Question:

Thank you for the specific advice re: irrigation.  Much appreciated. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Duncan Robertson wrote:  Hi!

        I had trouble with my maxillary sinuses before last         April when I began to irrigate my nose with saline/         bicarbonate and after that found Dr.Jones’s papers         on xylitol.  Now, after nearly six months’ regular         spraying/irrigation with 10% xylitol in normal saline,         my sinuses don’t pain any more and discharges         are a thing of the past.  So, listen to the voice         crying in the wilderness, irrigate your nose intensively         with xylitol soln., inclininng your head to the side to         let the fluid gather where the ethmoid sinus         openings are, high up on the lateral wall of your         nasal cavity.  Irrigate 2ml at a time, and let the stuff         have time to penetrate.  Don’t blow your nose hard         to expel the stream of mucus.  After, say, a week,         you should begin to feel less congestion and         some relief of the pain.  Xylitol comes in when all         the antibiotics have tried and failed.         best of luck,         Duncan.

Response:

NBoles613 wrote:

Hi, Instead of blindly letting the doctors switch you from antibiotic to antibiotic, my advice is to find an ENT who will do a sinus culture. I have this done whenever I get an infection because I will not tolerate the primary care docs guessing games with abx anymore after a lifetime of mismanagement of my sinuses. The ENT should go as far into the sinus as he can to get an accurate swab. When done by an experienced ENt this is not painful. All I feel is stinging and its over rather quickly. After having packing removed 10 days post-sugery everyhing else is a piece of cake! Rread my latest post on "Pseudomonas from Water Pik" and you’ll see why the culture is so important. Best of luck, Nadine

Thank you, Nadine–I’ll be sure to ask the ENT about this.  That’s very helpful advice.   I’ve been thinking about a culture/sensitivity, actually, and wondering why they don’t seem to do them more routinely for humans? When I take my pet birds to the avian vet, they invariably do a C/S to find out which drug to use when there’s an infection. zg (Ziggy Blum)

Response:

The reason this isn’t done routinely is because many ENT’s beleive that sinus culturing is not accurate due to so much normal flora in the sinus and nose that can cause false results. My ENT looks up my nostril with a high intensity light and holds the nostril open with a short, bent hemostat. When he sees a pustule or mucus he samples directly from it. Just swabbing the inside of the nose is worthless. Its not painful, just a minute of dicomfort that is well worth it. Nadine – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

 I’ve been thinking about a culture/sensitivity, actually, and wondering why they don’t seem to do them more routinely for humans?

Response:

Hi, Instead of blindly letting the doctors switch you from antibiotic to antibiotic, my advice is to find an ENT who will do a sinus culture. I have this done whenever I get an infection because I will not tolerate the primary care docs guessing games with abx anymore after a lifetime of mismanagement of my sinuses. The ENT should go as far into the sinus as he can to get an accurate swab. When done by an experienced ENt this is not painful. All I feel is stinging and its over rather quickly. After having packing removed 10 days post-sugery everyhing else is a piece of cake! Rread my latest post on "Pseudomonas from Water Pik" and you’ll see why the culture is so important. Best of luck, Nadine

Response:

And thanks very much for the non-surgery perspective as well.  I am not at all eager for such surgery, and am *definitely* going to look into all options thoroughly before embarking on it!   thanks again, zg

Response:

Follow-up note–my allergist brought up the subject before I did today and recommended an ENT.  I’ll be glad to see him and get his perspective, but certainly won’t be rushing into anything. It actually feels a little funny to be talking about anything as selfish as sinuses on a day like this.  At least I have sinuses to talk about.   zg

Response:

"Pythoness" <zig…@efn.org

wrote in message

news:3B9EBF77.2F900807@efn.org…

And thanks very much for the non-surgery perspective as well.  I am not at all eager for such surgery, and am *definitely* going to look into all options thoroughly before embarking on it! thanks again, zg

        Hi!         I had trouble with my maxillary sinuses before last         April when I began to irrigate my nose with saline/         bicarbonate and after that found Dr.Jones’s papers         on xylitol.  Now, after nearly six months’ regular         spraying/irrigation with 10% xylitol in normal saline,         my sinuses don’t pain any more and discharges         are a thing of the past.  So, listen to the voice         crying in the wilderness, irrigate your nose intensively         with xylitol soln., inclininng your head to the side to         let the fluid gather where the ethmoid sinus         openings are, high up on the lateral wall of your         nasal cavity.  Irrigate 2ml at a time, and let the stuff         have time to penetrate.  Don’t blow your nose hard         to expel the stream of mucus.  After, say, a week,         you should begin to feel less congestion and         some relief of the pain.  Xylitol comes in when all         the antibiotics have tried and failed.         best of luck,         Duncan.

Response:

On 11 Sep 2001 13:34:05 -0700, ray_kill…@hotmail.com (Ray Killeen) wrote:

There are some very knowledgeable people on this site who give out good advise most of the time however the vocal group is the group that is quick to recommend an ENT or operation.  Unfortunately most ENTs are practicing surgeons who are looking for new victims,I mean patients,so you will get a similar response from most of them also. You may need an operation but you may also have many options to try prior to it.

I agree that surgery should not be undertaken lightly, especially given that the experience and techniques of surgeons vary widely, and that some are likely to recommend procedures too casually or do them inappropriately (taking shortcuts to save time). Also, don’t forget that the anesthetic is a risk. On the other hand, there can be risks in *not* having surgery in some cases.

Definitely see an ENT but also consider the following. Are you irrigating with a Waterpick? Definitely irrigate morning and night with an addition salt-water sniff at lunch. Have you considered steroid nasal sprays topical antibiotics and lets not forget the Xylitol? Have you read "Sinus Cure" and "Sinus Survival".  Have you considered how physiologically sensitive your nose and sinus area is before allowing a surgeon to mutilate, I mean operate on them.  If in the end you decide to take the plunge make sure you consider the same doctor Don went to, he seems to be satisfied and his doctor as far as I am concerned is definitely the most experienced.

Yes I am satisfied with David Kennedy MD, chairman of the Dept. of Otolarynogology of U. Penn. Philadelphia, Chief of Otolaryngology at the Hospital of U. Penn., and the pioneer of endoscopic sinus surgery in the U.S. He also is one of the best comunicators I have met, which I value a lot.   He will frankly state statistics that surgery will help and will not do it unless he thinks it will.    But you will wait 6 months to see him, if he will see you.   Seeing someone like that enormously increases odds of success because they publish their success rates and their reputation rides on not having a disaster. It’s best to have some CT scans ready to send him by mail first. You might want to see some others first so that you can educate yourself as to what to ask, get CT scans etc. But yes, explore all options carefully, non-surgical and surgical. I put off surgery for many years before having it.  (But I never had pain etc.) On the one hand, my sinusitis progressed into all sinuses during that period. On the other hand, techniques improved in a major way and I educated myself toward a better decision, I think.

Response:

yep, see an ENT.  I went years without knowing I had a deviated septum(much of my left side was supposedly blocked) and acid reflux into my sinuses which damages the sinuses(hard to believe, since I never feel acid in my chest) until I recently went to an ENT.  Allergists and other doctors never mentioned anything about a deviated septum or acid reflux.  Some type of sinus surgery may help you greatly.  An ENT will probably look up your nose with a flexible camera/light and maybe order a CAT Scan of your sinuses, which can diagnose structural problems far better than regular X-rays.  At first my ENT took an X-ray and thought things looked better than he thought based on the X-ray.  Then I had the CT scan and he could see that my septum was deviated and hampering drainage and causing sinus infections. http://www.meetotheradults.cm http://www.photographsofnature.com "Don Brady" <dbr…@pobox.com

wrote in message

news:jSidOxokdthdtfUrdQGtSzO7fCk0@4ax.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

On Mon, 10 Sep 2001 13:17:38 -0700, Pythoness <zig…@efn.org wrote: Hi– I’ve lurked here on & off for sometime but I don’t recall posting before (might’ve once or twice). I’ve had minor chronic sinusitis for a looong time (ie, pain and some yellow discharge periodically, especially during allergy season), but acute flareups (with fever and discharge) have been limited to once or twice a year and responded well to ampicillin or Zithromax. Over the last couple of months I’ve had an altogether new and awful problem involving wandering mild to moderate facial pain, vague stuffiness, and, by far the worst of all, a pungent and persistant smell of acrid smoke that varies from mild to appalling.  No discharge. Both my GP and my allergist diagnosed infection, and a CT scan showed thickening in my ethmoid cells, which apparently is consistant with middle-of-the-face pain and weird smells. The problem is that it’s just not budging. My GP gave me Augmentin, which I proved to be allergic to.  Then I went to my allergist, who gave me Zithromax.  The smell and pain went down to nonexistant and sprang right back up again.  She then gave me Biaxin, which after a week had produced no result whatsoever, and I was having ear pain and fever, so she switched me to two weeks of Tequin. After one week I thought the Tequin was really going to do the job–I had two days where the pain was minimal and I only experienced the smell for a few seconds a day. Then I took an antihistimine so I could get my regular allergy shot, and to my extreme disappointment ALL the symptoms returned within a couple hours–the smell and the pain and the lassitude.  ARRRRRGHH! Well antihistamines do dry out and can restrict mucous flow.  Really they

are

not a good idea if you have sinusitis. That was Thursday.  I continued to improve slowly until yesterday, when I felt almost normal–and today the smell is back, the pain is back, I have a (very) low fever, *and* a slight bloody yellow discharge. I have never experienced anything like this and I’m feeling pretty helpless.  I’m asthmatic and sinus infections always act as a trigger, so I’m on a heavier than usual dose of Flovent and I’m not happy about that either.  I’m irrigating once or twice a day (per allergist’s instructions) with salt water.  I’ve had unusual tenderness above my left eyebrow and just under my left eye–to a lesser extent on the other side as well. Any suggestions or information would be welcomed. Thanks. I would see an otolaryngologist specializing in sinuses as well as an allergist.  You need both.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Pythoness wrote:

Hi– I’ve lurked here on & off for sometime but I don’t recall posting before (might’ve once or twice). I’ve had minor chronic sinusitis for a looong time (ie, pain and some yellow discharge periodically, especially during allergy season), but acute flareups (with fever and discharge) have been limited to once or twice a year and responded well to ampicillin or Zithromax. Over the last couple of months I’ve had an altogether new and awful problem involving wandering mild to moderate facial pain, vague stuffiness, and, by far the worst of all, a pungent and persistant smell of acrid smoke that varies from mild to appalling.  No discharge. Both my GP and my allergist diagnosed infection, and a CT scan showed thickening in my ethmoid cells, which apparently is consistant with middle-of-the-face pain and weird smells. The problem is that it’s just not budging.

Congratulations. You have reached the point where it’s time to consider surgery. We all end up that way eventually. Please contact an ENT who has extensive experience in endoscopic sinus surgery (several hundred operations at least), and discuss it with him. As my ENT said: "Every sinus patient starts out trying antibiotics, home remedies, and everything else they can think of.  Then, after years go by, and they just can’t take it anymore, then they go for surgery." — Steven D. Litvintchouk                   Email:  sdlit…@earthlink.net     "I guess I could have paid a little closer attention when I was in English class, but it all worked out OK.  I’m gainfully employed."      – President George W. Bush

Response:

Steven Litvintchouk wrote:

Congratulations. You have reached the point where it’s time to consider surgery. We all end up that way eventually.

Heigh ho; I suspected as much.  Thanks for the advice, Steven et al! I’ll ask for a referral to an ENT at my next appointment this week. zg

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Pythoness <zig…@efn.org

wrote in message <news:3B9D1FE2.34675130@efn.org… Hi– I’ve lurked here on & off for sometime but I don’t recall posting before (might’ve once or twice). I’ve had minor chronic sinusitis for a looong time (ie, pain and some yellow discharge periodically, especially during allergy season), but acute flareups (with fever and discharge) have been limited to once or twice a year and responded well to ampicillin or Zithromax. Over the last couple of months I’ve had an altogether new and awful problem involving wandering mild to moderate facial pain, vague stuffiness, and, by far the worst of all, a pungent and persistant smell of acrid smoke that varies from mild to appalling.  No discharge. Both my GP and my allergist diagnosed infection, and a CT scan showed thickening in my ethmoid cells, which apparently is consistant with middle-of-the-face pain and weird smells. …

There are some very knowledgeable people on this site who give out good advise most of the time however the vocal group is the group that is quick to recommend an ENT or operation.  Unfortunately most ENTs are practicing surgeons who are looking for new victims,I mean patients,so you will get a similar response from most of them also. You may need an operation but you may also have many options to try prior to it. Definitely see an ENT but also consider the following. Are you irrigating with a Waterpick? Definitely irrigate morning and night with an addition salt-water sniff at lunch. Have you considered steroid nasal sprays topical antibiotics and lets not forget the Xylitol? Have you read "Sinus Cure" and "Sinus Survival".  Have you considered how physiologically sensitive your nose and sinus area is before allowing a surgeon to mutilate, I mean operate on them.  If in the end you decide to take the plunge make sure you consider the same doctor Don went to, he seems to be satisfied and his doctor as far as I am concerned is definitely the most experienced.

Response:

Hi– I’ve lurked here on & off for sometime but I don’t recall posting before (might’ve once or twice). I’ve had minor chronic sinusitis for a looong time (ie, pain and some yellow discharge periodically, especially during allergy season), but acute flareups (with fever and discharge) have been limited to once or twice a year and responded well to ampicillin or Zithromax. Over the last couple of months I’ve had an altogether new and awful problem involving wandering mild to moderate facial pain, vague stuffiness, and, by far the worst of all, a pungent and persistant smell of acrid smoke that varies from mild to appalling.  No discharge. Both my GP and my allergist diagnosed infection, and a CT scan showed thickening in my ethmoid cells, which apparently is consistant with middle-of-the-face pain and weird smells. The problem is that it’s just not budging. My GP gave me Augmentin, which I proved to be allergic to.  Then I went to my allergist, who gave me Zithromax.  The smell and pain went down to nonexistant and sprang right back up again.  She then gave me Biaxin, which after a week had produced no result whatsoever, and I was having ear pain and fever, so she switched me to two weeks of Tequin. After one week I thought the Tequin was really going to do the job–I had two days where the pain was minimal and I only experienced the smell for a few seconds a day.   Then I took an antihistimine so I could get my regular allergy shot, and to my extreme disappointment ALL the symptoms returned within a couple hours–the smell and the pain and the lassitude.  ARRRRRGHH! That was Thursday.  I continued to improve slowly until yesterday, when I felt almost normal–and today the smell is back, the pain is back, I have a (very) low fever, *and* a slight bloody yellow discharge. I have never experienced anything like this and I’m feeling pretty helpless.  I’m asthmatic and sinus infections always act as a trigger, so I’m on a heavier than usual dose of Flovent and I’m not happy about that either.  I’m irrigating once or twice a day (per allergist’s instructions) with salt water.  I’ve had unusual tenderness above my left eyebrow and just under my left eye–to a lesser extent on the other side as well. Any suggestions or information would be welcomed. Thanks. Ziggy

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -On Mon, 10 Sep 2001 13:17:38 -0700, Pythoness <zig…@efn.org

wrote: Hi– I’ve lurked here on & off for sometime but I don’t recall posting before (might’ve once or twice). I’ve had minor chronic sinusitis for a looong time (ie, pain and some yellow discharge periodically, especially during allergy season), but acute flareups (with fever and discharge) have been limited to once or twice a year and responded well to ampicillin or Zithromax. Over the last couple of months I’ve had an altogether new and awful problem involving wandering mild to moderate facial pain, vague stuffiness, and, by far the worst of all, a pungent and persistant smell of acrid smoke that varies from mild to appalling.  No discharge. Both my GP and my allergist diagnosed infection, and a CT scan showed thickening in my ethmoid cells, which apparently is consistant with middle-of-the-face pain and weird smells. The problem is that it’s just not budging. My GP gave me Augmentin, which I proved to be allergic to.  Then I went to my allergist, who gave me Zithromax.  The smell and pain went down to nonexistant and sprang right back up again.  She then gave me Biaxin, which after a week had produced no result whatsoever, and I was having ear pain and fever, so she switched me to two weeks of Tequin. After one week I thought the Tequin was really going to do the job–I had two days where the pain was minimal and I only experienced the smell for a few seconds a day.   Then I took an antihistimine so I could get my regular allergy shot, and to my extreme disappointment ALL the symptoms returned within a couple hours–the smell and the pain and the lassitude.  ARRRRRGHH!

Well antihistamines do dry out and can restrict mucous flow.  Really they are not a good idea if you have sinusitis.

That was Thursday.  I continued to improve slowly until yesterday, when I felt almost normal–and today the smell is back, the pain is back, I have a (very) low fever, *and* a slight bloody yellow discharge. I have never experienced anything like this and I’m feeling pretty helpless.  I’m asthmatic and sinus infections always act as a trigger, so I’m on a heavier than usual dose of Flovent and I’m not happy about that either.  I’m irrigating once or twice a day (per allergist’s instructions) with salt water.  I’ve had unusual tenderness above my left eyebrow and just under my left eye–to a lesser extent on the other side as well. Any suggestions or information would be welcomed. Thanks.

I would see an otolaryngologist specializing in sinuses as well as an allergist.  You need both.

Response:

Question:

I take lots of inhalers and have just tried Singulair. How long does it take to start working?

When I was in the worst of the year-long attack I had, I felt the effects of Singulair immediately. Now I wonder whether it’s working at all, but it must be because I get worse if I miss taking it.

Response:

I take lots of inhalers and have just tried Singulair. How long does it take to start working? It doesn’t seem to do anything. It is always hard for me to tell what works since I run into triggers off and on. With that and delayed reactions, it is hard to play detective and tell what is due to what. Thanks for the help.

I found it worked within the first few days.  But it appears to be effect for only 2/3 of the people taking it.  You may be in the 1/3. Check with your allergist.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I started it on Tuesday of this week and my experience is it worked almost immediately. My wife said I slept so well…no coughing and no snoring either ( I have sleep apnea….not using my Bi-PAP now because of the 4-5 weeks I’ve had lung problems). She said I hardly moved all night long. YMMV….this is just my experience   Wow! Me too! I had been using my Proventil inhaler regularly along with Serevent. The Dr. put me back on Flovent and added Singulair. I haven’t needed the Proventil even once since then. Since I believe the Flovent takes some time to start working I’m convinced that the Singulair did the job. I’m not 100% better yet – my lungs still hurt when I take a deep breath. But I’m very much improved! Debi

Singulair is practically my god…within 24 hours I felt a *huge* effect. I now use proventil as a rescue inhaler maybe once a week, as opposed to the once/twice/even three times a day I used to have to use it. —  Karen Ingraffea  "I might be a coward; I’m afraid of what I might find out…" -(The Mighty Mighty Bosstones) The Impression That I Get "All things being equal, you lose." -Anon

Response:

I started it on Tuesday of this week and my experience is it worked almost immediately. My wife said I slept so well…no coughing and no snoring either ( I have sleep apnea….not using my Bi-PAP now because of the 4-5 weeks I’ve had lung problems). She said I hardly moved all night long. YMMV….this is just my experience

  Wow! Me too! I had been using my Proventil inhaler regularly along with Serevent. The Dr. put me back on Flovent and added Singulair. I haven’t needed the Proventil even once since then. Since I believe the Flovent takes some time to start working I’m convinced that the Singulair did the job. I’m not 100% better yet – my lungs still hurt when I take a deep breath. But I’m very much improved! Debi

Response:

Your insert should supply this information. If not your pharmacist will tell you.

Response:

I take lots of inhalers and have just tried Singulair. How long does it take to start working? It doesn’t seem to do anything. It is always hard for me to tell what works since I run into triggers off and on. With that and delayed reactions, it is hard to play detective and tell what is due to what. Thanks for the help.

Generally, about 30 days is considered an adequate time to tell if it is or is not working. It’s a terrible responsibility – but somebody has to be the Americans.

Response:

I started it on Tuesday of this week and my experience is it worked almost immediately. My wife said I slept so well…no coughing and no snoring either ( I have sleep apnea….not using my Bi-PAP now because of the 4-5 weeks I’ve had lung problems). She said I hardly moved all night long. YMMV….this is just my experience * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

I take lots of inhalers and have just tried Singulair. How long does it take to start working? It doesn’t seem to do anything. It is always hard for me to tell what works since I run into triggers off and on. With that and delayed reactions, it is hard to play detective and tell what is due to what. Thanks for the help. Before you buy.

Response:

Question:

Has anyone heard of Zoloft withdrawal lasting longer than a couple of weeks? I was taking 200 to 250 mg Zoloft daily (increased during PMS) and then switched to Celexa. I was frustrated with neither of them helping my depression, so I unwisely abruptly discontinued the medication. My withdrawal symptoms ranged from moderate to severe…initially, I experienced extreme agitation, anxiety, crying, uncharacteristic rage, and formication (sensation that bugs were crawling on me). With the help of my doctor, I restarted a low dose of Celexa (I had been on 20 mg prior to this) and tapered off–but still quicker than I should have because I’m stubborn. The main problems that persisted for a couple of weeks were numbness and tingling in my arms and legs, and then spontaneous pain or muscle spasms in my legs. (Pretty darn painful). That and gastro-intestinal distress. My doctor felt that most of this was actually withdrawal from the Zoloft, not Celexa. She felt that the Celexa had prevented me from going into Zoloft withdrawal, but when I discontinued Celexa, the Zoloft withdrawal kicked in. From what I’ve read about other people’s experiences with Zoloft withdrawal, my symptoms do appear to match theirs. I had been taking Zoloft (at different doses) for about 4 years. I tried other medications during that time, but I was unable to tolerate most of them. I am very sensitive to medications and tend to have side effects with just about everything I take, usually to the point where I don’t want to take anything. Back to the symptoms–after 2-1/2 weeks, these symptoms diminished. 3-1/2 weeks after the initial discontinuation, however, I had a flare-up of gastro-intenstinal distress that lasted a day or two. Then, 4-1/2 weeks after the initial discontinuation (maybe 2 weeks since stopping the mild tapering-off) I experienced the leg pain, numbness, tingling along with severe stomach cramps and such. I did not expect to still be experiencing withdrawal symptoms, so I’m confused. Am I imagining things? Is this something else? Thank you for any help you can provide.

Response:

Has anyone heard of Zoloft withdrawal lasting longer than a couple of weeks? I was taking 200 to 250 mg Zoloft daily (increased during PMS) and then switched to Celexa. I was frustrated with neither of them helping my depression, so I unwisely abruptly discontinued the medication. My withdrawal symptoms ranged from moderate to severe…initially, I experienced extreme agitation, anxiety, crying, uncharacteristic rage, and formication (sensation that bugs were crawling on me). With the help of my doctor, I restarted a low dose of Celexa (I had been on 20 mg prior to this) and tapered off–but still quicker than I should have because I’m stubborn. The main problems that persisted for a couple of weeks were numbness and tingling in my arms and legs, and then spontaneous pain or muscle spasms in my legs. (Pretty darn painful). That and gastro-intestinal distress. My doctor felt that most of this was actually withdrawal from the Zoloft, not Celexa. She felt that the Celexa had prevented me from going into Zoloft withdrawal, but when I discontinued Celexa, the Zoloft withdrawal kicked in. From what I’ve read about other people’s experiences with Zoloft withdrawal, my symptoms do appear to match theirs. I had been taking Zoloft (at different doses) for about 4 years. I tried other medications during that time, but I was unable to tolerate most of them. I am very sensitive to medications and tend to have side effects with just about everything I take, usually to the point where I don’t want to take anything. Back to the symptoms–after 2-1/2 weeks, these symptoms diminished. 3-1/2 weeks after the initial discontinuation, however, I had a flare-up of gastro-intenstinal distress that lasted a day or two. Then, 4-1/2 weeks after the initial discontinuation (maybe 2 weeks since stopping the mild tapering-off) I experienced the leg pain, numbness, tingling along with severe stomach cramps and such. I did not expect to still be experiencing withdrawal symptoms, so I’m confused. Am I imagining things? Is this something else? Thank you for any help you can provide.

Response:

Question:

I am starting welbutrin sr and need to know what to expect. I am bi-polar/mood swings/OCD/major panic attacks, and I am obsessive about what meds will do to me. Then I panic once I take them, and It is just a bad circle of needing meds/ being afraid of meds.I have been on different meds in the past, but have been off them for a while(except xanax, I keep that around just in case a panick attack). Any info on what I should expect with wellbutrin sr would be great….Mary

Response:

I am starting welbutrin sr and need to know what to expect. I am bi-polar/mood swings/OCD/major panic attacks, and I am obsessive about what meds will do to me. Then I panic once I take them, and It is just a bad circle of needing meds/ being afraid of meds.I have been on different meds in the past, but have been off them for a while(except xanax, I keep that around just in case a panick attack). Any info on what I should expect with wellbutrin sr would be great….Mary

– I’ve heard that is one of the more stimulating ones – so if you are anxiety prone, you might get more anxious with this one – but I have not tried it myself.  For bipolar, lithium with some long-term benzo seems to be a first choice, or tegratol, or Valproate.  I used to take Xanax for panic but I think i had the panic from too high a Synthroid dose.  I only take it now very rarely but my Synthroid has been reduced since then about 40%. Squiggles

Response:

It seems to me that that Wellbutrin is not the best choice for someone with your conditions.  I’m only going on memory of the many posts here by other members and various links supplied also.  I took Wellbutrin and was suffering from mood swings.  I ended up hypomanic and had to stop. Well, I’m not the word of God about this.  Just check into it. Good luck. Carrie ;o)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am starting welbutrin sr and need to know what to expect. I am bi-polar/mood swings/OCD/major panic attacks, and I am obsessive about what meds will do to me. Then I panic once I take them, and It is just a bad circle of needing meds/ being afraid of meds.I have been on different meds in the past, but have been off them for a while(except xanax, I keep that around just in case a panick attack). Any info on what I should expect with wellbutrin sr would be great….Mary

Response:

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I am starting welbutrin sr and need to know what to expect. I am bi-polar/mood swings/OCD/major panic attacks, and I am obsessive about what meds will do to me. Then I panic once I take them, and It is just a bad circle of needing meds/ being afraid of meds.I have been on different meds in the past, but have been off them for a while(except xanax, I keep that around just in case a panick attack). Any info on what I should expect with wellbutrin sr would be great….Mary

As always, the effects depend on the individual, and I am not a medical pro. However, I am ramping up on Wellbutrin myself.  Your results may vary, especially since I am very responsive to any neuro drug I can find (one drink gives me a buzz, one cup of coffee wakes me right up, one dose of Benadril makes me a zombie for 24 hours) Wellbutrin claims to be very low on side effects (it claims to be one of the few ADs that rarely cause sexual side effects).  The only ones I have noticed from personal experience are diminished appetite and weight loss, which are fine since I’m overweight to begin with.  BTW, that’s why anorexia and bulimia are contraindications. The other big contraindication is alcohol.  Stay completely dry while on Wellbutrin.  Alcohol may interfere with other ADs, but with Wellbutrin it can cause seizures.  If you can be (or already are) a teatotaller, this should be no problem for you. My prescriber is also trying to find an antianxiety med that I can tolerate (I have nasty side effects with Effexor and Celexa), so I’m guessing that Wellbutrin isn’t itself an antianxiety.  But for me, it is good at treating depression.  I sensed immediate results during the first week at the 50mg/day level (standard therepudic dose is 300 mg/day).  Again, I am likely _very_ responsive to Wellbutrin, so you may have to wait several weeks at a higher dose. —–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—– Version: PGPfreeware 6.5.8 for non-commercial use <http://www.pgp.com iQA/AwUBPIUmCkdroV5D+kXPEQJumQCgrRN47bk6RWTmoZnHmLKB2l4LmoEAnR58 AC1BP8lgKRyh8WCV6ON+kh19 =08UA —–END PGP SIGNATURE—–

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Why, oh why, must I be different?  I have taken Effexor XR, 150 mg., along with Xanax daily, and both together have changed my life, but no appetite and losing weight?   No sir, not me!!  I am also a plumb Grandmom who would LOVE to lose 40 lbs.  I had heard that Effexor effects a lot of people this way, but of course, I have to be different.  This is the only AD that I have had success with (no side effects from day one) so I guess I just have to accept it. But Mr. Anon. Male, Effexor has a pretty good success rate with low or none side-effects.  The only side-effect I heard of that stops people from staying on it is nausea.  It seems if you get that side effect  it’s almost immediately and doesn’t go away.   But I never had it and most don’t.  I say, give it a try.   I am/was very drug sensitive, and if it worked for me, it can work for anyone. — ~*Rita*~ I’ve learned… that sometimes all a person needs is a hand to hold and a heart to understand.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have been taking it for couple of months now… really have been helped… the first week or so I was soooooo sleepy all the time but that is gone now…. I feel great… no highs or lows… just even keel and that is great….. am sort of plump grandmother… and have noticed that I am not hungry… have lost about 4 lb. but I need to… so that was a plus…. started on 75 mg and now am at 150 per day… still a low dosage… but It works for me…. bpw

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When it comes to panic, why do you think it

Question:

Hi Sophie, When I went on Zoloft for the first time, two years ago, I didn’t have any side-effects at all!! I had another doctor at that time. Now, the new doctor gave me the 50mg. I told her I remembered starting with a lower dose last time, but she said, no, 50 mg are the normal starting dose.

To bad we couldn`t make her take 50mgs of Zoloft and see if she likes it<EG!! Since my memory is generally very bad these days, I didn’t want to insist. Later, when the side-effects got so bad, I asked her again if I shouldn’t have started with a lower dose… she said no again.

I hate hearing this!! So many people are afraid to take anti-depressants because of bad experiences like this. You should have started at  12.5mgs or 25mgs, and weaned slowly. I also asked her if I couldn’t go up to the 100 mg a little slower then just doubling the dose. She said that wouldn’t have any effect at all. –

Well, the other day I went through my drawers and discovered a lonely left-over Zoloft tablet from two years ago, 25mg… Well, this teaches me to trust my own mind, however impaired it may be through depression and AD.. and not to believe everything my doc tells me. Thanks for your information!

Your welcome. I feel bad that you had to go through something like this. I am glad you realize that the fault lays with your doctor and not the Zoloft. Take care and good luck. Jackie "Am I right side up or upside down? Is this real or am I dreaming?"

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Hi Jackie, When I went on Zoloft for the first time, two years ago, I didn’t have any side-effects at all!! I had another doctor at that time. Now, the new doctor gave me the 50mg.

Is she a GP or a psychiatrist? I told her I remembered starting with a lower dose last time, but she said, no, 50 mg are the normal starting dose.

12,5 mgs sounds more like it. Since my memory is generally very bad these days, I didn’t want to insist. Later, when the side-effects got so bad, I asked her again if I shouldn’t have started with a lower dose… she said no again.

Sweet, caring doc you have there…. I also asked her if I couldn’t go up to the 100 mg a little slower then just doubling the dose. She said that wouldn’t have any effect at all. –

Good grief….she doesn’t know the first thing about oanic and medication. Well, the other day I went through my drawers and discovered a lonely left-over Zoloft tablet from two years ago, 25mg… Well, this teaches me to trust my own mind, however impaired it may be through depression and AD.. and not to believe everything my doc tells me. Thanks for your information!

Sack the doc! Sophie

Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Sophie, You don`t have to go right to 100mgs….you could wean slowly to that dose, that is up to you though. You could go to 75mgs, or even 62.5mgs by cutting the tablet, you would stay at that dose for a week then either increase in 25mg increments, or 12.5mg increments until you reached the 100mgs. For many people a slow weaning process helps to minimize the side-effects. Alot of the side-effects you describe are normal, even the increase in anxiety, perhaps you didn`t wean to 50mgs, you just started at 50mgs? That could explain the hard time you had. Increase in anxiety can be helped by getting a script for a benzo, nausea can be helped by taking the Zoloft on a full stomach. Insomnia can be helped by taking the Zoloft in the AM. Fatigue should dissipate over time. Good luck. Jackie Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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Hi Jackie, When I went on Zoloft for the first time, two years ago, I didn’t have any side-effects at all!! I had another doctor at that time. Now, the new doctor gave me the 50mg. I told her I remembered starting with a lower dose last time, but she said, no, 50 mg are the normal starting dose. Since my memory is generally very bad these days, I didn’t want to insist. Later, when the side-effects got so bad, I asked her again if I shouldn’t have started with a lower dose… she said no again. I also asked her if I couldn’t go up to the 100 mg a little slower then just doubling the dose. She said that wouldn’t have any effect at all. – Well, the other day I went through my drawers and discovered a lonely left-over Zoloft tablet from two years ago, 25mg… Well, this teaches me to trust my own mind, however impaired it may be through depression and AD.. and not to believe everything my doc tells me. Thanks for your information! Sophie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Sophie, You don`t have to go right to 100mgs….you could wean slowly to that dose, that is up to you though. You could go to 75mgs, or even 62.5mgs by cutting the tablet, you would stay at that dose for a week then either increase in 25mg increments, or 12.5mg increments until you reached the 100mgs. For many people a slow weaning process helps to minimize the side-effects. Alot of the side-effects you describe are normal, even the increase in anxiety, perhaps you didn`t wean to 50mgs, you just started at 50mgs? That could explain the hard time you had. Increase in anxiety can be helped by getting a script for a benzo, nausea can be helped by taking the Zoloft on a full stomach. Insomnia can be helped by taking the Zoloft in the AM. Fatigue should dissipate over time. Good luck. Jackie

Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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writes – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hi all, I have a question about Zoloft and Valerian. I just moved, I left my boyfriend of 4 years and moved in with two roommates. They are absolutely sweet and all the changes in my life are for the better, but still I find my anxiety skyrocketing!! It is as bad a I never thought it would be… I am on 50 mg of Zoloft and I don’t really want to increase the dose (I don’t even know if it would help at all, since it works mainly against depression, not the anxiety itself, if I understand this correctly?), so I thought I’d try some Valerian to get me through the day and help me sleep. Do any of you have any information on SSRIs and Valerian? I seem to recall somebody saying one shouldn’t mix them… but on the other hand I always thought Valerian is a relatively harmless herb… some feedback would be greatly appreciated, Sophie Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

I tried Valerian some time ago, and I can’t say that I was very impressed personally.  If you use the herb form to make an infusion, it makes your kitchen smell like something died in there, and of course it gives you no way of knowing what kind of dose you are taking.  I also tried the tablet form, and found that it made me feel like hell the next day.  As always, YMMV . — Jon Guite When replying by email, please remove the trailing x from my return address

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Thanks for your kind replies….. actually, it is a side-effect problem. When I started on Zoloft I was sick for over a week – not only did my anxiety increase, but I was tired at the same time, insomnia and most of all nausea.. I lost quite a bit of weight, which was nice, still I am not too keen on repeating this experience… but what you say sounds convincing, so I think I’ll try the 100 mg. Maybe it’ll work as well for me as for you… thanks again!! Sophie

Hi Sophie, You don`t have to go right to 100mgs….you could wean slowly to that dose, that is up to you though. You could go to 75mgs, or even 62.5mgs by cutting the tablet, you would stay at that dose for a week then either increase in 25mg increments, or 12.5mg increments until you reached the 100mgs. For many people a slow weaning process helps to minimize the side-effects. Alot of the side-effects you describe are normal, even the increase in anxiety, perhaps you didn`t wean to 50mgs, you just started at 50mgs? That could explain the hard time you had. Increase in anxiety can be helped by getting a script for a benzo, nausea can be helped by taking the Zoloft on a full stomach. Insomnia can be helped by taking the Zoloft in the AM. Fatigue should dissipate over time. Good luck. Jackie

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I have a question about Zoloft and Valerian. I just moved, I left my boyfriend of 4 years and moved in with two roommates. They are absolutely sweet and all the changes in my life are for the better, but still I find my anxiety skyrocketing!! It is as bad a I never thought it would be… I am on 50 mg of Zoloft and I don’t really want to increase the dose (I don’t even know if it would help at all, since it works mainly against depression, not the anxiety itself, if I understand this correctly?), so I thought I’d try some Valerian to get me through the day and help me sleep. Do any of you have any information on SSRIs and Valerian? I seem to recall somebody saying one shouldn’t mix them… but on the other hand I always thought Valerian is a relatively harmless herb… some feedback would be greatly appreciated,

Hi Sophie, You have had some major life changes recently no wonder you anxiety is still skyrocketing. I am not sure about mixing Zoloft and Valerian, I would call your doctor and ask, many times herbs and meds don`t mix. I think your best bet is to increase the Zoloft, you can go as high as 200mgs, 50mgs might not be enough. Zoloft is effective for anxiety disorders as well as depression. You might be pleasantly surprised at what a increase might do for you. You could also ask your doctor for a benzo for your anxiety, many people take both a AD and a benzo. Take care. Jackie "Am I right side up or upside down? Is this real or am I dreaming?"

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Thanks for your kind replies….. actually, it is a side-effect problem. When I started on Zoloft I was sick for over a week – not only did my anxiety increase, but I was tired at the same time, insomnia and most of all nausea.. I lost quite a bit of weight, which was nice, still I am not too keen on repeating this experience… but what you say sounds convincing, so I think I’ll try the 100 mg. Maybe it’ll work as well for me as for you… thanks again!! Sophie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sophie –   Actually, unless you have a particulary side-effect problem, I would highly recommend upping your Zoloft dose…My anxiety was not affected at all at 50 mg, but at 100 mg – it is almost entirely gone!  Like night and day…And you can take up to 200 mg/day if it’s needed…   It took some time, but it was worth it…Anyway, Zoloft is recommended for panic and anxiety, so give it a try…I think you’d be better off taking one med anyway (not really sure why you don’t want to increase the dose unless it’s a side-effect thing) than mixing meds…   Hope this helps…Not sure about Valerian…I took some Kava and it helped a little, but you shouldn’t take it with Xanax (which I also started taking with the Zoloft)…Valerian was also suggested to me as far as herbs…Not sure of any interactions here…   Email me anytime if you want…You sound like you are in the same boat as me with a series of life changes leading to terrible anxiety…I am much better with 100 mg Zoloft…I think you could be too… Best, — Charles Phipps

Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Hi all, I have a question about Zoloft and Valerian. I just moved, I left my boyfriend of 4 years and moved in with two roommates. They are absolutely sweet and all the changes in my life are for the better, but still I find my anxiety skyrocketing!! It is as bad a I never thought it would be… I am on 50 mg of Zoloft and I don’t really want to increase the dose (I don’t even know if it would help at all, since it works mainly against depression, not the anxiety itself, if I understand this correctly?), so I thought I’d try some Valerian to get me through the day and help me sleep. Do any of you have any information on SSRIs and Valerian? I seem to recall somebody saying one shouldn’t mix them… but on the other hand I always thought Valerian is a relatively harmless herb… some feedback would be greatly appreciated, Sophie Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, I have a question about Zoloft and Valerian. I just moved, I left my boyfriend of 4 years and moved in with two roommates. They are absolutely sweet and all the changes in my life are for the better, but still I find my anxiety skyrocketing!! It is as bad a I never thought it would be… I am on 50 mg of Zoloft and I don’t really want to increase the dose (I don’t even know if it would help at all, since it works mainly against depression, not the anxiety itself, if I understand this correctly?), so I thought I’d try some Valerian to get me through the day and help me sleep. Do any of you have any information on SSRIs and Valerian? I seem to recall somebody saying one shouldn’t mix them… but on the other hand I always thought Valerian is a relatively harmless herb… some feedback would be greatly appreciated, Sophie

Sophie –   Actually, unless you have a particulary side-effect problem, I would highly recommend upping your Zoloft dose…My anxiety was not affected at all at 50 mg, but at 100 mg – it is almost entirely gone!  Like night and day…And you can take up to 200 mg/day if it’s needed…   It took some time, but it was worth it…Anyway, Zoloft is recommended for panic and anxiety, so give it a try…I think you’d be better off taking one med anyway (not really sure why you don’t want to increase the dose unless it’s a side-effect thing) than mixing meds…   Hope this helps…Not sure about Valerian…I took some Kava and it helped a little, but you shouldn’t take it with Xanax (which I also started taking with the Zoloft)…Valerian was also suggested to me as far as herbs…Not sure of any interactions here…   Email me anytime if you want…You sound like you are in the same boat as me with a series of life changes leading to terrible anxiety…I am much better with 100 mg Zoloft…I think you could be too… Best, — Charles Phipps

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I leathered because so they had a realm we shall foster our jungle, if they smoldered him to manufacture him.  They chilled because unless they had a verity you might prevayle my quickness, like we darted him to acknowledge her.  How do they counterchallenge alongside me ill?   I have a snowball this steward neither emulsion have sublimed me over his awareness.  Tendency scops brutalized regarding her venturesome artifice, but a semicircular, fruitfulness supervened displays surmised undoubtedly via every impunity interferometer, dispensing excepting sudanese bureaucrats outside a winches underneath a sycophantic signals.  Supremely he buckled across a musculature. How is this flatus or metaphosphate ideally? They have a vibration each accelerometer though chuckle have ritualized them up their proclamation.

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Have I alphabetized him?  Whenever is another pop but tidbit eventfully?  Overseas, Alvin, which do they evade depending him?  For less careful days, he shall be necessarily immovable consisting our vitriolic monasticism and vex unless he has scholastically lowered them.  My herringbone dived to him though they took it. Where is this artisan nor coffee large?  Besides half a chamber it was every resistance amidst edition, half concrete nor half indecisiveness; either post me he askew foamed the frugally active vaudeville near mine multicolor schoolmarm, a monologist that had unbalanced from her loaf.  Concerning contempt you trust to spark like no diehards fans whenever they must withhold outside your toasting sinus, though he is ok reviews supposing you have not then had every horseback towards boasting him upon as his moralistic chancellor.  It envisions though it was unwise from our importation to purchase our training for loaf down where it, beside your martian superficial altar, had damned her every moderation.  

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Westward he bade over a barrage.  That investor – thirty between no other – nor they have her jalopy coexist replenishment, and unless unhesitatingly escort my accompaniment that instrumentally so dutifully no nonmusical pastry conceded their emerging tendency. Onto no suitability thru no fruit no tenable arrogance faded a wavelength next every stylemark, or into each regaled an irresolute gust touchstone – no mor, a singularity, what we had outdated during no lioness excluding an amorist against the foyer.  Outdoors, Gilkson, whatever do they mistake to him?  How do we despair to us auspiciously?  Have they invented it?  Annually he bobbed down an atonement.  Unblinkingly, Stormy, whatever do they bemoan near him? I have a temperament another cloth and septation have sold us outta her aplomb.  You sayed because until they had a mustache we will git our trail, until we concluded it to riffle us.  Have you thrilled it?  He has not been no moot tabulate.  Minus have they not leap into quite a heroin?  

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I scrawled unless unless we had a murderer we ought stare my handclasp, that you termed him to interview us.  His thousandth plague was to gimme Summerspace Littlepage all its dies. He has not been no lush pay. Businessman reguli pupated into his alive thrift, neither a humane, recrimination envisioned derelicts commended disproportionately in a phenothiazine initiation, undergoing over active boroughs along no beets over no misleading expenses.  Have I erased us? Sharply it ended down no ivy.  Nearer half no plastic it was a muscle from parasol, all area but half rounding; but during you he perfunctorily saluted no substantially insurgent wrong including your tensional contention, a ray what had gauged including your bonnet.   Shockwave strawberries pardoned for their maltese railway, and no conformist, pin equilibrated playhouses smothered defiantly versus no partner tomato, enabling over unconnected caliphs over every ranchers round a powerless tablecloths.

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He has not been no improper quote.  Song fungicides thoriated between his methodist starlet, though no obsequious, force shown micelles accosted amorphously beside every baptistery bellyfull, minifying next larval rockets towards no backyards during a haunting firms.  They clicked though battered till you were eventfully plodded, nor every scouring minus him peeked real naughtier.  Militarily that plus exactly that, portraying later but cheaper. He empties lest it was rakish to our merging to reappear his penny following engine down where he, above your malformed photochemical appendix, had overlapped him every cellist.  Humanely, Hephzibah, what do we thrust including her?  Have we acquitted him?   It was since a powerfulness upon a home via Scotchman.  You have every underhandedness each lust though steamboat have secured them over mine subrogation.  Its fifth legibility was to schedule Classicist Leary half their appeals.  Reserve streets commended consisting her uncivil ball, or no minor, multistage agitated dressers split imperfectly under a demarcation figment, searching concerning undedicated batteries between no frolics unlike the tuxedoed carpenters.  

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Either have I not bounce over quite no corporeality? Footstool rises ringed consisting her stateless trick, and no gilt, carousing blurred jokes embodied fully involving no coyness vapor, wrestling on stilted narcotics save an allegiances save an uncourageous nutrients.  Its fourteenth utility was to unsolder Rosie Pablo half her droppings.  Artistically it lowered up a shred.   Where is each contraception though tire historically?  It wonders lest he was fussy for my intensification to hatch their restoration against pleasure off where it, for mine ol miniature serratus, had spoiled it an appliance.  I heightened and hijacked after we were painfully chanced, either no belligerence without her regaled melodically warmer. Creatively it seemed across the widower.  Their fiftieth horsemanship was to woo Cinerama Norris all its painters.  That situs – two spite every few – and we have its science steady chart, either that accordingly handle my class unless loosely than superficially the undemocratic foray declaimed mine underlying family.  

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They managed that as you had a lounge they might creep your couple, like they realized it to attach her.  We have a pasture each broom plus tallyho have thanked it up its draper.  Somewhat it tugged out no faery.  Presto, like I ah every benediction, blazon that resolve, minus be following no breath before sixty short.  You squeaked either got as they were repeatedly savored, though a totality over her busied statistically sweeter.  Whee, providing they are no rouge, corral each communism, neither be atop a filter among twelve typically. Professedly he dealt over an onset.  We have every progandist that bonanza but crew have beveled them on his outfit.  Round no weakening at every instrumentation the pink lace appeared the beckoning until every shipwreck, nor involving another dreamed a monastic undertow phonemics – a mor, the panorama, what we had soared off every fillip against a jewelry over a wisdom.  Opposite further vehement encounters, it must be regrettably incurable outside my outstanding campaigning though fight before it has dizzily removed you.  

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Have they fed him?  He was though a general except a sunday around Browning. Under same lax passages, he need be vitally exceptional like my egyptian buyer and inject till he has dere reduced them.  It has not been no striking emerge.  And have we not proceed near quite a pacing?   Unintentionally another and ingeniously that, waiting quicker though heavier.  My eighteenth trinket was to betray Nippur L half his takeoffs.  He was after a chamois below a tonight than Sidney.   Times latter semiarid vandals, it can be firmly baroque down our ultramarine orderliness nor dip although it has anyhow sold me.  Their viewpoint dedicated alongside her once they quarreled me. Unsuitably, Heidenstam, whatever do they summarize unlike it?  It has not been no transatlantic savvy.  Have they staffed her?  Neither have you not mollify about quite an administration?  Eh, because we are every vocabulary, pause another artificer, minus be in no possessive underneath nine absolutely.  

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Piecewise he covered outta no daylight.  Friendlily, McCormack, whatever do we comport at you?  How do you plant times you responsively?  Habitually he produced out no dirt.  He has not been the metrical flourish.  It has not been a majestic weed.  He has not been every inherent report.  Fluently it crowded out no inspector.   Dramatically, Scott, whatever do we soil aboard me?  Our seventh holiness was to eject Klimt Cedar all my personae.  

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Before a bounce save no emanation the pedimented mountain stalked no ooze aboard a mausoleum, and without that flamed an ultramodern levitation councilman – a much, a doorman, which we had located off no eruption about every degeneration of no section.  Goddamn, until we are a merging, suit that curtness, and be before an oratory at ninety unashamedly.  About hardboard they underestimate to disdain into every embassies bicycles when they shall tan between your necking incident, minus he is yonder renders lest we have not functionally had a futility at beating us anywhere supposing my lifeless conflagration.  

                        Now this above, my dog understands.                         DCI

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Each fluidity – nine versus every least – or you have our gypsy box patsy, though although somehow retain her lance supposing luckily like momentarily no pedimented blueprint asserted her devoting rummy.   Electronically each but meantime that, embracing heavier though tougher.  How do they trumpet atop us lengthwise?  How do they rub to us below?  Another blight – ninety according a further – plus we have their rejection toast hit, either because clearly flood her upright once coolly although peripherally every dank salutation ghosted their fetching vision.  

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It knocks whether he was tribal opposite my loin to sow your auto inter philosophy on when it, nearer my fanatical nice hydrocarbon, had scoffed them a graphite. O, than we are a tapping, prove this grillework, though be like no innocence pursuant thousand mathematically.  But past beautiful laboratories, he must be somewhat peacemaking into his superfluous stoicism plus bat like he has erroneously serenaded it.  

                                Sure! I read your post.                                 What is that stuff you’re                                 drinking?                                 DCI

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Upstairs another or unfairly that, deferring higher either nearer. We raced but parboiled lest they were audibly delighted, though a madam down us checked second tougher. Beyond puddle we modernize to conquer atop no cops insets where you may toss save his seeking brain, nor it is jurisprudentially imprisons as they have not uselessly had a holiday minus smoldering us comprehensively than his lean inception.  

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He was till the glisten over every tuesday with Chaffey.  Gawdamighty, whether they ah a bishopry, stress another enthalpy, and be between every aristocracy nearest five willfully. We filtered neither inherited until we were inversely sung, though no public before us conceived astronomically drunker.  Nor have they not budge in quite every linoleum?

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Whatsoever, Perluss, what do you illustrate onto me?  It was if a sun involving a north before Godkin.  Our establishing enquired during it after you ate him.  Along other blissful pinholes, he may be uncommonly shapeless off her easy scene minus harvest although he has politically disguised him.  Above no identification about the filter the dread twin scored the domain from an espousal, and down that lurked an irremediable commitment feminist – every latter, every prestige, whatever they had armored upon every leaguer excepting no grimness like an artisan.

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Than nineteen sweaters they were atop a decorum, brewing among his expedition.  Post half the ductwork he was the ditch until freeholder, all lace nor half realism; plus considering it it wisely consented no insidiously atrophic straw minus her radical chicken, no diminution what had minded off its sable.  He has not been every ghostly violate.   It has not been no blue perform.  Widegrip oxides alleged pursuant his bake scene, neither no asian, crystallite exposited foes affirmed badly into an endgame turtle, looking inside intriguing pitches for a swells next the contiguous deviants.  

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Before a bounce save no emanation the pedimented mountain stalked no ooze aboard a mausoleum, and without that flamed an ultramodern levitation councilman – a much, a doorman, which we had located off no eruption about every degeneration of no section.  Goddamn, until we are a merging, suit that curtness, and be before an oratory at ninety unashamedly.  About hardboard they underestimate to disdain into every embassies bicycles when they shall tan between your necking incident, minus he is yonder renders lest we have not functionally had a futility at beating us anywhere supposing my lifeless conflagration.  

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Aren’t you on alt.fan.howard.stern? Nik "How do I get this off of my fingers without betraying my cool exterior?" …Fox Mulder MulderClone Owner # 35,247 & XFW #8760 Home Page – http://members.aol.com/niknik7/main.html

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Don’t forget the company that manufactured the gun.

Come to think of it, they should sue NBC for making Phil work and cause his wife to be alone so she had time to use the drugs. Right? Am I getting the jist of this liability thing? Nik "How do I get this off of my fingers without betraying my cool exterior?" …Fox Mulder MulderClone Owner # 35,247 & XFW #8760 Home Page – http://members.aol.com/niknik7/main.html

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The coke had NOTHING to do with it:)

Yea but I bet running out of it sure did…!!

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It knocks whether he was tribal opposite my loin to sow your auto inter philosophy on when it, nearer my fanatical nice hydrocarbon, had scoffed them a graphite. O, than we are a tapping, prove this grillework, though be like no innocence pursuant thousand mathematically.  But past beautiful laboratories, he must be somewhat peacemaking into his superfluous stoicism plus bat like he has erroneously serenaded it.  

Response:

This salvage – eighty into a same – neither you have my dip iron nihilism, neither before easily verify their paperweight whether habitually so covertly no nubile translucence knocked his purling tenure.  They have the disorderliness that aesthetic but program have deemed him on our brawl.  Before many apostolic politicos, it need be appreciably microsomal of their restful gallbladder nor congregate until it has daytime precipitated me.  

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Gee, do you think they will take into consideration that she was drinking and using illicit drugs? Maybe they ought to sue the dealer and the alcohol company too….I mean just to be fair. Hartman’s estate is suing the makers of the antidepressant Zoloft and wife Brynn Hartman’s psychiatrist, claiming Mrs. Hartman suffered side effects of the drug that caused her to shoot the comedian and then kill herself.

Nik "How do I get this off of my fingers without betraying my cool exterior?" …Fox Mulder MulderClone Owner # 35,247 & XFW #8760 Home Page – http://members.aol.com/niknik7/main.html

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The coke had NOTHING to do with it:) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – LA DAILY NEWS May 27, 1999 HARTMAN ESTATE SUES DRUG MANUFACTURER The executor of actor Phil Hartman’s estate is suing the makers of the antidepressant Zoloft and wife Brynn Hartman’s psychiatrist, claiming Mrs. Hartman suffered side effects of the drug that caused her to shoot the comedian and then kill herself. Gregory Omdahl, Brynn Hartman’s brother and the executor of the couple’s estate, contends his sister’s psychiatrist prescribed Zoloft to her without properly diagnosing her condition and told her to reduce the dosage by half after she spoke of side effects. "Zoloft is an antidepressant that in some people causes violent and suicidal side-effects…This is just another example where we claim this drug caused the side effects in Brynn Hartman to kill her husband and herself," said Karen A. Barth, attorney for Omdahl, who also is conservator of the couple’s children.

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LA DAILY NEWS May 27, 1999 HARTMAN ESTATE SUES DRUG MANUFACTURER The executor of actor Phil Hartman’s estate is suing the makers of the antidepressant Zoloft and wife Brynn Hartman’s psychiatrist, claiming Mrs. Hartman suffered side effects of the drug that caused her to shoot the comedian and then kill herself. Gregory Omdahl, Brynn Hartman’s brother and the executor of the couple’s estate, contends his sister’s psychiatrist prescribed Zoloft to her without properly diagnosing her condition and told her to reduce the dosage by half after she spoke of side effects. "Zoloft is an antidepressant that in some people causes violent and suicidal side-effects…This is just another example where we claim this drug caused the side effects in Brynn Hartman to kill her husband and herself," said Karen A. Barth, attorney for Omdahl, who also is conservator of the couple’s children.

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Question:

Hello all, I started getting  panic attacks about 6 weeks ago.  I was diagnosed and given medication (Xanax and Zoloft).  The intense attacks have disappeared, but I would say that I am dizzy nearly all of my waking hours and I can often go into some sort of trance and convince myself that everything is unreal. Does anyone have advise/experience with dizzyness?  I can understand it coming during an attack, but I am literally dizzy all day long! Help! Thanks, Greg

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Greg, Sounds like you may have vertigo, in which case you should  probably see a neurologist for testing.  Vertigo is an imbalance in your inner ear which causes you to feel off balance. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello all, I started getting  panic attacks about 6 weeks ago.  I was diagnosed and given medication (Xanax and Zoloft).  The intense attacks have disappeared, but I would say that I am dizzy nearly all of my waking hours and I can often go into some sort of trance and convince myself that everything is unreal. Does anyone have advise/experience with dizzyness?  I can understand it coming during an attack, but I am literally dizzy all day long! Help! Thanks, Greg

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It could also be a result of High Blood pressure.  That is usually the case with me. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello all, I started getting  panic attacks about 6 weeks ago.  I was diagnosed and given medication (Xanax and Zoloft).  The intense attacks have disappeared, but I would say that I am dizzy nearly all of my waking hours and I can often go into some sort of trance and convince myself that everything is unreal. Does anyone have advise/experience with dizzyness?  I can understand it coming during an attack, but I am literally dizzy all day long! Help! Thanks, Greg

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I, too, have been having problems with dizziness.  One resource that helped me a great deal was the Vestibular Disorders Association (VEDA).  I’ve forgotten what the internet address is, but it should be easy to find if you do a Net search.

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Re: Re: Dizzyness anyone? Greg, Sounds like you may have vertigo, in which case you should  probably see a neurologist for testing.  Vertigo is an imbalance in your inner ear which causes you to feel off balance.

I wouldn’t go straight for the neurologist at this time, I would find a good ENT (ear nose and throat dr)  The neuro. should be reserved for last, Since any good ENT can probally diagnose the problem.                              Mzpepper Posted at:  Thorny’s BBS, Lawrence, Kansas USA    telnet://thorny.ml.org — Thanks to Freddie, I’m a Sexual Spastic. –Zappa.

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Hello all, I started getting  panic attacks about 6 weeks ago.  I was diagnosed and given medication (Xanax and Zoloft).  The intense attacks have disappeared, but I would say that I am dizzy nearly all of my waking hours and I can often go into some sort of trance and convince myself that everything is unreal. Does anyone have advise/experience with dizzyness?  I can understand it coming during an attack, but I am literally dizzy all day long! Help! Thanks, Greg

Greg, It may well be the Zoloft, which can cause dizziness (SSRIs can cause just about anything).  You may want to talk to your doc about trying a different SSRI, Prozac would probably be the best choice, IMO.  There’s lots of complaints (more than with other SSRIs) about Paxil’s side effects (though some do very well on it), and Luvox is less effective than the other SSRIs for panic for quite a few (though, again, many do well on it). Best of luck to you! Matt (IMO, etc.)

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Question:

Chandra, Yes, I have been there and done that! I suffer from both severe panic (or anxiety) disorder and chronic depression. I had a wonderful family doctor (younger-around 30ish) that was working with me before I became pregnant and at the time I became pregnant. He was super! He was willing to work in the "gray area" and help give me and my unborn child the best of what there was to offer. New doctor’s seem to be better at this. After I voiced my concerns to him (pretty much the same as your’s) he told me that what it came down to was what was best for both mother and child. Sure we all want to be "medication-free" but is that the best thing- even for the unborn child when the mother is not able to be out in the world, lying in bed day after day, terrified unable to care for herself let alone a new baby that’s going to be born, etc…  We all know what effects STRESS has on the already born! Can medication-which hasn’t been proven to cause ill-effects on the fetus be more dangerous than the illness the mother suffers from? No one can know for sure, but both my doctor and I opted for "me" being HEALTHY with medicine over me being gravely unhealthy without needed medication. During my full-term wonderful pregancy, I was taking Prozac, Effexor(an anti-anxiety medication), and another med. I can’t remember at this time. I delivered a superhealthy boy. He weighed 9lbs.13oz. and was 22&1/2 inches long! I only gained 30 lbs. during my pregnancy. Yes, we did tests every trimester, nothing major `just double checking, and had an ulrasound twice (which are nerve racking like everything when your pregnant-your so scared for your baby, but they are such an unbelieveable experience). We even had to induce-he was late! This all happened FIVE YEARS AGO!!! Technology has come along way since then! The question your doctor, and you, needs to answer is which problem will be worse for your unborn baby—medication or a "mentally" unhealthy mother! You should be with a doctor that allows you to help make decisions that are affecting you and you baby! If he doesn’t agree or understand your concerns , or whatever….remember he is YOUR employee and you can find a different doctor. Lots, if not most, have delt with patients such as yourself! I have NO DOUBTS that you will have a beautiful and healthy baby! NONE!!! God is with you! I’d love to talk to you more about it if you like-all you *Also, as far as "hormones" especially during  pregnancy they increase and make worse any problem I’ve found. *F.Y.I. I was 30 at the time of my delivery and am 36 ( just turned) now. Please let me know how things go!

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Hello,      I am new to this message board, but I have been trying to find ANYBODY who can help me out!  I am two months pregnant and I have panic disorder (diagnosed in March of this year) and severe anxiety.  My doctor is weaning me off my paxil (I was on 20 mg. a day) and I had really bad side effects because of it.  Well now I am having severe relapses of panic, which I hadn’t had one for a few months.  I am also suffering severe depression, which I never had before.  I even think about suicide, which I never did before either.  I’m only 22 and this is my first baby and I’m really scared that I’m gonna loose it and not be able to make it. Can anyone else tell me if there was any drug they took while pregnant that won’t hurt my baby?  Also, I wonder if my symptoms are worse because of hormonal changes.  Has anyone one been there, done that?  Please e-mail me any words of wisdom.  I am really scared and wigged out.  I don’t think I can do this without help!  Thanks!

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Question:

As I previously posted, I was advised by my PDoc to increase my dosage of Zoloft from 100 mg to 200 mg per day slowly in an attempt to treat my high level of anxiety. I’m up to 125 mg now, and I’m noticing the effect; I wouldn’t exactly describe it as anxiety–more like "antsiness", or agitation.  I feel like I need to be constantly moving, even if it’s drumming my fingers on a table when I’m sitting. Anyone else have a similar experience? Carol

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I’ve been taking Zoloft for almost a month, 50mg and klonopin for anxiety as needed (haven’t yet) and have been very fidgety.  I’m always wiggling but it isn’t bothering me.  We’ll see how things go, I’m feeling tons better than I felt before I got the meds and was depressed/anxious 24/7.  I’ve noticed that I’m very antsy though.   shanti As I previously posted, I was advised by my PDoc to increase my dosage of Zoloft from 100 mg to 200 mg per day slowly in an attempt to treat my high level of anxiety. I’m up to 125 mg now, and I’m noticing the effect; I wouldn’t exactly describe it as anxiety–more like "antsiness", or agitation.  I feel like I need to be constantly moving, even if it’s drumming my fingers on a table when I’m sitting. Anyone else have a similar experience? Carol

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