Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m new to this ng and am learning lots of new info about asthma. Recently mya sthma sent me to the ER and my doctor prescribed singulair for me.  It works really great.  The only problem is the price.  She gave me samples but if I want to continue taking it I need to get it from a pharmacy.  I can apply to get it paid for, which can be a pretty lengthy process, or I could go back to the clinic and get inhaled steroids for free or at least very cheap.  My question is shoul I go to the trouble of trying to get the singulair or go for the steroids.  I have had absolutely no side effects to the singulair and am wondering what side effects come with the steroids. Any info would be very helpful.  Thanks! Cathy

You should most definitely go through the trouble of getting the Singulair, since this medication is good preventive therapy.  It’s supposed to prevent or lessen attacks, not rescue you when you have them.  By the same token, inhaled steroids, while of some use for preventive therapy, are still necessary for rescue, even with Singulair.  My doctor has prescribed both for me during the summer, and during the winter I use Azmacort as well. I’ve long since forgotten what potential side effects come from using inhaled steroids, but I can tell you they’ve never created any problems for me. Sam

Response:

I’m new to this ng and am learning lots of new info about asthma.  Recently mya sthma sent me to the ER and my doctor prescribed singulair for me.  It works really great.  The only problem is the price.  She gave me samples but if I want to continue taking it I need to get it from a pharmacy.  I can apply to get it paid for, which can be a pretty lengthy process, or I could go back to the clinic and get inhaled steroids for free or at least very cheap.  My question is shoul I go to the trouble of trying to get the singulair or go for the steroids.  I have had absolutely no side effects to the singulair and am wondering what side effects come with the steroids. Any info would be very helpful.  Thanks! Cathy

Response:

I’m new to this ng and am learning lots of new info about asthma.  Recently mya sthma sent me to the ER and my doctor prescribed singulair for me.  It works really great.  The only problem is the price.  She gave me samples but if I want to continue taking it I need to get it from a pharmacy.  I can apply to get it paid for, which can be a pretty lengthy process, or I could go back to the clinic and get inhaled steroids for free or at least very cheap.  My question is shoul I go to the trouble of trying to get the singulair or go for the steroids.  I have had absolutely no side effects to the singulair and am wondering what side effects come with the steroids. Any info would be very helpful.  Thanks!

If you have a medicine that works, don’t mess with it; apply for the reimbursement. Chris Owens

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Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – hi tony, he doesnt want to be on any kind of drugs, his gp put him on this to get him off crystal meth and heroin. that has worked but now he wants to be totally drug free, but he seems to think that he can get off effexor… i wonder why she put him on those if she knew that they are the hardest drugs to get off, even tho she knew that he wanted to be drug free one day hmmmmmmmmmmmmm i think to make life easier for her mayeb? hi everyone, more of a reader than a poster, but i do have  a quick question. im not familiar with effexor, but my brother is on it, and has been since october last year. what is the best way to get off these? Jackie gave some good advise, but I can’t help asking why he wants to go off of effexor? Tony From a very bad personal experience.. I think I would rather go cold

turkey off of crystal meth and heroine simultaneously than cold turkey off of Effexor. If he does not go off of this medication without the help of a physician, he is going to be one sorry guy. I know this, because I did it.. despite having already known it was highly recommended NOT to do it.. I did it because the side effects from Effexor were just more than I thought I could tolerate another second. I know this drug has helped many people. I also know this drug has been .. to put it mildly.. a not so good experience for some others, myself included. I think your brother is being irrational, however.. if Effexor enabled him to stop the street drugs, it must have some positive effects for him. He sounds like he has benefited from taking it. We’d all *like* to be med free. Nobody wants to be chained to a regimen of drugs just to feel normal..but med free does not always mean that is the healthiest way to go. Medications can save your life, your sanity, save you from much discomfort and suffering… They are there for a good reason, and I hope he rethinks his position. He may or may not be able to live med free, but if he d/c’s the Effexor without a doctor’s supervision, he may be in for a very bad experience. Sally — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – hi tony, he doesnt want to be on any kind of drugs, his gp put him on this to get him off crystal meth and heroin. that has worked but now he wants to be totally drug free, but he seems to think that he can get off effexor… i wonder why she put him on those if she knew that they are the hardest drugs to get off, even tho she knew that he wanted to be drug free one day hmmmmmmmmmmmmm i think to make life easier for her mayeb? hi everyone, more of a reader than a poster, but i do have  a quick question. im not familiar with effexor, but my brother is on it, and has been since october last year. what is the best way to get off these? Jackie gave some good advise, but I can’t help asking why he wants to go off of effexor? Tony —

I dont mean to sound negative, but I had one HELL of a time getting off of Effexor. It didnt work for me so my doctor kept upping the dosage. She got it up to 250mg a day and my anxiety never relented. It took about 3 months to try to wean myself off, and even then I felt TERRIBLE. I would advise anyone taking this to try and get off of it before you stay on it long enough to have the withdrawl symptoms (and my doctor claimed she had never heard of anyone having any withdrawl symptoms-needless to say she is no longer my doc) I went to a new doc who gave me alprazolam (which the old doc wouldnt do because of concerns that I may become addicted, imagine that) which I only take when I need and it works wonders. I have heard of people having the same problems with Cymbalta. They say you will become addicted to valium or alprazolam (which are cheap and work when used properly, and will only result in addiction if abused) and then put you on high- dollar SSRI’s (which cause horrible withdrawl symtoms). Obviously the best paitent’s best interest is not top priority here. Sorry, I guess I got on a bit of a rant there…… Terri — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

hi tony, he doesnt want to be on any kind of drugs, his gp put him on this to get him off crystal meth and heroin. that has worked but now he wants to be totally drug free, but he seems to think that he can get off effexor… i wonder why she put him on those if she knew that they are the hardest drugs to get off, even tho she knew that he wanted to be drug free one day hmmmmmmmmmmmmm i think to make life easier for her mayeb?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – hi everyone, more of a reader than a poster, but i do have  a quick question. im not familiar with effexor, but my brother is on it, and has been since october last year. what is the best way to get off these? Jackie gave some good advise, but I can’t help asking why he wants to go off of effexor? Tony — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

– The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

Tennessee Tony schreef: hi everyone, more of a reader than a poster, but i do have  a quick question. im not familiar with effexor, but my brother is on it, and has been since october last year. what is the best way to get off these? Jackie gave some good advise, but I can’t help asking why he wants to go off of effexor? Tony

 ….which is a very good question (I know because I wanted to ask it myself Being on an AD for half a year is short. Now I have another question: why is he *on* it in the first place? Philip — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

hi everyone, more of a reader than a poster, but i do have  a quick question. im not familiar with effexor, but my brother is on it, and has been since october last year. what is the best way to get off these?

Jackie gave some good advise, but I can’t help asking why he wants to go off of effexor? Tony — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

:: ::hi everyone, :: ::more of a reader than a poster, but i do have  a quick question. :: ::im not familiar with effexor, but my brother is on it, and has been since ::october last year. :: ::what is the best way to get off these? :: ::thanks Hi Glama, Your brother should discontinue Effexor under the guidance of a medical professional. Effexor is one of the more difficult antidepressants to wean off of. A way to minimize withdrawal symptoms is to take it very slow and to decrease the dose in small amounts. Here is some info on discontinuing antidepressants….. http://bipolar.about.com/cs/antidep/a/0207_ssridisc1.htm http://bipolar.about.com/cs/antidep/a/0207_ssridisc2.htm http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=990CEED9173EF936A15756… Wishing your brother lots of luck and success getting off Effexor! Jackie ~*~Life is not the way it’s supposed to be. It’s the way it    is. The way you deal with it is what makes the difference~*~   ~~ Virginia Satir   — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

hi everyone, more of a reader than a poster, but i do have  a quick question. im not familiar with effexor, but my brother is on it, and has been since october last year. what is the best way to get off these? thanks — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

Question:

Yah, yooh betcha, I read most of and skimmed all of "Your Drug May Be Your Problem: How and Why to Stop Taking Psychiatric Medications."  He is at www.breggin.com  I highly recommend it to everybody here, even though I disagree with large pieces of his arguments. In particular, I found his suggestions about how to come off drugs invaluable. We ALL have to come off drugs, even if only to switch to yet other drugs. He is 110% behind the very-gradually approach. I used his ideas in getting off of Effexor, which was a bastard (I hate saying "it was a bitch"). Anyone who wants to can read elsewhere about the withdrawal I experienced getting off Effexor — I still get email from folks who find my posts when desperately looking on the net for info about Effexor withdrawal. I tapered SUPER ULTRA gradually and still had withdrawal, in retrospect partly because I was taking it only once a day. But reading his advice about coming off of a drug you have become dependent upon was very good for me. The part where I depart from the Dr. is in saying that all drugs everywhere are evil and stew the brains. Methinks this fellow never emptied his checking account and maxed out his credit card in a manic binge, or found out that lithium kept that devil at bay. I have never (to my knowledge) been censored at asdmm. Mostly I think their purpose is to sieve out the trolls and hurtful flames. -Tin who used to be Gan Tinuviel Cuivienen Elbethil "Nightingale, daughter of twilight, singing at the shadowed pool, beholds the divine radiance of the stars."

|Gan, | |Have you spent any time looking at Breggin or the other docs who have |written about the downside of thest meds? I can see that some of my |questions and  comments about them have been eliminated from appearing |on this thread. That seems like someone has a terribly toxic point of |view that doesn’t allow freedom to ask questions and to mention |alternative viewpoints. If that’s the case, then this really isn’t a |place for a bipolar person to be. | |What rare your thoughts? | |Anatman |

| |I’ve done both of those. I think that the obsessing goes along with |the hyperfocusing ADD that I have been noticing — getting stuck and |not being able to shift gears. According to Sears, the ADD doc who |says more than 1/2 of bipolars are ADD, the hyperfocusing ADDers hold |grudges, and I confess to doing that sometimes. The constantly getting |irritated totally sucks — when it is bad it is like running around |with blackboards screeching everywhere. | |- The-Gal-who-was-Gandalf-but-is-thinking-about-Tinuvial | | |   |

| |     | |(2) As I THINK I posted here my half-brother was hospitalized for a |manic episode last fall (Now recognizing the ADD I’m also seeing the |extent of my forgetfulness. | |As I predicted to his folks the month after he got out of the |hospital, and as I have seen in almost every bipolar I’ve ever met, he |has decided to stop taking his medications. |       | |Another trait is obsessing about a person, like an SO or someone you |like and just obsessively calling that person when upset or needing |constant validation from everybody. Or constantly getting irritated. | | | |MorphGrrl | |     | | | | |   | |

Response:

etched permanently into the ether: Antaman, lost posts happen from time to time.  Tonight, there was a little difficulty for us to moderate, and finally I was the only one who was able to do so.  I have allowed all the posts to go through.

That’s kind of an understatement!  We are having moderation problems, that are intermittent.  That can cause a few messages to get lost.  Messages also get lost between your provider and our provider–they never get to us at all.  Long messages (longer than about 200 lines) are most difficult to process.  The longer the message, the more likely something can happen to it.  This is why people need to snip messages and only quote what they are responding to.  And kill those blank lines. Just some hints about how you can help your own messages show up more readily. Another thing has been happening to some providers recently.  For some reason, they just don’t post everything.  Supernews is one of them, I haven’t tracked all of them.  So, check in google about 2-4 hours after you send your message–hopefully it will show up there–that is how you know your provider is dropping messages–they eventually show up in google, but never on your provider’s server. HTH, Nancy Just knockin’ around the zoo. (James Taylor)

Response:

That seems like someone has a terribly toxic point of view that doesn’t allow freedom to ask questions and to mention alternative viewpoints. If that’s the case, then this really isn’t a place for a bipolar person to be.

Antaman, lost posts happen from time to time.  Tonight, there was a little difficulty for us to moderate, and finally I was the only one who was able to do so.  I have allowed all the posts to go through. If your posts are a violation, then we would email you and let you know why we were rejecting your post and then give you the opportunity to resubmit if you make the suggested corrections.  We the moderation team do not just delete and allow your posts not to go through.  I’ve gone round and round with Harry over his not showing up on his server and everyone else saw them.   Just resubmit the missing ones again and I’ll be able to take a look at them.  If they don’t fit the guidelines, then I’ll email you a polite note with what you need to fix. We don’t have a problem with alternative view points.  What we DO have a problem with is people who provide misinformation and people who have a "cure" when there really isn’t one for bipolar disorder.  We also have a problem with people who say to stop taking your meds, that it’s all a crock of hooey and there is no such thing as bipolar disorder.  I’m not going to list everyone you need to go back and Google, but there is plenty of examples in ASDM as to why we can’t and don’t advocate going off all your meds.

Response:

Gan, Have you spent any time looking at Breggin or the other docs who have written about the downside of thest meds? I can see that some of my questions and  comments about them have been eliminated from appearing on this thread. That seems like someone has a terribly toxic point of view that doesn’t allow freedom to ask questions and to mention alternative viewpoints. If that’s the case, then this really isn’t a place for a bipolar person to be. What rare your thoughts? Anatman – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve done both of those. I think that the obsessing goes along with the hyperfocusing ADD that I have been noticing — getting stuck and not being able to shift gears. According to Sears, the ADD doc who says more than 1/2 of bipolars are ADD, the hyperfocusing ADDers hold grudges, and I confess to doing that sometimes. The constantly getting irritated totally sucks — when it is bad it is like running around with blackboards screeching everywhere. – The-Gal-who-was-Gandalf-but-is-thinking-about-Tinuvial (2) As I THINK I posted here my half-brother was hospitalized for a manic episode last fall (Now recognizing the ADD I’m also seeing the extent of my forgetfulness. As I predicted to his folks the month after he got out of the hospital, and as I have seen in almost every bipolar I’ve ever met, he has decided to stop taking his medications. Another trait is obsessing about a person, like an SO or someone you like and just obsessively calling that person when upset or needing constant validation from everybody. Or constantly getting irritated. MorphGrrl

Response:

Here’s Ten for you, hot off the press; You’ll be fine (for the rest of the day). You won’t need to take a holiday from hell, you can imagine you’re there. You won’t need a bank account, it will be empty. You’ll save money on pills, but in any case you would not be able to buy them (see above) You won’t need to pay rent for a property, you’ll feel quite comfortable on the street. You won’t have to buy your friends birthday cards, you won’t have any. You won’t need to decide if you are a Christian, Buddhist or Jew, you can be all three at once. People can make decisions for you in accordance with the instructions you left. Oh sugar, you forgot to leave any. Your family will be really worried and concerned, but that won’t be a problem as you will think everything’s hunky dory. You won’t be able to read this as you will have forgotten to pay your utilities bills. That’s Ten, and you won’t even wonder who this crazy person called Geoff is. Geoff

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Geoff, Sorry to hear about your brother. Mine is thinking about heading down a similar path. He is such a great guy too, so funny! But he doesn’t really care about or for himself, and if he doesn’t watch out pretty soon he is going to lose his current job, which just fits him to a tee at the moment. So let me see if I can squeeze any creativity out of this soggy brain. First the title. PLEASE folks we are bipolars here, and that means we are Creative!!! Help me out with some more reasons and with making these funnier. Heavy is fine — it IS heavy — but a little sugar will help the medicine go down. TOP TEN REASONS TO NOT STOP TAKING YOUR MEDICATION #1) Spending every cent you have and then maxing out all of your credit cards to start a collection of ceramic oriental dragons because they have a deeply mystical significance for you no longer seems like such a great idea.      Especially since you discovered from your last episode when you bought an entire library of Zen Buddhism books that these purchases are non-refundable once you return to sanity. "I was manic at the time," was not a valid defense for those hard-nosed shopkeepers. You could have returned them within that 10 day period, but you were still in the hospital at the time and had totally forgotten about them anyway because you had moved on to the next wonder. #2) You are thinking that you might like to keep a girlfriend/wife for longer than 5 years without scaring her away by telling her stories all night and calling her in the middle of the night from the hospital to tell her she is a whore and you never loved her anyway but then when she confronted you you  didn’t even remember calling her because you were bonkers psychotic at the time. #3) Because the drugs actually work. You have read stories about what happened to manic-depressives before there were drugs that work, and you really don’t need to go there — their lives were a nightmare. You’ve also heard that if bipolars don’t take their drugs their illness gets worse, and you’re not big into suffering. #4) You know that every time you have an episode you damage your brain AND increase the likelihood of another episode. You need to hold on to what little brains you have. With what little brains you have now you are thinking about doing stupid things like stopping your medication — what kind of brilliant life decisions will you make with less of a brain? #5) Suicide no longer has the attraction that it once did, and you know that chances are that bipolars will try and they unfortunately mean it and succeed at it. Life looks a little better to you at the moment and you’d to hang on to it for a bit longer. #6) You realize that although the depressions totally suck and are actually in fact valid reasons for contemplating suicide, that the depressions basically hurt you the most. Those manias on the other hand are a living hell on the people around you and you have decided sadism is not going to be your legacy to the world around you. This is always going to be a difficult one. Every visit for 10 years I ask is there a chance that I can stop or reduce my medication. Last December, my younger brother was also diagnosed b/p. (I’m 52, down in E England he is 47 up in Scotland). In my opinion he has always been ‘crazier’ than me….no, amend that….in everyone’s opinion! However, I do sometimes struggle against the effects of medication to maintain some sort of well being, and keep my eyelids propped open, whilst he seems to be carrying on on his own little planet, quite oblivious, unmedicated….well that’s how it seems……. But, I am not the one that’s had an acrimonious divorce; the one that’s fallen behind with house payments; the one that’s 40,000 UKP in debt; the one that drove down from Scotland on bald illegal and dangerous tyres; the one that forgets to keep in touch with his children;  and that bought a rubbish timeshare holiday apartment. Oops, not exactly playful as you had wanted, but a comparison between two people sharing the same nature, but not all of the same nurture in our case, due to the long time and distance separation. Hope you come up with the right form of words for your brother Geoff (2) As I THINK I posted here my half-brother was hospitalized for a manic episode last fall (Now recognizing the ADD I’m also seeing the extent of my forgetfulness. As I predicted to his folks the month after he got out of the hospital, and as I have seen in almost every bipolar I’ve ever met, he has decided to stop taking his medications. Since I am the older wiser? big Sis who has already been there and done that, he does think highly of me and defer to me in many ways about this. i.e. I have some clout. I’ve tried to keep a low profile and not give too many "thou shalts" — this is hard enough without people telling you what to do. But I feel called to say something, with my training and expertise I have some responsibility. I’m thinking about making this playful, and sending him an email with a "Top 10 reasons not to stop taking your medication." Any ideas? Many thanks, -The-ASDM/M-poster-previously-known-as-Gandalf-who-is-currently-in-transi t ion-to-a-new-moniker

Response:

I’ve done both of those. I think that the obsessing goes along with the hyperfocusing ADD that I have been noticing — getting stuck and not being able to shift gears. According to Sears, the ADD doc who says more than 1/2 of bipolars are ADD, the hyperfocusing ADDers hold grudges, and I confess to doing that sometimes. The constantly getting irritated totally sucks — when it is bad it is like running around with blackboards screeching everywhere. – The-Gal-who-was-Gandalf-but-is-thinking-about-Tinuvial – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (2) As I THINK I posted here my half-brother was hospitalized for a manic episode last fall (Now recognizing the ADD I’m also seeing the extent of my forgetfulness. As I predicted to his folks the month after he got out of the hospital, and as I have seen in almost every bipolar I’ve ever met, he has decided to stop taking his medications. Another trait is obsessing about a person, like an SO or someone you like and just obsessively calling that person when upset or needing constant validation from everybody. Or constantly getting irritated. MorphGrrl

Response:

Geoff, Sorry to hear about your brother. Mine is thinking about heading down a similar path. He is such a great guy too, so funny! But he doesn’t really care about or for himself, and if he doesn’t watch out pretty soon he is going to lose his current job, which just fits him to a tee at the moment. So let me see if I can squeeze any creativity out of this soggy brain. First the title. PLEASE folks we are bipolars here, and that means we are Creative!!! Help me out with some more reasons and with making these funnier. Heavy is fine — it IS heavy — but a little sugar will help the medicine go down. TOP TEN REASONS TO NOT STOP TAKING YOUR MEDICATION #1) Spending every cent you have and then maxing out all of your credit cards to start a collection of ceramic oriental dragons because they have a deeply mystical significance for you no longer seems like such a great idea.      Especially since you discovered from your last episode when you bought an entire library of Zen Buddhism books that these purchases are non-refundable once you return to sanity. "I was manic at the time," was not a valid defense for those hard-nosed shopkeepers. You could have returned them within that 10 day period, but you were still in the hospital at the time and had totally forgotten about them anyway because you had moved on to the next wonder. #2) You are thinking that you might like to keep a girlfriend/wife for longer than 5 years without scaring her away by telling her stories all night and calling her in the middle of the night from the hospital to tell her she is a whore and you never loved her anyway but then when she confronted you you  didn’t even remember calling her because you were bonkers psychotic at the time. #3) Because the drugs actually work. You have read stories about what happened to manic-depressives before there were drugs that work, and you really don’t need to go there — their lives were a nightmare. You’ve also heard that if bipolars don’t take their drugs their illness gets worse, and you’re not big into suffering. #4) You know that every time you have an episode you damage your brain AND increase the likelihood of another episode. You need to hold on to what little brains you have. With what little brains you have now you are thinking about doing stupid things like stopping your medication — what kind of brilliant life decisions will you make with less of a brain? #5) Suicide no longer has the attraction that it once did, and you know that chances are that bipolars will try and they unfortunately mean it and succeed at it. Life looks a little better to you at the moment and you’d to hang on to it for a bit longer. #6) You realize that although the depressions totally suck and are actually in fact valid reasons for contemplating suicide, that the depressions basically hurt you the most. Those manias on the other hand are a living hell on the people around you and you have decided sadism is not going to be your legacy to the world around you. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is always going to be a difficult one. Every visit for 10 years I ask is there a chance that I can stop or reduce my medication. Last December, my younger brother was also diagnosed b/p. (I’m 52, down in E England he is 47 up in Scotland). In my opinion he has always been ‘crazier’ than me….no, amend that….in everyone’s opinion! However, I do sometimes struggle against the effects of medication to maintain some sort of well being, and keep my eyelids propped open, whilst he seems to be carrying on on his own little planet, quite oblivious, unmedicated….well that’s how it seems……. But, I am not the one that’s had an acrimonious divorce; the one that’s fallen behind with house payments; the one that’s 40,000 UKP in debt; the one that drove down from Scotland on bald illegal and dangerous tyres; the one that forgets to keep in touch with his children;  and that bought a rubbish timeshare holiday apartment. Oops, not exactly playful as you had wanted, but a comparison between two people sharing the same nature, but not all of the same nurture in our case, due to the long time and distance separation. Hope you come up with the right form of words for your brother Geoff (2) As I THINK I posted here my half-brother was hospitalized for a manic episode last fall (Now recognizing the ADD I’m also seeing the extent of my forgetfulness. As I predicted to his folks the month after he got out of the hospital, and as I have seen in almost every bipolar I’ve ever met, he has decided to stop taking his medications. Since I am the older wiser? big Sis who has already been there and done that, he does think highly of me and defer to me in many ways about this. i.e. I have some clout. I’ve tried to keep a low profile and not give too many "thou shalts" — this is hard enough without people telling you what to do. But I feel called to say something, with my training and expertise I have some responsibility. I’m thinking about making this playful, and sending him an email with a "Top 10 reasons not to stop taking your medication." Any ideas? Many thanks, -The-ASDM/M-poster-previously-known-as-Gandalf-who-is-currently-in-transit ion-to-a-new-moniker

Response:

(2) As I THINK I posted here my half-brother was hospitalized for a manic episode last fall (Now recognizing the ADD I’m also seeing the extent of my forgetfulness. As I predicted to his folks the month after he got out of the hospital, and as I have seen in almost every bipolar I’ve ever met, he has decided to stop taking his medications.

Another trait is obsessing about a person, like an SO or someone you like and just obsessively calling that person when upset or needing constant validation from everybody. Or constantly getting irritated. MorphGrrl

Response:

This is always going to be a difficult one. Every visit for 10 years I ask is there a chance that I can stop or reduce my medication. Last December, my younger brother was also diagnosed b/p. (I’m 52, down in E England he is 47 up in Scotland). In my opinion he has always been ‘crazier’ than me….no, amend that….in everyone’s opinion! However, I do sometimes struggle against the effects of medication to maintain some sort of well being, and keep my eyelids propped open, whilst he seems to be carrying on on his own little planet, quite oblivious, unmedicated….well that’s how it seems……. But, I am not the one that’s had an acrimonious divorce; the one that’s fallen behind with house payments; the one that’s 40,000 UKP in debt; the one that drove down from Scotland on bald illegal and dangerous tyres; the one that forgets to keep in touch with his children;  and that bought a rubbish timeshare holiday apartment. Oops, not exactly playful as you had wanted, but a comparison between two people sharing the same nature, but not all of the same nurture in our case, due to the long time and distance separation. Hope you come up with the right form of words for your brother Geoff

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (2) As I THINK I posted here my half-brother was hospitalized for a manic episode last fall (Now recognizing the ADD I’m also seeing the extent of my forgetfulness. As I predicted to his folks the month after he got out of the hospital, and as I have seen in almost every bipolar I’ve ever met, he has decided to stop taking his medications. Since I am the older wiser? big Sis who has already been there and done that, he does think highly of me and defer to me in many ways about this. i.e. I have some clout. I’ve tried to keep a low profile and not give too many "thou shalts" — this is hard enough without people telling you what to do. But I feel called to say something, with my training and expertise I have some responsibility. I’m thinking about making this playful, and sending him an email with a "Top 10 reasons not to stop taking your medication." Any ideas? Many thanks, -The-ASDM/M-poster-previously-known-as-Gandalf-who-is-currently-in-transit

ion-to-a-new-moniker – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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(2) As I THINK I posted here my half-brother was hospitalized for a manic episode last fall (Now recognizing the ADD I’m also seeing the extent of my forgetfulness. As I predicted to his folks the month after he got out of the hospital, and as I have seen in almost every bipolar I’ve ever met, he has decided to stop taking his medications. Since I am the older wiser? big Sis who has already been there and done that, he does think highly of me and defer to me in many ways about this. i.e. I have some clout. I’ve tried to keep a low profile and not give too many "thou shalts" — this is hard enough without people telling you what to do. But I feel called to say something, with my training and expertise I have some responsibility. I’m thinking about making this playful, and sending him an email with a "Top 10 reasons not to stop taking your medication." Any ideas? Many thanks, -The-ASDM/M-poster-previously-known-as-Gandalf-who-is-currently-in-transiti on-to-a-new-moniker

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Hi Everyone, my name is Augest.  I am twenty nine and i have panic disorder and ocd sinc the age of 11.  I was on zoloft fot eight years and recently weaned myself off to try and go it alone.  A week ago all my symptoms returned and I have been having attacks 24/7 since then.  I am so despondent.  I had to drop my online college course, put my part time job on hold and delay my business I’m working on starting.  All I can do is have attacks.  I’m waiting for the zoloft to kick in, but I feel like a failure for having to go back on it.  I have a feeling  I will have to be on medication for the rest of my life if I am going to be able to function.  I am so sad.  Was I stupid to try and go it alone?  Has anyone else tried and failed?  Please write to me, as I need someone to talk to who understands. Always, Augest

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Hi Everyone, my name is Augest.  I am twenty nine and i have panic disorder and ocd sinc the age of 11.  I was on zoloft fot eight years and recently weaned myself off to try and go it alone.  A week ago all my symptoms returned and I have been having attacks 24/7 since then.  I am so despondent.  I had to drop my online college course, put my part time job on hold and delay my business I’m working on starting.  All I can do is have attacks.  I’m waiting for the zoloft to kick in, but I feel like a failure for having to go back on it.  I have a feeling  I will have to be on medication for the rest of my life if I am going to be able to function.  I am so sad.  Was I stupid to try and go it alone?  Has anyone else tried and failed?  Please write to me, as I need someone to talk to who understands. Always, Augest

Oh yeah, I am dealing with this right now.  Putting the job on hold, med changes, etc.  Actually, I did try to wean myself off of my AD a couple of times and not with good results.  You are not a failure because you need medication.  Would someone call I diabetic a failure?  No.  You are going to be fine.  If you need your medication, there is nothing wrong at all with it. Good Luck, Vicki

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Hi Everyone, my name is Augest.  I am twenty nine and i have panic disorder and ocd sinc the age of 11.  I was on zoloft fot eight years and recently weaned myself off to try and go it alone.  A week ago all my symptoms returned and I have been having attacks 24/7 since then.  I am so despondent.  I had to drop my online college course, put my part time job on hold and delay my business I’m working on starting.  All I can do is have attacks.  I’m waiting for the zoloft to kick in, but I feel like a failure for having to go back on it.

Hi Augest! You could take a benzodiazepine such as Xanax for your current panic attacks until the Zoloft kicks in. Bet you wouldn’t feel like a failure if you had to go back on  a blood pressure or diabetes med. You might be disappointed, but you wouldn’t feel like a failure. I have a feeling  I will have to be on medication for the rest of my life if I am going to be able to function.

You never know. At this point in time, you have to go back on. I am so sad.  Was I stupid to try and go it alone?  Has anyone else tried and failed?  Please write to me, as I need someone to talk to who understands.

I’ve tried to discontinue meds for panic disorder and depression on several occasions, but find I do best on a combo of Zoloft, desipramine, and Klonopin. Otherwise I start having panic attacks when driving on the freeway and start getting depressed. I’ve been on Zoloft for 10 years, desipramine for about 5 years, and Klonopin for 16 years. I have tried to discontinue all of these meds on one or more occasions and found I needed to stay on them. I think it’s a good idea to try to see how one does off a med from time to time. Also I have always tried to get down to the minimal effective dose for every med I’m on. Always, Augest

Take care (((Augest))) Chip  

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I think it’s a good idea to try to see how one does off a med from time to time. Also I have always tried to get down to the minimal effective dose for every med I’m on. Take care (((Augest))) Chip  

I think you are right, Chip.  A minimal dose is best. I sometimes wonder what this drug is doing to my body longterm which is why I wanted off. I’m taking xanax as I wait for the zoloft to kick in, but it is not working as effectiely as it used to in combating the panic attacks.  I wish I knew why.  Used to be I’d take one pill and sleep like a baby, now it barely effects me.  I guess I’m in for a lot of long nights ahead. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Augest

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I think it’s a good idea to try to see how one does off a med from time to time. Also I have always tried to get down to the minimal effective dose for every med I’m on. I think you are right, Chip.  A minimal dose is best. I sometimes wonder what this drug is doing to my body longterm which is why I wanted off.

That’s understandable. Don’t forget about the adverse effects untreated long term anxiety and depression can have on the body. To say nothing of all the suffering. I’m taking xanax as I wait for the zoloft to kick in, but it is not working as effectiely as it used to in combating the panic attacks.  I wish I knew why.

Maybe when the Zoloft was in effect, you needed less Xanax for anxiety relief. Currently your baseline anxiety level is way up, so you need more Xanax. That should change once the Zoloft kicks in. Used to be I’d take one pill and sleep like a baby, now it barely effects me.  I guess I’m in for a lot of long nights ahead.

I’d use the Xanax in generous enough doses to knock the anxiety level way down and block panic attacks untill the Zoloft kicks in. Chip

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Hi Augest, I’ve been where  you are now. I tried lowering my Zoloft dose a few times to see if I still needed it.  The panic attacks did return at the lower dose. Your body is adjusting to the Zoloft now and that may be adding to your anxiety.  How much Zoloft are you starting at ?  Your "ride" may be smoother if you gradually go up in 50 mg increments every 2 weeks.  If you’re in a hurry and can "tough it out", then maybe you can go up in higher doses.  Follow your doctor’s directions and keep him/her updated. Maybe you need a benzo like clonazepam or xanax to relieve your anxiety right now. Tell your doc how you’re feeling and see what he/she recommends. Take it easy :  ) Tony

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Maybe you need a benzo like clonazepam or xanax to relieve your anxiety right now. Tell your doc how you’re feeling and see what he/she recommends. Take it easy :  ) Tony

Hi Tony, I got the xanax, but it isn’t as effective on me as it used to be.  I’m trying to tough this out.  I’m hoping I can keep my zoloft levels low.  I started at 50mg two days ago.  I can feel the zoloft trying to work, but there just isn’t enough of it in my system yet to be effective.  My doctor said the same thing as you, to increase in two weeks.  I’m going to do that.  I’d like to stay under my old dose of 100mg though.  I didn’t like the side effects.  We’ll see what happens.  Thanks for the support. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Augest

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Hi Tony, I got the xanax, but it isn’t as effective on me as it used to be.  I’m trying to tough this out.  I’m hoping I can keep my zoloft levels low.  I started at 50mg two days ago.  I can feel the zoloft trying to work, but there just isn’t enough of it in my system yet to be effective.  My doctor said the same thing as you, to increase in two weeks.  I’m going to do that.  I’d like to stay under my old dose of 100mg though.  I didn’t like the side effects.  We’ll see what happens.  Thanks for the support. Augest

Hi Augest, I’d hate to throw a monkey wrench into your progress but I have made the switch from Zoloft to Effexor XR because it seemed that Zoloft had stopped working after about 6 years.  This probably won’t happen to you.  I may have just been completely burned out from constant stress at work for many years.  Anyway, I have found that Effexor XR is a very smooth med, does not mute my emotions and doesn’t have sexual side effects. That’s my case, it may not be the same for you.  For instance, I initially went from Zoloft to Lexapro and was incredibly tired all the time from the Lexapro.  You may fare well on Lexapro. Effexor XR is an SNRI (Serotonin and Norepinephrine Reuptake Inhibitor). Good luck with the Zoloft.  100 mg was my therapeutic dose although I did have some success at 50 mg when my stress levels were low. Tony

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i hear alot of this "when i get better", "when i overcome this", "when i feel well"…. what about those of us who have chronic depression, who are born with it, in our genes…..just like alcoholism.. i guess we will never get over it.  i’ve been dealing with it for half of my life, and i’m only 23.  it’s like it’s permantly tattooed…. wait, in reality it is.  it’s even hard when you’re dealing with it on your own.  i’ve gone through the rollarcoaster ride of physically trying to overcome it on my own. after that, i’ve gone through all the rollercoaster rides of self medicating myself with drugs and booze.  after that, i went through the rollercoaster of hibernating myself from society.  after that, and still on the same rollercoaster ride of anti depressant meds….but this last ride i’ve been on hasn’t helped to be honest.  but i’m not giving up hope.  but they only seem to be screwing with my mind more.  if this rollercoaster comes to an end with no luck, THEN WHAT?  i’m getting nausuas with all this rollercoaster talk.  I guess i’m on a very bumpy shitty ride for the rest of my life.   I’m definetely going to stick with my last sober plan though, and just pray for a miracle.  I pray for anyone else out there that is going through this and feels alone.   at one point in my life things were ok.  but for crying out loud, i have a young son, i’m a loner, i’m out of work, i’m not in school and havent’ been for the longest time, i have no friends, i come from a broken family, damn the list goes on and on and on….HOW THE HELL AM I SUPPOSED TO HAVE HOPE?  after hearing some of the stories in here, i wish i could be in some of your shoes believe me george

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i hear alot of this "when i get better", "when i overcome this", "when i feel well"…. what about those of us who have chronic depression, who are born with it, in our genes…..just like alcoholism.. i guess we will never get over it.  i’ve been dealing with it for half of my life, and i’m only 23.  it’s like it’s permantly tattooed…. wait, in reality it is.  it’s even hard when you’re dealing with it on your own.  i’ve gone through the rollarcoaster ride of physically trying to overcome it on my own. after that, i’ve gone through all the rollercoaster rides of self medicating myself with drugs and booze.  after that, i went through the rollercoaster of hibernating myself from society.  after that, and still on the same rollercoaster ride of anti depressant meds….but this last ride i’ve been on hasn’t helped to be honest.  but i’m not giving up hope.  but they only seem to be screwing with my mind more.  if this rollercoaster comes to an end with no luck, THEN WHAT?  i’m getting nausuas with all this rollercoaster talk.  I guess i’m on a very bumpy shitty ride for the rest of my life.   I’m definetely going to stick with my last sober plan though, and just pray for a miracle.  I pray for anyone else out there that is going through this and feels alone.   at one point in my life things were ok.  but for crying out loud, i have a young son, i’m a loner, i’m out of work, i’m not in school and havent’ been for the longest time, i have no friends, i come from a broken family, damn the list goes on and on and on….HOW THE HELL AM I SUPPOSED TO HAVE HOPE?  after hearing some of the stories in here, i wish i could be in some of your shoes believe me george

I’ve also had chronic depression for most of my adult life.  It sucks, especially when rich, famous and/or high status people tell you to get your act together. Self-medicating with drugs/alcohol is very bad.  If it’s a real problem, AA or NA can be a vast help, and helps with providing hope. I’ve found David Burns’s books to be helpful, e.g. Feeling Good – the New Mood Therapy. Most antidepressants haven’t worked for me, but currently I’m on sibutramine Meridia/Reductil), which is a SNRI like venlafaxine (Effexor).  These are good medications for unresponsive chronic depression.  Sibutramine is now marketed as a weight reducing treatment, but was developed as an antidepressant. Exercise and walking very long distances daily (or almost daily) can help a great deal. I think it also helps a lot to bear in mind how fucked up modern-day society really is.  I mean it definitely is, much more than the media or most people talk about.  The media is, of course, a huge part of the problem.  In the medium to long term, there’ll be a huge change for the better in our civilisation.  It’s an inevitability, as part of a very clear historical cycle.  That gives one hope. Those of us with chronic depression just have to keep going and do the best we can to find positive treatments that will help us.

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A new study found that patient complaints of sexual dysfunction caused by antidepressants are almost two times greater than believed by physicians, according to a report presented at the American Psychiatric Association’s annual meeting. Researchers studied 6,297 patients enrolled at 1,101 primary care offices throughout the U.S. and evaluated 10 different new generation antidepressants. Although selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) and serotonin and norephinephrine reuptake inhibitors (SNRIs) are associated with a higher rate of sexual dysfunction, newer antidepressants such as bupropion (Wellbutrin) and nefazodone have shown a lower incidence of the problem. "The SSRIs are known to cause sexual dysfunction as a side effect, but until now, there hasn’t been a study to look at all the new generation antidepressants to see how they compare," said Dr. Anita Clayton, associate professor and vice chair of the Department of Psychiatric Medicine at the University of Virginia and lead investigator of the study. "Physicians and patients are generally reluctant to talk about sexual problems. Therefore, physicians often underestimate the prevalence of antidepressant-associated sexual dysfunction and the impact on patients, as shown in this study." Wellbutrin SR (bupropion HCI) Sustained-Release was associated with the lowest rate of sexual dysfunction (25 percent) after Wellbutrin (bupropion HCI) (22 percent), compared with an average of 40 percent with the SSRIs venlafaxine (Effexor) and mirtazapine (Remeron). The prevalence rate of sexual dysfunction ranged from 7 percent of patients receiving Wellbutrin SR to 23 to 30 percent for patients receiving the other antidepressants, including fluoxetine (Prozac), citalopram (Celexa) and venlafaxine XR. This article is brought to you by the "Depression Week" online newsletter. This newletter presents the latest news and views on developments in Depression, it is one of a family of specialized medical newsletters brought to you by Medical Week, LLC. http://www.depressionweek.org/

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I went on 50mgd Zoloft 3 monthes ago and it has helped me.  Before I went on I had no energy of any kind, sexual or otherwise.  Now I’m back to my oldself.  I guess it just depends upon the person. —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – x-no-archive: yes the pdoc decided not to hospitalize me, as the suicidal impulses have passed for now. instead, she increased my zoloft dose again, renewed my klonny prescription and added trazodone for sleep. hopefully this will help me get eight *consecutive* hours of sleep a night. and i have to go back and see her next week. she also got me set up with a counselor who specializes in self-esteem issues, and my first appointment is February 23rd. if the trazodone doesn’t work, she’ll refer me to the sleep disorder clinic, and i will be spending a few nights there in order for them to find out why i wake up after three hours. thanks, everyone who wished me well. i appreciate it more than i can say. SK SK, I’m on the exact same meds. Took up to three dosage increases to find the right combination for me. 200mg of Zoloft in the morning, along with .05 Klonny; another Klonny around 11:00AM, and a third one around 4:30.  Then, 100mg of Trazadone about an hour before I’m ready to go to sleep. Getting a full night’s sleep was never a problem after my original Traz dose of 50mg was increased to 100mg. Frank i could use a full night’s sleep myself.  what is the klonny like? diana

Diana, Well, the Trazadone is for sleep.  The Klonny is an anti-anxiety med. I find it takes the edge off things, if that makes any sense. I like it, myself. Doesn’t make me tired, or any other side effects; it helps make things tolerable that might otherwise get me frazzled. Frank

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just a quick note on the sleepins meds trazadone always left me doped up the next day i’m on Sonata now, can be taken when you wake up in the middle of the night…just need 4 hrs to be able sleep afterwards i do know meds are very indivual, just thought i’d bring it up

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i’m glad you’re safe, Sunkitty.   hugs, Timmy

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – x-no-archive: yes the pdoc decided not to hospitalize me, as the suicidal impulses have passed for now. instead, she increased my zoloft dose again, renewed my klonny prescription and added trazodone for sleep. hopefully this will help me get eight *consecutive* hours of sleep a night. and i have to go back and see her next week. she also got me set up with a counselor who specializes in self-esteem issues, and my first appointment is February 23rd. if the trazodone doesn’t work, she’ll refer me to the sleep disorder clinic, and i will be spending a few nights there in order for them to find out why i wake up after three hours. thanks, everyone who wished me well. i appreciate it more than i can say. SK SK, I’m on the exact same meds. Took up to three dosage increases to find the right combination for me. 200mg of Zoloft in the morning, along with .05 Klonny; another Klonny around 11:00AM, and a third one around 4:30.  Then, 100mg of Trazadone about an hour before I’m ready to go to sleep. Getting a full night’s sleep was never a problem after my original Traz dose of 50mg was increased to 100mg. Frank

i could use a full night’s sleep myself.  what is the klonny like? diana

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – x-no-archive: yes the pdoc decided not to hospitalize me, as the suicidal impulses have passed for now. instead, she increased my zoloft dose again, renewed my klonny prescription and added trazodone for sleep. hopefully this will help me get eight *consecutive* hours of sleep a night. and i have to go back and see her next week. she also got me set up with a counselor who specializes in self-esteem issues, and my first appointment is February 23rd. if the trazodone doesn’t work, she’ll refer me to the sleep disorder clinic, and i will be spending a few nights there in order for them to find out why i wake up after three hours. thanks, everyone who wished me well. i appreciate it more than i can say. SK

SK, I’m on the exact same meds. Took up to three dosage increases to find the right combination for me. 200mg of Zoloft in the morning, along with .05 Klonny; another Klonny around 11:00AM, and a third one around 4:30.  Then, 100mg of Trazadone about an hour before I’m ready to go to sleep. Getting a full night’s sleep was never a problem after my original Traz dose of 50mg was increased to 100mg. Frank

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Fingers crossed for you!!!!!  =^..^=

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – x-no-archive: yes the pdoc decided not to hospitalize me, as the suicidal impulses have passed for now. instead, she increased my zoloft dose again, renewed my klonny prescription and added trazodone for sleep. hopefully this will help me get eight *consecutive* hours of sleep a night. and i have to go back and see her next week. she also got me set up with a counselor who specializes in self-esteem issues, and my first appointment is February 23rd. if the trazodone doesn’t work, she’ll refer me to the sleep disorder clinic, and i will be spending a few nights there in order for them to find out why i wake up after three hours. thanks, everyone who wished me well. i appreciate it more than i can say. SK x-no-archive is in headers; please respect it. thanks MSN: SunKitten — ICQ: 92790525

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Well, I just had a Dr appt. today and she gave me zoloft. I have also been on xanax for 3 weeks. What will zoloft do for me? side effects? I have panic attacks and depression but they want to work on the panic first. If both drugs are for panic, why do i need both? How will zoloft make me feel? Will i tell a difference?

Zoloft is a SSRI-type antidepressant often prescribed for panic/anxiety (PAD). As PAD and depression are chemical cousins most antidepressants are effectively used for PAD as well. So if you take Zoloft it’s for depression as well as for PAD. Xanax is a benzodazepine (*benzo*, minor tranquillizer) which as a rule works very well for PAD. In the beginning you may experience some drowsiness but that usually subsides. Zoloft, like all AD’s can worsen your symptoms at the beginning when your body is adjusting to it. This is why it’s important to start on a low dose, slowly raise it and have a benzo like Xanax on the side to avoid too much trouble with initial side effects. You don’t say on what dose of Zoloft and Xanax you are now. You should give Zoloft some weeks to kick in. For a trial about eight weeks are necessary. The idea is that you will feel *normal* after some time which may be an enormous relief. A common side effect with Zoloft and other AD’s from the SSRI-group is sexual dysfunction. If you experience that there are some reasonable band-aid solutions for that apart from changing meds of course. Zoloft and Xanax make a good combo, give it enough time, I’d say and have some patience (I *hate* having patience…) Also, I do not work b/c of my panic attacks. I have not worked in 6yrs b/c i had a child and stayed home with him and since Aug 97 my attacks are so bad i CANNOT work. I have no insurance & do not qualify for state & fed. help because I live with my fiance. He makes little so we cannot afford ins. Someone told me to try ssi. Would they help? I have only been on meds for 3 weeks.

Not being from the US I can’t comment on that but others will. Philip

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<snipped The worst side effect a the high dose limits was first a difficulty in achieving orgasm and then over time the inability to have any orgasms at all. I did not have the nausea and headaches that some people experience, even starting at the 50mg and quickly going to 100mg. I’m just giving my experiences. You can expect any of what I and the other posters may experience. We all differ; the side effects differ. JaneG

Hi Jane, I was also on Zoloft for a time, and had the very same S/E. Needless to say, I tossed them out the door. When I asked my Doc about the loss of sexual interest, she kinda laughed and asked me didin’t I know? I told her hell no! So we went on to a new med.Zoloft was the only AD that made me feel this way. Thanks for posting! Stephanie  :-)

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Well, I just had a Dr appt. today and she gave me zoloft. I have also been onxanax for 3 weeks. What will zoloft do for me? side effects? I have panic attacks and depression but they want to work on the panic first. If both drugs are for panic, why do i need both? How will zoloft make me feel? Will i tell a difference? Also, I do not work b/c of my panic attacks. I have not worked in 6yrs b/c i had a child and stayed home with him and since Aug 97 my attacks are so bad i CANNOT work. I have no insurance & do not qualify for state & fed. help because I live with my fiance. He makes little so we cannot afford ins. Someone told me to try ssi. Would they help? I have only been on meds for 3 weeks.

Welcome to ASD I see that others have responded to the differences between the benzos and AD’s, so I’ll share what I can on my personal use of Zoloft. My pdoc started me on 50mg Zoloft gradually increasing to 100 mg in two weeks. That may seem fast to some people here, but I have been on many SSRI’s over the past years, and it seemed about right for me. I had no side effects initially, as some people have mentioned, starting out and then increasing the dose. That is just me though. During the 7 months on Zoloft, I lost 60 pounds, ( I gained 90 on the others, so this was a god send for me). Again, some will expereince weight loss, some no changes, and some of us gain weight on Zoloft. This was the second best SSRI that I have been on in terms of treating the depression, with few side effects, and going beyond by actually making me feel better than "not depressed"; I actually felt "good". Other side effects, were at higher doses, ie. at 200mg and 250mg. They included the inability to cry. No way, just couldn’t do it, even with a death in the family; I appeared stoic. The worst side effect a the high dose limits was first a difficulty in achieving orgasm and then over time the inability to have any orgasms at all. I did not have the nausea and headaches that some people experience, even starting at the 50mg and quickly going to 100mg. I’m just giving my experiences. You can expect any of what I and the other posters may experience. We all differ; the side effects differ. JaneG

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MandMandM3 wrote . What will zoloft do for me? side effects? I’ve Been on 200 mg. of Zoloft of 6 years. My doc started me off slowly, 50mg. increase every 2 weeks.  I didn’t notice any side effects, except a slight losted interest in sex.  It did do wonders for the depression.  The main thing I noticed is that I feed like the same person without the intense depression. Hope it helps you Fred

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<snipped for space Someone told me to try ssi. Would they help? I have only been on meds for 3 weeks.

SSI is a supplemental security program for low income households, you may qualify for this.  SSD is disability and Panic and anxiety both qualify as a disability for this benefit. Call 800-772-1213 and ask about both benefits, you can apply over the phone and when it comes time for the doctors exam one can be sent to your home. Cathy

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Well, I just had a Dr appt. today and she gave me zoloft. I have also been onxanax for 3 weeks. What will zoloft do for me? side effects? I have panic attacks and depression but they want to work on the panic first. If both drugs are for panic, why do i need both? How will zoloft make me feel? Will i tell a difference? Also, I do not work b/c of my panic attacks. I have not worked in 6yrs b/c i had a child and stayed home with him and since Aug 97 my attacks are so bad i CANNOT work. I have no insurance & do not qualify for state & fed. help because I live with my fiance. He makes little so we cannot afford ins. Someone told me to try ssi. Would they help? I have only been on meds for 3 weeks.

Hi and welcome to ASAP, Zoloft is a SSRI antidepressant, whereas Xanax is a benzodiazepine, the same medication family as Valium. So Zoloft should treat both your anxiety and depression. There are several reasons why your doc is suggesting Zoloft instead of Xanax, but the main one is undoubtedly that many doctors (wrongly) treat benzodiazepines with great suspicion. Antidepressants (ADs) do have the advantage that they actually create often long-lasting changes within the brain. It is thought that the reason some of us develop anxiety/panic and/or depression is that our brains fail to correctly adapt to stress. ADs force the required adaption. A couple of things that you should know. First, most doctors suggest a starting dose that is too high for those of us with anx/pan. As a guide, a starting dose of about 1/4 of the smallest tab size is about right for most. In the case of Zoloft thats 1/4 of 50mg. The tabs are already scored to make it easier to divide in half, a pill cutter [from the pharmacy] will make it easier to cut them again.) NOTE: discuss this with your doctor **FIRST** please, **NEVER** make changes without his/her knowledge. ADs, unlike benzos, do not have an immediate effect, the physical changes take time to occur. It can take up to 8 weeks for ADs to ‘kick-in,’ but the average would be 2 to 4 weeks. Many ADs will make the anxiety worse initially, which is one reason that a low initial dose and slow increases are advisable. Having the support of Xanax during this period will make things a lot easier. My last point is that none of these meds are magic bullets. They will help you to stabilise your life and ease your recovery, but you will need to put a lot of effort into this too. Once you are feeling less anxious, talk to your doctor about doing a Cognitive Behaviour Therapy (CBT) course. An explanation of what CBT is all about can be found at:       www.cognitivetherapy.com/fuller.htm Your doctor will be able to recommend a therapist in your area. Good luck Ian

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Well, I just had a Dr appt. today and she gave me zoloft. I have also been on xanax for 3 weeks. What will zoloft do for me? side effects? I have panic attacks and depression but they want to work on the panic first. If both drugs are for panic, why do i need both? How will zoloft make me feel? Will i tell a difference? Also, I do not work b/c of my panic attacks. I have not worked in 6yrs b/c i had a child and stayed home with him and since Aug 97 my attacks are so bad i CANNOT work. I have no insurance & do not qualify for state & fed. help because I live with my fiance. He makes little so we cannot afford ins. Someone told me to try ssi. Would they help? I have only been on meds for 3 weeks.

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I am on xanax & zoloft already. Today my Dr also gave me risperdal. She almost went with lithium. Does anyone know anything about risperdal?

Risperdal is a rather new *antipsychotic*. I feel that anipsychotics have no place in the treatment of anxiety disorders unless at a low dose as an adjunct med for mood swings. Is this why it was prescribed to you? Philip

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Risperdal is a rather new *antipsychotic*. I feel that anipsychotics have no place in the treatment of anxiety disorders unless at a low dose as an adjunct med for mood swings. Is this why it was prescribed to you?

Actually, they can be good for very severe insomnia or agitation…. -elizabeth

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Risperdal is a rather new *antipsychotic*. I feel that anipsychotics have no place in the treatment of anxiety disorders unless at a low dose as an adjunct med for mood swings. Is this why it was prescribed to you? Actually, they can be good for very severe insomnia or agitation…. -elizabeth

As adjunct meds. It is preferable not to address each symptom with a different med. The art of treating PD with meds consists of finding the *right* med and if that’s not possible with *one* med, to proceed from there. Some people seem to be resistant to anti-anxiety meds – a question mark here considering the question whether the diagnosis was right – and that’s where other meds – like antipsychotics – may have to come in but it’s not a first choice by any stretch of the imagination (I recently learned this expression and now I want to use it too;)) Philip

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As adjunct meds. It is preferable not to address each symptom with a different med. The art of treating PD with meds consists of finding the *right* med and if that’s not possible with *one* med, to proceed from there. Some people seem to be resistant to anti-anxiety meds – a question mark here considering the question whether the diagnosis was right – and that’s where other meds – like antipsychotics – may have to come in but it’s not a first choice by any stretch of the imagination (I recently learned this expression and now I want to use

it too;)) Well used You’re right, they’re not first-choice for anxiety, and I don’t know whether there’s any evidence that they will help with "pure" panic. On the other hand, some people who have insomnia that doesn’t go away when the anxiety or mood disorder is treated find that antipsychotics help them sleep and don’t lose effectiveness with time. (I should note that this was not my experience with them, though.) Similarly, some people find that antipsychotics are uniquely efficacious for their particular anxiety. ("Anxiety" being a pretty broad term.) Also bear in mind that PD isn’t the only type of anxiety disorder, and that other anxiety disorders often are responsive to meds that don’t work for PD. (One word: BuSpar.) Since anxiety disorders and other things – depression, bipolar II, personality disorders, etc. – occur together so often, a lot of people do need to use unusual med combinations. -elizabeth

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I am on xanax & zoloft already. Today my Dr also gave me risperdal. She almost went with lithium. Does anyone know anything about risperdal?

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Question:

: Does anyone know the side effects from Prozak? I have been taking 20mg : daily for a couple of months, and have had a mild headache ever since. It’s : kind of like someone is pushing on my head from above! : Jim — Jim, All AD’s usually have some side-effects but they vary according to the person. I took one dose of 20 mg. of Prozac and had an extreme anxiety attack in the middle of the night. Prozac is an SSRI which is one of the newest drugs available and theoretically has fewer side effects than the older tri-cyclics. They don’t seem to have the tendency to sedate or cause dry-mouth and constipation like the older drugs, but I have had some side effects from Zoloft and Serzone which are fairly new as well. Basically any thing that you notice after being on the drug and didn’t have before could be a side-effect. Quite often the side-effects will go away or dissipate over time, sometimes not. Give it 4-6 weeks if it is not severe headache and then decide if it has helped. If not, you should hav e your doctor try another one. Good Luck! Lise,  Guelph, ON Canada

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Does anyone know the side effects of Prozak. I have been on 20mg a day for a couple of months and have had a strange heavy feeling 24 hours a day! Kind of a very mild dull headache. This was similar to the very reason (Symptom) that I was originally given the Prozak for. Any ideas would be great! Please reply by e-mail Jim

I have the same prescription which includes Xanax.  No side effects, except when I take too much alcohol (beer).  Then I get anxious or close to panic.  I was also on 60 mg of Prosac for years and the only side effect was need to sleep and no libido and that was a fair trade-off as far as I was concerned. —

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Does anyone know the side effects from Prozak? I have been taking 20mg daily for a couple of months, and have had a mild headache ever since. It’s kind of like someone is pushing on my head from above! Jim

 I was on Prozac for about 9 months to one year, it was my first AD and I had a hard time with it. I would have a few night mares and would be sexually uninterested if that is what the word would be. It took away my libido and gave me diarea, both of which were uncomfortable for me. I am no longer taking any medications but this summer I want to try to get back on something. I was also taking 20mg, 10 in the mourning and 10 at night. Then I was moved to just 10 a day, in the morning. Later I switched to wellbutrin and then to zoloft. None of these medications worked the way I wished they would have but I am still going to try again. Shane

Response:

Does anyone know the side effects of Prozak. I have been on 20mg a day for a couple of months and have had a strange heavy feeling 24 hours a day! Kind of a very mild dull headache. This was similar to the very reason (Symptom) that I was originally given the Prozak for. Any ideas would be great! Please reply by e-mail Jim

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, Yikes!!!  Yesterday I was ‘locked out’ of newsgroup because of some stuff Worldnet was doing with the Usenet so I am very far behind. I spoke with a woman in Idaho yesterday who wants to write a grant to Albertson’s (a food chain).  Apparently they fund stuff for kids with illnesses.  I was thinking that there must be some kids with generalized who need equipment of some type (ie computers, wheelchairs, etc). Christine needs numbers of kids affected by ITD, numbers from a quotable source.  Also some specifics on what kids might need.  Christine is an adult with torticollis so her knowledge is limited regarding ITD.  I told her I would try to get back to her on Thursday Oct 3rd…thinking I could post yesterday. Anyhow, your expertise would be much appreciated!! Thanks, MBValerie Kinch has a questionnaire on the WWW page and Bob Campbell might be able to help in getting some numbers put together. There is nothing in the literature that gives a number. The only possibility is maybe extrapolating ITD by contacting Chicago getting a percentage and applying it to 300,000 people. I would also contact Mike [of Jeff Harris who has disappeared, why?] and asking for input. Also get your hands on 8 to 18.

Hi Larry, I have 8-18.  I will contact Michael (don’t know what happened to him!). Christine already spoke to Chicago, however she was so vague with them that I am sure that is why they couldn’t help her.  I had to be pretty pushy on the phone just to center her on one topic and I find it hard to be pushy (believe it or not).  TY for the input! MB

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, Yikes!!!  Yesterday I was ‘locked out’ of newsgroup because of some stuff Worldnet was doing with the Usenet so I am very far behind. I spoke with a woman in Idaho yesterday who wants to write a grant to Albertson’s (a food chain).  Apparently they fund stuff for kids with illnesses.  I was thinking that there must be some kids with generalized who need equipment of some type (ie computers, wheelchairs, etc). Christine needs numbers of kids affected by ITD, numbers from a quotable source.  Also some specifics on what kids might need.  Christine is an adult with torticollis so her knowledge is limited regarding ITD.  I told her I would try to get back to her on Thursday Oct 3rd…thinking I could post yesterday. Anyhow, your expertise would be much appreciated!! Thanks, MBValerie Kinch has a questionnaire on the WWW page and Bob Campbell might

be able to help in getting some numbers put together. There is nothing in the literature that gives a number. The only possibility is maybe extrapolating ITD by contacting Chicago getting a percentage and applying it to 300,000 people. I would also contact Mike [of Jeff Harris who has disappeared, why?] and asking for input. Also get your hands on 8 to 18.

Response:

Hi All, Yikes!!!  Yesterday I was ‘locked out’ of newsgroup because of some stuff Worldnet was doing with the Usenet so I am very far behind. I spoke with a woman in Idaho yesterday who wants to write a grant to Albertson’s (a food chain).  Apparently they fund stuff for kids with illnesses.  I was thinking that there must be some kids with generalized who need equipment of some type (ie computers, wheelchairs, etc).   Christine needs numbers of kids affected by ITD, numbers from a quotable source.  Also some specifics on what kids might need.  Christine is an adult with torticollis so her knowledge is limited regarding ITD.  I told her I would try to get back to her on Thursday Oct 3rd…thinking I could post yesterday. Anyhow, your expertise would be much appreciated!! Thanks, MB

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, Yikes!!!  Yesterday I was ‘locked out’ of newsgroup because of some stuff Worldnet was doing with the Usenet so I am very far behind. I spoke with a woman in Idaho yesterday who wants to write a grant to Albertson’s (a food chain).  Apparently they fund stuff for kids with illnesses.  I was thinking that there must be some kids with generalized who need equipment of some type (ie computers, wheelchairs, etc). Christine needs numbers of kids affected by ITD, numbers from a quotable source.  Also some specifics on what kids might need.  Christine is an adult with torticollis so her knowledge is limited regarding ITD.  I told her I would try to get back to her on Thursday Oct 3rd…thinking I could post yesterday. Anyhow, your expertise would be much appreciated!! Thanks, MBValerie Kinch has a questionnaire on the WWW page and Bob Campbell might be able to help in getting some numbers put together. There is nothing in the literature that gives a number. The only possibility is maybe extrapolating ITD by contacting Chicago getting a percentage and applying it to 300,000 people. I would also contact Mike [of Jeff Harris who has disappeared, why?] and asking for input. Also get your hands on 8 to 18.

I’m here, Larry – just been busy so my posts have been few and far between.  Michael has not been "on line" for a while, but it you have anything for him send it to me and I’ll pass it along.  (BTW, MEDICALLY he’s been doing VERY well.  Today was a "spasmy" day, but on Rosh Hashana he STOOD on the Bima and helped lead the prayers in Junior Congregation!  (His Bar Mitzvah is a year away). As far as statistics, neither he nor I would have anything.  The best person I can think of for extrapolating numbers might be Debbie DeLeon.  I’m sure in doing the genetic models she must have percentages.  The other person who might have something would be Ron Cabay, the Childrens Advocacy leader. Jeff H.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, Yikes!!!  Yesterday I was ‘locked out’ of newsgroup because of some stuff Worldnet was doing with the Usenet so I am very far behind. I spoke with a woman in Idaho yesterday who wants to write a grant to Albertson’s (a food chain).  Apparently they fund stuff for kids with illnesses.  I was thinking that there must be some kids with generalized who need equipment of some type (ie computers, wheelchairs, etc). Christine needs numbers of kids affected by ITD, numbers from a quotable source.  Also some specifics on what kids might need.  Christine is an adult with torticollis so her knowledge is limited regarding ITD.  I told her I would try to get back to her on Thursday Oct 3rd…thinking I could post yesterday. Anyhow, your expertise would be much appreciated!! Thanks, MBValerie Kinch has a questionnaire on the WWW page and Bob Campbell might be able to help in getting some numbers put together. There is nothing in the literature that gives a number. The only possibility is maybe extrapolating ITD by contacting Chicago getting a percentage and applying it to 300,000 people. I would also contact Mike [of Jeff Harris who has disappeared, why?] and asking for input. Also get your hands on 8 to 18. Hi Larry, I have 8-18.  I will contact Michael (don’t know what happened to him!). Christine already spoke to Chicago, however she was so vague with them that I am sure that is why they couldn’t help her.  I had to be pretty pushy on the phone just to center her on one topic and I find it hard to be pushy (believe it or not).  TY for the input! MB

How about writing the NIH? Nationa Institute of Neuro Disorders and Stroke Building 10,  Room 5N226 10 CENTER DR. MISC 1428 BETHESDA MD 20892-1428 Phone (301)496-1561  (before 8 AM in CA it’s cheap and good time to get them back East.

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It is a horrible feeling of extreme isolation when looked out of this news group.  I understand how you felt.   I’m so glad your fund-raising dinner went well.  Good Job!  And to top it off, you were able to spend som quality time with Jennifer.   Now, to your needed suggestions.  Somewhere in the archieves for this newsgroup, I remember reading about one of the children with ITD needing voice activated software, like Dragon Dictate.  It is a wonderful program for someone who has limited mobility using their arms, hands, and shoulder area.  I have the program, because for a while I could barely use my right arm and hand.  It is very easy for a non-computer literate person to learn to use. (More complicated for us old-timers who are stuck in our ways.) It runs with most windows based programs, so a child would have access to programs for doing their homework as well as playing a few games.  It runs about $500 to $600 for a start-up set of disks, which has a smaller dictionary.  The dictionary would be adequate for most grade school and high school students.  The program can be added to, if the child decided to attend college and needed a larger vocabulary.  I believe there is only the PC version available, but checking with Dragon Dictate would clarify whether or not there is a Mac version.  I believe it is useable on laptops with enough memory installed, so a child could use it both at school and home.  Information can be obtained from Dragon Systems, Inc., 320 Nevada Street, Newton, MA 02160, Tel (617) 965-5200, Fax (617) 527-0372. Hope this helps. Sherrie

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It is a horrible feeling of extreme isolation when looked out of this news group.  I understand how you felt.   I’m so glad your fund-raising dinner went well.  Good Job!  And to top it off, you were able to spend som quality time with Jennifer.   Now, to your needed suggestions.  Somewhere in the archieves for this newsgroup, I remember reading about one of the children with ITD needing voice activated software, like Dragon Dictate.  It is a wonderful program for someone who has limited mobility using their arms, hands, and shoulder area.  I have the program, because for a while I could barely use my right arm and hand.  It is very easy for a non-computer literate person to learn to use. (More complicated for us old-timers who are stuck in our ways.) It runs with most windows based programs, so a child would have access to programs for doing their homework as well as playing a few games.  It runs about $500 to $600 for a start-up set of disks, which has a smaller dictionary.  The dictionary would be adequate for most grade school and high school students.  The program can be added to, if the child decided to attend college and needed a larger vocabulary.  I believe there is only the PC version available, but checking with Dragon Dictate would clarify whether or not there is a Mac version.  I believe it is useable on laptops with enough memory installed, so a child could use it both at school and home.  Information can be obtained from Dragon Systems, Inc., 320 Nevada Street, Newton, MA 02160, Tel (617) 965-5200, Fax (617) 527-0372. Hope this helps. Sherrie

Thanks so much, Sherrie!!  I am supposed to phone Chris today and I will most definitely give her this info.  I also remember that topic, now that you have jogged my memory…it gets harder and harder, the older one becomes <<VBG I really enjoyed the time with Jennifer…she is such a doll.  I refuse to use the word ’success’ yet in describing the event.  Perhaps in time and with some perspective, my attitude will change.  Right now I desparately need a ‘holiday from dystonia’. Take care, sweetheart! MB

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Hi! This is an informal survey of who among us Dystonia sufferers are still driving and who were forced to surrender their driver’s license. Please answer the following questions  truthfully: 1) Do you still drive despite your dystonia?   Yes            No 2) What type of dystonia do you have? 3) Did anyone of you lose your driver’s license because of your illness, dystonia? 4) To those who lost their license, were you able to get one again? I am making this informal survey because I am about to lose my license simply because my primary physician or any physician I know does not want to vouch for me that I am "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely? I don’t know what I will do without a driver’s license. I am very depressed.

Hi, Ador.  I’m a parent – not a patient – and Michael is only 12, so my answer to your survey wouldn’t be meaningful; but a couple of suggestions: Plan A – Ways you might keep your license: 1) Contact the Independent Living Center in your area.  There are driving programs/drivers ed programs especially designed for people with disabilities ("PWD") , and also specialized equipment that enables many PWD to operate a vehicle safely.  This training might convince your doctor; OR maybe they know a doctor who is more sensitive on the issues. 2) Discuss this with your Movement Disorder neurologist – NOT your primary care physician.   3) Contact some of the dealers of Adapted Vehicles and Equipment for suggestions. Keep in touch!  Maybe we can come up with other ideas LOL– Jeff H.

Response:

Hi! This is an informal survey of who among us Dystonia sufferers are still driving and who were forced to surrender their driver’s license. Please answer the following questions  truthfully: 1) Do you still drive despite your dystonia?   Yes            No 2) What type of dystonia do you have? 3) Did anyone of you lose your driver’s license because of your illness, dystonia? 4) To those who lost their license, were you able to get one again? I am making this informal survey because I am about to lose my license simply because my primary physician or any physician I know does not want to vouch for me that I am "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely? I don’t know what I will do without a driver’s license. I am very depressed.

Ador, I am hearing your ‘fear’ of becoming dependent, rather than remaining independent.  I am concerned.  I have generalized dystonia and must use a walker to get around, but I have driven for years with no questions from doctors or our CA Motor Vehicle Dept.  You have lingual dystonia, isn’t that right?  Does it impair your ability to drive?  I cannot quite visualize that…please help us understand so that we can help, OK?  We are HERE for you, Ador!  Please talk with us, OK? Love, MB

Response:

Hi! This is an informal survey of who among us Dystonia sufferers are still driving and who were forced to surrender their driver’s license. Please answer the following questions  truthfully: 1) Do you still drive despite your dystonia?   Yes            No 2) What type of dystonia do you have? 3) Did anyone of you lose your driver’s license because of your illness, dystonia? 4) To those who lost their license, were you able to get one again? I am making this informal survey because I am about to lose my license simply because my primary physician or any physician I know does not want to vouch for me that I am "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely? I don’t know what I will do without a driver’s license. I am very depressed.

Response:

Hi! This is an informal survey of who among us Dystonia sufferers are still driving and who were forced to surrender their driver’s license. Please answer the following questions  truthfully: 1) Do you still drive despite your dystonia?   Yes            No 2) What type of dystonia do you have? 3) Did anyone of you lose your driver’s license because of your illness, dystonia? 4) To those who lost their license, were you able to get one again? I am making this informal survey because I am about to lose my license simply because my primary physician or any physician I know does not want to vouch for me that I am "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely? I don’t know what I will do without a driver’s license. I am very depressed.

(emailed as well as posted) Hi Ador: Yes, I still drive.  I have ST.  I also have panic disorder with severe depressive episodes and Essential Tremor.  So I shake like a leaf most of the time and my head nid-nods, panic attacks can be *hell* and sometimes I can slide into a big, black hole of depresssion.  And if someone even *hinted* that I should lose my license because of any or all of that, you would hear the explosion all the way from BC Canada!  ): That depression is probably our worst enemy, because it just takes away the energy to enjoy anything and turns everything grey.  But it’s part of our being affected with disabling disorders you know.  Everything I’ve read says that we have to be aware that this can strike at us, my specialist says the same thing. PLEASE take steps to get some treatment for your depression ASAP.  It makes all the difference, I promise you.  Ask your specialist or your MD to refer you to a specialist in mood disorders so that you can get the help you need.  I know it’s hellish, but it’s a *symptom* and not a true emotion of the real you.  You need to hang on to that Ador, the depression is a symptom and can be cured – the way it makes you feel is not really you at all. As far as the license goes, a primare care physician is not capable of making that kind of decision.  Only a specialist in dystonia can do so.  Fight off that depression, pick up the phone and call a lawyer (Legal Aide if necessary) if you have to.  But FIRST get the appointment arranged for help with the depression. THEN do battle with the bureaucrats if you have to, you’ll more than likely be helping someone else who is unable to take on that battle who has run into the same discrimination.  Put on that red suit with the big yellow S on it!  :)  And after you read this, go subscribe to alt.support.depression – some wonderful, *caring* people there. Hope that helps a little.  Give ‘em HELL Ador. Mally  :)  (Who hopes Ador will not be offended by Mally in a bossy mood…who gets that way when she’s worried about someone.)

Response:

Hi Ador: I just had to stick my two cents in here.  I have two friends who come to mind when I read your posting.  One has CP, very bad spasms all the time, and this coupled with the fact that she’s now 73 years old.  The other was a Thalidamide (sp) baby, she’s now 46, has no arms nor legs. Both are still driving.  They didn’t have to get permission from their doctors or have them vouch for them.  This is in Texas so I don’t know about other states – but both took the driver’s test – both drive specially equiped vehicles – and drive under handicapped license plates. They had no problems as long as they could pass the exam. I know it is a major adjustment when we loose our ability to do things that we used to do – and I might add – took for granted – at least I certainly did.  And of course in the case of ones ability to get in their car and go when they want to would be hard to give up.  I understand that – I watched this happen with my father.  But Ador, he had to ask himself and be honest with himself on the answer of "Was he still able to drive safely".  Hard question for one to answer and be honest about it as it was (for him) letting go of his independence in having his own car, etc.  I’m not saying that you’re in this situation but it’s something to think about for all of us as we age, loose eyesight, whatever. Have you checked with your states requirements on this and if you were able to pass a drivers test would you have to get a doctors voucher? What about contacting your states organization for people with disabilities – I am sure they have one – I know this thought is depressing to you.  It would be to anyone – BUT – you can overcome this obsticle – do some research on it – Mally had a great point that a primary physician really doesn’t know the ins and outs of dystnia – mine only knows what I’ve told him – You’ve got a world of folks out here who you don’t even know Ador and we’re all pulling for you.  Hang in there and explore other avenues – you never know what your going to find around that corner. Good luck and big hugs from South Texas – Anne Here in San Antonio, we have wonderful bus services for people with disabilities.  It is a blessing for those who either can’t drive anymore or who never drove. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi! This is an informal survey of who among us Dystonia sufferers are still driving and who were forced to surrender their driver’s license. Please answer the following questions  truthfully: 1) Do you still drive despite your dystonia?   Yes            No 2) What type of dystonia do you have? 3) Did anyone of you lose your driver’s license because of your illness, dystonia? 4) To those who lost their license, were you able to get one again? I am making this informal survey because I am about to lose my license simply because my primary physician or any physician I know does not want to vouch for me that I am "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely? I don’t know what I will do without a driver’s license. I am very depressed. (emailed as well as posted) Hi Ador: Yes, I still drive.  I have ST.  I also have panic disorder with severe depressive episodes and Essential Tremor.  So I shake like a leaf most of the time and my head nid-nods, panic attacks can be *hell* and sometimes I can slide into a big, black hole of depresssion.  And if someone even *hinted* that I should lose my license because of any or all of that, you would hear the explosion all the way from BC Canada!  ): That depression is probably our worst enemy, because it just takes away the energy to enjoy anything and turns everything grey.  But it’s part of our being affected with disabling disorders you know.  Everything I’ve read says that we have to be aware that this can strike at us, my specialist says the same thing. PLEASE take steps to get some treatment for your depression ASAP.  It makes all the difference, I promise you.  Ask your specialist or your MD to refer you to a specialist in mood disorders so that you can get the help you need.  I know it’s hellish, but it’s a *symptom* and not a true emotion of the real you.  You need to hang on to that Ador, the depression is a symptom and can be cured – the way it makes you feel is not really you at all. As far as the license goes, a primare care physician is not capable of making that kind of decision.  Only a specialist in dystonia can do so.  Fight off that depression, pick up the phone and call a lawyer (Legal Aide if necessary) if you have to.  But FIRST get the appointment arranged for help with the depression. THEN do battle with the bureaucrats if you have to, you’ll more than likely be helping someone else who is unable to take on that battle who has run into the same discrimination.  Put on that red suit with the big yellow S on it!  :)  And after you read this, go subscribe to alt.support.depression – some wonderful, *caring* people there. Hope that helps a little.  Give ‘em HELL Ador. Mally  :)  (Who hopes Ador will not be offended by Mally in a bossy mood…who gets that way when she’s worried about someone.)

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi! This is an informal survey of who among us Dystonia sufferers are still driving and who were forced to surrender their driver’s license. Please answer the following questions  truthfully: 1) Do you still drive despite your dystonia?   Yes            No 2) What type of dystonia do you have? 3) Did anyone of you lose your driver’s license because of your illness, dystonia? 4) To those who lost their license, were you able to get one again? I am making this informal survey because I am about to lose my license simply because my primary physician or any physician I know does not want to vouch for me that I am "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely? I don’t know what I will do without a driver’s license. I am very depressed. (emailed as well as posted) Hi Ador: Yes, I still drive.  I have ST.  I also have panic disorder with severe depressive episodes and Essential Tremor.  So I shake like a leaf most of the time and my head nid-nods, panic attacks can be *hell* and sometimes I can slide into a big, black hole of depresssion.  And if someone even *hinted* that I should lose my license because of any or all of that, you would hear the explosion all the way from BC Canada!  ): That depression is probably our worst enemy, because it just takes away the energy to enjoy anything and turns everything grey.  But it’s part of our being affected with disabling disorders you know.  Everything I’ve read says that we have to be aware that this can strike at us, my specialist says the same thing. PLEASE take steps to get some treatment for your depression ASAP.  It makes all the difference, I promise you.  Ask your specialist or your MD to refer you to a specialist in mood disorders so that you can get the help you need.  I know it’s hellish, but it’s a *symptom* and not a true emotion of the real you.  You need to hang on to that Ador, the depression is a symptom and can be cured – the way it makes you feel is not really you at all. As far as the license goes, a primare care physician is not capable of making that kind of decision.  Only a specialist in dystonia can do so.  Fight off that depression, pick up the phone and call a lawyer (Legal Aide if necessary) if you have to.  But FIRST get the appointment arranged for help with the depression. THEN do battle with the bureaucrats if you have to, you’ll more than likely be helping someone else who is unable to take on that battle who has run into the same discrimination.  Put on that red suit with the big yellow S on it!  :)  And after you read this, go subscribe to alt.support.depression – some wonderful, *caring* people there. Hope that helps a little.  Give ‘em HELL Ador. Mally  :)  (Who hopes Ador will not be offended by Mally in a bossy mood…who gets that way when she’s worried about someone.)

Blessings Mally MB

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Hi! This is an informal survey of who among us Dystonia sufferers are still driving and who were forced to surrender their driver’s license. Please answer the following questions  truthfully: 1) Do you still drive despite your dystonia?   Yes            No 2) What type of dystonia do you have? 3) Did anyone of you lose your driver’s license because of your illness, dystonia? 4) To those who lost their license, were you able to get one again? I am making this informal survey because I am about to lose my license simply because my primary physician or any physician I know does not want to vouch for me that I am "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely? I don’t know what I will do without a driver’s license. I am very depressed.

Hi Ador. I suppose your GP is afraid of your leg dystonia.  I wouldn’t take his word. I have lingual dystonia but I also react with a wild general myoconic motions in all parts of m body when a certain sound is heard.  If first happened on an evoked potential test, then on MRI and sometimes it happens listening to music, altho on that if I can get to the raido soon enough no lasting harm done. Howeverer I insisted on showing my present Neuro what happens on the sound of the Evoked Potentials.  He knows other sounds d it too but he hasnever pulled my license. Suggest you go on your neuro’s decission. Catherine

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Hi! This is an informal survey of who among us Dystonia sufferers are still driving and who were forced to surrender their driver’s license. Please answer the following questions  truthfully: 1) Do you still drive despite your dystonia?   Yes            No 2) What type of dystonia do you have? 3) Did anyone of you lose your driver’s license because of your illness, dystonia? 4) To those who lost their license, were you able to get one again? I am making this informal survey because I am about to lose my license simply because my primary physician or any physician I know does not want to vouch for me that I am "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely? I don’t know what I will do without a driver’s license. I am very depressed.

Hi, The answer to question #1 isn’t applicable to me as I never had a driver’s lincense, and I’m 55 yrs old.  I did take driving lessons a couple of yrs ago — and I was doing quite well with the instructor I had, but unfortunately he quit his job just as I was gaining self-confidence…  I didn’t do anything to him for him to quit the job…  <g.  So, I never pursued my ‘dream’ for a driver’s lincense after this episode.  I could have gone to my state’s (Maryland) rehab center for driving lesons — I tried it once, but didn’t like the "snob" of instructor that was doing the teaching…  This brings to mind a question you — have u looked into your state’s rehab center — they could retrian you?  Why not write a letter to your congressman and see what he/she could do for you in issueing another driver’s license?  I know the feeling fof rejection.  You aren’t alone in this… The answer to question #2:  I have cerebral palsy  and generalized dystonia .  I can do anything I make up my mind to do.  If I want to do something — nothing stands in my way!  So, if you’re about to lose your license — why don’t ‘fight’ for it?  I have to fight for eveything I want — that’s the way the ball bounces.  I wished I didn’t have to fight for everything, but I do — to keep above board…  :-) Sorry, I can’t answer questions 3 & 4. There, I’ve said my 2 cents worth!  I *love* surveys!!… Cheerio, Becky

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Mally, bless you for the caring response to Ador about  her license and depression.  You said it all!! (I am on AOL and know how to "quote" when replying to e-mail but when in n/g it does not quote the same way; sorry) BTW, finally, met someone else with dystonia!!! Thru my dr., I have met another patient and had dinner with him and his wife Saturday.  What a joy for both of us. He is 62 with no computer and was fascinated by my telling him all I have found. You can be sure I will print some of these posts from a.s.d. to show him what a caring group can be found online. It really has helped my depression knowing every morning I can go to a.s.d. and "be" with others who truly know and understand. Love & Hugs,  Bonnie (hey, Texas is drying out!

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Dear MB, I think you are right. I have "fear" of becoming dependent rather than being indepen- dent which implies, among other things, the freedom to drive anywhere I please. I have generalized dystonia. I have dystonia of the foot but my neuro,a movement disorder specialist, says that my right leg is rigid only when I walk. Dystonia does not manifest itself or bother me when I am sitting or lying down so it does not affect my driving. I do use two canes when walking but that is to help me maintain my balance. I also have lingual dystonia which has caused me speech, chewing and swallowing difficulties—which do not affect my driving. The request for a medical examination report came about as a result of a minor vehicular accident wherein I caused a few scratches on the right rear side of the   other   vehicle involved. This was my first accident since I started driving here in the US in 1983 and since I was diagnosed with dystonia in 1991.DMV sent me a medical examination report for me and my doctor to accomplish to determine whether I am medically and physically fit to drive a motor vehicle safely. I went to my HMO (U.S. Healthcare) primary physician and asked him to fill up the report but he declined saying that since my illness is neurological in nature, I should ask my neurologist to accomplish the report. When we left his clinic, I was very depressed and I literally cried in the car going home because I knew that I stand to lose my driver’s license if I cannot find a doctor who will vouch for me as "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely."  I don’t know what I will do without a car. I am sure my depression will become worse if I become homebound. I have been driving a lot before the accident but since that accident, I think I have used the car only twice a week. I believe I am a careful driver because I have never been involved in an accident nor received a ticket for traffic violation since 1991 and 1983.      

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(U.S. Healthcare) primary physician and asked him to fill up the report but he declined saying that since my illness is neurological in nature, I should ask my neurologist to accomplish the report. When we left his clinic, I was very depressed and I literally cried in the car going home because I knew that I stand to lose my driver’s license if I cannot find a doctor who will vouch for me as "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely."

Have you been to see your neuro yet?  Seems that since, as you said, your leg is only rigid when you’re standing, he should have no problem in filling out the form for you and getting you back behind the wheel. It’s easy to right away worry about the "worst case" scenario, and becomse quite upset and depressed, but often things turn out to be not that bad (as we hope is the case in this situation!). Do keep us posted as to your neuro’s decision. Cathy. —  (—-)                                                     (—-)   "  "         http://www.cuug.ab.ca:8001/~collisoc          "  "

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear MB, I think you are right. I have "fear" of becoming dependent rather than being indepen- dent which implies, among other things, the freedom to drive anywhere I please. I have generalized dystonia. I have dystonia of the foot but my neuro,a movement disorder specialist, says that my right leg is rigid only when I walk. Dystonia does not manifest itself or bother me when I am sitting or lying down so it does not affect my driving. I do use two canes when walking but that is to help me maintain my balance. I also have lingual dystonia which has caused me speech, chewing and swallowing difficulties—which do not affect my driving. The request for a medical examination report came about as a result of a minor vehicular accident wherein I caused a few scratches on the right rear side of the   other   vehicle involved. This was my first accident since I started driving here in the US in 1983 and since I was diagnosed with dystonia in 1991.DMV sent me a medical examination report for me and my doctor to accomplish to determine whether I am medically and physically fit to drive a motor vehicle safely. I went to my HMO (U.S. Healthcare) primary physician and asked him to fill up the report but he declined saying that since my illness is neurological in nature, I should ask my neurologist to accomplish the report. When we left his clinic, I was very depressed and I literally cried in the car going home because I knew that I stand to lose my driver’s license if I cannot find a doctor who will vouch for me as "medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely."  I don’t know what I will do without a car. I am sure my depression will become worse if I become homebound. I have been driving a lot before the accident but since that accident, I think I have used the car only twice a week. I believe I am a careful driver because I have never been involved in an accident nor received a ticket for traffic violation since 1991 and 1983.      

Dear Ador, You have made my day by responding to all of us here on a.s.d. I want you to listen carefully!  I use a walker to get around due to generalized dystonia.  I have driven since 1962 and have been lucky to have had no accidents yet [knock on wood!].  I also am relaxed when sitting down so driving is not a problem for me.  I caught something in your other post that waved a major red flag to me…you said that you have Parkinson’s…perhaps that is part of the problem now because Parkinson’s is a progressive disease that leads to severe immobility and eventual death.  Dystonia is a damn nuisance, but does not kill us! Would Mitchel Brin be willing to fill out the form for you?  He apparently acknowledges that sitting & driving are no problem for you. Perhaps some of our NY connections on asd will have some suggestions!  It might be worth the trip to Columbia to attempt to get this resolved!  I am certain that you are a careful driver…I kinda think I am careful because I value my freedom to drive too much to risk throwing it away.   Maybe even a trip to your DMV office with info on dystonia [print out some stuff from the web pages http://www.ziplink.net/users/dystonia] and FIGHT for your license, Ador, knowing that there are a whole bunch of us here supporting you! Please keep us posted and Best Of Luck…I know you can do it, Ador!!! Much Love, MB

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Dear A.S.D. friends: I was overwhelmed by the response to my post re driver’s license for dystonia patients.. Thank you to all those who responded. I was deeply touched. But in my haste to post "Driver’s license for dystonia patients" I failed to include some valuable information which may change your opinion. Even so, I want to be honest to you. The request for Medical Examination from DMV was the result of a minor vehicu- lar accident I was involved in last December 28, 1966. I was driving south on Moonachie road at about 35 mph when a north-bound car swerved to the left into the driveway of Segovia Restaurant. I didn’t see it swerve to the left and I didn’t notice if the other car gave a warning signal. Half of the car body was inside the driveway when I noticed it. But considering the speed at which the other car entered the driveway, I thought that my speed was slow enough to pass the other car safely. But instead of moving on, the other  car suddenly stopped with its rear end protruding. When I saw the other car not moving and its rear end in my path, I hit the brake but the road was wet, my car skidded and struck the rear right side of the other car. The police report said I was trying to beat the other car in getting into the driveway but this is not true. I was going home which is one block away from the site of the accident. I think the reason the other car stopped abruptly is that the other driver realized he entered the wrong way. He entered the driveway exit instead of the entrance to the one-way driveway. The police noticed I was using two canes to walk and he asked me about my medical condition. I told him I have Parkinson’s disease. The police sent a copy of the report to DMV. The DMV sent me a medical examination report which they want me and "my doctor" to accomplish to determine whether I am medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely". I went to my US Healthcare (HMO) primary physician and asked him to accomplish the report but he declined saying that since my illness is neurological in nature, he thinks a neurologist should accomplish the report. When we left his clinic, I was very depressed and I literally cried in the car going home because I knew I stand to lose my driver’s license if I cannot find a doctor who will certify that I am mentally and physically fit to drive. I strongly believe I am mentally and physically fit to drive because I did a lot of driving last year, driving as far north as Paramus which is 10 miles away from home. I can still do it in my present condition. I also believe I am a careful driver but for this accident last Dec. 28, 1996, I think the other driver is partly to blame. I never had an accident before, not even a ticket for a traffic violation. This accident was my first since I started driving in the US IN 1983. I continued to drive even after I was diagnosed with dystonia in 1991. My illness, dystonia of the foot makes walking very difficult for me but not driving. Dr. M. Brin of Mount Sinai Medical Center said my right leg is rigid only when I am walking, but not when I am at rest. My foot dystonia does not manifest itself or bother me when I am sitting or lying down. Hence, it does not affect my driving.         I use two canes when walking to help  me maintain my balance. My tongue dystonia does not interrfere with my driving although it caused me speech, chewing and swallowing difficulty. My illness has some features of Parkinson’s disease and examples of those symptoms are drooling, impaired speech and balance problem–all of which do not affect my driving. I am willing to take driving test for physically challenged people. I am not new to this kind of test. I was given a "Behind-the-wheel evaluation training program" by an Adaptive Driving Specialist from DMV after I completed my physical and speech therapy at Kessler Institute for Rehabilitation in 1993. I passed the test. The Adaptive Driving Specialist makes suggestions for changes/additions or adaptive measures for  cars of people with disabilities so they can continue to drive. My ADS said my car did not need any. Before I can take a new driving test, I need a doctor to certify that I am medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely. If I can’t   get one, I will lose my license by March 18, 1997. I don’t want to be homebound by being denied the privilege to drive. If I become homebound, I am sure my depression will become worse. I just sent my request to my neuro the medical examination report but I am not sure she will agree to accomplish it. I guess doctors are afraid of legal suits if something happens to somebody they certified as medically and physically able to drive a motor vehicle safely. Thank you all for your support and prayers. Ador Peralta

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (I am on AOL and know how to "quote" when replying to e-mail but when in n/g it does not quote the same way; sorry) Hey, Bonnie. I’m on AOL too and have finally figured it out.  When in doubt, read the directions. If you want it to look like what you wrote above, click on Members, then Preferences, then Mail.  Take the ‘x’ off of "Use AOL style quotes."  Then, when you w I’m still contemplating on your idea of an AOL chat group.  There’s something that ‘doesn’t feel right’ about it but I don’t know what it is.  You, of course, Still getting over my p-neumonia but much better, Chana Mitzvah g’dolah l’hiyot b’simcha. "It is a great mitzvah to exist in a state of joy." Mass General has chat rooms open all the time for neuro patients.  There is one reserved for movement disorders.  We can set up a time and meet there if anyone is interested.  No Ports, No servers , etc.   Easy on and eas off if it doesn’t work.  I’m availabe most times.  Any suggestions on meting times.?

And yet another suggestion, check out the new IRCing program called Orbit IRC. It’s very much a WYSIWYG program, all set out for you.  You can give each person a different colour or font, all kinds of neat stuff useable with just a click. It’s shareware and you can download it from their site.  Sorry, don’t have URL handy, but just do a search on it. Mally  :)

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (I am on AOL and know how to "quote" when replying to e-mail but when in n/g it does not quote the same way; sorry) Hey, Bonnie. I’m on AOL too and have finally figured it out.  When in doubt, read the directions. If you want it to look like what you wrote above, click on Members, then Preferences, then Mail.  Take the ‘x’ off of "Use AOL style quotes."  Then, when you w I’m still contemplating on your idea of an AOL chat group.  There’s something that ‘doesn’t feel right’ about it but I don’t know what it is.  You, of course, Still getting over my p-neumonia but much better, Chana Mitzvah g’dolah l’hiyot b’simcha. "It is a great mitzvah to exist in a state of joy."

Mass General has chat rooms open all the time for neuro patients.  There is one reserved for movement disorders.  We can set up a time and meet there if anyone is interested.  No Ports, No servers , etc.   Easy on and eas off if it doesn’t work.  I’m availabe most times.  Any suggestions on meting times.? Catherine

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(I am on AOL and know how to "quote" when replying to e-mail but when in n/g it does not quote the same way; sorry)

Hey, Bonnie. I’m on AOL too and have finally figured it out.  When in doubt, read the directions. If you want it to look like what you wrote above, click on Members, then Preferences, then Mail.  Take the ‘x’ off of "Use AOL style quotes."  Then, when you want to quote … either in e-mail or n/gs … just highlight what you want and hit Reply.  BTW, this is called ‘Internet style quoting.’ I’m still contemplating on your idea of an AOL chat group.  There’s something that ‘doesn’t feel right’ about it but I don’t know what it is.  You, of course, are free to do what you want but you wouldn’t be ’sanctioned’ by DMRF or a.s.d. I don’t think.  Are  you having trouble with mIRC or, like for me, it’s almost too busy to follow and talk at the same time with all those people? Still getting over my p-neumonia but much better, Chana Mitzvah g’dolah l’hiyot b’simcha. "It is a great mitzvah to exist in a state of joy."

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mally, bless you for the caring response to Ador about  her license and depression.  You said it all!! (I am on AOL and know how to "quote" when replying to e-mail but when in n/g it does not quote the same way; sorry) BTW, finally, met someone else with dystonia!!! Thru my dr., I have met another patient and had dinner with him and his wife Saturday.  What a joy for both of us. He is 62 with no computer and was fascinated by my telling him all I have found. You can be sure I will print some of these posts from a.s.d. to show him what a caring group can be found online. It really has helped my depression knowing every morning I can go to a.s.d. and "be" with others who truly know and understand. Love & Hugs,  Bonnie (hey, Texas is drying out!

Hi Bonnie!  I am so very glad that you have met another person with dystonia…it took me 40 years to find another!!  Just a slight correction if ya don’t mind!  Ador is a ‘he’, not a ’she’!  In fact I wonder how he is doing??  Ador, how about an update?? Later, MB

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