Question:

Fred, andrew, now LyndaNP, always somebody obsessively flooding this poor NG.with CROSSPOSTS!

Does lynda np really have bipolar depression?  Anyway depression is part of bipolar so I suppose it is ok for her to post to the depression group.  But it is very VERY dangerous to medicate bipolar depression the same way you medicate plain old depression. (if there is such a thing)  I say this because some doktors in research think that reoccurring depression is on the bipolar spectrum. Diana has schizoaffective disorder and you have not complained about here being over there, or have you?

Response:

I think it says a great deal. We’re looking at direct reflections back to the self appointed monopolizer of the any ngs she wishes to join. Moll

Then, you may want to check out your ISP’s TOS because lots of you are going to get reported for usenet abuse. if the self appointed monopolizer is abusing her service, report her; if not, kill file her but all of you jerks who do nothing more than repost her articles are no better than she is–in terms of signal to noise, it isn’t she who’s producing the noise. — Love is a fruit in season at all times, and within reach of every hand.                Mother Teresa http://home.gwi.net/~mdmpsyd/index.htm for mail remove PETERHOOD69

Response:

I think in this case it goes way beyond monopolizing, because the NEW  NG isnt a bipolar NG. its the much beleaguered,  alt.support. depression.medication, for sufferers of depression, that …This PARTY, suffering bipolar disorder is obsessively flooding with posts also CROSSPOSTED  to the bipolar support groups, DAILY, as in every day, she floods us with 20 NEW threads crossposted to the bipolar NG. If she was a sufferer fo depression, her doing what she is doing be monopoloizing.  But being she sufferers an entirely different disorder, while flooding sufferers of distinctly different disorder and then crossposts them too,  this is outright TROLLING. Fred, andrew, now LyndaNP, always somebody obsessively flooding this poor NG.with CROSSPOSTS! … – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I think it says a great deal. We’re looking at direct reflections back to the self appointed monopolizer of the any ngs she wishes to join. Moll AboutLyndaNPsXposting wrote nothing: your point is? — Love is a fruit in season at all times, and within reach of every hand.                Mother Teresa http://home.gwi.net/~mdmpsyd/index.htm for mail remove PETERHOOD69

Response:

I think it says a great deal. We’re looking at direct reflections back to the self appointed monopolizer of the any ngs she wishes to join. Moll – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – AboutLyndaNPsXposting wrote nothing: your point is? — Love is a fruit in season at all times, and within reach of every hand.                Mother Teresa http://home.gwi.net/~mdmpsyd/index.htm for mail remove PETERHOOD69

Response:

AboutLyndaNPsXposting wrote nothing: your point is? — Love is a fruit in season at all times, and within reach of every hand.                Mother Teresa http://home.gwi.net/~mdmpsyd/index.htm for mail remove PETERHOOD69

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://pharmacology.about.com/health/pharmacology/library/weekly/aa00031 4a.htm Generic Drugs FAQ Prescription drugs can be a costly medical expense, especially for older people and those who are chronically ill. However, in the United States, each state has a law that allows pharmacists to substitute less expensive generic drugs for many brand-name products. Depending on your prescription needs, your savings could be significant. The same reasoning applies also to non-prescription, or over the counter, medications. What’s the difference between a generic and brand-name drug? The names are different, and the price of the generic drug is usually lower than that of a name-brand drug. A generic drug is called by its chemical name; a manufacturer assigns a brand name. Both generic and brand-name products have the same active ingredients. Overall, in a population, the generic drug is just as safe and effective as the brand-name drug. However, generics are not necessarily formulated in an identical manner to corresponding brand-name drugs. Because of that, there can be occasional differences in individual side-effects (nausea, for example; it may be better or worse with a generic versus a brand-name drug). There can also be occasional differences in an individual’s response to a generic drug (compared to the brand-name drug), since formulation differences can affect factors such as how much actually enters the bloodstream after oral administration. Do all drugs have generic equivalents? No. Newer drugs are protected by patents and are supplied by only one company. However, when the patent expires, other manufacturers can produce its generic version. Currently, about half the drugs on the market are available in generic form.  In addition to asking your physician or pharmacist about the availability of a specific generic drug, you can also investigate which drugs are available as generics by using our How To Find Drug Info page. How can I get generic drugs? Talk with your doctor or pharmacist. Explain that you want the most effective drug at the best price. Ask your doctor to write prescriptions for generic drugs when possible. Are there exceptions to the law? Yes. If your doctor writes on the prescription form that a specific brand-name drug is required, your pharmacist must fill the prescription as written. That is, a generic drug cannot be substituted. However, your pharmacist can talk with your doctor about the prescription. Perhaps there’s an acceptable generic drug that your doctor is not aware of. Your pharmacist can compare and evaluate generic and brand-name drugs and may be able to consult with your doctor to provide the right medication at the lowest possible price. Will my doctor automatically prescribe generic drugs? It depends on the physician. You can ask your doctor to write a prescription permitting substitution of a generic drug product when appropriate. You also can ask whether a generic product will be as effective and less costly. Or, you can request that only brand-name products be used to fill your prescriptions. Where can I get more information? See the links below. SOURCE: U.S. Federal Trade Commission; modified and some parts copied, as allowed. Information and links in this article were accurate as of the date near the title of the article. You can search this site or check New Drug Approvals or Drugs in the News for updates or more recent information. Additional InformationFeatured Articles         Other Drug Links Use the back button on your browser to return here. Better yet, bookmark this page Are Generic Drugs Appropriate Substitutes for Brand-name Drugs? – Yes From the American Council on Science and Health. A brief, but thorough, discussion. FDA Approval Process for Generic Medications An excellent explanation of a complicated process. From Stadtlander’s Pharmacy. Generic Drug Review Process The real thing, from the U.S. FDA. An interactive chart that provides an overview of how the FDA determines the safety and bioequivalence of generic drug products before approval for marketing. Generic Drugs From the Merck Manual of Medical Information Home Edition. A clearly-written chapter. Generic Pharmaceuticals: An Inside Look Excellent resource. From the Mylan Institute of Pharmacy, which is associated with generic drugs. Office of Generic Drugs From the U.S. FDA. A good starting point for detailed info. Plain Talk About Generics Very brief article, from Optimal Health. The Value of Generic Drugs Very brief, but a good read. Therapeutic Equivalence of Generic Drugs FDA letter to health practitioners. ABC News also has a story on the letter. Therapeutic Equivalence of Generic Drugs FDA response to U.S. National Association of Boards of Pharmacy. A different letter than the one above. How To Find Drug InfoDrug Manufacturer’s Web SitesNew Drug ApprovalsDrugs in the News IndexPharmacology HomeFor more information or details concerning this topic or specific drugs, try searching this web site. If you still need more info concerning individual drugs, it can usually be obtained by following the tips listed on our How To Find Drug Info page. Drug Manufacturer’s Web Sites are also a good source, especially for newer drugs when other information is less readily available. If you’ve tried and still can’t find the info you need, try posting your question on the Pharmacology Bulletin Board. I personally reply to some questions posted on the BB, but if you have a particular interest or expertise, please, feel free to reply to questions or add your comments or opinions. I regret that I can’t answer email questions, although your comments are always welcome. The Contact Information and FAQs Page is also always available. Disclaimer: The material in this Pharmacology web site is provided for education and information purposes only, and should not replace or substitute for advice from your physician or other health care professional. — LyndaNP Reality isn’t the way you wish things to be, nor the way they appear to be, but the way they actually are. – Robert J. Ringer — LyndaNP Reality isn’t the way you wish things to be, nor the way they appear to be, but the way they actually are. – Robert J. Ringer

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Question:

Tami, I don’t know what your office is like but if you have an office or workspace of your own perhaps your employer can install a window/wall air conditioner just for the space you are confined to. Then your area with stay cooler and less humid. I’m pretty certain that he can take some additonal tax write-offs under the ADA accomodations clauses and help both of you in the process. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is anyone else having trouble with the heat and humidity we are experiencing in the midwest this week and last?    I’m missing a lot of work because of the weather, I know my boss is not completely understanding the situation, and he’s getting a little digusted.   I just finished 2 weeks of prednisone, I take theodur, flovent 220, combivent, zyrtec, athsmacort  for my sinuses, and am taking augmenten again for yet another sinus infection.  My place of employment is air conditioned, but as the day goes on, and doors are constantly opened,  my lungs get tight, my face red, chest hurts, headache, you know the routine. coughing, wheezing,  tired.  Time to go home…What else can I do??  Any ideas??  Tami

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Problem for me is the constant change – going from hot humid outside to inside air conditioning and back.  Start having problems after going in and out serveral times.  Believe the sudden change doesn’t help my lungs at all! JEB – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is anyone else having trouble with the heat and humidity we are experiencing in the midwest this week and last?    I’m missing a lot of work because of the weather, I know my boss is not completely understanding the situation, and he’s getting a little digusted.   I just finished 2 weeks of prednisone, I take theodur, flovent 220, combivent, zyrtec, athsmacort  for my sinuses, and am taking augmenten again for yet another sinus infection.  My place of employment is air conditioned, but as the day goes on, and doors are constantly opened,  my lungs get tight, my face red, chest hurts, headache, you know the routine. coughing, wheezing,  tired.  Time to go home…What else can I do??  Any ideas??  Tami

Response:

Heat and humidity make it hard for anyone to breath and for asthmatics it’s worse.  Staying indoors with air-conditioning and drinking a lot of water is a good policy.  I work at home on "bad air" days when the  high humidity and or smog are high. I’m lucky that I can do my work from anywhere with a phone, computer and fax machine.  There are some days when I have to attend meetings etc., and then I take an air conditioned taxi or limo to the office to avoid being outdoors. In some jurisdictions there is legislation requiring reasonable accomodation of disabilities (e.g. Human Rights Codes), for example, installing wheelchair accessible washrooms.  In some cases, depending on the kind of work involved, arrangements for work at home on "bad air" days might be reasonable.  Some employers are happy to make this arrangement (with or without a statutory obligation) rather than have the employee book off sick since it allows for continued productivity.  Another possible accomodation arrangement is taxi fare to the office to avoid being outdoors to and from the office (assuming travel to the office is the problem and the office itself is air conditioned).

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is anyone else having trouble with the heat and humidity we are experiencing in the midwest this week and last?    I’m missing a lot of work because of the weather, I know my boss is not completely understanding the situation, and he’s getting a little digusted.   I just finished 2 weeks of prednisone, I take theodur, flovent 220, combivent, zyrtec, athsmacort  for my sinuses, and am taking augmenten again for yet another sinus infection.  My place of employment is air conditioned, but as the day goes on, and doors are constantly opened,  my lungs get tight, my face red, chest hurts, headache, you know the routine. coughing, wheezing,  tired.  Time to go home…What else can I do??  Any ideas??  Tami

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I am in the Midwest.. Wisconsin actually and the heat is killing me. I work down near the lake and the cooler air is not cool at all. I know how you feel. About work, I know how it goes. People think asthma is just some petty little excuse because we don’t want to work. Those people are ignorant. Luckily my job was a bit understanding when it came to me taking off for doctors. When I can, I work through my lunch. The bad part is that we have forced air conditioning and my asthma is worse at work. I was told to get some green plants but I don’t think that is going to do it. Unfortunately, with asthma, most of the time you don’t have a choice but to take off work. I feel for you but know that you are not alone. Shannon

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The totally bizarre thing about this is that some people seem to think we want to be ill!  When I developed asthma I had the most awful cough. However I found daytime TV boring so went to work.  We had a snotty young receptionist who accused me of deliberately coughing at her down the phone.  Now I realise it was unpleasant for those round me – but thankfully I resisted the urge to punch her face in.  In fact I was iller than I realised (due mostly to sleep deprivation) and the best thing anyone at work could have done was told me to go home and stay home until I was really well enough to work again.  And in my line of business I can work from home, though I’m not sure if we were so clued up on doing so at that time. Is anyone else having trouble with the heat and humidity we are experiencing in the midwest this week and last?    I’m missing a lot of work because of the weather, I know my boss is not completely understanding the situation, and he’s getting a little digusted.   I just finished 2 weeks of prednisone, I take theodur, flovent 220, combivent, zyrtec, athsmacort  for my sinuses, and am taking augmenten again for yet another sinus infection.  My place of employment is air conditioned, but as the day goes on, and doors are constantly opened,  my lungs get tight, my face red, chest hurts, headache, you know the routine. coughing, wheezing,  tired.  Time to go home…What else can I do??  Any ideas??  Tami Would moving your desk help?  Get your doctor to write your boss a letter explaining the problem . . . this is covered by ADA and Workers Comp. Chris Owens — Surfer!

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Is anyone else having trouble with the heat and humidity we are experiencing in the midwest this week and last?    I’m missing a lot of work because of the weather, I know my boss is not completely understanding the situation, and he’s getting a little digusted.   I just finished 2 weeks of prednisone, I take theodur, flovent 220, combivent, zyrtec, athsmacort  for my sinuses, and am taking augmenten again for yet another sinus infection.  My place of employment is air conditioned, but as the day goes on, and doors are constantly opened,  my lungs get tight, my face red, chest hurts, headache, you know the routine. coughing, wheezing,  tired.  Time to go home…What else can I do??  Any ideas??  Tami

Response:

Is anyone else having trouble with the heat and humidity we are experiencing in the midwest this week and last?  

I have had a little more trouble than usual.  When I go outside for very long at all, I come inside feeling like I’m suffocating.  It’s not an attack, just stuffy.   I know my boss is not completely understanding the situation, and he’s getting a little digusted.  

I used to have the same problem when I was working.  I eventually had to sit down with my boss and totally explain the situation to him and make him understand as best as I could.  Things got a little better after that, and my co-workers also understood more. my place of employment is air conditioned, but as the day goes on, and doors are constantly opened,  my lungs get tight, my face red, chest hurts, headache, you know the routine. coughing, wheezing,  tired.

Can you relocate your desk further away from the doors?? What else can I do??  Any ideas??  Tami

I had to end up taking an air purifier to work with me and putting it close to my desk area.  At first people thought it was weird, but eventually they ended up thank me, as their air was cleaned also.  It seems extreme, but I was determined not to let my work environment make me sick. Hope this helps! Take care! Ash http://www.angelfire.com/tn/Ashleigh1976/index.html

Response:

Is anyone else having trouble with the heat and humidity we are experiencing in the midwest this week and last?    I’m missing a lot of work because of the weather, I know my boss is not completely understanding the situation, and he’s getting a little digusted.   I just finished 2 weeks of prednisone, I take theodur, flovent 220, combivent, zyrtec, athsmacort  for my sinuses, and am taking augmenten again for yet another sinus infection.  My place of employment is air conditioned, but as the day goes on, and doors are constantly opened,  my lungs get tight, my face red, chest hurts, headache, you know the routine. coughing, wheezing,  tired.  Time to go home…What else can I do??  Any ideas??  Tami

Would moving your desk help?  Get your doctor to write your boss a letter explaining the problem . . . this is covered by ADA and Workers Comp. Chris Owens

Response:

The totally bizarre thing about this is that some people seem to think we want to be ill!  When I developed asthma I had the most awful cough. However I found daytime TV boring so went to work.  We had a snotty young receptionist who accused me of deliberately coughing at her down the phone.  Now I realise it was unpleasant for those round me – but thankfully I resisted the urge to punch her face in.  In fact I was iller than I realised (due mostly to sleep deprivation) and the best thing anyone at work could have done was told me to go home and stay home until I was really well enough to work again.  And in my line of business I can work from home, though I’m not sure if we were so clued up on doing so at that time. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is anyone else having trouble with the heat and humidity we are experiencing in the midwest this week and last?    I’m missing a lot of work because of the weather, I know my boss is not completely understanding the situation, and he’s getting a little digusted.   I just finished 2 weeks of prednisone, I take theodur, flovent 220, combivent, zyrtec, athsmacort  for my sinuses, and am taking augmenten again for yet another sinus infection.  My place of employment is air conditioned, but as the day goes on, and doors are constantly opened,  my lungs get tight, my face red, chest hurts, headache, you know the routine. coughing, wheezing,  tired.  Time to go home…What else can I do??  Any ideas??  Tami Would moving your desk help?  Get your doctor to write your boss a letter explaining the problem . . . this is covered by ADA and Workers Comp. Chris Owens

– Surfer!

Response:

Hi Blaine…. Check out www.aviationweather.com.  It has the latest surface analysis reports(SA’s) in ICAO format, and also translated (eg…"heavy rain, windy" just underneath something like 33030g45 RA+)… ed s.

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Back when I used to be a Microsoft Flight Simulator junkie, I noticed you could call up the weather on ATIS.  Is their any place on the web that would give you the weather (text) for a particular U.S. Airport.  Also, I would imagine it’s in shorthand, so an interpretation guide might be helpful too Many thanks, Blaine Thompson

Response:

Hi Blaine…. Check out www.aviationweather.com.  It has the latest surface analysis reports(SA’s) in ICAO format, and also translated (eg…"heavy rain, windy" just underneath something like 33030g45 RA+)… ed s.

Response:

Back when I used to be a Microsoft Flight Simulator junkie, I noticed you could call up the weather on ATIS.  Is their any place on the web that would give you the weather (text) for a particular U.S. Airport.  Also, I would imagine it’s in shorthand, so an interpretation guide might be helpful too Many thanks, Blaine Thompson

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Question:

Sorry dude, I tend to agree on the side effects of Xanax..I actually was on Xanax for almost 3 yrs, AND (forgive me) was working as a P.medic at the same time…I was a walking zombie and my partners had to cover my azz more than once cuz I was falling asleep everywhere..I couldnt think straight…I couldnt DRIVE at all, and put my car in the ditch at least once…I was trying to attend college but my grades dropped like a bomb..I felt like I was in another world (I was taking this for panic attacks)…then finally, one day, I was getting into the ambulance and fell out the back door while closing it…that was enuff..withdrawal was HEAVENLY..*I love to puke, since IM also bulimic so this was right up my alley…sigghh…the dry heaves was an added bonus since I also like to punish myself..the headaches werent so cool thooo…any other questions about this lovely wonder drug?  Paxil: I just took this one 2 yrs ago for depression..was on it for about 9 mos….It made me nauseous and my stomach hurt all the time..I had headaches and felt like I had a cold all the time (stuffy head feeling)..withdrawal was not as bad as with some others, but there still was the nauseau/vomiting thing etc..so it felt just like I was still taking it till it was out of my system…blah…~Ima – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – People with biplar disorder should not take Paxil or any other anti depressant long term. I am sick and tired about all these posts trying to scare people away from trying xanax.  As someone who has suffered from bipolar disorder(type 2) for 15 years, tried all the antidepressants, now on a cocktail of meds, including xanax and paxil, my experience is that PAXIL has many more adverse effects versus the marginal benefit of some anxiety relief.  I took Paxil for 5 months and was not taking any xanax, and I got some anticapation anxiety relief at the cost of NO LIBIDO, sleeping 12 hours a day, having no motivation, just didn’t give a shit, already gained 10 pounds in 5 months with the carbo craving…..And people want to talk about xanax dependency and problems with withdrawl.  I am not trying to minimize people’s experience or their pain, but with anxiety or other mental health issues, the word is YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY(YMMY).  I am a college graduate in electrical engineering from a top 5 engineering college, and now have not worked for over two years mostly because of anxiety and some depression yearly.  After working for 11 years struggling with depression and anxiety, I now have a hard time stepping outside my home.  I have considered suicide 1000’s of times over the last 15 years, actually researched and made the plans and was about to end it, and then I started on the Paxil…….Yeah, my suicidal obsessions went away, but now I was content to veg out all day watching TY or on the Net, my desire to GET A JOB disappeared.  Go research web sites and you will see how many people have problems with SSRI’s, yeah they are alive and taking that $3 pill two times a day or many $3 pills for me, but now I am NUMB and just there.  Prior to Paxil I use to be a emotional person, felt the pain of others and would cry when touched by something, but now I am a Paxil-zombie, yeah some anxiety relief but a LOT OF ME is also gone.  So all those xanax phobics, please allow people to fail with their options without scaring them.  What are people’s choices when it comes to anxiety or panic, yes paxil, yes benzo’s, yes MAIO’s, yes CBT(Cognitive Behavior Therapy).  My experience is PAXIL SUCKS and THE WITHDRAWAL IS HORRIBLE BASED ON MUCH FEEDBACK I HAVE READ ON THE NET, MAIO’S like parnate have some studies that back them up but the food restrictions are VERY DIFFICULT(no cheese, wine, beer, chocolate, many OTC meds, etc.), CBT might work for some but the feedback I have heard is that CBT plus meds work the best and I HAVE DONE THE THERAPY ROUTE and it was a waste of money. As one doctor told me, people who suffer from PANIC and think they are dieing have never been told that "your not going to die, it is all in your head"…Well that was my last session with him.  Just to repeat, this is MY EXPERIENCE and YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY.  Now I could continue to HIBERNATE IN MY HOUSE, NOT WORK, RUN OUT OF MONEY AND THEN BE HOMELESS…..Or I can be proactive and continue to experiment and try to find some solution that will allow me to work and have a life.  I have taken xanax in the past, just started it one month ago, still taking a low dose of paxil, and I am MUCH MUCH BETTER at dealing with day to day life, interacting with people, giving my shit done, etc. Yeah, maybe I will be taking xanax for the rest of my life but the only side effect I have had is some sleepiness.  And to those who talk about TOLERANCE BUILDUP, that is a CROCK, yes you might have to increase your xanax from .25mg 3 times a day to .50mg 3 times a day, there are people who have taken xanax for 5 to 15 years and most leveled out after 1 year at a dose and have no desire to increase. People need to do some research and FIND OUT THE REAL TRUTH, not what BIG PHARMA and BIG BUSINESS OWNED MEDIA OUTLETS want us to believe. Not to be cynical, but $3 no generic available paxil is much better for DRUG COMPANIES, then CHEAP GENERIC XANAX which might be more effective with less side-effects.  Why are benzo’s so hard to get, cause drug lobbiest have access to CONGRESS and made sure that THE NO-PROFIT SOLUTIONS(IE LIKE BENZO’S) are not readily available. Linda Channell, (740) 548-6874, 88 Ravine Rd, Powell, OH 43065 Let me make THE NEWCOMERS TO MENTAL ILLNESS aware that HYPE ABOUT THE LATEST ANTIDEPRESSANT HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT WILL BE MADE ON THE DRUG, and the only time you will hear about THE NEGATIVES about that drug will be when it comes off-patent. Now that we have generic prozac, we will hear more about side effects like NO LIBIDO, WEIGHT GAIN, SUICIDE, AND OTHER  EFEECTS.  Of course, as long as Paxil and Zoloft have no generics, MEDIA HYPE will be still muted, but give it time.  Just as all the SSRI’s go generic, we will hear about ALL THE NEGATIVES and out will come the new batch of 8 TO 12 WEEK STUDIED ANTIDEPRESSANTS to start the new profit cycle.  People with mental illness are just pawns, half ass useless meds are approved based on 8 week studies, NO REASON FOR A LONG TERM STUDY, we really don’t want to KNOW THE TRUTH, and as soon as the generics start rolling out, OUT COMES THE DIRTY LAUNDRY, not to HELP US, NO, ONLY SO THAT WE GO ON THE LATEST $5 PILL THAT HAS A 80% SUCCESS RATE AND EVEN LESS SIDE EFFECTS.  Hell as long as everyone is making money, who cares about THE CRAZIES that take the product, we just need them alive and taking their meds.  Now I forget, was I taking about the cigarette industry or drug companies, HELL WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE.  This of course is just the opinion of a mentally ill patient with 15 years of experience popping pills, all of which have a 70% effective rate, but I guess I am the exception, "ALIVE" AND NOT SUICIDAL, AND NOT HAPPY ABOUT IT. White Knight

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sorry dude, I tend to agree on the side effects of Xanax..I actually was on Xanax for almost 3 yrs, AND (forgive me) was working as a P.medic at the same time…I was a walking zombie and my partners had to cover my azz more than once cuz I was falling asleep everywhere..I couldnt think straight…I couldnt DRIVE at all, and put my car in the ditch at least once…I was trying to attend college but my grades dropped like a bomb..I felt like I was in another world (I was taking this for panic attacks)…then finally, one day, I was getting into the ambulance and fell out the back door while closing it…that was enuff..withdrawal was HEAVENLY..*I love to puke, since IM also bulimic so this was right up my alley…sigghh…the dry heaves was an added bonus since I also like to punish myself..the headaches werent so cool thooo…any other questions about this lovely wonder drug?  Paxil: I just took this one 2 yrs ago for depression..was on it for about 9 mos….It made me nauseous and my stomach hurt all the time..I had headaches and felt like I had a cold all the time (stuffy head feeling)..withdrawal was not as bad as with some others, but there still was the nauseau/vomiting thing etc..so it felt just like I was still taking it till it was out of my system…blah…~Ima

The worst thing about it, in my experience is the panic attacks that arose from reaching tolerance level.  After many years, maybe 7 or 10, I started getting severe panic attacks every day; it was a nightmare.  I got out of it myself by searching the net and suspecting that indeed this was addiction.  But my doctor did not know this I don’t think — I was helped and contratulated to get off altogether.  I believe that the longer term benzos are different in this respect – perhaps requiring much longer time to reach tolerance or habituation of the nervous system. I no longer have panic attacks – they destroyed my life and my career during my 30s and 40s – I’m wondering what’s next with the rest of my meds. Squiggles

Response:

the only thing that helped me was the book traveling light.I recommend it to anyone.its by Max Lucado.

Response:

the only thing that helped me was the book traveling light.I recommend it to anyone.its by Max Lucado.

Dawn, No offense but just because the medical establishment hasn’t got it right on psychopharmacology, doesn’t mean that Christianity does.  If it helped you that’s good, but spirituality is one thing and medicine another. Squiggles

Response:

Squiggles, I was not telling anyone that they had to go off their medication,I was just letting everyone know that I like that book and I want everyone to know that it was good.it had nothing to do with medication,because no matter how much I believe in god as my savior,I will always be mentally ill.I am sorry if you thought I was attacking you in anyway.

Response:

I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

Response:

I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

You should have a "post new message" or "new message" command around somewhere, use that instead of replying to someone else’s post. If you reply it will appear linked to the post to which you replied, even if you change the subject line. Can’t be more specific without knowing what program you’re using. Fiona — If we had no winter, the spring would not be so pleasant: if we did not sometimes taste the adversity, prosperity would not be so welcome.      – Anne Bradstreet, Meditations Divine and Moral, 1664

Response:

"Dawn" wrote I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

Do you have a "New Post" button? Oh, I see Fiona has already enswered this. Well, good luck, Dawn. Hugs, TK

Response:

Squiggles, I was not telling anyone that they had to go off their medication,I was just letting everyone know that I like that book and I want everyone to know that it was good.it had nothing to do with medication,because no matter how much I believe in god as my savior,I will always be mentally ill.I am sorry if you thought I was attacking you in anyway.

OK – sorry, I suppose I have become hypervigilant to propaganda on the net.  I apologize. Squiggles

Response:

Benzodiazepines cause cognitive decline and depression.

All of them?  Gasp — I have to take clonazepam for bipolar disorder, and some kids have to take 10 times my dose for epilepsy.  Are you sure? Squiggles

Response:

You have done it! Victoria – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Organization: Road Runner Newsgroups: alt.support.depression.manic,alt.support.personality,alt.support.depression .me dication I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

Response:

    I have the impression that convulsions cause brain damage too. Goblin

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Benzodiazepines cause cognitive decline and depression. All of them?  Gasp — I have to take clonazepam for bipolar disorder, and some kids have to take 10 times my dose for epilepsy.  Are you sure? Squiggles Cognitive Impairment and Long-Term Damage The many papers published in the 1960s and early to mid 1970s on this subject were largely single dose therapeutic dose studies or low-dose studies for periods of a few weeks. They showed a range of deficits in cognitive function, psychomotor performance and short-term memory problems with no development of tolerance. It was not until the late 1970s and early 1980s (when therapeutic dose dependency was belatedly accepted), that cognitive function and other tests on long-term benzodiazepine users (up to 10 years) were studied both during use and in acute withdrawals. From the mid 1980s to mid 1990s there was an increasing number of studies looking at damage after long-term use and at follow-up periods after discontinuation of up to six years. Several of these studies involve CT scans of the brain looking for structural changes. Summary Benzodiazepines produce impairment of cognitive functioning and psychomotor performance e.g. reaction time, vigilance, arousal, judgement, reasoning, speed and accuracy of information processing, visual spatial ability, co-ordination, short-term and post drug long-term memory, ‘blackouts’ and learned tasks. These effects are independent of abuse, dependency, non-dependency, normal, healthy, young or old subjects. Impairment increases with chronic use. Development of tolerance to these effects is very slow. CT brain scans show a difference in ventricular cerebral spinal fluid space dimensions between benzodiazepine users and non-users, and also between high and low benzodiazepine users. The functional brain damage causes increased morbidity, increased mortality and social deterioration. Subjects are generally not aware of their reduced capacity or the fact that they are not functioning well in every day life. In general much of the impairment is slowly reversible. Some aspects show improvement after six years, some are semi-permanent or permanent. http://www.benzo.org.uk/vot4.htm

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Benzodiazepines cause cognitive decline and depression. All of them?  Gasp — I have to take clonazepam for bipolar disorder, and some kids have to take 10 times my dose for epilepsy.  Are you sure? Squiggles Cognitive Impairment and Long-Term Damage The many papers published in the 1960s and early to mid 1970s on this subject were largely single dose therapeutic dose studies or low-dose studies for periods of a few weeks. They showed a range of deficits in cognitive function, psychomotor performance and short-term memory problems with no development of tolerance. It was not until the late 1970s and early 1980s (when therapeutic dose dependency was belatedly accepted), that cognitive function and other tests on long-term benzodiazepine users (up to 10 years) were studied both during use and in acute withdrawals. From the mid 1980s to mid 1990s there was an increasing number of studies looking at damage after long-term use and at follow-up periods after discontinuation of up to six years. Several of these studies involve CT scans of the brain looking for structural changes. Summary Benzodiazepines produce impairment of cognitive functioning and psychomotor performance e.g. reaction time, vigilance, arousal, judgement, reasoning, speed and accuracy of information processing, visual spatial ability, co-ordination, short-term and post drug long-term memory, ‘blackouts’ and learned tasks. These effects are independent of abuse, dependency, non-dependency, normal, healthy, young or old subjects. Impairment increases with chronic use. Development of tolerance to these effects is very slow. CT brain scans show a difference in ventricular cerebral spinal fluid space dimensions between benzodiazepine users and non-users, and also between high and low benzodiazepine users. The functional brain damage causes increased morbidity, increased mortality and social deterioration. Subjects are generally not aware of their reduced capacity or the fact that they are not functioning well in every day life. In general much of the impairment is slowly reversible. Some aspects show improvement after six years, some are semi-permanent or permanent. http://www.benzo.org.uk/vot4.htm

Right, Am I speaking with Ray or Rand or possible David Woolfe’s ghost? Squiggles

Response:

You have done it!

Depends on how the newsreader threads it. In Netscape this shows up with the new subject line but still under the old thread, so I don’t see the new subject line unless I open the old thread for it. Fiona — If we had no winter, the spring would not be so pleasant: if we did not sometimes taste the adversity, prosperity would not be so welcome.      – Anne Bradstreet, Meditations Divine and Moral, 1664

Response:

I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

You just title it and post it usnig new message.I have a AC and have the option of posting to the ngs. — LyndaNP Reality isn’t the way you wish things to be, nor the way they appear to be, but the way they actually are. – Robert J. Ringer

Response:

Dawn I was wondering exactly who you are posting to. Cause right now you are posting to 5 different groups. ~Michele

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

Response:

thanks Michelle I was a little confused.I am new to this.I just started.thanks

Response:

    I have the impression that convulsions cause brain damage too. Goblin

correct. very seriously, if left untreated and they are severe convulsions… — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

Now I’m confused.  (?) ~Michele

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – thanks Michelle I was a little confused.I am new to this.I just started.thanks

Response:

Dawn I was wondering exactly who you are posting to. Cause right now you are posting to 5 different groups. ~Michele

thats probably cos she hit reply to one of those messages that was crossposted to all and sundry… its not her fault. m — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

I didn’t mean for it to sound mean. I really wanted to know who she was posting to. I’m confused.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dawn I was wondering exactly who you are posting to. Cause right now you are posting to 5 different groups. ~Michele thats probably cos she hit reply to one of those messages that was crossposted to all and sundry… its not her fault. m — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

I didn’t mean for it to sound mean. I really wanted to know who she was posting to. I’m confused.

its okay. which group are you on? i think this was intended for alt.support.depression.manic m — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

Good author—-writes good books!! cal

Response:

Gee, I have been using Klonopin off and on now for around..oh..10 yrs now..in doses from .5 mg to 5mgs daily…..and my brain isnt fried….(half-baked but not fried)…in fact, I had to have an IQ test for the state to see if I was qualified for rehab (and not retarded) last year and had a very hefty score above 140…*but I didnt get to join rehab cuz they tells me I aint KURED enuff to join the work force in doing the menial minimum wage training of cleaning dirty lunch trays-which is what they wanted to ‘train’ me to do-so I could RE-enter society…(I was a paramedic for 16 yrs prior, so cleaning lunch trays was considered something I would be qualified to do thru rehab).. Good thing Ive been taking them tranks tho..keeps my mind clean and ..um, um..what was I saying? Was I saying something?  What the hell am I doing here anyway? Just forget it..I dont even know who you are..stop stealing my jacks or IM gonna tell.. ~Ima – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     I have the impression that convulsions cause brain damage too. Goblin correct. very seriously, if left untreated and they are severe convulsions… — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

     i haven’t read this book yet—-what is the "theme"?      i have read some of his other books—he is great.      If this helped you, don’t let ANYONE discourage you!! cal

Response:

EXACTELY. What about the damage these other meds cause like Li and anti psychotics? We could go on and on. Or even the progressive nature of BP/ and connvulsions. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have the impression that convulsions cause brain damage too. Goblin

Response:

I didn’t mean for it to sound mean. I really wanted to know who she was posting to. I’m confused.

its okay. which group are you on? i think this was intended for alt.support.depression.manic m — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

Gee, I have been using Klonopin off and on now for around..oh..10 yrs now..in doses from .5 mg to 5mgs daily…..and my brain isnt fried….(half-baked but not fried)…in fact, I had to have an IQ test for the state to see if I was qualified for rehab (and not retarded) last year and had a very hefty score above 140…*but I didnt get to join rehab cuz they tells me I aint KURED enuff to join the work force in doing the menial minimum wage training of cleaning dirty lunch trays-which is what they wanted to ‘train’ me to do-so I could RE-enter society…(I was a paramedic for 16 yrs prior, so cleaning lunch trays was considered something I would be qualified to do thru rehab).. Good thing Ive been taking them tranks tho..keeps my mind clean and ..um, um..what was I saying? Was I saying something?  What the hell am I doing here anyway? Just forget it..I dont even know who you are..stop stealing my jacks or IM gonna tell.. ~Ima – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     I have the impression that convulsions cause brain damage too. Goblin correct. very seriously, if left untreated and they are severe convulsions… — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

thanks Michelle I was a little confused.I am new to this.I just started.thanks

Response:

    I have the impression that convulsions cause brain damage too. Goblin

correct. very seriously, if left untreated and they are severe convulsions… — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

Now I’m confused.  (?) ~Michele

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – thanks Michelle I was a little confused.I am new to this.I just started.thanks

Response:

Dawn I was wondering exactly who you are posting to. Cause right now you are posting to 5 different groups. ~Michele

thats probably cos she hit reply to one of those messages that was crossposted to all and sundry… its not her fault. m — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

I didn’t mean for it to sound mean. I really wanted to know who she was posting to. I’m confused.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dawn I was wondering exactly who you are posting to. Cause right now you are posting to 5 different groups. ~Michele thats probably cos she hit reply to one of those messages that was crossposted to all and sundry… its not her fault. m — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Benzodiazepines cause cognitive decline and depression. All of them?  Gasp — I have to take clonazepam for bipolar disorder, and some kids have to take 10 times my dose for epilepsy.  Are you sure? Squiggles Cognitive Impairment and Long-Term Damage The many papers published in the 1960s and early to mid 1970s on this subject were largely single dose therapeutic dose studies or low-dose studies for periods of a few weeks. They showed a range of deficits in cognitive function, psychomotor performance and short-term memory problems with no development of tolerance. It was not until the late 1970s and early 1980s (when therapeutic dose dependency was belatedly accepted), that cognitive function and other tests on long-term benzodiazepine users (up to 10 years) were studied both during use and in acute withdrawals. From the mid 1980s to mid 1990s there was an increasing number of studies looking at damage after long-term use and at follow-up periods after discontinuation of up to six years. Several of these studies involve CT scans of the brain looking for structural changes. Summary Benzodiazepines produce impairment of cognitive functioning and psychomotor performance e.g. reaction time, vigilance, arousal, judgement, reasoning, speed and accuracy of information processing, visual spatial ability, co-ordination, short-term and post drug long-term memory, ‘blackouts’ and learned tasks. These effects are independent of abuse, dependency, non-dependency, normal, healthy, young or old subjects. Impairment increases with chronic use. Development of tolerance to these effects is very slow. CT brain scans show a difference in ventricular cerebral spinal fluid space dimensions between benzodiazepine users and non-users, and also between high and low benzodiazepine users. The functional brain damage causes increased morbidity, increased mortality and social deterioration. Subjects are generally not aware of their reduced capacity or the fact that they are not functioning well in every day life. In general much of the impairment is slowly reversible. Some aspects show improvement after six years, some are semi-permanent or permanent. http://www.benzo.org.uk/vot4.htm

Right, Am I speaking with Ray or Rand or possible David Woolfe’s ghost? Squiggles

Response:

I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

hey, dont worry…. what system are you using? if you’re on Outlook or Outlook Express, you should have a button at the top marked New Message… hit that instead of hitting reply…. its the same in netscape (which is what im using )…. m — ~~~~~<:~~~~~ iriXx "sometimes i get overcharged…   that’s when you see sparks   you ask me where the hell i’m going   at a thousand feet per second…" radiohead: the tourist

Response:

I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

You just title it and post it usnig new message.I have a AC and have the option of posting to the ngs. — LyndaNP Reality isn’t the way you wish things to be, nor the way they appear to be, but the way they actually are. – Robert J. Ringer

Response:

Dawn I was wondering exactly who you are posting to. Cause right now you are posting to 5 different groups. ~Michele

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

Response:

You have done it!

Depends on how the newsreader threads it. In Netscape this shows up with the new subject line but still under the old thread, so I don’t see the new subject line unless I open the old thread for it. Fiona — If we had no winter, the spring would not be so pleasant: if we did not sometimes taste the adversity, prosperity would not be so welcome.      – Anne Bradstreet, Meditations Divine and Moral, 1664

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sorry dude, I tend to agree on the side effects of Xanax..I actually was on Xanax for almost 3 yrs, AND (forgive me) was working as a P.medic at the same time…I was a walking zombie and my partners had to cover my azz more than once cuz I was falling asleep everywhere..I couldnt think straight…I couldnt DRIVE at all, and put my car in the ditch at least once…I was trying to attend college but my grades dropped like a bomb..I felt like I was in another world (I was taking this for panic attacks)…then finally, one day, I was getting into the ambulance and fell out the back door while closing it…that was enuff..withdrawal was HEAVENLY..*I love to puke, since IM also bulimic so this was right up my alley…sigghh…the dry heaves was an added bonus since I also like to punish myself..the headaches werent so cool thooo…any other questions about this lovely wonder drug?  Paxil: I just took this one 2 yrs ago for depression..was on it for about 9 mos….It made me nauseous and my stomach hurt all the time..I had headaches and felt like I had a cold all the time (stuffy head feeling)..withdrawal was not as bad as with some others, but there still was the nauseau/vomiting thing etc..so it felt just like I was still taking it till it was out of my system…blah…~Ima

The worst thing about it, in my experience is the panic attacks that arose from reaching tolerance level.  After many years, maybe 7 or 10, I started getting severe panic attacks every day; it was a nightmare.  I got out of it myself by searching the net and suspecting that indeed this was addiction.  But my doctor did not know this I don’t think — I was helped and contratulated to get off altogether.  I believe that the longer term benzos are different in this respect – perhaps requiring much longer time to reach tolerance or habituation of the nervous system. I no longer have panic attacks – they destroyed my life and my career during my 30s and 40s – I’m wondering what’s next with the rest of my meds. Squiggles

Response:

the only thing that helped me was the book traveling light.I recommend it to anyone.its by Max Lucado.

Response:

the only thing that helped me was the book traveling light.I recommend it to anyone.its by Max Lucado.

Dawn, No offense but just because the medical establishment hasn’t got it right on psychopharmacology, doesn’t mean that Christianity does.  If it helped you that’s good, but spirituality is one thing and medicine another. Squiggles

Response:

Squiggles, I was not telling anyone that they had to go off their medication,I was just letting everyone know that I like that book and I want everyone to know that it was good.it had nothing to do with medication,because no matter how much I believe in god as my savior,I will always be mentally ill.I am sorry if you thought I was attacking you in anyway.

Response:

I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

Response:

I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

You should have a "post new message" or "new message" command around somewhere, use that instead of replying to someone else’s post. If you reply it will appear linked to the post to which you replied, even if you change the subject line. Can’t be more specific without knowing what program you’re using. Fiona — If we had no winter, the spring would not be so pleasant: if we did not sometimes taste the adversity, prosperity would not be so welcome.      – Anne Bradstreet, Meditations Divine and Moral, 1664

Response:

"Dawn" wrote I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

Do you have a "New Post" button? Oh, I see Fiona has already enswered this. Well, good luck, Dawn. Hugs, TK

Response:

Squiggles, I was not telling anyone that they had to go off their medication,I was just letting everyone know that I like that book and I want everyone to know that it was good.it had nothing to do with medication,because no matter how much I believe in god as my savior,I will always be mentally ill.I am sorry if you thought I was attacking you in anyway.

OK – sorry, I suppose I have become hypervigilant to propaganda on the net.  I apologize. Squiggles

Response:

Benzodiazepines cause cognitive decline and depression.

All of them?  Gasp — I have to take clonazepam for bipolar disorder, and some kids have to take 10 times my dose for epilepsy.  Are you sure? Squiggles

Response:

You have done it! Victoria – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Organization: Road Runner Newsgroups: alt.support.depression.manic,alt.support.personality,alt.support.depression .me dication I want to know how to make or create a message so it doesn’t appear under someone else’s topic?that’s why squiggles got angry.

Response:

    I have the impression that convulsions cause brain damage too. Goblin

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Benzodiazepines cause cognitive decline and depression. All of them?  Gasp — I have to take clonazepam for bipolar disorder, and some kids have to take 10 times my dose for epilepsy.  Are you sure? Squiggles Cognitive Impairment and Long-Term Damage The many papers published in the 1960s and early to mid 1970s on this subject were largely single dose therapeutic dose studies or low-dose studies for periods of a few weeks. They showed a range of deficits in cognitive function, psychomotor performance and short-term memory problems with no development of tolerance. It was not until the late 1970s and early 1980s (when therapeutic dose dependency was belatedly accepted), that cognitive function and other tests on long-term benzodiazepine users (up to 10 years) were studied both during use and in acute withdrawals. From the mid 1980s to mid 1990s there was an increasing number of studies looking at damage after long-term use and at follow-up periods after discontinuation of up to six years. Several of these studies involve CT scans of the brain looking for structural changes. Summary Benzodiazepines produce impairment of cognitive functioning and psychomotor performance e.g. reaction time, vigilance, arousal, judgement, reasoning, speed and accuracy of information processing, visual spatial ability, co-ordination, short-term and post drug long-term memory, ‘blackouts’ and learned tasks. These effects are independent of abuse, dependency, non-dependency, normal, healthy, young or old subjects. Impairment increases with chronic use. Development of tolerance to these effects is very slow. CT brain scans show a difference in ventricular cerebral spinal fluid space dimensions between benzodiazepine users and non-users, and also between high and low benzodiazepine users. The functional brain damage causes increased morbidity, increased mortality and social deterioration. Subjects are generally not aware of their reduced capacity or the fact that they are not functioning well in every day life. In general much of the impairment is slowly reversible. Some aspects show improvement after six years, some are semi-permanent or permanent. http://www.benzo.org.uk/vot4.htm

Response:

Sorry dude, I tend to agree on the side effects of Xanax..I actually was on Xanax for almost 3 yrs, AND (forgive me) was working as a P.medic at the same time…I was a walking zombie and my partners had to cover my azz more than once cuz I was falling asleep everywhere..I couldnt think straight…I couldnt DRIVE at all, and put my car in the ditch at least once…I was trying to attend college but my grades dropped like a bomb..I felt like I was in another world (I was taking this for panic attacks)…then finally, one day, I was getting into the ambulance and fell out the back door while closing it…that was enuff..withdrawal was HEAVENLY..*I love to puke, since IM also bulimic so this was right up my alley…sigghh…the dry heaves was an added bonus since I also like to punish myself..the headaches werent so cool thooo…any other questions about this lovely wonder drug?  Paxil: I just took this one 2 yrs ago for depression..was on it for about 9 mos….It made me nauseous and my stomach hurt all the time..I had headaches and felt like I had a cold all the time (stuffy head feeling)..withdrawal was not as bad as with some others, but there still was the nauseau/vomiting thing etc..so it felt just like I was still taking it till it was out of my system…blah…~Ima – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – People with biplar disorder should not take Paxil or any other anti depressant long term. I am sick and tired about all these posts trying to scare people away from trying xanax.  As someone who has suffered from bipolar disorder(type 2) for 15 years, tried all the antidepressants, now on a cocktail of meds, including xanax and paxil, my experience is that PAXIL has many more adverse effects versus the marginal benefit of some anxiety relief.  I took Paxil for 5 months and was not taking any xanax, and I got some anticapation anxiety relief at the cost of NO LIBIDO, sleeping 12 hours a day, having no motivation, just didn’t give a shit, already gained 10 pounds in 5 months with the carbo craving…..And people want to talk about xanax dependency and problems with withdrawl.  I am not trying to minimize people’s experience or their pain, but with anxiety or other mental health issues, the word is YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY(YMMY).  I am a college graduate in electrical engineering from a top 5 engineering college, and now have not worked for over two years mostly because of anxiety and some depression yearly.  After working for 11 years struggling with depression and anxiety, I now have a hard time stepping outside my home.  I have considered suicide 1000’s of times over the last 15 years, actually researched and made the plans and was about to end it, and then I started on the Paxil…….Yeah, my suicidal obsessions went away, but now I was content to veg out all day watching TY or on the Net, my desire to GET A JOB disappeared.  Go research web sites and you will see how many people have problems with SSRI’s, yeah they are alive and taking that $3 pill two times a day or many $3 pills for me, but now I am NUMB and just there.  Prior to Paxil I use to be a emotional person, felt the pain of others and would cry when touched by something, but now I am a Paxil-zombie, yeah some anxiety relief but a LOT OF ME is also gone.  So all those xanax phobics, please allow people to fail with their options without scaring them.  What are people’s choices when it comes to anxiety or panic, yes paxil, yes benzo’s, yes MAIO’s, yes CBT(Cognitive Behavior Therapy).  My experience is PAXIL SUCKS and THE WITHDRAWAL IS HORRIBLE BASED ON MUCH FEEDBACK I HAVE READ ON THE NET, MAIO’S like parnate have some studies that back them up but the food restrictions are VERY DIFFICULT(no cheese, wine, beer, chocolate, many OTC meds, etc.), CBT might work for some but the feedback I have heard is that CBT plus meds work the best and I HAVE DONE THE THERAPY ROUTE and it was a waste of money. As one doctor told me, people who suffer from PANIC and think they are dieing have never been told that "your not going to die, it is all in your head"…Well that was my last session with him.  Just to repeat, this is MY EXPERIENCE and YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY.  Now I could continue to HIBERNATE IN MY HOUSE, NOT WORK, RUN OUT OF MONEY AND THEN BE HOMELESS…..Or I can be proactive and continue to experiment and try to find some solution that will allow me to work and have a life.  I have taken xanax in the past, just started it one month ago, still taking a low dose of paxil, and I am MUCH MUCH BETTER at dealing with day to day life, interacting with people, giving my shit done, etc. Yeah, maybe I will be taking xanax for the rest of my life but the only side effect I have had is some sleepiness.  And to those who talk about TOLERANCE BUILDUP, that is a CROCK, yes you might have to increase your xanax from .25mg 3 times a day to .50mg 3 times a day, there are people who have taken xanax for 5 to 15 years and most leveled out after 1 year at a dose and have no desire to increase. People need to do some research and FIND OUT THE REAL TRUTH, not what BIG PHARMA and BIG BUSINESS OWNED MEDIA OUTLETS want us to believe. Not to be cynical, but $3 no generic available paxil is much better for DRUG COMPANIES, then CHEAP GENERIC XANAX which might be more effective with less side-effects.  Why are benzo’s so hard to get, cause drug lobbiest have access to CONGRESS and made sure that THE NO-PROFIT SOLUTIONS(IE LIKE BENZO’S) are not readily available. Linda Channell, (740) 548-6874, 88 Ravine Rd, Powell, OH 43065 Let me make THE NEWCOMERS TO MENTAL ILLNESS aware that HYPE ABOUT THE LATEST ANTIDEPRESSANT HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT WILL BE MADE ON THE DRUG, and the only time you will hear about THE NEGATIVES about that drug will be when it comes off-patent. Now that we have generic prozac, we will hear more about side effects like NO LIBIDO, WEIGHT GAIN, SUICIDE, AND OTHER  EFEECTS.  Of course, as long as Paxil and Zoloft have no generics, MEDIA HYPE will be still muted, but give it time.  Just as all the SSRI’s go generic, we will hear about ALL THE NEGATIVES and out will come the new batch of 8 TO 12 WEEK STUDIED ANTIDEPRESSANTS to start the new profit cycle.  People with mental illness are just pawns, half ass useless meds are approved based on 8 week studies, NO REASON FOR A LONG TERM STUDY, we really don’t want to KNOW THE TRUTH, and as soon as the generics start rolling out, OUT COMES THE DIRTY LAUNDRY, not to HELP US, NO, ONLY SO THAT WE GO ON THE LATEST $5 PILL THAT HAS A 80% SUCCESS RATE AND EVEN LESS SIDE EFFECTS.  Hell as long as everyone is making money, who cares about THE CRAZIES that take the product, we just need them alive and taking their meds.  Now I forget, was I taking about the cigarette industry or drug companies, HELL WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE.  This of course is just the opinion of a mentally ill patient with 15 years of experience popping pills, all of which have a 70% effective rate, but I guess I am the exception, "ALIVE" AND NOT SUICIDAL, AND NOT HAPPY ABOUT IT. White Knight

Response:

Question:

My left ear has been ringing off and on for the last couple of weeks.  There also seems to be pressure and slight pain around my ear.  I’ve had a sinus infection in the past on my left side that caused my jaw to hurt.  Is it possible that the ringing in my ear is caused by a sinus infection?  I’ve read up on Tinnitus and I am very worried about what I’ve read.  The folks who have gotten it still have it and there is no cure.  I have an appt. with an ENT in 10 days but am concerned that a sinus infection may cause permanent damage if not treated immediately.  Anyone have any experience with ear problems related to a sinus infection?

Response:

Yes- I have it. I thought I was the only one. On certain days, my ears ring off the hook and make me crazier than I already am. I find that if I take a hot shower, it relieves it somewhat. I keep trying to tell the doctors that I can "hear" all the fluid in my head but they just ignore me.

Response:

Andy, in my case, the ringing in my left ear is directly related to my sinus condition, also on the left side. On "good" sinus days, the ringing is low, on "bad" sinus days (heavy pressure and headaches) the ringing is very loud.  If you’ve had a recent sinus infection, do research to find out how you can return them to a healthy state.  Sinus problems are complicated and it seems  they’re very unique to each of us so the same cure is not the same for everyone. Good luck Brad

Response:

yes…i hear what your saying..i have been getting this horrible pain and ringing in my right ear for days now.. it comes and goes.. most of the probs with the ear canal is post nasal drip… i also get the numbing of the neck and stiff neck from it.. any one else out there get a stiff neck and numbing of the neck area off and on?.. but yeah man i hear you on the ear thing..no doubt about it..                Nate   (jersey)

Response:

when you "hear the fluid in your head, does it sound like a "squeaking" type sound or like someone is rubbing something in your ears.. almost like the sound of someone rubbing a balloon? it may sound crazy but thats what i experience…                please let me know a.s.a.p…!!!                nate  (jersey)

Response:

The noise I hear is a high pitched hiss

Response:

In article <s4fngl8tgs…@corp.supernews.com

,

  "Andy Alshouse" <aalsho…@opticalsolutions.com

wrote: My left ear has been ringing off and on for the last couple of

weeks.  There

also seems to be pressure and slight pain around my ear.  I’ve had a

sinus

infection in the past on my left side that caused my jaw to hurt.  Is

it

possible that the ringing in my ear is caused by a sinus infection?

I’ve

read up on Tinnitus and I am very worried about what I’ve read.  The

folks

who have gotten it still have it and there is no cure.  I have an

ay cause

permanent damage if not treated immediately.  Anyone have any

I am just getting over a bad sinus infection with ear infection and I also have the hissing noise in the ears now.  I don’t think it will ever go away it is something one will have to live with.  I bought a nature sounds machine and listen to that to cover the noise works well.  There is no cure for tinnitus, my husband has it too.  Just another thing to live with.  Luc…@aol.com

with ear problems related to a sinus infection?

— Re:  Serevent and Flovent.  My biggest problem is not being permitted to Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

Response:

Question:

After reading your post on the allergy group a while back I tried adding a couple ml of hydrogen peroxide to a half bottle of Ocean salt water spray. This worked fine and seemed to really help. However after I ran out of this bottle and mixed up a batch myself, I either added too much hydrogen peroxide or my sinus infection was already well established as the second bottle seemed to irritate my already inflamed sinuses. I’ll try again with a weaker formulation after my sinuses heal. Thanks for the suggestions. — "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"   Thomas Jefferson "CanDo" <rasm1…@bellsouth.net

wrote in message

news:rcwic.2918$7a5.2178@bignews6.bellsouth.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

After suffering with multiple sinus infections, year after year, for decades, I experimented with flooding my sinuses with a mixture of diluted 3% hydrogen peroxide, baking soda and kosher salt. I kept my forehead down for quite a while, hoping that the anti-infective mixture could get to the infected area(s) within my sinuses and nasal passages.  . It worked! I have been sinus infection free for about 30 months.  . I have fully documented my experience and how I did it at Healthboards.com. There are posts over there by people who have tried my "upside down sinus flooding", and by who don’t think that it is a good idea. I have no connection at all with Healthboards. I consider it to be the best facility for discussing  health problems on the Internet.  . To find out more, select one of the following links:  . Here is the link to a discussion about the "Upside Down Sinus Flooding": . http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=129210  . Here is the link to the detailed documentation of the "Upside Down Sinus Flooding" and also some discussion:  . http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=139765

Response:

NorthShoreCEO wrote:

What is the long term effect of hydrogen peroxide on tissue?  Does anyone know?

If you believe that the decomposition of h2o2 produces free radicals and you believe that free radicals can cause cancer then you may be inclined to believe that cancer could be a long term effect. I certainly wouldn’t take a chance being so close to the brain.

Response:

"knob" <h…@dontemailme.com

wrote in message

news:Ouajc.10$Q5.7@fe39.usenetserver.com…

NorthShoreCEO wrote: What is the long term effect of hydrogen peroxide on tissue?  Does anyone know? If you believe that the decomposition of h2o2 produces free radicals and you believe that free radicals can cause cancer then you may be inclined to believe that cancer could be a long term effect. I certainly wouldn’t take a chance being so close to the brain.

3% Hydrogen Peroxide has been used for decades by millions of people, for cuts and for gargling, to prevent infection and to help remove mucus and phlegm. It is readily available at most super markets, discount stores, retail stores, etc. There are no health warnings on the bottles. If you feel that it is a cancer risk, you should get in touch with the proper authorities and warn them.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -CanDo wrote:

"knob" <h…@dontemailme.com wrote in message news:Ouajc.10$Q5.7@fe39.usenetserver.com… NorthShoreCEO wrote: What is the long term effect of hydrogen peroxide on tissue?  Does anyone know? If you believe that the decomposition of h2o2 produces free radicals and you believe that free radicals can cause cancer then you may be inclined to believe that cancer could be a long term effect. I certainly wouldn’t take a chance being so close to the brain. 3% Hydrogen Peroxide has been used for decades by millions of people, for cuts and for gargling, to prevent infection and to help remove mucus and phlegm. It is readily available at most super markets, discount stores, retail stores, etc. There are no health warnings on the bottles. If you feel that it is a cancer risk, you should get in touch with the proper authorities and warn them.

I didn’t say hydrogen peroxide was a cancer risk.

Response:

"CanDo" <rasm1…@bellsouth.net

wrote in message

news:pE9jc.9861$oN1.256@bignews5.bellsouth.net…

I know that you are looking for more scientific feedback, or feedback from the medical community, but I figured I’d offer my personal experience.

Thanks for sharing your experience.  Yes, I was looking for more scientific feedback, but also for use on longer term use than 30 months.  With all the research I do, I’ve not been able to find anything substantive.

Response:

Hydrogen peroxide can’t be too awfully toxic. I used to got to an alt. med MD who also did IV chelation therapy and I saw many patients in his office do large IV drips of hydrogen peroxide solution and this wasn’t the 3% variety. I think they were doing the IVs to protect their heart. I can’t remember the specific rational because it’s been 10 years or so. I’m sure a Google search would tell you whatever their theory was behind ingesting hydrogen peroxide. I remember some of the patients also drank hydrogen peroxide. — "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"   Thomas Jefferson "NorthShoreCEO" <NorthShore…@aol.com

wrote in message

news:Mp7jc.39999$w96.2823833@attbi_s54… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

What is the long term effect of hydrogen peroxide on tissue?  Does anyone know?

Response:

Before western culture learned of it, 3,000 years ago the Yoga did rapid in and out sniffing of saline. They did it very rapidly at a low pressure. Which, essentially is what the Hydro Pulse does . This rapid in and out did stimulate cilia and did remove dust and pollen. Try to teach this today ! good luck. Most patients this gentle low pressure means about 70 PSI which will damage the nose. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com

Response:

"Steven Litvintchouk" <sdlit…@earthlinkNOSPAM.net

wrote in message

news:pvwic.8554$gH6.6757@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net…

spam2death wrote: I’m currently on my second round of antibiotics in this years edition of my never ending battle against chronic sinus infections. I’m sorry to hear that.  I hope that throwing more and more antibiotics at the problem isn’t the only thing your doctors are doing for you.  The most important thing your doctors should be doine for you, is trying to figure out why you keep getting recurrent sinus infections in the first place.

I’ve had horrible allergies my entire life. I currently treat them with Flonase, Astelin, Nasal Crom, Singulair and whatever else is necessary. I’ve also taken desensitization shots several times and taken enough allergy pills to fill a 55 gallon drum. Once any of my sinuses or eustachen tubes clogs securely, an infection won’t be far behind.  I don’t even remember large portions of junior high because I was so zoned out on various allergy pills or sick with repeated sinus infections. My problem with sinus infections is that I probably wait much too long before beginning antibiotics and the infections are usually well advanced. Augmentin made me have diarreha so I was only on it two days. I’m taking Tequin now. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

What did people do for chronic severe sinus infections prior to the availability

of

antibiotics? IIRC:  nasal irrigation and surgery.  Pretty much what they do now! The first diagnoses of chronic maxillary sinus infections were first made around the 17th century.  And over time, better and better surgical procedures were devised.  (The Caldwell-Luc surgical procedure, for many years the state-of-the-art in sinus surgery, was invented in the late 19th century.) In the 18th century, doctors realized that some sinus infections were caused by dental abscesses and could be helped by extractions of the upper molars.  Nasal irrigation was employed for the first time in the 18th century too. I remember seeing a couple of pictures of the elaborate mechanical apparatuses they used for nasal irrigation, before the invention of electric irrigators.  One of them was a big tank that was fastened high on the wall, way above your head.  You put the hose into your nose, turned the crank, and gravity and siphoning pulled the water down into your nose and thru your nasopharynx. — Steven L.

I use saline nasal spray 4-6 times a day. It seems to help. Having nasal surgery scares the poop out of me as a friend went into the local hospital as an outpatient to clear a minor nasal blockage and immediately came down with incurable MRSA and also strep in his sinuses. He had to have repeated major surgeries to try and cure the infection. The infections and related pain eventually cost him his job and career. I’d probably have to be fighting a malignancy before I’d risk surgery, but if I further lost my ability to breathe, I might change my mind. Thanks for the medical history lessons and suggestions.   spam2death

Response:

spam2death wrote:

I’ve had horrible allergies my entire life. I currently treat them with Flonase, Astelin, Nasal Crom, Singulair and whatever else is necessary. I’ve also taken desensitization shots several times and taken enough allergy pills to fill a 55 gallon drum. Once any of my sinuses or eustachen tubes clogs securely, an infection won’t be far behind.  I don’t even remember large portions of junior high because I was so zoned out on various allergy pills or sick with repeated sinus infections. My problem with sinus infections is that I probably wait much too long before beginning antibiotics and the infections are usually well advanced. Augmentin made me have diarreha so I was only on it two days. I’m taking Tequin now.

Have you seen an ENT?  If so, what did he say?

I use saline nasal spray 4-6 times a day. It seems to help.

You might find that irrigation works better than spray. I use the Grossan irrigator religiously.  It works better for me than any nasal spray.

Having nasal surgery scares the poop out of me as a friend went into the local hospital as an outpatient to clear a minor nasal blockage and immediately came down with incurable MRSA and also strep in his sinuses.

Hmm, this is a new one for me. What the heck is "incurable MRSA?" Was this one of those brand-new strains of MRSA that’s even resistant to vancomycin? Not all hospitals are as careless as the one you describe.  Many of us have had sinus surgery and we didn’t get MRSA.  But we didn’t go to just any surgeon and just any hospital.  We chose carefully. — Steven L.

Response:

"NorthShoreCEO" wrote: "What is the long term effect of hydrogen peroxide on

tissue?  Does anyone know?" <================================

I’ve flooding my sinuses with a mixture of Hydrogen peroxide, baking soda and kosher salt for about 30 months, an average of less than twice a month. Total flooding time averages about 15 minutes. After decades of sinus misery, my sinuses have never been better. I’ve also use electro-acupuncture to treat my sinuses, and watch my diet, and I have made changes to my environment, so I can’t attribute my good sinus health to just the flooding. So far, I have not had any bad effects from the contact of the peroxide with my sinuses. I know that you are looking for more scientific feedback, or feedback from the medical community, but I figured I’d offer my personal experience. ===

"Hydrogen peroxide is water with extra oxygen attached. The formula for

water is H2O, and for hydrogen peroxide is H2O2. Another name for hydrogen peroxide would be hydrogen dioxide." <===

Response:

What is the long term effect of hydrogen peroxide on tissue?  Does anyone know?

Response:

"spam2death" wrote: After reading your post on the allergy group a while

back I tried adding a couple ml of hydrogen peroxide to a half bottle of Ocean salt water spray. This worked fine and seemed to really help. However after I ran out of this bottle and mixed up a batch myself, I either added too much hydrogen peroxide or my sinus infection was already well established as the second bottle seemed to irritate my already inflamed sinuses. I’ll try again with a weaker formulation after my sinuses heal.  Thanks for the suggestions." << <=============================

When I’ve used too much peroxide, it has caused my sinuses to swell shut for about three straight days. I am careful not to use more than one part peroxide to 10 parts water. Even that much used to sting my sinuses, but not any more. If the powerful anti-infective mixture of peroxide, baking soda and kosher salt can get to the source of infection, or infected material, then it can fight the infection and help to prevent recurring infections. If it can’t get to the source of the infection, then the benefits are limited. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

— "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"   Thomas Jefferson "CanDo" <rasm1…@bellsouth.net wrote in message news:rcwic.2918$7a5.2178@bignews6.bellsouth.net… After suffering with multiple sinus infections, year after year, for decades, I experimented with flooding my sinuses with a mixture of

diluted

3% hydrogen peroxide, baking soda and kosher salt. I kept my forehead

down

for quite a while, hoping that the anti-infective mixture could get to

the

infected area(s) within my sinuses and nasal passages.  . It worked! I have been sinus infection free for about 30 months.  . I have fully documented my experience and how I did it at

Healthboards.com.

There are posts over there by people who have tried my "upside down

sinus

flooding", and by who don’t think that it is a good idea. I have no connection at all with Healthboards. I consider it to be the best

facility

for discussing  health problems on the Internet.  . To find out more, select one of the following links:  . Here is the link to a discussion about the "Upside Down Sinus Flooding": . http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=129210  . Here is the link to the detailed documentation of the "Upside Down Sinus Flooding" and also some discussion:  . http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=139765

Response:

I’m currently on my second round of antibiotics in this years edition of my never ending battle against chronic sinus infections. What did people do for chronic severe sinus infections prior to the availability of antibiotics? Anyone have a brief explanation of archaic treatments used for sinus infections used in the years before antibiotics? Any medical historians in the group? thanks,    congested to death but still curious — "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"   Thomas Jefferson

Response:

After suffering with multiple sinus infections, year after year, for decades, I experimented with flooding my sinuses with a mixture of diluted 3% hydrogen peroxide, baking soda and kosher salt. I kept my forehead down for quite a while, hoping that the anti-infective mixture could get to the infected area(s) within my sinuses and nasal passages.  . It worked! I have been sinus infection free for about 30 months.  . I have fully documented my experience and how I did it at Healthboards.com. There are posts over there by people who have tried my "upside down sinus flooding", and by who don’t think that it is a good idea. I have no connection at all with Healthboards. I consider it to be the best facility for discussing  health problems on the Internet.  . To find out more, select one of the following links:  . Here is the link to a discussion about the "Upside Down Sinus Flooding": . http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=129210  . Here is the link to the detailed documentation of the "Upside Down Sinus Flooding" and also some discussion:  . http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=139765

Response:

spam2death wrote:

I’m currently on my second round of antibiotics in this years edition of my never ending battle against chronic sinus infections.

I’m sorry to hear that.  I hope that throwing more and more antibiotics at the problem isn’t the only thing your doctors are doing for you.  The most important thing your doctors should be doine for you, is trying to figure out why you keep getting recurrent sinus infections in the first place.

What did people do for chronic severe sinus infections prior to the availability of antibiotics?

IIRC:  nasal irrigation and surgery.  Pretty much what they do now! The first diagnoses of chronic maxillary sinus infections were first made around the 17th century.  And over time, better and better surgical procedures were devised.  (The Caldwell-Luc surgical procedure, for many years the state-of-the-art in sinus surgery, was invented in the late 19th century.) In the 18th century, doctors realized that some sinus infections were caused by dental abscesses and could be helped by extractions of the upper molars.  Nasal irrigation was employed for the first time in the 18th century too. I remember seeing a couple of pictures of the elaborate mechanical apparatuses they used for nasal irrigation, before the invention of electric irrigators.  One of them was a big tank that was fastened high on the wall, way above your head.  You put the hose into your nose, turned the crank, and gravity and siphoning pulled the water down into your nose and thru your nasopharynx. — Steven L.

Response:

Question:

Hi all!  Just came from Dr, now we have 2 inhalers (Flovent and Albuterol) plus ventolin to add to the albuterol nebulizer.  We also have the Steroids (Predinisone) for 5 days and another allergy medicine to try (Claritin didn’t help)…..     Thanks everyone who posted and emailed me, we have an action plan now and the Doctor talked to me for a long time today about what to look for – in order to know to take her to the ER, signs like some of the ones mentioned…     Finding the trigger I’m thinking will be next to impossible since she only gets it 2x per year, we are thinking it’s pollen or something seasonal.  I tried to respond via dejanews about the environment suggestions, it’s not showing up here now but anyway, the possibility of eliminating dust mold etc are pretty remote, if it’s the house, carpet, furniture…. Thanks again all, Kathleen | Hi Steve and Kathleen, | | I have a daughter 6 1/2 years of age and a son 4 years of age. Both have | had asthma since they were 3 months old. | | I have two nebulizers at home and I give the kids ventolin when they are | coughing.  They also have taken preventative medication Intal (didn’t work) | and Pulmicort.  They are now on 2 other preventative treatments Flixatide | (which is like Pulmicort) and Serevent (which is a preventative ventolin). | | I have them under the control of a pediatric respritory doctor who is | superb.  I can give my kids Ventolin every 1 – 2 hours.  My asthma plan is | they have 2 machines close together 1/2 hour apart.  Wait an 1hr give | another and wait an 1 hr and give another, if they don’t settle I take them | up to the hospital or start a 3 day course of prednisolone. | | Take a good close look at their chest.  If their chest is suken when you | lift their shirt then they need oxygen immediately. | | If she needs prednisolone, I feel she needs a preventative.  My children | have not been able to stop preventative medication for more than 3 months at | a time. | | Are you in Australia? | | LA

Response:

Barry is a salesman.  He sells air cleaners.

I am glad that you asked this question as it was the first thing I thought when I read the posting.

Response:

Hi ! First let me say that I can not help you but before you toss this you might be able to help me… I am a preschool teacher ( 4 and 5 year olds) and more of my students are being diagnosed with asthma.  One of my students was hospilatized theis weekend. ( he’s fine now but it got me thinking) I have taken courses in Health, Safety and Nutrition as well as CPR and First Aid and yet I too, do not know much about the early signs of a problem. I hope I would recognize a child in a severe condition and could respond accordingly but I’m not sure I could detect the early signs…. Can you help educate me? Can you share some information? Do you know of any helpful books or brochures. I would hate to think I could overlook sign until a distressful situation developed.   I probably won’t remember how I got to this board so can you respond in a

Response:

Tough call. If your child is mature enough to understand how to use a peak flow meter then I would get one. It is a little plastic device that they blow into as hard as they can. Asthmatics have a hard time getting air out of their lungs quickly. If there is an asthma attack it will show up on the peak flow. Have your child do three blows twice a day and record the results. Know what her best is. If she is 80-100% of her best, she is ok. If she is 60-80% of her best she is having some trouble, needs albuterol, but you don’t need to rush to the ER. Just see your doctor as quickly as possible. Under 60% then an ER visit is indicated. Remember, asthma is a desease of inflammation, not bronchoconstriction. Albuterol is a bronchodilator and steroids are antiinflammatories. Although you cannot overdose albuterol you may get to a point were it’s not effective anymore because you need that steroid. Also, is your child on a preventative medicine? I hope that helps. For more information on asthma you can check out my website at www.ibabydoc.com. No spam I just love being a pediatrician and helping children. Dr. Michael Bornstein, M.D. F.A.A.P. www.ibabydoc.com

Response:

My daughter has had asthma since she was around 2yo, just ‘officially’ diagnosed early this year.  We have a nebulizer at home and I have been instructed to use it when she starts coughing, with albuterol & saline solution.  About 2x a year it isn’t enough and she has had to take Pedipred/predinisone (spelling?) for 10 days and that has always cleared it up.     My question is, how do I know she needs to go to the hospital?

The Expert Panel Report 2 has a figure classifying severity of asthma exacerbations [Fig 3-9]. Some of the symptoms for a severe exacerbation are: Breathlessness–while at rest Talks in words, rather than phrases or sentences. Agitated Repiratory rate often 30/min Wheeze–usually loud; throughout inhale & exhale Pulse–120/min Peak flow <50% personal best [a 5 yr old should be             able to use a peak flow meter] Note: The presence of several parameters, but not necessarily all, indicates the general classification of the exacerbation.  Her appetite is better today than yesterday, she is wanting to get around today (yesterday she slept on and off all day) but I can feel the wheezing in her chest.  I have been giving her breathing treatments at least every three hours.     This started up Friday morning and I let her go to school, however the nebulizer does not seem to be helping, not more than for a couple hours anyway.  Is it possible to overdose on Albuterol??

Ask your doctor; albuterol is a fairly safe drug. Current asthma guidelines are to have an Action Plan to increase drugs when peak flow decreases or symptoms increase; typically a steroid inhaler is added or increased and albuterol used as needed, when peak flows drop below 80% personal best or symptoms increase. Such an Action Plan may help avoid the need to go on oral steroids like Pedipred or make a trip to ER. http://www.ama-assn.org/special/asthma/treatmnt/updates/patient.htm Patient Asthma Action Plans Ellis – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     We have had a great doctor since she was born, and will go see her tomorrow but it would be nice if I could converse with others who have dealt with this type of asthma…..   It never seems particularly severe to me but her doctor is always very concerned by the time I take her in.  I tend to worry about it a lot when she gets like this and fear the worst.. that I will under-react and it will be TOO LATE. Thanks, Kathleen

Response:

My daughter has had asthma since she was around 2yo, just ‘officially’ diagnosed early this year.  We have a nebulizer at home and I have been instructed to use it when she starts coughing, with albuterol & saline solution.  About 2x a year it isn’t enough and she has had to take Pedipred/predinisone (spelling?) for 10 days and that has always cleared it up.     My question is, how do I know she needs to go to the hospital?  Her appetite is better today than yesterday, she is wanting to get around today (yesterday she slept on and off all day) but I can feel the wheezing in her chest.  I have been giving her breathing treatments at least every three hours.     This started up Friday morning and I let her go to school, however the nebulizer does not seem to be helping, not more than for a couple hours anyway.  Is it possible to overdose on Albuterol??     We have had a great doctor since she was born, and will go see her tomorrow but it would be nice if I could converse with others who have dealt with this type of asthma…..   It never seems particularly severe to me but her doctor is always very concerned by the time I take her in.  I tend to worry about it a lot when she gets like this and fear the worst.. that I will under-react and it will be TOO LATE. Thanks, Kathleen I am not looking for treatment or medical gagets, just people who are familiar with this scenario — "If you think you are too small to be effective then you have never been in bed with a mosquito."

Response:

Barry here of http://www.aircleaners.com I know that your against medical devices, but if the drugs arent working then mabe its an environmental problem that products such as HEPA air cleaners, DustMite Proof mattress and pillow encasings Ect.. may help. Mabe your homes indoor environment needs to be cleaned up. Do you have any carpet that is less then two years old ? Have you had any roof leaks in the past? You could have a chemical outgassing problem or a mold problem in your home that could cause chronic health problems.Also have you had much pest control ? If you dont get rid of the triggers first, the drugs wont always do a good job.You need to look at the big picture for possible environmental problems.Both at home and at school. The drugs are just a part of it. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My daughter has had asthma since she was around 2yo, just ‘officially’ diagnosed early this year.  We have a nebulizer at home and I have been instructed to use it when she starts coughing, with albuterol & saline solution.  About 2x a year it isn’t enough and she has had to take Pedipred/predinisone (spelling?) for 10 days and that has always cleared it up.     My question is, how do I know she needs to go to the hospital?  Her appetite is better today than yesterday, she is wanting to get around today (yesterday she slept on and off all day) but I can feel the wheezing in her chest.  I have been giving her breathing treatments at least every three hours.     This started up Friday morning and I let her go to school, however the nebulizer does not seem to be helping, not more than for a couple hours anyway.  Is it possible to overdose on Albuterol??     We have had a great doctor since she was born, and will go see her tomorrow but it would be nice if I could converse with others who have dealt with this type of asthma…..   It never seems particularly severe to me but her doctor is always very concerned by the time I take her in.  I tend to worry about it a lot when she gets like this and fear the worst.. that I will under-react and it will be TOO LATE. Thanks, Kathleen I am not looking for treatment or medical gagets, just people who are familiar with this scenario — "If you think you are too small to be effective then you have never been in bed with a mosquito."

Response:

Barry here of http://www.aircleaners.com I know that your against medical devices, but if the drugs arent working then mabe its an environmental problem that products such as HEPA air cleaners, DustMite Proof mattress and pillow encasings Ect.. may help. Mabe your homes indoor environment needs to be cleaned up. Do you have any carpet that is less then two years old ? Have you had any roof leaks in the past? You could have a chemical outgassing problem or a mold problem in your home that could cause chronic health problems.Also have you had much pest control ? If you dont get rid of the triggers first, the drugs wont always do a good job.You need to look at the big picture for possible environmental problems.Both at home and at school. The drugs are just a part of it.

This in no way remotely addresses the questions she was answering. I don’t understand you people.

Response:

Barry here of http://www.aircleaners.com I know that your against medical devices, but if the drugs arent working then mabe its an environmental problem that products such as HEPA air cleaners, DustMite Proof mattress and pillow encasings Ect.. may help. Mabe your homes indoor environment needs to be cleaned up. Do you have any carpet that is less then two years old ? Have you had any roof leaks in the past? You could have a chemical outgassing problem or a mold problem in your home that could cause chronic health problems.Also have you had much pest control ? If you dont get rid of the triggers first, the drugs wont always do a good job.You need to look at the big picture for possible environmental problems.Both at home and at school.

That is assuming that there is an ‘environmental problem.’ Generally, in the case of asthma the problem will be allergy. Identifying the allergen in question is a must before you try to spend any money controlling things that usually are not causing problems. "Being responsible sometimes means pissing people off."    General Colin Powell

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Barry here of http://www.aircleaners.com I know that your against medical devices, but if the drugs arent working then mabe its an environmental problem that products such as HEPA air cleaners, DustMite Proof mattress and pillow encasings Ect.. may help. Mabe your homes indoor environment needs to be cleaned up. Do you have any carpet that is less then two years old ? Have you had any roof leaks in the past? You could have a chemical outgassing problem or a mold problem in your home that could cause chronic health problems.Also have you had much pest control ? If you dont get rid of the triggers first, the drugs wont always do a good job.You need to look at the big picture for possible environmental problems.Both at home and at school. The drugs are just a part of it. This in no way remotely addresses the questions she was answering. I don’t understand you people.

Barry is a salesman.  He sells air cleaners. PS  Barry, are you still selling Alpine products? "Being responsible sometimes means pissing people off."    General Colin Powell

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: : Barry here of http://www.aircleaners.com I know that your against medical : devices, but if the drugs arent working then mabe its an environmental : problem that products such as HEPA air cleaners, DustMite Proof mattress and : pillow encasings Ect.. may help. Mabe your homes indoor environment needs to : be cleaned up. Do you have any carpet that is less then two years old ? Have : you had any roof leaks in the past? You could have a chemical outgassing : problem or a mold problem in your home that could cause chronic health : problems.Also have you had much pest control ? If you dont get rid of the : triggers first, the drugs wont always do a good job.You need to look at the : big picture for possible environmental problems.Both at home and at school. : : That is assuming that there is an ‘environmental problem.’ : : Generally, in the case of asthma the problem will be allergy. : Identifying the allergen in question is a must before you try to spend : any money controlling things that usually are not causing problems. I do have asthma triggered by environmental problems and the air cleaners don’t help much if any. If you have an environmental trigger you get away from it or clean it up. At best a room sized air filter help me a very little bit. Cleaning the airconditioner ducts and sealing the leak between the cloths dryer and the return air and putting a decent filtering set helped a lot. The fabric softener in laundry products causes me problems if I get in in my lungs. I don’t use the crap on my cloths and we had changed for the one that caused me trouble but there was still enough in the  ducts to cause problems. I am not cured but I am a lot better. Before you spend money fixing problems find out what  triggers the asthma. An allergy test is a good start. Baring that some commons sense things that don’t cost anything are don’t run the vacuum while your child is in the house. Do it when she will be at school or a friends for a few hours. Make sure some fresh air gets in the house don’t live on recycled air. Wash the bed clothes in hot 150 degree water and dry them on high heat or dry them on a line in the sun shine. Both hard on dust mites. Keep the humidity between 30 and 50% if possible. Higher than this dust mites an molds are a problem lower than this air way irritation is a problem. Use ivory soap and avoid perfumed stuff for her in particular. They may or may not cause her a problem but they don’t help. Don’t use perfumed products when you can get a better cheaper plain product. Make your house smell clean by being clean not by deodorizers. Don’t use fabric softener on her clothes or bedding. It may not be a problem but it won’t help her asthma. One thing Barry is right on about is roof leaks and black slimy mold. If you have black slimy mold in the house you need to find out what it is and get rid of it. Some of them are very very bad news. They are also very rare. The seem to like to grow on the paper on sheet rock in the walls. Mildew is a lesser problem that should be dealt with by lowering the humidity until it is not much of a problem except at the corners of the bath tube and so on. Keeping molds out of carped bath rooms is hard to do. If you must have carpeted bathrooms make sure the shower curtain is tight and run the exhaust fan a lot and make sure the male members of the family have good aim. If you have animals move them outside or get rid of them. Don’t use a lot of Clorox or other cleaners that irritate the airways while she is in the house. Until you find the triggers or she grows enough that the asthma no longer causes attacks because the air ways get big enough the don’t close off you are running blind on trying to find relief by avoiding triggers. An allergist and pulmunolgist are your best bets for finding triggers and developing a plan to treat the asthma. Your daughter may be able to tell you what makes her feel bad. Sometimes they are right. — Gordon    W5RED

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Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Doews anyone sweat when medication is due? Not when medication is due but I’ve noticed since I’ve had my Prozac increased from 40 mg to 60 mg each morning that I start to get very hot and sweat starting around noon.  I also am having night sweats. Anyone else? Patti I have had the sweats when starting or changing ADs.  I feel warm at times for no apparent reason.  It goes away afterwhile. I’ve noticed it with Prozac, Effexor, Deseryl, Zoloft. My body temperature regulation is kind of messed up most of the time anyway.

Sweats have been a common issue with me and Effexor. Tracy Barber

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I have had the sweats when starting or changing ADs.  I feel warm at times for no apparent reason.  It goes away afterwhile. I’ve noticed it with Prozac, Effexor, Deseryl, Zoloft. My body temperature regulation is kind of messed up most of the time anyway.

Charles, Thanks for answering me, I appreciate it.  I tend to run warm anyway and did so before I started the Prozac.  The sweating is new to me, however. It’s odd because right after I posted the first message this morning I was feeling really, really cold.  :-) Patti

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Doews anyone sweat when medication is due? Not when medication is due but I’ve noticed since I’ve had my Prozac increased from 40 mg to 60 mg each morning that I start to get very hot and sweat starting around noon.  I also am having night sweats. Anyone else? Patti

I have had the sweats when starting or changing ADs.  I feel warm at times for no apparent reason.  It goes away afterwhile. I’ve noticed it with Prozac, Effexor, Deseryl, Zoloft. My body temperature regulation is kind of messed up most of the time anyway. _ – Charles – -does not play well with others

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Doews anyone sweat when medication is due?

Not when medication is due but I’ve noticed since I’ve had my Prozac increased from 40 mg to 60 mg each morning that I start to get very hot and sweat starting around noon.  I also am having night sweats. Anyone else? Patti

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Doews anyone sweat when medication is due?

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Question:

My doc put me on a beta blocker she seems to think it will help. Bringing my heart rate down some. Has anyone been on this and has it helped at all?

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Julie– I have mitral valve prolapse, and the first drug I was put on to control my symptoms (the most irritating being heart palipations and a racing heart) was a beta-blocker.   It did help but, since I have blood pressure in the normal to a-little-bit-low range, it ended up lowering my blood pressure to the point where I was feeling light-headed a lot.  For a while I counteracted that by eating salty foods, but eventually I went onto anti-anxiety meds (Xanax and Zoloft), which, for me, are actually more effective and have caused me far fewer side effects.  But, except for the blood pressure issue (mine went down to like 90/60 at one point, which will make you feel really, really faint), it wasn’t bad. Lori

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Hi, I took a beta blocker for several years for my anxiety – however it was started at the same time I officially started the anti-depressant I currently take.  It is difficult for me to determine how much each helped to control my symptoms.  I do know that  prior to the beta blocker I did experience a hard pounding heart beat when I would lay down at night, which was very anxiety provoking.  The beta blocker did ease that for me.  For myself, the beta blocker  was a part of a combination of meds to help manage my PD, not the only thing I was taking for it. Debbie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My doc put me on a beta blocker she seems to think it will help. Bringing my heart rate down some. Has anyone been on this and has it helped at all?

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My doc put me on a beta blocker she seems to think it will help. Bringing my heart rate down some. Has anyone been on this and has it helped at all?

I don

Question:

Hi Tom, I am a wine-maker and get a lot of pleasure from making and drinking my own wine. Most medications (as far as I have seen), tell you to avoid alcohol (there, that’s my disclaimer <G) but I truly do enjoy a good glass of red 3/4 times a week. Several times I have even had (gasp!) 2 glasses of wine, but I draw the line there. What I have found is that I have no tolerance for alcohol -I either feel very sleepy or get quite giddy. I have not felt any after-effects the next day. My doctor is fully aware of my hobby.

I think most doctors automatically tell you not to drink, or very little, whether you’re on medication or not.  But, for me too, when I’m on a benzo, alcohol has an increased effect, and a lot less of it goes a lot farther than I want.  A lot of us self-medicate with alcohol as it is a CNS depressant sort of like benzo’s with a much shorter half-life and more dangerous side-effects. Listen to your body and you can probably tell is you can handle a little alcohol with the drugs or not.  (Unless you are a substance abuser, that is.) Gordon Held

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That seems to be the case. Too bad meds ALL have to say this. I had to take an antibiotic once with the same warning – but there it DID matter. WOW! Talk about am upset stomach! Yikes! So… a beer or two is cool. A good glass of cabernet even better! Cheers… Tom – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Tom, I am a wine-maker and get a lot of pleasure from making and drinking my own wine. Most medications (as far as I have seen), tell you to avoid alcohol (there, that’s my disclaimer <G) but I truly do enjoy a good glass of red 3/4 times a week. Several times I have even had (gasp!) 2 glasses of wine, but I draw the line there. What I have found is that I have no tolerance for alcohol -I either feel very sleepy or get quite giddy. I have not felt any after-effects the next day. My doctor is fully aware of my hobby. The times that I do not drink at all are the periods when my anxiety is extremely high and I am either levelling up on a medication or trying a new one or if the depression is very bad. Then I wait for a few months until I feel "balanced" again. BTW, I take a TCA daily and an occasional benzo when needed. If you are concerned about damage to your body, you could have your doctor do a liver function test. Cheers! Charley So… I want to understand… Does taking Buspar or Xanax, etc. forever disallow you from enjoying a beer or two with friends -something that has REALLY lifted my spirits in the past. I’ve battled this question myself several times and usually have the beer or wine, not to excess. But I WOULD like to know if it is TRULY harmful, in this VERY moderate way? Doctors will, of course, say no alcohol. Pharmacy, same thing. I understand. They have to cover their ass and the combination probably is not good (chemically speaking) but alcohol never is good for you anyway. Addictive people should NEVER cross the two! To that I agree. But, once you take some of the "fairly" harmless fun out of your life, your anxiety can go though the roof! I KNOW! Exercise is great. I do it myself regularly when I can. BUT… giving up those few beers with my friends FOREVER seems harsh! I drank twice (half bottle of wine once and a few beers another time) while on Buspar (5 mg/twice day) and Xanax (1 mg 2-3 times a day). All I noticed is I had a good time, might have slept TOO well, and maybe a little more groggy getting up. So what! Took a shower and went back to my daily, fairly healthy grind! Probably a week or two later I may have done the same thing. I have a high tolerance to drugs (Found out the hard way after an appendectomy!). That’s just "my" body chemistry. Just curious if I’m crazy or not? Please no preachy non alcohol speeches. I’d just like to know what the REAL danger here is. Maybe we should all just go to http://www.beer.com and send each other a "virtual" beer! It’s really there! Someone else can start that tradition. Any takers? Tom …do not mix very well. i went a little nuts lastnight and drank a couple quarts of beer, felt fine til i woke up this morning, now i’m wondering if i have done long lasting damage to my body!!!!! uggggh. 15mg 2x a day and 3 quarts of pabst, you think i will live? needless to say i’m not doing that again. "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So… I want to understand… Does taking Buspar or Xanax, etc. forever disallow you from enjoying a beer or two with friends -something that has REALLY lifted my spirits in the past. I’ve battled this question myself several times and usually have the beer or wine, not to excess. But I WOULD like to know if it is TRULY harmful, in this VERY moderate way? Doctors will, of course, say no alcohol. Pharmacy, same thing. I understand. They have to cover their ass and the combination probably is not good (chemically speaking) but alcohol never is good for you anyway. Addictive people should NEVER cross the two! To that I agree. But, once you take some of the "fairly" harmless fun out of your life, your anxiety can go though the roof! I KNOW! Exercise is great. I do it myself regularly when I can. BUT… giving up those few beers with my friends FOREVER seems harsh! I drank twice (half bottle of wine once and a few beers another time) while on Buspar (5 mg/twice day) and Xanax (1 mg 2-3 times a day). All I noticed is I had a good time, might have slept TOO well, and maybe a little more groggy getting up. So what! Took a shower and went back to my daily, fairly healthy grind! Probably a week or two later I may have done the same thing. I have a high tolerance to drugs (Found out the hard way after an appendectomy!). That’s just "my" body chemistry. Just curious if I’m crazy or not? Please no preachy non alcohol speeches. I’d just like to know what the REAL danger here is. Tom

If you react well to it there should be no problem in moderate drinking, although it’s better not to do it on a daily basis. I often drink a few glasses of wine myself and have done so on 375 different meds and I’m still around with the ol’ liver still intact. *Moderation* is the keyword here though. Interaction with benzos: alcohol and benzos both are CNS depressants which means that they may enhance each other’s effects: in other words, you may get drunk sooner or be more sedated than others. Hangovers may consist of PA’s. I’m not familiar with the exact interaction with Buspar but I do know that except with MAOI’s, AD’s can be taken while drinking a few glasses of wine/beer. My pdoc doesn’t mind me drinking as he knows I’m not going to be a alcoholic. Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …do not mix very well. i went a little nuts lastnight and drank a couple quarts of beer, felt fine til i woke up this morning, now i’m wondering if i have done long lasting damage to my body!!!!! uggggh. 15mg 2x a day and 3 quarts of pabst, you think i will live? needless to say i’m not doing that again. "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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So… I want to understand… Does taking Buspar or Xanax, etc. forever disallow you from enjoying a beer or two with friends -something that has REALLY lifted my spirits in the past. I’ve battled this question myself several times and usually have the beer or wine, not to excess. But I WOULD like to know if it is TRULY harmful, in this VERY moderate way? Doctors will, of course, say no alcohol. Pharmacy, same thing. I understand. They have to cover their ass and the combination probably is not good (chemically speaking) but alcohol never is good for you anyway. Addictive people should NEVER cross the two! To that I agree. But, once you take some of the "fairly" harmless fun out of your life, your anxiety can go though the roof! I KNOW! Exercise is great. I do it myself regularly when I can. BUT… giving up those few beers with my friends FOREVER seems harsh! I drank twice (half bottle of wine once and a few beers another time) while on Buspar (5 mg/twice day) and Xanax (1 mg 2-3 times a day). All I noticed is I had a good time, might have slept TOO well, and maybe a little more groggy getting up. So what! Took a shower and went back to my daily, fairly healthy grind! Probably a week or two later I may have done the same thing. I have a high tolerance to drugs (Found out the hard way after an appendectomy!). That’s just "my" body chemistry. Just curious if I’m crazy or not? Please no preachy non alcohol speeches. I’d just like to know what the REAL danger here is. Maybe we should all just go to http://www.beer.com and send each other a "virtual" beer! It’s really there! Someone else can start that tradition. Any takers? Tom – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …do not mix very well. i went a little nuts lastnight and drank a couple quarts of beer, felt fine til i woke up this morning, now i’m wondering if i have done long lasting damage to my body!!!!! uggggh. 15mg 2x a day and 3 quarts of pabst, you think i will live? needless to say i’m not doing that again. "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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Well, I’ve tried this a couple of times (I am on Xanax and Zoloft), and all that ever seemed to happen is that I had a hangover seemingly no matter what – sometimes even from 1 beer!  Not kidding…That’s all it ever was like though…I’m not taking a ton of Xanax, though, so I don’t know… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So… I want to understand… Does taking Buspar or Xanax, etc. forever disallow you from enjoying a beer or two with friends -something that has REALLY lifted my spirits in the past. I’ve battled this question myself several times and usually have the beer or wine, not to excess. But I WOULD like to know if it is TRULY harmful, in this VERY moderate way? Doctors will, of course, say no alcohol. Pharmacy, same thing. I understand. They have to cover their ass and the combination probably is not good (chemically speaking) but alcohol never is good for you anyway. Addictive people should NEVER cross the two! To that I agree. But, once you take some of the "fairly" harmless fun out of your life, your anxiety can go though the roof! I KNOW! Exercise is great. I do it myself regularly when I can. BUT… giving up those few beers with my friends FOREVER seems harsh! I drank twice (half bottle of wine once and a few beers another time) while on Buspar (5 mg/twice day) and Xanax (1 mg 2-3 times a day). All I noticed is I had a good time, might have slept TOO well, and maybe a little more groggy getting up. So what! Took a shower and went back to my daily, fairly healthy grind! Probably a week or two later I may have done the same thing. I have a high tolerance to drugs (Found out the hard way after an appendectomy!). That’s just "my" body chemistry. Just curious if I’m crazy or not? Please no preachy non alcohol speeches. I’d just like to know what the REAL danger here is. Maybe we should all just go to http://www.beer.com and send each other a "virtual" beer! It’s really there! Someone else can start that tradition. Any takers? Tom …do not mix very well. i went a little nuts lastnight and drank a couple quarts of beer, felt fine til i woke up this morning, now i’m wondering if i have done long lasting damage to my body!!!!! uggggh. 15mg 2x a day and 3 quarts of pabst, you think i will live? needless to say i’m not doing that again. "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

– Charles Phipps

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…do not mix very well. i went a little nuts lastnight and drank a couple quarts of beer, felt fine til i woke up this morning, now i’m wondering if i have done long lasting damage to my body!!!!! uggggh. 15mg 2x a day and 3 quarts of pabst, you think i will live? needless to say i’m not doing that again. "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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I had a REAL BAD experience when I was a drinker and took Buspar.  The two do not mix together well at all.  I personally don’t approve of drinking while taking meds…end of story.  But for those who do I say this…..Buspar and alcohol ARE dangerous.  Be careful.  You have to stop and ask yourself is drinking more important or is my health more important. Yes….alcohol causes health problems.  I only wish the best for you. Xanman – Former Drunk, Junkie, Pill poppin’, Dope smokin’, Idiot! — A little insanity in an sane wolf. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …do not mix very well. i went a little nuts lastnight and drank a couple quarts of beer, felt fine til i woke up this morning, now i’m wondering if i have done long lasting damage to my body!!!!! uggggh. 15mg 2x a day and 3 quarts of pabst, you think i will live? needless to say i’m not doing that again. "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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well DAMN, boy! i think the three quarts of pabst would do you in the next morning even without the buspar! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -….do not mix very well. i went a little nuts lastnight and drank a couple quarts of beer, felt fine til i woke up this morning, now i’m wondering if i have done long lasting damage to my body!!!!! uggggh. 15mg 2x a day and 3 quarts of pabst, you think i will live? needless to say i’m not doing that again. "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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well DAMN, boy! i think the three quarts of pabst would do you in the next morning even without the buspar!

nah, i’m a professional drinker…… here’s my record for most alcohol consumed in an evening, it’s true i wrote it all down the next day, amazed myself even: 3 12oz cans of pabst 2 long island teas a martini 2 12 oz bottles of miller 1 screw driver 4 16 oz draft beers (unknown brand) 1 big margarita and a quart of pabst before bed and i didn’t even have a hangover, i was at work at 9 am on the dot.  i wouldn’t lie "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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…do not mix very well. i went a little nuts lastnight and drank a couple quarts of beer, felt fine til i woke up this morning, now i’m wondering if i have done long lasting damage to my body!!!!! uggggh. 15mg 2x a day and 3 quarts of pabst, you think i will live? needless to say i’m not doing that again.

Been doing that lately my self.   Watch – that it can truley mess you up. Do you feel it helps – albeit only temporarily?    What about depression the next day?  Terable? You’re so much better off when you do something physical.  Working out helps.  I guess that would include narly s-x too. Well i wish i could make that claim lately but i’m crossing a sand doon in the middle of the desert..  I know that soon along will come Ms or Mrs right,  food and water!   Maybe then i’ll be able to worry about somebody else’s life 1/2 as much as i do mine.  Maybe i just need two women! Wo wo wo, i thought you were banned.   Don’t know if we should be talking.  Well i think the question now is do you think you learned what ever lesson that it was you should have been learning?   Make people come to you.  Screw them – it’ll happen.! In the mean time hold your head up and by all means just relax. ralph g

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Wew that’s alot.  But try climbing on top your roof and smoking two bowls of green bud on top of it all and then fall off the ladder.  Still feeling that.  I drank a lot more than you did though. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – well DAMN, boy! i think the three quarts of pabst would do you in the next morning even without the buspar! nah, i’m a professional drinker…… here’s my record for most alcohol consumed in an evening, it’s true i wrote it all down the next day, amazed myself even: 3 12oz cans of pabst 2 long island teas a martini 2 12 oz bottles of miller 1 screw driver 4 16 oz draft beers (unknown brand) 1 big margarita and a quart of pabst before bed and i didn’t even have a hangover, i was at work at 9 am on the dot.  i wouldn’t lie "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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Been doing that lately my self.   Watch – that it can truley mess you up. Do you feel it helps – albeit only temporarily?    What about depression the next day?  Terable?

i felt great while drinking, it was the next morning i had to pay though. i didn’t have one single bit of anxiety during the festivities. no depression the next day, just horrible shakes and headache, and a thought that i had hurt my brain beyond repair. You’re so much better off when you do something physical.  Working out helps. I guess that would include narly s-x too.

working out is a good thing, well, i play soccer, and do a lot of walking, not really "working out" but it is exercise. sex is a bore and does nothing more than make life more complicated. oh well, i’ve sworn it off for now. Well i wish i could make that claim lately but i’m crossing a sand doon in the middle of the desert..  I know that soon along will come Ms or Mrs right, food and water!   Maybe then i’ll be able to worry about somebody else’s life 1/2 as much as i do mine.  Maybe i just need two women! Wo wo wo, i thought you were banned.   Don’t know if we should be talking. Well i think the question now is do you think you learned what ever lesson that it was you should have been learning?   Make people come to you.  Screw them – it’ll happen.!

huh? the banned thing is because i was banned from a club in memphis for talking shite on them on my web page, it’s just an inside joke in a couple other news groups. In the mean time hold your head up and by all means just relax.

sure, that’s what i’m going for. "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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Was only wondering.   Don’t mix meds and alcohol!   Not good for you and in most cases it’s antagonistic in it’s effects.  I RARELY even mix a little g.bud with it.  Come down and by all means don’t add to the problem! I never have any anxiety while drinking but i never need help with that, med wise. I don’t even like mixing analgisics with my hang over!   You bought it you pay for it.   PAY AS YOU GO!  Leave your chemistry alone And sex is a bore?   What?   <biting toung to keep from commenting See ya, gotta go now.   Sex a bore?   It’s always a bore if you’re lucky! Thanks for the explain- on the banned thing.  Avoided that as much as possible. Was there something you wanted to add? Talking s–t on yo web page?  Not cooo if you ask me.  I knew there was an alterior motive to your madness Later! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Been doing that lately my self.   Watch – that it can truley mess you up. Do you feel it helps – albeit only temporarily?    What about depression the next day?  Terable? i felt great while drinking, it was the next morning i had to pay though. i didn’t have one single bit of anxiety during the festivities. no depression the next day, just horrible shakes and headache, and a thought that i had hurt my brain beyond repair. You’re so much better off when you do something physical.  Working out helps. I guess that would include narly s-x too. working out is a good thing, well, i play soccer, and do a lot of walking, not really "working out" but it is exercise. sex is a bore and does nothing more than make life more complicated. oh well, i’ve sworn it off for now. Well i wish i could make that claim lately but i’m crossing a sand doon in the middle of the desert..  I know that soon along will come Ms or Mrs right, food and water!   Maybe then i’ll be able to worry about somebody else’s life 1/2 as much as i do mine.  Maybe i just need two women! Wo wo wo, i thought you were banned.   Don’t know if we should be talking. Well i think the question now is do you think you learned what ever lesson that it was you should have been learning?   Make people come to you.  Screw them – it’ll happen.! huh? the banned thing is because i was banned from a club in memphis for talking shite on them on my web page, it’s just an inside joke in a couple other news groups. In the mean time hold your head up and by all means just relax. sure, that’s what i’m going for. "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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Hi Tom, I am a wine-maker and get a lot of pleasure from making and drinking my own wine. Most medications (as far as I have seen), tell you to avoid alcohol (there, that’s my disclaimer <G) but I truly do enjoy a good glass of red 3/4 times a week. Several times I have even had (gasp!) 2 glasses of wine, but I draw the line there. What I have found is that I have no tolerance for alcohol -I either feel very sleepy or get quite giddy. I have not felt any after-effects the next day. My doctor is fully aware of my hobby. The times that I do not drink at all are the periods when my anxiety is extremely high and I am either levelling up on a medication or trying a new one or if the depression is very bad. Then I wait for a few months until I feel "balanced" again. BTW, I take a TCA daily and an occasional benzo when needed. If you are concerned about damage to your body, you could have your doctor do a liver function test. Cheers! Charley

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So… I want to understand… Does taking Buspar or Xanax, etc. forever disallow you from enjoying a beer or two with friends -something that has REALLY lifted my spirits in the past. I’ve battled this question myself several times and usually have the beer or wine, not to excess. But I WOULD like to know if it is TRULY harmful, in this VERY moderate way? Doctors will, of course, say no alcohol. Pharmacy, same thing. I understand. They have to cover their ass and the combination probably is not good (chemically speaking) but alcohol never is good for you anyway. Addictive people should NEVER cross the two! To that I agree. But, once you take some of the "fairly" harmless fun out of your life, your anxiety can go though the roof! I KNOW! Exercise is great. I do it myself regularly when I can. BUT… giving up those few beers with my friends FOREVER seems harsh! I drank twice (half bottle of wine once and a few beers another time) while on Buspar (5 mg/twice day) and Xanax (1 mg 2-3 times a day). All I noticed is I had a good time, might have slept TOO well, and maybe a little more groggy getting up. So what! Took a shower and went back to my daily, fairly healthy grind! Probably a week or two later I may have done the same thing. I have a high tolerance to drugs (Found out the hard way after an appendectomy!). That’s just "my" body chemistry. Just curious if I’m crazy or not? Please no preachy non alcohol speeches. I’d just like to know what the REAL danger here is. Maybe we should all just go to http://www.beer.com and send each other a "virtual" beer! It’s really there! Someone else can start that tradition. Any takers? Tom …do not mix very well. i went a little nuts lastnight and drank a couple quarts of beer, felt fine til i woke up this morning, now i’m wondering if i have done long lasting damage to my body!!!!! uggggh. 15mg 2x a day and 3 quarts of pabst, you think i will live? needless to say i’m not doing that again. "Remember, when someone annoys you that it takes 42 muscles to frown, but it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and whack them in the head." http://members.aol.com/unfun26/enter.htm

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This is an interesting question.  I have been seeking the answer to this for some time now.  My past two cars have been HUGE GM party barges.  A ‘79 Pontiac Bonneville and a ‘84 Buick Park Ave.  I purchased the first in ‘88 and it had about 36K mi. on it for 3100 dollars US. and sold it five years later for about $500 US. At that time it had about 106K mi.  The total cost of non-maintainance repairs was about 600$.  That means the cost of depreciation and repairs was about 5 cents per mile.  Insurance was also really inexpensive too since I paid cash and didn’t carry anything but liability.  It was really a great car.  It did however tend to drink gas, about 16 around town and 19 on the highway. My current car the ‘84 Buick Park Ave.  I purchased for 4500$ about two years ago.  It had about 53K mi. on it at the time.  Now it has about 83k mi. on it.  I have had two problems with it.  The total cost has been about 475 dollars so far.  The car still runs great and I plan on keeping it for another three years.  After that time I anticipate being able to sell it for 700-1000 dollars.  This is a really cheap way to drive. My next car may be an old Volvo or Mercedes.  These cars run forever and have an incredible reseale value.  Maintianance and repairs will cost more but the money will be recooped in better reseale values.  I figure if you buy a convertable Mercedes or a Volvo wagon, about 10-12 years old, you will be able to sell it for about what you paid for it five years later.  That is provided that you keep it in good condition.  Hey, if you buy the right older car, you could even make money on the whole deal.  New cars and Leases are for suckeres B-).  Buy a good used car.  Spend a little on keeping it looking good and running well and enjoy a coar that costs peanuts to run. Just my 2 cents.  Is there anyone else out there that does this out of necessity or out of the desire to save a few grand? Sincerely, Richard F. Giersch

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: On a 60 month loan, 10% interest rate, 67% of the first 2 yrs. payments go to : reducing principle.  Even on the first payment, 61% goes toward principle. : This according to a loan amortization table I just generated in Excel. : Auto loans are not amortized in the same manner as mortgages; they use : the Rule of 78’s method of allocating principal.  As such, up-front : payments are almost entirely interest, and ones near the end, : principal. It’s a good thing you lease your cars now, because if this is the kind of loan you get for your car, someone’s screwing you over. I have a car loan.  It is amortized the same way as my home loan.  All my car loans have been.  There’s nothing magical about it. —   Technology Group   Applied Micro Circuits Corp.

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[snip] : Doubtful. There are too many restrictions on a lease that can never : prove advantageous in all situations. And your addition of the gains [snip] Those leasing restrictions aren’t very attractive to those of us who like to modify their cars a lot.  To me, leasing seems like driving a rental car all the time; it’s like you’re just borrowing the car.  You can put a certain amount of mileage on it, you have to pay for gas and upkeep, but you can’t change it to suit yourself.  I guess if you just consider your car "basic transportation," then a lease might be alright, but if you love cars, forget it.      Danny

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The primary factor in the lease/finance/cash decision should be the interest rate: if one can borrow money at a lower rate than one can obtain by investing it, one should borrow.  Leasing is just another form of borrowing, and leases almost always beat auto loans in terms of interest rate; the average is around 7%, but can be as low as zero.

Not exactly John. A second, heavily determining factor is just how long are you willing to live with one car. If your aim is to frequently trade up to new cars, say every 3-4 years, leasing is almost always the best way to go. I can’t imagine any form of purchase, cash or otherwise, that would put you ahead once you factor in depreciation, etc. On the other hand, if your plan is to just find the cheapest way to run a car, period, then nothing, and I mean nothing, can prove cheaper then the old adage of buying cash and "running it `till the wheels fall off". This is hardly virgin territory we are treading here, as the subject has been the focus of countless studies (including the dissertation of a fellow doctoral graduate of mine some years back). The answer comes up the same every single time, and with an even larger lead in more recent times with the improving longevity of modern vehicles. It may not be the coolest thing to drive in a 10-year old car, but you’d have to have lease payments under $30/month to beat the money layout, including repairs, on a car which has been paid for in cash and driven 10 years (or 150,000 miles). Eventually everyone will catch on, and all cars will be leased. I’m on my fourth one, and much richer as a result: the money I left in GE stock rather than putting down on a car is now worth eight times what it was in 1986, so that $25K I could have used to buy the 1986 Mercedes is now worth over $200K.  And all the lease payments I’ve made since then total only to about $35K.

Doubtful. There are too many restrictions on a lease that can never prove advantageous in all situations. And your addition of the gains in stock is irrelevant to the cost factor of operating your vehicle. Your stock would have made equal profit had you leased your car, bought it, or rode a bike. You could counter that you may not have had the cash to invest had you purchased, but then again you could have invested in a bum scheme and lost all that money. In that case the capital in a car that you *owned* would have better return then your investments and lease payments. Investment is investment, and I’ve also made a lot of money for myself investing, while buying all my cars in cash. So let’s keep seperate subjects just that. So what was that about cash being the best way to buy a car? Thanks, but no thanks.

Again, it depends on usage. Between my job and my business, I drive a LOT. I’ve traded my last two Saabs and one BMW with well over 200,000 miles on them. I’m also an amateur racer and run my Porsche 911 Turbo at local club events. No lease of any type would give a better value than a cash purchase for the former. And no lease contract would even permit the latter. As they say, "your mileage may vary". What was that about "someday everyone will lease"? Thanks, but no thanks. Cheers, – Daryl

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Two year lease, 10% down.  Pay for just the filet.  Let someone else pay for the bone, tail and head.  You will never lose any money and have options at the end of the lease versus long term obligations.  Bear in mind that on a five year loan only 14% during the first two years goes toward principle reduction.  86% is pure interest. Not a judgment – just a factual correction: On a 60 month loan, 10% interest rate, 67% of the first 2 yrs. payments go to reducing principle.  Even on the first payment, 61% goes toward principle. This according to a loan amortization table I just generated in Excel.

Auto loans are not amortized in the same manner as mortgages; they use the Rule of 78’s method of allocating principal.  As such, up-front payments are almost entirely interest, and ones near the end, principal. Auto leases may also be amortized in this same manner, but this is less of a problem because of their shorther length, and the availability of "gap" insurance; this reduces or eliminates the financial impact if one’s car is totalled or stolen.  With financing, one could be seriously "upside-down." The primary factor in the lease/finance/cash decision should be the interest rate: if one can borrow money at a lower rate than one can obtain by investing it, one should borrow.  Leasing is just another form of borrowing, and leases almost always beat auto loans in terms of interest rate; the average is around 7%, but can be as low as zero. Just ask for the lease’s Money Factor and multiply by 24 to get the equivalent APR.  If this number is less than a loan interest rate, leasing is better than financing.  If however, you keep all your savings in a passbook savings account at 2.75%, then you’re probably better off buying with cash, although, there are many subsidized leases available with interest rates lower than this. Eventually everyone will catch on, and all cars will be leased. I’m on my fourth one, and much richer as a result: the money I left in GE stock rather than putting down on a car is now worth eight times what it was in 1986, so that $25K I could have used to buy the 1986 Mercedes is now worth over $200K.  And all the lease payments I’ve made since then total only to about $35K. So what was that about cash being the best way to buy a car? Thanks, but no thanks. Martin Marietta Government Electronic Systems    Moorestown NJ 08057 WPI Class of ‘75, Temple Class of ‘94 My new car history:   1975    1978    1982       1986        1989      1992      1995    VW –  Audi – Audi  - Mercedes – Mercedes – Audi – Mercedes Scirocco Fox GTI  4000S    190E 2.3    190E 2.6    100CS     S320 POSSLQ’s* new car history:           1978      1981      1985       1988      1990      1993         Triumph – Toyota – Toyota  -   VW    - Audi –   Audi         Spitfire   Tercel    Corolla    Jetta GL    80       90S *POSSLQ = Person of Opposite Sex Sharing Living Quarters Note: All Audis and Mercedes above were sold to friends or family.

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:: Two year lease, 10% down.  Pay for just the filet.  Let someone else pay :: for the bone, tail and head.  You will never lose any money and have :: options at the end of the lease versus long term obligations.  Bear in :: mind that on a five year loan only 14% during the first two years goes :: toward principle reduction.  86% is pure interest. : Not a judgment – just a factual correction: : : On a 60 month loan, 10% interest rate, 67% of the first 2 yrs. payments go to : reducing principle.  Even on the first payment, 61% goes toward principle. : This according to a loan amortization table I just generated in Excel. Your Excel spreadsheet is correct.  And, for a 5yr, 8% simple-interest loan, 72.5% of the first 24 payments go toward principle.  Furthermore, for equal APR’s, a lease will *ALWAYS* have the higher interest expense because the average unpaid balance is higher.  And please don’t forget that on a lease you’re probably also paying sales tax on the interest. Leases *do* have advantages, but interest expense is *NOT* one of them. …a loan is just a lease with a $0.00 residual, Mark

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: Two year lease, 10% down.  Pay for just the filet.  Let someone else pay : for the bone, tail and head.  You will never lose any money and have : options at the end of the lease versus long term obligations.  Bear in : mind that on a five year loan only 14% during the first two years goes : toward principle reduction.  86% is pure interest.   Funny, I’ve got a 5 year car loan with a $325 a month payment.  According to my bank statement, about $100 a month goes to interest, the rest to principal.  This is for the first month or two, where the amount to interest will be the greatest.  Now, that means that roughly 65% of the payment goes to principle reduction. But you state only 14% goes towards principle reduction.  huh.. mathematician. —   Technology Group   Applied Micro Circuits Corp.

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Two year lease, 10% down.  Pay for just the filet.  Let someone else pay for the bone, tail and head.  You will never lose any money and have options at the end of the lease versus long term obligations.  Bear in mind that on a five year loan only 14% during the first two years goes toward principle reduction.  86% is pure interest.

Not a judgment – just a factual correction: On a 60 month loan, 10% interest rate, 67% of the first 2 yrs. payments go to reducing principle.  Even on the first payment, 61% goes toward principle. This according to a loan amortization table I just generated in Excel. – David

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Two year lease, 10% down.  Pay for just the filet.  Let someone else pay for the bone, tail and head.  You will never lose any money and have options at the end of the lease versus long term obligations.  Bear in mind that on a five year loan only 14% during the first two years goes toward principle reduction.  86% is pure interest.  A normal vehicle will depreciate 40% during the first two years.  So long term loans cause negative equity and then you are forced to spend for wearable items such as tires, tunes brakes, stuff that never ad any value to the vehicle. It’s pure expense.  Just pay for the filet…the first two years depreciation then change cars instead of tires.

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Does anybody know by experience or by being clever with the calculator as to the cheapest way to own and run a car. Is it cheaper to Lease?  If so, over what period? Is it cheaper to by new and sell?  If so, when do you sell? Is it cheaper to buy second hand? If so, how old? As you can see, there are so many different variations. Perhaps an ex-salesman might have the answers. Please post any comments you have.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Path: news.redstone.army.mil!news.msfc.nasa.gov!bcm!cs.utexas.edu!uwm.edu!lll-win ken.llnl.gov!enews.sgi.com!decwrl!waikato!auckland.ac.nz!dmar04.cs.aukuni.a c.nz Newsgroups: rec.autos.misc Organization: University of Auckland Lines: 12 NNTP-Posting-Host: cs26.cs.auckland.ac.nz Summary: Cheapest way to own/run a car? X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #3 (NOV) Does anybody know by experience or by being clever with the calculator as to the cheapest way to own and run a car. Is it cheaper to Lease?  If so, over what period? Is it cheaper to by new and sell?  If so, when do you sell? Is it cheaper to buy second hand? If so, how old? As you can see, there are so many different variations. Perhaps an ex-salesman might have the answers. Please post any comments you have.

Good article in this month’s Esquire (Bruce Willis in on the cover) magazine that addresses many of the points that you raise…. Glenn E. Painter – SESI Redstone Arsenal, AL (205) 876-2325  DSN 746-2325 CompuServ 74357,1152

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