Question:

Hi  i always rinse and brush. But i also take        acidophilus,and plain yogurt as it contains live cultures  .it really help and it cut down on fungas . Pricilla.

Response:

I am still trying to figure out how to get rid of the sore throat I have had for the past three years. I would love to get rid of the discomfort, but I have pretty much accepted that I am stuck with it. I have a problem with post nasal drip. I would certainly be open to suggestions for a remedy. Pam

Response:

Brush your teeth after each use – You, your throat, and Dentist will all be happier! Tim Washington State

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear Readers: I know that someone has probably already asked this first question, so hopefully you won’t get too bored and will be kind enough to answer if you can.  :-) Are any of you using flovent and finding that you have a problem with sore throats?  I know that this medication can cause yeast infections (if I remember correctly, anyway).  I used to use the aerosol version (the "puffer" version), but my throat was so bad with that stuff that I started using the diskus version.  I rinse regularly, but obviously it isn’t enough.  I figure I probably just don’t have the lung power to suck all that stuff down, and so some of it just sits there and does mean things.  :-)  Does anyone know of some nice home remedy to deal with the soreness?  It’s starting to get sore again, and I don’t want to go off the medication since things have been getting worse lately (and not to mention the fact that people keep giving me heck for going off the medication). I’ve got another question just out of curiosity.  Has anyone had a chest xray done, and then been told that you have granulomas and calcification?  I was told that I have that in my lungs, and that it’s something that can happen to people who have had asthma for a long time (I’ve had problems for most of my life).  I thought it was strange – I thought people only got stuff like that from having things like TB, pneumonia, and whatever else I don’t know about.  I guess asthma is one of the things I didn’t know about.  So now I’m curious to see if other long time asthma sufferers have the same kind of thing going on. Thanks for reading! Vicky

Response:

Brush your teeth after each use – You, your throat, and Dentist will all be happier!

Interesting suggestion.  Now that I think about it, I always brush my teeth first and then use the inhaler.  (don’t know why)  Maybe I’ll start reversing the procedure to see if that helps.  Thanks! Vicky

Response:

That is what I do. — CBI, M.D.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Brush your teeth after each use – You, your throat, and Dentist will all be happier! Interesting suggestion.  Now that I think about it, I always brush my teeth first and then use the inhaler.  (don’t know why)  Maybe I’ll start reversing the procedure to see if that helps.  Thanks! Vicky

Response:

My mom started using Flovent and Serevent last week because she was coughing and wheezing something AWFUL. The inhalers really helped with that. Now she’s hoarse, VERY hoarse. I read that that’s a common side effect of Flovent. While it certainly beats  not being able to take a breath without coughing, etc., it’s still uncomfortable for her. Are there some natural things she could try that DOESN’T involve any more medication? I already told her to rinse her mouth after she finishes the inhaler sessions. (This doesn’t eradicate the good effects of them, does it?) Susan

Response:

I had sore throat and hoarseness (even though I did the mouth rinsing) until I read a posting in this group to always use a spacer.  Soon after I started doing that consistently, the problem disappeared.

Response:

I use Flovent 110. I do not  use the puffer supplied with the Flovent; I use a spacer instead.  Also I rinse my mouth thoroughly after use.  Consequently I never experienced either a sore throat or a yeast infection. Israel Weber

Response:

I use Flovent 110. I do not  use the puffer supplied with the Flovent; I use a spacer instead.  Also I rinse my mouth thoroughly after use.  Consequently I never experienced either a sore throat or a yeast infection. Israel Weber

Wow, those of you who don’t get sore throats are very lucky.  I rinse as much as possible,  and I still get sore throats.  I’ve got a bit of a useless immune system, though, so maybe that makes a difference. Anyway, I just bought some unpasteurized yogurt, so we’ll see if that helps.  It at least feels very soothing!  I have read and also heard from some people that this kind of yogurt helps restore proper balance to certain types of naturally occuring things (such as yeast).  I’m trying to avoid drugging myself for the sore throats because this is an ongoing problem, and the last thing I want is drug resistant yeast infections. Vicky

Response:

You didn’t mention if you were using an extender (Aerochamber) with the aerosol version of Flovent.  I had persistent hoarseness & sore throat until I started using an extender.  Personally, I’ve  found that the diskus versions are harder to use–the powder clings to the nasopharynx instead of going into the airways.  You still need to rinse thoroughly with an extender to prevent thrush… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear Readers: I know that someone has probably already asked this first question, so hopefully you won’t get too bored and will be kind enough to answer if you can.  :-) Are any of you using flovent and finding that you have a problem with sore throats?  I know that this medication can cause yeast infections (if I remember correctly, anyway).  I used to use the aerosol version (the "puffer" version), but my throat was so bad with that stuff that I started using the diskus version.  I rinse regularly, but obviously it isn’t enough.  I figure I probably just don’t have the lung power to suck all that stuff down, and so some of it just sits there and does mean things.  :-)  Does anyone know of some nice home remedy to deal with the soreness?  It’s starting to get sore again, and I don’t want to go off the medication since things have been getting worse lately (and not to mention the fact that people keep giving me heck for going off the medication). I’ve got another question just out of curiosity.  Has anyone had a chest xray done, and then been told that you have granulomas and calcification?  I was told that I have that in my lungs, and that it’s something that can happen to people who have had asthma for a long time (I’ve had problems for most of my life).  I thought it was strange – I thought people only got stuff like that from having things like TB, pneumonia, and whatever else I don’t know about.  I guess asthma is one of the things I didn’t know about.  So now I’m curious to see if other long time asthma sufferers have the same kind of thing going on. Thanks for reading! Vicky For me, the yeast infection manifested itself as a sore throat. I just thought I had a particularly persistent sore throat. A specialist looked as part of a unrelated exam and told me it was a yeast infection and perscribed stuff for it ( cleared up a case of athletes foot too). I’d get it checked out. Jerry Freedman,Jr — Creation took 6 days because God didn’t have an installed base Before you buy.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear Readers: I know that someone has probably already asked this first question, so hopefully you won’t get too bored and will be kind enough to answer if you can.  :-) Are any of you using flovent and finding that you have a problem with sore throats?  I know that this medication can cause yeast infections (if I remember correctly, anyway).  I used to use the aerosol version (the "puffer" version), but my throat was so bad with that stuff that I started using the diskus version.  I rinse regularly, but obviously it isn’t enough.  I figure I probably just don’t have the lung power to suck all that stuff down, and so some of it just sits there and does mean things.  :-)  Does anyone know of some nice home remedy to deal with the soreness?  It’s starting to get sore again, and I don’t want to go off the medication since things have been getting worse lately (and not to mention the fact that people keep giving me heck for going off the medication). I’ve got another question just out of curiosity.  Has anyone had a chest xray done, and then been told that you have granulomas and calcification?  I was told that I have that in my lungs, and that it’s something that can happen to people who have had asthma for a long time (I’ve had problems for most of my life).  I thought it was strange – I thought people only got stuff like that from having things like TB, pneumonia, and whatever else I don’t know about.  I guess asthma is one of the things I didn’t know about.  So now I’m curious to see if other long time asthma sufferers have the same kind of thing going on. Thanks for reading! Vicky

For me, the yeast infection manifested itself as a sore throat. I just thought I had a particularly persistent sore throat. A specialist looked as part of a unrelated exam and told me it was a yeast infection and perscribed stuff for it ( cleared up a case of athletes foot too). I’d get it checked out. Jerry Freedman,Jr — Creation took 6 days because God didn’t have an installed base Before you buy.

Response:

Dear Readers: I know that someone has probably already asked this first question, so hopefully you won’t get too bored and will be kind enough to answer if you can.  :-) Are any of you using flovent and finding that you have a problem with sore throats?  I know that this medication can cause yeast infections (if I remember correctly, anyway).  I used to use the aerosol version (the "puffer" version), but my throat was so bad with that stuff that I started using the diskus version.  I rinse regularly, but obviously it isn’t enough.  I figure I probably just don’t have the lung power to suck all that stuff down, and so some of it just sits there and does mean things.  :-)  Does anyone know of some nice home remedy to deal with the soreness?  It’s starting to get sore again, and I don’t want to go off the medication since things have been getting worse lately (and not to mention the fact that people keep giving me heck for going off the medication). I’ve got another question just out of curiosity.  Has anyone had a chest xray done, and then been told that you have granulomas and calcification?  I was told that I have that in my lungs, and that it’s something that can happen to people who have had asthma for a long time (I’ve had problems for most of my life).  I thought it was strange – I thought people only got stuff like that from having things like TB, pneumonia, and whatever else I don’t know about.  I guess asthma is one of the things I didn’t know about.  So now I’m curious to see if other long time asthma sufferers have the same kind of thing going on. Thanks for reading! Vicky

Response:

Question:

My mistake.  As from 1/1/2004 the concessional rate is $3.80 and the general rate is $23.70. "." <asspu…@punkass.com

wrote in message

news:MPG.1adf1ed2a3199a6b989740@news.individual.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Tim Dicinoski wrote… me $2.80 per prescription as a pensioner (it would be $15.60 as a

general

patient. Isn’t it $3.60 and $22.50? — Regards, .

Response:

Yes, I am Australian. "ABroaD" <lhj8…@hanafos.com

wrote in message

news:c52s0m$f10$1@news.hananet.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> are you an australian? > "Tim Dicinoski" <timino…@dodo.com.au

wrote in message

> news:407406f8@news.comindico.com.au… > > I was hospitalised on Christmas Eve after taking 100 paracetamol during a

major psychotic episode with paranoid delusions.  (It’s amazing I still have a functioning liver).  I am now taking Zyprexa (olanzapine) 5mg b.d. and Zoloft (sertraline)100mg b.d., and feel better than I have in years.

The

only side effects I have experienced are dry mouth and (slight) sexual dysfunction.  I was previously on Risperdal (risperidone) which caused

an

extremely unpleasant case of tardive dyskinesia & extrapyramidal disorders. I simply cannot recommend these medications (Risperdal & Zoloft) too highly. And thanks to the Australian Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, they only cost me $2.80 per prescription as a pensioner (it would be $15.60 as a

general

patient. Tim Dicinoski.

Response:

I was hospitalised on Christmas Eve after taking 100 paracetamol during a major psychotic episode with paranoid delusions.  (It’s amazing I still have a functioning liver).  I am now taking Zyprexa (olanzapine) 5mg b.d. and Zoloft (sertraline)100mg b.d., and feel better than I have in years.  The only side effects I have experienced are dry mouth and (slight) sexual dysfunction.  I was previously on Risperdal (risperidone) which caused an extremely unpleasant case of tardive dyskinesia & extrapyramidal disorders. I simply cannot recommend these medications (Risperdal & Zoloft) too highly. And thanks to the Australian Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, they only cost me $2.80 per prescription as a pensioner (it would be $15.60 as a general patient. Tim Dicinoski.

Response:

Tim Dicinoski wrote…

me $2.80 per prescription as a pensioner (it would be $15.60 as a general patient.

Isn’t it $3.60 and $22.50? — Regards, .

Response:

Paracetamol is also known as acetaminophen. "Tim Dicinoski" <timino…@dodo.com.au

wrote in message

news:407406f8@news.comindico.com.au… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I was hospitalised on Christmas Eve after taking 100 paracetamol during a major psychotic episode with paranoid delusions.  (It’s amazing I still

have

a functioning liver).  I am now taking Zyprexa (olanzapine) 5mg b.d. and Zoloft (sertraline)100mg b.d., and feel better than I have in years.  The only side effects I have experienced are dry mouth and (slight) sexual dysfunction.  I was previously on Risperdal (risperidone) which caused an extremely unpleasant case of tardive dyskinesia & extrapyramidal

disorders.

I simply cannot recommend these medications (Risperdal & Zoloft) too

highly.

And thanks to the Australian Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, they only

cost

me $2.80 per prescription as a pensioner (it would be $15.60 as a general patient. Tim Dicinoski.

Response:

How much Risperdal were you taking, that allegedly led to the problems? "Tim Dicinoski" <timino…@dodo.com.au

wrote in message

news:407406f8@news.comindico.com.au… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I was hospitalised on Christmas Eve after taking 100 paracetamol during a major psychotic episode with paranoid delusions.  (It’s amazing I still

have

a functioning liver).  I am now taking Zyprexa (olanzapine) 5mg b.d. and Zoloft (sertraline)100mg b.d., and feel better than I have in years.  The only side effects I have experienced are dry mouth and (slight) sexual dysfunction.  I was previously on Risperdal (risperidone) which caused an extremely unpleasant case of tardive dyskinesia & extrapyramidal

disorders.

I simply cannot recommend these medications (Risperdal & Zoloft) too

highly.

And thanks to the Australian Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, they only

cost

me $2.80 per prescription as a pensioner (it would be $15.60 as a general patient. Tim Dicinoski.

Response:

are you an australian? "Tim Dicinoski" <timino…@dodo.com.au

wrote in message

news:407406f8@news.comindico.com.au… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I was hospitalised on Christmas Eve after taking 100 paracetamol during a major psychotic episode with paranoid delusions.  (It’s amazing I still

have

a functioning liver).  I am now taking Zyprexa (olanzapine) 5mg b.d. and Zoloft (sertraline)100mg b.d., and feel better than I have in years.  The only side effects I have experienced are dry mouth and (slight) sexual dysfunction.  I was previously on Risperdal (risperidone) which caused an extremely unpleasant case of tardive dyskinesia & extrapyramidal

disorders.

I simply cannot recommend these medications (Risperdal & Zoloft) too

highly.

And thanks to the Australian Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, they only

cost

me $2.80 per prescription as a pensioner (it would be $15.60 as a general patient. Tim Dicinoski.

Response:

Initially 1 mg b.d., increasing to 3 mg b.d. by week 4.  And the dyskinesia was hardly alleged: people thought I was a spastic. "Cubit" <n…@no.not

wrote in message

news:jm3dc.19516$LG5.13631@newssvr27.news.prodigy.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> How much Risperdal were you taking, that allegedly led to the problems? > "Tim Dicinoski" <timino…@dodo.com.au

wrote in message

> news:407406f8@news.comindico.com.au… > > I was hospitalised on Christmas Eve after taking 100 paracetamol during a

major psychotic episode with paranoid delusions.  (It’s amazing I still have a functioning liver).  I am now taking Zyprexa (olanzapine) 5mg b.d. and Zoloft (sertraline)100mg b.d., and feel better than I have in years.

The

only side effects I have experienced are dry mouth and (slight) sexual dysfunction.  I was previously on Risperdal (risperidone) which caused

an

extremely unpleasant case of tardive dyskinesia & extrapyramidal disorders. I simply cannot recommend these medications (Risperdal & Zoloft) too highly. And thanks to the Australian Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, they only cost me $2.80 per prescription as a pensioner (it would be $15.60 as a

general

patient. Tim Dicinoski.

Response:

I am currently on a very low dose of Risperdal, thank God. —– – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Cubit wrote:

How much Risperdal were you taking, that allegedly led to the problems?

Response:

good! join Madites Intelligence Agency! "Tim Dicinoski" <timino…@dodo.com.au

wrote in message

news:4074fc1e@news.comindico.com.au… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Yes, I am Australian. > "ABroaD" <lhj8…@hanafos.com

wrote in message

> news:c52s0m$f10$1@news.hananet.net… > > are you an australian? > > "Tim Dicinoski" <timino…@dodo.com.au

wrote in message

> > news:407406f8@news.comindico.com.au… > > > I was hospitalised on Christmas Eve after taking 100 paracetamol during

a major psychotic episode with paranoid delusions.  (It’s amazing I

still

have a functioning liver).  I am now taking Zyprexa (olanzapine) 5mg b.d.

and

Zoloft (sertraline)100mg b.d., and feel better than I have in years. The only side effects I have experienced are dry mouth and (slight) sexual dysfunction.  I was previously on Risperdal (risperidone) which caused an extremely unpleasant case of tardive dyskinesia & extrapyramidal disorders. I simply cannot recommend these medications (Risperdal & Zoloft) too highly. And thanks to the Australian Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, they only cost me $2.80 per prescription as a pensioner (it would be $15.60 as a general patient. Tim Dicinoski.

Response:

Question:

I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts.  They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day.  I have tried natural progesterone cream.  I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it.  My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks.  I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas?  Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana

Response:

" Does anyone have any ideas?  Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence?

Hi Nana, It’s my understanding that a Effexor, an antidepressant, is used to help hot flashes.  I was diagnosed almost twenty years ago and completed a year of CMF chemo a year after diagnosis.  The chemo induced a premature menopause and with it came the hot flashes.  They abated a bit for quite a few years, but are back now (probably coinciding with the time of my natural menopause).  I haven’t asked my Dr. about the Effexor because I know that the antidepressants come with some side effects.  While I hate the hot flashes, I’ll put up with them over the possible side effects of a tricyclic antidepressant.  Good luck to you! Barb

Response:

I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it.  My lump was ER+.

Susan Love debunks this on her site: http://www.susanlovemd.com/community/flashes/hotflash030725.htm

Response:

Barb, I think Effexor is not a tricyclic antidepressant. I believe it works in a similar way to the ‘new’ antidepressants like Prozac.  The older tricyclics have some unpleasant side effects but I understand that the new antidepressants are relatively free of significant side effects.  With Effexor, the main problems seem to be nausea, sweating and insomnia but I know that these don’t affect everybody and I suppose the severity must be related to the dose. My wife couldn’t tolerate these drugs after her chemo and she had to put up with the hot flashes.  However, I know people who get along just fine with Effexor and it is a great help to them.  It would be a shame if anybody had to suffer unnecessarily because of concerns about Effexor side effects. Some people don’t have any side effects at all. I know a lot of people don’t like the thought of taking antidepressants and it’s certainly not for me to say they are right or wrong.  However, if these drugs can help with the hot flashes, some might consider it worthwhile to speak to their doctor. Best wishes to you, Richard

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – " Does anyone have any ideas?  Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? Hi Nana, It’s my understanding that a Effexor, an antidepressant, is used to help hot flashes.  I was diagnosed almost twenty years ago and completed a year of CMF chemo a year after diagnosis.  The chemo induced a premature menopause and with it came the hot flashes.  They abated a bit for quite a few years, but are back now (probably coinciding with the time of my natural menopause).  I haven’t asked my Dr. about the Effexor because I know that the antidepressants come with some side effects.  While I hate the hot flashes, I’ll put up with them over the possible side effects of a tricyclic antidepressant.  Good luck to you! Barb

Response:

Hi Nana, I don’t know if this is true for all but whenever  I ate foods with sugar I would get an almost immediate hot flash.  Avoiding those foods helped a great deal.  Then, if and when I did get one I tried to ride it through like a wave on the ocean.  Doing that me feel like I had some sense of control and that helped, too. Do hope these are lessened for you—take care…

Response:

I had unbearable hot flashes after CMF-induced chemopause at age 43.  Every 20-30 minutes,  24/7, dripping sweat on the floor….  I tried the yam cream (no help), clonidine patches (wouldn’t stick I sweat so much)- finally my onc tried Effexor XR– I got almost immediate relief (I take 75 mg in the AM)  The major side effect is that it can raise your blood pressure.  I have zero side effects.  jeannette

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts. They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day.  I have tried natural progesterone cream.  I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it.  My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks.  I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas?  Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana

Response:

I am a little nervous.  I reviewed my pathology report and remembered that my lump was both ER+ and PR+.  I have been using the natural progesterone cream for 3 weeks.  Do you think this could have caused a problem? I am not going to use any more "natural" methods such as progesterone cream or black cohosh.  Black Cohosh is estrogen like and therefore could possibly encourage tumor growth.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts. They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day.  I have tried natural progesterone cream.  I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it.  My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks.  I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas?  Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana

Response:

Barb, I think Effexor is not a tricyclic antidepressant. I believe it works in a similar way to the ‘new’ antidepressants like Prozac.

You are correct; Effexor is a selective serotonin reuptake inhibiter (SSRI).  As with any drug, it may have unwanted side effects, but is generally better tolerated than the tricyclics (which aren’t that bad for many people).  Clonidine (Catapres(R)), an alpha adrenergic blocker usually used for blood pressure control helps some folks, as does Bellergal or similar mixtures, evening primrose oil, and vitamin E.  I think the SSRIs are currently preferred.  Zoloft and Effexor are both good. Both can be associated with either weight gain or loss; Effexor is a little more likely to cause weight loss than gain, while most of the others cause gain more frequently than loss. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The older tricyclics have some unpleasant side effects but I understand that the new antidepressants are relatively free of significant side effects.  With Effexor, the main problems seem to be nausea, sweating and insomnia but I know that these don’t affect everybody and I suppose the severity must be related to the dose. My wife couldn’t tolerate these drugs after her chemo and she had to put up with the hot flashes.  However, I know people who get along just fine with Effexor and it is a great help to them.  It would be a shame if anybody had to suffer unnecessarily because of concerns about Effexor side effects. Some people don’t have any side effects at all. I know a lot of people don’t like the thought of taking antidepressants and it’s certainly not for me to say they are right or wrong.  However, if these drugs can help with the hot flashes, some might consider it worthwhile to speak to their doctor. Best wishes to you, Richard " Does anyone have any ideas?  Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? Hi Nana, It’s my understanding that a Effexor, an antidepressant, is used to help hot flashes.  I was diagnosed almost twenty years ago and completed a year of CMF chemo a year after diagnosis.  The chemo induced a premature menopause and with it came the hot flashes.  They abated a bit for quite a few years, but are back now (probably coinciding with the time of my natural menopause).  I haven’t asked my Dr. about the Effexor because I know that the antidepressants come with some side effects.  While I hate the hot flashes, I’ll put up with them over the possible side effects of a tricyclic antidepressant.  Good luck to you! Barb

Response:

Thanks for the correction.  I knew when I wrote it that it didn’t look right, and should have known better.  My daughter took many, many of the SSRI’s a couple of years ago for postpartum depression.  She had a hard time finding the right one and did have significant side effects with this category of drugs.  That doesn’t mean that another person would have the same.  I just prefer to put up with the hot flashes rather than risk the possible side effects.  It’s great when a person gets the optimum benefit with few of the hassles, isn’t it?  Thanks again for clearing my "boo-boo". Barb

Response:

Hi, Nana:     I must be one of the weird ones. I have the hot flashes, but I love the blinkin’ things — first time I’ve been warm in years.     I was also ER+. Nonetheless, when I started having the hot flashes, by onc offered to put me on an estrogen ring which would emit just enough estrogen to keep the hot flashes down but not enough to exacerbate the cancer. I didn’t take it because, as I said, I’m crazy and love my hot flashes.     If any body here would have an answer for you, it would be Tim. As far as I’m concerned, he’s our guru. But I wouldn’t take anything without talking first with your oncologist. Until you do, grab a fan and ice water, girlfriend! I wish I could take your flashes for you. I only get them every 3 minutes!     Hugs,         Mary K

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am a little nervous.  I reviewed my pathology report and remembered that my lump was both ER+ and PR+.  I have been using the natural progesterone cream for 3 weeks.  Do you think this could have caused a problem? I am not going to use any more "natural" methods such as progesterone cream or black cohosh.  Black Cohosh is estrogen like and therefore could possibly encourage tumor growth. I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts. They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day.  I have tried natural progesterone cream.  I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it.  My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks.  I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas?  Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana

Response:

I don’t really know very much about this.  I would certainly think that progesterone cream was a bad idea if the cancer is PR+, however the effect on potential tumours is relatively long term, so I doubt that 3 weeks has caused a problem. With regard to Black Cohosh and its ilk, there seem to be differing opinions, and the research results seem to be uncertain.  One obviously wants to minimise estrogen activity, but to replace the function of estrogen in -parts- of the body.  So the fact that it is estrogen-like is not necessarily a bad thing, it depends on the specific effects on breast cancer tissue, ie which particular estrogen receptors it can bind to.  After all Tamoxifen is estrogen-like in that it binds to estrogen receptors, but of course having done so it dos not activate them. I wouldn’t rule it out yet, but I’d read up on the latest research before using it, and of course consult with your oncologist before prescribing yourself anything, ‘natural’ or otherwise. Tim Jackson – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     If any body here would have an answer for you, it would be Tim. I am a little nervous.  I reviewed my pathology report and remembered that my lump was both ER+ and PR+.  I have been using the natural progesterone cream for 3 weeks.  Do you think this could have caused a problem? I am not going to use any more "natural" methods such as progesterone cream or black cohosh.  Black Cohosh is estrogen like and therefore could possibly encourage tumor growth.

Response:

Too bad the abstract didn’t list WHICH Vit. E — there are four, each with it’s own individual properties. Lady8

Response:

<< Too bad the abstract didn’t list WHICH Vit. E — there are four, each with it’s own individual properties. Lady8   I don’t know that much about vitamins but do think we need to be cautious about anything out-of-the norm that we opt to take.  One important fact about vitamins and supplements–they are considered dietary aids and are under different regulations for manufacture than medications.  What is contained and what the label states is contained do not have to be the same.  Because they are considered ‘dietary,’ they are allowed some leeway in that regard.  So, if decides to take them it is good to ascertain whether or not the company that you are getting them from guarantees that the ingredients and % of amounts are accurate.  Some vitamin manufacturers, however, do guarantee that their products and labels are accurate  even though they are not required to do so (state that they are guaranteed, accurate, or even be accurate).

Response:

Dee wrote <<   The Vitamin E worked to reduce the severity and made the flashes tolerable.  I was surprised at a doctor making that suggestion. I really don’t know alot about vitamins but there appear to be mixed reviews on whether they are or aren’t good for those with breast cancer. "http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/htbin-post/Entrez/query?uid=11807780&form… b=m&Dopt=r "1: Int J Cancer 2002 Feb 10;97(5):574-9 Oxidant-antioxidant status in relation to survival among breast cancer patients. Saintot M, Mathieu-Daude H, Astre C, Grenier J, Simony-Lafontaine J, Gerber M. Centre de Recherche en Cancerologie, INSERM-CRLCC, Val D’Aurelle, Parc Euromedecine, Montpellier, France. The role of plasma oxidant-antioxidant status in survival after breast cancer surgery was investigated in a cohort of patients (n = 363) hospitalized in Southern France between 1989 and 1992. The median follow-up was 8 years after surgery for histologically confirmed breast cancer. Plasma analyses were performed after diagnosis and before surgery and adjuvant therapy. We found an inverse relationship between plasma lipoperoxides (MDA) and tumor size at diagnosis, together with higher lipoperoxide levels in node-negative tumors than in node-positive ones (TNM). The longitudinal approach revealed an increased risk of recurrence for patients with plasma lipoperoxides in the highest tertile of the sample (RR = 2.1, 95% CI 1.1-4.0). In addition, the risk of recurrence increased (RR = 1.7, 95%CI 1.0-3.0), after adjustment for the known prognostic factors (TNM), for patients with plasma lipid-adjusted vitamin E levels of over 22 micromol/l. The risk of breast cancer death was twice as great for patients with plasma lipid-adjusted vitamin E levels above this value. Excesses of plasma lipoperoxides and vitamin E appear to be factors in poor prognosis for breast cancer-specific survival (OVS) and disease-free survival (DFS), respectively, independent of tumor characteristics at diagnosis. Several hypotheses are advanced to explain the possible role of plasma vitamin E as a factor in poor prognosis for survival. Copyright 2001 Wiley-Liss, Inc. MeSH Terms: *       Adult *       Aged *       Aged, 80 and over *       Antioxidants/metabolism* *       Biological Markers/blood *       Breast Neoplasms/surgery *       Breast Neoplasms/secondary *       Breast Neoplasms/mortality* *       Breast Neoplasms/metabolism* *       Carcinoma, Infiltrating Duct/surgery *       Carcinoma, Infiltrating Duct/secondary *       Carcinoma, Infiltrating Duct/metabolism* *       Carcinoma, Infiltrating Duct/epidemiology *       Carcinoma, Intraductal, Noninfiltrating/surgery *       Carcinoma, Intraductal, Noninfiltrating/metabolism* *       Carcinoma, Intraductal, Noninfiltrating/epidemiology *       Carcinoma, Lobular/surgery *       Carcinoma, Lobular/secondary *       Carcinoma, Lobular/metabolism* *       Carcinoma, Lobular/epidemiology *       Cholesterol/blood *       Cohort Studies *       Disease-Free Survival *       Female *       Follow-Up Studies *       France/epidemiology *       Human *       Lipid Peroxides/blood *       Longitudinal Studies *       Lymphatic Metastasis *       Middle Age *       Neoplasm Recurrence, Local *       Oxidants/blood* *       Receptors, Estrogen/metabolism *       Survival Rate Substances: *       Cholesterol *       Receptors, Estrogen *       Oxidants *       Lipid Peroxides *       Biological Markers *       Antioxidants PMID: 11807780 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]"

Response:

Interesting.  I suppose I could learn.  No I hadn’t heard of that either One might theorise about the tissue’s response to T which makes it ineffective after five years.  Something like preferentially breeding cell lines which are resistant to T.  Perhaps a similar effect occurs in other tissues and maybe that can cause a withdrawal effect when you stop. Do you know which arm of ATAC you were on, or is it totally blind? Tim

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t really know very much about this. Well perhaps you know something about this: In late June I finished the five year course of the ATAC programme (Arimidex, Tamoxifen, Alone or Combined). About two weeks after that I had a hot flush (being English – it’s what we say!) The incidents have increased, now I have them two or three times a day. Might there be a link? Mary (not due to menopause, that was fourteen years ago!)

Response:

Interesting.  I suppose I could learn.  No I hadn’t heard of that either One might theorise about the tissue’s response to T which makes it ineffective after five years.  Something like preferentially breeding cell lines which are resistant to T.  Perhaps a similar effect occurs in other tissues and maybe that can cause a withdrawal effect when you stop. Do you know which arm of ATAC you were on, or is it totally blind?

Totally blind. No clues at all. No-one knows. As I said, it might not be related but the co-incidence at my age might be significant. As you said, it’s interesting Mary – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Tim I don’t really know very much about this. Well perhaps you know something about this: In late June I finished the five year course of the ATAC programme (Arimidex, Tamoxifen, Alone or Combined). About two weeks after that I had a hot flush (being English – it’s what we say!) The incidents have increased, now I have them two or three times a day. Might there be a link? Mary (not due to menopause, that was fourteen years ago!)

Response:

My problem is I don’t understand what mechanism causes the hot flushes.  I understand that they happen in estrogen withdrawal, but I don’t know why. My thinking about Tamoxifen resistance is that most of our body tissues are constantly slowly being renewed, especially those in which cancer can occur. So if we change the regime of growth factors in which this happen we prevent the cell lines which are promoted by the particular growth factor, in this case estrogen, from being replaced as they die out, and cell lines which use other mechanisms become prevalent.  Pure Darwin.  And so the tissue becomes refractory to the drug.  We know the cells have the potential to use different growth factors because we get cancers which do.  This mechanism would equally apply to aromatase inhibitors, it is directly dependent on the absence of estrogen stimulation however caused and exactly parallels the cancer suppression. If this is the mechanism then one would expect the incidence of ER+ cancers to have fallen immediately the drug was introduced, to a plateau where it would pretty much stay even after the drug was eventually withdrawn, but the incidence of ER- cancers would have slowly risen because of the increased proportion of non-estrogen dependent cell lines (but of course not by as much as the ER+ fell, because they are the prevalent cancer).  Another prediction of the model is that if a woman who was post 5 years Tamoxifen took estrogen therapy, or became pregnant, her breasts would not enlarge as much as they normally do. In this scenario it is clear that the reintroduction of estrogen would do -something- although it would have little effect on breast tissue growth. It should for example still inhibit osteoclasts (bone removal cells), as the removal of an inhibition would not have suppressed cell line evolution.  If I understood how estrogen withdrawal actually causes spurious fluctuations in the temperature control system, then maybe I could use this model to explain a similar effect on reintroduction. Tim Jackson – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – One might theorise about the tissue’s response to T which makes it ineffective after five years. In late June I finished the five year course of the ATAC programme (Arimidex, Tamoxifen, Alone or Combined). About two weeks after that I had a hot flush (being English – it’s what we say!)

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My problem is I don’t understand what mechanism causes the hot flushes.  I understand that they happen in estrogen withdrawal, but I don’t know why. My thinking about Tamoxifen resistance is that most of our body tissues are constantly slowly being renewed, especially those in which cancer can occur. So if we change the regime of growth factors in which this happen we prevent the cell lines which are promoted by the particular growth factor, in this case estrogen, from being replaced as they die out, and cell lines which use other mechanisms become prevalent.  Pure Darwin.  And so the tissue becomes refractory to the drug.  We know the cells have the potential to use different growth factors because we get cancers which do.  This mechanism would equally apply to aromatase inhibitors, it is directly dependent on the absence of estrogen stimulation however caused and exactly parallels the cancer suppression.

Um. I -think- I understand some of that … If this is the mechanism then one would expect the incidence of ER+ cancers to have fallen immediately the drug was introduced, to a plateau where it would pretty much stay even after the drug was eventually withdrawn, but the incidence of ER- cancers would have slowly risen because of the increased proportion of non-estrogen dependent cell lines (but of course not by as much as the ER+ fell, because they are the prevalent cancer).  Another prediction of the model is that if a woman who was post 5 years Tamoxifen took estrogen therapy, or became pregnant, her breasts would not enlarge as much as they normally do.

Mine was ER+, I -think- that’s comforting … In this scenario it is clear that the reintroduction of estrogen would do -something- although it would have little effect on breast tissue growth. It should for example still inhibit osteoclasts (bone removal cells), as the removal of an inhibition would not have suppressed cell line evolution.

As I -think- I unerstand that it suggests that I should have estrogen re-introduced – although perhaps I’m still producing my own. I was tested post menopausally be pre-cancer diagnosis and told I had an excess of estrogen. If I understood how estrogen withdrawal actually causes spurious fluctuations in the temperature control system, then maybe I could use this model to explain a similar effect on reintroduction.

Of course I only started the flushes at menopause but all my life I’ve been a hot and sweaty person. Still am. I sweat in bed while Spouse shivers, he’s always warmed himself on me. Today I’m in shorts and T-shirt (not a pretty sight but I’m comfortable). He’s in jeans and sweat shirt. He says it’s because his thermostat works and mine doesn’t Mary – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Tim Jackson One might theorise about the tissue’s response to T which makes it ineffective after five years. In late June I finished the five year course of the ATAC programme (Arimidex, Tamoxifen, Alone or Combined). About two weeks after that I had a hot flush (being English – it’s what we say!)

Response:

No one has mentioned Vitamin E pills?  Tthe gyn recommended trying it and said there were prescription drugs that might help, if it didn’t.  The Vitamin E worked to reduce the severity and made the flashes tolerable.  I was surprised at a doctor making that suggestion. Also, don’t some people call them "power surges."

I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts.  They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day.  I have tried natural progesterone cream.  I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it.  My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks.  I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas?  Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana

Response:

No one has mentioned Vitamin E pills?  Tthe gyn recommended trying it and said there were prescription drugs that might help, if it didn’t.  The Vitamin E worked to reduce the severity and made the flashes tolerable.  I was surprised at a doctor making that suggestion. Also, don’t some people call them "power surges."

LOL! I’ll try to remember that Mary

Response:

Yeah, they do call them power surges! Believe me, my power *really* surges, too!! I do take the Vitamin E. 2,000IU per day. It also is supposed to help the mind and is recommended often for Alzheimer’s patients. I must be hopeless: I still have the hot flashes BIG time. My husband has the Alzheimer’s disease and he does seem to be doing pretty well. I, on the other hand, forget where I put my car keys, checkbook, etc. Mary K

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No one has mentioned Vitamin E pills?  Tthe gyn recommended trying it and said there were prescription drugs that might help, if it didn’t.  The Vitamin E worked to reduce the severity and made the flashes tolerable.  I was surprised at a doctor making that suggestion. Also, don’t some people call them "power surges." I know this is a common subject, but hot flashes are driving me nuts. They started near the end of chemo. I have about 20 a day.  I have tried natural progesterone cream.  I was interested in black cohosh, but after reading on the internet that it is "estrogen-like", I am afraid of it.  My lump was ER+. I have been using the progesterone cream for 3 weeks.  I have seen absolutely no abatement of the hot flashes with this. Does anyone have any ideas?  Is there anything which works but does not increase the chances of recurrence? thanks, nana

Response:

the reintroduction of estrogen would… for example still inhibit osteoclasts (bone removal cells) As I -think- I unerstand that it suggests that I should have estrogen re-introduced – although perhaps I’m still producing my own. I was tested post menopausally be pre-cancer diagnosis and told I had an excess of estrogen.

Yes. I wouldn’t advocate adding to what you already produce yourself.  That shouldn’t have changed. Of course I only started the flushes at menopause but all my life I’ve been a hot and sweaty person. Still am. I sweat in bed while Spouse shivers, he’s always warmed himself on me. Today I’m in shorts and T-shirt (not a pretty sight but I’m comfortable). He’s in jeans and sweat shirt. He says it’s because his thermostat works and mine doesn’t

Yes, this is the fascinating bit.  I know everyone’s thermostat is different and it depends on body weight and things, and it probably has something to do with fat metabolism, and so does (aromatase) estrogen production, but I can’t quite see the connection all the same. Tim

Response:

I don’t really know very much about this.

Well perhaps you know something about this: In late June I finished the five year course of the ATAC programme (Arimidex, Tamoxifen, Alone or Combined). About two weeks after that I had a hot flush (being English – it’s what we say!) The incidents have increased, now I have them two or three times a day. Might there be a link? Mary (not due to menopause, that was fourteen years ago!)

Response:

Question:

Carol: I took Paxil for a year, then switched to Celexa. The latter had far fewer side effects for me. Have you discussed this with your doctor? Best, Anne

Response:

I have been on Celexa, 30mg, for 6-8 weeks now. I have not noticed any side effect whatsoever. I am quite happy with it. AnxiousCollegeKid

Response:

This is a just a "me-too" to SSRI side-effects. The zoloft and effexor I tried out caused nothing but problems… -Doug (remove "botizer" from email addy to respond)

Response:

Hi all, Having a great deal of difficulty with the side effects of the SSRIs, and also having trouble sticking w/them as a result. Which SSRIs do you think have the least side effects? Thanks, Carol

Response:

:Hi all, : :Having a great deal of difficulty with the side effects of the SSRIs, and :also having trouble sticking w/them as a result. : :Which SSRIs do you think have the least side effects? : :Thanks, :Carol Dear Carol, There really is no easy answer to your question being reactions to meds are so very individualized. One SSRI that quite a few are having good luck with is Celexa. However, there is no guarantee that this AD would cause you the least amount of side-effects. How many SSRI`s have you tried? There is also a chance that you just can`t tolerate SSRI`s. You might want to talk to your doctor about the Tricyclic class of antidepressants, they are as effective as the SSRI`s. Take care Jackie ~*~In Everything You Hope Or Do, I`ll Encourage And Believe In You~*~

Response:

Hi all, Having a great deal of difficulty with the side effects of the SSRIs, and also having trouble sticking w/them as a result. Which SSRIs do you think have the least side effects? Thanks, Carol

This is very much an YMMV matter, our reactions to meds are so individual. In theory Celexa is supposed to have the lowest side effects profile of the SSRI’s. You are not married to SSRI’s by the way, there are other antidepressants out there too (such as the TCA’s). Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – X-No-archive: yes Hi, I posted here almost 2 years ago after suffering a series of panic attacks and extreme anxiety for abt 6 months. Months later, the anxiety is still around, though not as severe. I never had any treatment and it seemed to subside, although my eating habits have remained permanently screwed up. I’ve also had to deal with chronic severe endometriosis, which I finally had treatment for this year, so it has been fairly tough!! My problem is that I am due to begin my Honours year in psychology (ironic? I think so) next year and, to put it frankly, I am terrified that the anxiety is going to come back a lot worse. I already feel sick and shaky thinking about it, and I feel myself getting more and more agitated as the end of the year draws closer. This time, I want to take some kind of medication to help me through it, but I’m unsure when I should see a doctor and request it — since the university year runs from March – November here, I’m thinking early January, so I’ll have the chance to find something that will work hopefully and give it a chance to kick in? I want medication because, looking back, I can remember instances of extreme anxiety dating back to when I was 5 years old, which kinda suggests to me that it might be some kind of neurotransmitter imbalance as opposed to something learnt or directly environmentally triggered. I’ve had this all of my life, and it’s only now that it’s really starting to drive me crazy. I’m so scared I won’t find a med that will work for me. My fingers are just crossed that I will! Any advice on the kind of medication to take? I know that it varies, but I have friends who have taken Zoloft for anxiety and found it very effective, and I’m a little wary of Aropax (Paxil) due to the withdrawal symptoms I have heard about. Any comments/advice would most appreciated. Take care xxxxxxxx

I just started taking klonopin.  It is a benzo.  I like the ideas of benzo because if you have side effects or do not like them you simply stop and they are not in your system forever.  Like SSRI like Prozac Zoloft Celexa paxil all take at least 2 to 3 weeks of nasty side effects and making anxiety worse before you feel any relief  then if you feel you cannot stand the side effects and stop they stay in your system for like 2 or more weeks still!  Benzo is just a fancy term for tranquilizer.  I take .25 Klonopin once in the morning and once at night.  I have only been on it a week but like it so far. Also Benzo family work instantly like the very first pill you take it reduces anxiety.  The only thing is the firs day or so you may feel a little tired while you body adjusts.  Then the sleepiness for me went away but the anti anxiety calm feeling is staying so far! Good Luck! Dustin

Response:

Cool Dustin, I am glad it is working for you.  Good luck when you put the dosage up again. If it is working now, it will continue to work for you when you add a bit more, then you can concentrate on your "baby steps" getting out in that big wide world again! Take care Imogen

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – X-No-archive: yes Hi, I posted here almost 2 years ago after suffering a series of panic attacks and extreme anxiety for abt 6 months. Months later, the anxiety is still around, though not as severe. I never had any treatment and it seemed to subside, although my eating habits have remained permanently screwed up. I’ve also had to deal with chronic severe endometriosis, which I finally had treatment for this year, so it has been fairly tough!! My problem is that I am due to begin my Honours year in psychology (ironic? I think so) next year and, to put it frankly, I am terrified that the anxiety is going to come back a lot worse. I already feel sick and shaky thinking about it, and I feel myself getting more and more agitated as the end of the year draws closer. This time, I want to take some kind of medication to help me through it, but I’m unsure when I should see a doctor and request it — since the university year runs from March – November here, I’m thinking early January, so I’ll have the chance to find something that will work hopefully and give it a chance to kick in? I want medication because, looking back, I can remember instances of extreme anxiety dating back to when I was 5 years old, which kinda suggests to me that it might be some kind of neurotransmitter imbalance as opposed to something learnt or directly environmentally triggered. I’ve had this all of my life, and it’s only now that it’s really starting to drive me crazy. I’m so scared I won’t find a med that will work for me. My fingers are just crossed that I will! Any advice on the kind of medication to take? I know that it varies, but I have friends who have taken Zoloft for anxiety and found it very effective, and I’m a little wary of Aropax (Paxil) due to the withdrawal symptoms I have heard about. Any comments/advice would most appreciated. Take care xxxxxxxx I just started taking klonopin.  It is a benzo.  I like the ideas of benzo because if you have side effects or do not like them you simply stop and they are not in your system forever.  Like SSRI like Prozac Zoloft Celexa paxil all take at least 2 to 3 weeks of nasty side effects and making anxiety worse before you feel any relief  then if you feel you cannot stand the side effects and stop they stay in your system for like 2 or more weeks still!  Benzo is just a fancy term for tranquilizer.  I take .25 Klonopin once in the morning and once at night.  I have only been on it a week but like it so far. Also Benzo family work instantly like the very first pill you take it reduces anxiety.  The only thing is the firs day or so you may feel a little tired while you body adjusts.  Then the sleepiness for me went away but the anti anxiety calm feeling is staying so far! Good Luck! Dustin

Response:

Hello, I don’t see any reason for waiting. Why not see a specialist now. You may not need medication. Therapy may help but if you need medication as well it would be helpful to sort it out during your break, rather than worrying about it until next year. Sorry about the endometriosis but I’m pleased you have had treatment. I have been taking medication for years. A combination of Xanax and Efexor XR works for me but we are all different. Welcome to another Aussie. Take care, Meryl (Melbourne)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – X-No-archive: yes Hi, I posted here almost 2 years ago after suffering a series of panic attacks and extreme anxiety for abt 6 months. Months later, the anxiety is still around, though not as severe. I never had any treatment and it seemed to subside, although my eating habits have remained permanently screwed up. I’ve also had to deal with chronic severe endometriosis, which I finally had treatment for this year, so it has been fairly tough!! My problem is that I am due to begin my Honours year in psychology (ironic? I think so) next year and, to put it frankly, I am terrified that the anxiety is going to come back a lot worse. I already feel sick and shaky thinking about it, and I feel myself getting more and more agitated as the end of the year draws closer. This time, I want to take some kind of medication to help me through it, but I’m unsure when I should see a doctor and request it — since the university year runs from March – November here, I’m thinking early January, so I’ll have the chance to find something that will work hopefully and give it a chance to kick in? I want medication because, looking back, I can remember instances of extreme anxiety dating back to when I was 5 years old, which kinda suggests to me that it might be some kind of neurotransmitter imbalance as opposed to something learnt or directly environmentally triggered. I’ve had this all of my life, and it’s only now that it’s really starting to drive me crazy. I’m so scared I won’t find a med that will work for me. My fingers are just crossed that I will! Any advice on the kind of medication to take? I know that it varies, but I have friends who have taken Zoloft for anxiety and found it very effective, and I’m a little wary of Aropax (Paxil) due to the withdrawal symptoms I have heard about. Any comments/advice would most appreciated. Take care xxxxxxxx

Response:

Question:

I’ve just come back from the doctor, (who was a locum, not my usual doc)  and explained my nasty side effects and withdrawal symptoms to him (see my posting yesterday). I told him about this newsgroup and several websites that back-up mine and other stories, and that I was by no means a single case of these effects. He said he was very worried as I seemed not to be able to stop taking the Effexor, and would be urgently contacting the manufacturers and notifying the Committee for Safety of Medicines (government organisation in UK). I hope he has some success. He asked me to revisit him next week, when I hope to be a little more in the know. I’m cutting down to 37.5mg twice a day, but deep down I know this won’t help. What this situation needs is a real investigation. Sure, it helps a lot of people, but for many it is a nightmare. Anyway, I’m waffling on; bye for now. Peter Finan Bradford U.K

Response:

I just quit Effexor XR with my pmd’d permission today.  Didn’t have very nice side effects and after the extreme headache I got last night, I said, please, no more.  I am not prone to headaches.  I was only up to 75 mg once a day, so it doesn’t appear to be a problem. I will keep you all posted! Marilyn – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve just come back from the doctor, (who was a locum, not my usual doc)  and explained my nasty side effects and withdrawal symptoms to him (see my posting yesterday). I told him about this newsgroup and several websites that back-up mine and other stories, and that I was by no means a single case of these effects. He said he was very worried as I seemed not to be able to stop taking the Effexor, and would be urgently contacting the manufacturers and notifying the Committee for Safety of Medicines (government organisation in UK). I hope he has some success. He asked me to revisit him next week, when I hope to be a little more in the know. I’m cutting down to 37.5mg twice a day, but deep down I know this won’t help. What this situation needs is a real investigation. Sure, it helps a lot of people, but for many it is a nightmare. Anyway, I’m waffling on; bye for now. Peter Finan Bradford U.K

Response:

I had a horrible time coming off Effexor, in bed for most of six days. The thing that helped me out of it was Prozac (fluoxetine). I took 20mg-40mg per day until I was able to get my new AD up to a high enough dose. Prozac was the best for me because I had taken it before with no side effects and because it has a long half life and wouldn’t cause its own bad withdrawal effects. (I had withdrawal side effects with Paxil (paroxotine) too.) Roger

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve just come back from the doctor, (who was a locum, not my usual doc) and explained my nasty side effects and withdrawal symptoms to him (see my posting yesterday). I told him about this newsgroup and several websites that back-up mine and other stories, and that I was by no means a single case of these effects. He said he was very worried as I seemed not to be able to stop taking the Effexor, and would be urgently contacting the manufacturers and notifying the Committee for Safety of Medicines (government organisation in UK). I hope he has some success. He asked me to revisit him next week, when I hope to be a little more in the know. I’m cutting down to 37.5mg twice a day, but deep down I know this won’t help. What this situation needs is a real investigation. Sure, it helps a lot of people, but for many it is a nightmare. Anyway, I’m waffling on; bye for now. Peter Finan Bradford U.K

Response:

Question:

    Uh, just a thought. How high a dose of thyroid hormones are you on? T3 ? T4? Both maybe? The reason I ask is that if you are on too high a dose you can get shaky BUT when I was extremely hypo I shook pretty bad too. I never took Xanax, I take Valium. I think it is gentler on the system than Xanax. Do you take in much caffeine in the course of a day? Caffeine will make your hands tremble too. The adrenals can cause problems and often go hand in hand with thyroid problems, just another thing to consider.     Being a guy, I can’t vouch for if menopause would cause this but I can tell you I’ve never heard of it, even though it can do some strange things so I don’t discount that either ( I told you I might not have a good answer for you ).     Did you by chance have a recent copy of any tests you had done? Posting them here will get you replies that might be a bit more revealing or at least tell you a bit more about what is going on. "PowerPoster" <powerpos…@nospam.com

wrote in message

news:tNOu6.104188$tP3.1638117@news1.rdc1.bc.home.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Hi, my main questions were: – is constant tremor ever experienced by any of you on thyroid

replacement,

or who took xanax – do any of the women reading this have menopausal symptoms at the same

time > and have any of your doctors figured out which is menopause and which is > thyroid related. If so, has estrogen helped? > John Riggs <johnri32…@yahoo.com

wrote in message

> news:99ebgv$qa94$1@ID-41632.news.dfncis.de… > >     You don’t want junk mail? Gosh, and I was so looking forward to > sending > > mine off to some underprivileged soul > >     I’m sorry, I read your post but I lost track of what it was you were > > asking. Could you post a short, eentsy, version just for me? Pretty > please? > > I promise to give an answer, even if it’s wrong. > >     Thanks > >             John > > "PowerPoster" <powerpos…@nospam.com

wrote in message

> > news:Aoxu6.96934$tP3.1557994@news1.rdc1.bc.home.com… > > > Sorry, i forgot to give my address for those who can reply, it is > > > suz…@yahoo.com. Although I also will read the newsgroup. Thanks. I > > didn’t > > > have it in my preferences to avoid masses of unwanted junk mail.

Response:

    You don’t want junk mail? Gosh, and I was so looking forward to sending mine off to some underprivileged soul     I’m sorry, I read your post but I lost track of what it was you were asking. Could you post a short, eentsy, version just for me? Pretty please? I promise to give an answer, even if it’s wrong.     Thanks             John "PowerPoster" <powerpos…@nospam.com

wrote in message

news:Aoxu6.96934$tP3.1557994@news1.rdc1.bc.home.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Sorry, i forgot to give my address for those who can reply, it is suz…@yahoo.com. Although I also will read the newsgroup. Thanks. I

didn’t

have it in my preferences to avoid masses of unwanted junk mail.

Response:

Hi, my main questions were: – is constant tremor ever experienced by any of you on thyroid replacement, or who took xanax – do any of the women reading this have menopausal symptoms at the same time and have any of your doctors figured out which is menopause and which is thyroid related. If so, has estrogen helped? John Riggs <johnri32…@yahoo.com

wrote in message

news:99ebgv$qa94$1@ID-41632.news.dfncis.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

    You don’t want junk mail? Gosh, and I was so looking forward to

sending

mine off to some underprivileged soul     I’m sorry, I read your post but I lost track of what it was you were asking. Could you post a short, eentsy, version just for me? Pretty

please? > I promise to give an answer, even if it’s wrong. >     Thanks >             John > "PowerPoster" <powerpos…@nospam.com

wrote in message

> news:Aoxu6.96934$tP3.1557994@news1.rdc1.bc.home.com… > > Sorry, i forgot to give my address for those who can reply, it is > > suz…@yahoo.com. Although I also will read the newsgroup. Thanks. I > didn’t > > have it in my preferences to avoid masses of unwanted junk mail.

Response:

Sorry, i forgot to give my address for those who can reply, it is suz…@yahoo.com. Although I also will read the newsgroup. Thanks. I didn’t have it in my preferences to avoid masses of unwanted junk mail.

Response:

HI Suze, I better leave someone who knows more about thyroid to answer your post but I thought I would let the US readers know that the  CES you mention is a plant based conjugated estrogen similiar to Cenestin sold in the US. I’ve also removed the other newsgroup for this reply. Kathryn kathr…@telus.net On Thu, 22 Mar 2001 22:07:46 GMT, "PowerPoster" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<powerpos…@nospam.com

wrote: I went to my dr. today to get the results of my blood test last week. He won’t give them on the phone. It was very hard driving there, I have constant tremors and they are worsening. However, he dismissed them as well as my shivering and arm and leg weakness, these all have been with me only since early Feb, for no known reason. For the first time he chose not to order a TSH – only a free T4. So, it was 20.8. Normal range is 10.5 to 20.0, so it is just slightly high, but that then might explain why I have felt attacks of hyper adrenaline? And yet, I have felt ill and almost comatose on a lower dose, previously, and was attempting not to be hypothyroid. But he says that 100 mcg is too high and 75 would be too low, so I must now take .88. My last test a few months ago, the free t4 was 18 or high normal, and I was taking 100 then too, and told to stay on 100. Then I was switched by my endocrinologist to a combo of T4 and T3, which was excessive and made me have more heart pounding than usual, and I stopped the T3. I also felt hypo on the divided dose .50-T4, .12-T3 regimen, but more T3 seemed to make me have more sudden bursts of heart pounding. Even with the combined dose, the equivalent I tried to get was 100 mcg a day as it seemed to make me feel less ill and less hypo than other doses. I have years of journals to analyze for symptoms and doses; it has not helped me find an answer. It is always either too high or too low, with a euthyroid feeling appearing so rarely that maybe 2 or 3 times in ten years I have felt it and diarized it as a massively red letter day, virtually a feeling of euphoria. This euthyroid is the way I felt for the rest of my life  the first 45 years until the diseases started. Just able to function and feeling well. So my T4 is slightly high, and I should therefore not have hypo symptoms, which I do still have – feeling suddenly sleepy at any time and falling asleep for an hour or two. (Yet I have insomnia late at night, and spells of hyper, surging, too much unuseable adrenaline coursing through me). Swelling feet and legs, no appetite, hair falling out in my brush and when I wash it in huge clumps, trouble with digestion when I do eat, but the number one hypo symptom I have day and night is freezing cold, shivering, every day, unrelated to the temperature, that nothing will warm up until it passes. It’s an internal thing.  The constant tremors are not always shivering from cold…sometimes I have them together. These are NOT hyper symptoms so why would I think the dose was too high? My basal temperataure, when I get up, has ranged from 97.3 to 98.2, which I believe is normal according to Dr. Broda Barnes. One would think my dose was good. In the past the temperature was in the 96 range, and yet I felt better then, at a lower dose, though I had the hypo symptoms. Someone posted the query, which would you rather be – hypo or hyper? Choosing between them is something I have always had to do, and each one becomes horrific, causing me to go the other way for a time. Can this constant seesawing be causing the new problems? If one has to choose, hypo is less debilitating and life-destroying. One gets fat with painful joints, and slow, and placid, and confused, but there is a calm. And yet, then one is wistful for the energetic bursts, relative fit body and occasional clear thinking one did have even with the accompanying high anxiety, nervous state. As I am trying to explain, now I seem to be both hyper and hypo, but the test says slightly hyper. Besides the T4 test I had an FSH test. A year or so ago it was still normal, 22, now it is 47, which is out of range. Though I have had perimenopausal symptoms – severe ones, and all of them, for 6 years now, my tests were always in the normal range until now. So he gave me estrogen – CES, a ‘natural’ plant based one. He said more women were against Premarin now (which I used to be, but now I don’t care – I just want relief). I will take them, what else can I do? Hoping it will help. I studied this 3 or 4 years ago and was even given both Premarin and CES by doctors at the time of my hot flashes but I did not have good results and stopped them. Now that the hormone levels have changed maybe this is the answer. Does anyone have experience with CES? I have become a querulous, middle aged woman whom no one wants to know about, I suddenly realized in his office when facing his contempt and his lack of sympathy for me as a person, and his dismissing my complete worsening in the last 2 months…..his restating what he always states: "We’ll have to see if this gets the thyroid in range…" In ten years nothing has worked, and currently I am worse than ever before. My health has deteriorated drastically since around last October. The pains, weakness, unsteadiness, tremor are considered ‘essential tremor’ by a neurologist, and fibromyalgia by a rheumatologist, but there is NO treatment for these…until I take the .88 T4 for a while and if I don’t improve then my g.p. will give me a form of propanolol. This is the same thing I took when I first got Graves’ disease in 1989 and before the radiation. Why is this happening? If the T4 level is so  high then why not just stop the thyroid and become completely hypothyroid, that will calm me and make me placid like a cow, and overweight….which is what happened last year, i basically had ONLY intense muscle pain and hot flashes most of the time. No anxiety or heart pounding attacks, tremors or shivering. I don’t MIND hot flashes. I wish that was all I did have again. I learned to accept and deal with them. I cannot deal with a head tremor and weak muscles. Even my jaw feels sprained after chewing; I cannot hold a cup with one hand. If 100 was such a massive dose that it makes me hyper, then why the combined symptoms which include hypo items like hair loss, cold, confusion, cognitive problems with words and memory, and the rest? My God, I am at the end of my rope, and other than an expensive holistic doctor or naturopath, who might have an insight and might just be a quack, there is nowhere else to turn. It is not a simple matter to change doctors. I can barely stand to go to the ones I do have, that already know my complicated case. It is an ordeal, as everything is such an effort now. But my mind objects, wanting a way out of this nightmare. There surely is a first cause somewhere….the only one I know of is the Graves’ disease, the hyperthyroid suddenly in 1989. Everything else followed. I’ve said this before, I was an energetic, smart, normal looking and successful working mother with many friends and a full life and unbounded energy. And after the treatment I still functioned until 1996 when my body just began to be unable to function. The menopausal stuff began in 1994 and yes I did get worse after that, but nothing helped, and by 1996 I was too disabled to work. Four years now have been lost from my life because of iatrogenic disease. My psychiatrist says it is iatrogenic – doctor-caused. Wrong treatment, wrong pills. I no longer have a thyroid, and nothing replaces it correctly. He just listens to me – he cannot help the physical things and the doctors will not. He gives me Xanax, but i worry that it only makes it worse in the long run, causing rebound anxiety when not taken, as it messes up the GABA receptors in the brain. Yet, I guess I will still rely on it for the worst of the spells I have. Without any thyroid of course I cannot survive, but no combination or amount has worked for long, and these other worse conditions have happened one after another including 3 root canals needed for abcesses in the last year, and continued tooth pain. Despite no sugar in my diet for a year. I read in a doctor’s waiting room once that estrogen is used for every part of the body including the teeth. If that is the case could my tooth problems, nerve problems and the rest all be part of the menopause? I was once an expert on this, I wrote a paper on it that was published to high praise, and now I am too confused to figure it out, as nothing makes sense anymore, and my case does not fit any I read about. I don’t even have hot flashes most of the time and they were not a serious problem for me, in retrospect. I do periodically for a few months and then none. The cold spells and shivering are the thing now. And that totally indicates more thyroid needed, and yet the test shows no, I have even excess T4 in the blood. Any ideas, please, would be welcome. I also have fibromyalgia, and iGa nephropathy, both considered nothing by the medical profession, but those were the diagnoses. I live with constant back pain, but that does not affect my life the way the lack of stable hormones does. I lost 35 pounds since last May, when I deliberately lowered my food intake and did yoga. I continue at the lower weight, but do not lose more as I eat everything I feel like now since I so seldom have any appetite and since food causes indigestion. I felt better when I was obese, but I didn’t like the way I looked. Was it a mistake to diet? I no longer have knee problems, as my doctor promised when the weight came off, and my heel spur also went away. If being obese would restore my stable constitution though I’d do it again, except I am now unable to overeat to the required extent, my digestion won’t allow it. I was told to take Xanax, in November, for the attacks of heart pounding and surging which started

… read more »

Response:

I went to my dr. today to get the results of my blood test last week. He won’t give them on the phone. It was very hard driving there, I have constant tremors and they are worsening. However, he dismissed them as well as my shivering and arm and leg weakness, these all have been with me only since early Feb, for no known reason. For the first time he chose not to order a TSH – only a free T4. So, it was 20.8. Normal range is 10.5 to 20.0, so it is just slightly high, but that then might explain why I have felt attacks of hyper adrenaline? And yet, I have felt ill and almost comatose on a lower dose, previously, and was attempting not to be hypothyroid. But he says that 100 mcg is too high and 75 would be too low, so I must now take .88. My last test a few months ago, the free t4 was 18 or high normal, and I was taking 100 then too, and told to stay on 100. Then I was switched by my endocrinologist to a combo of T4 and T3, which was excessive and made me have more heart pounding than usual, and I stopped the T3. I also felt hypo on the divided dose .50-T4, .12-T3 regimen, but more T3 seemed to make me have more sudden bursts of heart pounding. Even with the combined dose, the equivalent I tried to get was 100 mcg a day as it seemed to make me feel less ill and less hypo than other doses. I have years of journals to analyze for symptoms and doses; it has not helped me find an answer. It is always either too high or too low, with a euthyroid feeling appearing so rarely that maybe 2 or 3 times in ten years I have felt it and diarized it as a massively red letter day, virtually a feeling of euphoria. This euthyroid is the way I felt for the rest of my life  the first 45 years until the diseases started. Just able to function and feeling well. So my T4 is slightly high, and I should therefore not have hypo symptoms, which I do still have – feeling suddenly sleepy at any time and falling asleep for an hour or two. (Yet I have insomnia late at night, and spells of hyper, surging, too much unuseable adrenaline coursing through me). Swelling feet and legs, no appetite, hair falling out in my brush and when I wash it in huge clumps, trouble with digestion when I do eat, but the number one hypo symptom I have day and night is freezing cold, shivering, every day, unrelated to the temperature, that nothing will warm up until it passes. It’s an internal thing.  The constant tremors are not always shivering from cold…sometimes I have them together. These are NOT hyper symptoms so why would I think the dose was too high? My basal temperataure, when I get up, has ranged from 97.3 to 98.2, which I believe is normal according to Dr. Broda Barnes. One would think my dose was good. In the past the temperature was in the 96 range, and yet I felt better then, at a lower dose, though I had the hypo symptoms. Someone posted the query, which would you rather be – hypo or hyper? Choosing between them is something I have always had to do, and each one becomes horrific, causing me to go the other way for a time. Can this constant seesawing be causing the new problems? If one has to choose, hypo is less debilitating and life-destroying. One gets fat with painful joints, and slow, and placid, and confused, but there is a calm. And yet, then one is wistful for the energetic bursts, relative fit body and occasional clear thinking one did have even with the accompanying high anxiety, nervous state. As I am trying to explain, now I seem to be both hyper and hypo, but the test says slightly hyper. Besides the T4 test I had an FSH test. A year or so ago it was still normal, 22, now it is 47, which is out of range. Though I have had perimenopausal symptoms – severe ones, and all of them, for 6 years now, my tests were always in the normal range until now. So he gave me estrogen – CES, a ‘natural’ plant based one. He said more women were against Premarin now (which I used to be, but now I don’t care – I just want relief). I will take them, what else can I do? Hoping it will help. I studied this 3 or 4 years ago and was even given both Premarin and CES by doctors at the time of my hot flashes but I did not have good results and stopped them. Now that the hormone levels have changed maybe this is the answer. Does anyone have experience with CES? I have become a querulous, middle aged woman whom no one wants to know about, I suddenly realized in his office when facing his contempt and his lack of sympathy for me as a person, and his dismissing my complete worsening in the last 2 months…..his restating what he always states: "We’ll have to see if this gets the thyroid in range…" In ten years nothing has worked, and currently I am worse than ever before. My health has deteriorated drastically since around last October. The pains, weakness, unsteadiness, tremor are considered ‘essential tremor’ by a neurologist, and fibromyalgia by a rheumatologist, but there is NO treatment for these…until I take the .88 T4 for a while and if I don’t improve then my g.p. will give me a form of propanolol. This is the same thing I took when I first got Graves’ disease in 1989 and before the radiation. Why is this happening? If the T4 level is so  high then why not just stop the thyroid and become completely hypothyroid, that will calm me and make me placid like a cow, and overweight….which is what happened last year, i basically had ONLY intense muscle pain and hot flashes most of the time. No anxiety or heart pounding attacks, tremors or shivering. I don’t MIND hot flashes. I wish that was all I did have again. I learned to accept and deal with them. I cannot deal with a head tremor and weak muscles. Even my jaw feels sprained after chewing; I cannot hold a cup with one hand. If 100 was such a massive dose that it makes me hyper, then why the combined symptoms which include hypo items like hair loss, cold, confusion, cognitive problems with words and memory, and the rest? My God, I am at the end of my rope, and other than an expensive holistic doctor or naturopath, who might have an insight and might just be a quack, there is nowhere else to turn. It is not a simple matter to change doctors. I can barely stand to go to the ones I do have, that already know my complicated case. It is an ordeal, as everything is such an effort now. But my mind objects, wanting a way out of this nightmare. There surely is a first cause somewhere….the only one I know of is the Graves’ disease, the hyperthyroid suddenly in 1989. Everything else followed. I’ve said this before, I was an energetic, smart, normal looking and successful working mother with many friends and a full life and unbounded energy. And after the treatment I still functioned until 1996 when my body just began to be unable to function. The menopausal stuff began in 1994 and yes I did get worse after that, but nothing helped, and by 1996 I was too disabled to work. Four years now have been lost from my life because of iatrogenic disease. My psychiatrist says it is iatrogenic – doctor-caused. Wrong treatment, wrong pills. I no longer have a thyroid, and nothing replaces it correctly. He just listens to me – he cannot help the physical things and the doctors will not. He gives me Xanax, but i worry that it only makes it worse in the long run, causing rebound anxiety when not taken, as it messes up the GABA receptors in the brain. Yet, I guess I will still rely on it for the worst of the spells I have. Without any thyroid of course I cannot survive, but no combination or amount has worked for long, and these other worse conditions have happened one after another including 3 root canals needed for abcesses in the last year, and continued tooth pain. Despite no sugar in my diet for a year. I read in a doctor’s waiting room once that estrogen is used for every part of the body including the teeth. If that is the case could my tooth problems, nerve problems and the rest all be part of the menopause? I was once an expert on this, I wrote a paper on it that was published to high praise, and now I am too confused to figure it out, as nothing makes sense anymore, and my case does not fit any I read about. I don’t even have hot flashes most of the time and they were not a serious problem for me, in retrospect. I do periodically for a few months and then none. The cold spells and shivering are the thing now. And that totally indicates more thyroid needed, and yet the test shows no, I have even excess T4 in the blood. Any ideas, please, would be welcome. I also have fibromyalgia, and iGa nephropathy, both considered nothing by the medical profession, but those were the diagnoses. I live with constant back pain, but that does not affect my life the way the lack of stable hormones does. I lost 35 pounds since last May, when I deliberately lowered my food intake and did yoga. I continue at the lower weight, but do not lose more as I eat everything I feel like now since I so seldom have any appetite and since food causes indigestion. I felt better when I was obese, but I didn’t like the way I looked. Was it a mistake to diet? I no longer have knee problems, as my doctor promised when the weight came off, and my heel spur also went away. If being obese would restore my stable constitution though I’d do it again, except I am now unable to overeat to the required extent, my digestion won’t allow it. I was told to take Xanax, in November, for the attacks of heart pounding and surging which started in October out of the blue. I took it only sporadically as needed for the worst, then was told to take it every day once the tremors became a daily problem, no matter how I felt, but that did not eliminate the tremors. It just makes me apathetic and totally cut off from the world, mentally it shuts down the brain, which no longer cares. As I don’t like that feeling, I don’t take it in big doses as recommended. I wondered if any of this new stuff was really xanax withdrawal or reaction, as it is known to be highly addictive even … read more »

Response:

Question:

Does anyone have experience with combinations of any of the following meds:  Wellbutrin, Zoloft, Effexor, and Ritalin? Thanks, groucho

Response:

Took them all, but I don’t think it was ever in combination with each other. Like most of the meds I have taken, they worked for a while then ZIPPO. It appears that the Paxil, Buspar, Neurontin Combo I am now on has gone ZIPPO on me. When you feel better without meds than you do on meds, "Somethin’ is screwie in St. Louie!!"          Ralph – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone have experience with combinations of any of the following meds:  Wellbutrin, Zoloft, Effexor, and Ritalin? Thanks, groucho

Response:

What dose is the ritaalin for depression?

Response:

Question:

hello, my son has been diagnosed with bipolar. he is an adult now and living in another state. we have been through alot together, were close but only talk everyother week. he starts college this fall. i worry about the stress hes under. hes 18 just finishing h.s.  i love him and try to give him the distance he ask for, it is quite possible he is in this cafe as it is new to me.  i came to this section in need of help in how i can stay out of his way and still be there when he needs me. what i’v found most interesting here is i have taken effexor before, last year. can my mild depression be a link to my sons manic depression.  i sometimes blame myself- and for no reason. i did’nt know effexor was used for bipolar disorder also.                                 love, tilly

Response:

Hello! My wife keeps switching doctors so she can get different diagnoses so she can try different medicines. I know from previous experience that AD’s without a mood stabilizer makes her manic. I was hoping someone would tell me Effexor would not do this. I am just waiting for the fireworks now. It probably won’t take long from what I am hearing! Once when they put her on Amitryptiline she decided it would be great to take the whole bottle. She almost ended her life that night. So I don’t understand what her newest doc is trying to prove by giving her Effexor w/o a mood stabilizer. Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Daniel Do you know from all the posts you have read that XR Effexor (that’s what I use too) is dangerous for your wife if she is diagnosed bipolar?  I do hope she isn’t bipolar or you’re in for a real treat. Sympathetically, Gandalf |Hi | |Thanks for the story. The doctor now has my wife on 150mg of sustained |release Effexor. But she is not taking any mood stabilizer like Lithium or |anything. I don’t know why. I guess they have changed her diagnoses |or something. I just hope the Effexor doesn’t send her up the wall or |anything. | |Good luck getting off the Effexor! | |Dan | | | Hi Daniel | | Effexor is same as the other AD, possible with bipolar if you are solid on a | mood stabilizer.  My personal situation is that I was unipolar manic until 3 | years ago, when a triple whammy stress threw me into my first clinical | depression.  So doctors fought me for 2 years, resisting any AD.  After being | depressed for 2 years and not being able to work or go to school for 1 year I | insisted on an AD.  My pdoc decided on effexor because of its short half life | (3 days and half of it is out of your system).  My ramped up VERY slowly, 5 | months until full therapeutic dosage.  It did not work for me until I was at | the full dosage.  But once I reached critical AD mass the stuff cleared away | my depression.  I stayed on it for 16 months, just going off it now. | | -Gandalf | | |Hi | | | |What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? | |Would it help or possibly make them more manic? | | | |Dan | | |

Response:

Hi What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? Would it help or possibly make them more manic? Dan

Response:

What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? Would it help or possibly make them more manic?

About any AD can activate mania or hypomania. I’m on both Depakote and Effexor and find the combination quite agreeable. — IMPORTANT: Remove the edible part of the E-mail address before replying.

Response:

I took Effexor for 3 months.  I loved its affects. It was way cool.  Everything was bright and clear. Then I began to get headaches and it bottomed out. So much for that. I don’t remember ever getting really out of hand on Effexor. Then again I don’t remember yesterday. <sigh Becky who is really not much help

Response:

Hi Thanks for the reply to my post. I take it that the Depakote keeps the Effexor from causing mania? Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? Would it help or possibly make them more manic? About any AD can activate mania or hypomania. I’m on both Depakote and Effexor and find the combination quite agreeable. — IMPORTANT: Remove the edible part of the E-mail address before replying.

Response:

Hi My wife just started on Effexor and is having a slight headache so far. Also blurry vision for an hour or so after taking it. And some dizziness. Just wondering if there is anything else that is about to happen! Thanks for the reply! Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I took Effexor for 3 months.  I loved its affects. It was way cool.  Everything was bright and clear. Then I began to get headaches and it bottomed out. So much for that. I don’t remember ever getting really out of hand on Effexor. Then again I don’t remember yesterday. <sigh Becky who is really not much help

Response:

Thanks for the reply to my post. I take it that the Depakote keeps the Effexor from causing mania?

Possibly. Although I can say that I’m definitely worse off without an AD. — IMPORTANT: Remove the edible part of the E-mail address before replying.

Response:

Hi Dan, Welcome to ASDM My wife just started on Effexor and is having a slight headache so far. Also blurry vision for an hour or so after taking it. And some dizziness.

All of these are potential side effects of Effexor. Just wondering if there is anything else that is about to happen!

Effexor can also increase blood pressure, so monitoring  of it is necessary. Alcohol should be avoided while taking Effexor. Report any rash or hives to the doctor immediately I suggest she notify her pdoc and report the headache and blurry vision. This may be dose related and perhaps starting at a lower dose and increasing slowly may help to avoid these unpleasant side effects. Peace, Reach beyond your grasp!

Response:

Thanks for the reply to my post. I take it that the Depakote keeps the Effexor from causing mania? Possibly. Although I can say that I’m definitely worse off without an AD. — IMPORTANT: Remove the edible part of the E-mail address before replying.

I’d have to agree with this completely too. I think some are more suseptable to the "mania", and some more to the "depression", but can easily switch. I think the Depakote adds a "balance" to the a.d. James — "Get some honesty… "Don’t Let The BASTARDS Grind You Down..".Latin Proverb take the best of me And the rest let go… When you’re tired of the Rage, Step outside your cage And let the real fool show.." Tears for Fear’s "Goodnight Song" Remember "Life is A Highway"?? Visit Tom Cochrane’s Official Homepage Http://www.tomcochrane.ca

Response:

Hi Daniel Effexor is same as the other AD, possible with bipolar if you are solid on a mood stabilizer.  My personal situation is that I was unipolar manic until 3 years ago, when a triple whammy stress threw me into my first clinical depression.  So doctors fought me for 2 years, resisting any AD.  After being depressed for 2 years and not being able to work or go to school for 1 year I insisted on an AD.  My pdoc decided on effexor because of its short half life (3 days and half of it is out of your system).  My ramped up VERY slowly, 5 months until full therapeutic dosage.  It did not work for me until I was at the full dosage.  But once I reached critical AD mass the stuff cleared away my depression.  I stayed on it for 16 months, just going off it now. -Gandalf

|Hi | |What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? |Would it help or possibly make them more manic? | |Dan |

Response:

Hi So the Depakote would be a stabilizer and the Effexor helps with the depressive side of things. Ok. I think I am starting to understand! Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks for the reply to my post. I take it that the Depakote keeps the Effexor from causing mania? Possibly. Although I can say that I’m definitely worse off without an AD. — IMPORTANT: Remove the edible part of the E-mail address before replying.

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Hello! My wife was having high blood pressure, dizziness, blurry vision and sleeping problems even before she came out of the hospital. And the prescription she has now is stronger than before. But is a sustained release version (150mg). So hopefully the side effects will not be as bad as they have been. Thanks for the helpful reply! Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Dan, Welcome to ASDM My wife just started on Effexor and is having a slight headache so far. Also blurry vision for an hour or so after taking it. And some dizziness. All of these are potential side effects of Effexor. Just wondering if there is anything else that is about to happen! Effexor can also increase blood pressure, so monitoring  of it is necessary. Alcohol should be avoided while taking Effexor. Report any rash or hives to the doctor immediately I suggest she notify her pdoc and report the headache and blurry vision. This may be dose related and perhaps starting at a lower dose and increasing slowly may help to avoid these unpleasant side effects. Peace, Reach beyond your grasp!

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Hi Thanks for the story. The doctor now has my wife on 150mg of sustained release Effexor. But she is not taking any mood stabilizer like Lithium or anything. I don’t know why. I guess they have changed her diagnoses or something. I just hope the Effexor doesn’t send her up the wall or anything. Good luck getting off the Effexor! Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Daniel Effexor is same as the other AD, possible with bipolar if you are solid on a mood stabilizer.  My personal situation is that I was unipolar manic until 3 years ago, when a triple whammy stress threw me into my first clinical depression.  So doctors fought me for 2 years, resisting any AD.  After being depressed for 2 years and not being able to work or go to school for 1 year I insisted on an AD.  My pdoc decided on effexor because of its short half life (3 days and half of it is out of your system).  My ramped up VERY slowly, 5 months until full therapeutic dosage.  It did not work for me until I was at the full dosage.  But once I reached critical AD mass the stuff cleared away my depression.  I stayed on it for 16 months, just going off it now. -Gandalf |Hi | |What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? |Would it help or possibly make them more manic? | |Dan |

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Daniel Do you know from all the posts you have read that XR Effexor (that’s what I use too) is dangerous for your wife if she is diagnosed bipolar?  I do hope she isn’t bipolar or you’re in for a real treat. Sympathetically, Gandalf

|Hi | |Thanks for the story. The doctor now has my wife on 150mg of sustained |release Effexor. But she is not taking any mood stabilizer like Lithium or |anything. I don’t know why. I guess they have changed her diagnoses |or something. I just hope the Effexor doesn’t send her up the wall or |anything. | |Good luck getting off the Effexor! | |Dan |

| | Hi Daniel | | Effexor is same as the other AD, possible with bipolar if you are solid on a | mood stabilizer.  My personal situation is that I was unipolar manic until 3 | years ago, when a triple whammy stress threw me into my first clinical | depression.  So doctors fought me for 2 years, resisting any AD.  After being | depressed for 2 years and not being able to work or go to school for 1 year I | insisted on an AD.  My pdoc decided on effexor because of its short half life | (3 days and half of it is out of your system).  My ramped up VERY slowly, 5 | months until full therapeutic dosage.  It did not work for me until I was at | the full dosage.  But once I reached critical AD mass the stuff cleared away | my depression.  I stayed on it for 16 months, just going off it now. | | -Gandalf |

| |Hi | | | |What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? | |Would it help or possibly make them more manic? | | | |Dan | | |

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be cautious with effexor, my mother was on it and it caused her to flatline meaning she had no hi’s or lows, no emotion what so ever…also a close friend was on it and had petite mal seizures. be sure to read all info on depakote as well, it has some nasty side effects. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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the other day we ran out of zoloft and dint have the money on hand to refill the prescription. (that’s how broke we are..only a $5 co-pay and dint have it!) anyway..noticed last night that head is spinning alittle and feeling kinda dizzy. vision blurring alittle off and on. does anybody know if there is a withdrawal from this stuff? can’t tell if we are feeling this wierd physical stuff cuz of internal stuff (int*gr*t*on, not complete at this time, just a partial thing), new stuff coming up, or cuz of the lack of zoloft in the system. was taking 100 mg. a day.  wonder if we should get a refill now or ride this out or what.  prolly could call dr. but doctor doesn’t know about the other stuff and we are not about to tell him <g. would it be harmful to be off this junk (as former addict, the dr. *official* drugs do not impress me, sorry to say!) and then start up again. just wondering if anybody knows. thanks, jayc p.s.  any other former addicts/DID have trouble telling if an antidepressant *works*?  i am always clueless when questioned.  in my mind, it doesn’t buzz me.. so i think "nope".  but, body is feeling odd now, so who knows.  maybe was doing something, just dint recognize it cuz of no buzz?  (sigh) dr.’s drugs confuse me.  too bad they won’t let me take the ones that i like. (fantasy…dr. perscribed marijauna. oh, heaven. i know, i know..it’ll never happen.) — For more information about this service, send e-mail to:

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posted and e-mailed   I’m sorry that you are feeling disoriented. FWIW, taking Zoloft does that to me. I looked up Zoloft in a prescription drug guide. It says that you shouldn’t experience any withdrawal effects even if you suddenly stop taking it bc it’s eliminated from the body very slowly. But you should call your MD if you quit taking the drug for any reason. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – the other day we ran out of zoloft and dint have the money on hand to refill the prescription. (that’s how broke we are..only a $5 co-pay and dint have it!) anyway..noticed last night that head is spinning alittle and feeling kinda dizzy. vision blurring alittle off and on. does anybody know if there is a withdrawal from this stuff? can’t tell if we are feeling this wierd physical stuff cuz of internal stuff (int*gr*t*on, not complete at this time, just a partial thing), new stuff coming up, or cuz of the lack of zoloft in the system. was taking 100 mg. a day.  wonder if we should get a refill now or ride this out or what.  prolly could call dr. but doctor doesn’t know about the other stuff and we are not about to tell him <g. would it be harmful to be off this junk (as former addict, the dr. *official* drugs do not impress me, sorry to say!) and then start up again. just wondering if anybody knows. thanks, jayc p.s.  any other former addicts/DID have trouble telling if an antidepressant *works*?  i am always clueless when questioned.  in my mind, it doesn’t buzz me.. so i think "nope".

I got the "Zoloft buzz" almost immediately when I took it. According to my friend (the walking pharmacy), it’s a common reaction. However, I get a better buzz from a good cup of coffee.  The coffee tastes better and is cheaper, too. But my MD wouldn’t prescribe my favorite local (very strong) brand.  ):   jayc: but, body is feeling odd now, so who knows.  maybe was doing something, just dint recognize it cuz of no buzz?  (sigh) dr.’s drugs confuse me.  too bad they won’t let me take the ones that i like. (fantasy…dr. perscribed marijauna. oh, heaven. i know, i know..it’ll never happen.)

You could move to California, although Bill & Co. seem to have made it difficult for MDs to prescribe it now. There are local places that still sell it at cost if you have a doctor’s prescription, though. (: If you can afford it, I think you should get your prescription refilled (you can use some of the money you’re saving on therapy now that you have good insurance!) and see if it helps. It will probably take a few weeks to tell. If it helps you, keep taking it. If it doesn’t, stop taking it. Just my 2 cents. (And if you get enough of them, you’ll have your $5 <g.) I don’t think there’s any medical danger in going on and off Zoloft, but bc it takes a while to be effective, it’s probably not a good way to take it. Good luck, jayc.  e — For more information about this service, send e-mail to:

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hi…just to add that i can’t even miss a day of Zoloft without getting side effects(from withdrawal).  I get the dizzy, spinny feelings. Which is what i got going onto it.  Even if i take it a half-day or quarter day late, i get slight side effects. which is a real pain, since my schedule is so irregular, that i often don’t take it exactly the same time each day.  so, e, i don’t doubt that the guide says this, but it hasn’t been my experience…and i was told that one shoiuldn’t go off any anti-depressant ‘cold turkey’ because of possible side effects and a possible ‘boomerang’ into depression. mouse – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -posted and e-mailed   I’m sorry that you are feeling disoriented. FWIW, taking Zoloft does that to me. I looked up Zoloft in a prescription drug guide. It says that you shouldn’t experience any withdrawal effects even if you suddenly stop taking it bc it’s eliminated from the body very slowly. But you should call your MD if you quit taking the drug for any reason. the other day we ran out of zoloft and dint have the money on hand to refill the prescription. (that’s how broke we are..only a $5 co-pay and dint have it!) anyway..noticed last night that head is spinning alittle and feeling kinda dizzy. vision blurring alittle off and on. does anybody know if there is a withdrawal from this stuff? can’t tell if we are feeling this wierd physical stuff cuz of internal stuff (int*gr*t*on, not complete at this time, just a partial thing), new stuff coming up, or cuz of the lack of zoloft in the system. was taking 100 mg. a day.  wonder if we should get a refill now or ride this out or what.  prolly could call dr. but doctor doesn’t know about the other stuff and we are not about to tell him <g. would it be harmful to be off this junk (as former addict, the dr. *official* drugs do not impress me, sorry to say!) and then start up again. just wondering if anybody knows. thanks, jayc p.s.  any other former addicts/DID have trouble telling if an antidepressant *works*?  i am always clueless when questioned.  in my mind, it doesn’t buzz me.. so i think "nope". I got the "Zoloft buzz" almost immediately when I took it. According to my friend (the walking pharmacy), it’s a common reaction. However, I get a better buzz from a good cup of coffee.  The coffee tastes better and is cheaper, too. But my MD wouldn’t prescribe my favorite local (very strong) brand.  ):   jayc: but, body is feeling odd now, so who knows.  maybe was doing something, just dint recognize it cuz of no buzz?  (sigh) dr.’s drugs confuse me.  too bad they won’t let me take the ones that i like. (fantasy…dr. perscribed marijauna. oh, heaven. i know, i know..it’ll never happen.) You could move to California, although Bill & Co. seem to have made it difficult for MDs to prescribe it now. There are local places that still sell it at cost if you have a doctor’s prescription, though. (: If you can afford it, I think you should get your prescription refilled (you can use some of the money you’re saving on therapy now that you have good insurance!) and see if it helps. It will probably take a few weeks to tell. If it helps you, keep taking it. If it doesn’t, stop taking it. Just my 2 cents. (And if you get enough of them, you’ll have your $5 <g.) I don’t think there’s any medical danger in going on and off Zoloft, but bc it takes a while to be effective, it’s probably not a good way to take it. Good luck, jayc.  e — For more information about this service, send e-mail to:

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the other day we ran out of zoloft and dint have the money on hand to refill the prescription. (that’s how broke we are..only a $5 co-pay and dint have it!) anyway..noticed last night that head is spinning alittle and feeling kinda dizzy. vision blurring alittle off and on. does anybody know if there is a withdrawal from this stuff?

I didnt feel this when I stopped taking this and I was on 200 mg at the time ( alittle high but they kept upping it cuz it didnt work switched to wellbutrin) can’t tell if we are feeling this wierd physical stuff cuz of internal stuff (int*gr*t*on, not complete at this time, just a partial thing), new stuff coming up, or cuz of the lack of zoloft in the system. was taking 100 mg. a day.  wonder if we should get a refill now or ride this out or what.  prolly could call dr. but doctor doesn’t know about the other stuff and we are not about to tell him <g.

Its important to stay on your antidepressant cuz you can crash and burn if your body still needs it. I went into a nose dive 4 or 5 months ago when I couldnt afford my med (Its $60 a pop -my insur pays only 1/2) and I hit the floor about 1 week later. So you might want to see if you could get the refill or at least ask your doctor. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – would it be harmful to be off this junk (as former addict, the dr. *official* drugs do not impress me, sorry to say!) and then start up again. just wondering if anybody knows. thanks, jayc p.s.  any other former addicts/DID have trouble telling if an antidepressant *works*?  i am always clueless when questioned.  in my mind, it doesn’t buzz me.. so i think "nope".  but, body is feeling odd now, so who knows.  maybe was doing something, just dint recognize it cuz of no buzz?  (sigh) dr.’s drugs confuse me.  too bad they won’t let me take the ones that i like. (fantasy…dr. perscribed marijauna. oh, heaven. i know, i know..it’ll never happen.)

Sometimes its not the past drugs but with DID often it works for one alter and not another! dang! Good luck and I hope it works out. Adult C Federation of C – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — For more information about this service, send e-mail to:

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Monique,         Yes, you could be experiencing withdrawal from the drug.  I believe it is because the drugs changes your chemistry gradually as you went on it.  A friend of mine stopped taking Zolof and had the same reaction.  It is best to go off these drugs _very slowly_ so as not to bet the side effects.           You may want to ask your physician’s office if they have "samples" which they supply to their clients who are having trouble paying for the drug.  Many places do give the samples to their clients who do not have the ability to pay. Also your pharmacist should be able fill a partical perscription.             I don’t think you would find that an antidepressent would give you a "buzz", maybe in the past they did but things like Zolof probably wouldn’t make you feel that way.  (Maybe unless you are going off them too fast   Good Luck – Noel – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – the other day we ran out of zoloft and dint have the money on hand to refill the prescription. (that’s how broke we are..only a $5 co-pay and dint have it!) anyway..noticed last night that head is spinning alittle and feeling kinda dizzy. vision blurring alittle off and on. does anybody know if there is a withdrawal from this stuff?

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