Hi all… A week ago Tues I saw my specialist who said to reduce my FloVent to 500 mcg per day and see how it goes. So Tues I had the reduced dose and Wed I woke with that familar tiggle and congestion in the back of my throat. I posted a message about this being related to reduced FloVent so fast but no one replied. Then Wed afternoon my PEF dropped into my yellow zone where it has remained (9 1/2 days total). During this time, I returned to 1000 mcg (last Fri). Since I was taking my Bricanyl more frequently, I called my doctor who said to up the dose to 2000 mcg until things calm down then gradually reduce to my regular 1000 mcg. I can’t figure out what caused this drop in PEF; I’m still very close to my red zone so I’m taking it easy, staying indoors and close to the phone incase my PEF drops to the red zone. I’m drinking lots of tea and water. At first I thought I may have a cold but no real cold symptoms have appeared other than feeling quite run down and sluggish. I don’t have any nasal congestion, excessive coughing, sneezing. I did notice a low grade transient fever that didn’t last very long. Does anyone have any ideas what may have caused this? I sure would like to find out so I can prevent it from happening again. — Janine
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A week ago Tues I saw my specialist who said to reduce my FloVent to 500 mcg per day and see how it goes. So Tues I had the reduced dose and Wed I woke with that familar tiggle and congestion in the back of my throat. I posted a message about this being related to reduced FloVent so fast but no one replied. Then Wed afternoon my PEF dropped into my yellow zone where it has remained (9 1/2 days total). During this time, I returned to 1000 mcg (last Fri). Since I was taking my Bricanyl more frequently, I called my doctor who said to up the dose to 2000 mcg until things calm down then gradually reduce to my regular 1000 mcg. I can’t figure out what caused this drop in PEF; I’m still very close to my red zone so I’m taking it easy, staying indoors and close to the phone incase my PEF drops to the red zone. I’m drinking lots of tea and water. At first I thought I may have a cold but no real cold symptoms have appeared other than feeling quite run down and sluggish. I don’t have any nasal congestion, excessive coughing, sneezing. I did notice a low grade transient fever that didn’t last very long. Does anyone have any ideas what may have caused this? I sure would like to find out so I can prevent it from happening again. —
Janine (in Canada), I would guess your exacerbation is caused by a virus, this happens often; external symptoms may be minimal but the lung function gets knocked down; another possibility is its one of your other triggers. Have your triggers been identified and exposure to them minimized? Per US Guidelines, fluticasone use above 660 mcg/day, or 3 puffs/day of Flovent 220 constitutes a High Dose. I believe in Canada you use the same MDI inhaler but labeled Flovent 250 since you measure dose at the nozzle whereas in the US its measured at the holder opening; so this translates to 750 mcg/day is a High Dose. It would be desireable to get your dose down to 500 mcg/day per your doctor’s suggestion, after you are over the exacerbation. Are you using any steroid-sparing meds; a long acting bronchodilator is usually recommended, Serevent, 2 pf twice a day; or TheoDur tablets. [I take both.] Another possibility is Accolate. Do you have Sinusitis or Gastroesophageal Reflux, that could be contributing to asthma? If so it needs to be treated. Do you breathe thru your nose most of the time (filters & humdifies air) Here are links on Asthma Triggers: ASTHMA TRIGGERS http://www.aaaai.org/patpub/resource/publicat/tips/tip04.html TRIGGERS OF ASTHMA http://www.njc.org/MFhtml/TRI_MF.html Identifying Triggers of Asthma, 1994 http://www.ama-assn.org/special/asthma/treatmnt/updates/identify.htm Identifying Asthma Triggers http://www.mayohealth.org/mayo/9602/htm/trigg_sb.htm Trigger-proofing your environment http://www.lungusa.org/learn/asthma/astastrig.html Asthma Triggers http://www.lungusa.org/global/news/medical/medfebaf.html Ozone Air Pollution, Particulates Ellis
snip I would guess your exacerbation is caused by a virus, this happens often; external symptoms may be minimal but the lung function gets knocked down
There’s a nasty respiratory bug going around right now. My son, who is normally a Mild Persistant asthmatic, had a horrible time of it last week. He dropped into his red zone fairly quickly, and when we got to the doctor, he was in bad shape. He had to go onto oral prednisone for five days–and two days later, had a coughing fit so bad he had problems catching his breath and we did the 911/emergency room run, ending up with another breathing treatment (and a verdict of clear lungs) and a diagnosis of a virus-caused cough triggering bronchospasm. So he got codeine to go with the prednisone. That same day he had a brief, but intense fever, going from normal to 103 degrees back down to normal in the space of five hours. We visited the doctor, had x-rays done, because the doctor was worried about the possibility of pneumonia. Lungs looked good, with only a few mucus plugs remaining in his lungs (the doctor pointed them out to me, saying "this is what an asthmatic’s lung looks like on x-rays)…it’s just an ugly, ugly virus causing coughing which irritates the bronchial tubes. I’m hoping we don’t have to go back on prednisone, because he’s now off–but he’s still blowing in his yellow zone. It’s borderline yellow/green–but I’d like him to get back to Intal only, not Intal and Ventolin, as we’ve been doing to manage the attack. jrw
280 is panic time??? Wow, I don’t get worried until I am down below 200. Sharre T.
It depends on what your personal best is. Obviously if your personal best is 600, your normal lung capicity is more than someone whose personal best is 400. Kim
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I went to the doctor’s again today since I have been in my yellow zone since the 7th despite increased FloVent (from 1000 mcg to 2000 mcg daily). A side effect of the FloVent has been thrush 
so he prescribed medication for that and Prednisone. Funny, I was rinsing after each FloVent inhalation, using tea tree oil toothpaste and using my spacer but still developed thrush! Perhaps I’m a little run down? I mentioned this to the doctor and he said I should call him Thurs to let him know how I was doing and if things were not improving then he would run some blood tests. Isn’t asthma fun? Even when you do everything you are supposed to, things can still go wrong. Janine
Yep, that’s true. I would suggest that instead of using a tea tree oil toothpaste you use a tea tree oil mouth wash. You can gargle with it and get the areas of your throat that a toothpast will miss. Also swishing it around your mouth will cover areas the toothpaste would miss. Hang in there. Sometimes, as you said, you do everything right and things still go wrong. Loki
I would suggest that instead of using a tea tree oil toothpaste you use a tea tree oil mouth wash. You can gargle with it and get the areas of your throat that a toothpast will miss. Also swishing it around your mouth will cover areas the toothpaste would miss.
I’m not familiar with tea tree oil. Is it an antispetic of some sort? Anyway, I use a standard antispetic mouthwash for the same purpose. It may not be ‘natural’ but it seems to do the job just fine (and is probably a lot less expensive).
I would suggest that instead of using a tea tree oil toothpaste you use a tea tree oil mouth wash. You can gargle with it and get the areas of your throat that a toothpast will miss. Also swishing it around your mouth will cover areas the toothpaste would miss. I’m not familiar with tea tree oil. Is it an antispetic of some sort?
It is an essential oil that has antiseptic and antifungal properties. As an antiseptic it’s ok. I use it on minor things like paper cuts. As an antifungal it is extremely good. Anyway, I use a standard antispetic mouthwash for the same purpose. It may not be ‘natural’ but it seems to do the job just fine (and is probably a lot less expensive).
As long as it works, that’s all that matters. I used just plain water for a long time. I’ve started using the tea tree oil mouthwash mostly because I had begun to get thrush no matter how thoroughly I rinsed. It seems to be doing the job (at least for now). I’m sure your mouthwash tastes better than mine anyway. Tea tree oil isn’t exactly the most appetizing thing in the world even when masked with spearmint oil (as mine is). Oh, I do believe you are correct about the cost. Someone who is adventurous might try just adding a drop of tea tree oil to their regular mouthwash but I’m uncertain of the correct dilution for that purpose so I wouldn’t. (I could go do the research but I’m in a hurry.) Now, if you need the dilution for shampoo (dandruff), that I can give you. <chuckle Loki
One more note about tea tree–as with any herbal remedy, be cautious with it. My niece is allergic to it, as she discovered to her horror when she used it on a skin inflammation and made it WORSE. I may be a bit sensitive to it as well, as I’ve found it irritating to some of the things I’ve tried to treat with it, and pretty much ineffective for me. Your mileage may vary, but do be careful in testing it. Tea tree oil is also sometimes called "ti tree oil". I understand the tree itself, which was imported into Florida, has become a pest there and is displacing native plants. Maybe if someone turned Floridians on to the market for the stuff, they’d harvest the interloper trees and the price would go down. ;-) My sympathies for those who get thrush from Azmacort or other inhalers. Apparently following my doctor’s recommendation of rinsing my mouth (or just drinking something) after use has been enough to prevent it in my case. Kiwi Carlisle
280 is panic time??? Wow, I don’t get worried until I am down below 200. I only use ventolin, and five mgs methylprenisolone with an antibiotic if I get an infection. I have never really understood peak flow numbers. I didn’t even own one for the first three years of my asthma. Once when I got an infection that went too long before I got my refill for prednisone, I blew 95. THEN I was panicked. I am a half an hour from the hospital. The doctor keeps telling me that there are no definite numbers. I keep wondering why the hell I have the meter. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all… I talked to my doctor on Thursday after trying to get my PEFs up out of the yellow for the past two weeks. Despite prednisone, they were still in the yellow. He referred me back to my specialist who I saw this afternoon at the end of his day. The first few minutes of the visit were disasterous! I told him that my peak flows were down and he commented that "You are obsessed with you peak flows, we have worse cases of asthma than this…go down to spirometry." I was stunned, since any other time I had dealt with him there had been no problem. I went down to spirometry, and the first try produced severe chest tightness and pain. The respirologist immediately left to talk to the specialist, then came back and asked if I would be ok to try again. I managed to get through two more tries. The last two loops could easily fit within the first loop as they were quite a bit smaller. This was under the influence of prednisone and Bricanyl (within 1 hr of the test). I headed back to the examining room while he looked over my results. When he returned, his attitude was significantly changed. Now he was extremely interested in my peak flow chart and commented that he hadn’t realized that I had been this bad for this long. He said that the FloVent was not depositing in my lungs so he has now put me on Pulmicort turbuhaler (400 ug) and he replaced my SereVent with Foradil aerolizer. He also gave me a renewable prescription for prednisone (5 mg) with instructions to use 4 tablets if my PEF drops to 280. I now have to go back in three weeks, sooner if things don’t settle down. He said I definitely had a viral infection which caused my peak flows to drop but I didn’t feel "sick" so I’m still wondering about this. What I found so interesting was his change in attitude and I am left wondering why the change. I definitely will make sure that my next visit with him is not at the end of the day though. — Janine
Sharre T. Truth is infinite; therefore, Truth cannot be known in finite terms – Joel Goldsmith
Hi all… <snip if things don’t settle down. He said I definitely had a viral infection which caused my peak flows to drop but I didn’t feel "sick" so I’m still wondering about this.
<snip I feel that quite a low-grade viral infection which I wouldn’t have noticed before asthma, or which would have lead to a slight drippy nose, can affect my chest or possibly increase my sensativity to chemical smells, such as toilet cleaner, which seem to make my asthma worse. — Surfer! http://www.nevis-vieww.demon.co.uk Hopeful anti-spam: alter double ‘w’ to single ‘w’ to view site & send Email.
Ted said in this very newsgroup… it is the SAME stuff you have been taking, and the price is now only TEN times the price people outside the US pay.
We can only hope that competition will bring the benefits to our US cousins that we Europeans have. Generic Metformin, on a three doses a day basis (1500mg total dose) is sold to the British NHS at a basic price of $4 a week or thereabouts. That is the price the NHS pays; anyone not able to supply at that price does not get used. So therefore as many manufacturers are supplying at that price there is no reason why it should not be available at around those prices in the US. I have had Israeli manufactured Metformin in the past; supplied at that price. Absolutely perfect generic Metformin. The manufacturers would not be selling at the UK price if it was unprofitable. This is not gloating BTW. It really sickens me that our good US friends are being taken for a ride. Ratty — Type 2 since 93 Can I get a new pancreas under the warranty? This one’s burnt out…. http://www.asduk.org.uk our shiny new website!
it is the SAME stuff you have been taking, and the price is now only TEN times the price people outside the US pay. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just got back from the pharmacy where I discovered that my insurance company forced a switch to the new generic metformin. Anyone have any experience with it yet? Any different (or new) side effects that I should be aware of? I still have about 20 days of the old stuff available, so I’d like to be forewarned if possible. Thanks in advance.
Bill Josephs said in this very newsgroup… I just got back from the pharmacy where I discovered that my insurance company forced a switch to the new generic metformin. Anyone have any experience with it yet? Any different (or new) side effects that I should be aware of? I still have about 20 days of the old stuff available, so I’d like to be forewarned if possible. Thanks in advance.
The only real meaningful difference is the name. Metformin is the lab name of the compound that Glucophage contains. The active ingredients are identical. Ratty — email: flyingrat at totalise.co.uk giggle: http://www.users.totalise.co.uk/~royellor/ spam: kiss my ar*e
I just got back from the pharmacy where I discovered that my insurance company forced a switch to the new generic metformin. Anyone have any experience with it yet? Any different (or new) side effects that I should be aware of? I still have about 20 days of the old stuff available, so I’d like to be forewarned if possible. Thanks in advance.
On Fri, 25 Jun 1999, Brenda McKaig wrote:
Comments on anything I’ve said in this message would be greatly appreciated, particularily your experience with either or both of the medications I mentioned: singulair and prednisone to treat polyps.
Before you try the prednisone, check your library or bookseller for a copy of "Coping With Prednisone." Some people can have devastating side-effects from prednisone. I know because I’m one of them.
Do you share a similiar story to me, I’d really like to hear from you. reoccuring polyps? unsuccessful surgery to remove polyps? chronic sinus infection? unsuccessful antibiotic treatments? have had, or are facing radical sinus surgery? feeling helpless and hopeless?
I think most of us who are battling chronic sinusitis suffer bouts of feeling helpless and hopeless. And most of us have been through course after course of unsuccessful antibiotic treatments. You are not the only one and you are not alone. We just have to keep putting one foot in fron of the other one and offering encouragement to each other.
If you have polyps, please ask your doctor about avoiding aspirin and all aspirin products to prevent the reoccurance of polyps. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com
Some people can have devastating side-effects from prednisone. I know because I’m one of them.
What kind of devastating side effects? I just started on Prednisone yesterday. My head still feels full and dizzy although the Dr. said this could take a few days. The only other thing is that I’m extremely weak today, especially in the legs and arms. Ellen in IL
Information on prednisone at http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic/pred.htm Remember, not all persons react the same. Not all develop the same side effects, and most don’t develop all the possible side effects. Most of the side effects disappear with tapering down to lower dosages or discontinuance. NEVER change prednisone dosage without your physician’s knowledge and agreement.. it can be very serious. Most physicians will try to use as little prednisone as possible if it the drug required for effective treatment. Good luck with your treatment and I hope it is quickly effective.
Brenda, Not so long ago I was feeling just as hopeless about my situation as you are now. I tried every treatment they had, you name it. Surgery was recommended but it was never explained to me why I needed it except for a deviated septum. I was on my 14th antibiotic course in about a year and my co-worker expressd concern about the over use of the abx. I told him I never heard of anyone who had sucessful sinus surgery and another co-worker overheard and told me his wife had a good outcome. So I asked for the name of her doctor. I went to see him and he sat with me for over an hour and explained why all the other treatments (sprays, abx, allergy shots, etc) had failed and always would without the surgery to unblock the drainage sites and fix the septum. So I went ahead with it, feeling complete confidence in him. While doing the surgery he found many small polyps that never had showed on CT scans, MRIs or nasal endoscopy. I am still recovering and using Nasonex and irrigation. I am about to start allergy shots next week. I was told the nasonex and shots are necessary to slow the regrowth of the polyps (they normally do always recur), and treat the allergies which had thickened all the membranes over many years. If you are anywhere near NYC please e-mail me for the name and location of my doctor. Please don’t give up, keep searching until you find the right doctor for you. Nadine
I saw a new ENT doctor today. My previous two ENT doctors basically gave up on me. I have had a sinus infection for two years now. It won’t go away despite surgery and 13 courses of antibiotics. CT scans and endoscopes show my sinuses are completely infitrated with polps. This new ENT doctor wants me to try the following: prednisone for three days singulair for thirty days I will also be taking my normal medications simultaneously with the new meds which include: nasacort 1 spray twice a day flovent 1 puff twice a day And of course, I’ll continue irrigating everyday and using lots of saline spray and drinking lots of water. I also started allergy shots yesterday which noone has told me I shouldn’t be taking even though I live with an infection every day. So, the bad news is the ENT mentioned he will consider doing that surgery that removes the lining of my sinuses if the prednisone and singulair don’t work. He said this type of surgery is risky because of the proximity to the eyes and brain, and that there may be some not-so-nice effects after of the surgery. I feel like I’m in a no-win situation. If I don’t remove the lining of my sinuses, then I live with an infection everyday which I think has the potential to cause serious damage. If I do remove the lining of my sinuses, the risk is high and the results not very pleasant. Needless to say, I’m depressed. I know I am NOT MY DISEASE but it is HARD to remain positive in light of this new prognosis which represents my third opinion from a specialist. Comments on anything I’ve said in this message would be greatly appreciated, particularily your experience with either or both of the medications I mentioned: singulair and prednisone to treat polyps. Do you share a similiar story to me, I’d really like to hear from you. reoccuring polyps? unsuccessful surgery to remove polyps? chronic sinus infection? unsuccessful antibiotic treatments? have had, or are facing radical sinus surgery? feeling helpless and hopeless? Thank you for listening. Brenda Pickering, Ontario, Canada bmck…@home.com
I have been on Singulair since Feb 98. I also have noticed fatigue and depression. I was going to stop once, but, since this is the only drug that has seemed to help I tell myself that I can handle it. Since nothing else has changed in my life since I started taking Singulair, I really feel that this is a problem due to the drug
I’ve noticed a tendency for Singulair to cause fatigue. I think the fatigue reduces with time, but still exists. [I'm in the 50% who experience significant improvement with Singulair, 25% get dramatic improvement, 25% no improvement] I still take Pulmicort, Serevent, and low dose TheoDur. My peak flows are running around 100%, but I have gained weight and have exercise induced asthma. I’ve been experimenting dropping the Singulair; or taking a reduced dose by using every other day (or splitting tablet). I am 60; children take a half dose; maybe certain others should be on a half dose? Singulair PI at www.singulair.com Fatigue is shown as 1.8% versus 1.2% for placebo. Also see: http://www.rxlist.com/scripts/patient/piumore.pl?mononum=806&order=0&… Patient Monograph – montelukast Excerpt: "What should my health care professional know before I use montelukast? They need to know if you have any of these conditions:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen
Karen, I have 2 suggestions: 1. Fly home for a visit. The sooner you face the fear, the sooner you get over it. A benzo can help. 2. If you just can’t get on the plane, take the bus. It takes longer but It still gets you there. God bless, Mark Before you buy.
Hi Karen, I have flown since I was young, so I can’t really say I’m afraid to fly. I do have some anticipatory anxiety until I am seated on the plane though. Would it be possible to take a short flight somewhere in your area with your S/O…like a half hour flight?? Or go to one of the flight areas where people have their own planes and ask if you could sit in one maybe to help to desensitize you? Gosh, sorry, I can’t think of anything else. I hope it works out for you somehow…. Bye, Maria – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen
You Can’t Always Get What You Want, by the Roilling Stones…. I saw her today at the reception, a glass of wine in her hand; I knew she was gonna meet her connection, at her feet was a foot loose man… You can’t always get what you want, You can’t always get what you want, You can’t always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you might find, you get what you need….. I went down to the demonstation, to get my fair share of abuse, Sayin’ we’re gonna vent our frustration, If we dont’, we’re gonna blow a 50 Amp fuse…. You can’t always get what you want, etc. I went down to the Chelsea drug store, to get your prescription filled, I was standin’ in line with Mr. Jimmy, A man said he looked pretty ill, We decided that we would have a soda, my favorite flavor, chrery red….. I sold my soul to Mr. Jimmy, yes, and he said one word to me, and that was DEAD… And I said,….."You can’t always get I saw her today at the reception, in her glass was a bleeding man,… She was practiced at the art of deception,,,well I could tell by her bloodstained hand…. You Can’t Always Get What You Want…..
Karen- I don’t have any profound advice to offer. I too have to get over my fear of flying. I Have to fly to Missouri in the spring to take a class. Unfortunately the is no other place in the country that teaches this course. I used to fly 4400 miles every august, and now the thought scares me. I don’t panic in the airport, I always volanter to pick people up! Desesnitize! I think I might fly to Boston a short flight for me to see how i react. Hugs Jess
Kelly- I have a dreadful fear of flying as well. I used to LOVE to fly, until I had my first PA. After that, I feared I’d "lose control" in an airplane. Isnt that awful? Well, a few years ago I flew to Florida. I was a mess getting onto the plain, and I had a big ole panic attack and started crying but then I CALMED DOWN and the rest of the flight went by great.. I even ate the gross plane food because I was hungry. I had a great time in Florida so the plane rice was worth the trip. I didnt even get myself upset about the flight home….. I havent flown since, but I want to plan a vacation now where I have to. I wish you luck, I imagine how you must feel separated from your family- but remember Ma Bell invented Long Distance & the internet for people like us!! You CAN do this and keep feeling good. If you focus on these negative feelings and stop "positive talking" to yourself, things tend to get out of hand. Keep positive! We’re all here for u Elizabeth – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Thank you all for responding!!! Kelly maybe your brother can come fly with me 
Charley, I do dread Christmas, first time in my whole entire life I am not going to be in the same house Christmas morning. I love your idea about the Christmas party. I appoint you organizer and I will be in charge of the food. <g Joan I wish I could just ‘do it’ because maybe you are right, know that you do it when you have to, makes me feel better. Debby, thanks for sharing your story. You are always such a sweetie to everyone. Steph, I am afraid if I did drive it (and that is scary too 
) I may never come back. And I will tell your beautiful, wonderful city hello, I know why you love it so much. Thanks everyone and those of you who have lots of spare time INVENT A TELEPORTER!!! )) Love to you all, Karen Hi Karen, I wish I had a good answer for you, but sadly I do not. I have a great fear of flying myself. I have not been on a plane in 10 years. And I used to fly everywhere. I know how badly you miss your family. Just wanted to let you know, I am thinking of you. Have you thought about driving it again? Arthur may have the answer, he has flown recently.Take Care! And say hello to my beloved city by the bay for me!!! I hope you are enjoying your new home! ((((Karen)))) Steph 
Karen Writes: Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen
Hi Karen, I wish I had a good answer for you, but sadly I do not. I have a great fear of flying myself. I have not been on a plane in 10 years. And I used to fly everywhere. I know how badly you miss your family. Just wanted to let you know, I am thinking of you. Have you thought about driving it again? Arthur may have the answer, he has flown recently.Take Care! And say hello to my beloved city by the bay for me!!! I hope you are enjoying your new home! ((((Karen)))) Steph
Karen Writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen
Thank you all for responding!!! Kelly maybe your brother can come fly with me Charley, I do dread Christmas, first time in my whole entire life I am not going to be in the same house Christmas morning. I love your idea about the Christmas party. I appoint you organizer and I will be in charge of the food. <g Joan I wish I could just ‘do it’ because maybe you are right, know that you do it when you have to, makes me feel better. Debby, thanks for sharing your story. You are always such a sweetie to everyone. Steph, I am afraid if I did drive it (and that is scary too ) I may never come back. And I will tell your beautiful, wonderful city hello, I know why you love it so much. Thanks everyone and those of you who have lots of spare time INVENT A TELEPORTER!!! )) Love to you all, Karen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Karen, I wish I had a good answer for you, but sadly I do not. I have a great fear of flying myself. I have not been on a plane in 10 years. And I used to fly everywhere. I know how badly you miss your family. Just wanted to let you know, I am thinking of you. Have you thought about driving it again? Arthur may have the answer, he has flown recently.Take Care! And say hello to my beloved city by the bay for me!!! I hope you are enjoying your new home! ((((Karen)))) Steph Karen Writes: Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen
When I first flew I was full of anxiety/anticipation like you are right now. But when the "big day" came, and the wheels left the ground, my anxiety changed to excitement. I couldn’t keep my eyes from the window for most of the flight. Things just look so neat from up there even though I have a fear of heights. Some suggestions I have is to bring a walkman (and extra batteries!) with some of your favorite music and some good reading material. Try reading comedy books or watching funny videos about flying before your flight day. When I fly, I can’t help but think about all the silliness from the movie "Airplane," Jerry Seinfeld and his jokes about airlines, or a Saturday Night Live skit about a fictitious airline called "Total Bastard Airlines." Don’t be afraid to start a conversation with the person seated next to you. Tell someone sitting next to you that you’re flying for the first time and that your nervous about it. That in itself could alleviate some of the anxiety and give you a way to start a conversation which will help you keep your mind off of your anxiety. Even though I’m a shy person I’ve managed to have many entertaining conversations with some interesting people. All in all, when the day comes you’re very likely to find that your fears were exaggerated, and who knows, you might even love flying. – Mike – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen
Hi Karen, I flew to Alabama from Washington about 8 months into my getting better a some 3 1/2 years ago. It was a big step for me.But My son was eight months old and my husband was taking him to see his parents with or with out me.So I couldnt let my baby board that plane with out me.To many miles to much could happen ect.. I was very scared but excited to. so I let my hubby make all the arangements and told myself I was going thats that. So I found things to do on the plane in the event I got anxious.I took support friends no. and little things they had said.like If you panic.distract yourself and remember its only anxiety , you will not go crazy or die.ect… The day of the departure we left real early.i was busy all the way up to sitting down on the plane.I felt alittle uncomftorble…and got busy playing with my son.I tryed to get excited when the plane took off but couldnt oh well once in the air I settled down most of my feelings had been anticapatory…since the zoloft was helping with the panic.My son slept most of the way. I did feel very uncomftorble in Memphis layover..we had to rush through a very populated airport.stepped outside to smoke and the humidity was thick. you will only have to suffer a little uncomftorbleness a couple hours and you can do that.you have felt all the panic symtoms before and can handle them.Take mini breaks in your seat.Like crosswords and getting to visit with people on the plane…listen to music and walk to the restroom.Sit in a window seat and look with amazement at flying. You can do it.It is all anticapatory anxiety.Dont let that hang you up.You could practice the not being able to get off the plane in a car during rush hour.I no its not quite the same but its only a feeling and if you accept that you will be anxious and find things to distract during the times you have unwelcomed negative thoughts it will be over before you know it. Long winded Char — On you will go/Onward up many/ a frightening creek./ though your arms may get sore/ and your sneakers may leak. —Dr. Seuss – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thank you all for responding!!! Kelly maybe your brother can come fly with me Charley, I do dread Christmas, first time in my whole entire life I am not going to be in the same house Christmas morning. I love your idea about the Christmas party. I appoint you organizer and I will be in charge of the food. <g Joan I wish I could just ‘do it’ because maybe you are right, know that you do it when you have to, makes me feel better. Debby, thanks for sharing your story. You are always such a sweetie to everyone. Steph, I am afraid if I did drive it (and that is scary too ) I may never come back. And I will tell your beautiful, wonderful city hello, I know why you love it so much. Thanks everyone and those of you who have lots of spare time INVENT A TELEPORTER!!! )) Love to you all, Karen
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hi Karen, I wish I had a good answer for you, but sadly I do not. I have a great fear of flying myself. I have not been on a plane in 10 years. And I used to fly everywhere. I know how badly you miss your family. Just wanted to let you know, I am thinking of you. Have you thought about driving it again? Arthur may have the answer, he has flown recently.Take Care! And say hello to my beloved city by the bay for me!!! I hope you are enjoying your new home! ((((Karen)))) Steph Karen Writes: Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen
Hi Karen, Some of the airlines have "fear of flying" classes. One here in the Seattle area does a "graduation" flight to Portland, which takes about half an hour. Maybe there is something like that in your area. Another option is the bus. I know people think "The bus? Ugh," but it really can be quite cozy and comfy. I don’t fly at all and can’t drive more than a couple of miles from my house, but I can go anywhere on a Greyhound! I would recommend that you take with you a cell phone if you need to feel secure, ginger, if you get motion sickness, and a good book and lots of munchies. I once rode from Seattle to San Diego and really enjoyed it. HTH Dot
Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen
I also am afraid to fly, but I do it. If I did not make myself, I would never see my family. I spend sleepless nights before the flight and take xanex to relax me. I have to make myself think more realistic. My chances of getting killed on the way to the airport are better than dying in a plane. Who knows, you may like it once you have flown. My husband is an engeneer with a Aero Space Industry and he flies all over the world. As he says,( its a piece of cake.) I promise you will make it to Ala and back.
Hi Karen, I had to fly for the first and only time several years ago. I had no choice. I either had to get on that plane in SanDiego to fly home to NY or stay in SD, all alone with no money etc. To say I was terrified is an understatement. I thought I was going to totally freak out or get sick – every bad scenario I could imagine. But luckily I got a seat in the first row so I was facing a partition, and that really helped. I sipped ginger ale the whole flight ( I had to change planes in Chicago) and it really wasn’t half as bad as I had imagined. I haven’t flown since but I just don’t have that fear anymore. It helps to bring a magazine or book along – something you are really interested in. I also now that one airline used to have a Fear of Flying course where you got on a plane and "practiced" flying. I had a friend who took the course and it helped her quite a bit. Maybe you could check that out. That anticipation anxiety is always the worst. You may even find out that you like to fly. You’ve been such an inspiration to me and I know that you will do fine on your plane trip. Take Care, Debby PS. I should have stayed in San Diego
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen
Hi Karen, I can’t give you any flying tips but I can empathise with how hard it is to be away from home especially with the holidays looming. The first Christmas is always the hardest-make sure you plan it to death-keep up some of your family’s traditions and make up some of your own. The more time you have to mope around your apartment, the worse you will feel. Have you made many new friends? Maybe a group of you could get together to do a potluck Christmas dinner. Keep busy, busy ,busy! It does get easier-I try not to imagine what my family is doing on Christmas Day; that helps. If you do feel sad, have a little cry but then get back to doing something you enjoy. Tell your boyfriend how you feel and ask him for ideas. Maybe you could go away for a romantic week-end during the holidays, Finally, have something to look forward to after the first week off January-tickets to a concert or play, a party or whatever you would enjoy. Looking forward to something is a good way to get past those day-to-day blues. Of course, we’ll (ASAP) still be here during the holidays. We should all pick a date to have a Christmas Party in the anx/pan chat room. We could even make it clothes optional; who would know? There are a few fellas I wouldn’t mind meeting under the mistletoe for a cyber-smooch. :o) Karen, you can do this; you are strong (even if you don’t think you are right now). Charley
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all, I need some help please. As you know I am 2500 miles from home. I love it here, but the thoughts of not being able to go home to visit is freaking me out. I have never flown and the thoughts of getting on a plane terrifies me to death. It isn’t like other stuff that I am afraid of. I don’t have the option of saying, "Ok I want to get off NOW" And it isnt like I can work my way up into the 5 or 6 hour flight, I mean how do you practice????? I miss my mom and dad and especially my niece so much it hurts sometimes. I don’t want to move home, but I want to visit. ARgghhh anyone have a private plane that they want to fly me to Bama in? Or any helpful hints? Who here has flown and freaked out or flown when they were scared and did it ? I try to invision getting on the plane, taking off, and then I can’t imagine past that. I even dream about flying and I never actually take off in my dream. Anyhow you are all so great, I just thought maybe some encouraging words would help me take the big leap. I can’t NEVER go home. I wish I had some ruby slippers and could just click my heels. thanks all, The little engine who wishes she could FLY, Karen Hi Karen, I’m not the one to give any advice on flying..remember I am the one who had the MAJOR panic attack on the plane! Someone told me, that if I ever decided to fly again to take something to make me sleep.? I can say that the stewardesses are really prepared for this to happen! I had one who sat with me and comforted me the rest of the way. They also had some waiting for me when I changed planes to help me on the next plane! But the good news I can give you, is my brother-in -law also has panic and depression and he has been flying back and forth to Kosovo…with no problems at all! The plane might be one of those things that does’nt even bother you! If this does’nt work, how about a bus? I know its hard, thats probably why I have always stuck real close around my family..I feel proud of you for even having the courage to make the move! Good Luck to you, Karen, Kelly
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Could anyone tell me if there are any chat rooms or online support groups about panic disorders? I need help :(
Hello to a fellow Gateway 2000 user, There is an anxiety/panic chat room on mIRC or irc called #anx/pan. Use any Dalnet server. Good to see you here at ASAP — Michelle
YES THERE IS A CHAT ROOM CALLED PANIC DISODERS .IF U NEED SOME ONE TO CHAT WITH FEEL FREE IN TALKING TO ME JUST EMAIL ME..I REALLY UNDERSTAND AND GOING THROUGH ALOT MYSELF..TAKE CARE TEABI…..
Could anyone tell me if there are any chat rooms or online support groups about panic disorders? I need help :(
You have found an online support group. Welcome. I don’t know about the chat rooms. Kiesha
writes Could anyone tell me if there are any chat rooms or online support groups about panic disorders? I need help :( Hello to a fellow Gateway 2000 user, There is an anxiety/panic chat room on mIRC or irc called #anx/pan. Use any Dalnet server. Good to see you here at ASAP
Just to add to what Michelle said, it normally starts at around 7pm EST (or midnight in the UK) — Jon Guite When replying by email, please remove the trailing x from my return address
Could anyone tell me if there are any chat rooms or online support groups about panic disorders? I need help :(
Depression causes suicidal tendencies. Often patients treated (with anything) get a little bit better, then they (while not really "better yet") have enough enough energy to complete a suicidal task. Patients started on any anti-depressant (allopathic or homeopathic IMO) should be observed closely as they start to experience the effects of the treatment. I will make it my business to find out more about this, and that means it will be discovered and disclosed. You can count on it. Gary
Well.. how about those people who try and treat their cancer naturally? ie: refusing chemotherapy or other forms of western medicine. There are plenty of cases of people dying due to that. Then we have royal jelly and echinichea. People can be sensitive to those (particullarly asthmatics) and have an allergic reaction. Kava – I’m sure there are reports of liver damage with that one.
NO these Blues man are class action Suits. Go look at the class action suits on Prozac. Again defending some thing you have no answers Come back when you have a better defense Blues Man. Stop posting if you can’t handle are post. Are Web Page is there to help people say what you will what are you doing to help people oh Yes attacking thread is your job HUH thats such big help HUH FUNNY
Gary check this out ELI LILLY Prozac Petition its on the internetgo see it on the Web. Have you seen any of these class action suits. Or are you giveing us your experience. Depresion didn’t cause these say what you will. Defend the Drug Companys Gary its Sad Find out and let us know ok. Zoloft and Prozac And celexa Effexor caused these not depresion tell that to the Families. Find me some thing natural that does the same thing they were useing it as recommended alot of things are bad if over used. Gary again nothing against you what we know and what you know if you haven’t checked it out doesn’t mean its not true it just means you don’t have that Knowledge. your here to help and so are we lets quit attacking each other we all care no matter how much passion we have Ok
Ha Tad pole give me Web Pages of people doing natural for Canser and Died. Yes all things if you have a reaction to it yes pplus ryal Jelly we already gave you that testimony if any thins abused Bye Tad POle need proof. Give me all those plenty of cases TAD POLE I dare you to Read JORDAN RUBENS BOOK: THE MAKERS DIET YOU CAN’T ATTACK RESULTS SORRY TRY HARDER NEXT TIME. Have A Blessed day
Is there any natural or a supplement out there that has caused death or suicide,if taken as recommended. Just wondering because I heard Zoloft,celexa Prozac, Effexor they causes suicidal tendencys I found 2,500.00 cases Can any one help Be blessed
1. Check out the number of people who died of eosinophilia myalgia syndrome as a result of takingl-trytophan. 2. Check out the deaths attributed to St.John’sWort because of negative interactions with other life-supporting drugs such as one used to treat HIV infection. 3. Remember laetrile (apricot pits)? How many people died when they abandoned conventional cancer treatments and went to Mexico for laetrile injections? 4. Check out how many people died as a result of the hepatogenic alkaloid in the kava-kava plant. 5. Check out the number of deaths attributed to Ma Huang (ephedra). The info is there if you have an open and objective mind. Same thing applies to prescription and OTC drugs.
Dear Sir: At no time have you been "attacked". You asked a "question", and I stated that I would make it my business to find out the answer, which I will do. I’m very matter of fact, in general. As I have said now, over and over, I’m glad you are doing well with your treatment plan but I also think it is narrow thinking to say that all western medicine plans are bad ones. Quite obviously, some depressed people don’t do well; that is very, very sad, but it is just the way things are, and they have always been that way – there is less suicide now than there was prior to the advent of treatment, I feel sure. However, I will find out more about this, as it is an important thing. G
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Gary check this out ELI LILLY Prozac Petition its on the internetgo see it on the Web. Have you seen any of these class action suits. Or are you giveing us your experience. Depresion didn’t cause these say what you will. Defend the Drug Companys Gary its Sad Find out and let us know ok. Zoloft and Prozac And celexa Effexor caused these not depresion tell that to the Families. Find me some thing natural that does the same thing they were useing it as recommended alot of things are bad if over used. Gary again nothing against you what we know and what you know if you haven’t checked it out doesn’t mean its not true it just means you don’t have that Knowledge. your here to help and so are we lets quit attacking each other we all care no matter how much passion we have Ok
Depresion didn’t cause these Zoloft and Prozac And celexa Effexor caused these not depresion
If depression didn’t cause these suicides then what were these individuals treating using an anti-depressant? Kevin..
It is possible the drugs themselves that were used to treat the depression increased the chance for suicide as in the latest FDA’s drug investigations into these medications based on new studies. It does sound strange that drugs given to people to treat depression can cause further depression resulting in suicide but it is looking like their is enough cases of it being reported for the FDA to stand up and take notice. Public Health Advisory: Suicidality in Adults Being Treated with Antidepressant Medications Audience: Neuropsychiatric healthcare professionals and consumers [UPDATE 07/08/2005] FDA notified healthcare professionals about the availability of updated Healthcare Professional and Patient Information Sheets for antidepressant medications that were the subject of a June 30, 2005 Public Health Advisory issued about the risk of suicidality (suicidal thinking or behavior) in adults being treated with antidepressant medications. [Posted 07/01/2005] In response to recent scientific publications that report the possibility of increased risk of suicidal behavior in adults treated with antidepressants, the FDA has issued a Public Health Advisory to update patients and healthcare providers with the latest information on this subject. Even before the publication of these recent reports, FDA had already begun the process of reviewing available data to determine whether there is an increased risk of suicidal behavior in adults taking antidepressants. The Agency has asked manufacturers to provide information from their trials using an approach similar to that used in the evaluation of the risk of suicidal behavior in the pediatric population taking antidepressants. This effort will involve hundreds of clinical trials and may take more than a year to complete. [July 08, 2005 - Healthcare Professional and Patient Information Sheets - FDA] - http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/antidepressants/antidepressantList.htm [July 01, 2005 - Talk Paper - FDA] – http://www.fda.gov/bbs/topics/ANSWERS/2005/ANS01362.html [June 30, 2005 - Public Health Advisory - FDA] – http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/advisory/SSRI200507.htm [June 30, 2005 - Drug Information Page - FDA] – http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/antidepressants/default.htm
Okay, open your mind to this as it is very real and unknown syndrome. Do some of your searching on this. It needs to be exposed. Stimulants (marijuana, cocaine, anti-depressants, anti-anxiety drugs, kava kava, st johns wort, etc etc.) have an uncanny ability to send harm to a second or third party who may not be on anything, the most common harm being crohns or colitis, IBD etc. I believe it is those (for the most part) that get this aura of harm via mind/body connection, literally that get depressed or ill and even suicidal. The conventional thinking is that the person taking the anti-depressant is the one that gets suicidal. NO, NOT ALWAYS. Someone else’s med can affect them, and always adversely. To compound the strangeness, the two (or three) need not be in the same room for the vulnerable person to be affected, they can be miles and miles apart. Still the damage continues. And the damage can in any part of the body, heart, eyes, digestive tract etc. I also think SIDS is often caused by the mother or caretaker being on an anti-depressant, or recreational drug. No one knows what is happening, but the person on the med is totally unaware their drug can harm or sometimes kill the child. I can elaborate on cases of this type, but too long for putting all of it here. If you are investigating anything, pay special attention to groups and friends that participate in using marijuana, and if they are close in mind connection, some will be ill, or a friend or relative will be ill. You can bet on this. Look into it. It is strange and almost unbelievable but destructive in a subtle manner no one can suspect. No judgment on the drugs, just an effort to make this known, so that it can be curbed to an extent, or at least inform the ill person just why they are ill. No one can realize the amount of harm done in this manner. These illnesses are being research throughout the world, but not being a scientific cause, it remains in the realm of impossible. But it is not impossible, it is very LIKELY. Gail
To anwser the orrigional question, no I dont know of any natural supplement that has caused death. As for why some people commit suicide on prozac etc. it is typically thought that when depressed patients are on medication they can gain increased energy yet not necessarly decreased depression and thus are gain the energy or motivation needed to comitt suicide. There can be many cognitive reasons for why it is antidepressants spur someone on to commit suicide but considering a so called "healthy" person would not commit suicide if given an antidepressant it cannot be said that the antidepressant alone is the only cause of the suicide. Since everyones brain chemistry is different, antidepressants work differently on the individual person. Antidepressants are not "bad" things people just not right for certian people. Individuals just need to find out what works well for them and people who are at risk for suicide should be monitered especially teens who in general don’t have the ability to make good judgements and may not *fully* understand the implications of their actions. As for Gail’s post, the illnesses mentioned such as IBS and Chrons etc are stress related illnesses which may be percipitated by the stressful events one has to deal with say by interacting with a depressed loved one. The stomach also is highly innervated with the same neurotransmitters involved in depression. Therfore there may be a general disregulation in the brain and stomach, say in families. As for the mariguana stuff and illness it almost becomes a question of which came first the chicken or the egg? I tend to believe that any drug someone abuses be it coffee, alcohol or something "harder" is being used to medicate an underlying problem
GFX and AC are 100% correct about anti-depressants and suicide. As a medical practitioner who prescribes these drugs regularly, I havn’t personally had one of my patients commit suicide, but some colleagues of mine have. These are patients who have major depressive disorders, or are dually diagnosed as depressive with schizophrenia usually. As for the drugs causing suicide? I think it would be fair to say that the data from those studies is wildly open to interpretation. Is a person with a Major depressive disorder likely to commit suicide if put on an anti-depressant? NO. quite the contrary in the vast majority of cases. But, as GFX and AC correctly pointed out, in a major depressive disorder, most patients lack the energy or motivation to commit suicide, if that’s something their even thinking about. I’d say that of the patients with MDD I see, about 5% admit to suicidal ideations. Now some simply lie, but most are sincere and just want to get better. The anti-depressant, whatever type or dose and if it works for that person, gives them more energy and helps them think a bit better. Sometimes the increase comes with better sleep or better appetite that the medication gives them. What ever the cause of the "increased energy" or motivation is probably from the anti-depressant effects. Then with this energy and motivation increase, the person is able to carry out possibly a premeditated suicide plan that they had been thinking about, but were too unmotivated to act upon those feelings. I feel these odds of this happening are extremely slim and I really don’t think you can entirely blame the anti-depressant for the suicide. Now, people with GAD or PD aren’t at any increased risk for suicide when taking anti-depressants. Some may be depressed, but not to the point of someone with MDD as their primary diagnosis. Scott
I will speak only for myself – the more I read, hear and see, the more arcane the entire subject becomes. Anxiety meds cause anxiety as a side effect for some, and tranquilize others. It is just not that well-elucidated yet – this whole psychopharm thing. Scarier still is that there are many people out there who are being evaluated and treated by people who see themselves largely as ‘brain-technicians’ (if you will) and not really receiving very good (if any) therapy at all – talk about lack of holism. Some schizophrenic patients improve simply by having someone listen to their situation, give concrete suggestion, and suddenly their symptoms (positive and negative) lessen – irrespective of drugs used. This is not to say that I’m abandoning the pharmacy (well, maybe the one I’m presently using, but that’s a whole ‘nuther story..) for tea and aroma infusions, but the various effects and responses do seem way over-determined sometimes, at least to me.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – GFX and AC are 100% correct about anti-depressants and suicide. As a medical practitioner who prescribes these drugs regularly, I havn’t personally had one of my patients commit suicide, but some colleagues of mine have. These are patients who have major depressive disorders, or are dually diagnosed as depressive with schizophrenia usually. As for the drugs causing suicide? I think it would be fair to say that the data from those studies is wildly open to interpretation. Is a person with a Major depressive disorder likely to commit suicide if put on an anti-depressant? NO. quite the contrary in the vast majority of cases. But, as GFX and AC correctly pointed out, in a major depressive disorder, most patients lack the energy or motivation to commit suicide, if that’s something their even thinking about. I’d say that of the patients with MDD I see, about 5% admit to suicidal ideations. Now some simply lie, but most are sincere and just want to get better. The anti-depressant, whatever type or dose and if it works for that person, gives them more energy and helps them think a bit better. Sometimes the increase comes with better sleep or better appetite that the medication gives them. What ever the cause of the "increased energy" or motivation is probably from the anti-depressant effects. Then with this energy and motivation increase, the person is able to carry out possibly a premeditated suicide plan that they had been thinking about, but were too unmotivated to act upon those feelings. I feel these odds of this happening are extremely slim and I really don’t think you can entirely blame the anti-depressant for the suicide. Now, people with GAD or PD aren’t at any increased risk for suicide when taking anti-depressants. Some may be depressed, but not to the point of someone with MDD as their primary diagnosis. Scott
Is there any natural or a supplement out there that has caused death or suicide,if taken as recommended. Just wondering because I heard Zoloft,celexa Prozac, Effexor they causes suicidal tendencys I found 2,500.00 cases Can any one help Be blessed
Is there any natural or a supplement out there that has caused death or suicide,if taken as recommended. Just wondering because I heard Zoloft,celexa Prozac, Effexor they causes suicidal tendencys I found 2,500.00 cases Can any one help Be blessed
Well not exactly. You found evidence of attempted law suits. Now post how many were actually attributed to those drugs in the end. Natural remedies ? You mean you don’t list them on your cockamamie web site ?
Depression causes suicidal tendencies. Often patients treated (with anything) get a little bit better, then they (while not really "better yet") have enough enough energy to complete a suicidal task. Patients started on any anti-depressant (allopathic or homeopathic IMO) should be observed closely as they start to experience the effects of the treatment. I will make it my business to find out more about this, and that means it will be discovered and disclosed. You can count on it. Gary
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is there any natural or a supplement out there that has caused death or suicide,if taken as recommended. Just wondering because I heard Zoloft,celexa Prozac, Effexor they causes suicidal tendencys I found 2,500.00 cases Can any one help Be blessed
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I will speak only for myself – the more I read, hear and see, the more arcane the entire subject becomes. Anxiety meds cause anxiety as a side effect for some, and tranquilize others. It is just not that well-elucidated yet – this whole psychopharm thing. Scarier still is that there are many people out there who are being evaluated and treated by people who see themselves largely as ‘brain-technicians’ (if you will) and not really receiving very good (if any) therapy at all – talk about lack of holism. Some schizophrenic patients improve simply by having someone listen to their situation, give concrete suggestion, and suddenly their symptoms (positive and negative) lessen – irrespective of drugs used. This is not to say that I’m abandoning the pharmacy (well, maybe the one I’m presently using, but that’s a whole ‘nuther story..) for tea and aroma infusions, but the various effects and responses do seem way over-determined sometimes, at least to me. GFX and AC are 100% correct about anti-depressants and suicide. As a medical practitioner who prescribes these drugs regularly, I havn’t personally had one of my patients commit suicide, but some colleagues of mine have. These are patients who have major depressive disorders, or are dually diagnosed as depressive with schizophrenia usually. As for the drugs causing suicide? I think it would be fair to say that the data from those studies is wildly open to interpretation. Is a person with a Major depressive disorder likely to commit suicide if put on an anti-depressant? NO. quite the contrary in the vast majority of cases. But, as GFX and AC correctly pointed out, in a major depressive disorder, most patients lack the energy or motivation to commit suicide, if that’s something their even thinking about. I’d say that of the patients with MDD I see, about 5% admit to suicidal ideations. Now some simply lie, but most are sincere and just want to get better. The anti-depressant, whatever type or dose and if it works for that person, gives them more energy and helps them think a bit better. Sometimes the increase comes with better sleep or better appetite that the medication gives them. What ever the cause of the "increased energy" or motivation is probably from the anti-depressant effects. Then with this energy and motivation increase, the person is able to carry out possibly a premeditated suicide plan that they had been thinking about, but were too unmotivated to act upon those feelings. I feel these odds of this happening are extremely slim and I really don’t think you can entirely blame the anti-depressant for the suicide. Now, people with GAD or PD aren’t at any increased risk for suicide when taking anti-depressants. Some may be depressed, but not to the point of someone with MDD as their primary diagnosis. Scott
funny thing about suicide-we can’t ask those who did it, why? I have seen people commit suicide on and off meds-thankfully like Scott, I have lost two clients in over thirty years and both had significant disordered psyches-ad meds do lots of things to people-most of the brooha is regarding teens using them and a teens brain isn’t like an adults-nor are their responses to things like "impulses" and it can be a fair assesment to state ad meds lower impulse control for some people prone to this response on these meds-hence-you will find people who commit crimes, to themselves or others, who take ad meds. The popularity of these drugs has increased the small percentage of those who fall to this behavior and response to a grerater degree—with that litigenous attorneys, media and horror mongering have made these issues much more prevalent to our awareness in our society. Meds have risks-every one of them. It is only prudent to weigh the risk vrs benefit ratio for any patient considering using pharmaceuticals. By and large, ad meds are safe when used as directed by a doc who knows how to use them. All medical practitioners tend to become myopic when drugs become over sold by big pharma and by media hyperbole-anxiety and depression are not easy to treat-we are led to believe they are. These meds are not a panacea or magic bullet, just a tool to use- The mutlidimensional application of prudent intervention and therapy as well as insightful use of pharmacopea has allowed us to garner much better results in treating disorders then ever before-but with that comes a price and that price is that some will suffer from some sort of side effect or paradoxical effect or long term negative manifestations from using a specific chemcial or procedure-there are after all, as analogy, those who do not survive angioplasty or gain great benefit from it-so we don’t scrap it, we do embrace it as a lifesaving technique with risk-psychiatry is the same just my 2 cents
YOU SAID YOU WAS LEAVIN’ !!!! doncha hate when people come to yer house, advertise they’re leavin, get in tha dang car… then come back’n stay awhile? JUST when ya get nekkid and start eatin a nuked artichoke, feelin’ like you can breathe agin? ok.. i’m gunna call ya Uncle Buck from this day forward .Yoga helps a lot, and specially CBT. CBT ain’t cognitive behavioral therapy where i come from, Uncle Buck.. and i gotchur CBT !!!! Sagan, and hypochondriac. (no, english is not my mother tongue
(cept when it’s convenient) and by tha way.. WHO ASKED YA?
I have been on Atenolol 25mg which is a beta blocker and about the lowest dose around, in fact my doctor told me that it has only been around 2 or 3 years. I’ve been taking it for about a year now and I have to say I feel a lot more rested and together than when I was on no medication at all. Panic Attacks are rare now, although I still get bouts of anxiety but I guess that everyone. One thing though, coming off it is annoying because of the shakes but because of my low doasge my doctor said it wouldn’t neccesarily be that much of a problem. Daniko.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Tom I take Xanax and a beta blocker, but I have a pacemaker so the beta blocker is to lower the heart rate when the pacer isn’t doin it’s job…sometimes it fires off to a rate of nearly 200bpm. If you get on a beta blocker, take it at night because it tends to make you tired and feel crappy (due to the lowering of the heart rate). — If you sing a country song backwards, you get your job and your wife back. Hi, Although I don’t have frequent panic attacks, my heart races in doctor office, and blood pessure soars. I’ve been on 20 mg/day of an ACE inhibitor, and BP varies from 110/70 in summer to 135/85 in winter as measured by home monitor (cause unknown). This is an established cycle over past three years. I almost considered asking to reduce the med, since I got some dizziness when standing when BPs were 105/65 every summer. Most problematic, not only do I have this anxiety in MDs office, but my HR will go up, at times, when I strap on my home BP monitor. FWIW, I believe I don’t have the most common form of hypertension, but, rather, anxiety about HAVING high blood pressure, as well as some anxiety when it comes to health issues. I’m thinking it’s time for a beta blocker, and my doc would likely agree. But I’m athletic, and resting heart rate most of the time is 50 BPM. I’d hate to suffer side effects (ED, loss of ability to do strenuous exercise) to control the fight-or-flight response. Incidentally, my resting heart rate has recently climbed (15 BPM), as it does when I exercise too much and don’t eat enough. One month of no exercise and more food usually get’s me back to 100%. As for the anxiety, I’m looking for comments regarding Xanax, Valium, and/or beta blockers, as well as yoga, biofeedback etc. I’m type A personality, but never get this adrenaline rush unless it’s time to measure BP, or going on a first date Thanks, flighty-mikey
Although I don’t have frequent panic attacks, my heart races in doctor office, and blood pessure soars. Most problematic, not only do I have this anxiety in MDs office, but my HR will go up, at times, when I strap on my home BP monitor. FWIW, I believe I don’t have the most common form of hypertension, but, rather, anxiety about HAVING high blood pressure, as well as some anxiety when it comes to health issues.
Hi Tom. This sounds very familiar to me. I have exactly the same problem/fear though I had more frequent attacks (one every three days) until I started to take xanax and zoloft. I feel quite well now. I’ve found that my dosage is fine, or perhaps in the borderline, at 3.5mg of Xanax XR (1.5-0.5-1.5) and 75mg of Zoloft. Sometimes I take 0.5mg of Ativan if I feel a bit anxious or Xanax IR for special occasions My resting HR is among 60 and 65 bpm, and during a Holter test, it decreased to 40 being asleep, which you know is normal, and increased to 140!!! in the afternoon because of my fear while thinking about the possible results of the test. I also had white coat HBP (140-155 sistolic and 90-95 diastolic), while my normal BP (during a 24h. monitoring was 137-87) and I was VERY anxious that whole day, I didn’t sleep at all :/ (I was not taking benzos). The lowest BP I’ve seen in body was 130/80, one night, after the doc at the ER told me I was not dying (the first time I had a panic attack), I felt so well and happy that didn’t notice they were measuring my BP Yoga helps a lot, and specially CBT. Change your point of view, stop thinking about your health/yourself. This was MHO. Good luck. Sagan, and hypochondriac. (no, english is not my mother tongue
Gary and others, Thank you for the replies. You have eased my anxiety, and all have diagnosed me quite accurately….you’re hired. Imagine being anxious because BP is not 120/80, or because sleep is not perfect, or because resting heart rate increases from 50 to 65 BPM. That’s me. I suspect all of my recent ailments are related to doing too much (running, volleyball, weights), without paying enough attention to food and water intake, and paying too much attention to heart rate and blood pressure. Interestingly, overtraining symptoms (OK, from what I’ve read in the medical literature) include anxiety, moodiness, and insomnia. My sleep in near normal now that I’ve backed off the excessive/obsessive exercise! I have an excellent benefit plan and will see someone in the employee assistance program. If medication is the answer, I will consider it. Thanks again for the replies. I will stay tuned here to keep tabs on all the latest and greatest. Tom – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Tom, it just occured to me that I left out one thing I wanted to tell you. The current zeitgeist in medicine is to treat anxiety with SSRI antidepressants, such as Paxil, Effexor etc, or tricyclic antidepressants, such as desipramine or nortryptiline.. In that you referenced some episodes of what are likely postural hypotension (dizziness when standing), a tricyclic antidepressant (TCA) would not be a particularly good choice for you – these drugs have a ‘moderate’ affinity for alpha 1 adrenergic receptor blockade, which is the primary reason why postural hypotension is such a common side effect with these agents. Celexa (an SSRI) is my personal favorite because it is the most selective agent for the serotonin receptor – ten times moreso than Paxil, despite the fact that Paxil is clearly the most potent inhibitor of serotonin reuptake. Potency is mainly a good predictor of adverse events and drug interactions, whereas selectivity will be a better predictor of clinical results. In the slang of the psychiatry industry, Celexa (or lexapro if you like) is more "clean". Having taken many of these drugs myself, I’ve also found that Celexa is the most anxiolytic of them that I’ve tried. Another thing I wanted to mention but forgot – I’ve been taking Xanax for 13 years now, and the dose is still the same, and it works just fine every single day. –Gary
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Although I don’t have frequent panic attacks, my heart races in doctor office, and blood pessure soars. Most problematic, not only do I have this anxiety in MDs office, but my HR will go up, at times, when I strap on my home BP monitor. FWIW, I believe I don’t have the most common form of hypertension, but, rather, anxiety about HAVING high blood pressure, as well as some anxiety when it comes to health issues. Hi Tom. This sounds very familiar to me. I have exactly the same problem/fear though I had more frequent attacks (one every three days) until I started to take xanax and zoloft. I feel quite well now. I’ve found that my dosage is fine, or perhaps in the borderline, at 3.5mg of Xanax XR (1.5-0.5-1.5) and 75mg of Zoloft. Sometimes I take 0.5mg of Ativan if I feel a bit anxious or Xanax IR for special occasions My resting HR is among 60 and 65 bpm, and during a Holter test, it decreased to 40 being asleep, which you know is normal, and increased to 140!!! in the afternoon because of my fear while thinking about the possible results of the test. I also had white coat HBP (140-155 sistolic and 90-95 diastolic), while my normal BP (during a 24h. monitoring was 137-87) and I was VERY anxious that whole day, I didn’t sleep at all :/ (I was not taking benzos). The lowest BP I’ve seen in body was 130/80, one night, after the doc at the ER told me I was not dying (the first time I had a panic attack), I felt so well and happy that didn’t notice they were measuring my BP Yoga helps a lot, and specially CBT. Change your point of view, stop thinking about your health/yourself.
Now that is good advice Sagan, and is also very familiar. Now where have I heard that before?! ;o)
Tom, it just occured to me that I left out one thing I wanted to tell you. The current zeitgeist in medicine is to treat anxiety with SSRI antidepressants, such as Paxil, Effexor etc, or tricyclic antidepressants, such as desipramine or nortryptiline.. In that you referenced some episodes of what are likely postural hypotension (dizziness when standing), a tricyclic antidepressant (TCA) would not be a particularly good choice for you – these drugs have a ‘moderate’ affinity for alpha 1 adrenergic receptor blockade, which is the primary reason why postural hypotension is such a common side effect with these agents. Celexa (an SSRI) is my personal favorite because it is the most selective agent for the serotonin receptor – ten times moreso than Paxil, despite the fact that Paxil is clearly the most potent inhibitor of serotonin reuptake. Potency is mainly a good predictor of adverse events and drug interactions, whereas selectivity will be a better predictor of clinical results. In the slang of the psychiatry industry, Celexa (or lexapro if you like) is more "clean". Having taken many of these drugs myself, I’ve also found that Celexa is the most anxiolytic of them that I’ve tried. Another thing I wanted to mention but forgot – I’ve been taking Xanax for 13 years now, and the dose is still the same, and it works just fine every single day. –Gary
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Many physicians are even ill-informed on the full depth and breadth of the subject of benzodiazepines. When *taken for an indicated condition in the amount prescribed* benzodiazepines RARELY show evidence of tolerance or tachyphylaxis (needing to take more of the drug to get the same result). Over about 30 days, and often less, they DO lose their ability to sedate generally, so are not an especially good choice for sleep medicines in the long term – for most people. I work with hundreds of MD’s and can absolutely assure you that a blood pressure of 135/85 is something that they would be UTTERLY unconcerned with. The American Cardiology Association says that ideally one should have the diastolic (bottom number) pressure at 85 or less, so I’d keep an eye on the sodium intake. IF your pressure were to rise further, particularly the diastolic part, the first thing they’d likely want to do would be to add a mild diuretic to your ace-inhibitor, usually hydrochlorothiazide (HCTZ) As an athlete with a low resting heart rate and a BP like that, you would likely be unremarkable to any cardiologist, and I’ve worked in some pretty fancy shmanzy places where virtually everything was reacted to and treated aggressively. The point: don’t worry so much. If ya can’t stop worrying, get some Xanax or some anxiolytic drug from your doctor – he should be far more interested in that problem than in your enviable pulse and blood pressure. Kudos to you for exercising, it does keep anxiety from getting totally out of hand for a lot of people. I’ll even go so far as to say that if your physician actually agreed to give you a beta blocker with numbers like that (in that the drug isn’t indicated at all), I’d fire his ass. It is clinically dangerous to administer any amount of beta blockade to someone with a resting heart rate of 50. Kindest Regards, Gary You will probably get plenty of "yes" votes for taking Xanax. I’ve heard that the effect lessens if taken regularly. In my opinion, a person with a resting heart rate that hovers in the 50’s ought not to be messing with beta blockers. You may be right, but I don’t think many knowledgible MDs would be unconcerned with a BP of 135/85. Also, as it appears you are mildly over-concerned about the "numbers" that indicate "good health", be aware that beta blockers can easily cause a rise in serum cholesterol levels. That’s what I’ve heard. I’ll pass thanks. Exercising too much and not eating enough do not sound like difficult I have no one to blame but myself. Funny how all of my sedentary friends and relatives all feel dandy 24/7. My New Years resolution on Nov 1: exercise less eat more work less vacation more…. Thanks for the input. Mike Hi, Although I don’t have frequent panic attacks, my heart races in doctor office, and blood pessure soars. I’ve been on 20 mg/day of an ACE inhibitor, and BP varies from 110/70 in summer to 135/85 in winter as measured by home monitor (cause unknown). This is an established cycle over past three years. I almost considered asking to reduce the med, since I got some dizziness when standing when BPs were 105/65 every summer. Most problematic, not only do I have this anxiety in MDs office, but my HR will go up, at times, when I strap on my home BP monitor. FWIW, I believe I don’t have the most common form of hypertension, but, rather, anxiety about HAVING high blood pressure, as well as some anxiety when it comes to health issues. I’m thinking it’s time for a beta blocker, and my doc would likely agree. But I’m athletic, and resting heart rate most of the time is 50 BPM. I’d hate to suffer side effects (ED, loss of ability to do strenuous exercise) to control the fight-or-flight response. Incidentally, my resting heart rate has recently climbed (15 BPM), as it does when I exercise too much and don’t eat enough. One month of no exercise and more food usually get’s me back to 100%. As for the anxiety, I’m looking for comments regarding Xanax, Valium, and/or beta blockers, as well as yoga, biofeedback etc. I’m type A personality, but never get this adrenaline rush unless it’s time to measure BP, or going on a first date Thanks, flighty-mikey
You will probably get plenty of "yes" votes for taking Xanax. I’ve heard that the effect lessens if taken regularly.
You listened to the wrong people. As a rule no *tolerance* occurs with anxiety sufferers, it’s really exceedingly rare. In my opinion, a person with a resting heart rate that hovers in the 50’s ought not to be messing with beta blockers.
I certainly agree. You may be right, but I don’t think many knowledgible MDs would be unconcerned with a BP of 135/85.
Actually this is well within the normal range, no reason to worry. Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, Although I don’t have frequent panic attacks, my heart races in doctor office, and blood pessure soars. I’ve been on 20 mg/day of an ACE inhibitor, and BP varies from 110/70 in summer to 135/85 in winter as measured by home monitor (cause unknown). This is an established cycle over past three years. I almost considered asking to reduce the med, since I got some dizziness when standing when BPs were 105/65 every summer. Most problematic, not only do I have this anxiety in MDs office, but my HR will go up, at times, when I strap on my home BP monitor. FWIW, I believe I don’t have the most common form of hypertension, but, rather, anxiety about HAVING high blood pressure, as well as some anxiety when it comes to health issues. I’m thinking it’s time for a beta blocker, and my doc would likely agree. But I’m athletic, and resting heart rate most of the time is 50 BPM. I’d hate to suffer side effects (ED, loss of ability to do strenuous exercise) to control the fight-or-flight response. Incidentally, my resting heart rate has recently climbed (15 BPM), as it does when I exercise too much and don’t eat enough. One month of no exercise and more food usually get’s me back to 100%. As for the anxiety, I’m looking for comments regarding Xanax, Valium, and/or beta blockers, as well as yoga, biofeedback etc. I’m type A personality, but never get this adrenaline rush unless it’s time to measure BP, or going on a first date Thanks, flighty-mikey
Many physicians are even ill-informed on the full depth and breadth of the subject of benzodiazepines. When *taken for an indicated condition in the amount prescribed* benzodiazepines RARELY show evidence of tolerance or tachyphylaxis (needing to take more of the drug to get the same result). Over about 30 days, and often less, they DO lose their ability to sedate generally, so are not an especially good choice for sleep medicines in the long term – for most people. I work with hundreds of MD’s and can absolutely assure you that a blood pressure of 135/85 is something that they would be UTTERLY unconcerned with. The American Cardiology Association says that ideally one should have the diastolic (bottom number) pressure at 85 or less, so I’d keep an eye on the sodium intake. IF your pressure were to rise further, particularly the diastolic part, the first thing they’d likely want to do would be to add a mild diuretic to your ace-inhibitor, usually hydrochlorothiazide (HCTZ) As an athlete with a low resting heart rate and a BP like that, you would likely be unremarkable to any cardiologist, and I’ve worked in some pretty fancy shmanzy places where virtually everything was reacted to and treated aggressively. The point: don’t worry so much. If ya can’t stop worrying, get some Xanax or some anxiolytic drug from your doctor – he should be far more interested in that problem than in your enviable pulse and blood pressure. Kudos to you for exercising, it does keep anxiety from getting totally out of hand for a lot of people. I’ll even go so far as to say that if your physician actually agreed to give you a beta blocker with numbers like that (in that the drug isn’t indicated at all), I’d fire his ass. It is clinically dangerous to administer any amount of beta blockade to someone with a resting heart rate of 50. Kindest Regards, Gary
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You will probably get plenty of "yes" votes for taking Xanax. I’ve heard that the effect lessens if taken regularly. In my opinion, a person with a resting heart rate that hovers in the 50’s ought not to be messing with beta blockers. You may be right, but I don’t think many knowledgible MDs would be unconcerned with a BP of 135/85. Also, as it appears you are mildly over-concerned about the "numbers" that indicate "good health", be aware that beta blockers can easily cause a rise in serum cholesterol levels. That’s what I’ve heard. I’ll pass thanks. Exercising too much and not eating enough do not sound like difficult I have no one to blame but myself. Funny how all of my sedentary friends and relatives all feel dandy 24/7. My New Years resolution on Nov 1: exercise less eat more work less vacation more…. Thanks for the input. Mike Hi, Although I don’t have frequent panic attacks, my heart races in doctor office, and blood pessure soars. I’ve been on 20 mg/day of an ACE inhibitor, and BP varies from 110/70 in summer to 135/85 in winter as measured by home monitor (cause unknown). This is an established cycle over past three years. I almost considered asking to reduce the med, since I got some dizziness when standing when BPs were 105/65 every summer. Most problematic, not only do I have this anxiety in MDs office, but my HR will go up, at times, when I strap on my home BP monitor. FWIW, I believe I don’t have the most common form of hypertension, but, rather, anxiety about HAVING high blood pressure, as well as some anxiety when it comes to health issues. I’m thinking it’s time for a beta blocker, and my doc would likely agree. But I’m athletic, and resting heart rate most of the time is 50 BPM. I’d hate to suffer side effects (ED, loss of ability to do strenuous exercise) to control the fight-or-flight response. Incidentally, my resting heart rate has recently climbed (15 BPM), as it does when I exercise too much and don’t eat enough. One month of no exercise and more food usually get’s me back to 100%. As for the anxiety, I’m looking for comments regarding Xanax, Valium, and/or beta blockers, as well as yoga, biofeedback etc. I’m type A personality, but never get this adrenaline rush unless it’s time to measure BP, or going on a first date Thanks, flighty-mikey
You will probably get plenty of "yes" votes for taking Xanax.
I’ve heard that the effect lessens if taken regularly. In my opinion, a person with a resting heart rate that hovers in the 50’s ought not to be messing with beta blockers.
You may be right, but I don’t think many knowledgible MDs would be unconcerned with a BP of 135/85. Also, as it appears you are mildly over-concerned about the "numbers" that indicate "good health", be aware that beta blockers can easily cause a rise in serum cholesterol levels.
That’s what I’ve heard. I’ll pass thanks. Exercising too much and not eating enough do not sound like difficult
I have no one to blame but myself. Funny how all of my sedentary friends and relatives all feel dandy 24/7. My New Years resolution on Nov 1: exercise less eat more work less vacation more…. Thanks for the input. Mike – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, Although I don’t have frequent panic attacks, my heart races in doctor office, and blood pessure soars. I’ve been on 20 mg/day of an ACE inhibitor, and BP varies from 110/70 in summer to 135/85 in winter as measured by home monitor (cause unknown). This is an established cycle over past three years. I almost considered asking to reduce the med, since I got some dizziness when standing when BPs were 105/65 every summer. Most problematic, not only do I have this anxiety in MDs office, but my HR will go up, at times, when I strap on my home BP monitor. FWIW, I believe I don’t have the most common form of hypertension, but, rather, anxiety about HAVING high blood pressure, as well as some anxiety when it comes to health issues. I’m thinking it’s time for a beta blocker, and my doc would likely agree. But I’m athletic, and resting heart rate most of the time is 50 BPM. I’d hate to suffer side effects (ED, loss of ability to do strenuous exercise) to control the fight-or-flight response. Incidentally, my resting heart rate has recently climbed (15 BPM), as it does when I exercise too much and don’t eat enough. One month of no exercise and more food usually get’s me back to 100%. As for the anxiety, I’m looking for comments regarding Xanax, Valium, and/or beta blockers, as well as yoga, biofeedback etc. I’m type A personality, but never get this adrenaline rush unless it’s time to measure BP, or going on a first date Thanks, flighty-mikey
You will probably get plenty of "yes" votes for taking Xanax.
i dunno what the topic is, but xanax ALWAYS gets MY vote.. AYE! Exercising too much and not eating enough do not sound like difficult
not difficult at all.. come live at my house. BADDA BING ! ::tossin backah twinkie:: ~tanya
Tom I take Xanax and a beta blocker, but I have a pacemaker so the beta blocker is to lower the heart rate when the pacer isn’t doin it’s job…sometimes it fires off to a rate of nearly 200bpm. If you get on a beta blocker, take it at night because it tends to make you tired and feel crappy (due to the lowering of the heart rate). — If you sing a country song backwards, you get your job and your wife back.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, Although I don’t have frequent panic attacks, my heart races in doctor office, and blood pessure soars. I’ve been on 20 mg/day of an ACE inhibitor, and BP varies from 110/70 in summer to 135/85 in winter as measured by home monitor (cause unknown). This is an established cycle over past three years. I almost considered asking to reduce the med, since I got some dizziness when standing when BPs were 105/65 every summer. Most problematic, not only do I have this anxiety in MDs office, but my HR will go up, at times, when I strap on my home BP monitor. FWIW, I believe I don’t have the most common form of hypertension, but, rather, anxiety about HAVING high blood pressure, as well as some anxiety when it comes to health issues. I’m thinking it’s time for a beta blocker, and my doc would likely agree. But I’m athletic, and resting heart rate most of the time is 50 BPM. I’d hate to suffer side effects (ED, loss of ability to do strenuous exercise) to control the fight-or-flight response. Incidentally, my resting heart rate has recently climbed (15 BPM), as it does when I exercise too much and don’t eat enough. One month of no exercise and more food usually get’s me back to 100%. As for the anxiety, I’m looking for comments regarding Xanax, Valium, and/or beta blockers, as well as yoga, biofeedback etc. I’m type A personality, but never get this adrenaline rush unless it’s time to measure BP, or going on a first date Thanks, flighty-mikey
Hi, Although I don’t have frequent panic attacks, my heart races in doctor office, and blood pessure soars. I’ve been on 20 mg/day of an ACE inhibitor, and BP varies from 110/70 in summer to 135/85 in winter as measured by home monitor (cause unknown). This is an established cycle over past three years. I almost considered asking to reduce the med, since I got some dizziness when standing when BPs were 105/65 every summer. Most problematic, not only do I have this anxiety in MDs office, but my HR will go up, at times, when I strap on my home BP monitor. FWIW, I believe I don’t have the most common form of hypertension, but, rather, anxiety about HAVING high blood pressure, as well as some anxiety when it comes to health issues. I’m thinking it’s time for a beta blocker, and my doc would likely agree. But I’m athletic, and resting heart rate most of the time is 50 BPM. I’d hate to suffer side effects (ED, loss of ability to do strenuous exercise) to control the fight-or-flight response. Incidentally, my resting heart rate has recently climbed (15 BPM), as it does when I exercise too much and don’t eat enough. One month of no exercise and more food usually get’s me back to 100%. As for the anxiety, I’m looking for comments regarding Xanax, Valium, and/or beta blockers, as well as yoga, biofeedback etc. I’m type A personality, but never get this adrenaline rush unless it’s time to measure BP, or going on a first date Thanks, flighty-mikey
You will probably get plenty of "yes" votes for taking Xanax.. In my opinion, a person with a resting heart rate that hovers in the 50’s ought not to be messing with beta blockers. Also, as it appears you are mildly over-concerned about the "numbers" that indicate "good health", be aware that beta blockers can easily cause a rise in serum cholesterol levels. Exercising too much and not eating enough do not sound like difficult
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, Although I don’t have frequent panic attacks, my heart races in doctor office, and blood pessure soars. I’ve been on 20 mg/day of an ACE inhibitor, and BP varies from 110/70 in summer to 135/85 in winter as measured by home monitor (cause unknown). This is an established cycle over past three years. I almost considered asking to reduce the med, since I got some dizziness when standing when BPs were 105/65 every summer. Most problematic, not only do I have this anxiety in MDs office, but my HR will go up, at times, when I strap on my home BP monitor. FWIW, I believe I don’t have the most common form of hypertension, but, rather, anxiety about HAVING high blood pressure, as well as some anxiety when it comes to health issues. I’m thinking it’s time for a beta blocker, and my doc would likely agree. But I’m athletic, and resting heart rate most of the time is 50 BPM. I’d hate to suffer side effects (ED, loss of ability to do strenuous exercise) to control the fight-or-flight response. Incidentally, my resting heart rate has recently climbed (15 BPM), as it does when I exercise too much and don’t eat enough. One month of no exercise and more food usually get’s me back to 100%. As for the anxiety, I’m looking for comments regarding Xanax, Valium, and/or beta blockers, as well as yoga, biofeedback etc. I’m type A personality, but never get this adrenaline rush unless it’s time to measure BP, or going on a first date Thanks, flighty-mikey
Added benefits of pre-surgery: bone scan and cat scan. Bone scan found my arthritis (I could have told them), cat scan found a an unknown, unexplained lurker in my gut: a leiomyoma, which is a benign intestinal tumor. One out of 15 are discovered before autopsy… Mine was 5 * 7 * 10 cc; described as the size of a baby’s head. Leiomyoma was removed at the same time as the Prostate
John, Wow ….. What a break. Bet you never thought you’d say you were "lucky" to get PCa!! What’s the deal with that leiomyoma? Could it have grown and caused blockage problems down the road? Oh, my congrats on Mr. Happy. I hope to be posting the same info soon. Tom RRP 12/12/02
What’s the deal with that leiomyoma? Could it have grown and caused blockage problems down the road? Tom RRP 12/12/02
Yeah. It WAS causing problems, and as I think back, it was leaking a bit of blood. Eventually it would have been found without killing me first 
) I’m glad that my trusty Urologist was following the instruction manual for dealing with PCa. He said that he liked to do the CAT scan because once in a while he picked up a kidney cancer. He found garbage in my case, but, as Ripley says in the first Alien Movie, "lucky-lucky-lucky." John. —-== Posted via Newsfeed.Com – Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==—- http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups —= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers – Total Privacy via Encryption =—
What’s the deal with that leiomyoma? Could it have grown and caused blockage problems down the road? Tom RRP 12/12/02
oh … and the surgeon who put my gut back together said that the leiomyoma tumors are slow-growing. It would take several years to get to the size of a golf-ball. I guess that sucker was in there for 20-30 years getting bigger and bigger ) I was one of those ‘interesting cases.’ John. —-== Posted via Newsfeed.Com – Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==—- http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups —= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers – Total Privacy via Encryption =—
Hi, John….. I was relieved of my prostate on November 21…. so in two days, I am expecting to see Mr. Happy standing at attention. ) Thanks for sharing your success with recovery. It’s the one thing left I keep hoping for! I don’t see it happening anytime soon….. unless it’s just a change *overnight*. Take care… and use it well….. MikeH
Well, I think it comes and goes… That’s what I’ve read on the news group, and that seems to be the case with me. But as the coach said, if you can run a 4 minute mile once, you can do it again. Just keep practicing and don’t loose heart ) John. —-== Posted via Newsfeed.Com – Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==—- http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups —= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers – Total Privacy via Encryption =—
Hi, John….. I was relieved of my prostate on November 21…. so in two days, I am expecting to see Mr. Happy standing at attention. ) Thanks for sharing your success with recovery. It’s the one thing left I keep hoping for! I don’t see it happening anytime soon….. unless it’s just a change *overnight*. Take care… and use it well….. MikeH – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was relieved of the prostate 11/18/2002. Started out with one or two pads, but was down to one pad after a week. Quit the pads on the weekends about 2 months post op, and went work on a Monday at about 3 months, forgetting the pad (as it worked for Dumbo, it worked for me ;o), but I did not need the crows to tell me that I could fly.) The ‘one thing’ that had been old-reliable since 18 months did not function… I got a script of vitamin V as my kindly Urologist refers to it… No blue vision, occasional headaches, and a pathetic boner (like Harry Potter: no bone, but flexible) Was also taking an anti-depressant (Paxil) classed as SSRI, widely known by pharmacists and psychatrists as a doggie-downer; anti-depressant was to treat the lump in the throat that developed concomitant with the dx of prostate cancer. Changed to Lexapro, a less potent SSRI anti-depressant, but still no cigar ;o) On the advise of a pharmacist friend, skipped the Lexapro last night and bingo-bongo-sproingo. Not quite Mr Happy, but certainly not mister Jell-O: it was insertion quality for sure.
hi john – thanks for the progress report. that’s pretty quick recovery for my happy. i hope to be so lucky. it’s interesting, you mention that you had such a large prostate. mine was about 30cc. but FELT like 65cc. reminds you of the joke. oh, it’s six on hand. no, it’s five on one hand. then when you get on the table and the doctor sticks his hand up there. you know, it feels like six on one hand ~ curtis knowledge is power – growing old is mandatory – growing wise is optional
Was also taking an anti-depressant (Paxil) classed as SSRI, widely known by pharmacists and psychatrists
as a doggie-downer; anti-depressant was to treat the lump in the throat that developed concomitant with the dx of prostate cancer. Changed to Lexapro, a less potent SSRI anti-depressant, but still no cigar ;o) On the advise of a pharmacist friend, skipped the Lexapro last night and bingo-bongo-sproingo. Not quite Mr Happy, but certainly not mister Jell-O: it was insertion quality for sure. Now to get off the SSRI (Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor) and
onto a different anti-depressant. Happy to hear that both you and Mr. Happy are happy……as that side of things is not in my sphere of experience…..grin!! As to SSRI drugs, I know a lot about them because my daughter has a serotonin deficiency and has to take them. There are roughly 30 different brands, of which Paxil, Zoloft, Effexor, Welbutrin, and Luvox are the more well known ones. They are all newer derivatives of Prozac to my knowledge, but our good doctor on this group can better inform you. E. has been on Luvox (horrible fatigue), Welbutrin (stopped working) and now Effexor, which is working quite well as it attacks the problem from a different angle. And each one worked for about 2 years, then she had to switch. And every darn one of them has a lot of side effects!! So speak to your doctor…….or better yet, your pharmacist…..and see if there isn’t one that won’t be a ‘doggie downer’. E. does not have that problem (G). But as these SSRI drugs seem to be for chemical deficiencies, perhaps there is a totally different anti-depressant that will do in the meantime, that won’t interfere with Mr. Happy. Just my 2 Cdn. cents worth……and if you can manage without them…..go for it. I refuse to take any myself at the moment and am doing OK without them. If I need a pill temporarily, I will certainly take one though. My rant on here last week got rid of a lot of it…..grin. (thanks, people) The way I look at it is that ‘depression’ is a not an abnormal thing when life is tough, and unless it *really* interferes with your enjoyment of life, it will get better on its own. I am not a doctor…..but on the flip side, I have seen the amazing difference in E’s life and also my sister’s……as she is battling the same Cheers…….Heather – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
Way to go, John You just keep on smiling. We will know why. Lee – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – it was insertion quality for sure. Mr. Happy is the better anti-depressant. You’d better believe it. They can’t chisel the slight smile off my face today ) John. — Steve Kramer PSA 16 10/17/2000 Dx 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 Radiation MAY – JUL 2002 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 —-== Posted via Newsfeed.Com – Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==—- http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups —= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers – Total Privacy via Encryption
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it was insertion quality for sure. Mr. Happy is the better anti-depressant.
You’d better believe it. They can’t chisel the slight smile off my face today ) John. — Steve Kramer PSA 16 10/17/2000 Dx 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 Radiation MAY – JUL 2002 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21
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The ‘one thing’ that had been old-reliable since 18 months did not function… I got a script of vitamin V as my kindly Urologist refers to it… No blue vision, occasional headaches, and a pathetic boner (like Harry Potter: no bone, but flexible) Was also taking an anti-depressant (Paxil) classed as SSRI, widely known by pharmacists and psychatrists as a doggie-downer; anti-depressant was to treat the lump in the throat that developed concomitant with the dx of prostate cancer. Changed to Lexapro, a less potent SSRI anti-depressant, but still no cigar ;o) On the advise of a pharmacist friend, skipped the Lexapro last night and bingo-bongo-sproingo. Not quite Mr Happy, but certainly not mister Jell-O: it was insertion quality for sure.
Mr. Happy is the better anti-depressant. — Steve Kramer PSA 16 10/17/2000 Dx 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 Radiation MAY – JUL 2002 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21
I was relieved of the prostate 11/18/2002. Started out with one or two pads, but was down to one pad after a week. Quit the pads on the weekends about 2 months post op, and went work on a Monday at about 3 months, forgetting the pad (as it worked for Dumbo, it worked for me ;o), but I did not need the crows to tell me that I could fly.) The ‘one thing’ that had been old-reliable since 18 months did not function… I got a script of vitamin V as my kindly Urologist refers to it… No blue vision, occasional headaches, and a pathetic boner (like Harry Potter: no bone, but flexible) Was also taking an anti-depressant (Paxil) classed as SSRI, widely known by pharmacists and psychatrists as a doggie-downer; anti-depressant was to treat the lump in the throat that developed concomitant with the dx of prostate cancer. Changed to Lexapro, a less potent SSRI anti-depressant, but still no cigar ;o) On the advise of a pharmacist friend, skipped the Lexapro last night and bingo-bongo-sproingo. Not quite Mr Happy, but certainly not mister Jell-O: it was insertion quality for sure. Now to get off the SSRI (Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor) and onto a different anti-depressant. Physical Specs: Age 60, fairly good health, Gleason was about 6, 1Tc (or whatever the arragement of letters and numbers is) psa between 3.75 and just over 4.0 at time of discovery. Large prostate at 65 cc, one core out of 12 positive (but with a prostate the size of a large lemon/small grapefruit, finding the CA in that haystack was luck). Added benefits of pre-surgery: bone scan and cat scan. Bone scan found my arthritis (I could have told them), cat scan found a an unknown, unexplained lurker in my gut: a leiomyoma, which is a benign intestinal tumor. One out of 15 are discovered before autopsy… Mine was 5 * 7 * 10 cc; described as the size of a baby’s head. Leiomyoma was removed at the same time as the Prostate; was in the hospital for 6 days, and gained 20 pounds of water weight. With a grandfather who died of prostate cancer at age 65, early detection is a good thing in my case… My 20 cents. John. —-== Posted via Newsfeed.Com – Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==—- http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups —= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers – Total Privacy via Encryption =—
Has anyone heard of Zoloft withdrawal lasting longer than a couple of weeks? I was taking 200 to 250 mg Zoloft daily (increased during PMS) and then switched to Celexa. I was frustrated with neither of them helping my depression, so I unwisely abruptly discontinued the medication. My withdrawal symptoms ranged from moderate to severe…initially, I experienced extreme agitation, anxiety, crying, uncharacteristic rage, and formication (sensation that bugs were crawling on me). With the help of my doctor, I restarted a low dose of Celexa (I had been on 20 mg prior to this) and tapered off–but still quicker than I should have because I’m stubborn. The main problems that persisted for a couple of weeks were numbness and tingling in my arms and legs, and then spontaneous pain or muscle spasms in my legs. (Pretty darn painful). That and gastro-intestinal distress. My doctor felt that most of this was actually withdrawal from the Zoloft, not Celexa. She felt that the Celexa had prevented me from going into Zoloft withdrawal, but when I discontinued Celexa, the Zoloft withdrawal kicked in. From what I’ve read about other people’s experiences with Zoloft withdrawal, my symptoms do appear to match theirs. I had been taking Zoloft (at different doses) for about 4 years. I tried other medications during that time, but I was unable to tolerate most of them. I am very sensitive to medications and tend to have side effects with just about everything I take, usually to the point where I don’t want to take anything. Back to the symptoms–after 2-1/2 weeks, these symptoms diminished. 3-1/2 weeks after the initial discontinuation, however, I had a flare-up of gastro-intenstinal distress that lasted a day or two. Then, 4-1/2 weeks after the initial discontinuation (maybe 2 weeks since stopping the mild tapering-off) I experienced the leg pain, numbness, tingling along with severe stomach cramps and such. I did not expect to still be experiencing withdrawal symptoms, so I’m confused. Am I imagining things? Is this something else? Thank you for any help you can provide.
Has anyone heard of Zoloft withdrawal lasting longer than a couple of weeks? I was taking 200 to 250 mg Zoloft daily (increased during PMS) and then switched to Celexa. I was frustrated with neither of them helping my depression, so I unwisely abruptly discontinued the medication. My withdrawal symptoms ranged from moderate to severe…initially, I experienced extreme agitation, anxiety, crying, uncharacteristic rage, and formication (sensation that bugs were crawling on me). With the help of my doctor, I restarted a low dose of Celexa (I had been on 20 mg prior to this) and tapered off–but still quicker than I should have because I’m stubborn. The main problems that persisted for a couple of weeks were numbness and tingling in my arms and legs, and then spontaneous pain or muscle spasms in my legs. (Pretty darn painful). That and gastro-intestinal distress. My doctor felt that most of this was actually withdrawal from the Zoloft, not Celexa. She felt that the Celexa had prevented me from going into Zoloft withdrawal, but when I discontinued Celexa, the Zoloft withdrawal kicked in. From what I’ve read about other people’s experiences with Zoloft withdrawal, my symptoms do appear to match theirs. I had been taking Zoloft (at different doses) for about 4 years. I tried other medications during that time, but I was unable to tolerate most of them. I am very sensitive to medications and tend to have side effects with just about everything I take, usually to the point where I don’t want to take anything. Back to the symptoms–after 2-1/2 weeks, these symptoms diminished. 3-1/2 weeks after the initial discontinuation, however, I had a flare-up of gastro-intenstinal distress that lasted a day or two. Then, 4-1/2 weeks after the initial discontinuation (maybe 2 weeks since stopping the mild tapering-off) I experienced the leg pain, numbness, tingling along with severe stomach cramps and such. I did not expect to still be experiencing withdrawal symptoms, so I’m confused. Am I imagining things? Is this something else? Thank you for any help you can provide.
: I feel guilty for receiving support and not giving back so much right now : but maybe I can forgive myself and accept that I’m not doing well and I’m : trying to make a very diffiult decision, ect or not. : : I called my pdoc today and we talked. she answered my questions and I’m : satisfied with her answers so I think I’ll try ect. the ward is full right : now but my pdoc was going to call every day and find out when they have room : for me. probably on sunday she said. : : unreal. can’t understand that I’m talking about myself. : : I’m terrified. ((((((Linda)))))) When I first read this, I wasn’t sure what ect was, but then I looked it up in the group’s FAQ. Now I do understand. I do hope this treatment works well for you. Jim — Jim Todd Remove "SPAM" to send e-mail
snip unreal. can’t understand that I’m talking about myself. I’m terrified.
I’m thinking of you. Whiskery Hugs {{{{{Linda}}}}} — — Whiskers
Linda, If you’re running out of meds to try, then maybe ECT is an option for you. I once spoke to my pdoc about it, and he said that ECT is very effective, but you have to try to come up with a plan for what to do after the treatments. ECT works to make things better for a while, and gives you time to plan what your next med will be, but you have to talk with your pdoc about what other meds you can try. Personally I’ve had a great run with Aurorix (moclobemide) but that’s not available in all countries. I don’t know if it’s available in Europe. If you can get the Aurorix, I had to push the dose up to 1200 mg to get a lasting effect (which is a pretty high dose). I also had a good run for a while combining Effexor XR with risperidone and later seroquel. I don’t know if you’ve tried these type of meds (antipsychotics / major tranqualisers) in combination with an SSRI. I know ECT is scary, but I think it might be a good option to give you some time and some relief for a while. I really hope it works for you. Email me if you want to talk anytime. Get Bjorn to forward messages to ASD about how you’re doing if you’re in hospital or not feeling up to posting. I (and many others here) care and want to know what’s happening with you. Best of luck, Kylie
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I feel guilty for receiving support and not giving back so much right now but maybe I can forgive myself and accept that I’m not doing well and I’m trying to make a very diffiult decision, ect or not. I called my pdoc today and we talked. she answered my questions and I’m satisfied with her answers so I think I’ll try ect. the ward is full right now but my pdoc was going to call every day and find out when they have room for me. probably on sunday she said. unreal. can’t understand that I’m talking about myself. I’m terrified. Linda
I feel guilty for receiving support and not giving back so much right now but maybe I can forgive myself and accept that I’m not doing well and I’m trying to make a very diffiult decision, ect or not. I called my pdoc today and we talked. she answered my questions and I’m satisfied with her answers so I think I’ll try ect. the ward is full right now but my pdoc was going to call every day and find out when they have room for me. probably on sunday she said. unreal. can’t understand that I’m talking about myself. I’m terrified. Linda
I feel guilty for receiving support and not giving back so much right now but maybe I can forgive myself and accept that I’m not doing well and I’m trying to make a very diffiult decision, ect or not. I called my pdoc today and we talked. she answered my questions and I’m satisfied with her answers so I think I’ll try ect. the ward is full right now but my pdoc was going to call every day and find out when they have room for me. probably on sunday she said. unreal. can’t understand that I’m talking about myself. I’m terrified.
I can understand that. But I do feel you have made a good decision. Stan Linda
Remove "JUNK" for my valid address.
Celexia, Prozac, Wellbutin, Zoloft, Effexor, which I stopped called turky, a 2 months ago. I’mback on Paxil as the pain clinic said it helps the most with chronic pain… The thing with Paxil, by the third week I am a zombie…. dory
Paul, I used to take Paxil, now on Effexor XR. I am currently thinking about switching to another one. I think I build up a tolerance to them over time. I have a cousin who seems to have this same problem with tolerance, he can only last about six months on a given antidepressant. Susan E
oooohhhhhhhhhhh i have a headache — all your base are belong to us <el…@notathome.com
wrote in message
news:3af18654.8951432@news.cis.dfn.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
On Thu, 03 May 2001 15:53:14 GMT, "Diana Calder" <d.r.calder@home wrote: family. Anyway! with M.S., the mind says yes and the body says no, or is the other way around! Close. I believe its "the mind says yes, and the body says f*** off"
Eliz. To paraphrase Oedipus, Hamlet, Lear, and all those guys, "I wish I had known this some time ago." – Corwin, Sign of the Unicorn
oh please a bit of couth — all your base are belong to us "Michael" <muirh…@island.net
wrote in message
news:9cs146$f4sgt$1@ID-78693.news.dfncis.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "Podz" <po.dzDEL…@ntlworld.com
wrote in message
> news:9crs0o$f9vfv$1@ID-83140.news.dfncis.de… > > Paroxetine (Seroxat) > <snip> > > 1…Prevents ejaculation at high doses > High-dose ejaculation is undesirable? > Is that because *both* people would have to sleep in the wet spot? > <ducking> > — > ((((((((((U)))))))))) > Michael <muirh…@island.net> > -=| Livin’ on Island Time |=-
Michael wrote:
The description of Effexor’s side effects goes on for two whole *pages* of fine print! Effing brutal, huh? I’ll pass.
It is an EXCELLENT anti-depressant. And if I felt I needed it I’d take again in a heartbeat, side effects be damned. But, for me right now, I’m not especially depressed, I’ll take wellbrutrin as a ‘just in case’ pill and to help me quit smoking. I am mostly stopping it because I was tired of feeling like a sexless lump. Heheh, now I’m just a frisky tired lump, deeeeeep sigh. ps. I forgot to mention the fun ‘clicking’ sound in your head when you move your eyes. whoopie! Eliz. _____ As God is my witness, I really thought turkeys could fly. (WKRP in Cincinnati)
<el…@notathome.com
wrote in message news:3af0ec09.50575026@news.cis.dfn.de… Michael wrote: The description of Effexor’s side effects goes on for two whole *pages* of fine print! Effing brutal, huh? I’ll pass. It is an EXCELLENT anti-depressant. And if I felt I needed it I’d take again in a heartbeat, side effects be damned.
Easy there…. I wasn’t dumping on the stuff… just expressing (understandable, by my lights) fright. It took a long time to convince myself to take Zoloft, whose side-effect list is not much shorter than Effexor’s. It would doubtless take as long to convince me to take Effexor.
take wellbrutrin as a ‘just in case’ pill and to help me quit smoking. I am mostly stopping it because I was tired of feeling like a sexless lump. Heheh, now I’m just a frisky tired lump, deeeeeep sigh.
I had much the same problem while I took that stuff. Libido *real* good… get-it-uppitiness OK… stamina *nil*.
ps. I forgot to mention the fun ‘clicking’ sound in your head when you move your eyes. whoopie!
Oh, JOY! Do you use 3-D specs and Dolby-surround for added effect? — ((((((((((U)))))))))) Michael <muirh…@island.net
-=| Livin’ on Island Time |=-
Response:
I have used ALMOST every drug in the previous 50 posts EXCEPT Effexor…Though I may have had a brief stint with that too….I have been on Zoloft now for awhile….The only thing I can say, is I have to make sure to take it as early as possible or it becomes impossible to..you know…I don’t want to be crass…well I do, but I won’t….You know….My Dr said good, It is probably the most exercise u get…:-) Warm Regards and I hope you are all well, Eric Remember Strawberries, Watermellons, Lollipops, Sunshine and Hugs?
Response:
Parnate (Tranylcypromine) and Aurorix I used the Aurorix to have a break from the Parnate but I was on it for too long. It didn’t work as well and I was flat for a few months without realizing that I had pretty serious depression while on an anti depressant. Partly it was what was going on. When looking at the two though, Parnate is a much "dirtier" drug but is said to improve the catecholamines, adrenaline, noradrenaline, dopamine and also serotonin. (as well as who knows what.) In the Aurorix information dopamine isn’t mentioned. I wonder if it is *that* which is the really missing ingredient. btw originally it was prescribed for fatigue. At the time I had euphoria rather than depression. So I wonder about the making of these lists. There is a complication that GPs especially introduce when they prescribed drugs which they know *work* (for some of their patients) for some symptoms. But which aren’t what the authorities or the companies make them for. eg the new anti epileptic drug which in Australia only people with epilepsy could get as a cheap drug. Others had to pay the full price. (PwMS) keep up the good work Paul, Linda http://www.ozemail.com.au/~lindafrd/ remove JUNK from address to reply
Response:
Yup, I agree. I especially hate it when I miss a day, just one day, and I get the withdrawal symptoms, makes you wonder just what’s going on in there eh? But did you know that MS affects the seratonin levels? For me that little tidbit, coupled with my history of depression, and the fact that this disease would make anyone depressed, makes me loathe to stop taking anti-depressants. More of a preventative measure. I know all too well how easily depression can sneak up on you. On Thu, 03 May 2001 16:45:28 GMT, "Diana Calder" <d.r.calder@home
wrote: I want to get off the dam things because of their horrible addictiveness. I also feel that my body is getting used to them and are finding them not as effective as in the past. They say don’t try to fix whats not broken, but I do think we build up a tolerance to drugs after awhile.
Eliz. _____ There is an angel inside of me whom I am constantly shocking.
Response:
I want to get off the dam things because of their horrible addictiveness. I also feel that my body is getting used to them and are finding them not as effective as in the past. They say don’t try to fix whats not broken, but I do think we build up a tolerance to drugs after awhile. <el…@notathome.com
wrote in message
news:3af186d4.9079372@news.cis.dfn.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Eek! The most I ever took was 75 mg/day! I’ve always been > really sensitve to anti-depressants. After TWO weeks I > managed to get down to 37.5, now I’m phasing down from that. > 4-5 days!?! Holy crap batman. That’s way too fast. > Be careful of the tablets – they really burn your guts if > you don’t take with a FULL meal. > Why did you want to stop taking it? > Diane Calder wrote: > >Hi Eliz! > >The doctor tried to wean me off 150 mgs in November over a > >4 0r 5 day period. I then was to switch to wellbutrin. > >Well! besides feeling extremely nauseated, and a horrible > >sweeping sound in my head, I fell into a major depressive > >episode. I ended up in the hospital for two weeks with my > >blood pressure all askew. They put me back on Effexor and > >now have increased the dose up to 225 mgs. I didn’t know > >they had the tablet form. How are you doing weaning off > >Effexor! Are you being succesful? Good luck! > >Diana > ><el…@notathome.com
wrote in message
> >news:3af0e13e.47811940@news.cis.dfn.de… > >> Diana Calder wrote: > >> >Paxil, Zoloft, Elavil, Am now on Effexor which I find > >> >great, but hard to wean off of. > >> I too am trying to get off effexor. I am taking > wellbutrin > >> as well. Have you tried taking the tablet form of > effexor? > >> You can break the tablets into smaller and smaller pieces > to > >> get off it. Otherwise the side effects are brutal as you > >> know! > >> Eliz. > >> _____ > >> As God is my witness, I really thought turkeys could fly. > >> (WKRP in Cincinnati) > Eliz. > To paraphrase Oedipus, Hamlet, Lear, and all those guys, "I wish I > had known this some time ago." – Corwin, Sign of the Unicorn
Response:
"Podz" <po.dzDEL…@ntlworld.com
wrote in message
news:9crs0o$f9vfv$1@ID-83140.news.dfncis.de…
Paroxetine (Seroxat)
<snip
1…Prevents ejaculation at high doses
High-dose ejaculation is undesirable? Is that because *both* people would have to sleep in the wet spot? <ducking
— ((((((((((U)))))))))) Michael <muirh…@island.net
-=| Livin’ on Island Time |=-
Response:
Eek! The most I ever took was 75 mg/day! I’ve always been really sensitve to anti-depressants. After TWO weeks I managed to get down to 37.5, now I’m phasing down from that. 4-5 days!?! Holy crap batman. That’s way too fast. Be careful of the tablets – they really burn your guts if you don’t take with a FULL meal. Why did you want to stop taking it? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Diane Calder wrote:
Hi Eliz! The doctor tried to wean me off 150 mgs in November over a 4 0r 5 day period. I then was to switch to wellbutrin. Well! besides feeling extremely nauseated, and a horrible sweeping sound in my head, I fell into a major depressive episode. I ended up in the hospital for two weeks with my blood pressure all askew. They put me back on Effexor and now have increased the dose up to 225 mgs. I didn’t know they had the tablet form. How are you doing weaning off Effexor! Are you being succesful? Good luck! Diana <el…@notathome.com wrote in message news:3af0e13e.47811940@news.cis.dfn.de… Diana Calder wrote: Paxil, Zoloft, Elavil, Am now on Effexor which I find great, but hard to wean off of. I too am trying to get off effexor. I am taking
wellbutrin
as well. Have you tried taking the tablet form of
effexor?
You can break the tablets into smaller and smaller pieces
to
get off it. Otherwise the side effects are brutal as you know! Eliz. _____ As God is my witness, I really thought turkeys could fly. (WKRP in Cincinnati)
Eliz. To paraphrase Oedipus, Hamlet, Lear, and all those guys, "I wish I had known this some time ago." – Corwin, Sign of the Unicorn
Response:
Eliz! You explained coming off Effexor to a tee! As far as the libido side effects, Effexor has been the only antidepresant that has not interfered with that subject for myself. All the others have, especially the prozac family. Anyway! with M.S., the mind says yes and the body says no, or is the other way around! Diana <el…@notathome.com
wrote in message
news:3af0e9da.50016336@news.cis.dfn.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Michael wrote: I’m curious here… what *are* the side effects to watch for when kicking Effexor? I remember this feeling of total depersonalization (nothing seemed real, and it was almost as if I was in some sort of a "bubble" that kept the world out,) when kicking a couple of different tricyclics… but never had any difficulty with trazodone or Zoloft. The word ‘discombobulated’ really sums it up. Turn your head too fast and it feels like your brain has become unhinged. Stir in a hefty of dose of bed-spin feeling. I imagine its what a mild concussion would feel like, or a good whollop to the noggin. effing brutal. Ten times worse than the symptoms you get when you start taking it. Eliz. _____ As God is my witness, I really thought turkeys could fly. (WKRP in Cincinnati)
Response:
On Thu, 03 May 2001 15:53:14 GMT, "Diana Calder" <d.r.calder@home
wrote: family. Anyway! with M.S., the mind says yes and the body says no, or is the other way around!
Close. I believe its "the mind says yes, and the body says f*** off"
Response:
Yup! that analogy is much more fitting! Thanks! Diana <el…@notathome.com
wrote in message
news:3af18654.8951432@news.cis.dfn.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
On Thu, 03 May 2001 15:53:14 GMT, "Diana Calder" <d.r.calder@home wrote: family. Anyway! with M.S., the mind says yes and the body says no, or is the other way around! Close. I believe its "the mind says yes, and the body says f*** off"
Response:
Hi Eliz! The doctor tried to wean me off 150 mgs in November over a 4 0r 5 day period. I then was to switch to wellbutrin. Well! besides feeling extremely nauseated, and a horrible sweeping sound in my head, I fell into a major depressive episode. I ended up in the hospital for two weeks with my blood pressure all askew. They put me back on Effexor and now have increased the dose up to 225 mgs. I didn’t know they had the tablet form. How are you doing weaning off Effexor! Are you being succesful? Good luck! Diana <el…@notathome.com
wrote in message
news:3af0e13e.47811940@news.cis.dfn.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Diana Calder wrote: Paxil, Zoloft, Elavil, Am now on Effexor which I find great, but hard to wean off of. I too am trying to get off effexor. I am taking wellbutrin as well. Have you tried taking the tablet form of effexor? You can break the tablets into smaller and smaller pieces to get off it. Otherwise the side effects are brutal as you know! Eliz. _____ As God is my witness, I really thought turkeys could fly. (WKRP in Cincinnati)
Response:
"Paul Jones" <Paul_Jo…@btinternet.com
wrote in message
news:3AF09386.6A58CF2F@btinternet.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Hi, I’m preparing a list of medications that people use in MS for my non-profit web site. I’m doing them symptoms by symptom. I’m particularly interested in the brand names as I can always get back to the generic from that and brands vary from country to country. Right now I’m doing anti-depressants. If could people reply to this just saying all the brands of anti-depressant that they have used, even if you’re not using them now, I’d be very grateful. Thanks, Paul http://www.btinternet.com/~ms_pages/
Been on; Prozac (Fluoxetine) Lustral (Sertraline) Dothiepin ( *forgot*) Amitriptylline (generic name) Paroxetine (Seroxat) This latter is the best for me, but has 2 unwelcome effects. 1…Prevents ejaculation at high doses 2…Known withdrawal syndrome ( see www.bnf.org ) HTH, P.
Response:
<el…@notathome.com
wrote …
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Michael wrote: I’m curious here… what *are* the side effects to watch for when kicking Effexor? I remember this feeling of total depersonalization (nothing seemed real, and it was almost as if I was in some sort of a "bubble" that kept the world out,) when kicking a couple of different tricyclics… but never had any difficulty with trazodone or Zoloft. The word ‘discombobulated’ really sums it up. Turn your head too fast and it feels like your brain has become unhinged. Stir in a hefty of dose of bed-spin feeling. I imagine its what a mild concussion would feel like, or a good whollop to the noggin. effing brutal. Ten times worse than the symptoms you get when you start taking it.
I just poked through my little (NOT) book of pills… The description of Effexor’s side effects goes on for two whole *pages* of fine print! Effing brutal, huh? I’ll pass. — ((((((((((U)))))))))) Michael <muirh…@island.net
-=| Livin’ on Island Time |=-
Response:
Michael wrote:
I’m curious here… what *are* the side effects to watch for when kicking Effexor? I remember this feeling of total depersonalization (nothing seemed real, and it was almost as if I was in some sort of a "bubble" that kept the world out,) when kicking a couple of different tricyclics… but never had any difficulty with trazodone or Zoloft.
The word ‘discombobulated’ really sums it up. Turn your head too fast and it feels like your brain has become unhinged. Stir in a hefty of dose of bed-spin feeling. I imagine its what a mild concussion would feel like, or a good whollop to the noggin. effing brutal. Ten times worse than the symptoms you get when you start taking it. Eliz. _____ As God is my witness, I really thought turkeys could fly. (WKRP in Cincinnati)
Response:
Diana Calder wrote:
Paxil, Zoloft, Elavil, Am now on Effexor which I find great, but hard to wean off of.
I too am trying to get off effexor. I am taking wellbutrin as well. Have you tried taking the tablet form of effexor? You can break the tablets into smaller and smaller pieces to get off it. Otherwise the side effects are brutal as you know! Eliz. _____ As God is my witness, I really thought turkeys could fly. (WKRP in Cincinnati)
Response:
<el…@notathome.com
wrote in message news:3af0e13e.47811940@news.cis.dfn.de… Diana Calder wrote: Paxil, Zoloft, Elavil, Am now on Effexor which I find great, but hard to wean off of. I too am trying to get off effexor. I am taking wellbutrin as well. Have you tried taking the tablet form of effexor? You can break the tablets into smaller and smaller pieces to get off it. Otherwise the side effects are brutal as you know!
I’m curious here… what *are* the side effects to watch for when kicking Effexor? I remember this feeling of total depersonalization (nothing seemed real, and it was almost as if I was in some sort of a "bubble" that kept the world out,) when kicking a couple of different tricyclics… but never had any difficulty with trazodone or Zoloft. — ((((((((((U)))))))))) Michael <muirh…@island.net
-=| Livin’ on Island Time |=-
Response:
Zoloft, Effexor, Wellbutrin. On Thu, 03 May 2001 00:08:54 +0100, Paul Jones – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<Paul_Jo…@btinternet.com
wrote: Hi, I’m preparing a list of medications that people use in MS
for my
non-profit web site. I’m doing them symptoms by symptom.
I’m
particularly interested in the brand names as I can always
get back to
the generic from that and brands vary from country to
country.
Right now I’m doing anti-depressants. If could people reply to this just saying all the brands of anti-depressant that they have used, even if you’re not
using them now,
I’d be very grateful. Thanks, Paul http://www.btinternet.com/~ms_pages/
Eliz. _____ As God is my witness, I really thought turkeys could fly. (WKRP in Cincinnati)
Response:
Prozac, Zoloft, Effexor, Trazedone. Not using any now. Didn’t like the so-called "side effects" cc:ng
Response:
Paxil, Zoloft, Elavil, Am now on Effexor which I find great, but hard to wean off of. Diana Paul Jones <Paul_Jo…@btinternet.com
wrote in message
news:3AF09386.6A58CF2F@btinternet.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Hi, I’m preparing a list of medications that people use in MS for my non-profit web site. I’m doing them symptoms by symptom. I’m particularly interested in the brand names as I can always get back to the generic from that and brands vary from country to country. Right now I’m doing anti-depressants. If could people reply to this just saying all the brands of anti-depressant that they have used, even if you’re not using them now, I’d be very grateful. Thanks, Paul http://www.btinternet.com/~ms_pages/
Response:
Hi, I’m preparing a list of medications that people use in MS for my non-profit web site. I’m doing them symptoms by symptom. I’m particularly interested in the brand names as I can always get back to the generic from that and brands vary from country to country. Right now I’m doing anti-depressants. If could people reply to this just saying all the brands of anti-depressant that they have used, even if you’re not using them now, I’d be very grateful. Thanks, Paul http://www.btinternet.com/~ms_pages/
Response: