Just buy a separate voltage converter (what the heck are those things called?..someone help me) that will enable you to use your nebulizer, hairdryer, etc. when in Europe. They are not expensive. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m going to Europe for 3 weeks in June. I’ve had severe asthma for my whole life (50, now) that’s usually under control with Albuterol, Serevent, and Flovent. I’ll be taking those medihalers with me, but, thought it might be wise to take some kind of portable nebulizer and some albuterol solution just in case. I assume I’m looking for a battery powered ultrasonic one, but, was wondering if there’s one with a transformer/recharger that works with the European voltages (220 VAC/50Hz). I’ll be traveling in France, Germany, and Italy. Thanks!
I know in England that Omeron does a battery one for
I had told the nurse I wanted to do the CT scan today and she said she would schedule it and call with a time. I let the time get away from me and before I knew it, it was after 5pm. I guess I will call this morning and see what is up. I have a question for anyone who may know. I have been taking Bidex, Singulair and Histussin HC for the past week for my breathing and chest congestion. Do any of these cause a depressing or down-feeling effect? I have felt like crying a lot the last couple of days. Of course, when I have felt bad for too long I feel that way also. I was just wondering if any of these meds could have that side-effect? Vicki — The charter is available at:
does anyone here know what the sideaffects of zoloft are? i have been on the 100mg for a week now, well tomorrow it will be. and tonight i felt shaky inside, nervous, but yet i also felt like i was in a coma. i just didn’t want to move. thank you everyone for the great responses.
I also felt shaky..very shaky, and only at a 12.5 dose. It was like drinking 3 pots of coffee. I started at 12.5 mg, then titrated by 12.5 mg per week despite my depression being severe. All that went away. I now take 200mg with no problems and no nervousness. — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
does anyone here know what the sideaffects of zoloft are? i have been on the 100mg for a week now, well tomorrow it will be. and tonight i felt shaky inside, nervous, but yet i also felt like i was in a coma. i just didn’t want to move. thank you everyone for the great responses. yes i know i can’t spell lol. — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
Hi, Many of the meds we take do have side effects which usually will go away in time. Some could include anxiety, sleepiness… Could the coma-like state you refer to be depersonalization which is defined as a state in which one no longer perceives the reality of one’s self or one’s environment? smiles, Elise
does anyone here know what the sideaffects of zoloft are? i have been on the 100mg for a week now, well tomorrow it will be. and tonight i felt shaky inside, nervous, but yet i also felt like i was in a coma. i just didn’t want to move. thank you everyone for the great responses. yes i know i can’t spell lol. — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
– The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
::does anyone here know what the sideaffects of zoloft are? i have been ::on the 100mg for a week now, well tomorrow it will be. and tonight i ::felt shaky inside, nervous, but yet i also felt like i was in a coma. i ::just didn’t want to move. thank you everyone for the great responses. ::yes i know i can’t spell lol. Dear Gina, I really hate listing side effects of a med for fear it will cause someone to anticipate them. I can tell you this, the symptoms you are experiencing are common side effects of Zoloft. They are not dangerous, just very uncomfortable. You do have some options, ask your doctor for a benzo (Xanax, Klonopin, Ativan) to be used while you acclimate to Zoloft. It can really help to tame side-effects. If you find you are just too uncomfortable and your doctor won’t prescribe a benzo, ask him to ‘temporarily’ lower your dose a bit, then wean slowly back to 100 mgs. What was your dose before your doctor increased you to 100mgs? How long had you been on that dose? Feel better soon! Jackie ~*~The glass isn’t half full or half empty… the glass is EMPTY…BONE DRY…NOTHING! 
~*~ — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
jackie, I am just going to counseling. i started the 50mg about a month ago and went straight to 100mg after that. i started getting tickling feelings and numbness in some places, so now i am back to 50mg. my counselar thinks now maybe bipolar, but i don’t think so. gina – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear Gina, I really hate listing side effects of a med for fear it will cause someone to anticipate them. I can tell you this, the symptoms you are experiencing are common side effects of Zoloft. They are not dangerous, just very uncomfortable. You do have some options, ask your doctor for a benzo (Xanax, Klonopin, Ativan) to be used while you acclimate to Zoloft. It can really help to tame side-effects. If you find you are just too uncomfortable and your doctor won’t prescribe a benzo, ask him to ‘temporarily’ lower your dose a bit, then wean slowly back to 100 mgs. What was your dose before your doctor increased you to 100mgs? How long had you been on that dose? Feel better soon! Jackie ~*~The glass isn’t half full or half empty… the glass is EMPTY…BONE DRY…NOTHING! ~*~ — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
– The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
::I am just going to counseling. i started the 50mg about a month ago and ::went straight to 100mg after that. i started getting tickling feelings ::and numbness in some places, so now i am back to 50mg. my counselar ::thinks now maybe bipolar, but i don’t think so. Dear Gina, A 50mg increase at one time is too much for someone with an anxiety disorder. When it comes to Zoloft, increasing in 12.5 or 25mg increments is the best way to go. If you decide to go for 100mgs, do it slowly. It won’t be so painful. About the Bipolar diagnosis, get a 2nd from a psychiatrist. When we are very anxious and panicky it can mimic other mental disorders, like Bipolar. Didn’ t this therapist tell you last week that she thought you had PTSD? Who is prescribing your Zoloft? Take care, Gina Jackie ~*~Acting like a witch…..Eating 14 chocolate bars…..this isn`t a holiday for — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts. They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day. I have tried natural progesterone cream. I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it. My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks. I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas? Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana
" Does anyone have any ideas? Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence?
Hi Nana, It’s my understanding that a Effexor, an antidepressant, is used to help hot flashes. I was diagnosed almost twenty years ago and completed a year of CMF chemo a year after diagnosis. The chemo induced a premature menopause and with it came the hot flashes. They abated a bit for quite a few years, but are back now (probably coinciding with the time of my natural menopause). I haven’t asked my Dr. about the Effexor because I know that the antidepressants come with some side effects. While I hate the hot flashes, I’ll put up with them over the possible side effects of a tricyclic antidepressant. Good luck to you! Barb
I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it. My lump was ER+.
Susan Love debunks this on her site: http://www.susanlovemd.com/community/flashes/hotflash030725.htm
Barb, I think Effexor is not a tricyclic antidepressant. I believe it works in a similar way to the ‘new’ antidepressants like Prozac. The older tricyclics have some unpleasant side effects but I understand that the new antidepressants are relatively free of significant side effects. With Effexor, the main problems seem to be nausea, sweating and insomnia but I know that these don’t affect everybody and I suppose the severity must be related to the dose. My wife couldn’t tolerate these drugs after her chemo and she had to put up with the hot flashes. However, I know people who get along just fine with Effexor and it is a great help to them. It would be a shame if anybody had to suffer unnecessarily because of concerns about Effexor side effects. Some people don’t have any side effects at all. I know a lot of people don’t like the thought of taking antidepressants and it’s certainly not for me to say they are right or wrong. However, if these drugs can help with the hot flashes, some might consider it worthwhile to speak to their doctor. Best wishes to you, Richard
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – " Does anyone have any ideas? Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? Hi Nana, It’s my understanding that a Effexor, an antidepressant, is used to help hot flashes. I was diagnosed almost twenty years ago and completed a year of CMF chemo a year after diagnosis. The chemo induced a premature menopause and with it came the hot flashes. They abated a bit for quite a few years, but are back now (probably coinciding with the time of my natural menopause). I haven’t asked my Dr. about the Effexor because I know that the antidepressants come with some side effects. While I hate the hot flashes, I’ll put up with them over the possible side effects of a tricyclic antidepressant. Good luck to you! Barb
Hi Nana, I don’t know if this is true for all but whenever I ate foods with sugar I would get an almost immediate hot flash. Avoiding those foods helped a great deal. Then, if and when I did get one I tried to ride it through like a wave on the ocean. Doing that me feel like I had some sense of control and that helped, too. Do hope these are lessened for you—take care…
I had unbearable hot flashes after CMF-induced chemopause at age 43. Every 20-30 minutes, 24/7, dripping sweat on the floor…. I tried the yam cream (no help), clonidine patches (wouldn’t stick I sweat so much)- finally my onc tried Effexor XR– I got almost immediate relief (I take 75 mg in the AM) The major side effect is that it can raise your blood pressure. I have zero side effects. jeannette
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts. They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day. I have tried natural progesterone cream. I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it. My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks. I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas? Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana
I am a little nervous. I reviewed my pathology report and remembered that my lump was both ER+ and PR+. I have been using the natural progesterone cream for 3 weeks. Do you think this could have caused a problem? I am not going to use any more "natural" methods such as progesterone cream or black cohosh. Black Cohosh is estrogen like and therefore could possibly encourage tumor growth.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts. They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day. I have tried natural progesterone cream. I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it. My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks. I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas? Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana
Barb, I think Effexor is not a tricyclic antidepressant. I believe it works in a similar way to the ‘new’ antidepressants like Prozac.
You are correct; Effexor is a selective serotonin reuptake inhibiter (SSRI). As with any drug, it may have unwanted side effects, but is generally better tolerated than the tricyclics (which aren’t that bad for many people). Clonidine (Catapres(R)), an alpha adrenergic blocker usually used for blood pressure control helps some folks, as does Bellergal or similar mixtures, evening primrose oil, and vitamin E. I think the SSRIs are currently preferred. Zoloft and Effexor are both good. Both can be associated with either weight gain or loss; Effexor is a little more likely to cause weight loss than gain, while most of the others cause gain more frequently than loss. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The older tricyclics have some unpleasant side effects but I understand that the new antidepressants are relatively free of significant side effects. With Effexor, the main problems seem to be nausea, sweating and insomnia but I know that these don’t affect everybody and I suppose the severity must be related to the dose. My wife couldn’t tolerate these drugs after her chemo and she had to put up with the hot flashes. However, I know people who get along just fine with Effexor and it is a great help to them. It would be a shame if anybody had to suffer unnecessarily because of concerns about Effexor side effects. Some people don’t have any side effects at all. I know a lot of people don’t like the thought of taking antidepressants and it’s certainly not for me to say they are right or wrong. However, if these drugs can help with the hot flashes, some might consider it worthwhile to speak to their doctor. Best wishes to you, Richard " Does anyone have any ideas? Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? Hi Nana, It’s my understanding that a Effexor, an antidepressant, is used to help hot flashes. I was diagnosed almost twenty years ago and completed a year of CMF chemo a year after diagnosis. The chemo induced a premature menopause and with it came the hot flashes. They abated a bit for quite a few years, but are back now (probably coinciding with the time of my natural menopause). I haven’t asked my Dr. about the Effexor because I know that the antidepressants come with some side effects. While I hate the hot flashes, I’ll put up with them over the possible side effects of a tricyclic antidepressant. Good luck to you! Barb
Thanks for the correction. I knew when I wrote it that it didn’t look right, and should have known better. My daughter took many, many of the SSRI’s a couple of years ago for postpartum depression. She had a hard time finding the right one and did have significant side effects with this category of drugs. That doesn’t mean that another person would have the same. I just prefer to put up with the hot flashes rather than risk the possible side effects. It’s great when a person gets the optimum benefit with few of the hassles, isn’t it? Thanks again for clearing my "boo-boo". Barb
Hi, Nana: I must be one of the weird ones. I have the hot flashes, but I love the blinkin’ things — first time I’ve been warm in years. 
I was also ER+. Nonetheless, when I started having the hot flashes, by onc offered to put me on an estrogen ring which would emit just enough estrogen to keep the hot flashes down but not enough to exacerbate the cancer. I didn’t take it because, as I said, I’m crazy and love my hot flashes. If any body here would have an answer for you, it would be Tim. As far as I’m concerned, he’s our guru. But I wouldn’t take anything without talking first with your oncologist. Until you do, grab a fan and ice water, girlfriend! I wish I could take your flashes for you. I only get them every 3 minutes! Hugs, Mary K
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am a little nervous. I reviewed my pathology report and remembered that my lump was both ER+ and PR+. I have been using the natural progesterone cream for 3 weeks. Do you think this could have caused a problem? I am not going to use any more "natural" methods such as progesterone cream or black cohosh. Black Cohosh is estrogen like and therefore could possibly encourage tumor growth. I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts. They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day. I have tried natural progesterone cream. I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it. My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks. I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas? Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana
I don’t really know very much about this. I would certainly think that progesterone cream was a bad idea if the cancer is PR+, however the effect on potential tumours is relatively long term, so I doubt that 3 weeks has caused a problem. With regard to Black Cohosh and its ilk, there seem to be differing opinions, and the research results seem to be uncertain. One obviously wants to minimise estrogen activity, but to replace the function of estrogen in -parts- of the body. So the fact that it is estrogen-like is not necessarily a bad thing, it depends on the specific effects on breast cancer tissue, ie which particular estrogen receptors it can bind to. After all Tamoxifen is estrogen-like in that it binds to estrogen receptors, but of course having done so it dos not activate them. I wouldn’t rule it out yet, but I’d read up on the latest research before using it, and of course consult with your oncologist before prescribing yourself anything, ‘natural’ or otherwise. Tim Jackson – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If any body here would have an answer for you, it would be Tim. I am a little nervous. I reviewed my pathology report and remembered that my lump was both ER+ and PR+. I have been using the natural progesterone cream for 3 weeks. Do you think this could have caused a problem? I am not going to use any more "natural" methods such as progesterone cream or black cohosh. Black Cohosh is estrogen like and therefore could possibly encourage tumor growth.
Too bad the abstract didn’t list WHICH Vit. E — there are four, each with it’s own individual properties. Lady8
<< Too bad the abstract didn’t list WHICH Vit. E — there are four, each with it’s own individual properties. Lady8 I don’t know that much about vitamins but do think we need to be cautious about anything out-of-the norm that we opt to take. One important fact about vitamins and supplements–they are considered dietary aids and are under different regulations for manufacture than medications. What is contained and what the label states is contained do not have to be the same. Because they are considered ‘dietary,’ they are allowed some leeway in that regard. So, if decides to take them it is good to ascertain whether or not the company that you are getting them from guarantees that the ingredients and % of amounts are accurate. Some vitamin manufacturers, however, do guarantee that their products and labels are accurate even though they are not required to do so (state that they are guaranteed, accurate, or even be accurate).
Dee wrote << The Vitamin E worked to reduce the severity and made the flashes tolerable. I was surprised at a doctor making that suggestion. I really don’t know alot about vitamins but there appear to be mixed reviews on whether they are or aren’t good for those with breast cancer. "http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/htbin-post/Entrez/query?uid=11807780&form… b=m&Dopt=r "1: Int J Cancer 2002 Feb 10;97(5):574-9 Oxidant-antioxidant status in relation to survival among breast cancer patients. Saintot M, Mathieu-Daude H, Astre C, Grenier J, Simony-Lafontaine J, Gerber M. Centre de Recherche en Cancerologie, INSERM-CRLCC, Val D’Aurelle, Parc Euromedecine, Montpellier, France. The role of plasma oxidant-antioxidant status in survival after breast cancer surgery was investigated in a cohort of patients (n = 363) hospitalized in Southern France between 1989 and 1992. The median follow-up was 8 years after surgery for histologically confirmed breast cancer. Plasma analyses were performed after diagnosis and before surgery and adjuvant therapy. We found an inverse relationship between plasma lipoperoxides (MDA) and tumor size at diagnosis, together with higher lipoperoxide levels in node-negative tumors than in node-positive ones (TNM). The longitudinal approach revealed an increased risk of recurrence for patients with plasma lipoperoxides in the highest tertile of the sample (RR = 2.1, 95% CI 1.1-4.0). In addition, the risk of recurrence increased (RR = 1.7, 95%CI 1.0-3.0), after adjustment for the known prognostic factors (TNM), for patients with plasma lipid-adjusted vitamin E levels of over 22 micromol/l. The risk of breast cancer death was twice as great for patients with plasma lipid-adjusted vitamin E levels above this value. Excesses of plasma lipoperoxides and vitamin E appear to be factors in poor prognosis for breast cancer-specific survival (OVS) and disease-free survival (DFS), respectively, independent of tumor characteristics at diagnosis. Several hypotheses are advanced to explain the possible role of plasma vitamin E as a factor in poor prognosis for survival. Copyright 2001 Wiley-Liss, Inc. MeSH Terms: * Adult * Aged * Aged, 80 and over * Antioxidants/metabolism* * Biological Markers/blood * Breast Neoplasms/surgery * Breast Neoplasms/secondary * Breast Neoplasms/mortality* * Breast Neoplasms/metabolism* * Carcinoma, Infiltrating Duct/surgery * Carcinoma, Infiltrating Duct/secondary * Carcinoma, Infiltrating Duct/metabolism* * Carcinoma, Infiltrating Duct/epidemiology * Carcinoma, Intraductal, Noninfiltrating/surgery * Carcinoma, Intraductal, Noninfiltrating/metabolism* * Carcinoma, Intraductal, Noninfiltrating/epidemiology * Carcinoma, Lobular/surgery * Carcinoma, Lobular/secondary * Carcinoma, Lobular/metabolism* * Carcinoma, Lobular/epidemiology * Cholesterol/blood * Cohort Studies * Disease-Free Survival * Female * Follow-Up Studies * France/epidemiology * Human * Lipid Peroxides/blood * Longitudinal Studies * Lymphatic Metastasis * Middle Age * Neoplasm Recurrence, Local * Oxidants/blood* * Receptors, Estrogen/metabolism * Survival Rate Substances: * Cholesterol * Receptors, Estrogen * Oxidants * Lipid Peroxides * Biological Markers * Antioxidants PMID: 11807780 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]"
Interesting. I suppose I could learn. No I hadn’t heard of that either One might theorise about the tissue’s response to T which makes it ineffective after five years. Something like preferentially breeding cell lines which are resistant to T. Perhaps a similar effect occurs in other tissues and maybe that can cause a withdrawal effect when you stop. Do you know which arm of ATAC you were on, or is it totally blind? Tim
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t really know very much about this. Well perhaps you know something about this: In late June I finished the five year course of the ATAC programme (Arimidex, Tamoxifen, Alone or Combined). About two weeks after that I had a hot flush (being English – it’s what we say!) The incidents have increased, now I have them two or three times a day. Might there be a link? Mary (not due to menopause, that was fourteen years ago!)
Interesting. I suppose I could learn. No I hadn’t heard of that either One might theorise about the tissue’s response to T which makes it ineffective after five years. Something like preferentially breeding cell lines which are resistant to T. Perhaps a similar effect occurs in other tissues and maybe that can cause a withdrawal effect when you stop. Do you know which arm of ATAC you were on, or is it totally blind?
Totally blind. No clues at all. No-one knows. As I said, it might not be related but the co-incidence at my age might be significant. As you said, it’s interesting Mary – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Tim I don’t really know very much about this. Well perhaps you know something about this: In late June I finished the five year course of the ATAC programme (Arimidex, Tamoxifen, Alone or Combined). About two weeks after that I had a hot flush (being English – it’s what we say!) The incidents have increased, now I have them two or three times a day. Might there be a link? Mary (not due to menopause, that was fourteen years ago!)
My problem is I don’t understand what mechanism causes the hot flushes. I understand that they happen in estrogen withdrawal, but I don’t know why. My thinking about Tamoxifen resistance is that most of our body tissues are constantly slowly being renewed, especially those in which cancer can occur. So if we change the regime of growth factors in which this happen we prevent the cell lines which are promoted by the particular growth factor, in this case estrogen, from being replaced as they die out, and cell lines which use other mechanisms become prevalent. Pure Darwin. And so the tissue becomes refractory to the drug. We know the cells have the potential to use different growth factors because we get cancers which do. This mechanism would equally apply to aromatase inhibitors, it is directly dependent on the absence of estrogen stimulation however caused and exactly parallels the cancer suppression. If this is the mechanism then one would expect the incidence of ER+ cancers to have fallen immediately the drug was introduced, to a plateau where it would pretty much stay even after the drug was eventually withdrawn, but the incidence of ER- cancers would have slowly risen because of the increased proportion of non-estrogen dependent cell lines (but of course not by as much as the ER+ fell, because they are the prevalent cancer). Another prediction of the model is that if a woman who was post 5 years Tamoxifen took estrogen therapy, or became pregnant, her breasts would not enlarge as much as they normally do. In this scenario it is clear that the reintroduction of estrogen would do -something- although it would have little effect on breast tissue growth. It should for example still inhibit osteoclasts (bone removal cells), as the removal of an inhibition would not have suppressed cell line evolution. If I understood how estrogen withdrawal actually causes spurious fluctuations in the temperature control system, then maybe I could use this model to explain a similar effect on reintroduction. Tim Jackson – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – One might theorise about the tissue’s response to T which makes it ineffective after five years. In late June I finished the five year course of the ATAC programme (Arimidex, Tamoxifen, Alone or Combined). About two weeks after that I had a hot flush (being English – it’s what we say!)
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My problem is I don’t understand what mechanism causes the hot flushes. I understand that they happen in estrogen withdrawal, but I don’t know why. My thinking about Tamoxifen resistance is that most of our body tissues are constantly slowly being renewed, especially those in which cancer can occur. So if we change the regime of growth factors in which this happen we prevent the cell lines which are promoted by the particular growth factor, in this case estrogen, from being replaced as they die out, and cell lines which use other mechanisms become prevalent. Pure Darwin. And so the tissue becomes refractory to the drug. We know the cells have the potential to use different growth factors because we get cancers which do. This mechanism would equally apply to aromatase inhibitors, it is directly dependent on the absence of estrogen stimulation however caused and exactly parallels the cancer suppression.
Um. I -think- I understand some of that … If this is the mechanism then one would expect the incidence of ER+ cancers to have fallen immediately the drug was introduced, to a plateau where it would pretty much stay even after the drug was eventually withdrawn, but the incidence of ER- cancers would have slowly risen because of the increased proportion of non-estrogen dependent cell lines (but of course not by as much as the ER+ fell, because they are the prevalent cancer). Another prediction of the model is that if a woman who was post 5 years Tamoxifen took estrogen therapy, or became pregnant, her breasts would not enlarge as much as they normally do.
Mine was ER+, I -think- that’s comforting … In this scenario it is clear that the reintroduction of estrogen would do -something- although it would have little effect on breast tissue growth. It should for example still inhibit osteoclasts (bone removal cells), as the removal of an inhibition would not have suppressed cell line evolution.
As I -think- I unerstand that it suggests that I should have estrogen re-introduced – although perhaps I’m still producing my own. I was tested post menopausally be pre-cancer diagnosis and told I had an excess of estrogen. If I understood how estrogen withdrawal actually causes spurious fluctuations in the temperature control system, then maybe I could use this model to explain a similar effect on reintroduction.
Of course I only started the flushes at menopause but all my life I’ve been a hot and sweaty person. Still am. I sweat in bed while Spouse shivers, he’s always warmed himself on me. Today I’m in shorts and T-shirt (not a pretty sight but I’m comfortable). He’s in jeans and sweat shirt. He says it’s because his thermostat works and mine doesn’t Mary – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Tim Jackson One might theorise about the tissue’s response to T which makes it ineffective after five years. In late June I finished the five year course of the ATAC programme (Arimidex, Tamoxifen, Alone or Combined). About two weeks after that I had a hot flush (being English – it’s what we say!)
No one has mentioned Vitamin E pills? Tthe gyn recommended trying it and said there were prescription drugs that might help, if it didn’t. The Vitamin E worked to reduce the severity and made the flashes tolerable. I was surprised at a doctor making that suggestion. Also, don’t some people call them "power surges."
I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts. They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day. I have tried natural progesterone cream. I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it. My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks. I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas? Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana
No one has mentioned Vitamin E pills? Tthe gyn recommended trying it and said there were prescription drugs that might help, if it didn’t. The Vitamin E worked to reduce the severity and made the flashes tolerable. I was surprised at a doctor making that suggestion. Also, don’t some people call them "power surges."
LOL! I’ll try to remember that Mary
Yeah, they do call them power surges! Believe me, my power *really* surges, too!! I do take the Vitamin E. 2,000IU per day. It also is supposed to help the mind and is recommended often for Alzheimer’s patients. I must be hopeless: I still have the hot flashes BIG time. My husband has the Alzheimer’s disease and he does seem to be doing pretty well. I, on the other hand, forget where I put my car keys, checkbook, etc. 
Mary K
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No one has mentioned Vitamin E pills? Tthe gyn recommended trying it and said there were prescription drugs that might help, if it didn’t. The Vitamin E worked to reduce the severity and made the flashes tolerable. I was surprised at a doctor making that suggestion. Also, don’t some people call them "power surges." I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts. They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day. I have tried natural progesterone cream. I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it. My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks. I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas? Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana
the reintroduction of estrogen would… for example still inhibit osteoclasts (bone removal cells) As I -think- I unerstand that it suggests that I should have estrogen re-introduced – although perhaps I’m still producing my own. I was tested post menopausally be pre-cancer diagnosis and told I had an excess of estrogen.
Yes. I wouldn’t advocate adding to what you already produce yourself. That shouldn’t have changed. Of course I only started the flushes at menopause but all my life I’ve been a hot and sweaty person. Still am. I sweat in bed while Spouse shivers, he’s always warmed himself on me. Today I’m in shorts and T-shirt (not a pretty sight but I’m comfortable). He’s in jeans and sweat shirt. He says it’s because his thermostat works and mine doesn’t
Yes, this is the fascinating bit. I know everyone’s thermostat is different and it depends on body weight and things, and it probably has something to do with fat metabolism, and so does (aromatase) estrogen production, but I can’t quite see the connection all the same. Tim
I don’t really know very much about this.
Well perhaps you know something about this: In late June I finished the five year course of the ATAC programme (Arimidex, Tamoxifen, Alone or Combined). About two weeks after that I had a hot flush (being English – it’s what we say!) The incidents have increased, now I have them two or three times a day. Might there be a link? Mary (not due to menopause, that was fourteen years ago!)
sylvain, (&FJ if you’re reading this) been out of town for almost a week, hence the delayed reply. i switched to lexapro at the instigation of my female companion, to reduce the well-known sexual side-effect. in my case, the sexual side-effect was greatly reduced in fact.
That the sexual sideeffects are reduced so much compared th seroxat is good news to me. This is what I’m after, a lessening of sideeffects and the same benefits anxiety wise. Could you make an immediate shift between the two meds or did you have to cut down the milligrams slowly and then start on the new med?
FJ wrote:
That the sexual sideeffects are reduced so much compared th seroxat is good news to me. This is what I’m after, a lessening of sideeffects and the same benefits anxiety wise. Could you make an immediate shift between the two meds or did you have to cut down the milligrams slowly and then start on the new med?
Usually you should be able to cut down one med and up the other at the same time but discuss it with your shrink.
None <i-dont-want-to-receive-any-ma…@swissonline.ch
wrote in message <news:3f5b685f$1@news.swissonline.ch… FJ wrote: That the sexual sideeffects are reduced so much compared th seroxat is good news to me. This is what I’m after, a lessening of sideeffects and the same benefits anxiety wise. Could you make an immediate shift between the two meds or did you have to cut down the milligrams slowly and then start on the new med? Usually you should be able to cut down one med and up the other at the same time but discuss it with your shrink.
i actually stopped taking the paxil completely & switched to lexapro the day after i got some. i wasn’t as worried about that as i perhaps should have been, because several times before i had missed one dose of paxil–but made sure i never missed two in consecutive days–and missing one dose didn’t affect me greatly, just made me a little edgy.
yitwail wrote:
i actually stopped taking the paxil completely & switched to lexapro the day after i got some. i wasn’t as worried about that as i perhaps should have been, because several times before i had missed one dose of paxil–but made sure i never missed two in consecutive days–and missing one dose didn’t affect me greatly, just made me a little edgy.
At times I get all sad if I only miss my Effexor dose by a few hours. At other times I can miss it completely for a day and don’t notice. It’s weird.
"Sylvain Van der Walde" <sylvain.vanderwa…@which.net
wrote in message <news:F4F3b.1606$FZ3.430214@newsfep2-win.server.ntli.net…
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
"FJ" <F@J wrote in message news:3f4e34ac$0$19384$d40e179e@nntp05.dk.telia.net… If you’re on 20 Mg, a raise to 40 Mg should do the trick I’ve been on Seroxat (Paxil) for 5-6 years. Sylvain. Hi Sylvain! Does this mean that you have to raise the milligrams again and again, untill the med doesn’t work anymore? FJ. According to the manufacturer; 20 Mg is the minimum therapeutic dosage for SP, and 50 Mg is the maximum. If you get no improvement on 40 Mg, I don’t believe that there’s much point raising it to 50 Mg. It’s 60 Mg max. for OCD, by the way. I would urge you to stick with Seroxat as long as possible, as you just don’t know how the other meds. will work with you. On the other hand, if you want badly enough to change, by all means do so. You could try Celexa (Cipramil, Citalopram) first. Sylvain.
or you could try 30mg before going to 40mg, trying for a little better mileage. i took 30mg for a few years before switching to lexapro. thing to remember about SSRI is that dosage isn’t always linear, meaning doubling the dose doesn’t necessarily double the effect, which can either more than double or increase more moderately, so trial and error is worthwhile.
i took 30mg for a few years before switching to lexapro. thing to remember about SSRI is that dosage isn’t always linear, meaning doubling the dose doesn’t necessarily double the effect, which can either more than double or increase more moderately, so trial and error is worthwhile.
How did Lexapro woork for you, compared to seroxat?
"yitwail" <catim…@yahoo.com
wrote in message
news:cc4558e9.0308291004.781d801e@posting.google.com… > "Sylvain Van der Walde" <sylvain.vanderwa…@which.net
wrote in message
<news:F4F3b.1606$FZ3.430214@newsfep2-win.server.ntli.net
…
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > "FJ" <F@J
wrote in message
> > news:3f4e34ac$0$19384$d40e179e@nntp05.dk.telia.net… > > > > If you’re on 20 Mg, a raise to 40 Mg should do the trick > > > > I’ve been on Seroxat (Paxil) for 5-6 years. > > > > Sylvain. > > > Hi Sylvain! > > > Does this mean that you have to raise the milligrams again and again,
untill the med doesn’t work anymore? FJ. According to the manufacturer; 20 Mg is the minimum therapeutic dosage
for
SP, and 50 Mg is the maximum. If you get no improvement on 40 Mg, I
don’t
believe that there’s much point raising it to 50 Mg. It’s 60 Mg max. for OCD, by the way. I would urge you to stick with Seroxat as long as possible, as you just don’t know how the other meds. will work with you. On the other hand, if you want badly enough to change, by all means do
so.
You could try Celexa (Cipramil, Citalopram) first. Sylvain. or you could try 30mg before going to 40mg, trying for a little better mileage.
Yitwail. Yes, of course he could. I tried it myself, but it hardly made any difference. Going to 40 Mg did the trick.
i took 30mg for a few years before switching to lexapro. thing to remember about SSRI is that dosage isn’t always linear, meaning doubling the dose doesn’t necessarily double the effect, which can either more than double or increase more moderately, so trial and error is worthwhile.
Agreed. I have 2 questions: Why did you stop at 30 Mg of Paroxetine (Paxil, Seroxat), and start with Lexapro (Escitalopram) rather than going with Celexa (Citalopram)? I won’t carry on with this thread after this message. Sylvain
"Sylvain Van der Walde" <sylvain.vanderwa…@which.net
wrote in message <news:YI_3b.3132$FZ3.672264@newsfep2-win.server.ntli.net… I have 2 questions: Why did you stop at 30 Mg of Paroxetine (Paxil, Seroxat), and start with Lexapro (Escitalopram) rather than going with Celexa (Citalopram)? I won’t carry on with this thread after this message. Sylvain
sylvain, (&FJ if you’re reading this) been out of town for almost a week, hence the delayed reply. i switched to lexapro at the instigation of my female companion, to reduce the well-known sexual side-effect. in my case, the sexual side-effect was greatly reduced in fact. otherwise, i haven’t noticed any significant medical difference between 30mg paxil & 10mg lexapro. lexapro does cost a bit more in the copayment required by my medical insurance.
If you’re on 20 Mg, a raise to 40 Mg should do the trick I’ve been on Seroxat (Paxil) for 5-6 years. Sylvain.
Hi Sylvain! Does this mean that you have to raise the milligrams again and again, untill the med doesn’t work anymore?
"FJ" <F@J
wrote in message
news:3f4e34ac$0$19384$d40e179e@nntp05.dk.telia.net…
If you’re on 20 Mg, a raise to 40 Mg should do the trick I’ve been on Seroxat (Paxil) for 5-6 years. Sylvain. Hi Sylvain! Does this mean that you have to raise the milligrams again and again, untill the med doesn’t work anymore?
FJ. According to the manufacturer; 20 Mg is the minimum therapeutic dosage for SP, and 50 Mg is the maximum. If you get no improvement on 40 Mg, I don’t believe that there’s much point raising it to 50 Mg. It’s 60 Mg max. for OCD, by the way. I would urge you to stick with Seroxat as long as possible, as you just don’t know how the other meds. will work with you. On the other hand, if you want badly enough to change, by all means do so. You could try Celexa (Cipramil, Citalopram) first. Sylvain.
Pretty much all modern anti depressants (SSRI and the newer stuff) should work.
Thanks for the answer, but do you think that a change will lessen the SP more than the weaned off seroxat
FJ wrote:
Pretty much all modern anti depressants (SSRI and the newer stuff) should work. Thanks for the answer, but do you think that a change will lessen the SP more than the weaned off seroxat
Hard to say, really. They all fight SP to some extent but their effectiveness is highly dependent on the individual. Effexor works quite nicely for me and simply fantastic when it comes to my depression.
"FJ" <F@J
wrote in message
news:3f4b81b6$0$7822$d40e179e@nntp03.dk.telia.net…
I have a feeling that seroxat (after having worked a year) not is as effective anymore. Is it possible that change to another med would work!
FJ. If you’re on 20 Mg, a raise to 40 Mg should do the trick I’ve been on Seroxat (Paxil) for 5-6 years. Sylvain.
I have a feeling that seroxat (after having worked a year) not is as effective anymore. Is it possible that change to another med would work!
FJ wrote:
I have a feeling that seroxat (after having worked a year) not is as effective anymore. Is it possible that change to another med would work!
Pretty much all modern anti depressants (SSRI and the newer stuff) should work.
Actually, the story is a bit more complicated. He was supposed to start on 10 mg, go to 20 mg (10×2) in a week, then 30 (10×3). The pharmacy goofed and put 18s in the bottle, so he started on 18. He experienced almost immediate positive affects, in terms of behavior in school. But he also was having drowsy spells and stomach aches, and sometimes just seems drugged up – he falls asleep in the car for the first time since he was an infant. Fortunately, we noticed the error before it was time for him to take two, and immediately cut him back to 10. Which brings us to our present circumstances – side effects with 18, insufficient effects with 10. During his time with me this summer, I have chosen to give him 10 – he has more chance for physical exercise, and less requirement to be still and attentive. But I’m more interested in determining a good long-term solution for him, and none has been forthcoming from his physicial or Lilly.
You need to give the drug time, a few weeks, before you will know what staying side effects will be. Drowsiness and stomach aches are common on reuptake inhibitors and often go away with time. You have raised another issue as regards the four hour half life. His physician’s solution to the side-effects was to suggest he take the medication in the evening. I was concerned that he was still being overmedicated, but just sleeping through the symptoms. But I am now further concerned that by giving him the medication in the evening, most of the effect is wasted, thus requiring a higher dosage to maintain the effect. Also, his physician said that it builds up in the blood, but this is also apparently wrong. More info on half-life and other issues at: http://www.mosbysdrugconsult.com/DrugConsult/003578.html
Taking it at night to avoid drowsiness during the day is a good idea and often helps reduce drowsiness – not always, but sometimes. Taking it at night will make no difference to its positive effects. With reuptake inhibitors, the blood half life has little to do with the positive effect. However, it may have a lot to do with side effects. These are nothing like stimulants where you only have an effect while it is in your blood. Reuptake inhibitors can take weeks before the drugs start having the effect you want, and after you quit can take a long time to stop "working" also. Just follow your doctors orders and stop panicking.
The pharmacy goofed and put 18s in the bottle, so he started on 18. He experienced almost immediate positive affects, in terms of behavior in school. But he also was having drowsy spells and stomach aches, and sometimes just seems drugged up – he falls asleep in the car for the first time since he was an infant. Fortunately, we noticed the error before it was time for him to take two, and immediately cut him back to 10. Which brings us to our present circumstances – side effects with 18, insufficient effects with 10.
In our experience (our son is 10) the side effects you mentioned go away pretty quickly — and were greatly lessened by dosing at night (which we still do). The medication has been very helpful for us. I suggest you go back to 18 and take it at night. In time, you may be able to switch to morning dosing (we may do this when school starts; right now bedtime is a much more predictable time than morning is.) -Dawn Mom to Henry, 10
Actually, the story is a bit more complicated. He was supposed to start on 10 mg, go to 20 mg (10×2) in a week, then 30 (10×3). The pharmacy goofed and put 18s in the bottle, so he started on 18. He experienced almost immediate positive affects, in terms of behavior in school. But he also was having drowsy spells and stomach aches, and sometimes just seems drugged up – he falls asleep in the car for the first time since he was an infant. Fortunately, we noticed the error before it was time for him to take two, and immediately cut him back to 10. Which brings us to our present circumstances – side effects with 18, insufficient effects with 10. During his time with me this summer, I have chosen to give him 10 – he has more chance for physical exercise, and less requirement to be still and attentive. But I’m more interested in determining a good long-term solution for him, and none has been forthcoming from his physicial or Lilly. You have raised another issue as regards the four hour half life. His physician’s solution to the side-effects was to suggest he take the medication in the evening. I was concerned that he was still being overmedicated, but just sleeping through the symptoms. But I am now further concerned that by giving him the medication in the evening, most of the effect is wasted, thus requiring a higher dosage to maintain the effect. Also, his physician said that it builds up in the blood, but this is also apparently wrong. More info on half-life and other issues at: http://www.mosbysdrugconsult.com/DrugConsult/003578.html
Actually, the story is a bit more complicated. He was supposed to start on 10 mg, go to 20 mg (10×2) in a week, then 30 (10×3). The pharmacy goofed and put 18s in the bottle, so he started on 18. He experienced almost immediate positive affects, in terms of behavior in school. But he also was having drowsy spells and stomach aches, and sometimes just seems drugged up – he falls asleep in the car for the first time since he was an infant.
Is he sleeping the night through? One side effect some people experience with Strattera is that it interrupts their sleep. I wasn’t able to sleep more than 3 hours at a stretch when I was on it. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Fortunately, we noticed the error before it was time for him to take two, and immediately cut him back to 10. Which brings us to our present circumstances – side effects with 18, insufficient effects with 10. During his time with me this summer, I have chosen to give him 10 – he has more chance for physical exercise, and less requirement to be still and attentive. But I’m more interested in determining a good long-term solution for him, and none has been forthcoming from his physicial or Lilly. You have raised another issue as regards the four hour half life. His physician’s solution to the side-effects was to suggest he take the medication in the evening. I was concerned that he was still being overmedicated, but just sleeping through the symptoms. But I am now further concerned that by giving him the medication in the evening, most of the effect is wasted, thus requiring a higher dosage to maintain the effect. Also, his physician said that it builds up in the blood, but this is also apparently wrong. More info on half-life and other issues at: http://www.mosbysdrugconsult.com/DrugConsult/003578.html
– –John Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
So far as I know, he is sleeping through the night. The problem we’re having is that when he takes 18 mg, he is often drowsy during the day. The doctor’s solution to this was to switch to giving him the medication at dinner instead of breakfast. This seems foolish to me, though – Strattera levels peak in 1-2 hours, and it has a half-life of 5.2 hours. So by morning, 3/4 of the medication is gone. Seems better to me to give him the medication two hours before school for maximum effect. However, the Lilly support rep said that effects of Strattera persist after blood levels drop – she said they suspect it stays in the brain after it is gone from the blood, but they aren’t sure about this. I am leaning toward morning administration on an empty stomach, and we’ll see how that goes. I just wish there were more authoritative guidance on this.
My 7 year old son has been using Strattera for about a month, with reportedly good effects. Unfortunately, it seems that 10 mg is not enough for him, but 18 mg produces substantial side-effects. Since there is no such thing as 14 mg, and you can’t break the capsules, does anyone have any experience with daily alternating between 10 and 18 mg? His physician is making contradictory statements – on the one hand, you must never miss a day on Strattera because it builds up in your blood – but on the other hand, alternating dosages will create huge swings in effect. It seems to me that if it’s a cumulative buildup, there should be very little swinging induced by alternating doses. Lilly says they have no information on this since it wasn’t part of their clinical trial.
What are the side effects? If he has only been on 18mg for a week, that is probably not long enough to judge the side effects. With these types of drugs, often the initial side effects go away. Maybe not, but I would give it more than two weeks and then start looking at the side effects. The half-life of Strattera is only about 4 hours. So, you wont get any smoothing out of blood levels by alternating doses. You start fresh every day with Strattera. Thats not to say other mechanisms besides blood levels wont smooth out somehow. I dont know. This page is where I found the half-life: http://lists.chadd-mc.org/pipermail/chadd-mc/2002-November/000063.html For me, the nausea side effects from Effexor (which partly inhibits the reuptake of norepinephrine like Strattra dose) went away in a few days. The sleepy side effects never went away. I doubt you will know ahead of time if alternating between 10 and 18 would work. Some of the side effects happen immediately, others take time. Going from 10mg to 18, you would be taking almost double the dose every other day. You would NEVER do this with Effexor, for example – because you would be nauseous and have a headache every day. You would go though withdrawal on the half-dose days, and experience the side effects of the increased dose on the double-dose days. At least with Effexor, and other anti-depressants (I cant say about Strattera) its very important to have a steady dose. Any variation only causes more side effects. You probably can open the capsule and remove 22% of the contents. Doctors rarely let you do this because they dont trust you to do it right. And, some of them may mistakenly believe you will disrupt the absorption or time-release functions of the capsule. Anyone with any sense of statistics would see this is not a problem except for specialized capsules like Concerta. But, Strattera is not a time-release capsule anyway. And there would be no change in absorption. Again, I am curious, what are the side effects? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My 7 year old son has been using Strattera for about a month, with reportedly good effects. Unfortunately, it seems that 10 mg is not enough for him, but 18 mg produces substantial side-effects. Since there is no such thing as 14 mg, and you can’t break the capsules, does anyone have any experience with daily alternating between 10 and 18 mg? His physician is making contradictory statements – on the one hand, you must never miss a day on Strattera because it builds up in your blood – but on the other hand, alternating dosages will create huge swings in effect. It seems to me that if it’s a cumulative buildup, there should be very little swinging induced by alternating doses. Lilly says they have no information on this since it wasn’t part of their clinical trial.
Hithere… for anyone who cares to know. I am doing remarkably well on day 2 at 25% of my regular 50 mg Zoloft dosage. I will remain at this dosage until after my menses have passed as PMS can be hellish. Happy as a Clam… PW
Hello. I have dealt with anxiety and secondary depression for about 15 years. I have been misdiagnosed more times than I have fingers. I am under the impression that diagnoses are merely a way for the
psychology/psychiatry – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – industry to allocate medication. It has nothing to do with management. I have been on Prozac, Melaril, Paxil, Zoloft, Depakote, Risperdal and Xanax. Of all of them I found Zoloft to be the most helpful. Unfortunately, one of the side effects is weight gain. I have been on it, 2nd time around, for about a year and a half. I have learned of a new pseudo-natural supplement called L5 Hydroxytryptophan (5HTP). It’s a lot like Tryptophan in that it helps the body produce serotonin and melatonin. I lost my job about 6 months ago, as I go through them like kleenex tissues, and, subsequently lost my health insurance. I cannot afford to see my psychiatrist anymore. I have always been inclined toward natural healing techniques and really wanted to come off the Zoloft. I also wanted to lose the 30 pounds I gained in the last 9 months. I tried to come off it and I started feeling edgy on day 3. On day 4 I was as maniacal as I was at my absolute worst. I did some research to learn that there are indeed significant withdrawal symptoms associated with SSRIs not excluding permanent neurological damage and death. Of all 20 or so doctors I have seen in the last 15 years nobody ever mentioned this! I was appalled. Had I known this I may have looked deeper into alternatives. It’s like coming off heroin! I am on my 6th week of tapering off. I have had to cut my 40 hour week (at my new job w/o insurance) to 20. Fortunately I have a job where this is possible. I am consulting with a nutritionist on my diet and 5HTP. She has personal experience with the same type of disorder manifestation as myself except she was on Prozac prior to using 5HTP. What I would like to know is if anyone reading this has any experience coming off SSRIs and/or using 5HTP. I am using kava kava to help keep me calm during the day while lowering my dosage. I use a subligual form of melatonin at night to help me stay asleep, as I have a tendancy to wake up every hour. It’s working so far. I am down by 50% of my 50 mg dosage. To women out there: I do not recommend adjusting your dosage during PMS. Most of us have it worst during this time. I adjust my dosage about a week into my cycle – when I am at my best. I have had the best results this way. Also, it takes me about a week to adjust to the lowered dosage. I have been working with this for nearly 2 months now. I found that using 5HTP with the SSRI is not good. I was flooded with serotonin and nuts as ever. I’d love to hear other ppls’ experience coming off SSRIs and the use of natural "supplements". Thanks! Ms. PW
I suppose you know that kava is not recommended for use with any other psychoactive drug. Kava is known to potentiate (increase) the effects of other drugs e,g,, benzodiazepenes, alcohol and barbituates. I haven’t seen anything specific to SSRIs or other drugs that affect serotonin, just educated speculation that kava could have a negative impact on serotonin utilization. Another poster related a problem with anxiety rebound when taking kava, a report I’ve never seen before; I wonder if he/she was taking another drug at the time. From your last post, though, the combination seems to be working for you. I’d suggest, though, that you keep a close watch on your reactions and discontinue the kava as appropriate. I’d be interested in hearing how it goes for you. I gather that your intent is to withdraw from Zoloft and start on 5-HTP. May I suggest that you hold off on the 5-HTP and just stay on kava for awhile? If you have anxiety-driven depression, you may not need anything else, or perhaps something milder like an omega-3 supplement (skip St. John’s Wort – it eats kava as well as birth control pills, HIV medication, etc.) Anyway, take the time to evaluate yourself before you take on the possible risks associated with 5-HTP. (Actually, I’m considering taking 5-HTP in lieu of melatonin – still researching the issue of combining it with kava) One other note about kava: researchers may have found the reason why some users have suffered liver damage. It seems that some herbal manufacturers have been making their kava extracts from "peelings", the bark of the aboveground stems of the plant; which contain pipemethystine, a substance proved to be toxic to liver cultures. Peelings are a by-product of kava use in the South Pacific and are normally discarded as waste material; in 1998, though, 82% of the kava imported into the U.S. consisted of dried peelings. It would be reasonable for all kava users to research the product they use and determine whether any of the above ground portions of the plant (peelings, stem or leaves) are used; if so, change to another brand that only uses the underground portions (lateral roots and rootstalk). You don’t need hepititis or cirrohsis on top of your other problems. You may also end up with a more effective kava :}. Cheers, Figaro
I am reevaluating my need for 5-htp at all. Kava does seem to be working for me. I actually only need it on days 1-3 (about) after downgrading my Zoloft dose. After that, I seem to level out naturally, except for the use of sublingual melatonin. I think that working only 20 hours a week really halps too, though I can’t do this forever. I have forwarded your message to my nutritionist. I am particularly interested in what she has to say about the peelings. The brand of kava I use is Gaia Herbs. I’ve used other supplements they manufacture with positive results. I have heard of the anxiety rebound effect of kava though, as of yet, it’s not happened to me. It may be because I don’t use it all the time, only while transitioning to a lower dose ssri. My most annoying withdrawal symptoms now is nausea. It only lasts for a couple of days and it’s mild, but it makes eating difficult. The other side of that is that I eat less. Since I gained 30 pounds on Zoloft, I’m not complaining too loudly. I anticipate it stopping after I come off the ssri completely. I have lost 10 of the 30 pounds in the last 6 weeks. Every time I downgrade my dose I lose 3 pounds in the first 36 hours! Woo-Hoo! PW
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I suppose you know that kava is not recommended for use with any other psychoactive drug. Kava is known to potentiate (increase) the effects of other drugs e,g,, benzodiazepenes, alcohol and barbituates. I haven’t seen anything specific to SSRIs or other drugs that affect serotonin, just educated speculation that kava could have a negative impact on serotonin utilization. Another poster related a problem with anxiety rebound when taking kava, a report I’ve never seen before; I wonder if he/she was taking another drug at the time. From your last post, though, the combination seems to be working for you. I’d suggest, though, that you keep a close watch on your reactions and discontinue the kava as appropriate. I’d be interested in hearing how it goes for you. I gather that your intent is to withdraw from Zoloft and start on 5-HTP. May I suggest that you hold off on the 5-HTP and just stay on kava for awhile? If you have anxiety-driven depression, you may not need anything else, or perhaps something milder like an omega-3 supplement (skip St. John’s Wort – it eats kava as well as birth control pills, HIV medication, etc.) Anyway, take the time to evaluate yourself before you take on the possible risks associated with 5-HTP. (Actually, I’m considering taking 5-HTP in lieu of melatonin – still researching the issue of combining it with kava) One other note about kava: researchers may have found the reason why some users have suffered liver damage. It seems that some herbal manufacturers have been making their kava extracts from "peelings", the bark of the aboveground stems of the plant; which contain pipemethystine, a substance proved to be toxic to liver cultures. Peelings are a by-product of kava use in the South Pacific and are normally discarded as waste material; in 1998, though, 82% of the kava imported into the U.S. consisted of dried peelings. It would be reasonable for all kava users to research the product they use and determine whether any of the above ground portions of the plant (peelings, stem or leaves) are used; if so, change to another brand that only uses the underground portions (lateral roots and rootstalk). You don’t need hepititis or cirrohsis on top of your other problems. You may also end up with a more effective kava :}. Cheers, Figaro
Another poster related a problem with anxiety rebound when taking kava, a report I’ve never seen before; I wonder if he/she was taking another drug at the time.
That was me. The only other drug I was on was alcohol… and lot’s of it. I was self medicating for about 25 years. Over 15 months sober, one day at a time. Tono
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Another poster related a problem with anxiety rebound when taking kava, a report I’ve never seen before; I wonder if he/she was taking another drug at the time. That was me. The only other drug I was on was alcohol… and lot’s of it. I was self medicating for about 25 years. Over 15 months sober, one day at a time. Tono
Thanks for posting the info, Tono. I just try to collect info on kava whereever it may be!
LM, Thank you for your information. I am working with a nutritionist who has an MS. She has informaed me that the blood levels of 5HTP are a concern only for those very few with serious metabolic issues. I am quite healthy in that regard. She assures me that in her years of working with the CDC she participated in clinical studies on the use of 5htp and tryptophan and found that both amino acids are quite safe in healthy individuals. She has several patients who are taking up to 250 mg of 5htp daily and have for a year or better with no problems at all. In my opinion, the ssris are a much greater risk for me personally since there are no clinical studies on the effect ssris in ppl taking them over one year. The side effects of ssris have been devastating for me. For those with metabolic issues it should not be taken lightly though. Thank you. I will keep the group informed on my progress. PW
Hello. I have dealt with anxiety and secondary depression for about 15 years. I have been misdiagnosed more times than I have fingers. I am under the impression that diagnoses are merely a way for the
psychology/psychiatry – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – industry to allocate medication. It has nothing to do with management. I have been on Prozac, Melaril, Paxil, Zoloft, Depakote, Risperdal and Xanax. Of all of them I found Zoloft to be the most helpful. Unfortunately, one of the side effects is weight gain. I have been on it, 2nd time around, for about a year and a half. I have learned of a new pseudo-natural supplement called L5 Hydroxytryptophan (5HTP). It’s a lot like Tryptophan in that it helps the body produce serotonin and melatonin. I lost my job about 6 months ago, as I go through them like kleenex tissues, and, subsequently lost my health insurance. I cannot afford to see my psychiatrist anymore. I have always been inclined toward natural healing techniques and really wanted to come off the Zoloft. I also wanted to lose the 30 pounds I gained in the last 9 months. I tried to come off it and I started feeling edgy on day 3. On day 4 I was as maniacal as I was at my absolute worst. I did some research to learn that there are indeed significant withdrawal symptoms associated with SSRIs not excluding permanent neurological damage and death. Of all 20 or so doctors I have seen in the last 15 years nobody ever mentioned this! I was appalled. Had I known this I may have looked deeper into alternatives. It’s like coming off heroin! I am on my 6th week of tapering off. I have had to cut my 40 hour week (at my new job w/o insurance) to 20. Fortunately I have a job where this is possible. I am consulting with a nutritionist on my diet and 5HTP. She has personal experience with the same type of disorder manifestation as myself except she was on Prozac prior to using 5HTP. What I would like to know is if anyone reading this has any experience coming off SSRIs and/or using 5HTP. I am using kava kava to help keep me calm during the day while lowering my dosage. I use a subligual form of melatonin at night to help me stay asleep, as I have a tendancy to wake up every hour. It’s working so far. I am down by 50% of my 50 mg dosage. To women out there: I do not recommend adjusting your dosage during PMS. Most of us have it worst during this time. I adjust my dosage about a week into my cycle – when I am at my best. I have had the best results this way. Also, it takes me about a week to adjust to the lowered dosage. I have been working with this for nearly 2 months now. I found that using 5HTP with the SSRI is not good. I was flooded with serotonin and nuts as ever. I’d love to hear other ppls’ experience coming off SSRIs and the use of natural "supplements". Thanks! Ms. PW please do not take 5ht without discussing it thoroughly with a doctor-it can cause elevated serum levels of serotonin which does not pass the blood brain barrier but can destroy the valves of your heart-tryptophan as a supplement will not do this because the metabolic process of converting tryptophan buffers the larger flooding of blood levels if you truly believe this supplement is working for you a urinary 5HIAA test should be done every month or so to see if your blood level of serotonin isn’t too high-if you have any coronary artery disease using this supplement is dangerous there is a whole complex interplay between B vitamins and serotonin as well as its percursors like 5ht -natural supplements are often drugs or co-drugs in a sense so please don’t be over-comfortable by their "natural" label-there are cancerous tumors that secrete gobs of 5ht and that is natural too-for the tumors. Just be careful please LM
Thanks, Tono. Actually the kava kava really does help me. The thing I like to keep in mind is that everyone is different. That’s why I have a hard time beleiving in diagnoses – there are too many variations. I’ll keep your suggestion in mind. But for now it’s the only thing that DOES help.
Well, I’m glad it’s helping. Just be sure not to over do it. As far as the diagnosis, I know what you mean. My Dr. never gave me an actual diagnosis, or I would have 10 or 20 of them! He only tries to work with all my various symptoms. And like Margrove said, BE CAREFULL! Tono – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – PW What I would like to know is if anyone reading this has any experience coming off SSRIs and/or using 5HTP. I am using kava kava to help keep me calm during the day while lowering my dosage. Kava always gave me an awful rebound effect of anxiety. It worsened each day and I needed more and more of it. It’s one of the worst "natural" remedies I’ve tried. Remember, natural doesn’t mean it’s good or safe. I’d never drink crude oil. Tono
Hello. I have dealt with anxiety and secondary depression for about 15 years. I have been misdiagnosed more times than I have fingers. I am under the impression that diagnoses are merely a way for the psychology/psychiatry industry to allocate medication. It has nothing to do with management. I have been on Prozac, Melaril, Paxil, Zoloft, Depakote, Risperdal and Xanax. Of all of them I found Zoloft to be the most helpful. Unfortunately, one of the side effects is weight gain. I have been on it, 2nd time around, for about a year and a half. I have learned of a new pseudo-natural supplement called L5 Hydroxytryptophan (5HTP). It’s a lot like Tryptophan in that it helps the body produce serotonin and melatonin. I lost my job about 6 months ago, as I go through them like kleenex tissues, and, subsequently lost my health insurance. I cannot afford to see my psychiatrist anymore. I have always been inclined toward natural healing techniques and really wanted to come off the Zoloft. I also wanted to lose the 30 pounds I gained in the last 9 months. I tried to come off it and I started feeling edgy on day 3. On day 4 I was as maniacal as I was at my absolute worst. I did some research to learn that there are indeed significant withdrawal symptoms associated with SSRIs not excluding permanent neurological damage and death. Of all 20 or so doctors I have seen in the last 15 years nobody ever mentioned this! I was appalled. Had I known this I may have looked deeper into alternatives. It’s like coming off heroin! I am on my 6th week of tapering off. I have had to cut my 40 hour week (at my new job w/o insurance) to 20. Fortunately I have a job where this is possible. I am consulting with a nutritionist on my diet and 5HTP. She has personal experience with the same type of disorder manifestation as myself except she was on Prozac prior to using 5HTP. What I would like to know is if anyone reading this has any experience coming off SSRIs and/or using 5HTP. I am using kava kava to help keep me calm during the day while lowering my dosage. I use a subligual form of melatonin at night to help me stay asleep, as I have a tendancy to wake up every hour. It’s working so far. I am down by 50% of my 50 mg dosage. To women out there: I do not recommend adjusting your dosage during PMS. Most of us have it worst during this time. I adjust my dosage about a week into my cycle – when I am at my best. I have had the best results this way. Also, it takes me about a week to adjust to the lowered dosage. I have been working with this for nearly 2 months now. I found that using 5HTP with the SSRI is not good. I was flooded with serotonin and nuts as ever. I’d love to hear other ppls’ experience coming off SSRIs and the use of natural "supplements". Thanks! Ms. PW
What I would like to know is if anyone reading this has any experience coming off SSRIs and/or using 5HTP. I am using kava kava to help keep me calm during the day while lowering my dosage.
Kava always gave me an awful rebound effect of anxiety. It worsened each day and I needed more and more of it. It’s one of the worst "natural" remedies I’ve tried. Remember, natural doesn’t mean it’s good or safe. I’d never drink crude oil. Tono
Thanks, Tono. Actually the kava kava really does help me. The thing I like to keep in mind is that everyone is different. That’s why I have a hard time beleiving in diagnoses – there are too many variations. I’ll keep your suggestion in mind. But for now it’s the only thing that DOES help. PW
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What I would like to know is if anyone reading this has any experience coming off SSRIs and/or using 5HTP. I am using kava kava to help keep me calm during the day while lowering my dosage. Kava always gave me an awful rebound effect of anxiety. It worsened each day and I needed more and more of it. It’s one of the worst "natural" remedies I’ve tried. Remember, natural doesn’t mean it’s good or safe. I’d never drink crude oil. Tono
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello. I have dealt with anxiety and secondary depression for about 15 years. I have been misdiagnosed more times than I have fingers. I am under the impression that diagnoses are merely a way for the psychology/psychiatry industry to allocate medication. It has nothing to do with management. I have been on Prozac, Melaril, Paxil, Zoloft, Depakote, Risperdal and Xanax. Of all of them I found Zoloft to be the most helpful. Unfortunately, one of the side effects is weight gain. I have been on it, 2nd time around, for about a year and a half. I have learned of a new pseudo-natural supplement called L5 Hydroxytryptophan (5HTP). It’s a lot like Tryptophan in that it helps the body produce serotonin and melatonin. I lost my job about 6 months ago, as I go through them like kleenex tissues, and, subsequently lost my health insurance. I cannot afford to see my psychiatrist anymore. I have always been inclined toward natural healing techniques and really wanted to come off the Zoloft. I also wanted to lose the 30 pounds I gained in the last 9 months. I tried to come off it and I started feeling edgy on day 3. On day 4 I was as maniacal as I was at my absolute worst. I did some research to learn that there are indeed significant withdrawal symptoms associated with SSRIs not excluding permanent neurological damage and death. Of all 20 or so doctors I have seen in the last 15 years nobody ever mentioned this! I was appalled. Had I known this I may have looked deeper into alternatives. It’s like coming off heroin! I am on my 6th week of tapering off. I have had to cut my 40 hour week (at my new job w/o insurance) to 20. Fortunately I have a job where this is possible. I am consulting with a nutritionist on my diet and 5HTP. She has personal experience with the same type of disorder manifestation as myself except she was on Prozac prior to using 5HTP. What I would like to know is if anyone reading this has any experience coming off SSRIs and/or using 5HTP. I am using kava kava to help keep me calm during the day while lowering my dosage. I use a subligual form of melatonin at night to help me stay asleep, as I have a tendancy to wake up every hour. It’s working so far. I am down by 50% of my 50 mg dosage. To women out there: I do not recommend adjusting your dosage during PMS. Most of us have it worst during this time. I adjust my dosage about a week into my cycle – when I am at my best. I have had the best results this way. Also, it takes me about a week to adjust to the lowered dosage. I have been working with this for nearly 2 months now. I found that using 5HTP with the SSRI is not good. I was flooded with serotonin and nuts as ever. I’d love to hear other ppls’ experience coming off SSRIs and the use of natural "supplements". Thanks! Ms. PW
please do not take 5ht without discussing it thoroughly with a doctor-it can cause elevated serum levels of serotonin which does not pass the blood brain barrier but can destroy the valves of your heart-tryptophan as a supplement will not do this because the metabolic process of converting tryptophan buffers the larger flooding of blood levels if you truly believe this supplement is working for you a urinary 5HIAA test should be done every month or so to see if your blood level of serotonin isn’t too high-if you have any coronary artery disease using this supplement is dangerous there is a whole complex interplay between B vitamins and serotonin as well as its percursors like 5ht -natural supplements are often drugs or co-drugs in a sense so please don’t be over-comfortable by their "natural" label-there are cancerous tumors that secrete gobs of 5ht and that is natural too-for the tumors. Just be careful please LM
Sasha — Please do not change your doses on your own… go to your doctor…. If you present your situation (your complaints regarding how you feel), and you ask your doctor to work with you to make you feel your best both physiclly and emotionally, I am sure they will make the effort to work with you.
Yes, thanks, I’ve calmed down a bit now. I have already reduced my zoloft to 150 mg, but we had already talked about doing that, so I just jumped the gun a little. I’m going towait to discuss changes in the Ritalin at my appt next week. The thing is, my pdoc likes to make changes one at a time so he will know exactly which drug is having the effect. It may take awhile to get off the zoloft and see how I do for awhile, and maybe have to go back on again if it has a bad effect. Ritalin may be quicker to see the effects. If, as you say, you are BP II, and weight gain and energy are concerns I would make the following recommendation: the Lithium (lithobid) could be replaced with either Topamax, Lamotrigine (Lamictil), or Neurontin (gabapentin). I would, personally, try the Topamax first — only because it is the one I have personal experience with and it has some tendancies for some people to cause weight loss (I have lost about 45 pounds in the year on it).
The thing is, there really was a big improvement with the lithium, and I am afraid to make a change. Several years ago I was on depakote monotherapy which caused me to bruise easily and frequently, and to gain weight too. So that didn’t seem to work very well, not to mention I went through several two week jobs while I was on it anyway. So I’m a little wary of the seizure drugs. Tose you mentioned are newer though, right? I tried Neurontin breifly in addition to all the others I’m on, but it only contributed to my sleepiness, so It was stopped. It’s a shame too, since even at a low dose it really seemed to help with my pain. If Icould take that, then maybe I wouldn’t need anything additional for pain too. I try not to take things for pain if I can help it, but anti-inflammitories actually seem to help with my energy, but I can’t take too many because it interferes with the lithium. The B-12 may help your energy, if it is a result of your anemia, however, I would alsoe suggest that you get your thyroid checked again — you may need an adjustment of the Synthroid to level out your energy levels.
I was hoping for awhile maybe These were the only problems and if I get them treated, then maybe I’m not really "crazy" after all. But I don’t think it’s gonna turn out that way, and they will probably just find something else wrong with me anyway. Besides that theory doesn’t account for the sudden change in energy from barely being able to move for weeks, and then one day I hardly need to sleep and find that I can move around very easily and rush to cram weeks worth of stuff into just a few days, before the gravity gets me again so I can’t move, etc… As for the Ritalin… that is a really difficult issue as ADD and BP II are nasty together… personally, my attention span is sometimes that of a wet noodle…:-) But, you must remember that Ritalin is an amphetamine — a powerful stimulant, and CAN destabalize the bi-polar mind. Once you get the Mood-Stabalizer checked out, and the thyroid… try and see how low a dose of Ritalin you can tolerate, and maintain your concentration. This may, in the long run, be very beneficial for you.
Actually, it doesn’t really seem to help me with concentration. I’m beginning to think its something else besides ADD. I need to talk with my neuroloist about it too to see what he thinks. He has EEGs from before I was on it, and there is supposed to be something in that that can distinguish ADD. He seemed surprised that I was taking it. Good luck, and please keep us posted. Peter
Thanks Sasha
What is does your diet consist of on the average, and what is your activity level? I’m on a couple of drugs, but I seem to have gotten very good results from diets principles of a Santa Barbara endocrinologist along with moderate daily walking.
I go for walks daily too now, although there are the times when I hardly have the strength to go to the mailbox, or am too paranoid to go outside. I’ve been well enough to go on walks for months now though. The thing is I used to be very active, or at least during active spells. Even in deep depression, I would get out of bed to go to dance class – the only thing I would do, it was that important to me. A couple years ago I started having trouble breathing and got dizzy when I ran or biked for more than a couple minutes and had to abandon my workout. I just figured I was out of shape and getting old. Now I’m thinking it was probably the hypothyroid and pernicious anemia. I was on a fairly good diet at the time. It’s hard to say what my average diet is because it changes in phases. I don’t eat on a regular schedule, or take in a regular amount of calories from day to day, and that combined with the quality of food switch leads to a very inconsistent diet which probably screws with my blood sugar levels. I don’t eat much meat or fat, which leaves too many carbs, and in some phases too much sugar. I do like fruits and vegetables though, and those are supposed to be good for you, right? I don’t know if a diet would help me much until I learn to become more consistent in my whole life. There is a lot I need to work on, including paying bills and getting errands done, and soon going to class and getting assignments in on time. The first thing I’ve been working on lately, is getting to all of my doctors appts and taking all of my medication on time, which takes a good deal of my concentration. Thanks for the advice though Sasha
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Sascha, Help! I’m having urges lately to screw with my medication and reduce doses to eventually eliminate two of them. Ok, heres what I’m on. Synthroid 25mcg Lithobid 900 mg Zoloft 200 mg Seroquel 25mg Ritalin 45mg Everything was going so well a few months ago with all these medications, but I was getting increasingly tired again, and had gained a little weight, so I complained. Pdoc wanted to get rid of the seroquel – didn’t work. What happened?
Paranoia, hypervigilence, dissociation, irritability, ultrawithdrawn, things looked/ seemed weird, etc… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Last time he said start taking it every night again, and also take all my lithobid at night so maybe I wouldn’t be so tired throughout the day, then maybe next month we can try reducing the zoloft. Ok, then I find out I have this pernicious anemia thing, and so I’m hoping maybe these vitamin B-12 shots will give me energy. They should help. But then I think back to when my thyroid was so low, and the synthroid was supposed to make me all better, which it seemed to for awhile, but then I got so very tired and sleepy again (perhaps I’m still cycling a little too?) so I think what if the same thing happens here? Perhaps it is time to have yout TSH level chcked
Yes I’m getting it checked later this week – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m getting very impatient. I start school in like two weeks and I want to have energy and concentration for it! I can’t wait to see if these shots fix everything and then the next illness comes along to wipe me out! Maybe I’m just taking too much medicine. So I’ve already lowered my zoloft dose a little, but I want to go ahead and get rid of the ritalin too. It hasn’t helped my concentration any, and it is no longer keeping me awake, so what good is it? Ask your doctr that question….he is the best source of info since he know your history.
I know, I’m just getting impatient. I’m tempted to start reducing it already just to see. I only have one week before I see the pdoc, so I guess maybe I should just wait. I already made one change earlier than we had planned anyway, reducing my zoloft to 150 mg. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What if it’s actually making me sleepy now, like caffein does? Pdoc seems to think it should help me though. I dunno. And if I’m really BP ll then should I be taking lithium anyway? I just want my brain to work better and be out of this hazy foggy state. I know it can’t all be the drugs though, because I was sleeping just as much before I sought treatment. OK, that’s enough for now. Sascha, it sounds like a thorough medication evaluation is needes as well as some blood work. I can empathazie with your frustration as I have been there too 
. When was the last time tou had a complete physical exam? Perhaps the folloeing tests should be condisered: CBC with differential Electrolyte Panel BUN and Creatinine Serum Iron Lithium level
I’m scheduled to have my lithium and TSH checked. My neurologist gave me a bunch of tests recently too, with only the vit B-12 screwed up. Good luck with school.
Thanks, I’ll need it May I ask what you will be studying? Well, about 5 years ago, I was two classes away from graduating with a BA in anthropology, but I freaked out manicstyle and did not complete my thesis or take my statistics final, and ran off and became a stripper instead. Brilliant huh? Well, now I’m planning to finish up the degree, or the one in English which I was also very close to finishing, but I have to take these freshmen courses that are required here in CA before they will admit me as a senior. So I’m going to summer school Sasha – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Love, Lynda
What is does your diet consist of on the average, and what is your activity level? I’m on a couple of drugs, but I seem to have gotten very good results from diets principles of a Santa Barbara endocrinologist along with moderate daily walking. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Help! I’m having urges lately to screw with my medication and reduce doses to eventually eliminate two of them. Ok, heres what I’m on. Synthroid 25mcg Lithobid 900 mg Zoloft 200 mg Seroquel 25mg Ritalin 45mg Everything was going so well a few months ago with all these medications, but I was getting increasingly tired again, and had gained a little weight, so I complained. Pdoc wanted to get rid of the seroquel – didn’t work. Last time he said start taking it every night again, and also take all my lithobid at night so maybe I wouldn’t be so tired throughout the day, then maybe next month we can try reducing the zoloft. Ok, then I find out I have this pernicious anemia thing, and so I’m hoping maybe these vitamin B-12 shots will give me energy. But then I think back to when my thyroid was so low, and the synthroid was supposed to make me all better, which it seemed to for awhile, but then I got so very tired and sleepy again (perhaps I’m still cycling a little too?) so I think what if the same thing happens here? I’m getting very impatient. I start school in like two weeks and I want to have energy and concentration for it! I can’t wait to see if these shots fix everything and then the next illness comes along to wipe me out! Maybe I’m just taking too much medicine. So I’ve already lowered my zoloft dose a little, but I want to go ahead and get rid of the ritalin too. It hasn’t helped my concentration any, and it is no longer keeping me awake, so what good is it? What if it’s actually making me sleepy now, like caffein does? Pdoc seems to think it should help me though. I dunno. And if I’m really BP ll then should I be taking lithium anyway? I just want my brain to work better and be out of this hazy foggy state. I know it can’t all be the drugs though, because I was sleeping just as much before I sought treatment. OK, that’s enough for now. Sasha
Sasha — Please do not change your doses on your own… go to your doctor…. If you present your situation (your complaints regarding how you feel), and you ask your doctor to work with you to make you feel your best both physiclly and emotionally, I am sure they will make the effort to work with you. If, as you say, you are BP II, and weight gain and energy are concerns I would make the following recommendation: the Lithium (lithobid) could be replaced with either Topamax, Lamotrigine (Lamictil), or Neurontin (gabapentin). I would, personally, try the Topamax first — only because it is the one I have personal experience with and it has some tendancies for some people to cause weight loss (I have lost about 45 pounds in the year on it). The B-12 may help your energy, if it is a result of your anemia, however, I would alsoe suggest that you get your thyroid checked again — you may need an adjustment of the Synthroid to level out your energy levels. As for the Ritalin… that is a really difficult issue as ADD and BP II are nasty together… personally, my attention span is sometimes that of a wet noodle…:-) But, you must remember that Ritalin is an amphetamine — a powerful stimulant, and CAN destabalize the bi-polar mind. Once you get the Mood-Stabalizer checked out, and the thyroid… try and see how low a dose of Ritalin you can tolerate, and maintain your concentration. This may, in the long run, be very beneficial for you. Good luck, and please keep us posted. Peter – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Help! I’m having urges lately to screw with my medication and reduce doses to eventually eliminate two of them. Ok, heres what I’m on. Synthroid 25mcg Lithobid 900 mg Zoloft 200 mg Seroquel 25mg Ritalin 45mg Everything was going so well a few months ago with all these medications, but I was getting increasingly tired again, and had gained a little weight, so I complained. Pdoc wanted to get rid of the seroquel – didn’t work. Last time he said start taking it every night again, and also take all my lithobid at night so maybe I wouldn’t be so tired throughout the day, then maybe next month we can try reducing the zoloft. Ok, then I find out I have this pernicious anemia thing, and so I’m hoping maybe these vitamin B-12 shots will give me energy. But then I think back to when my thyroid was so low, and the synthroid was supposed to make me all better, which it seemed to for awhile, but then I got so very tired and sleepy again (perhaps I’m still cycling a little too?) so I think what if the same thing happens here? I’m getting very impatient. I start school in like two weeks and I want to have energy and concentration for it! I can’t wait to see if these shots fix everything and then the next illness comes along to wipe me out! Maybe I’m just taking too much medicine. So I’ve already lowered my zoloft dose a little, but I want to go ahead and get rid of the ritalin too. It hasn’t helped my concentration any, and it is no longer keeping me awake, so what good is it? What if it’s actually making me sleepy now, like caffein does? Pdoc seems to think it should help me though. I dunno. And if I’m really BP ll then should I be taking lithium anyway? I just want my brain to work better and be out of this hazy foggy state. I know it can’t all be the drugs though, because I was sleeping just as much before I sought treatment. OK, that’s enough for now. Sasha
Hi Sascha, Help! I’m having urges lately to screw with my medication and reduce doses to eventually eliminate two of them. Ok, heres what I’m on. Synthroid 25mcg Lithobid 900 mg Zoloft 200 mg Seroquel 25mg Ritalin 45mg Everything was going so well a few months ago with all these medications, but I was getting increasingly tired again, and had gained a little weight, so I complained. Pdoc wanted to get rid of the seroquel – didn’t work.
What happened? Last time he said start taking it every night again, and also take all my lithobid at night so maybe I wouldn’t be so tired throughout the day, then maybe next month we can try reducing the zoloft. Ok, then I find out I have this pernicious anemia thing, and so I’m hoping maybe these vitamin B-12 shots will give me energy.
They should help. But then I think back to when my thyroid was so low, and the synthroid was supposed to make me all better, which it seemed to for awhile, but then I got so very tired and sleepy again (perhaps I’m still cycling a little too?) so I think what if the same thing happens here?
Perhaps it is time to have yout TSH level chcked I’m getting very impatient. I start school in like two weeks and I want to have energy and concentration for it! I can’t wait to see if these shots fix everything and then the next illness comes along to wipe me out! Maybe I’m just taking too much medicine. So I’ve already lowered my zoloft dose a little, but I want to go ahead and get rid of the ritalin too. It hasn’t helped my concentration any, and it is no longer keeping me awake, so what good is it?
Ask your doctr that question….he is the best source of info since he know your history. What if it’s actually making me sleepy now, like caffein does? Pdoc seems to think it should help me though. I dunno. And if I’m really BP ll then should I be taking lithium anyway? I just want my brain to work better and be out of this hazy foggy state. I know it can’t all be the drugs though, because I was sleeping just as much before I sought treatment. OK, that’s enough for now.
Sascha, it sounds like a thorough medication evaluation is needes as well as some blood work. I can empathazie with your frustration as I have been there too . When was the last time tou had a complete physical exam? Perhaps the folloeing tests should be condisered: CBC with differential Electrolyte Panel BUN and Creatinine Serum Iron Lithium level Good luck with school. May I ask what you will be studying? Love, Lynda
Help! I’m having urges lately to screw with my medication and reduce doses to eventually eliminate two of them. Ok, heres what I’m on. Synthroid 25mcg Lithobid 900 mg Zoloft 200 mg Seroquel 25mg Ritalin 45mg Everything was going so well a few months ago with all these medications, but I was getting increasingly tired again, and had gained a little weight, so I complained. Pdoc wanted to get rid of the seroquel – didn’t work. Last time he said start taking it every night again, and also take all my lithobid at night so maybe I wouldn’t be so tired throughout the day, then maybe next month we can try reducing the zoloft. Ok, then I find out I have this pernicious anemia thing, and so I’m hoping maybe these vitamin B-12 shots will give me energy. But then I think back to when my thyroid was so low, and the synthroid was supposed to make me all better, which it seemed to for awhile, but then I got so very tired and sleepy again (perhaps I’m still cycling a little too?) so I think what if the same thing happens here? I’m getting very impatient. I start school in like two weeks and I want to have energy and concentration for it! I can’t wait to see if these shots fix everything and then the next illness comes along to wipe me out! Maybe I’m just taking too much medicine. So I’ve already lowered my zoloft dose a little, but I want to go ahead and get rid of the ritalin too. It hasn’t helped my concentration any, and it is no longer keeping me awake, so what good is it? What if it’s actually making me sleepy now, like caffein does? Pdoc seems to think it should help me though. I dunno. And if I’m really BP ll then should I be taking lithium anyway? I just want my brain to work better and be out of this hazy foggy state. I know it can’t all be the drugs though, because I was sleeping just as much before I sought treatment. OK, that’s enough for now. Sasha
I have never experienced any sedation or gotten any "buzz" from Xanax, in fact it actually energizes me without making me "speedy", if that makes sense.
It does make sense, and that happens for me at low doses as well. How much have you taken at a time? I am totally screwed up with sleep and energy due to the fact that I work full time night shift and then watch my highly hyperactive toddler all day until 4 or 5 when my eldest daughter comes home to help. So I am always tired and yet cannot fall asleep..frustrating!
You have my sympathies! I often have trouble falling asleep due to pain, and I have problems with waking up in the middle of the night. I’m convinced this has had a deleterious effect on my mental functioning. :-/ -elizabeth
I have never experienced any sedation or gotten any "buzz" from Xanax, in fact it actually energizes me without making me "speedy", if that makes sense. It does make sense, and that happens for me at low doses as well. How much have you taken at a time?
In the middle of an extreme panic attack I have once or twice taken 3 mgs at a time..and have taken 2 mgs at once for slightly less severe but still awful ones..Now though I never take more than 1mg at a time, I dont need to with the other meds, in fact dont take any sometimes cause I just plain old forget. May -elizabeth
– "Believe me! The secret of reaping the greatest fruitfulness and the greatest enjoyment from life is to live dangerously!" - Nietzsche
Hi Diana, If you have never seen a p-doc yet, who prescribed the meds? 25mg is a good starting dose for zoloft, this should keep the side affects bearable. Zoloft taken daily and xanax whenever needed has worked very well for me, but then again YMMV. The p-doc you are going to see should be very caring and understanding towards your feelings. One that could try to understand what it is like to feel the way we do. I know mine does. I wish you the best of luck and hope the zoloft works for you. Please keep us posted. steve
Hello everyone haven’t posted lately but i am back, I finally made a appt with a psych doc today, my appointment if for next tuesday this is the first time for me, alittle nervous, can anyone give me any suggestions on what to look for with her to make sure she is the right one for me? been having PA for 9 years now and finally being medicated for it .05mg of xanax and 25mg of zoloft is that a good combo? Thanks, Diana
The med combo is pretty standard, however that Zoloft dose is probably too low for any therapeutic benefit…although with all of the SSRI’s you must increase the dose gradually…and you can anticipate some increase in symptoms while you are going on any meds. SSRI’s are more popular these days than TCA’s because they effect fewer systems (less side effects) and are more site specific. Xanax is a standard med to be used as needed., usually in combo with another med… however, I’ve been doing a lot of reading about a rebound effect … something I experience always, so I stopped. In terms of your shrink… a good dr. should educate you about the disorder in addition to writing scripts for meds. Find out what percentage of her practice is anxiety patients. Also, check out the Anxiety Disorder Assoc. web site for more ideas on getting a good shrink: www.adaa.org GOOD LUCK!! Keep us posted on the outcome.
Steve, thanks for responding my family doc got me started on the meds and referred me to the psych doc.
Hello everyone haven’t posted lately but i am back, I finally made a appt with a psych doc today, my appointment if for next tuesday this is the first time for me, alittle nervous, can anyone give me any suggestions on what to look for with her to make sure she is the right one for me? been having PA for 9 years now and finally being medicated for it .05mg of xanax and 25mg of zoloft is that a good combo?
Zoloft (SSRI-antidepresant) and Xanax (benzo) make a good combo although our reactions to meds are very personal. One of the things to find out is whether your pdoc is a *benzophobe* (one who doesn’t prescribe benzos because of the alleged *addcition* problem). If she is, she’s not the right one for you. Also you should feel at ease with her. You should be listened to and treated like a responsible adult. You should be able to work on treatment together rather than the doc just telling you what to do. She should explain what she prescribes and proposes and why and then you should *agree* on what’s the right course to take. Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks, Diana
Hi Diana, The only words of advice I can give are not medicine -related. Don’t go into your appointment believing that your doctor can wave a magic wand, say all the right things and heal you. Yes, you can be healed but you will have to work hard. Also, do a lot of reading and decide what sort of therapy will work for you. (If I have to talk about my childhood one more time, I will scream!) Also, if you don’t feel comfortable with your doctor, say so Finally, if you trust your doctor, follow his/her advice. I know how big a step it is to go to a pdoc….good for you! You’re one step closer to feeling better. Good luck. Let us know how it goes. Charley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello everyone haven’t posted lately but i am back, I finally made a appt with a psych doc today, my appointment if for next tuesday this is the first time for me, alittle nervous, can anyone give me any suggestions on what to look for with her to make sure she is the right one for me? been having PA for 9 years now and finally being medicated for it .05mg of xanax and 25mg of zoloft is that a good combo? Thanks, Diana
Hey Diana!! I’m on Zoloft, 100 mgs., and Xanax .25 mgs. as needed. Be careful with the Zoloft…I didn’t have many side effects but it definitely increased my panic attacks in the beginning. Hang in there…Zoloft has worked great for me. I still have a few "muted" PAs but I can handle them much better now. And the fact that I can drive to and from work and even make it to stores (close to home) by myself is amazing!! I’m going up to 125 mgs. of Zoloft starting tomorrow on the advice of my pdoc…good luck and keep us all posted. Melissa
Hi, I take only zoloft 50 mgs. And it works well for me. Except around pms time when anxiety is high anyway. I feel some symtoms but they are very mild. It took 4 weeks to see the difference so give it awhile to work, the longer the better I feel.
One of the things to find out is whether your pdoc is a *benzophobe* (one who doesn’t prescribe benzos because of the alleged *addcition* problem). If she is, she’s not the right one for you.
I second this…even if I didn’t take benzos, I’d avoid benzophobic doctors just on principle! As everybody has said, Zoloft and Xanax is a good combination for panic disorder. 25mg is a starting dose of Zoloft, not a therapeutic dose; around 50mg, many people start to get some benefit, 100 is often enough, 200 is the high end (though you *can* go higher, this is the "official" recommended maximum). Doses of benzos are pretty individualized – are you taking it "as needed," or on some schedule? When I was using it for panic attacks, I needed 2mg to stop them (I didn’t take it all the time, just when I felt an attack coming on), but that’s just me. I actually don’t know how much other people use for this purpose – anyone? -elizabeth
Xanax is a standard med to be used as needed., usually in combo with another med… however, I’ve been doing a lot of reading about a rebound effect … something I experience always, so I stopped.
I’ve got a question about this: how many times a day were you taking it? I think that Xanax does not last equally long for everyone, so some people can get by taking twice a day but others need it four times a day. -elizabeth
Xanax is a standard med to be used as needed., usually in combo with another med… however, I’ve been doing a lot of reading about a rebound effect … something I experience always, so I stopped. I’ve got a question about this: how many times a day were you taking it? I think that Xanax does not last equally long for everyone, so some people can get by taking twice a day but others need it four times a day. -elizabeth
Personally I had trouble taking it PRN because my pas were often OOB (as in while sleeping or nothing at all) although after enough of them I developed pretty much a state of constant anticipatory anxiety ..I could literally think myself into a panic attack trying to figure out how to avoid them..enter agoraphobia..Anyhow when I finally got Xanax I found if I had a PA it would generally take me 1.5-2 mgs to stop it..and I had little success with twice a day dosage,so I decided to stop the PRN route, as that is almost sure to leave anyone like myself with lots of hours of anxiety, as Xanax lasts 4 to 5 hrs at most for me. I now take it regularly .05 mg to 1 mg every four hours while awake, and if I rememeber..I do skip doses lots of times without even noticing it since my other two meds are helping a good deal too I think. But I can’t imagine twice a day being a very good xanax dosing..I would think 3 times at least given its short action. I have had almost no…nada..zero PAs for 6 weeks or more *knock on wood*, and my anxiety level is low enough to live with..I am sorry I was talked out of Xanax for so long because its tailor made for me and allows me to live, like a ..well not normal..but like a person anyhow ;- May — "Believe me! The secret of reaping the greatest fruitfulness and the greatest enjoyment from life is to live dangerously!" - Nietzsche
Personally I had trouble taking it PRN because my pas were often OOB (as in while sleeping or nothing at all) although after enough of them I developed pretty much a state of constant anticipatory anxiety
I pretty much *exclusively* had OOTB panic attacks; I can only think of one instance in which there’s been an apparent trigger (it was a couple months ago – anxiety about school, actually). However, I experience an aura that predicts panic pretty consistently. I’ve never had one in my sleep, but then again, I don’t sleep much. :-} Anyhow when I finally got Xanax I found if I had a PA it would generally take me 1.5-2 mgs to stop it..and I had little success with twice a day dosage,so I decided to stop the PRN route, as that is almost sure to leave anyone like myself with lots of hours of anxiety, as Xanax lasts 4 to 5 hrs at most for me.
Yowsers. It lasts a lot longer than that for me: if I take a large enough dose to be sedating, I can actually get a full night’s sleep (7-8 hours). Most people do need to take it at least 3 times a day, though. I now take it regularly .05 mg to 1 mg every four hours while awake, and if I rememeber..I do skip doses lots of times without even noticing it since my other two meds are helping a good deal too I think.
Every 4 hours? Wow. Do you wake up in the morning feeling cruddy? When I tried taking Buprenex by itself (without a regular antidepressant), I found that I would get nasty rebound depression if I missed a dose. I think that sort of thing (short-acting) is better if you have an antidepressant (or two to smooth things out. (Now I’m just using the Buprenex as a p.r.n.) -elizabeth
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Personally I had trouble taking it PRN because my pas were often OOB (as in while sleeping or nothing at all) although after enough of them I developed pretty much a state of constant anticipatory anxiety I pretty much *exclusively* had OOTB panic attacks; I can only think of one instance in which there’s been an apparent trigger (it was a couple months ago – anxiety about school, actually). However, I experience an aura that predicts panic pretty consistently. I’ve never had one in my sleep, but then again, I don’t sleep much. :-} Anyhow when I finally got Xanax I found if I had a PA it would generally take me 1.5-2 mgs to stop it..and I had little success with twice a day dosage,so I decided to stop the PRN route, as that is almost sure to leave anyone like myself with lots of hours of anxiety, as Xanax lasts 4 to 5 hrs at most for me. Yowsers. It lasts a lot longer than that for me: if I take a large enough dose to be sedating, I can actually get a full night’s sleep (7-8 hours).
I have never experienced any sedation or gotten any "buzz" from Xanax, in fact it actually energizes me without making me "speedy", if that makes sense. I had awful drowsiness on Klonopin that never went any and I was not even on a full therapeutic dosage any of the three times I took it. I still do not sleep well and have Ambien that I take on occasion and find somewhat helpful, but If I take it more than two days in a row it seems to lose its effectiveness for me. I am totally screwed up with sleep and energy due to the fact that I work full time night shift and then watch my highly hyperactive toddler all day until 4 or 5 when my eldest daughter comes home to help. So I am always tired and yet cannot fall asleep..frustrating! Most people do need to take it at least 3 times a day, though. I now take it regularly .05 mg to 1 mg every four hours while awake, and if I rememeber..I do skip doses lots of times without even noticing it since my other two meds are helping a good deal too I think. Every 4 hours? Wow. Do you wake up in the morning feeling cruddy?
I wake up feeling better than I ever have in my life; I no longer sleep through the alarm or take an hour to drag my butt out of it. As I said though (I think) I am also on Pamelor 50mgs and 20mgs of Prozac and I no longer necessarily take xanax every four hours..On days off at home I have forgotten to take any at all even, and then there are days where I know I am going to be better off to take it every 4 hours before I *need* it after six…I have never had any aura at all for my OOB attacks and over the years I have accumulated a ton of triggers that I am now working on overcoming..the big one so far was not only to ride comfortably in a car but to drive myself..Now that the Pamelor/Prozac is kicking in, I am taking the xanax pretty much prn..I dont generally take more than 2 mgs total on any day now, and as I say I have never felt more competent or alive in my life =) When I tried taking Buprenex by itself (without a regular antidepressant), I found that I would get nasty rebound depression if I missed a dose. I think that sort of thing (short-acting) is better if you have an antidepressant (or two to smooth things out. (Now I’m just using the Buprenex as a p.r.n.) -elizabeth
May — "Believe me! The secret of reaping the greatest fruitfulness and the greatest enjoyment from life is to live dangerously!" - Nietzsche
Hi, I started taking zoloft 2 months ago (25 mg). I couldnt handle the side effects when i tried to do 50 (sleepiness, weight gain, diarrhea), so i went to my pd friday. He put me on 100 mg of Wellbutrin every morning along with the 25 mg of zoloft in the evening. I’m worried about mixing 2 antidepressants. Are any of you doing this now?
Hi- Combining two- or sometimes even three- anti-depressants (or sometimes other drugs) is pretty standard psychopharmacology these days. Sometimes, high enough doses of one drug can’t be tolerated or are unsafe, or sometimes the one medication might just not be effective enough for your needs. Combining two can target more specific needs or one might be used to improve the effect of the other. Hope it helps- Susan
: Hi, : I started taking zoloft 2 months ago (25 mg). I couldnt handle the side : effects when i tried to do 50 (sleepiness, weight gain, diarrhea), so i went to : my pd friday. He put me on 100 mg of Wellbutrin every morning along with the : 25 mg of zoloft in the evening. I’m worried about mixing 2 antidepressants. : Are any of you doing this now? : —
Anxiousgrl schreef: Hi, I started taking zoloft 2 months ago (25 mg). I couldnt handle the side effects when i tried to do 50 (sleepiness, weight gain, diarrhea), so i went to my pd friday. He put me on 100 mg of Wellbutrin every morning along with the 25 mg of zoloft in the evening. I’m worried about mixing 2 antidepressants. Are any of you doing this now?
In principle this can be done. Your doctor probably prescribed the Wellbutrin because it’s sort of *stimulating* and can undo the sleepiness caused by Zoloft. Still, there are better solutions possible IMO which include adding a benzo like Xanax instead of Wellbutrin of which the anti-anxiety effect is highly debatable. OTOH, Xanax can make you drowsly, especially in the beginning, which is not quite what you seem to need right now. So another proposition could be another SSRI like Zoloft but then a more stimulating one which might be Prozac or else switching to a TCA. Still you might want to give the combo Zoloft/Wellbutrin a chance. Stranger combos have worked for people. Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
Hi, I started taking zoloft 2 months ago (25 mg). I couldnt handle the side effects when i tried to do 50 (sleepiness, weight gain, diarrhea), so i went to my pd friday. He put me on 100 mg of Wellbutrin every morning along with the 25 mg of zoloft in the evening. I’m worried about mixing 2 antidepressants. Are any of you doing this now?
Hi Anxiousgirl, Mixing two or more antidepressants is becoming a routine treatment method. While I’m not totally convinced that its necessary in most cases, it won’t do any harm (there are some ADs, however, which should not be mixed). The proponents of ‘cocktail’ prescribing claim that the wider affect of more than one anti-anxiety med increases the probability of successful treatment. It’s true that each antidepressant tends to affect a slightly different groups of neurotransmitter receptors and it may be that this broader combined mode of action will have a greater affect. However, the same results can often be achieved using just one AD. The difficult being that you need to find the ‘right’ one. The one advantage of the Zoloft/Wellbutin combo is that Wellbutin tends to moderate the sexual dysfunction affect of some ADs, incl Zoloft. If this combination of meds is doing the job, then stick with it, if not see your doc about changing to something else. Ian Phobias: Catapedaphobia- Fear of jumping from high and low places.
i was on Zoloft for about a year and1/2.Just like you i had all the same symptom,s as you.then when going of the Zoloft i was sent to a neurologist because the back of my head kept going numb.Then i was off of everything for about 2yrs.Istarted all the dizziness and mass confusion at the time that we had moved ,i then changed to a new dr.He read my chart and he desided to put me on what they call SERZONE,,,,,,,, man I LOVED IT, no side afffects.i took the serzone for a little over a year and then went off of it .I can honestly say i feel great ,i actually wake up in the same mood i went to bed in .for the first time in my LIFE my day;s seem to be as normal as the next guy;s. SERZONE is a chemical- it replaces the saratonin and prolactin in the brain which are the hormones the the brain and body produce.For me my imbalance was caused by childhood trauma….. i hope you get the help you need see ya later. kugoe