Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen

Karen, I have 2 suggestions: 1.     Fly home for a visit.  The sooner you face the fear, the sooner you get over it.  A benzo can help. 2.     If you just can’t get on the plane, take the bus.  It takes longer but It still gets you there. God bless,   Mark Before you buy.

Response:

Hi Karen, I have flown since I was young, so I can’t really say I’m afraid to fly.  I do have some anticipatory anxiety until I am seated on the plane though. Would it be possible to take a short flight somewhere in your area with your S/O…like a half hour flight?? Or go to one of the flight areas where people have their own planes and ask if you could sit in one maybe to help to desensitize you? Gosh, sorry,  I can’t think of anything else. I hope it works out for you somehow…. Bye, Maria   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen

Response:

You Can’t Always Get What You Want, by the Roilling Stones…. I saw her today at the reception, a glass of wine in her hand; I knew she was gonna meet her connection, at her feet was a foot loose man… You can’t always get what you want, You can’t always get what you want, You can’t always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you might find, you get what you need….. I went down to the demonstation, to get my fair share of abuse, Sayin’ we’re gonna vent our frustration, If we dont’, we’re gonna blow a 50 Amp fuse…. You can’t always get what you want, etc. I went down to the Chelsea drug store, to get your prescription filled, I was standin’ in line with Mr. Jimmy, A man said he looked pretty ill, We decided that we would have a soda, my favorite flavor, chrery red….. I sold my soul to Mr. Jimmy, yes, and he said one word to me, and that was DEAD… And I said,….."You can’t always get I saw her today at the reception, in her glass was a bleeding man,… She was practiced at the art of deception,,,well I could tell by her bloodstained hand…. You Can’t Always Get What You Want…..

Response:

Karen- I don’t have any profound advice to offer.  I too have to get over my fear of flying. I Have to fly to Missouri in the spring to take a class.  Unfortunately the is no other place in the country that teaches this course.  I used to fly 4400 miles every august, and now the thought scares me.  I don’t panic in the airport, I always volanter to pick people up! Desesnitize!  I think I might fly to Boston a short flight for me to see how i react. Hugs Jess

Response:

Kelly- I have a dreadful fear of flying as well.  I used to LOVE to fly, until I had my first PA.  After that, I feared I’d "lose control" in an airplane.  Isnt that awful?  Well, a few years ago I flew to Florida.   I was a mess getting onto the plain, and I had a big ole panic attack and started crying but then I CALMED DOWN and the rest of the flight went by great..  I even ate the gross plane food because I was hungry.  I had a great time in Florida so the plane rice was worth the trip.  I didnt even get myself upset about the flight home…..  I havent flown since, but I want to plan a vacation now where I have to.  I wish you luck, I imagine how you must feel separated from your family- but remember Ma Bell invented Long Distance & the internet for people like us!!  You CAN do this and keep feeling good.  If you focus on these negative feelings and stop "positive talking" to yourself, things tend to get out of hand.  Keep positive!  We’re all here for u Elizabeth – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Thank you all for responding!!! Kelly maybe your brother can come fly with me Charley, I do dread Christmas, first time in my whole entire life I am not going to be in the same house Christmas morning. I love your idea about the Christmas party. I appoint you organizer and I will be in charge of the food. <g Joan I wish I could just ‘do it’ because maybe you are right, know that you do it when you have to, makes me feel better. Debby, thanks for sharing your story. You are always such a sweetie to everyone. Steph, I am afraid if I did drive it (and that is scary too ) I may never come back. And I will tell your beautiful, wonderful city hello, I know why you love it so much. Thanks everyone and those of you who have lots of spare time INVENT A TELEPORTER!!! )) Love to you all, Karen Hi Karen, I wish I had a good answer for you, but sadly I do not. I have a great fear of flying myself. I have not been on a plane in 10 years. And I used to fly everywhere. I know how badly you miss your family. Just wanted to let you know, I am thinking of you. Have you thought about driving it again? Arthur may have the answer, he has flown recently.Take Care! And say hello to my beloved city by the bay for me!!! I hope you are enjoying your new home! ((((Karen)))) Steph Karen Writes: Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen

Response:

Hi Karen, I wish I had a good answer for you, but sadly I do not. I have a great fear of flying myself. I have not been on a plane in 10 years. And I used to fly everywhere. I know how badly you miss your family. Just wanted to let you know, I am thinking of you. Have you thought about driving it again? Arthur may have the answer, he has flown recently.Take Care! And say hello to my beloved city by the bay for me!!! I hope you are enjoying your new home! ((((Karen)))) Steph

Karen Writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen

Response:

Thank you all for responding!!! Kelly maybe your brother can come fly with me Charley, I do dread Christmas, first time in my whole entire life I am not going to be in the same house Christmas morning. I love your idea about the Christmas party. I appoint you organizer and I will be in charge of the food. <g Joan I wish I could just ‘do it’ because maybe you are right, know that you do it when you have to, makes me feel better. Debby, thanks for sharing your story. You are always such a sweetie to everyone. Steph, I am afraid if I did drive it (and that is scary too ) I may never come back. And I will tell your beautiful, wonderful city hello, I know why you love it so much. Thanks everyone and those of you who have lots of spare time INVENT A TELEPORTER!!! )) Love to you all, Karen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Karen, I wish I had a good answer for you, but sadly I do not. I have a great fear of flying myself. I have not been on a plane in 10 years. And I used to fly everywhere. I know how badly you miss your family. Just wanted to let you know, I am thinking of you. Have you thought about driving it again? Arthur may have the answer, he has flown recently.Take Care! And say hello to my beloved city by the bay for me!!! I hope you are enjoying your new home! ((((Karen)))) Steph Karen Writes: Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen

Response:

When I first flew I was full of anxiety/anticipation like you are right now.  But when the "big day" came, and the wheels left the ground, my anxiety changed to excitement.  I couldn’t keep my eyes from the window for most of the flight.  Things just look so neat from up there even though I have a fear of heights.   Some suggestions I have is to bring a walkman (and extra batteries!) with some of your favorite music and some good reading material.  Try reading comedy books or watching funny videos about flying before your flight day.  When I fly, I can’t help but think about all the silliness from the movie "Airplane," Jerry Seinfeld and his jokes about airlines, or a Saturday Night Live skit about a fictitious airline called "Total Bastard Airlines."   Don’t be afraid to start a conversation with the person seated next to you.  Tell someone sitting next to you that you’re flying for the first time and that your nervous about it.  That in itself could alleviate some of the anxiety and give you a way to start a conversation which will help you keep your mind off of your anxiety. Even though I’m a shy person I’ve managed to have many entertaining conversations with some interesting people.   All in all, when the day comes you’re very likely to find that your fears were exaggerated, and who knows, you might even love flying.   – Mike       – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen

Response:

Hi Karen, I flew to Alabama from Washington about 8 months into my getting better a some 3 1/2 years ago. It was a big step for me.But My son was eight months old and my husband was taking him to see his parents with or with out me.So I couldnt let my baby board that plane with out me.To many miles to much could happen ect.. I was very scared but excited to. so I let my hubby make all the arangements and told myself I was going thats that. So I found things to do on the plane in the event I got anxious.I took support friends no. and little things they had said.like If you panic.distract yourself and remember its only anxiety , you will not go crazy or die.ect… The day of the departure we left real early.i was busy all the way up to sitting down on the plane.I felt alittle uncomftorble…and got busy playing with my son.I tryed to get excited when the plane took off but couldnt oh well once in the air I settled down most of my feelings had been anticapatory…since the zoloft was helping with the panic.My son slept most of the way. I did feel very uncomftorble in Memphis layover..we had to rush through a very populated airport.stepped outside to smoke and the humidity was thick. you will only have to suffer a little uncomftorbleness a couple hours and you can do that.you have felt all the panic symtoms before and can handle them.Take mini breaks in your seat.Like crosswords and getting to visit with people on the plane…listen to music and walk to the restroom.Sit in a window seat and look with amazement at flying. You can do it.It is all anticapatory anxiety.Dont let that hang you up.You could practice the not being able to get off the plane in a car during rush hour.I no its not quite the same but its only a feeling and if you accept that you will be anxious and find things to distract during the times you have unwelcomed negative thoughts it will be over before you know it. Long winded Char — On you will go/Onward up many/ a frightening creek./ though your arms may get sore/ and your sneakers may leak.                                                 —Dr. Seuss – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thank you all for responding!!! Kelly maybe your brother can come fly with me Charley, I do dread Christmas, first time in my whole entire life I am not going to be in the same house Christmas morning. I love your idea about the Christmas party. I appoint you organizer and I will be in charge of the food. <g Joan I wish I could just ‘do it’ because maybe you are right, know that you do it when you have to, makes me feel better. Debby, thanks for sharing your story. You are always such a sweetie to everyone. Steph, I am afraid if I did drive it (and that is scary too ) I may never come back. And I will tell your beautiful, wonderful city hello, I know why you love it so much. Thanks everyone and those of you who have lots of spare time INVENT A TELEPORTER!!! )) Love to you all, Karen

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hi Karen, I wish I had a good answer for you, but sadly I do not. I have a great fear of flying myself. I have not been on a plane in 10 years. And I used to fly everywhere. I know how badly you miss your family. Just wanted to let you know, I am thinking of you. Have you thought about driving it again? Arthur may have the answer, he has flown recently.Take Care! And say hello to my beloved city by the bay for me!!! I hope you are enjoying your new home! ((((Karen)))) Steph Karen Writes: Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen

Response:

Hi Karen, Some of the airlines have "fear of flying" classes.  One here in the Seattle area does a "graduation" flight to Portland, which takes about half an hour.  Maybe there is something like that in your area. Another option is the bus.  I know people think "The bus?  Ugh," but it really can be quite cozy and comfy.  I don’t fly at all and can’t drive more than a couple of miles from my house, but I can go anywhere on a Greyhound!  I would recommend that you take with you a cell phone if you need to feel secure, ginger, if you get motion sickness, and a good book and lots of munchies.  I once rode from Seattle to San Diego and really enjoyed it. HTH Dot

Response:

Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen

Response:

I also am afraid to fly, but I do it. If I did not make myself, I would never see my family. I spend sleepless nights before the flight and take xanex to relax me. I have to make myself think more realistic. My chances of getting killed on the way to the airport are better than dying in a plane. Who knows, you may like it once you have flown. My husband is an engeneer with a Aero Space Industry and he flies all over the world. As he says,( its a piece of cake.) I promise you will make it to Ala and back.

Response:

      Hi Karen,             I had to fly for the first and only time several years ago.   I had no choice.  I either had to get on that plane in SanDiego to fly home to NY or stay in  SD, all alone with no money etc.  To say I was terrified is an understatement.  I thought I was going to totally freak out or get sick – every bad scenario I could imagine.  But luckily I got a seat in the first row so I was facing a partition, and that really helped.  I sipped ginger ale the whole flight ( I had to change planes in Chicago) and it really wasn’t half as bad as I had imagined.  I haven’t flown since but I just don’t have that fear anymore.  It helps to bring a magazine or book along – something you are really interested in.  I also now that one airline used to have a Fear of Flying course where you got on a plane and "practiced" flying.  I had a friend who took the course and it helped her quite a bit. Maybe you could check  that out.   That anticipation anxiety is always the worst.  You may even find out that you like to fly.  You’ve been such an inspiration to me and I know that you will do fine on your plane trip. Take Care,  Debby PS.  I should have stayed in San Diego

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen

Response:

Hi Karen, I can’t give you any flying tips but I can empathise with how hard it is to be away from home especially with the holidays looming. The first Christmas is always the hardest-make sure you plan it to death-keep up some of your family’s traditions and make up some of your own. The more time you have to mope around your apartment, the worse you will feel. Have you made many new friends? Maybe a group of you could get together to do a potluck Christmas dinner. Keep busy, busy ,busy! It does get easier-I try not to imagine what my family is doing on Christmas Day; that helps. If you do feel sad, have a little cry but then get back to doing something you enjoy. Tell your boyfriend how you feel and ask him for ideas. Maybe you could go away for a romantic week-end  during the holidays, Finally, have something to look forward to after the first week off January-tickets to a concert or play, a party or whatever you would enjoy. Looking forward to something is a good way to get past those day-to-day blues. Of course, we’ll (ASAP) still be here during the holidays. We should all pick a date to have a Christmas Party in  the anx/pan chat room. We could even make it clothes optional; who would know?  There are a few fellas I wouldn’t mind meeting under the mistletoe for a cyber-smooch.  :o) Karen, you can do this; you are strong (even if you don’t think you are right now). Charley

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all, I need some help please.  As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit.  ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen Hi Karen, I’m not the one to give any advice on flying..remember I am the one who had the MAJOR panic attack on the plane! Someone told me, that if I ever decided to fly again to take something to make me sleep.? I can say that the stewardesses are really prepared for this to happen! I had one who sat with me and comforted me the rest of the way. They also had some waiting for me when I changed planes to help me on the next plane! But the good news I can give you, is my brother-in -law also has panic and depression and he has been flying back and forth to Kosovo…with no problems at all! The plane might be one of those things that does’nt even bother you! If this does’nt work, how about a bus? I know its hard, thats probably why I have always stuck real close around my family..I feel proud of you for even having the courage to make the move! Good Luck to you, Karen, Kelly

– Posted via Talkway – http://www.talkway.com Exchange ideas on practically anything ™.

Response:

Could anyone tell me if there are any chat rooms or online support groups about panic disorders?  I need help  :(

Hello to a fellow Gateway 2000 user, There is an anxiety/panic chat room on mIRC or irc called #anx/pan.  Use any Dalnet server.  Good to see you here at ASAP —                                 Michelle

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YES THERE IS A CHAT ROOM CALLED PANIC DISODERS .IF U NEED SOME ONE TO CHAT WITH FEEL FREE IN TALKING TO ME JUST EMAIL ME..I REALLY UNDERSTAND AND GOING THROUGH ALOT MYSELF..TAKE CARE TEABI…..

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Could anyone tell me if there are any chat rooms or online support groups about panic disorders?  I need help  :(

You have found an online support group.  Welcome. I don’t know about the chat rooms.                                 Kiesha

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writes Could anyone tell me if there are any chat rooms or online support groups about panic disorders?  I need help  :( Hello to a fellow Gateway 2000 user, There is an anxiety/panic chat room on mIRC or irc called #anx/pan.  Use any Dalnet server.  Good to see you here at ASAP

Just to add to what Michelle said, it normally starts at around 7pm EST (or midnight in the UK) — Jon Guite When replying by email, please remove the trailing x from my return address

Response:

Could anyone tell me if there are any chat rooms or online support groups about panic disorders?  I need help  :(

Response:

Depression causes suicidal tendencies.  Often patients treated (with anything) get a little bit better, then they (while not really "better yet") have enough enough energy to complete a suicidal task.  Patients started on any anti-depressant (allopathic or homeopathic IMO) should be observed closely as they start to experience the effects of the treatment.  I will make it my business to find out more about this, and that means it will be discovered and disclosed.  You can count on it. Gary

Well.. how about those people who try and treat their cancer naturally? ie: refusing chemotherapy or other forms of western medicine. There are plenty of cases of people dying due to that. Then we have royal jelly and echinichea. People can be sensitive to those (particullarly asthmatics) and have an allergic reaction. Kava – I’m sure there are reports of liver damage with that one.

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NO these Blues man are class action Suits. Go look at the class action suits on Prozac. Again defending some thing you have no answers Come back when you have a better defense Blues Man. Stop posting if you can’t handle are post. Are Web Page is there to help people say what you will what are you doing to help people oh Yes attacking thread is your job HUH thats such big help HUH FUNNY      

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Gary check this out ELI LILLY Prozac Petition its on the internetgo see it on the Web. Have you seen any of these class action suits. Or are you giveing us your experience. Depresion didn’t cause these say what you will. Defend the Drug Companys Gary its Sad Find out and let us know ok. Zoloft and Prozac And celexa Effexor caused these not depresion tell that to the Families. Find me some thing natural that  does the same thing they were useing it as recommended alot of things are bad if over used. Gary again nothing against you what we know and what you know if you haven’t checked it out doesn’t mean its not true it just means you don’t have that Knowledge.  your here to help and so are we lets quit attacking each other we all care no matter how much passion we have Ok      

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Ha Tad pole give me Web Pages of people doing natural for Canser and Died. Yes all things if you have a reaction to it yes pplus ryal Jelly we already gave you that testimony if any thins abused Bye Tad POle need proof. Give me all those plenty of cases TAD POLE I dare you to  Read JORDAN RUBENS BOOK: THE MAKERS DIET YOU CAN’T ATTACK RESULTS SORRY TRY HARDER NEXT TIME.  Have A Blessed day  

Response:

Is there any natural or a supplement out there that has caused death or suicide,if taken as recommended. Just wondering because I heard Zoloft,celexa Prozac, Effexor they causes suicidal tendencys I found 2,500.00 cases Can any one help Be blessed

1. Check out the number of people who died of eosinophilia myalgia syndrome as a result of takingl-trytophan. 2. Check out the deaths attributed to St.John’sWort because of negative interactions with other life-supporting drugs such as one used to treat HIV infection. 3. Remember laetrile (apricot pits)? How many people died when they abandoned conventional cancer treatments and went to Mexico for laetrile injections? 4. Check out how many people died as a result of the hepatogenic alkaloid in the kava-kava plant. 5. Check out the number of deaths attributed to Ma Huang (ephedra). The info is there if you have an open and objective mind.  Same thing applies to prescription and OTC drugs.

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Dear Sir:  At no time have you been "attacked".  You asked a "question", and I stated that I would make it my business to find out the answer, which I will do.  I’m very matter of fact, in general.  As I have said now, over and over, I’m glad you are doing well with your treatment plan but I also think it is narrow thinking to say that all western medicine plans are bad ones. Quite obviously, some depressed people don’t do well; that is very, very sad, but it is just the way things are, and they have always been that way – there is less suicide now than there was prior to the advent of treatment, I feel sure.  However, I will find out more about this, as it is an important thing. G

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Gary check this out ELI LILLY Prozac Petition its on the internetgo see it on the Web. Have you seen any of these class action suits. Or are you giveing us your experience. Depresion didn’t cause these say what you will. Defend the Drug Companys Gary its Sad Find out and let us know ok. Zoloft and Prozac And celexa Effexor caused these not depresion tell that to the Families. Find me some thing natural that  does the same thing they were useing it as recommended alot of things are bad if over used. Gary again nothing against you what we know and what you know if you haven’t checked it out doesn’t mean its not true it just means you don’t have that Knowledge.  your here to help and so are we lets quit attacking each other we all care no matter how much passion we have Ok

Response:

Depresion didn’t cause these Zoloft and Prozac And celexa Effexor caused these not depresion

If depression didn’t cause these suicides then what were these individuals treating using an anti-depressant? Kevin..

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It is possible the drugs themselves that were used to treat the depression increased the chance for suicide as in the latest FDA’s drug investigations into these medications based on new studies. It does sound strange that drugs given to people to treat depression can cause further depression resulting in suicide but it is looking like their is enough cases of it being reported for the FDA to stand up and take notice. Public Health Advisory: Suicidality in Adults Being Treated with Antidepressant Medications Audience: Neuropsychiatric healthcare professionals and consumers [UPDATE 07/08/2005] FDA notified healthcare professionals about the availability of updated Healthcare Professional and Patient Information Sheets for antidepressant medications that were the subject of a June 30, 2005 Public Health Advisory issued about the risk of suicidality (suicidal thinking or behavior) in adults being treated with antidepressant medications. [Posted 07/01/2005] In response to recent scientific publications that report the possibility of increased risk of suicidal behavior in adults treated with antidepressants, the FDA has issued a Public Health Advisory to update patients and healthcare providers with the latest information on this subject. Even before the publication of these recent reports, FDA had already begun the process of reviewing available data to determine whether there is an increased risk of suicidal behavior in adults taking antidepressants. The Agency has asked manufacturers to provide information from their trials using an approach similar to that used in the evaluation of the risk of suicidal behavior in the pediatric population taking antidepressants. This effort will involve hundreds of clinical trials and may take more than a year to complete. [July 08, 2005 - Healthcare Professional and Patient Information Sheets - FDA]  - http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/antidepressants/antidepressantList.htm [July 01, 2005 - Talk Paper - FDA] – http://www.fda.gov/bbs/topics/ANSWERS/2005/ANS01362.html [June 30, 2005 - Public Health Advisory - FDA] – http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/advisory/SSRI200507.htm [June 30, 2005 - Drug Information Page - FDA] – http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/antidepressants/default.htm

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Okay, open your mind to this as it is very real and unknown syndrome.    Do some of your searching on this.    It needs to be exposed.    Stimulants (marijuana, cocaine, anti-depressants, anti-anxiety drugs, kava kava, st johns wort, etc etc.) have an uncanny ability to send harm to a second or third party  who may not be on anything, the most common harm being crohns or colitis, IBD etc.    I believe it is those (for the most part) that get this aura of harm via mind/body connection, literally that get depressed or ill and even suicidal.    The conventional thinking is that the person taking the anti-depressant is the one that gets suicidal.    NO, NOT ALWAYS. Someone else’s med can affect them, and always adversely. To compound the strangeness, the two (or three) need not be in the same room for the vulnerable person to be affected, they can be miles and miles apart. Still the damage continues.  And the damage can in any part of the body, heart, eyes, digestive tract etc. I also think SIDS is often caused by the mother or caretaker being on an anti-depressant, or recreational drug.    No one knows what is happening, but the person on the med is totally unaware their drug  can harm or sometimes kill the child.    I can elaborate on cases of this type, but too long for putting all of it here. If you are investigating anything, pay special attention to groups and friends that participate in using marijuana, and if they are close in mind connection, some will be ill, or a friend or relative will be ill.      You can bet on this.    Look into it. It is strange and almost unbelievable but destructive in a subtle manner no one can suspect.     No judgment on the drugs, just an effort to make this known, so that it can be curbed to an extent, or at least inform the ill person just why they are ill. No one can realize the amount of harm done in this manner.    These illnesses are being research throughout the world, but not being a scientific cause, it remains in the realm of impossible.    But it is not impossible, it is very LIKELY. Gail

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To anwser the orrigional question, no I dont know of any natural supplement that has caused death. As for why some people commit suicide on prozac etc. it is typically thought that when depressed patients are on medication they can gain increased energy yet not necessarly decreased depression and thus are gain the energy or motivation needed to comitt suicide. There can be many cognitive reasons for why it is antidepressants spur someone on to commit suicide but considering a so called "healthy" person would not commit suicide if given an antidepressant it cannot be said that the antidepressant alone is the only cause of the suicide. Since everyones brain chemistry is different, antidepressants work differently on the individual person. Antidepressants are not "bad" things people just not right for certian people. Individuals just need to find out what works well for them and people who are at risk for suicide should be monitered especially teens who in general don’t have the ability to make good judgements and may not *fully* understand the implications of their actions. As for Gail’s post, the illnesses mentioned such as IBS and Chrons etc are stress related illnesses which may be percipitated by the stressful events one has to deal with say by interacting with a depressed loved one. The stomach also is highly innervated with the same neurotransmitters involved in depression. Therfore there may be a general disregulation in the brain and stomach, say in families. As for the mariguana stuff and illness it almost becomes a question of which came first the chicken or the egg? I tend to believe that any drug someone abuses be it coffee, alcohol or something "harder" is being used to medicate an underlying problem

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GFX and AC are 100% correct about anti-depressants and suicide.  As a medical practitioner who prescribes these drugs regularly, I havn’t personally had one of my patients commit suicide, but some colleagues of mine have.  These are patients who have major depressive disorders, or are dually diagnosed as depressive with schizophrenia usually.  As for the drugs causing suicide?  I think it would be fair to say that the data from those studies is wildly open to interpretation.  Is a person with a Major depressive disorder likely to commit suicide if put on an anti-depressant? NO.  quite the contrary in the vast majority of cases.  But, as GFX and AC correctly pointed out, in a major depressive disorder, most patients lack the energy or motivation to commit suicide, if that’s something their even thinking about.  I’d say that of the patients with MDD I see, about 5% admit to suicidal ideations.  Now some simply lie, but most are sincere and just want to get better.  The anti-depressant, whatever type or dose and if it works for that person, gives them more energy and helps them think a bit better.  Sometimes the increase comes with better sleep or better appetite that the medication gives them.  What ever the cause of the "increased energy" or motivation is probably from the anti-depressant effects.  Then with this energy and motivation increase, the person is able to carry out possibly a premeditated suicide plan that they had been thinking about, but were too unmotivated to act upon those feelings.  I feel these odds of this happening are extremely slim and I really don’t think you can entirely blame the anti-depressant for the suicide.  Now, people with GAD or PD aren’t at any increased risk for suicide when taking anti-depressants.  Some may be depressed, but not to the point of someone with MDD as their primary diagnosis. Scott

Response:

I will speak only for myself – the more I read, hear and see, the more arcane the entire subject becomes.  Anxiety meds cause anxiety as a side effect for some, and tranquilize others. It is just not that well-elucidated yet – this whole psychopharm thing.  Scarier still is that there are many people out there who are being evaluated and treated by people who see themselves largely as ‘brain-technicians’ (if you will) and not really receiving very good (if any) therapy at all – talk about lack of holism. Some schizophrenic patients improve simply by having someone listen to their situation, give concrete suggestion, and suddenly their symptoms (positive and negative) lessen – irrespective of drugs used.  This is not to say that I’m abandoning the pharmacy (well, maybe the one I’m presently using, but that’s a whole ‘nuther story..) for tea and aroma infusions, but the various effects and responses do seem way over-determined sometimes, at least to me.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – GFX and AC are 100% correct about anti-depressants and suicide.  As a medical practitioner who prescribes these drugs regularly, I havn’t personally had one of my patients commit suicide, but some colleagues of mine have.  These are patients who have major depressive disorders, or are dually diagnosed as depressive with schizophrenia usually.  As for the drugs causing suicide?  I think it would be fair to say that the data from those studies is wildly open to interpretation.  Is a person with a Major depressive disorder likely to commit suicide if put on an anti-depressant? NO.  quite the contrary in the vast majority of cases.  But, as GFX and AC correctly pointed out, in a major depressive disorder, most patients lack the energy or motivation to commit suicide, if that’s something their even thinking about.  I’d say that of the patients with MDD I see, about 5% admit to suicidal ideations.  Now some simply lie, but most are sincere and just want to get better.  The anti-depressant, whatever type or dose and if it works for that person, gives them more energy and helps them think a bit better.  Sometimes the increase comes with better sleep or better appetite that the medication gives them.  What ever the cause of the "increased energy" or motivation is probably from the anti-depressant effects.  Then with this energy and motivation increase, the person is able to carry out possibly a premeditated suicide plan that they had been thinking about, but were too unmotivated to act upon those feelings.  I feel these odds of this happening are extremely slim and I really don’t think you can entirely blame the anti-depressant for the suicide.  Now, people with GAD or PD aren’t at any increased risk for suicide when taking anti-depressants.  Some may be depressed, but not to the point of someone with MDD as their primary diagnosis. Scott

Response:

Is there any natural or a supplement out there that has caused death or suicide,if taken as recommended. Just wondering because I heard Zoloft,celexa Prozac, Effexor they causes suicidal tendencys I found 2,500.00 cases Can any one help Be blessed      

Response:

Is there any natural or a supplement out there that has caused death or suicide,if taken as recommended. Just wondering because I heard Zoloft,celexa Prozac, Effexor they causes suicidal tendencys I found 2,500.00 cases Can any one help Be blessed  

Well not exactly. You found evidence of attempted law suits. Now post how many were actually attributed to those drugs in the end. Natural remedies ? You mean you don’t list them on your cockamamie web site ?

Response:

Depression causes suicidal tendencies.  Often patients treated (with anything) get a little bit better, then they (while not really "better yet") have enough enough energy to complete a suicidal task.  Patients started on any anti-depressant (allopathic or homeopathic IMO) should be observed closely as they start to experience the effects of the treatment.  I will make it my business to find out more about this, and that means it will be discovered and disclosed.  You can count on it. Gary

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is there any natural or a supplement out there that has caused death or suicide,if taken as recommended. Just wondering because I heard Zoloft,celexa Prozac, Effexor they causes suicidal tendencys I found 2,500.00 cases Can any one help Be blessed

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I will speak only for myself – the more I read, hear and see, the more arcane the entire subject becomes.  Anxiety meds cause anxiety as a side effect for some, and tranquilize others. It is just not that well-elucidated yet – this whole psychopharm thing.  Scarier still is that there are many people out there who are being evaluated and treated by people who see themselves largely as ‘brain-technicians’ (if you will) and not really receiving very good (if any) therapy at all – talk about lack of holism. Some schizophrenic patients improve simply by having someone listen to their situation, give concrete suggestion, and suddenly their symptoms (positive and negative) lessen – irrespective of drugs used.  This is not to say that I’m abandoning the pharmacy (well, maybe the one I’m presently using, but that’s a whole ‘nuther story..) for tea and aroma infusions, but the various effects and responses do seem way over-determined sometimes, at least to me. GFX and AC are 100% correct about anti-depressants and suicide.  As a medical practitioner who prescribes these drugs regularly, I havn’t personally had one of my patients commit suicide, but some colleagues of mine have.  These are patients who have major depressive disorders, or are dually diagnosed as depressive with schizophrenia usually.  As for the drugs causing suicide?  I think it would be fair to say that the data from those studies is wildly open to interpretation.  Is a person with a Major depressive disorder likely to commit suicide if put on an anti-depressant? NO.  quite the contrary in the vast majority of cases.  But, as GFX and AC correctly pointed out, in a major depressive disorder, most patients lack the energy or motivation to commit suicide, if that’s something their even thinking about.  I’d say that of the patients with MDD I see, about 5% admit to suicidal ideations.  Now some simply lie, but most are sincere and just want to get better.  The anti-depressant, whatever type or dose and if it works for that person, gives them more energy and helps them think a bit better.  Sometimes the increase comes with better sleep or better appetite that the medication gives them.  What ever the cause of the "increased energy" or motivation is probably from the anti-depressant effects.  Then with this energy and motivation increase, the person is able to carry out possibly a premeditated suicide plan that they had been thinking about, but were too unmotivated to act upon those feelings.  I feel these odds of this happening are extremely slim and I really don’t think you can entirely blame the anti-depressant for the suicide.  Now, people with GAD or PD aren’t at any increased risk for suicide when taking anti-depressants.  Some may be depressed, but not to the point of someone with MDD as their primary diagnosis. Scott

funny thing about suicide-we can’t ask those who did it,  why? I have seen people commit suicide on and off meds-thankfully like Scott, I have lost two clients in over thirty years and both had significant disordered psyches-ad meds do lots of things to people-most of the brooha is regarding teens using them and a teens brain isn’t like an adults-nor are their responses to things like "impulses" and it can be a fair assesment to state ad meds lower impulse control for some people prone to this response on these meds-hence-you will find people who commit crimes, to themselves or others, who take ad meds. The popularity of these drugs has increased the small percentage of those who fall to this behavior and response to a grerater degree—with that litigenous attorneys, media and horror mongering have made these issues much more prevalent to our awareness in our society. Meds have risks-every one of them. It is only prudent to weigh the risk vrs benefit ratio for any patient considering using pharmaceuticals. By and large, ad meds are safe when used as directed by a doc who knows how to use them. All medical practitioners tend to become myopic when drugs become over sold by big pharma and by media hyperbole-anxiety and depression are not easy to treat-we are led to believe they are. These meds are not a panacea or magic bullet, just a tool to use- The mutlidimensional application of prudent intervention and therapy as well as insightful use of pharmacopea has allowed us to garner much better results in treating disorders then ever before-but with that comes a price and that price is that some will suffer from some sort of side effect or paradoxical effect or long term negative manifestations from using a specific chemcial or procedure-there are after all, as analogy, those who do not survive angioplasty or gain great benefit from it-so we don’t scrap it, we do embrace it as a lifesaving technique with risk-psychiatry is the same just my 2 cents  

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Question:

Wellbutrin doesn’t cause sexual side effects!  Effexor XR worked great for me but is a TOTAL b*tch to withdraw from – even if you miss one day you get nauseated and sick – bad news!  It also caused sexual side effects for me, as does Celexa – I would avoid both Celexa and Effexor XR and go for the BuSpar or try Wellbutrin. ~Melissa

Response:

Wellbutrin doesn’t cause sexual side effects!  Effexor XR worked great for me but is a TOTAL b*tch to withdraw from – even if you miss one day you get nauseated and sick – bad news!  It also caused sexual side effects for me, as does Celexa – I would avoid both Celexa and Effexor XR and go for the BuSpar or try Wellbutrin. ~Melissa

 But thats your response to Effexor Melissa. Everyone is different. I have been on Effexor XR now for about 3 months. Last weekend I missed my first daily dose, I was staying at a friends house and was so busy with things going on that I just forgot to take my Effexor. I experienced no side effects at all – none. The next day I took my usual dose of 75mg without noticing anything out of the ordinary. I don’t think you can’t lump everyone into the same catagory – people respond differently. So far Effexor XR has helped me a lot.

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My wife has been suffering from daily anxiety for some time now. It may be related to her diagnoses of multiple sclerosis over a year ago; her menopausal phase; or her hypothyroidism. After taking hormone replacement therapy and synthroid for the thyroid problem, she still has daily anxiety. She has been treating it with Ativan but her doc recommend an anti-depressent. Here’s the problem: her GP recommends Celexa; her neurologist recommends Effexor; and her psychiatrist recommended Buspar (and maybe a second drug as well.) She tried Prozac years ago and it worked well except she lost all interest in sex or orgasm was near impossible. My question is…can anyone give some insight into possible side effects of the 3 ADs mentioned? What might she expect? What about withdrawl from them? Getting off of Prozac was a bitch. Any help would be appreciated.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My wife has been suffering from daily anxiety for some time now. It may be related to her diagnoses of multiple sclerosis over a year ago; her menopausal phase; or her hypothyroidism. After taking hormone replacement therapy and synthroid for the thyroid problem, she still has daily anxiety. She has been treating it with Ativan but her doc recommend an anti-depressent. Here’s the problem: her GP recommends Celexa; her neurologist recommends Effexor; and her psychiatrist recommended Buspar (and maybe a second drug as well.) She tried Prozac years ago and it worked well except she lost all interest in sex or orgasm was near impossible. My question is…can anyone give some insight into possible side effects of the 3 ADs mentioned? What might she expect? What about withdrawl from them? Getting off of Prozac was a bitch. Any help would be appreciated.

Buspar in not like any other anxiety drug and not use for panick attack. It takes effect after a few weeks and does not interfere with the interest in sex. On the contrary, some say that at high dosage, it helps. The only sundesirable side effects i have experienced with Buspar is, sometimes, dizziness and tiredness. Il helps to take the medication with a very large glass of water. If you experience panick attack you could had attivan or something similar for a couple of days. ap

Response:

Question:

Hi.  I was wondering if anyone has experienced an increase in anxiety while on the birth control pill?  Or if anyone can direct me to info about this?  I am taking mircette for endometriosis – and it helps so I really don’t want to stop taking it, but my doc suggests I stop because it may be increasing my anxiety. So instead of increasing my zoloft (currently 50mg) that I should stop the bcp.  Of course due to the anxiety I tend to explore every single little aspect of this….. .  Thanks in advance. Kami

Response:

I was wondering if anyone has experienced an increase in anxiety while on the birth control pill?

increasing blood levels of estrogen and progesterone can increase anxiety or depression, however your zoloft dose is very low-I think your doc is being too reactionary by taking you off the mircette-if he suspects this med may be promoting anxiety there are many others to try including the whole ortho novum ortho tri-cyclen line which is very well tolerated. LM

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Question:

I have been taking effexor for two weeks after being on parnate for ten years and have been having terrible dreams and a very hard time coming out of a dream sleep in the morning- kind of like dreaming while awake- it’s really unpleasant.                                                                  Has anyone out there had  a similiar experience with effexor or any other anti- depressent? Thanks. Lara

Response:

I have been taking effexor for two weeks after being on parnate for ten years and have been having terrible dreams and a very hard time coming out of a dream sleep in the morning- kind of like dreaming while awake- it’s really unpleasant.                                Has anyone out there had  a similiar experience with effexor or any other anti- depressent? Thanks. Lara

Hi lara, I did take Effexor but did not experience any side effects. Here is some info on side effects. No mention of bad dreams. http://www.mentalhealth.com/drug/p30-e02.html#Head_6 Adverse Effects Commonly Observed Adverse Reactions: The most commonly observed adverse events associated with the use of venlafaxine (incidence of 5% or greater) and not seen at an equivalent incidence among placebo-treated patients (i.e., incidence for venlafaxine at least twice that for placebo), derived from the 1% incidence Table III, were asthenia, sweating, nausea, constipation, anorexia, vomiting, somnolence, dry mouth, dizziness nervousness, anxiety, tremor, blurred vision, and abnormal ejaculation/orgasm and impotence in men. Adverse Reactions Associated with Discontinuation of Treatment: Nineteen percent (537/2897) of venlafaxine-treated patients in Phase II and III depression studies discontinued treatment due to an adverse reaction (see Table II). The more common events (=1%) associated with discontinuation of treatment and considered to be drug-related (i.e., those events associated with dropout at a rate approximately twice or greater for venlafaxine compared to placebo) included Table II. Table II Adverse Reactions Associated with Discontinuation of Treatment                       Venlafaxine   Placebo CNS   Somnolence              3%           1%   Insomnia                3%           1%   Dizziness               3%           —   Nervousness             2%           —   Dry Mouth               2%           —   Anxiety                 2%           1% Gastrointestinal   Nausea                  6%           1% Urogenital   Abnormal Ejaculation*   3%           — Other   Headache                3%           1%   Asthenia                2%           —  Sweating                 2%           —  *  percentages based on the number of males.  – Less than 1% Incidence in Controlled Trials: Table III that follows enumerates adverse events that occurred at an incidence of 1% or more, and were more frequent than in the placebo group, among venlafaxine-treated patients who participated in 4- to 8-week placebo-controlled trials in which patients were administered doses in the range of 75 to 375 mg/day. Reported adverse events were classified using a standard COSTART-based Dictionary terminology. Dose Dependency of Adverse Events: A comparison of adverse event rates in a fixed-dose study comparing Effexor 75, 225, and 375 mg/day with placebo revealed a dose dependency for some of the more common adverse events associated with Effexor use, as shown in Table IV. The rule for including events was to enumerate those that occurred at an incidence of 5% or more for at least one of the venlafaxine groups and for which the incidence was at least twice the placebo incidence for at least one Effexor group. Tests for potential dose relationships for these events (Cochran-Armitage Test, with a criterion of exact 2-sided p-value <= 0.05) suggested a dose-dependency for several adverse events in this list, including chills, hypertension, anorexia, nausea, agitation, dizziness, somnolence, tremor, yawning, sweating, and abnormal ejaculation . – Table III Treatment-Emergent Adverse Experience Incidence in 4-to 8-Week Placebo-Controlled Clinical Trials (Percentage) –                                              Effexor   Placebo Body System          Preferred Term          (n=1033)  (n=609) – Body as a whole      Headache                    25        24                      Asthenia                    12         6                      Infection                    6         5                      Chills                       3        –                      Chest Pain                   2         1                      Trauma                       2         1 Cardiovascular       Vasodilatation               4         3                      Increased blood/pressure                        hypertension               2        –                      Tachycardia                  2        –                      Postural hypotension         1        – Dermatological       Sweating                    12         3                      Rash                         3         2                      Pruritus                     1        – Gastrointestinal     Nausea                      37        11                      Constipation                15         7                      Anorexia                    11         2                      Diarrhoea                    8         7                      Vomiting                     6         2                      Dyspepsia                    5         4                      Flatulence                   3         2 Metabolic            Weight loss                  1        – Nervous              Somnolence                  23         9                      Dry mouth                   22        11                      Dizziness                   19         7                      Insomnia                    18        10                      Nervousness                 13         6                      Anxiety                      6         3                      Tremor                       5         1                      Abnormal Dreams              4         3                      Hypertonia                   3         2                      Paraesthesia                 3         2                      Libido decreased             2        –                      Agitation                    2        –                      Confusion                    2         1                      Thinking abnormal            2         1                      Depersonalization            1        –                      Depression                   1        –                      Urinary retention            1        –                      Twitching                    1        – Respiration          Yawn                         3        – Special Senses       Blurred vision               6         2                      Taste perversion             2        –                      Tinnitus                     2        –                      Mydriasis                    2        – Urogenital           Abnormal ejaculation/                        orgasm                    12 [2]     2                      Impotence                    6 [2]     2                      Urinary frequency            3         2                      Urination impaired           2        –                      Orgasm disturbance           2 [3]    – [3]                      Menstrual disorder           1 [3]    – [3] – [1] Events reported by at least 1% of patients treated with Effexor are     included, and are rounded to the nearest %. Events for which the     Effexor incidence was equal to or less than placebo are not listed     in the table, but included the following: abdominal pain, pain, back     pain, flu syndrome, fever, palpitation, increased appetite, myalgia,     arthralgia, amnesia, hypaesthesia, rhinitis pharyngitis, sinusitis     cough increased urinary tract infection and dysmenorrhoea [3] —  Incidence less than 1% [2] Incidence based on number of male patients. [3] Incidence based on number of female patients. – Adaptation to Certain Adverse Events: Over a 6-week period, there was evidence of adaptation to some adverse events with continued therapy (e.g., dizziness and nausea), but less to other effects (e.g., abnormal ejaculation and dry mouth). Vital Sign Changes: Venlafaxine treatment (averaged over all dose groups) in clinical trials was associated with a mean increase in pulse rate of approximately 3 beats per minute, compared to no change for placebo. It was associated with mean increases in diastolic blood pressure ranging from 0.7 to 2.5 mm Hg averaged over all dose groups, compared to mean decreases ranging from O.9 to 3.8 mm Hg for placebo. However, there is a dose dependency for blood pressure increase (see Warnings). Laboratory Changes: Of the serum chemistry and hematology parameters monitored during clinical trials with venlafaxine, a statistically significant difference with placebo was seen only for serum cholesterol, i.e., patients treated with venlafaxine had mean increases from baseline of 3 mg/dL, a change of unknown clinical significance. Table IV Treatment-Emergent Adverse Experience Incidence    in a Dose Comparison Trial                                      Effexor (mg/day) Body System/              Placebo     75        225       375 Preferred Term            (n=92)    (n=89)    (n=89)    (n=88) Body as Whole   Abdominal pain            3.3%      3.4%      2.2%      8.0%   Asthenia                  3.3%     16.9%     14.6%    

… read more »

Response:

Hi Lara, Yes the odd dreaming is definatly a side effect of effexor. Some people also have a terrible time getting to sleep. I found that when I put the dose up, my anxiety got worse and I used to get very frustrated trying to get to sleep! I also had really WEIRD dreams. Aswell as yelling out in my sleep (I’ve always talked in my sleep though), I sometimes punched and kicked my poor fiance! This is my advice to you: 1. If you find yourself getting anxious and irritable, and your doctor tells you to up the dose, be VERY wary of doing that, because it is possible that the effexor could be causing the anxiety. 2. When/if you decide to come off the effexor, please do it VERY slowly. Some people go fine going off it over a week or two, but others have very serious yucky withdrawls. (I did it over 2 weeks and got really dizzy and nauseous and very, very moody!). To help you sleep better, perhaps try some simple relaxation techniques before bed (like stretching, then when you’re in bed concentrate on your breathing or something. I you’ll find that you’re dreams will be worse if you’re particularily stressed when you go to bed. Um… I hope this helped a little. Kara.

Response:

Question:

Why, oh why, must I be different?  I have taken Effexor XR, 150 mg., along with Xanax daily, and both together have changed my life, but no appetite and losing weight?   No sir, not me!!  I am also a plumb Grandmom who would LOVE to lose 40 lbs.  I had heard that Effexor effects a lot of people this way, but of course, I have to be different.  This is the only AD that I have had success with (no side effects from day one) so I guess I just have to accept it. But Mr. Anon. Male, Effexor has a pretty good success rate with low or none side-effects.  The only side-effect I heard of that stops people from staying on it is nausea.  It seems if you get that side effect  it’s almost immediately and doesn’t go away.   But I never had it and most don’t.  I say, give it a try.   I am/was very drug sensitive, and if it worked for me, it can work for anyone. — ~*Rita*~ I’ve learned… that sometimes all a person needs is a hand to hold and a heart to understand.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have been taking it for couple of months now… really have been helped… the first week or so I was soooooo sleepy all the time but that is gone now…. I feel great… no highs or lows… just even keel and that is great….. am sort of plump grandmother… and have noticed that I am not hungry… have lost about 4 lb. but I need to… so that was a plus…. started on 75 mg and now am at 150 per day… still a low dosage… but It works for me…. bpw

Response:

When it comes to panic, why do you think it

Question:

They still do not know for sure if Ecstasy even cause brain damage.

Yes it does!! Go to Medscape and use the key words "Ecstasy and brain damage", and see all the info there is. We`ve had two posters at this newsgroup that know of people that have devastating brain damage from using Ecstasy. In many case, the brain damage is a fate worse than death. Not to mention that people have died after using Ecstasy just ONE time. Jackie Here is a small sample of what is at Medscape: [Clinical and toxicologic aspects of the use of Ecstasy (see comments)] [Klinische en toxicologische aspecten van ecstasygebruik.] Ned Tijdschr Geneeskd 1998 Aug 29;142(35):1942-6   (ISSN: 0028-2162) Pennings EJ; Konijn KZ; de Wolff FA [Find other articles with these Authors] Leids Universitair Medisch Centrum, afd. Klinische Chemie, Leiden. Methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA, the active compound of ecstacy (XTC) tablets) is a psychoactive amphetamine congener which in humans has a stimulatory effect and enhances feelings of openness and solidarity. MDMA is neurotoxic in animals. It depletes axonal serotonin stores, it inhibits serotonin synthesis by inhibiting tryptophan hydroxylase, and it inhibits the reuptake of serotonin into the neuron. These events lead to destruction of serotonergic axon terminals in animal brain. Selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors protect against the neurotoxic effects of MDMA. Binding of (+)[11C]McN-5652, a selective neuroligand for the serotonin transporter, is decreased in the brains of XTC-users. This indicates that XTC damages serotonergic axon terminals in human brain, also. We strongly advise against the use of XTC as the long-term clinical consequences are not known. In man, somatic life-threatening complications after XTC use include hyperthermia, hyponatraemia and liver failure. Psychiatric complications include psychosis, depression, panic disorder, and impulsive behaviour. The chronic psychosis responds poorly to therapy. Comment in: Ned Tijdschr Geneeskd 1998 Oct 17; 142(42):2321-2 [Ecstasy: psychostimulant, hallucinogen and toxic substance] [L'ecstasy: psychostimulant, hallucinogene et toxique.] Presse Med 1996 Sep 14;25(26):1208-12   (ISSN: 0755-4982) Burnat P; Le Brumant-Payen C; Huart B; Ceppa F; Pailler FM [Find other articles with these Authors] Laboratoire de Biochimie et de Toxicologie cliniques, Hopital d’Instruction des Armees Begin, Saint-Mande. MDMA or 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine, more commonly called "ecstasy", is a drug classified as a stupefiant and increasingly used by young people for its stimulant and hallucinogen effects. This popular designer drug is often used in techno or rave parties and perceived by users as relatively harmless. It has however been associated with disorders of thermoregulation and has been the cause of several deaths. In addition, the drug has been shown to destroy serotonin receptors in the brain in the monkey and leads to serious physchiatric disorders and liver damage in man. Adverse reactions with 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA; ‘ecstasy’). Drug Saf 1996 Aug;15(2):107-15   (ISSN: 0114-5916) McCann UD; Slate SO; Ricaurte GA [Find other articles with these Authors] Unit on Anxiety Disorders, National Institute of Mental Health, Bethesda, Maryland, USA. 3,4-Methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA; ‘ecstasy’) is an increasingly popular recreational drug in the US, Western Europe and Australia. In animals, including nonhuman primates, MDMA is known to damage brain serotonin (5-hydroxytryptamine; 5-HT) neurons. It is not known whether MDMA damages serotonin neurons in the human brain but there is some indication that it may. Although the large majority of individuals who have used MDMA recreationally do not develop acute complications, as the popularity of MDMA has increased, so have reports of adverse nonpsychiatric and psychiatric consequences associated with use of the drug. Further, since manifestations of MDMA-induced serotonin injury might only become apparent with age, or under periods of stress, it is possible that some individuals with no apparent abnormalities might develop complications over time. High intensity dependence of auditory evoked dipole source activity indicates decreased serotonergic activity in abstinent ecstasy (MDMA) users. Neuropsychopharmacology 2000 Jun;22(6):608-17   (ISSN: 0893-133X) Tuchtenhagen F; Daumann J; Norra C; Gobbele R; Becker S; Pelz S; Sass H; Buchner H; Gouzoulis-Mayfrank E [Find other articles with these Authors] Department of Psychiatry and Psychotherapy, Medical Faculty of the University of Technology, Pauwelsstrasse 30, D-52074, Aachen, Germany. Neurotoxic damage of central serotonergic systems has been demonstrated in numerous animal studies after exposure to methylenedioxyamphetamines (ecstasy). A high intensity dependence of auditory evoked potentials and, particularly, of the tangential N1/P2 source activity has been associated with low levels of serotonergic neurotransmission in humans. We performed an auditory evoked potentials study in 28 abstinent recreational ecstasy users and two equally sized groups of cannabis users and nonusers. The ecstasy users exhibited an increase of the amplitude of the tangential N1/P2 source activity with higher stimulus intensities; whereas, both control groups failed to exhibit this feature. These data are in line with the hypothesis that abstinent ecstasy users present with diminished central serotonergic activity. This feature of information processing is probably related to the well-recognized neurotoxic potential of ecstasy. Our data indicate that recreational ecstasy use may cause long-term alterations in the function (and possibly structure) of the human brain.

Response:

Hi, I was

here before talking about worries I had about SSRI’s. I am not a doctor. I do

have a degree in Sociology (a B.A.), but this whole informal study of mine was

due to some concerns I had about restarting taking SSRIs. It seemed to some

of you that I thought they were awful, but that really was not the case. I’d

like to start posting non-related concerns, posts, etc., so I thought I should

clear up this old one first. Ok, here goes…. My Conclusion as of Now

(conclusions can always change): #1 – In light of the fact that panic and

anxiety can be debilitating and these meds have shown positive effects in

people, they are worth a shot and have few concerns attached to them. They are

almost totally harmless to the point that I would almost say they are not

harmless at all. *see note #1* #2 – It is my opinion and the opinion of many

doctors(at least I get the impression) that these meds are best used to "pick you up" out of a period of stress/depression and not for a lifetime. I say this mostly because one cannot always count on a medicine to work or to be available. There may be some very small long term concerns with the meds as

well. They are very small but worth a little "concern". In my opinion and from

what I have gathered, the best way to use an SSRI, Effexor, or Buspar is for a

short period of time to help you to overcome the problems. It is best to

actually overcome one’s problems by oneself and it is my belief that the meds

act as aides in your OWN recovery process, which when fully complete will see you medicine free. #3 – While I do not wish to put down these meds, I believe from experience that one should go about solving one’s problems with stress in

the following manner (a) Therapy of any sort in which no medicine is administered (b) Medicine with therapy (c) However one chooses to go when

one is "better" (relatively speaking- I am an optimist so I DO – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -think one can get 100% better). #4 – This might be a bit of a rehash of another point, but it only makes logical sense to first try everything besides medication for the anxiety unless the anxiety becomes somewhat debilitating. Then, it makes sense to take a med for a period of time while working on the causes of the anxiety. This may seem like common sense so far. What I am REALLY trying to say is that there are SLIGHT risks associated with these meds and SIDE EFFECTS, so obviously the best approach possible would be to take no

meds at all. I say this because some of us have not tried everything out there

yet. EXAMPLE: Some of my major problems are specific phobias that grip me in

certain situations. Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprogramming is supposed

to work for this. Also, Reiki or "the Healing Touch" has been proven

scientifically legitimate as a method of relieving stress. Some of us rush to

the medication without trying enough of the alternatives. I think it is wise to

FIRST try to deal with it without the meds or at least use the meds as a

"helper" while doing other therapy that will ultimately bring you to a stage of being as well as possible. #5 – When calculating the risks of the meds, one

should factor in what having the stress itself could possibly cause. In my case, I came to the conclusion that taking an SSRI again might be worth it to me because stress can cause heart attacks. Even if the SSRI itself may cause some minor physical problems (if they do they would be minor), the effect of taking away the stress would outweight the bad parts. #6 – The actual

concerns I still have to a small degree: Heart- Although, many medical

studies concluded that SSRI’s have no effect on the heart, I did find a couple

noting some problems in some people and in animals in the cardio area. One

noted that SSRIs affected Calcium and Sodium in some manner related to the heart – I don’t remember but the effect was related to Calcium and Sodium. I did not fully understand the significance of this, but I believe it is small. I also found some articles in which EKG’s were affected SLIGHTLY due to SSRIs.

HOWEVER, it should be noted that even people who have had heart attacks have

taken SSRIs and MOST do not have any problems. MOST of the elderly who take

these meds do not have cardio problems because of the meds. SO, what I would

say to do here is periodically get your heart checked to ensure that you do not

have any cardio problems. My main fear here comes from the fact that Trycyclics

and drugs such as Phen-Fen DID have effects on the heart that were

significantly bad. Studies show that the SSRIs are almost completely safe, but

*personally* I would periodically get my heart checked to ensure nothing was developing. Blood Pressure – Effexor does cause an elevation in blood pressure. For this reason, I will not even take Effexor. My blood pressure is perfect so, *personally* I will not take Effexor unless nothing helps at all. OR, I would perhaps try Effexor and see if it did not do this… If it did not, I might go with it. Brain – The study I noted about rats and

SSRIs and brain damage was not fully completed. That particular study showed

that rat brain cells shrunk and also took on "corkscrew-like" shapes. This was with a high dosage. I have since been alerted that my logic was wrong in this regard. Taking lower doses of the meds over time will not likely have this effect. However, the study did say "this raises concerns". For myself, I am considering the usage of the medicine a short term aide that

is part of a bigger plan. I wish there were more studies on the effect of SSRIs on the brain in the long term. I do not think they will cause serious problems unless one notices them during treatment. Most of the problems, such as tics, go away when the medicine is discontinued. Liver – There was some

literature that found that there were some concerns with liver enzymes but

these were again just concerns. They did not seem enough to make someone not

take the medicine. I believe the concerns were based on Prozac more than any other SSRI. Mental/Emotional Effects – I would like to further research this area. Sometimes and for some people, these meds can cause negative mental events, such as mania .04% in Sertraline (too much for me personally). Does anyone know if this is something that will either happen right away or could these pop up all of sudden??? I would hate to be taking an SSRI and then after 2 years or so on the med have an episode of mania. Is this

possible? I just don’t know right now. I tend to believe if the medicine does

not cause these effects after it is started that it will not cause them in the

future. Can anyone validify that??? Anyway, the point here is, as with anything

uncertain, the better path would be to use the meds to cope until one could get off of them. The actual risk of "going crazy" is really low. I apologize that I do not fully understand this aspect. Does anyone know if the people who "flip out" have it happen right away or if that can happen out of the blue once treatment is well underway????? Note: It is not unfair to say that these effects have happened. In some people they have. Parkinson’s –

They are not sure, but they believe the drug Ecstasy may cause Parkinson’s.

They found in the infamous rat study that the effects of SSRIs were similar to

that of Ecstasy. However, these studies did not have any definitive answers and

it should be noted that Ecstasy is a lot more potent of a medicine with a

different chemistry. I only used it here for comparison. So far, there is no

evidence linking SSRIs to Parkinson’s or brain damage. They still do not know for sure if Ecstasy even cause brain damage. Other: Some people get movement

disorders (small %). Circulatory problems have been noted as a possibility

(nothing life threatening I believe and in a small % people). The normal side effects have been reported as "not worth it" by some. How I have decided to

deal with these concerns: (a) Consider the treatment with an SSRI to be a short term solution. (b) Consider the small risk of mostly minor problems (most of the concerns- even minor brain damage can be overcome) to be insignificant in

comparison of the help the meds may bring to me. (c) Realize that the

percentages of people reporting any problems of any magnitude is very small. (d) Realize that right now it is all speculation, as it is possible that any long term "side effect" could be due to something else in that person’s life. Ex: Someone having a heart attack while on an SSRI does not necessarily mean they cause heart attacks. The most important

realization I have had: My psychiatrist(I hate the term "pdoc" -sorry) told

me that taking these meds is like taking Aspirin, Tylenol, or Advil. You can choose which to take and you can choose to stop them. I feel this is the best attitude. I still would heartily recommend checking oneself medically more frequently than other people may. I do not say this to cause anxiety in anyone. I say this because there are SLIGHT issues that are still being looked into regarding these medicines. I can show anyone who wants to see it the article on the actual effect on the heart (sounds minor- would

have to look up what this effect actually means/ it could mean really nothing at all). Also, I used to take Paxil and I think it did help me. It is very hard to tell for me as regular life can sometimes cause things to get better and worse. Anyway, I believe it did help and I know that the only real annoying problem was that if I took an entire 20mg pill before bed I would wake up exactly  6 hours later. I am considering going back on Paxil

or trying Zoloft. I don’t think I gave Paxil enough of a chance because I drank

coffee while taking it, so – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I will perhaps go with it again.

… read more »

Response:

NOTE: I lumped Effexor and Buspar in here. Effexor had many of the same effects of an SSRI. There really wasn’t too much info on Buspar. I read somewhere that they think Buspar might actually *help* people with Parkinson’s (read this in "Beyond Prozac") so that’s kind of encouraging as far as the safety issue.

Response:

Before you take an SSRI I think you should read about this. You won’t likely get it from taking too much of one SSRI (allegedly impossible to get it from just taking a lot of one SSRI), but you can get it when you mix certain meds. They think it only applies with MAO-Inhibitors and SSRIs. I could have sworn I read that it’s possible to get from mixing two different SSRIs, but that may not be true. Nonetheless, you should at least be aware of it as a phenomenon.

Response:

Hi, I was here before talking about worries I had about SSRI’s. I am not a doctor. I do have a degree in Sociology (a B.A.), but this whole informal study of mine was due to some concerns I had about restarting taking SSRIs. It seemed to some of you that I thought they were awful, but that really was not the case. I’d like to start posting non-related concerns, posts, etc., so I thought I should clear up this old one first. Ok, here goes…. My Conclusion as of Now (conclusions can always change): #1 – In light of the fact that panic and anxiety can be debilitating and these meds have shown positive effects in people, they are worth a shot and have few concerns attached to them. They are almost totally harmless to the point that I would almost say they are not harmless at all. *see note #1* #2 – It is my opinion and the opinion of many doctors(at least I get the impression) that these meds are best used to "pick you up" out of a period of stress/depression and not for a lifetime. I say this mostly because one cannot always count on a medicine to work or to be available. There may be some very small long term concerns with the meds as well. They are very small but worth a little "concern". In my opinion and from what I have gathered, the best way to use an SSRI, Effexor, or Buspar is for a short period of time to help you to overcome the problems. It is best to actually overcome one’s problems by oneself and it is my belief that the meds act as aides in your OWN recovery process, which when fully complete will see you medicine free. #3 – While I do not wish to put down these meds, I believe from experience that one should go about solving one’s problems with stress in the following manner (a) Therapy of any sort in which no medicine is administered (b) Medicine with therapy (c) However one chooses to go when one is "better" (relatively speaking- I am an optimist so I DO think one can get 100% better). #4 – This might be a bit of a rehash of another point, but it only makes logical sense to first try everything besides medication for the anxiety unless the anxiety becomes somewhat debilitating. Then, it makes sense to take a med for a period of time while working on the causes of the anxiety. This may seem like common sense so far. What I am REALLY trying to say is that there are SLIGHT risks associated with these meds and SIDE EFFECTS, so obviously the best approach possible would be to take no meds at all. I say this because some of us have not tried everything out there yet. EXAMPLE: Some of my major problems are specific phobias that grip me in certain situations. Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprogramming is supposed to work for this. Also, Reiki or "the Healing Touch" has been proven scientifically legitimate as a method of relieving stress. Some of us rush to the medication without trying enough of the alternatives. I think it is wise to FIRST try to deal with it without the meds or at least use the meds as a "helper" while doing other therapy that will ultimately bring you to a stage of being as well as possible. #5 – When calculating the risks of the meds, one should factor in what having the stress itself could possibly cause. In my case, I came to the conclusion that taking an SSRI again might be worth it to me because stress can cause heart attacks. Even if the SSRI itself may cause some minor physical problems (if they do they would be minor), the effect of taking away the stress would outweight the bad parts. #6 – The actual concerns I still have to a small degree: Heart- Although, many medical studies concluded that SSRI’s have no effect on the heart, I did find a couple noting some problems in some people and in animals in the cardio area. One noted that SSRIs affected Calcium and Sodium in some manner related to the heart – I don’t remember but the effect was related to Calcium and Sodium. I did not fully understand the significance of this, but I believe it is small. I also found some articles in which EKG’s were affected SLIGHTLY due to SSRIs. HOWEVER, it should be noted that even people who have had heart attacks have taken SSRIs and MOST do not have any problems. MOST of the elderly who take these meds do not have cardio problems because of the meds. SO, what I would say to do here is periodically get your heart checked to ensure that you do not have any cardio problems. My main fear here comes from the fact that Trycyclics and drugs such as Phen-Fen DID have effects on the heart that were significantly bad. Studies show that the SSRIs are almost completely safe, but *personally* I would periodically get my heart checked to ensure nothing was developing. Blood Pressure – Effexor does cause an elevation in blood pressure. For this reason, I will not even take Effexor. My blood pressure is perfect so, *personally* I will not take Effexor unless nothing helps at all. OR, I would perhaps try Effexor and see if it did not do this… If it did not, I might go with it. Brain – The study I noted about rats and SSRIs and brain damage was not fully completed. That particular study showed that rat brain cells shrunk and also took on "corkscrew-like" shapes. This was with a high dosage. I have since been alerted that my logic was wrong in this regard. Taking lower doses of the meds over time will not likely have this effect. However, the study did say "this raises concerns". For myself, I am considering the usage of the medicine a short term aide that is part of a bigger plan. I wish there were more studies on the effect of SSRIs on the brain in the long term. I do not think they will cause serious problems unless one notices them during treatment. Most of the problems, such as tics, go away when the medicine is discontinued. Liver – There was some literature that found that there were some concerns with liver enzymes but these were again just concerns. They did not seem enough to make someone not take the medicine. I believe the concerns were based on Prozac more than any other SSRI. Mental/Emotional Effects – I would like to further research this area. Sometimes and for some people, these meds can cause negative mental events, such as mania .04% in Sertraline (too much for me personally). Does anyone know if this is something that will either happen right away or could these pop up all of sudden??? I would hate to be taking an SSRI and then after 2 years or so on the med have an episode of mania. Is this possible? I just don’t know right now. I tend to believe if the medicine does not cause these effects after it is started that it will not cause them in the future. Can anyone validify that??? Anyway, the point here is, as with anything uncertain, the better path would be to use the meds to cope until one could get off of them. The actual risk of "going crazy" is really low. I apologize that I do not fully understand this aspect. Does anyone know if the people who "flip out" have it happen right away or if that can happen out of the blue once treatment is well underway????? Note: It is not unfair to say that these effects have happened. In some people they have. Parkinson’s – They are not sure, but they believe the drug Ecstasy may cause Parkinson’s. They found in the infamous rat study that the effects of SSRIs were similar to that of Ecstasy. However, these studies did not have any definitive answers and it should be noted that Ecstasy is a lot more potent of a medicine with a different chemistry. I only used it here for comparison. So far, there is no evidence linking SSRIs to Parkinson’s or brain damage. They still do not know for sure if Ecstasy even cause brain damage. Other: Some people get movement disorders (small %). Circulatory problems have been noted as a possibility (nothing life threatening I believe and in a small % people). The normal side effects have been reported as "not worth it" by some. How I have decided to deal with these concerns: (a) Consider the treatment with an SSRI to be a short term solution. (b) Consider the small risk of mostly minor problems (most of the concerns- even minor brain damage can be overcome) to be insignificant in comparison of the help the meds may bring to me. (c) Realize that the percentages of people reporting any problems of any magnitude is very small. (d) Realize that right now it is all speculation, as it is possible that any long term "side effect" could be due to something else in that person’s life. Ex: Someone having a heart attack while on an SSRI does not necessarily mean they cause heart attacks. The most important realization I have had: My psychiatrist(I hate the term "pdoc" -sorry) told me that taking these meds is like taking Aspirin, Tylenol, or Advil. You can choose which to take and you can choose to stop them. I feel this is the best attitude. I still would heartily recommend checking oneself medically more frequently than other people may. I do not say this to cause anxiety in anyone. I say this because there are SLIGHT issues that are still being looked into regarding these medicines. I can show anyone who wants to see it the article on the actual effect on the heart (sounds minor- would have to look up what this effect actually means/ it could mean really nothing at all). Also, I used to take Paxil and I think it did help me. It is very hard to tell for me as regular life can sometimes cause things to get better and worse. Anyway, I believe it did help and I know that the only real annoying problem was that if I took an entire 20mg pill before bed I would wake up exactly  6 hours later. I am considering going back on Paxil or trying Zoloft. I don’t think I gave Paxil enough of a chance because I drank coffee while taking it, so I will perhaps go with it again. As far as other meds, I have not found anything really worrisome about Clonazepam except that some believe one can become addicted to it. I definitely have not become addicted to it. Anyway, I hope everyone realizes that I do think taking … read more »

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Question:

Courageous,the point  I  am trying to make is that "ecstasy" is sometimes not really ecstasy at all.There are so many people making the stuff,and using so many different chemicals to make their version of it,that oftentimes the people using it have absolutely no idea what they are ingesting.And to mix any unknown chemical with Viagra(or any other drug for that matter)in an attempt to experience an ultimate sexual high,is in my opinion extremely risky.

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seadog,STOP taking ecstasy.There are so many different people making the stuff that you never know exactly what might be in it.Any drug that keeps you up for hours on end partying cant be doing you a damn bit of good.And do you really enjoy that day after feeling?You know,the one where you pull the shades,turn off the phone,and hide out,like a vampire in a coffin trying to get some sleep?As for your initial question,I would definately NOT mix viagra with ecstasy.You would be toying with a mixture of drugs that could possibly do serious harm.

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where you pull the shades,turn off the phone,and hide out,like a vampire in a coffin trying to get some sleep?As for your initial question,I would definately NOT mix viagra with ecstasy.You would be toying with a mixture of drugs that could possibly do serious harm.

I don’t have any reason to believe that the *mixture* is harmful, but the reason that researchers discarded MDMA as a potential antidepressant was because it was shown in research to cause negative long-term serotonin-receptor downregulation (and eradication) in rats. The thought was that the substance might with chronic use actually CAUSE (irreversible) clinical depression. I suspect that it’s no coincidence at all that MDMA abusers end up on SSRI medication for (what probably is) the rest of their life whenupon they finally decided that there life is in ruins. Keep in mind that I’m an anti-prohibitionist. If people want to fry out their brains, it should be there right. Just recall an old truism: "What goes up, must come down". C//

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If you’re a big enough fool to resort to taking the mind bending crap you do to get through life, then you don’t really deserve the pleasure of an erection do you? May you suffer in silence.

Thanks for your narrow-minded input. I’m sure you bring confort to the geniuses that brought us The War on Drugs. Al

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Is that a value judgement or what? OR eon^^^

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Might be a value judgement but this is a support forum for people with a medical condition who are trying to alleviate a problem, not create one. If you want to experiment with non-prescription drugs, that is entirely your choice, and I for one wouldn’t stop you. But I really think you are missing the point of this forum.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is that a value judgement or what? OR eon^^^

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If you’re a big enough fool to resort to taking the mind bending crap you do to get through life, then you don’t really deserve the pleasure of an erection do you?

DESERVE?????   My, my, my.  The words "glass house" come to mind.

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Sorry if this has been posted before,   I’ve started so I’ll finish Has anyone out there had experience with Ecstacy and Viagra? I know when I take ecstacy it makes you more or less impotent anyway. I’m just wondering how the drugs get on together …. same for marijuana.  I dont plan on taking them together,  but I use the two drugs semi regularly. Thanks.

I felt a little bit sad that the replies to this post so far have, for the most part, been somewhat judgemental. After all, we may have a guy (probably quite young) who may have an underlying problem that is not clear from this posting. If this is the case, this post is not inappropriate here. I certainly don’t know the specific answers to this question but I would like to make a few comments that might promote open-minded discussion. I believe that, whatever your personal view of the use of no-prescription drug use, we have to accept it as "normal" in our modern society. I also think that, " a little pinch of what yer like does yer good", even though the substance is intrinsically bad for you. After all, I bet there are a good few guys on here who like a couple of beers, or a whiskey, or maybe a cigar. Whatever you do, I believe you should do it sensibly and in moderation. Ecstasy is certainly questionable but there is a a lot of evidence that can demonstrate that cannabis (separated from tobacco) is a less harmful than alcohol. Getting back to the ED / impotency point. Cut out all drug use for a while. All drugs that is, alcohol in any form, tobacco, "E", grass, tea, and coffee. Tobacco is the worst thing that you can do for your health (I guess that if you smoke cannabis this is mixed with tobacco) When you get yourself sorted out try a different substrate, maybe mint, or try one of those vaporiser things. Give it a few of weeks or so Mr seadog and see how it goes. Post in again and tell us how you get on. If you still have a problem, some of the experienced guys in here might be able to help. And, get an appointment with your doctor. Good luck, VMS

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If you’re a big enough fool to resort to taking the mind bending crap you do to get through life, then you don’t really deserve the pleasure of an erection do you? May you suffer in silence. Ben Sorry if this has been posted before,   I’ve started so I’ll finish Has anyone out there had experience with Ecstacy and Viagra? I know when I take ecstacy it makes you more or less impotent anyway. I’m just wondering how the drugs get on together …. same for marijuana.  I dont plan on taking them together,  but I use the two drugs semi regularly. Thanks.

For every winner there are dozens of loosers Odds are you’re one of them.

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Sorry if this has been posted before,   I’ve started so I’ll finish Has anyone out there had experience with Ecstacy and Viagra? I know when I take ecstacy it makes you more or less impotent anyway. I’m just wondering how the drugs get on together …. same for marijuana.  I dont plan on taking them together,  but I use the two drugs semi regularly. Thanks.

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It is my understanding that the THC in marijuana mimics estrogen so the regular heavy smokers of the drug sometimes develop gyno. If this is the case I would think that except for getting you over some inhibitions, marijuana would contribute to rather than help ED. With ecstacy, it works by causing a massive dumping of seratonin in the brain. If the sort of mild manic feeling I used to have when I was taking prozac is any indication of how a slight increase in seratonin due to a change in it’s reuptake causes, I shutter to think what it would feel like if you took something that caused a massive dumping of it. I would think that the increased seratonin levels would make you escatic while they lasted though totally unable to have an orgasm. I would think that the seratonin depleted state your brain would be in when you came down would be extremely unpleasant. I don’t know what the long term effects of either drug might be. I’ve experienced having my brain chemistry messed up and my hormones messed up. How ever ‘great’ the high from these drugs is, I don’t think it could possibly be worth messing up one’s chemistry. I’m just real happy that I’ve finally gotten my chemistry unmessed up. So, call me an old fuddy duddy if you want but I’d stay away from both those drugs. mike71646 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sorry if this has been posted before,   I’ve started so I’ll finish Has anyone out there had experience with Ecstacy and Viagra? I know when I take ecstacy it makes you more or less impotent anyway. I’m just wondering how the drugs get on together …. same for marijuana.  I dont plan on taking them together,  but I use the two drugs semi regularly. Thanks.

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Question:

Hello. I just found this newsgroup, so please forgive me if this question has been asked before: Does anyone know of any empirical studies on feverfew?  I have used it for about five years (about two were used for determining the correct supplier, concentration, dosage, etc) and it has done wonders for me in decreasing the frequency and severity of my migraines. The problem is that when I do get the really bad migraines they are uncontrollable. On the advice of a (somewhat) trusted physician, I have recently stopped the feverfew in order to get some diagnostic tests done and to try IM Immetrex(sp?).  I am a bit nervous that the preventative benefits of the feverfew will be lost if I stay off it for too long. I would like to find some good hard studies to give to my physicians, all of which doubt the effectiveness and safety of feverfew. Thanks in advance to anyone who can help. Carl (remove NOSPAM from address)

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Hi Carl, Why not continue the feverfew if it works, and use Imitrex or Maxalt or Zomig for the ‘horrible’ ones?. Also, there are several Neurologists who suggest a baby aspirin a day or a ‘light’ aspirin every 2nd day to cut down on intensity and severity of migraines.  This works for me, and Maxalt works great for the bad migraines.  I tried feverfew for 8 months and it did not help at all.  Most people who try it [Mygrafew in my case] don’t get any relief. I wish you luck. Email me any questions. Joyce

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Joyce, Thanks for the message. I appreciate the advice. About feverfew: I needed advice from an herbologist (who specialized in pain relief) and from some of my relatives (who have been using it for their migraines) before I found the correct dosage, supplier, type, etc. to do me any good. One I did; however, I felt the effects in a few weeks. Here is what works best for me (and one of my friends): Retailer: GNC Brand: GNC Herbal Plus, Full Spectrum, (Feverfew, of course) Type: 125mg capsules, standardized to 0.5% parthenolides Dose: One capsule per day The problem with taking both Imitrex and feverfew is that the actions of both are similar, so there is no relief when the bad migraines appear (there is a synergistic effect that can initiate another headache). I do need to go off all supplements in order to be re-evaluated for migraines, so I have done so (reluctantly) until the tests are over. My physician gave me the IM Imitrex in case I had a migraine during that time, and also to determine the effects of the Imitrex if I had to use it while off the feverfew. I am allergic to aspirin, so can’t try your advice with that. Sounds interesting, though. I wonder if it is effective because of the counteraction of platelette aggregation or because of its action as a pain releiver? Haven’t tried Maxalt. What is it? Prescription or over-the-counter? Thanks again, and my wishes for many migraine-free days. Carl — – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Carl, Why not continue the feverfew if it works, and use Imitrex or Maxalt or Zomig for the ‘horrible’ ones?. Also, there are several Neurologists who suggest a baby aspirin a day or a ‘light’ aspirin every 2nd day to cut down on intensity and severity of migraines.  This works for me, and Maxalt works great for the bad migraines.  I tried feverfew for 8 months and it did not help at all. Most people who try it [Mygrafew in my case] don’t get any relief. I wish you luck. Email me any questions. Joyce

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writes: I could see why someone whose migraines had gotten better might just leave the group.

;-( Now I know why everyone has been so helpful, trying to cure my clusters!!! Bob Never Blame the Rainbows for the Rain [J.H.& R.T.]

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(snipped) I could see why someone whose migraines had gotten better might just leave the group. Priscilla

You’re right Priscilla.  I’ve been weaning myself away slowly, now, since the Imitrex has begun to work such wonders for me.  I’ll still "lurk" (and enjoy all the sinister connotations that go with that desgination ; ) and maybe even make a smart aleck comment now and again, although I’m trying to wean myself away from those too!   I have six days a month more time to read now!!!!  And speaking of reading, I must get back ‘The Sparrow’.  Thanks so much for recommending it although I sincerely hope you don’t expect me to write essays on the study questions in the back of the book! ; )   The only real difficulty I’ve had so far was in trying to tell Denny about the main character, ‘Sandoz’, and mistakenly calling him "Fiorinal"!!!! Anne : ) "We know the truth not only by the reason but also by the heart."  Blaise Pascal

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greetings… i just know that since taking feverfew my migraines have finally taken a break and left me alone… 3 months without a debilitating (2 days in bed) to a few minor ones ( 1 shot of imitrex) and now 3 weeks without any… i know this so hang in all and keep doing research and find out what works for you… but you have to research and try oh so many remedies/drugs etc.. take care

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: Hi Wind Dancer, : Most of us here have suffered with migraines many years, including myself. : Have you noticed that most of us also, including me, are saying that they have : gotten worse in the last few years???  Makes me wonder why????? This may be because those whose migraines have gotten worse are more vocal, or maybe if your migraines have gotten worse you notice more the people whose migraines have done the same.

Or perhaps we have access (electronically) to more people than we did years ago. I personally know about a dozen people who get migraines. Add the considerable number of people I’ve "met" through this group and you skew the statistics considerably. — Dana ‘96 FXD-Conv "Roxie" Web:  http://www.chaeron.com/danamania/ NOTE:  Remove Spamicide ™ before replying!!!

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Hi Wind Dancer, Most of us here have suffered with migraines many years, including myself. Have you noticed that most of us also, including me, are saying that they have gotten worse in the last few years???  Makes me wonder why????? ~~Heather~~

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: Hi Wind Dancer, : Most of us here have suffered with migraines many years, including myself. : Have you noticed that most of us also, including me, are saying that they have : gotten worse in the last few years???  Makes me wonder why????? This may be because those whose migraines have gotten worse are more vocal, or maybe if your migraines have gotten worse you notice more the people whose migraines have done the same. Mine have gotten better, and I know there are others, too.  I could see why someone whose migraines had gotten better might just leave the group. Priscilla

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good morning all… i have to share this – i have been taking feverfew for 3 months now and have not had a debilitating migraine for 8 weeks (the 2 day in bed type) and have not had a sever (1 shot of imitrex) for 2 weeks.  I have also started chiropractic care for the last 4 weeks… this is a first for me – i have had migraines since i was 10 years old – but never as bad as the last 1 1/2 years……there is hope for us all… we just have to research and find out what works for us.. take care

I’ve started going to a Chiropractice and it has helped. I used to get the ‘aura’ feel that something was going to happen. My neck would then really stiffen up and be sore, and a migraine would start. I still get the migraine headache, which I try to avoid with Imigran, but the neck pain is a lot better. It turned out that when I slept, I slept mostly in same position, on my front with my neck bent to the left. This made sense, when he said that after a week of this, it got too much for my neck and it hurt. On the migraine front now, I used to get it on Saturday when I relaxed and lay in. Now that I do skydiving at the weekends, I tend to feel rough mid week. At least my weekends are not so affected and I can enjoy the jumps and the parties! I’ll try taking Feverfew and see if that helps too. Belle.

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I would try feverfew, but I am afraid of taking it with my daily inderal.  I am worried about combining the herbs with the drugs.

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Feverfew Nasal Mist, uses only when it is needed/

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Feverfew Nasal Mist, uses only when it is needed/

Tell us more about this, please! — "It is useless to resent anything in this world." -E. Roosevelt oh, and please remove the "z" when replying by e-mail

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good morning all… i have to share this – i have been taking feverfew for 3 months now and have not had a debilitating migraine for 8 weeks (the 2 day in bed type) and have not had a sever (1 shot of imitrex) for 2 weeks.  I have also started chiropractic care for the last 4 weeks… this is a first for me – i have had migraines since i was 10 years old – but never as bad as the last 1 1/2 years……there is hope for us all… we just have to research and find out what works for us.. take care

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I thought Feverfew was a miracle herb. And it was for 11 months. But then the migraines returned. I hope you do better.

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Greetings from a longtime migraine sufferer, but new to this group.  I have suffered from migraines since I was a child.  I have found that daily feverfew is great at minimizing the nausea and vomiting part of migraines.  Yes I still get them, but to at least not have the vomiting I can function until my Imitrex kicks in.  Fortunately Imitrex works beautifully for me, since I have had no success with abortives like Inderal and Elavil.  I have found that if I catch my migraine early and on an empty stomach then oral Imitrex works, but if it has gone beyond that early point then my only hope is injectable Imitrex. I am intrigued by the 5-HTP mentioned in someones note, so am going to get some today. I’d love to find an alternative to Imitrex, as I’m still leary about the potential longterm side efects which are yet unknown. I  will try to keep in this ng loop, but due to my hectic schedule I may be spotty in my correspondence…….thanks

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Of course, the alternative may be worse than the original med…all part of migraine roulette. Like many of you, I’m a triptan test case, hoping we don’t discover a few years down the road that we’ve permanently damaged something important. But I have to weigh that against the fact that I’m convinced I wouldn’t be here at all without SOMETHING for the pain. I, too, am trying the 5THP…have to keep trying. Welcome to the group! –Julianne

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welcome mike!!! we’ll be happy to have you whenever your schedule permits. some of us (like myself) have so little a life, that we spend every day here, but it’s perfectly understandable that a hectic scedule permits little more than spotty correspondence. again,welcome!!!! Mike Barton wrote … Greetings from a longtime migraine sufferer, but new to this group.

….snip …. . – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I  will try to keep in this ng loop, but due to my hectic schedule I may be spotty in my correspondence…….thanks

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greetings from a longtime migraine sufferer, but new to this group.  I have suffered from migraines since I was a child.  I have found that daily feverfew is great at minimizing the nausea and vomiting part of migraines.  Yes I still get them, but to at least not have the vomiting I can function until my Imitrex kicks in.  Fortunately Imitrex works beautifully for me, since I have had no success with abortives like Inderal and Elavil.  I have found that if I catch my migraine early and on an empty stomach then oral Imitrex works, but if it has gone beyond that early point then my only hope is injectable Imitrex. I am intrigued by the 5-HTP mentioned in someones note, so am going to get some today. I’d love to find an alternative to Imitrex, as I’m still leary about the potential longterm side efects which are yet unknown. I  will try to keep in this ng loop, but due to my hectic schedule I may be spotty in my correspondence…….thanks Hello Mike,

I’ve tried feverfew without noticing any difference and wonder if the dosage I’m using is incorrect. If you’re having success, I’ll gladly try whatever dosage you’re taking. Also what brand do you use?     Carol     –the sheer joy of being

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the note.   I take Migracare by Enzymatic Therapy which has 600mcg of parthenolide.  I have tried less and it didn’t work and I’ve tried more with no greater effect.  I know some products are available with up to 1200mcg.  Perhaps – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greetings from a longtime migraine sufferer, but new to this group.  I have suffered from migraines since I was a child.  I have found that daily feverfew is great at minimizing the nausea and vomiting part of migraines.  Yes I still get them, but to at least not have the vomiting I can function until my Imitrex kicks in.  Fortunately Imitrex works beautifully for me, since I have had no success with abortives like Inderal and Elavil.  I have found that if I catch my migraine early and on an empty stomach then oral Imitrex works, but if it has gone beyond that early point then my only hope is injectable Imitrex. I am intrigued by the 5-HTP mentioned in someones note, so am going to get some today. I’d love to find an alternative to Imitrex, as I’m still leary about the potential longterm side efects which are yet unknown. I  will try to keep in this ng loop, but due to my hectic schedule I may be spotty in my correspondence…….thanks Hello Mike, I’ve tried feverfew without noticing any difference and wonder if the dosage I’m using is incorrect. If you’re having success, I’ll gladly try whatever dosage you’re taking. Also what brand do you use?     Carol     –the sheer joy of being

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has anyone tried this natural herb.. i have been using it for 5 weeks and have not had a "severe" type (usually sends one to bed for 2 days) – they have been milder and i can function.. would like to hear feedback thanks

Response:

has anyone tried this natural herb.. i have been using it for 5 weeks and have not had a "severe" type (usually sends one to bed for 2 days) – they have been milder and i can function.. would like to hear feedback thanks

I’ve been taking Feverfew for a couple of months now, and have had 2 severe (go to bed) migraines during that time. Which, for me, is an improvement. I don’t think it’s a miracle or anything, but I do think it’s helping some. — Dana Taramina Web:  http://www.chaeron.com/danamania/ NOTE:  Remove Spamicide ™ before replying!!!

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has anyone tried this natural herb.. i have been using it for 5 weeks and have not had a "severe" type (usually sends one to bed for 2 days) – they have been milder and i can function.. would like to hear feedback thanks

Yes!!! I started taking Feverfew (1 380 mg. capsule per day) about three months ago, and have reduced both the frequency and severity of my migraines considerably.  In case I wasn’t sure , I somehow forgot to take them for a few weeks recently and the old #9-10 headaches were back with a vengance.  I am a believer, for sure.  Good luck.  By the way, I have noticed no side effects at all and can even take it on an empty stomach! Molly

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Feverfew is an herb, and it is effective for some, but usually only after taking it for quite a while – months sometimes.  My grandmother grew it when I was little and made us eat the leaves or drink tea from its leaves everyday, to "ward off evil in the body" as she said.  If it was going to work for you, it probably would have needed more than 3 weeks, and from what I understand, the new capsules and store brands have the same natural "weaknesses" of all other organic cures

Question:

I feel for you!  No advice, just hugs.  You aren’t a total slug, since you just joined this new NG and are still searching for answers – or at least advice.  Bravo! Helen "PhBtBet" <phbt…@aol.com

wrote in message

news:20000609130806.23881.00000332@ng-ck1.aol.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Hi group!  Thought it was about time I formally introduced myself and

asked for

some advice since I have been lurking for a very long time. My name is Betty, I’m 46 years old and I have Lupus, RA, Fibro, MPS, and

mitral

valve prolapse along with "vasoconstriction" (I have angina attacks at

rest and

on the go).  I think it appropriate to give some history here: I’ve had fibro since I was 27.  I’d had my son when I was 25 and went for several years without sleep–the kid screamed *non-stop* and was (still

is) an

incredibly intense child!  Anyway, one day I woke up and my entire rib

cage and

back was in spasm and screaming pain.  Went to my GP who did blood tests

and I

came out with a positive ANA.  Referred to a rheumy who did a zillion

tests for

Lupus, but finally diagnosed FMS.  Also discovered MVP at that time. Flash forward to a few years ago when, all of a sudden, my body went

totally

haywire.  I had major tremors (looked like an alcoholic desperately in

need of

a drink!).  Additionally, I had major chest pains.  Went to a cardiologist

who

first blew me off but when she did a stress test and I failed big time,

she

apologized profusely saying I looked so young and fit that she thought I

was

just a hypochondriac.  Anyway, she offered to hospitalize me that day but

I

declined.  Went in for an angiogram the next Monday and the heart was

clear but

when she injected me with some kind of medicine it brought on the angina.

Gave

me meds and did a follow up stress test which I still failed!  At this

point

she admitted that she didn’t have a clue and thought I should have a

second

opinion.  I went to a doctor outside of the group and he couldn’t find

anything

else either.  Right now I’m taking Cardizem CD and have my little Nitroglycerine spray for my "attacks."  As for the tremors, he thought

perhaps

I had "essential tremor" and suggested seeing a neurologist. During this same time my rheumy did some extra blood tests and I tested positive for Lupus–my anti-Sm was positive.  My joints were acting up big time–swelling of the knees and hands, costochondritis, etc.  She started

a

regimen of Plaquenil and prednisone which controlled my symptoms for a bit

and

also helped to relieve my tremors and my migraines which lasted for days

at a

time.  Unfortunately, my symptoms gradually worsened–terrible swelling of

my

knees and hands–and she started me on Methotrexate and increased the prednisone.  I asked her if I had RA and she, at first, insisted that I couldn’t have RA since I definitely had Lupus and said that even if I did,

the

meds should control the RA as well as the Lupus. Several months ago my joints were SO swollen I couldn’t move, I broke down crying in her office and told her "I don’t have a life!"  She was

sympathetic,

sat down and told me that I DO have RA and wanted to add Arava to the mix. That helped quite a lot with the swelling so I started to taper the

prednisone.

She also put me on Neurontin for the FMS pain which was severe.  Well, now

the

tremors and the migraines (which had subsided for 6 months) are back with

a

vengeance and I’m wondering if the prednisone helped control the migraines

and

tremors.  Any thoughts? Currently I’m taking 20mg. MTX, Folic Acid, 20mg. Arava, Robaxin, Xanax, Remeron, Cardizem CD, 9mg. Prednisone, Cytotec, Vicodin, Neurontin, and a

few

other things that I can’t remember off-hand. I never have a "good" day–it’s always bad or awful.  I’m basically house-bound.  I get severe tendonitis for no apparent reason that comes

and

goes on a whim.  By the time my morning regimen of having coffee,

showering,

and getting dressed is over with, I’m wasted and my legs are so swollen

along

with my ankles, toes, etc., that I sit on the couch all day!  I try to

pace

myself but the reality is that I can either clean a few bathroom sinks OR

cook

a meal and by that time I’m in screaming pain.  I’m really getting fed up

with

this!  I used to be so active–played tennis, racquetball, swam laps,

worked

out on the treadmill and did weights, etc.–and now I’m a slug. I am on several NGs and see other people with Lupus or RA saying they can

do

things, go places, go to work, and all the other things that comprise

having a

life.  I don’t know what ailments to attribute to RA and to Lupus.  The Neurontin has helped with the FMS but not the other pain.  Frankly, I’m beginning to lose it! I have planned a trip to Italy for the fall–a 12-night Mediterranean

cruise

with a few nights in Barcelona at the beginning and end of the trip.  I

want to

be able to see the sights and am desperately trying to find out what to do

that

will enable me to have a decent time.  I went on a cruise 1 1/2 years ago

for 7

days and barely came out of my cabin I was so sick the entire time (not

seasick

either)!  I don’t want a repeat. Well, sorry for the long rant, pity party and so on, but I’m in need of

some

help, suggestions, thoughts–anything that might lead me to a better life. Thanks in advance for any advice or words of wisdom! Hugs, Betty

Response:

Dear Betty, Sounds like you’ve had a tough time and I’m so sorry, will keep you in my thoughts and prayers.   Back to business-my experience with Neurontin brought on tremor type seizures. I took it to reduce inflammation in the nerves of a particularly bad leg. Tremors-Seizures were bad enough to spend 4 days in the hospital.  Discontinued the neurontin and I haven’t had any more.  Best of luck to you -I can empathize, I have Ra and SLE.  God Bless.  Cindy

Response:

I want to welcome you to the group.  You certainly sound like you’ve had a really tough time with lupus and RA.  You have my utmost sympathies and respect for the incredible courage you show every day just facing life.  Fortunately, it does sound like you’ve been blessed with some good doctors. My sister, BTW, has had similar problems with angina associated with her MVP (mitral valve prolapse).  Fortunately, after lots of testing, it looks like even though she has a lot of symptoms, nothing overtly dangerous is going on with her heart.  She’s been treated symptomatically since then. So far as the tremors and migraines go, this sounds very much like CNS involvement of lupus.  My daughter also has CNS lupus.  We’ve been told by some very prominent researchers on her case that Methotrexate isn’t a great drug for this particular complication.  It’s wonderful for RA, but not as useful with lupus.  In my daughter’s case, they’ve suggested Imuran, Cellcept or Cytoxan.   If you’d like some weblinks where you can get more RA and lupus information, I’d be h happy to send them.  You’re also welcome to e-mail or IM me anytime.   Take care, Sandra

Response:

Hi group!  Thought it was about time I formally introduced myself and asked for some advice since I have been lurking for a very long time.   My name is Betty, I’m 46 years old and I have Lupus, RA, Fibro, MPS, and mitral valve prolapse along with "vasoconstriction" (I have angina attacks at rest and on the go).  I think it appropriate to give some history here: I’ve had fibro since I was 27.  I’d had my son when I was 25 and went for several years without sleep–the kid screamed *non-stop* and was (still is) an incredibly intense child!  Anyway, one day I woke up and my entire rib cage and back was in spasm and screaming pain.  Went to my GP who did blood tests and I came out with a positive ANA.  Referred to a rheumy who did a zillion tests for Lupus, but finally diagnosed FMS.  Also discovered MVP at that time.   Flash forward to a few years ago when, all of a sudden, my body went totally haywire.  I had major tremors (looked like an alcoholic desperately in need of a drink!).  Additionally, I had major chest pains.  Went to a cardiologist who first blew me off but when she did a stress test and I failed big time, she apologized profusely saying I looked so young and fit that she thought I was just a hypochondriac.  Anyway, she offered to hospitalize me that day but I declined.  Went in for an angiogram the next Monday and the heart was clear but when she injected me with some kind of medicine it brought on the angina.  Gave me meds and did a follow up stress test which I still failed!  At this point she admitted that she didn’t have a clue and thought I should have a second opinion.  I went to a doctor outside of the group and he couldn’t find anything else either.  Right now I’m taking Cardizem CD and have my little Nitroglycerine spray for my "attacks."  As for the tremors, he thought perhaps I had "essential tremor" and suggested seeing a neurologist. During this same time my rheumy did some extra blood tests and I tested positive for Lupus–my anti-Sm was positive.  My joints were acting up big time–swelling of the knees and hands, costochondritis, etc.  She started a regimen of Plaquenil and prednisone which controlled my symptoms for a bit and also helped to relieve my tremors and my migraines which lasted for days at a time.  Unfortunately, my symptoms gradually worsened–terrible swelling of my knees and hands–and she started me on Methotrexate and increased the prednisone.  I asked her if I had RA and she, at first, insisted that I couldn’t have RA since I definitely had Lupus and said that even if I did, the meds should control the RA as well as the Lupus.   Several months ago my joints were SO swollen I couldn’t move, I broke down crying in her office and told her "I don’t have a life!"  She was sympathetic, sat down and told me that I DO have RA and wanted to add Arava to the mix. That helped quite a lot with the swelling so I started to taper the prednisone. She also put me on Neurontin for the FMS pain which was severe.  Well, now the tremors and the migraines (which had subsided for 6 months) are back with a vengeance and I’m wondering if the prednisone helped control the migraines and tremors.  Any thoughts? Currently I’m taking 20mg. MTX, Folic Acid, 20mg. Arava, Robaxin, Xanax, Remeron, Cardizem CD, 9mg. Prednisone, Cytotec, Vicodin, Neurontin, and a few other things that I can’t remember off-hand. I never have a "good" day–it’s always bad or awful.  I’m basically house-bound.  I get severe tendonitis for no apparent reason that comes and goes on a whim.  By the time my morning regimen of having coffee, showering, and getting dressed is over with, I’m wasted and my legs are so swollen along with my ankles, toes, etc., that I sit on the couch all day!  I try to pace myself but the reality is that I can either clean a few bathroom sinks OR cook a meal and by that time I’m in screaming pain.  I’m really getting fed up with this!  I used to be so active–played tennis, racquetball, swam laps, worked out on the treadmill and did weights, etc.–and now I’m a slug. I am on several NGs and see other people with Lupus or RA saying they can do things, go places, go to work, and all the other things that comprise having a life.  I don’t know what ailments to attribute to RA and to Lupus.  The Neurontin has helped with the FMS but not the other pain.  Frankly, I’m beginning to lose it!   I have planned a trip to Italy for the fall–a 12-night Mediterranean cruise with a few nights in Barcelona at the beginning and end of the trip.  I want to be able to see the sights and am desperately trying to find out what to do that will enable me to have a decent time.  I went on a cruise 1 1/2 years ago for 7 days and barely came out of my cabin I was so sick the entire time (not seasick either)!  I don’t want a repeat. Well, sorry for the long rant, pity party and so on, but I’m in need of some help, suggestions, thoughts–anything that might lead me to a better life. Thanks in advance for any advice or words of wisdom! Hugs, Betty

Response:

Question:

I have never had a problem with trembling, even at the height of panic…Since I started on Zoloft, I am definitly doing better with the panic, but notice I have a slight tremor in my left arm/hand..sometimes I feel as if my legs are shaking too..Is this a possible side effect of Zoloft? Thanks Laura

Response:

Laura, yes zoloft can cause tremors but there is nothing to get worried about it is a possible side effect. If would ease your anxiety talk to your Dr. about it.

Response: