well. I understand human nature better than YOU will ever know.
How do you know? I might have a degree in sociology or philosophy. Maybe I have been to dozens of countrys or studied anthropolgy under eminent professors and philosophers. You don’t know so don’t assume that I can’t know as much, or more, about human nature than you do. (*christian arrogance* : I know best) Evolution is a fact of reality for life, planetary formation, and the development of the universe. The "theory of evolution", which it still is, is still chopped up with many holes like swiss cheese, and remains to have too many unanswered questions in it.
I didn’t use evolution in the context of human evolution. I used it to represent the process of change. There is a process to the formation of planets, solar systems, minerals and life. You can’t disagree that formation has a process can you? Evolution is merely change, thats all. And I already have a clue from what you have written that you are not very familiar with scientific procedures. A theory, as it is used in the SCIENTIFIC sense is a formula or construct that has successfuly stood up to all tests, but has not found the single piece of proof that makes it a law. Simliar to proving a mathematical formula. Some formulas can describe a set of numbers from x to any number you care to crunch. But since numbers go to infity you cant say that since the fromula works for the first billion numbers it must work for all. Same with evolution. Everything that we can test it with, genetics, diseases, speciation, etc.. it stands up to it. But since no one was around 100million years ago we can’t say for certain evolution worked the same way then. We can say though that from this poitn on evolution seems to work. I have studied evolution for a few years now, under intellgient professors, and all of these holes you speak of are not realy there. These holes are only visible to ignorant uneducated people. Once you have studied evolution you not just find it to be logical but rather mundane in its process. (I am not implying that you are uneducated or ignorant in these matters and I really don’t care.) If evolution was accepted by everyone then creationism will become a fairy tale. Creation will never become a fairy tale to anyone except the atheists who seek to destroy humanity at all costs.
Creationism will become a fairy tale once people stop believing in it. Just as Zeus, Ra and all of those old world gods have become. Once there is no one to believe in somethign it no longer exists. And on my weekends I, sit in a dark room clutching a glass of brandy planing world domination… give me a break man. Atheists aren’t trying to destroy humanity, every religion, every culture has individuals who cause negative repricussion on society. If you really wish to single out atheists as if EVER ONE OF THEM wanted to take away your freedoms and destroy your culture then give me a half an hour and I will be able to pull up a hundred sources saying the same about any religion. I recomend we do not go down this path of blame.. it never gets us anywhere. Our spontaneous creation by god is the fundamental cornerstone of christianity and many other religions. If we no longer were intentionally created, but instead evolved from other life forms, religions would completely loose any foundation it may have. This is why there is such resistance to evolution, not that it requires creationsim, but people are too scared to be wrong. Another reply that is wrought with loopholes and falasies using methods that still have work to be done to prove the atheist theory that the "theory of evolution" is the key to the beginnings of the human race.
Please point out my loopholes in the previous paragraph. I will break it down for you to make it simpler. 1. Creationsim is a foundation of Christianity (True / False)? 2. Evolution says creationsim is b.s. and we evolved from simpler life forms (True / False)? 3. IF EVOLUTION IS TRUE then we are no longer spontaneously created by god. (True / False)? 4. If our existence is nothing more than chance, then we have no more purpose than any other creature (True / False)? 5. If we are no longer special then christianity will loose its strongest cornerstone (True / False)? You still haven’t proven a thing.
I never had any intention to prove anything. Do you?
Response:
You obviously don’t understand human nature very well. I understand human nature better than YOU will ever know. I have lived it as well as studied the human mind from the best perspective that one can study anything. So believe what you will, it is your right in a free society.
Huh. What exactly is the best perspective that one can study anything? It seems to me that someone convinced that their perspective is "best" probably doesn’t have much interest in perspective at all. Evolution is a fact of reality for life, planetary formation, and the development of the universe. The "theory of evolution", which it still is, is still chopped up with many holes like swiss cheese, and remains to have too many unanswered questions in it.
Therein lies its beauty. For some reason, people are attracted to neat little answers that can be expressed in sound bites. But if an answer is too easy, it’s probably not true. The theory of evolution doesn’t boil down to a sound bite. It’s an ongoing, fluid attempt to answer questions about the origin of different species on Earth. These issues are not simple. Ancient Greeks believed lightning could be explained in a sound bite: "Zeus is throwing bolts from the sky." It turned out that lightning was the result of incredibly complex electrical dynamics between the earth and suspended clouds of water vapor, which I am at a loss to explain fully. Research into this matter continues today: the Japanese have built a supercomputer the likes of which has never been seen, dedicated to running large-scale weather and geological simulations. In the middle ages, another prevailing belief was also a sound bite: "The heavens rotate around the earth." No dice. Galileo observed that orbits did not follow this pattern. Kepler attempted to devise a system of mathematics to describe planetary motion. It was on the right track, but wrong. Newton attempted further explanation, which proved insightful but incomplete. Einstein’s theories of general relativity, years after his death, proved useful in explaining certain orbital anomalies. Research into orbits and gravitation continues today: NASA is engaged in a study of gravitational libration points – often-unstable areas where gravitational forces cancel each other out and leave a net sum of zero. I am unwilling to believe that the sound bite: "God created all the animals and humans as they are" could have any more validity than those. The origin of life, and the origin of species, are incredibly complex issues, which deserve our full attention and study. Attempts to reduce evolution to a sound bite, like "Species evolve through natural selection" or "Man descended from monkeys", mistakenly render it as ridiculous as any other sound bite. That’s not what evolution is about. Evolution is about inductive research: gather evidence, form theories, test those theories. It is an ongoing, incomplete process. If evolution was accepted by everyone then creationism will become a fairy tale. Creation will never become a fairy tale to anyone except the atheists who seek to destroy humanity at all costs.
That’s not really a fair statement: those atheists I know are dedicated to preserving humanity at all costs. Some creationists, on the other hand, are eagerly anticipating the end of the world. Our spontaneous creation by god is the fundamental cornerstone of christianity and many other religions. If we no longer were intentionally created, but instead evolved from other life forms, religions would completely loose any foundation it may have. This is why there is such resistance to evolution, not that it requires creationsim, but people are too scared to be wrong. Another reply that is wrought with loopholes and falasies using methods that still have work to be done to prove the atheist theory that the "theory of evolution" is the key to the beginnings of the human race. You still haven’t proven a thing.
I think, in life, you will find that it’s nearly impossible to prove anything at all. But that doesn’t give us carte blanche to write our own stories and ignore the world around us. Jon
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I found the following a long time ago and could not help but read it again to better understand why God exists. After looking at the world around me, it is obvious because man needs all the help he can get to not blow up the world for his own pleasur like a little child with a temper tantrum. And going out on our own away from God, that is exactly what we have become; little children with a bad temper and a lust for all the possessions we can get. Well, happy reading and I hope this helps someone out there find a new understanding of who Jesus is and why God does exists. … When will you publish your next paper, Doctor Freud? Why, my friend, are you waiting for your next athesistic laugh? You appear to live and devote your entire life to making jokes, so I would guess that you are.
He’s got to do something during this LONG wait for one of you creationist assholes to present ANY valid evidence to support your claims!
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you’re looking for proof that God exists in the Bible, forget it! If you search for a thing from the wrong POINT OF VIEW, you will never prove a thing. Try a different approach. This philosophy goes along with anything in life, and not limited to religious nature. I will let your intelligent and scientific mind find that approach for yourself. It is the only fair thing to do in order to keep you from feeling utterly USELESS. God is truly beyond our human comprehension, and to box in, narrowly define and limit God to a book is totally asinine. Man, in all of his infinite wisdom, has already tried to place God in a box, with little success, I might add to the point of limiting him in almost every aspect of human life. God is still in control of this world, whether we care to believe or not. Let me picture it this way for you. If Jesus had come off of the cross at Calvary by divine power, what would the world be doing today?
Getting beaten like DOGS by Him….. Paul – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ponder over this question for a while and get back with me. Emails welcome, and are subject to use by me in whatever way that I see fit. Deletion is possible. So – since you cannot prove god exists, there is no valid reason to assume god exists! So, my friend, have you proven that God doesn’t exist? That is the other question I pose tonight. You have yet to do so in any form whatsoever, except to argue over trivial things because you appear to enjoy it. Oh, by the way, God is only unprovable to those who cannot, or will not believe. Shalom, Bill But the Bible is God’s Word for us to live by. You haven’t proven god exists – so any claims about the bible are meaningless! You have not proven that God doesn’t exist, so any claims that your infinite wisdom have presented are TOTALLY MEANINGLESS. Good night, and may God bless your life forever. Edgar
Response:
Unscientific, non-reality based opinion.
Yes, that is exactly where your mentality has lead you. Christianity and the belief in Creation is very scientific if looked about in the right way. How? Banging your head agasint the wall for a day, and then taking a double dose of LSD? You can only look at science in a scientific way!
A pity. Limited mentality in your case is very dangerous. How much LSD have you taken in a lifetime? There might be a few missing or dead brain cells. As mentioned before, Creation and evolution go hand in hand. Do you mean the word creation …. well maybe. If you mean biblical creation – nonsense!
Biblical Creation and evolution can go hand in hand by a scientific stand point to tie up the "theory of evolutions" loose ends that scientists cannot explain. All one has to do is to use all knowledge of mankind at his disposal, without throwing out a vast amount of it, dismissing it as fairy tales and fallasies. One cannot be truthfully explained without the other. Science has done quite well explaing things without needing (or finiding evidence for) a god!
Science is as baffled at this Creation and evolution thing today as it was a hundred years ago. Many scientists, who are Christian, are turning to the Bible for answers to loose ends in the "theory of evolution". If it were so, then one or the other would have overtaken the world with little or know question whatsoever. Bull shit! Science has answers — plenty of them.
Science has many loose ends that cannot be explained without God or the Biblical history. Science does not have ALL the answers, and never will.
Because it dismisses too many facts leaving a lot of unanswered questions and loose ends that cannot be explained any other way except with God. Science is STILL based in reality, facts and evidence; creationism is still based in fables and fairy tales.
With a mentality like this, it is a wonder you made it out of Kindergarten. Today, that age old debate still rages on, and on, and on. The debate is over. Unfortunately that does not stop ignorance from trying to spread.
As long as atheists and non-believers persist, ignorance will persist in the world, and scientific questions will go unanswered forever. When you take away a part of history, gaps begin to form, and holes in theories keep them as that, just theories. We will never fully understand until we accept reality that God does exist in this universe and all around us. I will accept that reality the moment you PROVE that reality! You haven’t, you won’t, you can’t! You can no more prove YOUR god than the acient Romans and Greeks could prove their multiple gods!
And I will except your reality the moment you can PROVE your theories without you eliminating many facts of human history. It still hasn’t been done by the all-knowing, all-powerful atheists and non-believers. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – BTW….there is a born again, fundamentalist christian in the White House who, it appears, is just like the arrogant, selfish and uncontrollable child you describe. Funny, I know that G.W. is a Christian, and to my belief has handled this crisin we are in quite well. I assume you mean crisis. He CREATED this crisis, by handling a situation like a moron! he is no longer concerned (interested?) in bin Laden (the man who caluse the tragedy) and is now trying to engage us in an invasion of a nation that has little, if anything, to do with 9/11!
And if you have concrete proof of this, then why don’t you excercise your rights in this nation and head up an impeachment procedure to remove him from office. With your infinite wisdom, you do know that you can do that? Of course you did. Even better than I believed at first as he rushed off to start a war. But he has not blasted Iraq out of existence because he knows that Saddam is waiting for him or someone to do just that so he can pounce like a waiting cat stalking its prey. Saddam wants the US to go rushing in blindly bombing Iraq and the innocent peoples so he can look very good in the eyes of the world. If you cannot see this, you are blind as a bat. Iraq has nothing to do qith 9/11. It is ENTIRELY a Bush corrupt, incompetent, political move!
And you have concrete proof of this? We are dealing with a maniac in this little nation of Iraq that would sell his own grandmother for a buck, and a chance to remain in power, as would many Americans, if not all. Do you have concrete proof that he was NOT supplying weapons to terrorists factions of the Muslim religion of Islam? If so, present it. I am sure the state department, as well as the president would like to see it as well, or are you as a Darwinian evolutionist used to hiding, withholding, destroying, or discarding the facts? Bush and his administration have handled this situation very well despite how it started out. So why is he no longer interested in the man that caused the death of thousands of Americans?
And you have privy information on the inside of his mind that the rest of us are not privy to? Enlighten us so we can believe too. If war is to be, then it has to be and will be time, but no sooner, or not a minute later. Read Ecclesiastes 3:1-8. If you have a Bible, look it up and read it.
You can acquire a Bible at any retail store, book store, or library. It would be a useful tool for you to broaden your search for the truth. War does not have to be … that’s deranged. You bible quotes mean nothing!
The Bible is God’s plan, our guide, and a book that is good for discipline, wisdom, finances, moral values, history, psychology, families, education, medical, and much, much more. You should try reading it sometimes. A lot of your questions and falasies in your beliefs could be answered. The loopholes that you believe in could become closed, and your intelligence might be greatly improved. So you see, God has allowed mankind a time for everything that is under heaven. What god? You haven’t proven ANY god!
I took the liberty of writing this for you all to see it for yourself and that I am not making it up. No one accused you of making up the bible; just that the bible (YOUR religous beliefs) are based on fables and fairy tales – not fact!
are just fairy tales? Interesting. The kingdoms and peoples that existed in the past, and the past in general, are all just fairy tales. An interesting concept of our World History, you should write silently I smile with a smirking grin! I have given you the scriptures to view it for yourselves which is a very good practice rather than taking ones word for it as many people in our history have done due to illiteracy which reigned supreme and gave many religious leaders power to control their lives for a long, long time. Your "scriptures" mean nothing! They are a part of your religion – not the real world!
Christ and Christianity are as much a part of the real world as dinosaurs, man, and all that is in it. Your philosophy is so full of holes that it can never possibly hold water (or anything else). I see you didn’t post the scriptures, but you left the place where they could be found in the only book that has withstood the test of time. God does exist, and if you open your eyes, ears, and mind, you can see him too, in all of his glory. Happy reading and may God richly bless you for doing this. My eyes, ears and mind are always open … to evidence. You have none; only religious babbling!
As is your babbling about things that you cannot prove. My eyes, ears, and mind are too always open to everything and not just bits and pieces I choose for my own. I am open to science, Creation, Evolution, God, Heaven, Hell, witchcraft and occult, and much, much more, because I believe that all of it plays a vital part of our human history and ancestry. Atheists and non-believers, however, discard and dismiss parts of it and thus limits our history, knowledge, and understanding. Atheists are as the Liberals of our democratic society here in America. They only see what they wish to see, and dismiss the rest as "fairy tales". That blows your whole delusion to bits! It does nothing to anything as you have not yet proven that God doesn’t exist. You haven’t shown one shred of evidence god does exist! The burden is yours.
A typical atheistic cop out. The burden also rest upon yourself. You have an infinite wisdom, use it without deleting the facts of history and removing them from the eyes and ears of our children to prove that God doesnt’ exist. Until I see it, I will always believe that GOD DOES EXIST regardless of what fractured evidence you might present Of course you can’t, so I don’t have to worry. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Try giving the real Jesus a try and step away from your denominalational Jesus. You will see the difference for once in your life. I did, and he has helped me through some of the toughest times of my life. You also cannot explain away the miracles that still happen today as we go through this life. So give God a try
… read more »
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You obviously don’t understand human nature very well. I understand human nature better than YOU will ever know. I have lived it as well as studied the human mind from the best perspective that one can study anything. So believe what you will, it is your right in a free society. Evolution is a fact of reality for life, planetary formation, and the development of the universe. The "theory of evolution", which it still is, is still chopped up with many holes like swiss cheese, and remains to have too many unanswered questions in it. If evolution was accepted by everyone then creationism will become a fairy tale. Creation will never become a fairy tale to anyone except the atheists who seek to destroy humanity at all costs. Our spontaneous creation by god is the fundamental cornerstone of christianity and many other religions. If we no longer were intentionally created, but instead evolved from other life forms, religions would completely loose any foundation it may have. This is why there is such resistance to evolution, not that it requires creationsim, but people are too scared to be wrong. Another reply that is wrought with loopholes and falasies using methods that still have work to be done to prove the atheist theory that the "theory of evolution" is the key to the beginnings of the human race. You still haven’t proven a thing.
Neither have you. Cosmopolite God delights in diversity.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you’re looking for proof that God exists in the Bible, forget it! God is truly beyond our human comprehension, and to box in, narrowly define and limit God to a book is totally asinine. So – since you cannot prove god exists, there is no valid reason to assume god exists! Shalom, Bill But the Bible is God’s Word for us to live by. You haven’t proven god exists – so any claims about the bible are meaningless!
I second this one
Response:
Unscientific, non-reality based opinion. Christianity and the belief in Creation is very scientific if looked about in the right way. As mentioned before, Creation and evolution go hand in hand. One cannot be truthfully explained without the other. If it were so, then one or the other would have overtaken the world with little or know question whatsoever. Today, that age old debate still rages on, and on, and on. We will never fully understand until we accept reality that God does exist in this universe and all around us.
I thout the age old question was Wich came first the chican or the egg – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – BTW….there is a born again, fundamentalist christian in the White House who, it appears, is just like the arrogant, selfish and uncontrollable child you describe. Funny, I know that G.W. is a Christian, and to my belief has handled this crisin we are in quite well. Even better than I believed at first as he rushed off to start a war. But he has not blasted Iraq out of existence because he knows that Saddam is waiting for him or someone to do just that so he can pounce like a waiting cat stalking its prey. Saddam wants the US to go rushing in blindly bombing Iraq and the innocent peoples so he can look very good in the eyes of the world. If you cannot see this, you are blind as a bat. Bush and his administration have handled this situation very well despite how it started out. If war is to be, then it has to be and will be time, but no sooner, or not a minute later. Read Ecclesiastes 3:1-8. If you have a Bible, look it up and read it. 1. "To everything there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven. 2. A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted; 3. A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up; 4. A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance; 5. A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain form embracing; 6. A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away. 7. A time rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak; 8. A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace." So you see, God has allowed mankind a time for everything that is under heaven. I took the liberty of writing this for you all to see it for yourself and that I am not making it up. I have given you the scriptures to view it for yourselves which is a very good practice rather than taking ones word for it as many people in our history have done due to illiteracy which reigned supreme and gave many religious leaders power to control their lives for a long, long time. God does exist, and if you open your eyes, ears, and mind, you can see him too, in all of his glory. Happy reading and may God richly bless you for doing this. That blows your whole delusion to bits! It does nothing to anything as you have not yet proven that God doesn’t exist. Try giving the real Jesus a try and step away from your denominalational Jesus. You will see the difference for once in your life. I did, and he has helped me through some of the toughest times of my life. You also cannot explain away the miracles that still happen today as we go through this life. So give God a try through Jesus Christ.
Response:
If you’re looking for proof that God exists in the Bible, forget it!
If you search for a thing from the wrong POINT OF VIEW, you will never prove a thing. Try a different approach. This philosophy goes along with anything in life, and not limited to religious nature. I will let your intelligent and scientific mind find that approach for yourself. It is the only fair thing to do in order to keep you from feeling utterly USELESS. God is truly beyond our human comprehension, and to box in, narrowly define and limit God to a book is totally asinine.
Man, in all of his infinite wisdom, has already tried to place God in a box, with little success, I might add to the point of limiting him in almost every aspect of human life. God is still in control of this world, whether we care to believe or not. Let me picture it this way for you. If Jesus had come off of the cross at Calvary by divine power, what would the world be doing today? Ponder over this question for a while and get back with me. Emails welcome, and are subject to use by me in whatever way that I see fit. Deletion is possible. So – since you cannot prove god exists, there is no valid reason to assume god exists!
So, my friend, have you proven that God doesn’t exist? That is the other question I pose tonight. You have yet to do so in any form whatsoever, except to argue over trivial things because you appear to enjoy it. Oh, by the way, God is only unprovable to those who cannot, or will not believe. Shalom, Bill But the Bible is God’s Word for us to live by. You haven’t proven god exists – so any claims about the bible are meaningless!
You have not proven that God doesn’t exist, so any claims that your infinite wisdom have presented are TOTALLY MEANINGLESS. Good night, and may God bless your life forever. Edgar
Response:
Unscientific, non-reality based opinion. Christianity and the belief in Creation is very scientific if looked about in the right way. As mentioned before, Creation and evolution go hand in hand. One cannot be truthfully explained without the other. If it were so, then one or the other would have overtaken the world with little or know question whatsoever.
You obviously don’t understand human nature very well. Evolution is a fact of reality for life, planetary formation, and the development of the universe. If evolution was accepted by everyone then creationism will become a fairy tale. Our spontaneous creation by god is the fundamental cornerstone of christianity and many other religions. If we no longer were intentionally created, but instead evolved from other life forms, religions would completely loose any foundation it may have. This is why there is such resistance to evolution, not that it requires creationsim, but people are too scared to be wrong.
Response:
I found the following a long time ago and could not help but read it again to better understand why God exists. After looking at the world around me, it is obvious because man needs all the help he can get to not blow up the world for his own pleasur like a little child with a temper tantrum. And going out on our own away from God, that is exactly what we have become; little children with a bad temper and a lust for all the possessions we can get. Well, happy reading and I hope this helps someone out there find a new understanding of who Jesus is and why God does exists. … When will you publish your next paper, Doctor Freud?
Why, my friend, are you waiting for your next athesistic laugh? You appear to live and devote your entire life to making jokes, so I would guess that you are.
Response:
You obviously don’t understand human nature very well.
I understand human nature better than YOU will ever know. I have lived it as well as studied the human mind from the best perspective that one can study anything. So believe what you will, it is your right in a free society. Evolution is a fact of reality for life, planetary formation, and the development of the universe.
The "theory of evolution", which it still is, is still chopped up with many holes like swiss cheese, and remains to have too many unanswered questions in it. If evolution was accepted by everyone then creationism will become a fairy tale.
Creation will never become a fairy tale to anyone except the atheists who seek to destroy humanity at all costs. Our spontaneous creation by god is the fundamental cornerstone of christianity and many other religions. If we no longer were intentionally created, but instead evolved from other life forms, religions would completely loose any foundation it may have. This is why there is such resistance to evolution, not that it requires creationsim, but people are too scared to be wrong.
Another reply that is wrought with loopholes and falasies using methods that still have work to be done to prove the atheist theory that the "theory of evolution" is the key to the beginnings of the human race. You still haven’t proven a thing.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Unscientific, non-reality based opinion. Christianity and the belief in Creation is very scientific if looked about in the right way. As mentioned before, Creation and evolution go hand in hand. One cannot be truthfully explained without the other. If it were so, then one or the other would have overtaken the world with little or know question whatsoever. Today, that age old debate still rages on, and on, and on. We will never fully understand until we accept reality that God does exist in this universe and all around us. BTW….there is a born again, fundamentalist christian in the White House who, it appears, is just like the arrogant, selfish and uncontrollable child you describe. Funny, I know that G.W. is a Christian, and to my belief has handled this crisin we are in quite well. Even better than I believed at first as he rushed off to start a war. But he has not blasted Iraq out of existence because he knows that Saddam is waiting for him or someone to do just that so he can pounce like a waiting cat stalking its prey. Saddam wants the US to go rushing in blindly bombing Iraq and the innocent peoples so he can look very good in the eyes of the world. If you cannot see this, you are blind as a bat. Bush and his administration have handled this situation very well despite how it started out. If war is to be, then it has to be and will be time, but no sooner, or not a minute later. Read Ecclesiastes 3:1-8. If you have a Bible, look it up and read it. 1. "To everything there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven. 2. A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted; 3. A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up; 4. A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance; 5. A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain form embracing; 6. A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away. 7. A time rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak; 8. A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace." So you see, God has allowed mankind a time for everything that is under heaven. I took the liberty of writing this for you all to see it for yourself and that I am not making it up. I have given you the scriptures to view it for yourselves which is a very good practice rather than taking ones word for it as many people in our history have done due to illiteracy which reigned supreme and gave many religious leaders power to control their lives for a long, long time. God does exist, and if you open your eyes, ears, and mind, you can see him too, in all of his glory. Happy reading and may God richly bless you for doing this. That blows your whole delusion to bits! It does nothing to anything as you have not yet proven that God doesn’t exist. Try giving the real Jesus a try and step away from your denominalational Jesus. You will see the difference for once in your life. I did, and he has helped me through some of the toughest times of my life. You also cannot explain away the miracles that still happen today as we go through this life. So give God a try through Jesus Christ. Please explain the " miracles " that are mentioned above. Cosmopolite God delights in diversity.
Miracles are the christians way of spells and wichcraft but they say it is richas and thusfore Good
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you’re looking for proof that God exists in the Bible, forget it! God is truly beyond our human comprehension, and to box in, narrowly define and limit God to a book is totally asinine. Shalom, Bill But the Bible is God’s Word for us to live by. It is a guidebook, a book of discipline, a history book, a psychology book, as well as a book of prophesy that explains things that many an adult cannot fathom or come anywhere close to understanding. Why? Because most seculiar humans are looking at God from a worldly point of view without ever knowing him personally. In this way, he becomes ever elusive seeking out only those who believe by faith and ask Jesus for forgiveness of their sins, for it is this man Jesus who has bridged the gap between God and man over the great divide of sin that separates the two. Without him, despite what many atheists, wiccans, and non-believers would say, no one will see the Father in heaven. Thank you for your time in allowing me to respond to this post. May God bless you in your life forever.
the bible is nothing more than a fictianal noval created buy people with a need to hide ther lust for money ,power,and pleshur
Response:
Unscientific, non-reality based opinion. Christianity and the belief in Creation is very scientific if looked about in the right way.
How? Banging your head agasint the wall for a day, and then taking a double dose of LSD? You can only look at science in a scientific way! As mentioned before, Creation and evolution go hand in hand.
Do you mean the word creation …. well maybe. If you mean biblical creation – nonsense! One cannot be truthfully explained without the other.
Science has done quite well explaing things without needing (or finiding evidence for) a god! If it were so, then one or the other would have overtaken the world with little or know question whatsoever.
Bull shit! Science has answers — plenty of them. Science does not have ALL the answers, and never will. Science is STILL based in reality, facts and evidence; creationism is still based in fables and fairy tales. Today, that age old debate still rages on, and on, and on.
The debate is over. Unfortunately that does not stop ignorance from trying to spread. We will never fully understand until we accept reality that God does exist in this universe and all around us.
I will accept that reality the moment you PROVE that reality! You haven’t, you won’t, you can’t! You can no more prove YOUR god than the acient Romans and Greeks could prove their multiple gods! BTW….there is a born again, fundamentalist christian in the White House who, it appears, is just like the arrogant, selfish and uncontrollable child you describe. Funny, I know that G.W. is a Christian, and to my belief has handled this crisin we are in quite well.
I assume you mean crisis. He CREATED this crisis, by handling a situation like a moron! he is no longer concerned (interested?) in bin Laden (the man who caluse the tragedy) and is now trying to engage us in an invasion of a nation that has little, if anything, to do with 9/11! Even better than I believed at first as he rushed off to start a war. But he has not blasted Iraq out of existence because he knows that Saddam is waiting for him or someone to do just that so he can pounce like a waiting cat stalking its prey. Saddam wants the US to go rushing in blindly bombing Iraq and the innocent peoples so he can look very good in the eyes of the world. If you cannot see this, you are blind as a bat.
Iraq has nothing to do qith 9/11. It is ENTIRELY a Bush corrupt, incompetent, political move! Bush and his administration have handled this situation very well despite how it started out.
So why is he no longer interested in the man that caused the death of thousands of Americans? If war is to be, then it has to be and will be time, but no sooner, or not a minute later. Read Ecclesiastes 3:1-8. If you have a Bible, look it up and read it.
War does not have to be … that’s deranged. You bible quotes mean nothing! So you see, God has allowed mankind a time for everything that is under heaven.
What god? You haven’t proven ANY god! I took the liberty of writing this for you all to see it for yourself and that I am not making it up.
No one accused you of making up the bible; just that the bible (YOUR religous beliefs) are based on fables and fairy tales – not fact! I have given you the scriptures to view it for yourselves which is a very good practice rather than taking ones word for it as many people in our history have done due to illiteracy which reigned supreme and gave many religious leaders power to control their lives for a long, long time.
Your "scriptures" mean nothing! They are a part of your religion – not the real world! God does exist, and if you open your eyes, ears, and mind, you can see him too, in all of his glory. Happy reading and may God richly bless you for doing this.
My eyes, ears and mind are always open … to evidence. You have none; only religious babbling! That blows your whole delusion to bits! It does nothing to anything as you have not yet proven that God doesn’t exist.
You haven’t shown one shred of evidence god does exist! The burden is yours. Try giving the real Jesus a try and step away from your denominalational Jesus. You will see the difference for once in your life. I did, and he has helped me through some of the toughest times of my life. You also cannot explain away the miracles that still happen today as we go through this life. So give God a try through Jesus Christ.
The very moment you provide evidence! and don’t even think about that insane crap that I have to try it first in order to believe! All that says is I have to be brainwashed into learning that what I’m being brainwashed about is true!
Response:
I found the following a long time ago and could not help but read it again to better understand why God exists. After looking at the world around me, it is obvious because man needs all the help he can get to not blow up the world for his own pleasur like a little child with a temper tantrum. And going out on our own away from God, that is exactly what we have become; little children with a bad temper and a lust for all the possessions we can get. Well, happy reading and I hope this helps someone out there find a new understanding of who Jesus is and why God does exists.
Unscientific, non-reality based opinion. BTW….there is a born again, fundamentalist christian in the White House who, it appears, is just like the arrogant, selfish and uncontrollable child you describe. That blows your whole delusion to bits!
Response:
If you’re looking for proof that God exists in the Bible, forget it! God is truly beyond our human comprehension, and to box in, narrowly define and limit God to a book is totally asinine. Shalom, Bill
But the Bible is God’s Word for us to live by. It is a guidebook, a book of discipline, a history book, a psychology book, as well as a book of prophesy that explains things that many an adult cannot fathom or come anywhere close to understanding. Why? Because most seculiar humans are looking at God from a worldly point of view without ever knowing him personally. In this way, he becomes ever elusive seeking out only those who believe by faith and ask Jesus for forgiveness of their sins, for it is this man Jesus who has bridged the gap between God and man over the great divide of sin that separates the two. Without him, despite what many atheists, wiccans, and non-believers would say, no one will see the Father in heaven. Thank you for your time in allowing me to respond to this post. May God bless you in your life forever.
Response:
Unscientific, non-reality based opinion.
Christianity and the belief in Creation is very scientific if looked about in the right way. As mentioned before, Creation and evolution go hand in hand. One cannot be truthfully explained without the other. If it were so, then one or the other would have overtaken the world with little or know question whatsoever. Today, that age old debate still rages on, and on, and on. We will never fully understand until we accept reality that God does exist in this universe and all around us. BTW….there is a born again, fundamentalist christian in the White House who, it appears, is just like the arrogant, selfish and uncontrollable child you describe.
Funny, I know that G.W. is a Christian, and to my belief has handled this crisin we are in quite well. Even better than I believed at first as he rushed off to start a war. But he has not blasted Iraq out of existence because he knows that Saddam is waiting for him or someone to do just that so he can pounce like a waiting cat stalking its prey. Saddam wants the US to go rushing in blindly bombing Iraq and the innocent peoples so he can look very good in the eyes of the world. If you cannot see this, you are blind as a bat. Bush and his administration have handled this situation very well despite how it started out. If war is to be, then it has to be and will be time, but no sooner, or not a minute later. Read Ecclesiastes 3:1-8. If you have a Bible, look it up and read it. 1. "To everything there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven. 2. A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted; 3. A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up; 4. A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance; 5. A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain form embracing; 6. A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away. 7. A time rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak; 8. A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace." So you see, God has allowed mankind a time for everything that is under heaven. I took the liberty of writing this for you all to see it for yourself and that I am not making it up. I have given you the scriptures to view it for yourselves which is a very good practice rather than taking ones word for it as many people in our history have done due to illiteracy which reigned supreme and gave many religious leaders power to control their lives for a long, long time. God does exist, and if you open your eyes, ears, and mind, you can see him too, in all of his glory. Happy reading and may God richly bless you for doing this. That blows your whole delusion to bits!
It does nothing to anything as you have not yet proven that God doesn’t exist. Try giving the real Jesus a try and step away from your denominalational Jesus. You will see the difference for once in your life. I did, and he has helped me through some of the toughest times of my life. You also cannot explain away the miracles that still happen today as we go through this life. So give God a try through Jesus Christ.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Unscientific, non-reality based opinion. Christianity and the belief in Creation is very scientific if looked about in the right way. As mentioned before, Creation and evolution go hand in hand. One cannot be truthfully explained without the other. If it were so, then one or the other would have overtaken the world with little or know question whatsoever. Today, that age old debate still rages on, and on, and on. We will never fully understand until we accept reality that God does exist in this universe and all around us. BTW….there is a born again, fundamentalist christian in the White House who, it appears, is just like the arrogant, selfish and uncontrollable child you describe. Funny, I know that G.W. is a Christian, and to my belief has handled this crisin we are in quite well. Even better than I believed at first as he rushed off to start a war. But he has not blasted Iraq out of existence because he knows that Saddam is waiting for him or someone to do just that so he can pounce like a waiting cat stalking its prey. Saddam wants the US to go rushing in blindly bombing Iraq and the innocent peoples so he can look very good in the eyes of the world. If you cannot see this, you are blind as a bat. Bush and his administration have handled this situation very well despite how it started out. If war is to be, then it has to be and will be time, but no sooner, or not a minute later. Read Ecclesiastes 3:1-8. If you have a Bible, look it up and read it. 1. "To everything there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven. 2. A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted; 3. A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up; 4. A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance; 5. A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain form embracing; 6. A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away. 7. A time rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak; 8. A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace." So you see, God has allowed mankind a time for everything that is under heaven. I took the liberty of writing this for you all to see it for yourself and that I am not making it up. I have given you the scriptures to view it for yourselves which is a very good practice rather than taking ones word for it as many people in our history have done due to illiteracy which reigned supreme and gave many religious leaders power to control their lives for a long, long time. God does exist, and if you open your eyes, ears, and mind, you can see him too, in all of his glory. Happy reading and may God richly bless you for doing this. That blows your whole delusion to bits! It does nothing to anything as you have not yet proven that God doesn’t exist. Try giving the real Jesus a try and step away from your denominalational Jesus. You will see the difference for once in your life. I did, and he has helped me through some of the toughest times of my life. You also cannot explain away the miracles that still happen today as we go through this life. So give God a try through Jesus Christ.
Please explain the " miracles " that are mentioned above. Cosmopolite God delights in diversity.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I found the following a long time ago and could not help but read it again to better understand why God exists. After looking at the world around me, it is obvious because man needs all the help he can get to not blow up the world for his own pleasur like a little child with a temper tantrum. And going out on our own away from God, that is exactly what we have become; little children with a bad temper and a lust for all the possessions we can get. Well, happy reading and I hope this helps someone out there find a new understanding of who Jesus is and why God does exists. Saturday, March 8, 2003: Devotional: Orderliness in our Christian life: Science and Creation together as one: an old concept in a new light: To the Christian, Creation reveals God’s wisdom and power and orderliness. The study of science provides a means for us to get a glimpse of His unfathomable wisdom. The Bible says, "The works of the Lord are great, studied by all who have pleasure in them" (Psalm 111:2). Finding pleasure in the works of God is a legitimate, pure motivation to pursue the study of science. By contrast a humanist, atheist, or agnostic, and non-believer typically looks at science as a means of showing that God is not needed. He next assumes that since God is not needed that it is irrational to believe that He does exist. The scientific method is simply a process which earlier scientists developed in an effort to qualify the order that they observed in the universe. It consists of: 1) developing models, such that the models describe how the universe normally behaves, 2) testing the models in an experiment in order to determine the scopes of their validities, and then 3) modifying the models as necessary to make them more consistent with the observations. Thus, the scientific method is limited to providing us with information in the form of descriptions and measurements. It does not tell us the underlying reasons for anything. The Bible teaches that God is a God of order and not confusion. As a scientist looks at Creation, he not only recognizes orderliness in the structure of things, but his entire system is founded and dependent on its existence. Even the modern field of "chaos theory" is dependent upon observed events which are chaotic from man’s perspective but which still have certain characteristic qualities which render them capable of analysis. Thus, the Christian sees the orderliness of the universe as an outward expression of God’s innate orderliness. In one sense, science does not have the tools to determine this: there is no tool or instrument which can measure the boundaries of Deity, by the very definition of Deity. Yet, science is not necessarily completely silent on the issue either. Let’s consider the origin of life, which the Bible presents as among the greatest of God’s works. I believe that if an attempt is made to reduce the origin of life to purely natural, "scientific" causes, one ends up with nothing but dead ends and contradictions. This may not be what is typically taught by atheists within the science community, but I will attempt to justify this position over the next several chapters. Let’s suppose we can indeed show that one runs into dead ends and contradictions whenever he attempts to explain the origin of life through natural means exclusively, apart from intervention by God. Then we would be left with the only rational explanation for life being that God is its source. This in turn would imply that He exists. Furthermore, the Bible teaches that God considers this to be a valid argument. Therefore, a person should be very, very cautious about discarding it, particularly before he considers carefully the evidence. "The heavens declare the glory of God; and the expanse of heaven shows the work of His hands" (Psalm 19:1). "Let everything that has breath praise the Lord" (Psalm 150:6). . I hope this is helpful to anyone who is struggling with the age old debate of science and religion Creation and Evolution. It can be easily explained if one does not discard any valuable information such as we already know. This valuable information includes the theories that have come before us by the very scientists and theologists who have gone on now to know the truth. They were the forerunners of our own understanding of the universe in which we live whether they were Christian or not. Many still do not believe in the Creation theory, but I have always believed that evolution and Creation can go hand in hand if one accepts the theory of the "order of the universe" and will not discard a valuable variable such as God as fallacy, fantasy, or fairy tales. When we do this, there is a tendency to create confusion among the population as it would be to discard the variable of evolution. The two go hand in hand and should be treated as such. "…..For we trust we have a good conscience, in all things willing to live honestly
If you’re looking for proof that God exists in the Bible, forget it! God is truly beyond our human comprehension, and to box in, narrowly define and limit God to a book is totally asinine. Shalom, Bill
Response:
If you’re looking for proof that God exists in the Bible, forget it! God is truly beyond our human comprehension, and to box in, narrowly define and limit God to a book is totally asinine.
So – since you cannot prove god exists, there is no valid reason to assume god exists! Shalom, Bill But the Bible is God’s Word for us to live by.
You haven’t proven god exists – so any claims about the bible are meaningless!
Response:
I found the following a long time ago and could not help but read it again to better understand why God exists. After looking at the world around me, it is obvious because man needs all the help he can get to not blow up the world for his own pleasur like a little child with a temper tantrum. And going out on our own away from God, that is exactly what we have become; little children with a bad temper and a lust for all the possessions we can get. Well, happy reading and I hope this helps someone out there find a new understanding of who Jesus is and why God does exists.
… When will you publish your next paper, Doctor Freud?
Response:
I found the following a long time ago and could not help but read it again to better understand why God exists. After looking at the world around me, it is obvious because man needs all the help he can get to not blow up the world for his own pleasur like a little child with a temper tantrum. And going out on our own away from God, that is exactly what we have become; little children with a bad temper and a lust for all the possessions we can get. Well, happy reading and I hope this helps someone out there find a new understanding of who Jesus is and why God does exists. Saturday, March 8, 2003: Devotional: Orderliness in our Christian life: Science and Creation together as one: an old concept in a new light: To the Christian, Creation reveals God’s wisdom and power and orderliness. The study of science provides a means for us to get a glimpse of His unfathomable wisdom. The Bible says, "The works of the Lord are great, studied by all who have pleasure in them" (Psalm 111:2). Finding pleasure in the works of God is a legitimate, pure motivation to pursue the study of science. By contrast a humanist, atheist, or agnostic, and non-believer typically looks at science as a means of showing that God is not needed. He next assumes that since God is not needed that it is irrational to believe that He does exist. The scientific method is simply a process which earlier scientists developed in an effort to qualify the order that they observed in the universe. It consists of: 1) developing models, such that the models describe how the universe normally behaves, 2) testing the models in an experiment in order to determine the scopes of their validities, and then 3) modifying the models as necessary to make them more consistent with the observations. Thus, the scientific method is limited to providing us with information in the form of descriptions and measurements. It does not tell us the underlying reasons for anything. The Bible teaches that God is a God of order and not confusion. As a scientist looks at Creation, he not only recognizes orderliness in the structure of things, but his entire system is founded and dependent on its existence. Even the modern field of "chaos theory" is dependent upon observed events which are chaotic from man’s perspective but which still have certain characteristic qualities which render them capable of analysis. Thus, the Christian sees the orderliness of the universe as an outward expression of God’s innate orderliness. In one sense, science does not have the tools to determine this: there is no tool or instrument which can measure the boundaries of Deity, by the very definition of Deity. Yet, science is not necessarily completely silent on the issue either. Let’s consider the origin of life, which the Bible presents as among the greatest of God’s works. I believe that if an attempt is made to reduce the origin of life to purely natural, "scientific" causes, one ends up with nothing but dead ends and contradictions. This may not be what is typically taught by atheists within the science community, but I will attempt to justify this position over the next several chapters. Let’s suppose we can indeed show that one runs into dead ends and contradictions whenever he attempts to explain the origin of life through natural means exclusively, apart from intervention by God. Then we would be left with the only rational explanation for life being that God is its source. This in turn would imply that He exists. Furthermore, the Bible teaches that God considers this to be a valid argument. Therefore, a person should be very, very cautious about discarding it, particularly before he considers carefully the evidence. "The heavens declare the glory of God; and the expanse of heaven shows the work of His hands" (Psalm 19:1). "Let everything that has breath praise the Lord" (Psalm 150:6). . I hope this is helpful to anyone who is struggling with the age old debate of science and religion Creation and Evolution. It can be easily explained if one does not discard any valuable information such as we already know. This valuable information includes the theories that have come before us by the very scientists and theologists who have gone on now to know the truth. They were the forerunners of our own understanding of the universe in which we live whether they were Christian or not. Many still do not believe in the Creation theory, but I have always believed that evolution and Creation can go hand in hand if one accepts the theory of the "order of the universe" and will not discard a valuable variable such as God as fallacy, fantasy, or fairy tales. When we do this, there is a tendency to create confusion among the population as it would be to discard the variable of evolution. The two go hand in hand and should be treated as such. "…..For we trust we have a good conscience, in all things willing to live honestly
Response:
Question:
Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar).
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources) "(The BNN is published four times a year by an international group of investigators working with patients with bipolar disorder to better understand the long-term course and treatment of the illness. The goal of the Network is to help develop new and more effective treatments for bipolar disorder. http://www.bipolarnetwork.org, email: Genetics 378 genetic markers were examined and a linkage was found "between bipolar illness vulnerability and loci on chromosomes 15q14 and 7q11. Lithium Lithium: The literature was reviewed of patients taking lithium long term to patients that discontinued it. "Suicidal acts rose 22-fold, and fatalities increased 14-fold, within the first year after discontinuing the lithium." There are increased cases of goiter in 100 patients taking lithium that was related to dose and duration. This was prevented by thyroxine. Bipolar Disord 1999 Sep;1(1):5-10 Perspectives on lithium treatment of bipolar disorder: action, efficacy, effect on suicidal behavior. Schou M. The Psychiatric Hospital, Risskov, Denmark In bipolar disorder the choice of prophylactic drug must be based on a weighing of efficacy against tolerability, interactions, ease of management, use during pregnancy and lactation, and expense. Lithium should be the preferred prophylactic drug in patients with typical bipolar disorder and in patients who are at high risk of committing suicide, that is, patients with severe depressions or depressions combined with persistent suicidal ideas or with suicide attempts in the past. Antidepressants Mood stabilizers taken with newer (second generation) antidepressants induce mania less than older antidepressants – tricyclics and MAOI. Bupropion (Wellbutrin), sertraline (Zoloft), and venlafaxine (Effexor) are examined in consumers with the bipolar disorder who experience "break through depression," even though medicated. There is a moderate antidepressant response in 33% and a 12% rate of triggering mania in this study of 100 bipolars. Buproprion (Wellbutrin) vs. Desipramine (Norpramin) were studied. The rate of cycling between mania and hypomania was significantly greater in the Desipramine group (37%). Buproprion (13%,p<0.05). Paxil studied in a randomized, controlled six week trial. It was found to be "equally effective for depression breaking through ongoing mood stabilizer treatment as an addition of a second mood stabilizer, typically valproate to lithium, or vice versa." "…the risk of depressive relapse for 27 bipolar patients after antidepressant discontinuation was 67% versus 39% in the 18 patients who" stayed on their antidepressants. Mood Stabilizers The treatment of combining one or more mood stabilizers with an antidepressant to prevent manic episodes, needs to be explored further. "…using the newer antidepressants earlier to supplement mood stabilizers should be considered." New medication and combining medications can produce remarkable improvement. Lamotrigine (Lamictal) Lamotrigine (Lamictal) has assisted many consumers whose illness has not responded to other treatments. (Frye et al, 2000, J Clin Psychopharmacol, in press; Calabrese et al., 1999, J Clin Psychiatry 60: 79-88). Proceed slowly with Lamictal to reduce risk of rash and other side effects. Lamotrigine (Lamictal) was superior to both gabapentin and placebo in a six-week monotherapy trial for refractory patients. 437 outpatient study, double-blind, placebo-controlled; Lamotrigine is equal to desipramine and superior to placebo in unipolar depression. Gabapentin (Neurontin) Gabapentin (Neurontin) is helpful for residual manic and depressive symptoms, but not rapid cycling. Neurontin has better response with patients who are associated with younger age, shorter duration of illness, and lower initial body weight. Gabapentin failed to exceed placebo in an outpatient study of acute mania. Gabapentin is not an effective medication for acute mania. Study: 10 wk., double-blind, placebo-controlled trial dosed between 900 and 3600 mg/day. Gabapentin was "not superior to the placebo for bipolar I symptoms of hypomania, mania, or mixed states." Gabapentin has also been "effective in some anxiety disorders including social phobia and is widely used for adjunctive treatment in pain syndromes." 218 patient study of Gabapentin in the treatment of bipolar disorder shows that if it is "combined with antidepressants, neuroleptics, lithium, and other anticonvulsants, had a high rate of response in combination (69%) and in monotherapy (42%)." Bipolar Disord 1999 Sep;1(1):61-5 Altshuler LL, Keck PE Jr, McElroy SL, Suppes T, Brown ES, Denicoff K, Frye M, Gitlin M, Hwang S, Goodman R, Leverich G, Nolen W, Kupka R, Post R. UCLA Mood Disorders Research Program, UCLA Medical Plaza, CA 90095-7057, USA Gabapentin appears to have acute anti-manic and anti-depressant properties as an adjunctive agent for refractory bipolar illness. Prospective double-blind studies are needed to further delineate its acute efficacy when used as monotherapy and its prophylactic efficacy as monotherapy or in conjuction with other mood stabilizers. Divalproex (Depakote) Divalproex (Depakote) vs. Lithium were both equally effective in 43 patients. The patients that did not respond to Lithium, responded to Depakote and vice versa. "Depakote monotherapy was notably effective in treating depressive symptoms." Topiramate (Topamax) Topiramate (Topamax) find a 56% much or very much improved response in "16 patients after 6 weeks, four of the 16 had unpleasant sense of touch and two had word finding difficulties," in the treatment of bipolar disorder. All patients lost weight at an average of 10 pounds. "Dr. R. McIntyre and colleagues at the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health, Toronto, compared topiramate (50-300 mg/day) to bupropion SR (Wellbutrin, 100-400 mg/day) for eight weeks as adjuncts to mood stabilizers in 26 bipolar out patients with major depression. Both bupropion SR and topiramate showed a significant reduction in depressive symptoms and were not statistically different from each other. No patients switched into a manic episode on either treatment. These preliminary results suggest that topiramate may have comparable antidepressant activity to bupropion SR, a remarkable finding if replicated." Mexiletine (Mexitil) Mexiletine (Mexitil) has anticonvulsant, antiarrhythmic, and analgesic properties. In a study of 13 treatment resistant bipolars at doses from 200 – 1200 mg/day had a full response in 45% of patients. Another study: 8 out of 26 patients treated with Mexiletine had a positive therapeutic effect. ECT (Electro Convulsive Therapy) "…low dose, right unilateral (one-sided) was ineffective in two different studies of major depression (i.e., 23% improvement or 17% improvement respectively). However, high dose right unilateral ECT was as effective as bilateral (two-sided) ECT, and bilateral ECT clearly produced more lasting amnesia and memory defects. (Sackeim et al, 2000; Arch Gen Psychiatry 57: 425-434). rTMS and ECT are generally equally effective in "patients with nondelusional major depression. ECT superior to patients with delusional depression than rTMS. Bipolar Brains Study of 10 bipolar brains during autopsy compared with "11 nonpsychiatric control subjects. Dr. Rajkowska found decreased density of layer 3 in the dorsolateral pre-frontal cortex (Brodman’s area nine), comprised of a decrease in the numbers of pyramidal cells but not other neuronal elements, a decrease in glial cell density, and an increase in glial size." "…bipolar patients showed: 1) decreased dorsolateral prefrontal cortex NAA bilaterally; 2) decreased prefrontal white matter NAA bilaterally; and, 3) increased thalamic NAA bilaterally. These data thus supplement a growing amount of structural imaging data suggesting alterations in size or chemistry of the prefrontal cortex, amygdala, and hippocampus in bipolar patients compared with controls." Neuroleptics Olanzapine (Zyprexa) Olanzapine (Zyprexa) was statistically significantly superior to placebo in the treatment of rapid cycling Bipolar I patients. Bipolar Disord 2000 Sep;2(3 Pt 1):196-9 Ghaemi SN, Cherry EL, Katzow JA, Goodwin FK. Harvard Bipolar Research Program, Massachusetts General Hospital, Consolidated Department of Psychiatry, Boston 02114, USA. "Olanzapine appears to be moderately effective in open add-on treatment in patients with mainly depressive symptoms. Accumulating evidence suggests that olanzapine, and atypical antipsychotics in general, possess mild to moderate adjunctive antidepressant properties." "Dr. R. Baker and co-workers from Lilly Research Laboratories and Harvard Medical School found that in two inpatient double-blind, randomized trials investigating the efficacy of olanzapine for acute mania, worsening of mania occurred more often on placebo than on olanzapine, in contrast to previous reports in open trials that olanzapine induced or exacerbated mania." "Dr. J. Frazier from Harvard Medical School and colleagues conducted a study of olanzapine monotherapy (2.5-20 mg/day) in 23 juvenile bipolar patients (ages 5-14) with mania or mixed symptoms. Sixty-one percent of patients responded, and 22
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I take mine at night as well. I don’t find it making me sleepy though. Carrie
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Gained 5 or 10 pounds, have to take it at night. No, not sleepy at all. I don’t believe there has been any weight gain from it. But I’ve not jumped on the scales and only started Zyprexa last week. Any weight gain for you? That is one side effect that just sucks with some meds! Carrie 
Does it make you sleepy too? Gain any weight? Works well for me, too. This is the best I’ve ever felt in 3 years. I take it with Neurontin. I’m nearly normal and ready to take on the world. Well, some of it. I’ll leave the thorny parts until I’m at my very best. LOL. Carrie 
Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar). http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources)
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Does it make you sleepy too? Gain any weight?
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Works well for me, too. This is the best I’ve ever felt in 3 years. I take it with Neurontin. I’m nearly normal and ready to take on the world. Well, some of it. I’ll leave the thorny parts until I’m at my very best. LOL. Carrie Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar). http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources)
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No, not sleepy at all. I don’t believe there has been any weight gain from it. But I’ve not jumped on the scales and only started Zyprexa last week. Any weight gain for you? That is one side effect that just sucks with some meds! Carrie
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does it make you sleepy too? Gain any weight? Works well for me, too. This is the best I’ve ever felt in 3 years. I take it with Neurontin. I’m nearly normal and ready to take on the world. Well, some of it. I’ll leave the thorny parts until I’m at my very best. LOL. Carrie Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar). http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources)
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Gained 5 or 10 pounds, have to take it at night.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No, not sleepy at all. I don’t believe there has been any weight gain from it. But I’ve not jumped on the scales and only started Zyprexa last week. Any weight gain for you? That is one side effect that just sucks with some meds! Carrie Does it make you sleepy too? Gain any weight? Works well for me, too. This is the best I’ve ever felt in 3 years. I take it with Neurontin. I’m nearly normal and ready to take on the world. Well, some of it. I’ll leave the thorny parts until I’m at my very best. LOL. Carrie Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar). http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources)
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Works well for me, too. This is the best I’ve ever felt in 3 years. I take it with Neurontin. I’m nearly normal and ready to take on the world. Well, some of it. I’ll leave the thorny parts until I’m at my very best. LOL. Carrie
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar). http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources) "(The BNN is published four times a year by an international group of investigators working with patients with bipolar disorder to better understand the long-term course and treatment of the illness. The goal of the Network is to help develop new and more effective treatments for bipolar disorder. http://www.bipolarnetwork.org, email: Genetics 378 genetic markers were examined and a linkage was found "between bipolar illness vulnerability and loci on chromosomes 15q14 and 7q11. Lithium Lithium: The literature was reviewed of patients taking lithium long term to patients that discontinued it. "Suicidal acts rose 22-fold, and fatalities increased 14-fold, within the first year after discontinuing the lithium." There are increased cases of goiter in 100 patients taking lithium that was related to dose and duration. This was prevented by thyroxine. Bipolar Disord 1999 Sep;1(1):5-10 Perspectives on lithium treatment of bipolar disorder: action, efficacy, effect on suicidal behavior. Schou M. The Psychiatric Hospital, Risskov, Denmark In bipolar disorder the choice of prophylactic drug must be based on a weighing of efficacy against tolerability, interactions, ease of management, use during pregnancy and lactation, and expense. Lithium should be the preferred prophylactic drug in patients with typical bipolar disorder and in patients who are at high risk of committing suicide, that is, patients with severe depressions or depressions combined with persistent suicidal ideas or with suicide attempts in the past. Antidepressants Mood stabilizers taken with newer (second generation) antidepressants induce mania less than older antidepressants – tricyclics and MAOI. Bupropion (Wellbutrin), sertraline (Zoloft), and venlafaxine (Effexor) are examined in consumers with the bipolar disorder who experience "break through depression," even though medicated. There is a moderate antidepressant response in 33% and a 12% rate of triggering mania in this study of 100 bipolars. Buproprion (Wellbutrin) vs. Desipramine (Norpramin) were studied. The rate of cycling between mania and hypomania was significantly greater in the Desipramine group (37%). Buproprion (13%,p<0.05). Paxil studied in a randomized, controlled six week trial. It was found to be "equally effective for depression breaking through ongoing mood stabilizer treatment as an addition of a second mood stabilizer, typically valproate to lithium, or vice versa." "…the risk of depressive relapse for 27 bipolar patients after antidepressant discontinuation was 67% versus 39% in the 18 patients who" stayed on their antidepressants. Mood Stabilizers The treatment of combining one or more mood stabilizers with an antidepressant to prevent manic episodes, needs to be explored further. "…using the newer antidepressants earlier to supplement mood stabilizers should be considered." New medication and combining medications can produce remarkable improvement. Lamotrigine (Lamictal) Lamotrigine (Lamictal) has assisted many consumers whose illness has not responded to other treatments. (Frye et al, 2000, J Clin Psychopharmacol, in press; Calabrese et al., 1999, J Clin Psychiatry 60: 79-88). Proceed slowly with Lamictal to reduce risk of rash and other side effects. Lamotrigine (Lamictal) was superior to both gabapentin and placebo in a six-week monotherapy trial for refractory patients. 437 outpatient study, double-blind, placebo-controlled; Lamotrigine is equal to desipramine and superior to placebo in unipolar depression. Gabapentin (Neurontin) Gabapentin (Neurontin) is helpful for residual manic and depressive symptoms, but not rapid cycling. Neurontin has better response with patients who are associated with younger age, shorter duration of illness, and lower initial body weight. Gabapentin failed to exceed placebo in an outpatient study of acute mania. Gabapentin is not an effective medication for acute mania. Study: 10 wk., double-blind, placebo-controlled trial dosed between 900 and 3600 mg/day. Gabapentin was "not superior to the placebo for bipolar I symptoms of hypomania, mania, or mixed states." Gabapentin has also been "effective in some anxiety disorders including social phobia and is widely used for adjunctive treatment in pain syndromes." 218 patient study of Gabapentin in the treatment of bipolar disorder shows that if it is "combined with antidepressants, neuroleptics, lithium, and other anticonvulsants, had a high rate of response in combination (69%) and in monotherapy (42%)." Bipolar Disord 1999 Sep;1(1):61-5 Altshuler LL, Keck PE Jr, McElroy SL, Suppes T, Brown ES, Denicoff K, Frye M, Gitlin M, Hwang S, Goodman R, Leverich G, Nolen W, Kupka R, Post R. UCLA Mood Disorders Research Program, UCLA Medical Plaza, CA 90095-7057, USA Gabapentin appears to have acute anti-manic and anti-depressant properties as an adjunctive agent for refractory bipolar illness. Prospective double-blind studies are needed to further delineate its acute efficacy when used as monotherapy and its prophylactic efficacy as monotherapy or in conjuction with other mood stabilizers. Divalproex (Depakote) Divalproex (Depakote) vs. Lithium were both equally effective in 43 patients. The patients that did not respond to Lithium, responded to Depakote and vice versa. "Depakote monotherapy was notably effective in treating depressive symptoms." Topiramate (Topamax) Topiramate (Topamax) find a 56% much or very much improved response in "16 patients after 6 weeks, four of the 16 had unpleasant sense of touch and two had word finding difficulties," in the treatment of bipolar disorder. All patients lost weight at an average of 10 pounds. "Dr. R. McIntyre and colleagues at the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health, Toronto, compared topiramate (50-300 mg/day) to bupropion SR (Wellbutrin, 100-400 mg/day) for eight weeks as adjuncts to mood stabilizers in 26 bipolar out patients with major depression. Both bupropion SR and topiramate showed a significant reduction in depressive symptoms and were not statistically different from each other. No patients switched into a manic episode on either treatment. These preliminary results suggest that topiramate may have comparable antidepressant activity to bupropion SR, a remarkable finding if replicated." Mexiletine (Mexitil) Mexiletine (Mexitil) has anticonvulsant, antiarrhythmic, and analgesic properties. In a study of 13 treatment resistant bipolars at doses from 200 – 1200 mg/day had a full response in 45% of patients. Another study: 8 out of 26 patients treated with Mexiletine had a positive therapeutic effect. ECT (Electro Convulsive Therapy) "…low dose, right unilateral (one-sided) was ineffective in two different studies of major depression (i.e., 23% improvement or 17% improvement respectively). However, high dose right unilateral ECT was as effective as bilateral (two-sided) ECT, and bilateral ECT clearly produced more lasting amnesia and memory defects. (Sackeim et al, 2000; Arch Gen Psychiatry 57: 425-434). rTMS and ECT are generally equally effective in "patients with nondelusional major depression. ECT superior to patients with delusional depression than rTMS. Bipolar Brains Study of 10 bipolar brains during autopsy compared with "11 nonpsychiatric control subjects. Dr. Rajkowska found decreased density of layer 3 in the dorsolateral pre-frontal cortex (Brodman’s area nine), comprised of a decrease in the numbers of pyramidal cells but not other neuronal elements, a decrease in glial cell density, and an increase in glial size." "…bipolar patients showed: 1) decreased dorsolateral prefrontal cortex NAA bilaterally; 2) decreased prefrontal white matter NAA bilaterally; and, 3) increased thalamic NAA bilaterally. These data thus supplement a growing amount of structural imaging data suggesting alterations in size or chemistry of the prefrontal cortex, amygdala, and hippocampus in bipolar patients compared with controls." Neuroleptics Olanzapine (Zyprexa) Olanzapine (Zyprexa) was statistically significantly superior to placebo in the treatment of rapid cycling Bipolar I patients. Bipolar Disord 2000 Sep;2(3 Pt 1):196-9 Ghaemi SN, Cherry EL, Katzow JA, Goodwin FK. Harvard Bipolar Research Program, Massachusetts General Hospital, Consolidated Department of Psychiatry, Boston 02114, USA. "Olanzapine appears to be moderately effective in open add-on treatment in patients with mainly depressive symptoms. Accumulating
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Question:
Ditto to everything Chip and Randee posted. There is absolutely no evidence to support that any SSRI causes permanent brain damage….in rats or in humans….and they sliced up a lot of rodents to find this out. SPECT and MRI scans indicate the same for humans….and I’m sure that over the next decade, posthumous studies will produce the same results. What you should know is that the average age of onset for most Axis I diagnoses is 18-25. More than likely your continued problems are as Philip described synchronous rather than caused by the meds. We have all been angry about the seeming failure of our body chemistry as expressed by psych symptoms. However, blaming it on the meds, is a cop-out of taking responsibility for making yourself well…..and posting such accusations here causes a lot of unnecessary worry by people who need their energies to focus on REAL problems. Get some counseling. ~Valerie
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I take zoloft and I was crazy before I took it. Panic and the constant thought pattern ruined my life. Zoloft has really helped me. Yes, I had some side effects but nothing like I had on other meds. I will not say neg on xanex but I am sure long term use may also cause you to go crazy. I also have psoriasis and this is not caused by zoloft. Got that before the zoloft or panic. Read up on psoriasis.Psoriasis may aggrivate the zoloft. Some meds do. Good luck on your research but remember many of us need this medication and unless you are 100% sure of what you have found I would be careful before you scare to many people. Joan
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ***I’m trying to get to the bottom of this *** I am posting this because of this problem and research I am doing on Zoloft… I have also found another person that has te same exact problems that I have because of this anti-depressant.. First of all , I think it causes permanent brain damage.. I also think that a person who starts out on zoloft will need some sort of anti-depressant for the rest of their life because of the damage it does.. Well, I’ll just try to be short here because I dont know how many of you will have the same problem.. When I was 18, I took zoloft.. I felt very weird in the beggining. Like a draining , kind of brain meltdown feeling… And ever since then (6 years without zoloft) I have had a constant numbing feeling on the left side of my head… It makes me feel more prone to stress/anxiety/panic.. Since then I have also developed a social phobia , psoriasis , and psoriatic arthritis…. Even though I was a little depressed when I was 18, I never knew that this crazyness was going to happen.. It made my condition much worse.. Now i’m stuck with taking xanax for the rest of my life….Anybody else expierence simaler symptoms?? We should sue these damn companies for this garbage.
I’d say it’s doubtful that your complaints are the result of having taken Zoloft. There seems to be a *synchronicity* here but not necessarily a *causal* relationship. It might be the original anxiety for all I know (or can conclude from the sparse data you provided). Does Xanax work for these symptoms as you say that you’re taking it? If it works (at what dose?) it’s obviously a better med for you than Zoloft was. Some of us (including me) will have to be on meds for the rest of our lives. I’d rather not be on meds but it’s the only way for me to have a life. You may be just like me… Philip
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***I’m trying to get to the bottom of this *** I am posting this because of this problem and research I am doing on Zoloft… I have also found another person that has te same exact problems that I have because of this anti-depressant.. First of all , I think it causes permanent brain damage.. I also think that a person who starts out on zoloft will need some sort of anti-depressant for the rest of their life because of the damage it does..
Well, I’ll just try to be short here because I dont know how many of you will have the same problem.. When I was 18, I took zoloft.. I felt very weird in the beggining. Like a draining , kind of brain meltdown feeling… And ever since then (6 years without zoloft) I have had a constant numbing feeling on the left side of my head… It makes me feel more prone to stress/anxiety/panic.. Since then I have also developed a social phobia , psoriasis , and psoriatic arthritis…. Even though I was a little depressed when I was 18, I never knew that this crazyness was going to happen.. It made my condition much worse.. Now i’m stuck with taking xanax for the rest of my life….Anybody else expierence simaler symptoms?? We should sue these damn companies for this garbage.
Mike you can spend the rest of your life trying to figure out why you have this disorder. I seriously doubt that Zoloft is the cause. You were put on Zoloft for a reason, what was that reason? Depression and anxiety are closely related. My disorder started when I was 18, one day I was fine and the next day I was different. Mike you can try to find the reason for your disorder, and try to place blame. You are going to make yourself nuts trying to find the cause. Even if you do find the cause, it won`t help you much. Unless you accept your disorder and own it, you are not going to move on and get better. There are many people that have never been on anti-depressants, that have depression, anxiety, panic, social phobia and psoriasis. How do you explain that Mike? Take all this energy that you are using to blame Zoloft into getting better instead. Jackie
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Would it be safe to say…that Zoloft is a powerful drug?For me the answer is YES. Did Zoloft increase my Anxiety?…yes for me it did! The first month or so were the weirdest (kind of a slight mania….depersonalization ) it pretty much went away.(.except for Anxiety) the longer I stayed on it! I can see how it can help people, I think it helped me with a uplifting state of mind; but it didn’t seem to be worth the price of continuing if I still had to deal Tension and Anxiety. I have discontinued Zoloft for about 2 weeks and I can’t tell much difference; except I can tell I’m not quite as know) I wanted them all to work wonders for me…but they created there own little draw-backs. I’ve given Zoloft 2 trys. I can see why somebody posted about the effects of this drug…I’ve read many places and from ASAP posters on the things I went through…I know that I’m not alone. BUT I know this drug has worked wonders for many other people. Anyway just sharing…not an expert(Obviously) Oh by the way if anybody can offer me a better alternative drug….I’m all EARS! Thanks Much Wild & Crazy P.S. my other 2 drugs are Trazodone and Zanax( I really like the Zanax!) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ***I’m trying to get to the bottom of this *** I am posting this because of this problem and research I am doing on Zoloft… I have also found another person that has te same exact problems that I have because of this anti-depressant.. First of all , I think it causes permanent brain damage.. I also think that a person who starts out on zoloft will need some sort of anti-depressant for the rest of their life because of the damage it does.. Well, I’ll just try to be short here because I dont know how many of you will have the same problem.. When I was 18, I took zoloft.. I felt very weird in the beggining. Like a draining , kind of brain meltdown feeling… And ever since then (6 years without zoloft) I have had a constant numbing feeling on the left side of my head… It makes me feel more prone to stress/anxiety/panic.. Since then I have also developed a social phobia , psoriasis , and psoriatic arthritis…. Even though I was a little depressed when I was 18, I never knew that this crazyness was going to happen.. It made my condition much worse.. Now i’m stuck with taking xanax for the rest of my life….Anybody else expierence simaler symptoms?? We should sue these damn companies for this garbage. My wife has been on Imiprimine, Luvox, and Zoloft. The imiprimine helped her depression but the side effects were almost bad enough that the depression was better. The Luvox had very mild side effects, but it didn’t do much for her depression. Zoloft has been effective with her depression and with very mild side effects. I see no evidence of brain dammage. I was on prozac (an SSRI, the same family as Zoloft) for 2 weeks. It gave me tinnitus and halucinations. I won’t take an SSRI again. These are very rare side effects for Prozac, but I’m not the first to get them. However, just because SSRIs are a bad choice for me, doesn’t mean that huge numbers of users haven’t been helped by them. Xanax is what helps me, and I may have to take it the rest of my life, but there’s enough research to suggest that there’s a good chance that I won’t. If Zoloft really does cause brain dammage, I think it would of turned up prior to now. I agree with the prior posts that say you have an anxiety/panc disorder that just happend to manifest itself after you went off the Zoloft. I would also say that you at least have a chance that it’s not permenant. Good Luck, Mark Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ***I’m trying to get to the bottom of this *** I am posting this because of this problem and research I am doing on Zoloft… I have also found another person that has te same exact problems that I have because of this anti-depressant.. First of all , I think it causes permanent brain damage.. I also think that a person who starts out on zoloft will need some sort of anti-depressant for the rest of their life because of the damage it does.. Well, I’ll just try to be short here because I dont know how many of you will have the same problem.. When I was 18, I took zoloft.. I felt very weird in the beggining. Like a draining , kind of brain meltdown feeling… And ever since then (6 years without zoloft) I have had a constant numbing feeling on the left side of my head… It makes me feel more prone to stress/anxiety/panic.. Since then I have also developed a social phobia , psoriasis , and psoriatic arthritis…. Even though I was a little depressed when I was 18, I never knew that this crazyness was going to happen.. It made my condition much worse.. Now i’m stuck with taking xanax for the rest of my life….Anybody else expierence simaler symptoms?? We should sue these damn companies for this garbage.
My wife has been on Imiprimine, Luvox, and Zoloft. The imiprimine helped her depression but the side effects were almost bad enough that the depression was better. The Luvox had very mild side effects, but it didn’t do much for her depression. Zoloft has been effective with her depression and with very mild side effects. I see no evidence of brain dammage. I was on prozac (an SSRI, the same family as Zoloft) for 2 weeks. It gave me tinnitus and halucinations. I won’t take an SSRI again. These are very rare side effects for Prozac, but I’m not the first to get them. However, just because SSRIs are a bad choice for me, doesn’t mean that huge numbers of users haven’t been helped by them. Xanax is what helps me, and I may have to take it the rest of my life, but there’s enough research to suggest that there’s a good chance that I won’t. If Zoloft really does cause brain dammage, I think it would of turned up prior to now. I agree with the prior posts that say you have an anxiety/panc disorder that just happend to manifest itself after you went off the Zoloft. I would also say that you at least have a chance that it’s not permenant. Good Luck, Mark Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am posting this because of this problem and research I am doing on Zoloft… I have also found another person that has te same exact problems that I have because of this anti-depressant.. First of all , I think it causes permanent brain damage.. I also think that a person who starts out on zoloft will need some sort of anti-depressant for the rest of their life because of the damage it does.. Well, I’ll just try to be short here because I dont know how many of you will have the same problem.. When I was 18, I took zoloft.. I felt very weird in the beggining. Like a draining , kind of brain meltdown feeling… And ever since then (6 years without zoloft) I have had a constant numbing feeling on the left side of my head… It makes me feel more prone to stress/anxiety/panic.. Since then I have also developed a social phobia , psoriasis , and psoriatic arthritis…. Even though I was a little depressed when I was 18, I never knew that this crazyness was going to happen.. It made my condition much worse.. Now i’m stuck with taking xanax for the rest of my life….Anybody else expierence simaler symptoms?? We should sue these damn companies for this garbage.
You may be confusing cause and effect here. There are many people on this NG who take or have taken Zoloft as well as many other AD’s. The symptoms that you describe could mean that you are still have problems with depression. I’m not saying outright that you are wrong, however, there is no current evidence to support your claim, either from the med reaearch or, more importantly, anecodotes posted to the NG’s. Is it possible than somehow in your mind that it might be easier to believe your symptoms were induced by your use of Zoloft than to acknowledge that you have an ongoing problem with Panic and/or depression? Keep us up to date if you find any research on the topic. Regards, JaneB
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These kind of messages really make me mad.Keep your opinions to yourself. Its not enough that I have to take this but then there are people like you who have to make it worse for me.Zoloft is really helping me and I definatly have no brain damage and i’m not depressed.So when you have real proof then post it!!!! Randee
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ***I’m trying to get to the bottom of this *** I am posting this because of this problem and research I am doing on Zoloft… I have also found another person that has te same exact problems that I have because of this anti-depressant.. First of all , I think it causes permanent brain damage.. I also think that a person who starts out on zoloft will need some sort of anti-depressant for the rest of their life because of the damage it does.. Well, I’ll just try to be short here because I dont know how many of you will have the same problem.. When I was 18, I took zoloft.. I felt very weird in the beggining. Like a draining , kind of brain meltdown feeling… And ever since then (6 years without zoloft) I have had a constant numbing feeling on the left side of my head… It makes me feel more prone to stress/anxiety/panic.. Since then I have also developed a social phobia , psoriasis , and psoriatic arthritis…. Even though I was a little depressed when I was 18, I never knew that this crazyness was going to happen.. It made my condition much worse.. Now i’m stuck with taking xanax for the rest of my life….Anybody else expierence simaler symptoms?? We should sue these damn companies for this garbage.
I don’t know about this either…I have had fewer side-effects on Zoloft than I’ve had on any other med but aspirin and ibuprofen (no kidding)…Antibiotics give me flu-like symptoms, antihistimines knock me on my ass and cause dizziness…The list goes on…I have had almost NIL side-effects on Zoloft…Not only that, but like others have said, I was drained and sick WELL before I took Zoloft…If I still am when I get off, I can only assume I still need it, not that it caused it… Finally, all the research I have read recently is starting to suggest just the opposite of what you say…That depression and anxiety (specifically cortisol and other hormones that are overstimulated in depressed and anxious folks) CAUSES brain damage…Long time depressives have smaller brains in some places (I cannot remember the specific region at 12:20 PM! ) that control emotions…This seems to be reversible, but that is inconclusive…Also, research shows that taking medications and getting therapy immediately is the best way to prevent this effect and reduce or eliminate further epsiodes… Best, — Charles Phipps
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I’d be interested in whatever you find out about zoloft. I have been on it since March 99. Only 50mg. Haven’t seen a lot of improvement, but I thought it was to treat depression. I went to the Pdoc complaining of anxiety,panic and lack of sleep. Although, he did give me xanax as well for that. You may be right in your claim about zoloft, but I have not heard this before about the medicine.
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Hi, New Jersey! Haven’t I seen you before down on the boardwalk in Atlantic City , and over there at the Trump Plaza? You look familiar. : ) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -New Jersey writes: I’m trying to get to the bottom of this. I am posting this because of this problem and research I am doing on Zoloft… I have also found another person that has te same exact problems that I have because of this anti-depressant.. First of all , I think it causes permanent brain damage.. I also think that a person who starts out on zoloft will need some sort of anti-depressant for the rest of their life because of the damage it does.. Well, I’ll just try to be short here because I dont know how many of you will have the same problem.. When I was 18, I took zoloft.. I felt very weird in the beggining. Like a draining , kind of brain meltdown feeling… And ever since then (6 years without zoloft) I have had a constant numbing feeling on the left side of my head… It makes me feel more prone to stress/anxiety/panic.. Since then I have also developed a social phobia , psoriasis , and psoriatic arthritis…. Even though I was a little depressed when I was 18, I never knew that this crazyness was going to happen.. It made my condition much worse.. Now i’m stuck with taking xanax for the rest of my life….Anybody else expierence simaler symptoms?? We should sue these damn companies for this garbage.
NJ, I’ve been on Zoloft for the last 6 years, and so far, no brain damage, just less depression and anxiety. And I’ve been very pleased with this med. And I have never even heard that it causes brain damage. And untill someone shows me proof, I won’t believe it. Just because you met someone that claims his problems are due to brain damage caused by Zoloft doesn’t mean it’s true. It sounds like you were depressed enough at 18 to be treated with Zoloft. I don’t know how long you took it. It seems you now have anxieties, phobias, numbness on your face. All of these are part of an anxiety disorder. Some, like you, get depressed first, and later on get the anxiety symptoms. Others have the anxiety symptoms first and may get depressed later on. I had depression in my late teens, and onset of panic disorder and phobias at age 22. And I had alot of strange feelings all over my body and thought I had disease. But I didn’t. It sounds like you have the same problems we have here at ASAP. And they’re not due to brain damage from meds. So, are you ever going to go back down to Atlantic City, again? : ) Take care, Chip
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***I’m trying to get to the bottom of this *** I am posting this because of this problem and research I am doing on Zoloft… I have also found another person that has te same exact problems that I have because of this anti-depressant.. First of all , I think it causes permanent brain damage.. I also think that a person who starts out on zoloft will need some sort of anti-depressant for the rest of their life because of the damage it does.. Well, I’ll just try to be short here because I dont know how many of you will have the same problem.. When I was 18, I took zoloft.. I felt very weird in the beggining. Like a draining , kind of brain meltdown feeling… And ever since then (6 years without zoloft) I have had a constant numbing feeling on the left side of my head… It makes me feel more prone to stress/anxiety/panic.. Since then I have also developed a social phobia , psoriasis , and psoriatic arthritis…. Even though I was a little depressed when I was 18, I never knew that this crazyness was going to happen.. It made my condition much worse.. Now i’m stuck with taking xanax for the rest of my life….Anybody else expierence simaler symptoms?? We should sue these damn companies for this garbage.
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