Question:

WK, Now that you’re getting some relief with Xanax, are you going to try getting back into the work world?  Considering how long you’ve had to stay away, you might want to check with your local gov’t., your doctor, whoever, to see if there is "dept." set up to help people with mental disabilities re-enter the work force.  I’d like to say that potential employers will probably just gloss over your 2 year absence, but that’s unlikely.  Sad to say, but there’s still tons of ignorance and some stigma attached to having a disorder.  Anyway, getting back to some sort of go between organization, if it exists, (and I know it does in some states in the U.S.), such a dept. can smooth the waters some in locating employers who’re interested in what you can do and will have been properly briefed that you have an anxiety disorder, but are being treated for it.  Something else to think about, and you may already be doing this, is that for an interview or any particularly stressful event, I’ve found that taking an extra dose or two of Xanax all at once just before the ordeal can make it a lot less stressful. I had to experiment some to find the right amount and you may too (not enuf vs. too much).  Good luck. Doug On 2 Feb 2002 22:19:52 -0800, vegasrules…@yahoo.com (White Knight) wrote: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I am sick and tired about all these posts trying to scare people away from trying xanax.  As someone who has suffered from bipolar disorder(type 2) for 15 years, tried all the antidepressants, now on a cocktail of meds, including xanax and paxil, my experience is that PAXIL has many more adverse effects versus the marginal benefit of some anxiety relief.  I took Paxil for 5 months and was not taking any xanax, and I got some anticapation anxiety relief at the cost of NO LIBIDO, sleeping 12 hours a day, having no motivation, just didn’t give a shit, already gained 10 pounds in 5 months with the carbo craving…..And people want to talk about xanax dependency and problems with withdrawl.  I am not trying to minimize people’s experience or their pain, but with anxiety or other mental health issues, the word is YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY(YMMY).  I am a college graduate in electrical engineering from a top 5 engineering college, and now have not worked for over two years mostly because of anxiety and some depression yearly.  After working for 11 years struggling with depression and anxiety, I now have a hard time stepping outside my home.  I have considered suicide 1000’s of times over the last 15 years, actually researched and made the plans and was about to end it, and then I started on the Paxil…….Yeah, my suicidal obsessions went away, but now I was content to veg out all day watching TY or on the Net, my desire to GET A JOB disappeared.  Go research web sites and you will see how many people have problems with SSRI’s, yeah they are alive and taking that $3 pill two times a day or many $3 pills for me, but now I am NUMB and just there.  Prior to Paxil I use to be a emotional person, felt the pain of others and would cry when touched by something, but now I am a Paxil-zombie, yeah some anxiety relief but a LOT OF ME is also gone.  So all those xanax phobics, please allow people to fail with their options without scaring them.  What are people’s choices when it comes to anxiety or panic, yes paxil, yes benzo’s, yes MAIO’s, yes CBT(Cognitive Behavior Therapy).  My experience is PAXIL SUCKS and THE WITHDRAWAL IS HORRIBLE BASED ON MUCH FEEDBACK I HAVE READ ON THE NET, MAIO’S like parnate have some studies that back them up but the food restrictions are VERY DIFFICULT(no cheese, wine, beer, chocolate, many OTC meds, etc.), CBT might work for some but the feedback I have heard is that CBT plus meds work the best and I HAVE DONE THE THERAPY ROUTE and it was a waste of money. As one doctor told me, people who suffer from PANIC and think they are dieing have never been told that "your not going to die, it is all in your head"…Well that was my last session with him.  Just to repeat, this is MY EXPERIENCE and YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY.  Now I could continue to HIBERNATE IN MY HOUSE, NOT WORK, RUN OUT OF MONEY AND THEN BE HOMELESS…..Or I can be proactive and continue to experiment and try to find some solution that will allow me to work and have a life.  I have taken xanax in the past, just started it one month ago, still taking a low dose of paxil, and I am MUCH MUCH BETTER at dealing with day to day life, interacting with people, giving my shit done, etc. Yeah, maybe I will be taking xanax for the rest of my life but the only side effect I have had is some sleepiness.  And to those who talk about TOLERANCE BUILDUP, that is a CROCK, yes you might have to increase your xanax from .25mg 3 times a day to .50mg 3 times a day, or even 1mg 3 times a day……..The fact is that people level out, there are people who have taken xanax for 5 to 15 years and most leveled out after 1 year at a dose and have no desire to increase. People need to do some research and FIND OUT THE REAL TRUTH, not what BIG PHARMA and BIG BUSINESS OWNED MEDIA OUTLETS want us to believe. Not to be cynical, but $3 no generic available paxil is much better for DRUG COMPANIES, then CHEAP GENERIC XANAX which might be more effective with less side-effects.  Why are benzo’s so hard to get, cause drug lobbiest have access to CONGRESS and made sure that THE NO-PROFIT SOLUTIONS(IE LIKE BENZO’S) are not readily available. Let me make THE NEWCOMERS TO MENTAL ILLNESS aware that HYPE ABOUT THE LATEST ANTIDEPRESSANT HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT WILL BE MADE ON THE DRUG, and the only time you will hear about THE NEGATIVES about that drug will be when it comes off-patent. Now that we have generic prozac, we will hear more about side effects like NO LIBIDO, WEIGHT GAIN, SUICIDE, AND OTHER  EFEECTS.  Of course, as long as Paxil and Zoloft have no generics, MEDIA HYPE will be still muted, but give it time.  Just as all the SSRI’s go generic, we will hear about ALL THE NEGATIVES and out will come the new batch of 8 TO 12 WEEK STUDIED ANTIDEPRESSANTS to start the new profit cycle.  People with mental illness are just pawns, half ass useless meds are approved based on 8 week studies, NO REASON FOR A LONG TERM STUDY, we really don’t want to KNOW THE TRUTH, and as soon as the generics start rolling out, OUT COMES THE DIRTY LAUNDRY, not to HELP US, NO, ONLY SO THAT WE GO ON THE LATEST $5 PILL THAT HAS A 80% SUCCESS RATE AND EVEN LESS SIDE EFFECTS.  Hell as long as everyone is making money, who cares about THE CRAZIES that take the product, we just need them alive and taking their meds.  Now I forget, was I taking about the cigarette industry or drug companies, HELL WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE.  This of course is just the opinion of a mentally ill patient with 15 years of experience popping pills, all of which have a 70% effective rate, but I guess I am the exception, "ALIVE" AND NOT SUICIDAL, AND NOT HAPPY ABOUT IT. White Knight

Response:

White Knight wrote:

I am sick and tired about all these posts trying to scare people away from trying xanax.  As someone who has suffered from bipolar disorder(type 2) for 15 years, tried all the antidepressants, now on a cocktail of meds, including xanax and paxil, my experience is that PAXIL has many more adverse effects versus the marginal benefit of some anxiety relief.  I took Paxil for 5 months and was not taking any xanax, and I got some anticapation anxiety relief at the cost of NO

Which posts? Anyway do you get pre, during and post anxiety or just anticipation and during anxiety? Cause I get all three and am curious about your experience. I the amount I get of each one depends on the situation. Richard — Registered Lunatic #100347

Response:

I..Am..A..Paxil..Zom Bie..You..Need..To Chill..Out..Man.. Simon. "White Knight" <vegasrules…@yahoo.com

wrote in message

news:28eafa9a.0202022219.7ee7d068@posting.google.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I am sick and tired about all these posts trying to scare people away from trying xanax.  As someone who has suffered from bipolar disorder(type 2) for 15 years, tried all the antidepressants, now on a cocktail of meds, including xanax and paxil, my experience is that PAXIL has many more adverse effects versus the marginal benefit of some anxiety relief.  I took Paxil for 5 months and was not taking any xanax, and I got some anticapation anxiety relief at the cost of NO LIBIDO, sleeping 12 hours a day, having no motivation, just didn’t give a shit, already gained 10 pounds in 5 months with the carbo craving…..And people want to talk about xanax dependency and problems with withdrawl.  I am not trying to minimize people’s experience or their pain, but with anxiety or other mental health issues, the word is YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY(YMMY).  I am a college graduate in electrical engineering from a top 5 engineering college, and now have not worked for over two years mostly because of anxiety and some depression yearly.  After working for 11 years struggling with depression and anxiety, I now have a hard time stepping outside my home.  I have considered suicide 1000’s of times over the last 15 years, actually researched and made the plans and was about to end it, and then I started on the Paxil…….Yeah, my suicidal obsessions went away, but now I was content to veg out all day watching TY or on the Net, my desire to GET A JOB disappeared.  Go research web sites and you will see how many people have problems with SSRI’s, yeah they are alive and taking that $3 pill two times a day or many $3 pills for me, but now I am NUMB and just there.  Prior to Paxil I use to be a emotional person, felt the pain of others and would cry when touched by something, but now I am a Paxil-zombie, yeah some anxiety relief but a LOT OF ME is also gone.  So all those xanax phobics, please allow people to fail with their options without scaring them.  What are people’s choices when it comes to anxiety or panic, yes paxil, yes benzo’s, yes MAIO’s, yes CBT(Cognitive Behavior Therapy).  My experience is PAXIL SUCKS and THE WITHDRAWAL IS HORRIBLE BASED ON MUCH FEEDBACK I HAVE READ ON THE NET, MAIO’S like parnate have some studies that back them up but the food restrictions are VERY DIFFICULT(no cheese, wine, beer, chocolate, many OTC meds, etc.), CBT might work for some but the feedback I have heard is that CBT plus meds work the best and I HAVE DONE THE THERAPY ROUTE and it was a waste of money. As one doctor told me, people who suffer from PANIC and think they are dieing have never been told that "your not going to die, it is all in your head"…Well that was my last session with him.  Just to repeat, this is MY EXPERIENCE and YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY.  Now I could continue to HIBERNATE IN MY HOUSE, NOT WORK, RUN OUT OF MONEY AND THEN BE HOMELESS…..Or I can be proactive and continue to experiment and try to find some solution that will allow me to work and have a life.  I have taken xanax in the past, just started it one month ago, still taking a low dose of paxil, and I am MUCH MUCH BETTER at dealing with day to day life, interacting with people, giving my shit done, etc. Yeah, maybe I will be taking xanax for the rest of my life but the only side effect I have had is some sleepiness.  And to those who talk about TOLERANCE BUILDUP, that is a CROCK, yes you might have to increase your xanax from .25mg 3 times a day to .50mg 3 times a day, or even 1mg 3 times a day……..The fact is that people level out, there are people who have taken xanax for 5 to 15 years and most leveled out after 1 year at a dose and have no desire to increase. People need to do some research and FIND OUT THE REAL TRUTH, not what BIG PHARMA and BIG BUSINESS OWNED MEDIA OUTLETS want us to believe. Not to be cynical, but $3 no generic available paxil is much better for DRUG COMPANIES, then CHEAP GENERIC XANAX which might be more effective with less side-effects.  Why are benzo’s so hard to get, cause drug lobbiest have access to CONGRESS and made sure that THE NO-PROFIT SOLUTIONS(IE LIKE BENZO’S) are not readily available. Let me make THE NEWCOMERS TO MENTAL ILLNESS aware that HYPE ABOUT THE LATEST ANTIDEPRESSANT HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT WILL BE MADE ON THE DRUG, and the only time you will hear about THE NEGATIVES about that drug will be when it comes off-patent. Now that we have generic prozac, we will hear more about side effects like NO LIBIDO, WEIGHT GAIN, SUICIDE, AND OTHER  EFEECTS.  Of course, as long as Paxil and Zoloft have no generics, MEDIA HYPE will be still muted, but give it time.  Just as all the SSRI’s go generic, we will hear about ALL THE NEGATIVES and out will come the new batch of 8 TO 12 WEEK STUDIED ANTIDEPRESSANTS to start the new profit cycle.  People with mental illness are just pawns, half ass useless meds are approved based on 8 week studies, NO REASON FOR A LONG TERM STUDY, we really don’t want to KNOW THE TRUTH, and as soon as the generics start rolling out, OUT COMES THE DIRTY LAUNDRY, not to HELP US, NO, ONLY SO THAT WE GO ON THE LATEST $5 PILL THAT HAS A 80% SUCCESS RATE AND EVEN LESS SIDE EFFECTS.  Hell as long as everyone is making money, who cares about THE CRAZIES that take the product, we just need them alive and taking their meds.  Now I forget, was I taking about the cigarette industry or drug companies, HELL WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE.  This of course is just the opinion of a mentally ill patient with 15 years of experience popping pills, all of which have a 70% effective rate, but I guess I am the exception, "ALIVE" AND NOT SUICIDAL, AND NOT HAPPY ABOUT IT. White Knight

Response:

I am sick and tired about all these posts trying to scare people away from trying xanax.  As someone who has suffered from bipolar disorder(type 2) for 15 years, tried all the antidepressants, now on a cocktail of meds, including xanax and paxil, my experience is that PAXIL has many more adverse effects versus the marginal benefit of some anxiety relief.  I took Paxil for 5 months and was not taking any xanax, and I got some anticapation anxiety relief at the cost of NO LIBIDO, sleeping 12 hours a day, having no motivation, just didn’t give a shit, already gained 10 pounds in 5 months with the carbo craving…..And people want to talk about xanax dependency and problems with withdrawl.  I am not trying to minimize people’s experience or their pain, but with anxiety or other mental health issues, the word is YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY(YMMY).  I am a college graduate in electrical engineering from a top 5 engineering college, and now have not worked for over two years mostly because of anxiety and some depression yearly.  After working for 11 years struggling with depression and anxiety, I now have a hard time stepping outside my home.  I have considered suicide 1000’s of times over the last 15 years, actually researched and made the plans and was about to end it, and then I started on the Paxil…….Yeah, my suicidal obsessions went away, but now I was content to veg out all day watching TY or on the Net, my desire to GET A JOB disappeared.  Go research web sites and you will see how many people have problems with SSRI’s, yeah they are alive and taking that $3 pill two times a day or many $3 pills for me, but now I am NUMB and just there.  Prior to Paxil I use to be a emotional person, felt the pain of others and would cry when touched by something, but now I am a Paxil-zombie, yeah some anxiety relief but a LOT OF ME is also gone.  So all those xanax phobics, please allow people to fail with their options without scaring them.  What are people’s choices when it comes to anxiety or panic, yes paxil, yes benzo’s, yes MAIO’s, yes CBT(Cognitive Behavior Therapy).  My experience is PAXIL SUCKS and THE WITHDRAWAL IS HORRIBLE BASED ON MUCH FEEDBACK I HAVE READ ON THE NET, MAIO’S like parnate have some studies that back them up but the food restrictions are VERY DIFFICULT(no cheese, wine, beer, chocolate, many OTC meds, etc.), CBT might work for some but the feedback I have heard is that CBT plus meds work the best and I HAVE DONE THE THERAPY ROUTE and it was a waste of money. As one doctor told me, people who suffer from PANIC and think they are dieing have never been told that "your not going to die, it is all in your head"…Well that was my last session with him.  Just to repeat, this is MY EXPERIENCE and YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY.  Now I could continue to HIBERNATE IN MY HOUSE, NOT WORK, RUN OUT OF MONEY AND THEN BE HOMELESS…..Or I can be proactive and continue to experiment and try to find some solution that will allow me to work and have a life.  I have taken xanax in the past, just started it one month ago, still taking a low dose of paxil, and I am MUCH MUCH BETTER at dealing with day to day life, interacting with people, giving my shit done, etc. Yeah, maybe I will be taking xanax for the rest of my life but the only side effect I have had is some sleepiness.  And to those who talk about TOLERANCE BUILDUP, that is a CROCK, yes you might have to increase your xanax from .25mg 3 times a day to .50mg 3 times a day, or even 1mg 3 times a day……..The fact is that people level out, there are people who have taken xanax for 5 to 15 years and most leveled out after 1 year at a dose and have no desire to increase. People need to do some research and FIND OUT THE REAL TRUTH, not what BIG PHARMA and BIG BUSINESS OWNED MEDIA OUTLETS want us to believe. Not to be cynical, but $3 no generic available paxil is much better for DRUG COMPANIES, then CHEAP GENERIC XANAX which might be more effective with less side-effects.  Why are benzo’s so hard to get, cause drug lobbiest have access to CONGRESS and made sure that THE NO-PROFIT SOLUTIONS(IE LIKE BENZO’S) are not readily available. Let me make THE NEWCOMERS TO MENTAL ILLNESS aware that HYPE ABOUT THE LATEST ANTIDEPRESSANT HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT WILL BE MADE ON THE DRUG, and the only time you will hear about THE NEGATIVES about that drug will be when it comes off-patent. Now that we have generic prozac, we will hear more about side effects like NO LIBIDO, WEIGHT GAIN, SUICIDE, AND OTHER  EFEECTS.  Of course, as long as Paxil and Zoloft have no generics, MEDIA HYPE will be still muted, but give it time.  Just as all the SSRI’s go generic, we will hear about ALL THE NEGATIVES and out will come the new batch of 8 TO 12 WEEK STUDIED ANTIDEPRESSANTS to start the new profit cycle.  People with mental illness are just pawns, half ass useless meds are approved based on 8 week studies, NO REASON FOR A LONG TERM STUDY, we really don’t want to KNOW THE TRUTH, and as soon as the generics start rolling out, OUT COMES THE DIRTY LAUNDRY, not to HELP US, NO, ONLY SO THAT WE GO ON THE LATEST $5 PILL THAT HAS A 80% SUCCESS RATE AND EVEN LESS SIDE EFFECTS.  Hell as long as everyone is making money, who cares about THE CRAZIES that take the product, we just need them alive and taking their meds.  Now I forget, was I taking about the cigarette industry or drug companies, HELL WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE.  This of course is just the opinion of a mentally ill patient with 15 years of experience popping pills, all of which have a 70% effective rate, but I guess I am the exception, "ALIVE" AND NOT SUICIDAL, AND NOT HAPPY ABOUT IT. White Knight

Response:

Question:

Hi jenwolf, I don’t know what your situation is, but if you don’t have insurance or lost your insurance coverage most states have an insurance pool available to residents that can’t get private insurance due to chronic illness, birth defects or the like.  I would call your State Insurance Office and see what kind of coverage is available including prescription drugs (this is not through welfare and there is a cost).  I have had to go through this a million times because my youngest child was born with a life long birth defect and no one other than group insurance will touch him…recently ditto for myself and my other son with asthma.  Really raises the blood pressure at times, for sure. Best wishes, Patrice – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – can someone please tell me if there is any help anywhere for this. i have about a month left. please don’t suggest welfare, they have turned me away already. someone mailed me a link to http://www.themedicineprogram.com/ but I’m a lot skeptical about something like this when it’s being done out of a p.o. box and requiring at least $5 up front. please don’t suggest getting samples from my doctor. I take several nebulizer solutions plus singulair and theophyline

Response:

Hello Jenwolf     I just checked this other site and it has some very good info for free so take a look. http://www.needymeds.com/index.html Thanks Lane Lewis

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – can someone please tell me if there is any help anywhere for this. i have about a month left. please don’t suggest welfare, they have turned me away already. someone mailed me a link to http://www.themedicineprogram.com/ but I’m a lot skeptical about something like this when it’s being done out of a p.o. box and requiring at least $5 up front. please don’t suggest getting samples from my doctor. I take several nebulizer solutions plus singulair and theophyline

Response:

Hello Jenwolf     I just checked this other site and it has some very good info for free so take a look. http://www.needymeds.com/index.html

Yes, that one was much more helpful. The thing that bothers me is that some of these companies have an income limit. One said not over $1200/month for a family of 2. Our income is just *slightly* over that right now. What these individual companies don’t seem to realize is that the drug they manufacture is not the only drug I need. The cost for all of them approaches $1000. That’s nearly *all* of our income just for medications. There’s no way we can afford it. Some other people suggested I check into a state insurance pool. Michigan has no such thing. Just some laws about covering people with pre-existing conditions, but that only pertains to employers offering employees insurance through insurance companies within the state. The law has a huge loophole in that they can offer insurance through an out-of-state company which doesn’t have to follow Michigan law or they can offer a private insurance which is not regulated by the state. I found only one insurance company that would sell a policy to a private individual, but they don’t offer prescription coverage to individuals at all. I only got lucky that my husband’s other employer seems to have paid the premium that I am covered under even though they didn’t have to since he’s laid off. So, at least I will be able to get another 3 month supply of everything for about $50. This still doesn’t solve the problem, it just puts a band-aid on it. What we need is a *federal* pool. Or I need to move to SC or CO.

Response:

This insurance program is sometimes listed under wierd things in the blue pages. Try your state insurance commissioner’s office. Also, there are patient advocacy groups that sometimes have all this information together. Under Michigan State Government on the web, I found this page which has a way to access consumer information services of the Michigan State Insurance Bureau: http://www.cis.state.mi.us/ins/  Good luck. Linda

Thank you for the link. I managed to find the number to the state health insurance bureau and called them. For about $200/month I can get health insurance that covers a lot of things: office visits, lab work, x-rays, dental, optical, hospitalization etc … but not prescriptions. They suggested I call the welfare people. When I told them I’d already been turned away by the welfare people, they said "sorry, can’t help ya" Now I know why so many sick people in Michigan kill themselves.

Response:

Links for free drugs for the needy: http://www.themedicineprogram.com/ The Medicine Program "MEDICINE at NO COST!

Medicine at no cost, just be sure you send $5 per medicine requested to this p.o. box and, oh btw, there’s no guarantee. Sounds like a scam to me. The others I haven’t looked at. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://www.needymeds.com/index.html  Free Meds http://www.aaaai.org/professional/physicianreference/drugassistance.stm Prescription Assistance

Response:

Hello Jenwolf     Send them the money. They will send you the forms for the free meds. This is legit but there are no guarantees that you will qualify and only some meds such as accolate are available. The drug companies themselves put on these programs for the needy but not all of them do so this service will tell you which ones do and do not. You could try contacting them directly but I’m not sure they would respond. Didn’t you post this about six months ago it’s what got me interested in this and thanks to the person who first posted the link. Thanks :O) Lane Lewis

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – can someone please tell me if there is any help anywhere for this. i have about a month left. please don’t suggest welfare, they have turned me away already. someone mailed me a link to http://www.themedicineprogram.com/ but I’m a lot skeptical about something like this when it’s being done out of a p.o. box and requiring at least $5 up front. please don’t suggest getting samples from my doctor. I take several nebulizer solutions plus singulair and theophyline

Response:

Links for free drugs for the needy: http://www.themedicineprogram.com/ The Medicine Program "MEDICINE at NO COST! http://www.needymeds.com/index.html  Free Meds http://www.aaaai.org/professional/physicianreference/drugassistance.stm Prescription Assistance

Response:

can someone please tell me if there is any help anywhere for this. i have about a month left. please don’t suggest welfare, they have turned me away already. someone mailed me a link to http://www.themedicineprogram.com/ but I’m a lot skeptical about something like this when it’s being done out of a p.o. box and requiring at least $5 up front. please don’t suggest getting samples from my doctor. I take several nebulizer solutions plus singulair and theophyline

Response:

Hi jenwolf, I don’t know what your situation is, but if you don’t have insurance or lost your insurance coverage most states have an insurance pool available to residents that can’t get private insurance due to chronic illness, birth defects or the like.  I would call your State Insurance Office

I’ve heard of this for auto insurance, but not medical. State Insurance Office. I don’t even know that Michigan has one. I can try to find out. What state are you in?

Response:

I’m in South Carolina.  Look in your blue pages under State Insurance Department.  I live in one of the most backward states in the US, so that gives me hope that your state has comparable benefits.  (I know there are SC residents that lurk on this ng, so please don’t flame me for this comment.)

Hmmm, all I can find is listed under community services – insurance complaints – insurance information hotline. I suppose I could call them and complain about being excluded from every medical insurance on the planet just because I have asthma and depression and need about $1000 worth of medication every month. But there’s no listing under the state section. Shrug. Interesting that they also list the suicide prevention hotline under insurance complaints. ‘Course lack of adequate medical care is probably the number 1 reason people in Michigan kill themselves. Not very encouraging, that.

Response:

This insurance program is sometimes listed under wierd things in the blue pages. Try your state insurance commissioner’s office. Also, there are patient advocacy groups that sometimes have all this information together. Under Michigan State Government on the web, I found this page which has a way to access consumer information services of the Michigan State Insurance Bureau: http://www.cis.state.mi.us/ins/  Good luck. Linda – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m in South Carolina.  Look in your blue pages under State Insurance Department.  I live in one of the most backward states in the US, so that gives me hope that your state has comparable benefits.  (I know there are SC residents that lurk on this ng, so please don’t flame me for this comment.) Hmmm, all I can find is listed under community services – insurance complaints – insurance information hotline. I suppose I could call them and complain about being excluded from every medical insurance on the planet just because I have asthma and depression and need about $1000 worth of medication every month. But there’s no listing under the state section. Shrug. Interesting that they also list the suicide prevention hotline under insurance complaints. ‘Course lack of adequate medical care is probably the number 1 reason people in Michigan kill themselves. Not very encouraging, that.

Response:

I’m in South Carolina.  Look in your blue pages under State Insurance Department.  I live in one of the most backward states in the US, so that gives me hope that your state has comparable benefits.  (I know there are SC residents that lurk on this ng, so please don’t flame me for this comment.) Good luck, Patrice – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi jenwolf, I don’t know what your situation is, but if you don’t have insurance or lost your insurance coverage most states have an insurance pool available to residents that can’t get private insurance due to chronic illness, birth defects or the like.  I would call your State Insurance Office I’ve heard of this for auto insurance, but not medical. State Insurance Office. I don’t even know that Michigan has one. I can try to find out. What state are you in?

Response:

Question:

Hi everyone, i’ve suffered headaches off and on my whole life, but over the past 8 days, I have had a severe morning headache every single morning.  It is more in the back of my head, my neck muscles are very sore and my jaw and bottom molars are sore as well. I take two excedrin migraine and the headache is completely gone within an hour, if I don’t take the excedrin, then well the headache stays with me for most of the day until after lunch.  Also my eyes are very light sensitive with these headaches. I had been on zoloft 50mg for about 8 months and two months ago I stopped taking it, I slowly weaned myself off of it.  I’m thinking these headaches could be from the zoloft withdrawal?  I also feel that I may be grinding my teeth at night but i’m not sure.  Any thoughts? Thanks in advance.

Response:

I had been on zoloft 50mg for about 8 months and two months ago I stopped taking it, I slowly weaned myself off of it. I’m thinking these headaches could be from the zoloft withdrawal? I also feel that I may be grinding my teeth at night but i’m not sure. Any thoughts?

IMHO, it may well be the grinding of your teeth, as well as not taking zoloft anymore.  Doctors say that anti-depressants are not addictive as benzo’s, but they are so wrong.  I  weaned myself off prozac very slowly, and I felt ok for  a few months.  Then all of a sudden, I developed dizzy spells, felt very sad and awful.  So…I took the prozac again, and bingo, the dizziness went away, my crying fits stopped, and felt better (but still have that same underlying feelings of sadness and feelings of despair , guilt, etc.  Try taking the zoloft again in small doses, and see if the headaches stop.  Then you know it was the brain yelling out for the zoloft.  The brain does not forget these little pills we take, and lets us know that it wants it again.  Of course, I could be entirely wrong about this.  Maybe your headaches are caused by tension.  Maybe this, or maybe that.  Good luck and be well.   Art Decco… nyc, usa

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Question:

They say imitation is the sincerest form of flattery… But somebody just ripped off my whole Keywords: line! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Lynd…@bigfoot.com (LyndaNP) wrote:

One of the best ways to learn about medication effects–both positive and negative–is by comparing notes with other patients.  The following index links to forum posts discussing each particular medication.  Read what others have had to say about your medication and share your own experiences. Adapin, Sinequan (doxepin) Anafranil (clomipramine) Buspar (buspirone) Desyrel (trazodone) Celexa (citalopram) Effexor (venlafaxine) Elavil, Endep (amitriptyline) Luvox (fluvoxamine) Nardil (phenelzine) Norpramin, Pertofrane (desipramine) Pamelor (nortryptyline) Parnate (tranylcypromine) Paxil, Seroxat (paroxetine) Prozac (fluoxetine) Remeron (mirtazapine) Serzone  (nefazodone) Surmontil (trimipramine) Tofranil (imipramine) Vestra (reboxetine) Wellbutrin (bupropion) Zoloft (sertraline) — LyndaNP

— "Thou shalt not suffer a witch [poisoner] to live" – Exodus 22:18 "A man or a woman who is a medium or a wizard shall be put to death" – Leviticus 20:27 More more info, visit http://www.drugawareness.org

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No Shit?

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Charla: I think it is unwise to drive while impaired on benzos. A person doesn’t think they are impaired but anything over 10 mgs Valium ( which is equal to .1 alcohol ) or it’s equivalent makes a person impaired ( not legally obviously ) . But it is illegal to be engaged in hardcore action while driving so be careful you don’t get caught with your panties down !!!! You wrote" Hi Guys, I believe you can drive on freeways with out a benzo. It will just take a change in perseptions and beliefs and some relatively hard core action. Charla What exactly did you have in mind ? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Elise, I can’t drive panic free unless I take clonazepam at least 1 hour before getting in the car. Recently I was getting anxious on highways because I my pharmacy closed and my new pharmacy carried a different generic manufacturer of clonazepam. Teva makes a stronger version of clonazepam than Purepac in my opinion and others have confirmed my belief through emails. I was feeling anxious while taking the Purepac version of clonazepam and as so I switched to a pharmacy that carried the Teva clonazepam I have been feeling good although I need to build my confidence up again to stop any anticipatory attacks. I should probably ask my pdoc to give me a prescription for Xanax so I could take that before driving and not have to wait for the clonazepam to reach my brain. Elise – are you taking any benzos ?  In my case, I cannot drive on highways without a benzo. Hang in there, Tony Hi Guys, I believe you can drive on freeways with out a benzo. It will just take a change in perseptions and beliefs and some relatively hard core action. Charla — "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans"

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Elise, I can’t drive panic free unless I take clonazepam at least 1 hour before getting in the car. Recently I was getting anxious on highways because I my pharmacy closed and my new pharmacy carried a different generic manufacturer of clonazepam. Teva makes a stronger version of clonazepam than Purepac in my opinion and others have confirmed my belief through emails.

I’ve taken the Purepac brand of clonazepam and alprazolam and noticed no difference between it and Klonopin (Roche) which I started in 1987, and Xanax started in 1985. Chip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was feeling anxious while taking the Purepac version of clonazepam and as so I switched to a pharmacy that carried the Teva clonazepam I have been feeling good although I need to build my confidence up again to stop any anticipatory attacks. I should probably ask my pdoc to give me a prescription for Xanax so I could take that before driving and not have to wait for the clonazepam to reach my brain. Elise – are you taking any benzos ?  In my case, I cannot drive on highways without a benzo. Hang in there, Tony — "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans" Tony, I am glad that you are on a med that makes it easier to do your daily drive to and back from work.  I am starting to doubt that going off the xanax is good for me.  At least when I was on xanax I could drive in town with very little problem. I am going to have to reevaluate this whole med thing within the next 2 weeks.  The pdoc says if I give the paxil time I will feel better than I have felt in years – but after a month I can’t say I am really impressed.  I don’t like not being able to drive – it makes everything tooooo needy and does nothing for my self confidence. But, am glad you have found a way to combat the driving. Smiles, Elise Zoe, I take 1 mg of Klonopin (aka Clonazepam) in the morning before I drive to work and 1 mg in the afternoon about 1 hour before I drive home from work. You can let it dissolve under your tongue if you want to get it into your bloodstream faster.  My main problem is panic while driving on highways. I have a 50 mile roundtrip drive to work on I-95 for 5 days a week. I also take 100 mg of Zoloft a day. I don’t have any hangups about taking meds. The alternative is to have adrenaline pumping through my body whenever I have a panic experience.  I’m certain that flooding your bloodstream and organs with adrenaline every day will shorten your life.  It’s the plain truth.  Sorry if I am coming off as not having feelings but you need to overcome your med phobia. Take care, Tony — "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans" What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Before you buy.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Elise, I can’t drive panic free unless I take clonazepam at least 1 hour before getting in the car. Recently I was getting anxious on highways because I my pharmacy closed and my new pharmacy carried a different generic manufacturer of clonazepam. Teva makes a stronger version of clonazepam than Purepac in my opinion and others have confirmed my belief through emails. I was feeling anxious while taking the Purepac version of clonazepam and as so I switched to a pharmacy that carried the Teva clonazepam I have been feeling good although I need to build my confidence up again to stop any anticipatory attacks. I should probably ask my pdoc to give me a prescription for Xanax so I could take that before driving and not have to wait for the clonazepam to reach my brain. Elise – are you taking any benzos ?  In my case, I cannot drive on highways without a benzo. Hang in there, Tony

Hi Guys, I believe you can drive on freeways with out a benzo. It will just take a change in perseptions and beliefs and some relatively hard core action. Charla – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans"

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Charla: I think it is unwise to drive while impaired on benzos. A person doesn’t think they are impaired but anything over 10 mgs Valium ( which is equal to .1

alcohol What!!?  The sort of impairment that .1 BAC causes is what 10mg Valium causes?  This is total b.s..  I’ve been on 5mg Klonopin and driven with no impairment whatsoever.  One can feel the impairment at .1% BAC.  This is nothing at all like what one feels at even very high doses of benzodiazepines.  Perhaps if one just starts on a high dose of a benzo there will be that sort of impairment, but not if one titrates from a lower dose.  This is yet another scare tactic with no basis in reality. You really ought to examine how much you’ve been brainwashed by your anti-benzo groups. Matt

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Well Rich, you must be a real old timer. Please share how you are. Charla

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Philip Peters wrote : Hey, RICH!! Glad to see you here. I missed you (as do a few other people you know and like!). This sure is a nice surprise… Philip Hi Philip It’s nice to see you too my friend! Rich.

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I take one of those .5mg pills 4x a day.  .5 mg is not an unusual dosage.  I hope this helps!  God Bless and be at peace!

Why are you taking Klonopin 4x day, I thought that this was a 12 hour pill? Dennis. Dennis Hawkins (Remove "dont.spam.me." from address before replying) Do you want to know who has been calling you and hanging up when you answer the phone? Visit http://www.antitelemarketer.com to find out.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Almost every AD, including Zoloft and even when started at a low dose like you’re doing, may worsen anxiety at first. Your doctor should have told you this! You should give Zoloft up to 6-8 weeks to be able to fully assess its effect but you may feel better much earlier (I myself am slow, I tried 5 or 6 AD’s and always needed the full 8 weeks but that seems to be rare). Having a benzo like Klonopin on the side should lessen those initial Zoloft side effects. A normal average amount of Klonopin as a PD maintenance med is around 3 mgs. Epileptics take up to 10-20 mg so not to worry! You might want to try .5 mg *as needed* and see where it gets you. Philip As usual, Philip is totally right… I’ve been on Klonopin for several years and *my* dose is 3.5mg/day… 1mg in the morning, 1mg noon and 1.5mg at bedtime… Of course, we are all different… I also take 200mg of Imipramine at bedtime… Rich.

Hey, RICH!! Glad to see you here. I missed you (as do a few other people you know and like!). This sure is a nice surprise… Philip

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Dear Zoe, You should call your doctor and ask him what dose you should take or follow the instructions on the bottle. I know you are a med phobic, so taking 1/2 of a .5mgs pill will be fine. However, it may not be enough to lower you anxiety. It is very common to have a *temporary* increase in anxiety while weaning on AD`s. It should pass with time and most people use a benzo while weaning on a AD. Take care, Jackie

desensitize taking the pills by swallowing m&m’s and convince yourself you took a pill and then mix a half pill of k in with the m&m’s and when you feel that little surge of I can do this don’t hesitate swallow the pill-if your that freaked out go to the prescribing docs office and take one there-the neat thing about benzos is they are designed to lower anxiety not increase it so if you start to upset yourself the med will slowly calm you down LM

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Tony, Xanax is what the pdoc took me off of cold turkey about a month ago – I wasn’t doing very well on the highway but could drive in town at that time. Now, I am starting to get fed up and wondering if I did the right thing?  I won’t let this go on much longer – my job is in town and I really need to be able to drive the work.  This week my son will follow me down and be there to follow me home.  Trying to stay behind the wheel but I can’t do it alone – tooooo much anxiety.  I am really getting frustrated because it is just too much to expect my family to always be available.  I am not sure about this pdoc but I had to change when I did because my old pdoc moved to Pittsburgh.  I will just hang in there a little longer but won’t let it screw up my job – I love my job and if I give it up probably will never get one like this again.  I guess what I am saying is that shortly I will consider benzos again… smiles, elise

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Elise, I can’t drive panic free unless I take clonazepam at least 1 hour before getting in the car. Recently I was getting anxious on highways because I my pharmacy closed and my new pharmacy carried a different generic manufacturer of clonazepam. Teva makes a stronger version of clonazepam than Purepac in my opinion and others have confirmed my belief through emails. I was feeling anxious while taking the Purepac version of clonazepam and as so I switched to a pharmacy that carried the Teva clonazepam I have been feeling good although I need to build my confidence up again to stop any anticipatory attacks. I should probably ask my pdoc to give me a prescription for Xanax so I could take that before driving and not have to wait for the clonazepam to reach my brain. Elise – are you taking any benzos ?  In my case, I cannot drive on highways without a benzo. Hang in there, Tony — "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans" Tony, I am glad that you are on a med that makes it easier to do your daily drive to and back from work.  I am starting to doubt that going off the xanax is good for me.  At least when I was on xanax I could drive in town with very little problem. I am going to have to reevaluate this whole med thing within the next 2 weeks.  The pdoc says if I give the paxil time I will feel better than I have felt in years – but after a month I can’t say I am really impressed. I don’t like not being able to drive – it makes everything tooooo needy and does nothing for my self confidence. But, am glad you have found a way to combat the driving. Smiles, Elise Zoe, I take 1 mg of Klonopin (aka Clonazepam) in the morning before I drive to work and 1 mg in the afternoon about 1 hour before I drive home from work. You can let it dissolve under your tongue if you want to get it into your bloodstream faster.  My main problem is panic while driving on highways. I have a 50 mile roundtrip drive to work on I-95 for 5 days a week. I also take 100 mg of Zoloft a day. I don’t have any hangups about taking meds. The alternative is to have adrenaline pumping through my body whenever I have a panic experience.  I’m certain that flooding your bloodstream and organs with adrenaline every day will shorten your life.  It’s the plain truth.  Sorry if I am coming off as not having feelings but you need to overcome your med phobia. Take care, Tony — "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans" What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Tony, I am glad that you are on a med that makes it easier to do your daily drive to and back from work.  I am starting to doubt that going off the xanax is good for me.  At least when I was on xanax I could drive in town with very little problem. I am going to have to reevaluate this whole med thing within the next 2 weeks.  The pdoc says if I give the paxil time I will feel better than I have felt in years – but after a month I can’t say I am really impressed.  I don’t like not being able to drive – it makes everything tooooo needy and does nothing for my self confidence. But, am glad you have found a way to combat the driving. Smiles, Elise

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Zoe, I take 1 mg of Klonopin (aka Clonazepam) in the morning before I drive to work and 1 mg in the afternoon about 1 hour before I drive home from work. You can let it dissolve under your tongue if you want to get it into your bloodstream faster.  My main problem is panic while driving on highways. I have a 50 mile roundtrip drive to work on I-95 for 5 days a week. I also take 100 mg of Zoloft a day. I don’t have any hangups about taking meds. The alternative is to have adrenaline pumping through my body whenever I have a panic experience.  I’m certain that flooding your bloodstream and organs with adrenaline every day will shorten your life.  It’s the plain truth.  Sorry if I am coming off as not having feelings but you need to overcome your med phobia. Take care, Tony — "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans" What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

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Dennis, Klonapin reaches it’s peak effect after 6 hours and then it starts to wear off. I feel this everyday. Tony — "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans"

I take one of those .5mg pills 4x a day.  .5 mg is not an unusual dosage. I hope this helps!  God Bless and be at peace!

Why are you taking Klonopin 4x day, I thought that this was a 12 hour pill? Dennis. Dennis Hawkins (Remove "dont.spam.me." from address before replying) Do you want to know who has been calling you and hanging up when you answer the phone? Visit http://www.antitelemarketer.com to find out.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Zoe, I take 1 mg of Klonopin (aka Clonazepam) in the morning before I drive to work and 1 mg in the afternoon about 1 hour before I drive home from work. You can let it dissolve under your tongue if you want to get it into your bloodstream faster.  My main problem is panic while driving on highways.  I have a 50 mile roundtrip drive to work on I-95 for 5 days a week. I also take 100 mg of Zoloft a day. I don’t have any hangups about taking meds. The alternative is to have adrenaline pumping through my body whenever I have a panic experience.  I’m certain that flooding your bloodstream and organs with adrenaline every day will shorten your life.  It’s the plain truth.  Sorry if I am coming off as not having feelings but you need to overcome your med phobia. Take care, Tony

Tony, I take Zoloft 100 mg/day, and Klonopin 2 mg/day, and prn Xanax 0.5 mg. My psych said Klonopin can be taken twice daily with the larger dose (if there is one) in the evening. Thus I take my 2 mg/day as 1 mg in the AM upon awakening and 1 mg at bedtime. The 1/2 life is long enough to allow twice daily dosing. Xanax is much more lipid soluable than Klonopin and reaches the brain much sooner after taking it than Klonopin. Thus if I’m on the highway and get anxious, I’ll take Xanax 0.5 mg for rapid relief. It works in 5 to 10 minutes for me. Chip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans" What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Before you buy.

Response:

Zoe, I take 1 mg of Klonopin (aka Clonazepam) in the morning before I drive to work and 1 mg in the afternoon about 1 hour before I drive home from work. You can let it dissolve under your tongue if you want to get it into your bloodstream faster.  My main problem is panic while driving on highways.  I have a 50 mile roundtrip drive to work on I-95 for 5 days a week. I also take 100 mg of Zoloft a day. I don’t have any hangups about taking meds. The alternative is to have adrenaline pumping through my body whenever I have a panic experience.  I’m certain that flooding your bloodstream and organs with adrenaline every day will shorten your life.  It’s the plain truth.  Sorry if I am coming off as not having feelings but you need to overcome your med phobia. Take care, Tony — "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans"

What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Hi ZoeT, I know how you feel about taking meds.  After we’ve had a few bad experiences with them or heard all the horror stories, no wonder we’re phobic about taking them.  But please don’t be. You’re going to have to trust your doctor on this one.  If it helps you for the first few days, take just 1/2 of the Klonopin so you will see it won’t hurt you.  After that, up it to the prescribed dose so that you’ll get the full benefits of it. Believe me, after a while you be asking yourself what you were so afraid of?  But you’re no different than a lot of us, me included.  The only difference this time is I have a psych doctor who I really trusted from the first minute I met him, plus I had learned a lot along the way.  It will be OK. Regards, Rita Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Dennis, It was my dr.s script!  LOL

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I take one of those .5mg pills 4x a day.  .5 mg is not an unusual dosage. I hope this helps!  God Bless and be at peace! Why are you taking Klonopin 4x day, I thought that this was a 12 hour pill? Dennis. Dennis Hawkins (Remove "dont.spam.me." from address before replying) Do you want to know who has been calling you and hanging up when you answer the phone? Visit http://www.antitelemarketer.com to find out.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

I was on 4mgs a day for a long time for non PAD anxiety. Good luck. Matt

Response:

Philip Peters wrote : Hey, RICH!! Glad to see you here. I missed you (as do a few other people you know and like!). This sure is a nice surprise… Philip

Hi Philip It’s nice to see you too my friend! Rich.

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desensitize taking the pills by swallowing m&m’s and convince yourself you took a pill and then mix a half pill of k in with the m&m’s and when you feel that little surge of I can do this

Margrove.  You may have helped the original poster here, but mentioning mixing M&M’s with medication is liable to have disastrous effects if Jackie happens to read it. Gordon Held

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Almost every AD, including Zoloft and even when started at a low dose like you’re doing, may worsen anxiety at first. Your doctor should have told you this! You should give Zoloft up to 6-8 weeks to be able to fully assess its effect but you may feel better much earlier (I myself am slow, I tried 5 or 6 AD’s and always needed the full 8 weeks but that seems to be rare). Having a benzo like Klonopin on the side should lessen those initial Zoloft side effects. A normal average amount of Klonopin as a PD maintenance med is around 3 mgs. Epileptics take up to 10-20 mg so not to worry! You might want to try .5 mg *as needed* and see where it gets you. Philip

As usual, Philip is totally right… I’ve been on Klonopin for several years and *my* dose is 3.5mg/day… 1mg in the morning, 1mg noon and 1.5mg at bedtime… Of course, we are all different… I also take 200mg of Imipramine at bedtime… Rich.

Response:

What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take?

Dear Zoe, You should call your doctor and ask him what dose you should take or follow the instructions on the bottle. I know you are a med phobic, so taking 1/2 of a .5mgs pill will be fine. However, it may not be enough to lower you anxiety. It is very common to have a *temporary* increase in anxiety while weaning on AD`s. It should pass with time and most people use a benzo while weaning on a AD. Take care, Jackie

Response:

What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take?

Almost every AD, including Zoloft and even when started at a low dose like you’re doing, may worsen anxiety at first. Your doctor should have told you this! You should give Zoloft up to 6-8 weeks to be able to fully assess its effect but you may feel better much earlier (I myself am slow, I tried 5 or 6 AD’s and always needed the full 8 weeks but that seems to be rare). Having a benzo like Klonopin on the side should lessen those initial Zoloft side effects. A normal average amount of Klonopin as a PD maintenance med is around 3 mgs. Epileptics take up to 10-20 mg so not to worry! You might want to try .5 mg *as needed* and see where it gets you. Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

HI zoe! (((((((((HUGS))))))))) I take one of those .5mg pills 4x a day.  .5 mg is not an unusual dosage.  I hope this helps!  God Bless and be at peace! Kindest Regards, Katie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

The best person to tell you this is the dr that prescribed them. People do well on breaking the .5 mg tablet. But you really should ask your dr if your unsure. I know that didn’t help, but it is the best thing to do. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What’s a standard dose to take of Klonopin?  I’m sitting here having PA’s in my office, and I have a vial of Klonopin that I’m too afraid to take (med phobia.)  I have had it about 6 months and not taken one, and looking at the vial it’s .5 mg per pill —  is half of that too much (.25 mg?)?  Should I cut it into 1/4?   I also took my first dose of Zoloft last night (12.5 mg) and I think thinking about that (the Zoloft) is making me anxious. What sort of doses do other people take? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Question:

Hello I have a question.I am a 29 year old male.My hands shakes all the time especially in my fingers,and mostly my pinky.When I get scared,or nervous my hands starts to shake real bad.This has been going on well over a year.Now lately my chess gets tight,and my heart beats rapidly for a log period of time.When I hear my dog barking I get real jumpy,and chest gets tight etc.doses anyone know what this is,and what can be done.Thanks.

I think I said this before but I’ll do it again: IMO your tremor seems anxiety related as you say it gets worse when you’re scared and your other symptoms are typical anxiety symptoms too. However, there are multiple physical conditions that can cause tremor so it would be advisable to have them ruled out. There is *no* reason to think about *Parkinson’s disease* although tremor can be one of its symptoms. I think this reply is unnecessarily frightening. I *would* opt for a physical check-up first though as it is always advisable to rule out other causes and then to go on working on anxiety with a good psychiatrist specialized in anxiety disorders to be properly diagnosed and get prescribed some meds. Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – mail contents: subjects from public accessible information for direct on  processes of several symptoms on tremor and Parkinson’s disease sites  for tremor and Parkinson’s disease ==== One thing about equality is not just that you be treated equally …but that you treat yourself equally to the way you treat [others]…. (make reference to writings of Marlo Thomas) subjects: bradykinesia [slowness of movements] CT and/or MRI scan deep-brain structures, including the basal ganglia, the thalamus, and the globus pallidus. These form a ‘circuit’ that transfers motion-related signals from the brain to the spinal cord and thus to the rest of the body. dyskinesia (uncontrollable movements) electrophysiologically monitored pallidotomy for Parkinson’s disease intraoperative physiologic testing during the operations Massachusetts General Hospital is the only hospital in New England offering the pallidotomy procedure New York teaching hospital  planned to offer the pallidotomy procedure neurologist, evaluates Parkinson’s patients for surgery medicine  Neither drugs nor operations can cure Parkinson’s. Eventually patients need higher doses of medication to control their symptoms. many develop drug-induced dyskinesias and find themselves existing on a precarious edge: motionless without medication, moving uncontrollably with medication. Operations available for certain specific syndromes [of Parkinson'sfunctional and stereotactic neurosurgery (including electrophysiologically monitored pallidotomy for Parkinson's disease and thalamotomy for disabling tremor) pain (no pain-sensing nerves are located inside the brain) Parkinson's disease  treatment  include radiofrequency lesioning, glycerol or phenol injection, the insertion of epidural catheters for continuous medication infusion, cordotomy pallidotomy (to treat Parkinson's procedures involve making small lesions (areas of damaged tissue) in parts of the brain involved with motion control, the lesion is placed in an area called the globus pallidus) Parkinson's Disease (PD) is a progressive neurological disorder caused by --- a loss of nerve cells in the substantia nigra ---death of certain brain cells secreting a chemical called dopamine, one of several neurotransmitters that carry signals between brain cells. Normally, dopamine operates in a delicate balance with other neurotransmitters to help coordinate the millions of nerve and muscle cells involved in movement. Without enough dopamine, this balance is upset. ---infections of the brain, certain drugs, and brain injury paroxysmal pain such as trigeminal and glossopharyngeal neuralgia stereotactic neurosurgery PET scanning preoperative evaluation preoperative imaging studies spasticity (muscle spasms, usually caused by stroke or other neurologic diseases) Stereotactic pallidotomy or thalamotomy . The surgical target within the pallidum is defined for the surgical procedure itself. A skin incision is made in the scalp after infiltration with local anesthesia and a burr hole is drilled through the skull. A insulated stimulating electrode is then introduced into the postero-ventro-lateral globus pallidus. When the intraoperative stimulation indicates that the tip of the electrode lies in a critically identified location with high accuracy need,  the optimal location, a temporary (nonpermanent) lesion is first made. If all of these conditions are met, then a permanent lesion is created at the  site. The lesion may suppress that area and partially restore the lost balance between neurotransmitter systems  It should be noted that none of the stimulation or lesioning is at all painful. Surgery on the thalamus , thalamotomy as surgical treatment for Parkinson's Disease. Thalamotomy,  has an excellent effect on tremor,  not quite as effective at reducing rigidity.  (warning: it can cause the third major symptom, slowness of movement, to get worse). stereotactic surgery made operating on the brain much safer. Stereotaxis uses a metal frame to hold a patient's head absolutely still during imaging studies and the operation. thalamotomy, [creation of a lesion in] the thalamus <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<inte rnet sites  on  processes of some symptoms in tremor and Parkinson’s disease World wide web page: http://neurosurgery.mgh.harvard.edu/Pdpallid. htm#frustrations — an operation for Surgical Treatment of Parkinson’s Disease —on Parkinson’s disease and the globus pallidus World wide web page of Parkinson’s disease: http://mcns10.med.nyu.edu —–History of man with a 18-year history of Parkinson’s disease, candidate for a left stereotactic pallidotomy. —Physical Exam —Procedure —Surgical Treatment of Parkinson’s Disease Other Parkinson’s disease World Wide Web Sites Parkinson Foundation of Canada Parkinson Society of from Jeffrey Kaye (including definitions and U.S. legislation)  Parkinson’s Disease Guide: . American Association for Neurology articles about Parkinson’s Disease World wide web page to search on Parkinson’s disease : General Medical.htm —Parkinson’s disease —Medicines in development World wide web page to search: Hoehn and Yahr Staging [effects] of Parkinson’s Disease (Parkinson’s Disease Staging.htm) World wide web page to search on Parkinson’s disease by Neurosurgery : .Functional Neurosurgery MGH ~ Links.htm <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<disclaimer i notice readings as public accessible information. often i use personal opinion only but many  sources  from reputable medical sites. i am without medical authority to treat conditions. Message 1 of 1 Before you buy.

Response:

Hello I have a question.I am a 29 year old male.My hands shakes all the time especially in my fingers,and mostly my pinky.When I get scared,or nervous my hands starts to shake real bad.This has been going on well over a year.Now lately my chess gets tight,and my heart beats rapidly for a log period of time.When I hear my dog barking I get real jumpy,and chest gets tight etc.doses anyone know what this is,and what can be done.Thanks.

Response:

Hello I have a question.I am a 29 year old male.My hands shakes all the time especially in my fingers,and mostly my pinky.When I get scared,or nervous my hands starts to shake real bad.This has been going on well over a year.Now lately my chess gets tight,and my heart beats rapidly for a log period of time.When I hear my dog barking I get real jumpy,and chest gets tight etc.doses anyone know what this is,and what can be done.Thanks.

You may have *essential tremor* but your tremor may also be attributed to a panic disorder as is suggested by the chest pain, heart racing and jumpiness at loud sounds. I think you should have a physical checkup to rule out other disorders and if those are not found you’ll need a psychiatrist specialized in anxiety disorders (maybe there’s a university clinic in your area?) to get properly diganosed and prescribed meds and/or therapy. The sooner this is treated the better. Philip

Response:

Tremors and cracking voice were the symtoms that drove me to fear social situations.  Turned out I had mitral valve prolapse, a fluttering heart valve, that was corrected by beta blockers like Inderal. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello I have a question.I am a 29 year old male.My hands shakes all the time especially in my fingers,and mostly my pinky.When I get scared,or nervous my hands starts to shake real bad.This has been going on well over a year.Now lately my chess gets tight,and my heart beats rapidly for a log period of time.When I hear my dog barking I get real jumpy,and chest gets tight etc.doses anyone know what this is,and what can be done.Thanks.

Response:

Hello I have a question.I am a 29 year old male.My hands shakes all the time especially in my fingers,and mostly my pinky.When I get scared,or nervous my hands starts to shake real bad.This has been going on well over a year.Now lately my chess gets tight,and my heart beats rapidly for a log period of time.When I hear my dog barking I get real jumpy,and chest gets tight etc.doses anyone know what this is,and what can be done.Thanks.

mail contents: subjects from public accessible information for direct on  processes of several symptoms on tremor and Parkinson’s disease sites  for tremor and Parkinson’s disease ==== One thing about equality is not just that you be treated equally …but that you treat yourself equally to the way you treat [others]…. (make reference to writings of Marlo Thomas) subjects: bradykinesia [slowness of movements] CT and/or MRI scan deep-brain structures, including the basal ganglia, the thalamus, and the globus pallidus. These form a ‘circuit’ that transfers motion-related signals from the brain to the spinal cord and thus to the rest of the body. dyskinesia (uncontrollable movements) electrophysiologically monitored pallidotomy for Parkinson’s disease intraoperative physiologic testing during the operations Massachusetts General Hospital is the only hospital in New England offering the pallidotomy procedure New York teaching hospital  planned to offer the pallidotomy procedure neurologist, evaluates Parkinson’s patients for surgery medicine  Neither drugs nor operations can cure Parkinson’s. Eventually patients need higher doses of medication to control their symptoms. many develop drug-induced dyskinesias and find themselves existing on a precarious edge: motionless without medication, moving uncontrollably with medication. Operations available for certain specific syndromes [of Parkinson'sfunctional and stereotactic neurosurgery (including electrophysiologically monitored pallidotomy for Parkinson's disease and thalamotomy for disabling tremor) pain (no pain-sensing nerves are located inside the brain) Parkinson's disease  treatment  include radiofrequency lesioning, glycerol or phenol injection, the insertion of epidural catheters for continuous medication infusion, cordotomy pallidotomy (to treat Parkinson's procedures involve making small lesions (areas of damaged tissue) in parts of the brain involved with motion control, the lesion is placed in an area called the globus pallidus) Parkinson's Disease (PD) is a progressive neurological disorder caused by --- a loss of nerve cells in the substantia nigra ---death of certain brain cells secreting a chemical called dopamine, one of several neurotransmitters that carry signals between brain cells. Normally, dopamine operates in a delicate balance with other neurotransmitters to help coordinate the millions of nerve and muscle cells involved in movement. Without enough dopamine, this balance is upset. ---infections of the brain, certain drugs, and brain injury paroxysmal pain such as trigeminal and glossopharyngeal neuralgia stereotactic neurosurgery PET scanning preoperative evaluation preoperative imaging studies spasticity (muscle spasms, usually caused by stroke or other neurologic diseases) Stereotactic pallidotomy or thalamotomy . The surgical target within the pallidum is defined for the surgical procedure itself. A skin incision is made in the scalp after infiltration with local anesthesia and a burr hole is drilled through the skull. A insulated stimulating electrode is then introduced into the postero-ventro-lateral globus pallidus. When the intraoperative stimulation indicates that the tip of the electrode lies in a critically identified location with high accuracy need,  the optimal location, a temporary (nonpermanent) lesion is first made. If all of these conditions are met, then a permanent lesion is created at the  site. The lesion may suppress that area and partially restore the lost balance between neurotransmitter systems  It should be noted that none of the stimulation or lesioning is at all painful. Surgery on the thalamus , thalamotomy as surgical treatment for Parkinson's Disease. Thalamotomy,  has an excellent effect on tremor,  not quite as effective at reducing rigidity.  (warning: it can cause the third major symptom, slowness of movement, to get worse). stereotactic surgery made operating on the brain much safer. Stereotaxis uses a metal frame to hold a patient's head absolutely still during imaging studies and the operation. thalamotomy, [creation of a lesion in] the thalamus <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<inte rnet sites  on  processes of some symptoms in tremor and Parkinson’s disease World wide web page: http://neurosurgery.mgh.harvard.edu/Pdpallid. htm#frustrations — an operation for Surgical Treatment of Parkinson’s Disease —on Parkinson’s disease and the globus pallidus World wide web page of Parkinson’s disease: http://mcns10.med.nyu.edu —–History of man with a 18-year history of Parkinson’s disease, candidate for a left stereotactic pallidotomy. —Physical Exam —Procedure —Surgical Treatment of Parkinson’s Disease Other Parkinson’s disease World Wide Web Sites Parkinson Foundation of Canada Parkinson Society of from Jeffrey Kaye (including definitions and U.S. legislation)  Parkinson’s Disease Guide: . American Association for Neurology articles about Parkinson’s Disease World wide web page to search on Parkinson’s disease : General Medical.htm —Parkinson’s disease —Medicines in development World wide web page to search: Hoehn and Yahr Staging [effects] of Parkinson’s Disease (Parkinson’s Disease Staging.htm) World wide web page to search on Parkinson’s disease by Neurosurgery : .Functional Neurosurgery MGH ~ Links.htm <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<disclaimer i notice readings as public accessible information. often i use personal opinion only but many  sources  from reputable medical sites. i am without medical authority to treat conditions. Message 1 of 1

Before you buy.

Response:

Question:

I told my doctor today that the zoloft was not doing anything for me after the initial dosage of 25mg. (I did feel a little better) and after a month he uped the dosage to 50mg– which I felt no different and if anything more anxious. (Xanax aslo perscribed) After taking the 50 mg for a month –I asked him today should I switch to Paxil? He told me don’t believe all the advertizing you read, paxil won’t work any better than zoloft. Just thought you might like mto hear this from what I consider a good  P doctor.

Response:

I told my doctor today that the zoloft was not doing anything for me after the initial dosage of 25mg. (I did feel a little better) and after a month he uped the dosage to 50mg– which I felt no different and if anything more anxious. (Xanax aslo perscribed) After taking the 50 mg for a month –I asked him today should I switch to Paxil? He told me don’t believe all the advertizing you read, paxil won’t work any better than zoloft. Just thought you might like mto hear this from what I consider a good  P doctor.

  I think that your doctor just means that Paxil and Zoloft are just as effective percentage wise in treating PA…However, this does not mean that you don’t fit into the 30% that don’t find help with Zoloft…Nor does it mean that you won’t be sucessful with Paxil because you weren’t with Zoloft…All the SSRI’s may have different effects on you…All that being said I agree with what’s been said here…I felt a little better with 50 mg…A lot better at 100 mg…You have a long way to go before giving up on Zoloft…And some improvement at 25 mg likely means a lot more later…Therefore switching to Paxil may just cost you time (since it’ll take just as long to be effective most likely)… — Charles Phipps

Response:

Philip,     I just wanted to chime in an opinion.  I’ve been on both paxil and zoloft. Zoloft made me like a zombie.  Paxil did wonders in preventing attacks.  I’m on Effexor XR 75 mg right now and it has actually let me make some improvements in my life.  Plus it doesn’t make me feel drowsy like most of the others do. Craig Mangrum – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I told my doctor today that the zoloft was not doing anything for me after the initial dosage of 25mg. (I did feel a little better) and after a month he uped the dosage to 50mg– which I felt no different and if anything more anxious. (Xanax aslo perscribed) After taking the 50 mg for a month –I asked him today should I switch to Paxil? He told me don’t believe all the advertizing you read, paxil won’t work any better than zoloft. Just thought you might like mto hear this from what I consider a good  P doctor. The truth is, though, that our reactions to different SSRI’s are very personal and that some may do well on Zoloft and worse on Paxil or vice versa etc. If all SSRI’s had the same results with everybody there wouldn’t have to be more than one. Regarding the Zoloft I believe that you haven’t given it a fair trial yet. Philip

Response:

I told my doctor today that the zoloft was not doing anything for me after the initial dosage of 25mg. (I did feel a little better) and after a month he uped the dosage to 50mg– which I felt no different and if anything more anxious. (Xanax aslo perscribed) After taking the 50 mg for a month –I asked him today should I switch to Paxil? He told me don’t believe all the advertizing you read, paxil won’t work any better than zoloft. Just thought you might like mto hear this from what I consider a good  P doctor.

The truth is, though, that our reactions to different SSRI’s are very personal and that some may do well on Zoloft and worse on Paxil or vice versa etc. If all SSRI’s had the same results with everybody there wouldn’t have to be more than one. Regarding the Zoloft I believe that you haven’t given it a fair trial yet. Philip

Response:

I told my doctor today that the zoloft was not doing anything for me after the initial dosage of 25mg. (I did feel a little better) and after a month he uped the dosage to 50mg– which I felt no different and if anything more anxious. (Xanax aslo perscribed) After taking the 50 mg for a month –I asked him today should I switch to Paxil? He told me don’t believe all the advertizing you read, paxil won’t work any better than zoloft. Just thought you might like mto hear this from what I consider a good  P doctor.

Hi Dan, Get a new doctor, or educate him His statement is false. We have many people here that did awful on Zoloft but did well on Paxil and vice  versa. Even though the two are SSRI anti-depressants, they are still quite different. All the meds in the SSRI family are different from each other. Some are more sedating than others, and some are more stimulating. If you feel that strongly about trying a new med, demand it or find a new doctor. You might want to think of upping the Zoloft dose, your dose might be a bit low, and that is why you are still experiencing anxiety. 50mgs of Zoloft is a low therapeutic dose. Use your Xanax to help you deal with the anxiety.  Take care!! Jackie ~~On earth, an angel’s wings are inside~~

Response:

I agree to educate this MD or get a new one.  Very poor answer.  I have been on paxil about 5 years and it has been a life saver, Zoloft did nothing for me.

Response:

(Dan Littleton) writes: I told my doctor today that the zoloft was not doing anything for me after the initial dosage of 25mg. (I did feel a little better) and after a month he uped the dosage to 50mg– which I felt no different and if anything more anxious.

Hi Dan. I think you might want to give the Z more of a chance. 25mg *really* isn’t much and if it was helping a little bit, that’s a good sign. Some people need 200mg or even more, but your doctor is right to increase it gradually. The increased anxiety as you raise the dose is a common side effect – if you’re able to tolerate it for a little while, the extra anxiety will go away as your body gets used to the drug. I don’t remember if you are taking other meds as well, but if not, you might ask for a benzo such as Klonopin, Xanax, or Ativan, to smooth things out while you’re increasing the dose of Zoloft. Paxil doesn’t work better than Zoloft in general (statistically), but it does work better for some people. For others, Zoloft works better – it averages out the same. You have no way of knowing which will be better for you unless you try them both – which is a pain in the a**, admittedly! If I were in your place, though, I’d stay with the Zoloft, since you’ve already put so much time into it and had a bit of an improvement even at a very low dose. I hope things continue to get better! -elizabeth

Response:

Question:

    Recently I read a study on sibutramine (Meridia).  I had read several others, but not recently.  In this study patients on 5 mg lost more weight than those on placebo.  Patients taking 20 mg lost far more than those taking 5 mg or placebo.  All patients were consuming structured diets, using behavioral modification, and mild exercise.     My question is this: since the drug appears useful in weight reduction (which I guess it’d have to be, to have ever been approved) why are so many people not seeing results with it?  I know a few people have seen results, but the majority, myself included, have been disappointed.     Why would prior phen-fen use make one less likely to benefit from Meridia (which seems to be the common opinion)?  I only took Meridia for 4 weeks; I didn’t want to fork out that much money for another month if it wasn’t doing anything.  Do the effects increase with time?  The study I refer to was only a 12-week study, although none of the participants  were currently using other meds, so phen users would have been excluded from the study.     Any ideas? Adria

Response:

I’ve been on 10mg per day of Meridia for two weeks and I’ve lost 8 pounds. As a purely subjective speculation, I wonder if it may be effective for so few people because it may work on just a single cause of obesity, that being due to an out-of-whack appetite. For as long as I can remember I’ve been able to look at what most people would consider a normal sized portion of food and know before I ever start eating that my appetite won’t be satisfied until I eat two or three times that amount. This is even more of a problem with sweet and/or fatty foods than it is with things like fruits and vegetables. I also tend to think about food very frequently throughout the day and as a result eat frequent snacks. This is independent of habit, mood, emotional or physical condition or any other variable I can think of. The bottom line is I just seem to be hard-wired to overeat. The Meridia seems to have almost magically "reset" my perception of how much food is enough. I prepare small portions of relatively healthful, varied kinds of foods, and even though sometimes my stomach feels physically hungry, I can easily resist what is now a much weakened urge to snack or overeat. And although it’s a distant secondary consideration, the price of the medication is a motivating factor, too! I’d hate to be spending so much money on something that turned out to be ineffective. Of course I realize 2 weeks isn’t very long, but since my doctor is concerned about my gradually but steadily increasing blood pressure and has told me a weight loss of even 10 or 20 pounds will likely prevent my having to control it with medication, even the weight I’ve already lost is of beneft.

<most of reply snipped – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -4) In the Meridia studies, patients did the best on the larger doses (20 and 30 mg), but the blood pressure results were unacceptable. The largest dose Knoll could get approved was 15 mg. Of the surveys I’ve gotten (something like 300 of them), I’d say about 80 percent of the people were not satisfied with the results they got. Barbara Barbara Hirsch, Publisher Obesity Meds and Research News OMR Web Site: http://www.obesity-news.com

Response:

   Why would prior phen-fen use make one less likely to benefit from Meridia (which seems to be the common opinion)?  

Here are a few reasons: 1) Phentermine and fenfluramine are releasers and reuptake inhibitors, Meridia is only a reuptake inhibitor of norepinephrine and serotonin. 2) Phentermine works on dopamine, whereas Meridia has a very small action on dopamine (which is one of the reasons some folks get sleepy on it). 3) Most people develop some what of a tolerance to obesity medications after a while. So if you develop a tolerance,  and you start taking a weaker drug, you are likely to see poor results. Of course, every one’s receptors are different, and YMMV. 4) In the Meridia studies, patients did the best on the larger doses (20 and 30 mg), but the blood pressure results were unacceptable. The largest dose Knoll could get approved was 15 mg. Of the surveys I’ve gotten (something like 300 of them), I’d say about 80 percent of the people were not satisfied with the results they got. Barbara Barbara Hirsch, Publisher Obesity Meds and Research News OMR Web Site: http://www.obesity-news.com

Response:

I’ve been on 10mg per day of Meridia for two weeks and I’ve lost 8 pounds. As a purely subjective speculation, I wonder if it may be effective for so few people because it may work on just a single cause of obesity, that being due to an out-of-whack appetite.

Meridia doesn’t work on any cause of obesity, it’s an appetite suppressant, and the serotonin component *may* help with OCD. But the jury is still out on that. But phen/fen didn’t work on a cause of obesity either. At this point in time researchers conclude that a variety of "susceptibility genes" cause people to be obese. The only way you could accurately treat an obese person is by knowing what those genes were, and then develop drugs or gene therapy to treat. We are many, many years from that point. I can easily resist what is now a much weakened urge to snack or overeat. And although it’s a distant secondary consideration, the price of the medication is a motivating factor, too! I’d hate to be spending so much money on something that turned out to be ineffective.

I’m glad it’s working for you. There’s no arguing with success <G! Of course I realize 2 weeks isn’t very long

No it isn’t. Let me know how you feel in another six months. If you still think it’s effective. Barbara Barbara Hirsch, Publisher Obesity Meds and Research News OMR Web Site: http://www.obesity-news.com

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –    Recently I read a study on sibutramine (Meridia).  I had read several others, but not recently.  In this study patients on 5 mg lost more weight than those on placebo.  Patients taking 20 mg lost far more than those taking 5 mg or placebo.  All patients were consuming structured diets, using behavioral modification, and mild exercise.    My question is this: since the drug appears useful in weight reduction (which I guess it’d have to be, to have ever been approved) why are so many people not seeing results with it?  I know a few people have seen results, but the majority, myself included, have been disappointed.    Why would prior phen-fen use make one less likely to benefit from Meridia (which seems to be the common opinion)?  I only took Meridia for 4 weeks; I didn’t want to fork out that much money for another month if it wasn’t doing anything.  Do the effects increase with time?  The study I refer to was only a 12-week study, although none of the participants  were currently using other meds, so phen users would have been excluded from the study.

My own belief is that the mechanisms involved are quite different.  If you were having success with phen/fen, this points heavily in the direction of problems with serotonin levels (Phen increases the release of serotonin, fen slows down the reabsobtion).  Meridia does not greatly affect the serotonin levels – it works (when it works) in other ways.  So it PROBABLY would be true in the other direction as well – IF you are helped by Meridia the odds would be good that Phen/Fen wouldn’t help you much (if you could get it).

Response:

My own belief is that the mechanisms involved are quite different.  If you were having success with phen/fen, this points heavily in the direction of problems with serotonin levels (Phen increases the release of serotonin, fen slows down the reabsobtion).

Phentermine is thought to act by releasing dopamine and retarding its reuptake.  I’ve never heard of it affecting serotonin. Meridia does not greatly affect the serotonin levels – it works (when it works) in other ways.

Siburamine is, like venlafaxine (Effexor), a NE/SRI, reducing the reuptake of both norepinephrine and serotonin. — Steve Dyer

Response:

Harold, I read what you wrote about Phentermine. You got it all wrong. I’d suggest reading the articles on Phentermine on the web site for Rx on the Internet. Love your Dutch name. I am Dutch also.   John Bowen   Nipomo, California   http://www.thegrid.net/jhbowen/life.htm  "Too bad the only people who know how to run this country are too   busy driving cabs and cutting hair." — George Burns

Response:

phentermine releases stored norepinephrine. Main site of activity appears to be thecerebral cortex and the reticular activating system. Promotes nerve impulse transmissions by releasing stored norepinephrine from nerve terminals in the  brain.

I always understood amphetamine, phentermine and the like worked (to the extent that we know how any of these drugs "work") by enhancing the release and reducing the reuptake of dopamine, not NE. — Steve Dyer

Response:

phentermine releases stored norepinephrine. Main site of activity appears to be thecerebral cortex and the reticular activating system. Promotes nerve impulse transmissions by releasing stored norepinephrine from nerve terminals in the  brain.

Response:

Steve, Since sibutramine inhibits re-uptake of serotonin and dopamine, do you think that Wellbutrin (buproprion) would also work for weight loss since it is a dopamine-reuptake inhibitor?   Thanks! Cindy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – phentermine releases stored norepinephrine. Main site of activity appears to be thecerebral cortex and the reticular activating system. Promotes nerve impulse transmissions by releasing stored norepinephrine from nerve terminals in the  brain. I always understood amphetamine, phentermine and the like worked (to the extent that we know how any of these drugs "work") by enhancing the release and reducing the reuptake of dopamine, not NE. — Steve Dyer

Response:

Since sibutramine inhibits re-uptake of serotonin and dopamine, do you

Serotonin and norepinephrine. think that Wellbutrin (buproprion) would also work for weight loss since it is a dopamine-reuptake inhibitor?  

Although bupropion is one of the few antidepressants that rarely causes weight gain, and often causes a slight amount of weight loss in people taking it for depression, and even though it’s chemically related to the anorectic drug diethylpropion (Tenuate), I don’t think it’s a very powerful drug when it comes to weight loss. — Steve Dyer

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If one is already taking Prozac, is it safe to try Meridia? I used Fen/Phen and Prozac successfully with no side affects and had good results in  weight loss, FM pain relief, and depression control. My doctor is recommending Meridia, but would like to have me discontinue the Prozac, I’m worried about removing the Prozac. Have been advised by other doctors not to stop taking it because of previous "crashes" following attempts to come off it.

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If one is already taking Prozac, is it safe to try Meridia?

Meridia product info specifically states "no Prozac." My doctor said the same thing. Weening off Prozac should help "crashes." This is conjecture…I "crashed" big time 4 weeks after stopping cold (only 20mg dose/day). It was not fun, but only lasted about 2 weeks. Waited another week before starting Meridia and am not having any difficulty. I used Fen/Phen and Prozac successfully with no side affects and had good results in  weight loss, FM pain relief, and depression control. My doctor is recommending Meridia, but would like to have me discontinue the Prozac, I’m worried about removing the Prozac. Have been advised by other doctors not to stop taking it because of previous "crashes" following attempts to come off it.

– Mary

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I don’t know about Meridia, but if it’s like Phentermine you CAN’T take Prozac with it. Please refer to an MIT study posted at: http://drugawareness.org/MIT.html Appetite suppressants are MAO inhibitors and cause an internal battlefield when paired with anti-depressant drugs such as Prozac (or fenfluramine, the phen/fen combo we all know and love.) From the article: "Maher said that the information that appears on drug labels, in the   Physician’s Desk Reference and on package inserts that reach   consumers is negotiated between the manufacturer and the    FDA."When the labels for phentermine and Sudafed were negotiated,    their MAO inhibitory activity was not known or appreciated or    considered to be important. And apparently there was no requirement    for phentermine’s label to be updated 20 years ago when it was first    shown to be an MAO inhibitor," he said.    The new findings also probably explain why only a handful of the tens     of millions of patients outside America who took drugs in the     fenfluramine family without phentermine developed pulmonary     hypertension or heart valve lesions, and almost all of these people were     also taking other drugs that we have found are unrecognized MAO      inhibitors," he said." So, my advice would be to find out if Meridia (like all other appetite suppresants is an MAO inhibitor). If so, Prozac and Meridia can be a dangerous combination. Good luck – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If one is already taking Prozac, is it safe to try Meridia? Meridia product info specifically states "no Prozac." My doctor said the same thing. Weening off Prozac should help "crashes." This is conjecture…I "crashed" big time 4 weeks after stopping cold (only 20mg dose/day). It was not fun, but only lasted about 2 weeks. Waited another week before starting Meridia and am not having any difficulty. I used Fen/Phen and Prozac successfully with no side affects and had good results in  weight loss, FM pain relief, and depression control. My doctor is recommending Meridia, but would like to have me discontinue the Prozac, I’m worried about removing the Prozac. Have been advised by other doctors not to stop taking it because of previous "crashes" following attempts to come off it. — Mary

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I don’t know about Meridia, but if it’s like Phentermine you CAN’T take Prozac with it.

There’s no absolute contraindication in taking phentermine with Prozac. Please refer to an MIT study posted at: http://drugawareness.org/MIT.html Appetite suppressants are MAO inhibitors and cause an internal battlefield when paired with anti-depressant drugs such as Prozac (or fenfluramine, the phen/fen combo we all know and love.)

Appetite suppressants like amphetamine and phentermine are "MAO inhibitors" only in an extremely restricted sense; one with unproven clinical relevance, despite the claims on that web page. The reason you wouldn’t want to take Prozac and Meridia together is that they both act as serotonin-reuptake inhibitors (with Meridia also acting as a norepinephrine-reuptake inhibitor.) — Steve Dyer

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Question:

Hi,    I have had PD for 14 years now. I haven’t had a bad time with it in years..until here recently.  I am on klonopin..low dosage .25 mg 1/day.     I have had some traumatic events happening in the last few days that have caused me to constantly cry, can’t eat, nausea, and terrible anxiety.  I have some zoloft in my cabinet, but i never took it (pill phobic).  Are there awful side effects to this? My dr. wanted to put me on prozac, but i thought i would rather have one not so stimulating to the nervous system….or does st. john’s wort work? i have some of that as well. thanks

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: : Hi, Hi, Welcome to ASAP! :    I have had PD for 14 years now. I haven’t had a bad time with it in : years..until here recently.  I am on klonopin..low dosage .25 mg 1/day.   : :   I have had some traumatic events happening in the last few days that have : caused me to constantly cry, can’t eat, nausea, and terrible anxiety.  I have : some zoloft in my cabinet, but i never took it (pill phobic).  Are there awful : side effects to this? My dr. wanted to put me on prozac, but i thought i would : rather have one not so stimulating to the nervous system….or does st. john’s : wort work? i have some of that as well. Zoloft and Prozac both belong to the same family of medications; known as Serotonin Re-uptake Inhibitors (SRIs). If you feel better about trying the Zoloft, then maybe you should try that first, but only under the direction of your doctor. Also, I’m not sure how long your Zoloft has been in the cabinette, so it may have to be replaced since medications can go bad after a time (shelf-life). IMPORTANT NOTE: Do Not take St John’s Wort (SJW) together with an SRI medication. There is a serious possibility of a dangerous interaction between the two. If you are Not taking an SRI medication, then you might give SJW a try, but (again) discuss this with your doctor first. SJW seems most effective for moderate depression and anxiety. Severe anxiety and depression may require something else. Considering that recent traumatic events have aggrivated your condition, some form of psychotherapy should seriously be considered. Without knowing your circumstances, I can’t suggest a specific kind of therapy. If you are open to discussing it (via post or e-mail) I will be glad to make a suggestion, but otherwise you should consult a counselor or psychotherapist.                                         Best Wishes,                                         Arthur

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Anxiousgrl schreef: Hi,    I have had PD for 14 years now. I haven’t had a bad time with it in years..until here recently.  I am on klonopin..low dosage .25 mg 1/day.   I have had some traumatic events happening in the last few days that have caused me to constantly cry, can’t eat, nausea, and terrible anxiety.  I have some zoloft in my cabinet, but i never took it (pill phobic).  Are there awful side effects to this? My dr. wanted to put me on prozac, but i thought i would rather have one not so stimulating to the nervous system….or does st. john’s wort work? i have some of that as well. thanks

  Considering recent reports on Paxil and Zoloft side effects I think you’d better try Prozac (max. .5 mgs first dose, liquid) and slowly raise the dose while helped by a benzo, preferably Xanax, to keep initial worsening of symptoms at bay. Almost *all* AD’s worsen your symptoms in the beginning, which may last from2-8 weeks. If you feel you shouldn’t even try Prozac, I would suggest taking Luvox instead. Philip

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Question:

This is an interesting question.  I have been seeking the answer to this for some time now.  My past two cars have been HUGE GM party barges.  A ‘79 Pontiac Bonneville and a ‘84 Buick Park Ave.  I purchased the first in ‘88 and it had about 36K mi. on it for 3100 dollars US. and sold it five years later for about $500 US. At that time it had about 106K mi.  The total cost of non-maintainance repairs was about 600$.  That means the cost of depreciation and repairs was about 5 cents per mile.  Insurance was also really inexpensive too since I paid cash and didn’t carry anything but liability.  It was really a great car.  It did however tend to drink gas, about 16 around town and 19 on the highway. My current car the ‘84 Buick Park Ave.  I purchased for 4500$ about two years ago.  It had about 53K mi. on it at the time.  Now it has about 83k mi. on it.  I have had two problems with it.  The total cost has been about 475 dollars so far.  The car still runs great and I plan on keeping it for another three years.  After that time I anticipate being able to sell it for 700-1000 dollars.  This is a really cheap way to drive. My next car may be an old Volvo or Mercedes.  These cars run forever and have an incredible reseale value.  Maintianance and repairs will cost more but the money will be recooped in better reseale values.  I figure if you buy a convertable Mercedes or a Volvo wagon, about 10-12 years old, you will be able to sell it for about what you paid for it five years later.  That is provided that you keep it in good condition.  Hey, if you buy the right older car, you could even make money on the whole deal.  New cars and Leases are for suckeres B-).  Buy a good used car.  Spend a little on keeping it looking good and running well and enjoy a coar that costs peanuts to run. Just my 2 cents.  Is there anyone else out there that does this out of necessity or out of the desire to save a few grand? Sincerely, Richard F. Giersch

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: On a 60 month loan, 10% interest rate, 67% of the first 2 yrs. payments go to : reducing principle.  Even on the first payment, 61% goes toward principle. : This according to a loan amortization table I just generated in Excel. : Auto loans are not amortized in the same manner as mortgages; they use : the Rule of 78’s method of allocating principal.  As such, up-front : payments are almost entirely interest, and ones near the end, : principal. It’s a good thing you lease your cars now, because if this is the kind of loan you get for your car, someone’s screwing you over. I have a car loan.  It is amortized the same way as my home loan.  All my car loans have been.  There’s nothing magical about it. —   Technology Group   Applied Micro Circuits Corp.

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[snip] : Doubtful. There are too many restrictions on a lease that can never : prove advantageous in all situations. And your addition of the gains [snip] Those leasing restrictions aren’t very attractive to those of us who like to modify their cars a lot.  To me, leasing seems like driving a rental car all the time; it’s like you’re just borrowing the car.  You can put a certain amount of mileage on it, you have to pay for gas and upkeep, but you can’t change it to suit yourself.  I guess if you just consider your car "basic transportation," then a lease might be alright, but if you love cars, forget it.      Danny

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The primary factor in the lease/finance/cash decision should be the interest rate: if one can borrow money at a lower rate than one can obtain by investing it, one should borrow.  Leasing is just another form of borrowing, and leases almost always beat auto loans in terms of interest rate; the average is around 7%, but can be as low as zero.

Not exactly John. A second, heavily determining factor is just how long are you willing to live with one car. If your aim is to frequently trade up to new cars, say every 3-4 years, leasing is almost always the best way to go. I can’t imagine any form of purchase, cash or otherwise, that would put you ahead once you factor in depreciation, etc. On the other hand, if your plan is to just find the cheapest way to run a car, period, then nothing, and I mean nothing, can prove cheaper then the old adage of buying cash and "running it `till the wheels fall off". This is hardly virgin territory we are treading here, as the subject has been the focus of countless studies (including the dissertation of a fellow doctoral graduate of mine some years back). The answer comes up the same every single time, and with an even larger lead in more recent times with the improving longevity of modern vehicles. It may not be the coolest thing to drive in a 10-year old car, but you’d have to have lease payments under $30/month to beat the money layout, including repairs, on a car which has been paid for in cash and driven 10 years (or 150,000 miles). Eventually everyone will catch on, and all cars will be leased. I’m on my fourth one, and much richer as a result: the money I left in GE stock rather than putting down on a car is now worth eight times what it was in 1986, so that $25K I could have used to buy the 1986 Mercedes is now worth over $200K.  And all the lease payments I’ve made since then total only to about $35K.

Doubtful. There are too many restrictions on a lease that can never prove advantageous in all situations. And your addition of the gains in stock is irrelevant to the cost factor of operating your vehicle. Your stock would have made equal profit had you leased your car, bought it, or rode a bike. You could counter that you may not have had the cash to invest had you purchased, but then again you could have invested in a bum scheme and lost all that money. In that case the capital in a car that you *owned* would have better return then your investments and lease payments. Investment is investment, and I’ve also made a lot of money for myself investing, while buying all my cars in cash. So let’s keep seperate subjects just that. So what was that about cash being the best way to buy a car? Thanks, but no thanks.

Again, it depends on usage. Between my job and my business, I drive a LOT. I’ve traded my last two Saabs and one BMW with well over 200,000 miles on them. I’m also an amateur racer and run my Porsche 911 Turbo at local club events. No lease of any type would give a better value than a cash purchase for the former. And no lease contract would even permit the latter. As they say, "your mileage may vary". What was that about "someday everyone will lease"? Thanks, but no thanks. Cheers, – Daryl

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Two year lease, 10% down.  Pay for just the filet.  Let someone else pay for the bone, tail and head.  You will never lose any money and have options at the end of the lease versus long term obligations.  Bear in mind that on a five year loan only 14% during the first two years goes toward principle reduction.  86% is pure interest. Not a judgment – just a factual correction: On a 60 month loan, 10% interest rate, 67% of the first 2 yrs. payments go to reducing principle.  Even on the first payment, 61% goes toward principle. This according to a loan amortization table I just generated in Excel.

Auto loans are not amortized in the same manner as mortgages; they use the Rule of 78’s method of allocating principal.  As such, up-front payments are almost entirely interest, and ones near the end, principal. Auto leases may also be amortized in this same manner, but this is less of a problem because of their shorther length, and the availability of "gap" insurance; this reduces or eliminates the financial impact if one’s car is totalled or stolen.  With financing, one could be seriously "upside-down." The primary factor in the lease/finance/cash decision should be the interest rate: if one can borrow money at a lower rate than one can obtain by investing it, one should borrow.  Leasing is just another form of borrowing, and leases almost always beat auto loans in terms of interest rate; the average is around 7%, but can be as low as zero. Just ask for the lease’s Money Factor and multiply by 24 to get the equivalent APR.  If this number is less than a loan interest rate, leasing is better than financing.  If however, you keep all your savings in a passbook savings account at 2.75%, then you’re probably better off buying with cash, although, there are many subsidized leases available with interest rates lower than this. Eventually everyone will catch on, and all cars will be leased. I’m on my fourth one, and much richer as a result: the money I left in GE stock rather than putting down on a car is now worth eight times what it was in 1986, so that $25K I could have used to buy the 1986 Mercedes is now worth over $200K.  And all the lease payments I’ve made since then total only to about $35K. So what was that about cash being the best way to buy a car? Thanks, but no thanks. Martin Marietta Government Electronic Systems    Moorestown NJ 08057 WPI Class of ‘75, Temple Class of ‘94 My new car history:   1975    1978    1982       1986        1989      1992      1995    VW –  Audi – Audi  - Mercedes – Mercedes – Audi – Mercedes Scirocco Fox GTI  4000S    190E 2.3    190E 2.6    100CS     S320 POSSLQ’s* new car history:           1978      1981      1985       1988      1990      1993         Triumph – Toyota – Toyota  -   VW    - Audi –   Audi         Spitfire   Tercel    Corolla    Jetta GL    80       90S *POSSLQ = Person of Opposite Sex Sharing Living Quarters Note: All Audis and Mercedes above were sold to friends or family.

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:: Two year lease, 10% down.  Pay for just the filet.  Let someone else pay :: for the bone, tail and head.  You will never lose any money and have :: options at the end of the lease versus long term obligations.  Bear in :: mind that on a five year loan only 14% during the first two years goes :: toward principle reduction.  86% is pure interest. : Not a judgment – just a factual correction: : : On a 60 month loan, 10% interest rate, 67% of the first 2 yrs. payments go to : reducing principle.  Even on the first payment, 61% goes toward principle. : This according to a loan amortization table I just generated in Excel. Your Excel spreadsheet is correct.  And, for a 5yr, 8% simple-interest loan, 72.5% of the first 24 payments go toward principle.  Furthermore, for equal APR’s, a lease will *ALWAYS* have the higher interest expense because the average unpaid balance is higher.  And please don’t forget that on a lease you’re probably also paying sales tax on the interest. Leases *do* have advantages, but interest expense is *NOT* one of them. …a loan is just a lease with a $0.00 residual, Mark

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: Two year lease, 10% down.  Pay for just the filet.  Let someone else pay : for the bone, tail and head.  You will never lose any money and have : options at the end of the lease versus long term obligations.  Bear in : mind that on a five year loan only 14% during the first two years goes : toward principle reduction.  86% is pure interest.   Funny, I’ve got a 5 year car loan with a $325 a month payment.  According to my bank statement, about $100 a month goes to interest, the rest to principal.  This is for the first month or two, where the amount to interest will be the greatest.  Now, that means that roughly 65% of the payment goes to principle reduction. But you state only 14% goes towards principle reduction.  huh.. mathematician. —   Technology Group   Applied Micro Circuits Corp.

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Two year lease, 10% down.  Pay for just the filet.  Let someone else pay for the bone, tail and head.  You will never lose any money and have options at the end of the lease versus long term obligations.  Bear in mind that on a five year loan only 14% during the first two years goes toward principle reduction.  86% is pure interest.

Not a judgment – just a factual correction: On a 60 month loan, 10% interest rate, 67% of the first 2 yrs. payments go to reducing principle.  Even on the first payment, 61% goes toward principle. This according to a loan amortization table I just generated in Excel. – David

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Two year lease, 10% down.  Pay for just the filet.  Let someone else pay for the bone, tail and head.  You will never lose any money and have options at the end of the lease versus long term obligations.  Bear in mind that on a five year loan only 14% during the first two years goes toward principle reduction.  86% is pure interest.  A normal vehicle will depreciate 40% during the first two years.  So long term loans cause negative equity and then you are forced to spend for wearable items such as tires, tunes brakes, stuff that never ad any value to the vehicle. It’s pure expense.  Just pay for the filet…the first two years depreciation then change cars instead of tires.

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Does anybody know by experience or by being clever with the calculator as to the cheapest way to own and run a car. Is it cheaper to Lease?  If so, over what period? Is it cheaper to by new and sell?  If so, when do you sell? Is it cheaper to buy second hand? If so, how old? As you can see, there are so many different variations. Perhaps an ex-salesman might have the answers. Please post any comments you have.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Path: news.redstone.army.mil!news.msfc.nasa.gov!bcm!cs.utexas.edu!uwm.edu!lll-win ken.llnl.gov!enews.sgi.com!decwrl!waikato!auckland.ac.nz!dmar04.cs.aukuni.a c.nz Newsgroups: rec.autos.misc Organization: University of Auckland Lines: 12 NNTP-Posting-Host: cs26.cs.auckland.ac.nz Summary: Cheapest way to own/run a car? X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #3 (NOV) Does anybody know by experience or by being clever with the calculator as to the cheapest way to own and run a car. Is it cheaper to Lease?  If so, over what period? Is it cheaper to by new and sell?  If so, when do you sell? Is it cheaper to buy second hand? If so, how old? As you can see, there are so many different variations. Perhaps an ex-salesman might have the answers. Please post any comments you have.

Good article in this month’s Esquire (Bruce Willis in on the cover) magazine that addresses many of the points that you raise…. Glenn E. Painter – SESI Redstone Arsenal, AL (205) 876-2325  DSN 746-2325 CompuServ 74357,1152

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