Question:

<SNIP

your statement Serotonin is also essential for the development of an effective Immune Response. Researchers have shown that depletion of Serotonin in animals leads to ImmunoSuppression.

<SNIP

my statement I also dont trust it because they are claiming immunosupression from Prozac at the same time as it being an antidepresant.  Doesnt anybody know that these two things are practically mutually exclusive.  I say this because I have the following anectdotal experience: when my mothers white blood cell count was below a safe level,  something like <1800  she was extremely fatigued and many people who are diagnosed as depressed are simply fatigued. My conclusion (and leap)- it could be because they dont have enough circulating white blood cells.  Why would you want to immunosupress such a person?

<SNIP

your response I dont know what your talking about.  What does your mothers situation have to do with this?  Maybe you didnt finish your thought or something.

OK this response is really obnoxious in print.    You indicated you were interested in my point of view..  Im sure you didnt really mean it that way. Let me spell it out a little more clearly.  My mom was immune suppressed to the point where she practically had to live in a bubble.  I have personal experience with what happens in such a situation.  Anything below WBC of 2200 is considered hazardous.  The number one way she could tell the status of her WBC was by how much she was sleeping.  My personal observations lead me to conclude that there is a direct link bewteen WBC and fatigue.  Call it anemia of the immune cells instead of the RBCs.  Many MS;rs complain of fatigue as a problem.  Many MS’er are prescribed antidepressants because of fatigue.  I have made an association that I think is valid. I dont see anything wrong with my conclusion just like you dont see anything wrong with yours. Celeste

Response:

"Michael" <muirh…@haidagwaii.net

wrote in message

news:7ZednT3zEa76-MbfRVn-gw@qcislands.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "Rob Duncan" <robdun…@gbronline.com

wrote in message

> news:VrqdnfVWSdUdxMbfRVn-ug@gbronline.com… >> "Celeste" <celeste…@adelphia.net

wrote in message

>> news:hMWdndeR5cWKt8bfRVn-2A@adelphia.com… >>>I guess that one of the reasons I do not trust it is that I dont buy the >>>Freunds adjuvant anymore.  Not since the Glasgow write up 2 years ago >>>which opened –  Just because it is common and popular does not make it >>>right. They proceded to show that EAE was more than likely a rabies >>>model..  That sort of explains the bad results everytime mice are cured >>>but the cure does not work in people. >>> I also dont trust it because Prozac seems to be drug in search of other >>> uses.  I think the makers are looking for a way to get the enitre >>> population of the world on their pill for one reason or another.  It >>> seems like about once a month there is another reason to take the drug. >>> I am very suspicious about the funding and wether ot not it is a >>> marketing ploy from the manufacturer. >> There is no manufacturer.  Its a generic.  Anyone can make it.  Even you. > New patents can be issued for new applications and formulations of old > products, Rob.  

Why bother once its already gone generic?  Or can the original company force its generic status to be removed? Rob

Response:

"Celeste" <celeste…@adelphia.net

wrote in message

news:N-GdnTeaT_9X4MHfRVn-vQ@adelphia.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

<SNIP your statement Serotonin is also essential for the development of an effective Immune Response. Researchers have shown that depletion of Serotonin in animals leads to ImmunoSuppression. <SNIP my statement I also dont trust it because they are claiming immunosupression from Prozac at the same time as it being an antidepresant.  Doesnt anybody know that these two things are practically mutually exclusive.  I say this because I have the following anectdotal experience: when my mothers white blood cell count was below a safe level,  something like <1800  she was extremely fatigued and many people who are diagnosed as depressed are simply fatigued. My conclusion (and leap)- it could be because they dont have enough circulating white blood cells.  Why would you want to immunosupress such a person? <SNIP your response I dont know what your talking about.  What does your mothers situation have to do with this?  Maybe you didnt finish your thought or something. OK this response is really obnoxious in print.    You indicated you were interested in my point of view..  Im sure you didnt really mean it that way. Let me spell it out a little more clearly.  My mom was immune suppressed to the point where she practically had to live in a bubble.  I have personal experience with what happens in such a situation.  Anything below WBC of 2200 is considered hazardous.  The number one way she could tell the status of here WBC was by how much she was sleeping.  My personal observations lead me to conclude that there is a direct link bewteen WBC and fatigue. Call it anemia of the immune cells instead of the RBCs.  I dont see anything wrong with my conclusion just like you dont see anything wrong with yours. Celeste

I dont see anything wrong with your conclusion either.  But I dont understand its relivence.  Im being dense I guess.  No irritation intended. Rob

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Rob Duncan wrote:

"Michael" <muirh…@haidagwaii.net wrote in message news:7ZednT3zEa76-MbfRVn-gw@qcislands.net… "Rob Duncan" <robdun…@gbronline.com wrote in message news:VrqdnfVWSdUdxMbfRVn-ug@gbronline.com… "Celeste" <celeste…@adelphia.net wrote in message news:hMWdndeR5cWKt8bfRVn-2A@adelphia.com… I guess that one of the reasons I do not trust it is that I dont buy the Freunds adjuvant anymore.  Not since the Glasgow write up 2 years ago which opened –  Just because it is common and popular does not make it right. They proceded to show that EAE was more than likely a rabies model..  That sort of explains the bad results everytime mice are cured but the cure does not work in people. I also dont trust it because Prozac seems to be drug in search of other uses.  I think the makers are looking for a way to get the enitre population of the world on their pill for one reason or another.  It seems like about once a month there is another reason to take the drug. I am very suspicious about the funding and wether ot not it is a marketing ploy from the manufacturer. There is no manufacturer.  Its a generic.  Anyone can make it. Even you. New patents can be issued for new applications and formulations of old products, Rob.   Why bother once its already gone generic?

The laws are very specific, Rob. If I’m first to patent a drug for – let’s say – treatment of depression, then when its patent runs out, I’ll have generic competition from others piggybacking on my (old) patent.   Thing is, my patent protection runs for (in Canada) 20 years, but 12 years of that was already taken up in R&D and clinical testing… and I’d really like 20 years’ profits, thank you very much. Solution? All I have to do is either re-patent the drug for treating some other disorder (this is how most MS drugs came to be, but it’s extremely expensive,) or re-*package* the drug in a new delivery vehicle – say, a sustained-release (SR) tablet – and patent the new formulation… a much easier and cheaper method, since all the safety testing and most of the clinical work have already been done.

Or can the original company force its generic status to be removed?

Not as far as I’m aware…

Response:

"Michael" <muirh…@haidagwaii.net

wrote in message

news:8pudnXgI7oeAUcHfRVn-uA@qcislands.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Rob Duncan wrote: >> "Michael" <muirh…@haidagwaii.net

wrote in message

>> news:BsqdnR-SD-jECsHfRVn-2A@qcislands.net… >>> Rob Duncan wrote: >>>> "Michael" <muirh…@haidagwaii.net

wrote in message

>>>> news:7ZednT3zEa76-MbfRVn-gw@qcislands.net… >>>>> "Rob Duncan" <robdun…@gbronline.com

wrote in message

>>>>> news:VrqdnfVWSdUdxMbfRVn-ug@gbronline.com… >>>>>> "Celeste" <celeste…@adelphia.net

wrote in message

>>>>>> news:hMWdndeR5cWKt8bfRVn-2A@adelphia.com… >>>>>>> I guess that one of the reasons I do not trust it is that I dont >>>>>>> buy the Freunds adjuvant anymore.  Not since the Glasgow write up >>>>>>> 2 years ago which opened –  Just because it is common and popular >>>>>>> does not make it right. They proceded to show that EAE was more >>>>>>> than likely a rabies model..  That sort of explains the bad >>>>>>> results everytime mice are cured but the cure does not work in >>>>>>> people. I also dont trust it because Prozac seems to be drug in >>>>>>> search of >>>>>>> other uses.  I think the makers are looking for a way to get the >>>>>>> enitre population of the world on their pill for one reason or >>>>>>> another.  It seems like about once a month there is another >>>>>>> reason to take the drug. I am very suspicious about the funding and >>>>>>> wether ot not it is a marketing ploy from the manufacturer. >>>>>> There is no manufacturer.  Its a generic.  Anyone can make it. >>>>>> Even you. >>>>> New patents can be issued for new applications and formulations of >>>>> old products, Rob.   >>>> Why bother once its already gone generic? >>> The laws are very specific, Rob. >>> If I’m first to patent a drug for – let’s say – treatment of >>> depression, then when its patent runs out, I’ll have generic >>> competition from others piggybacking on my (old) patent.   Thing is, >>> my patent protection runs for (in Canada) 20 years, but 12 years of >>> that was already taken up in R&D and clinical testing… and I’d >>> really like 20 years’ profits, thank you very much. >>> Solution? >>> All I have to do is either re-patent the drug for treating some other >>> disorder (this is how most MS drugs came to be, but it’s extremely >>> expensive,) or re-*package* the drug in a new delivery vehicle – >>> say, a sustained-release (SR) tablet – and patent the new >>> formulation… a much easier and cheaper method, since all the >>> safety testing and most of the clinical work have already been done. >>>> Or can the original >>>> company force its generic status to be removed? >>> Not as far as I’m aware… >> Then Im unsure of your point.  What is it exactly in regard to what >> we are talking about?  Anybody can make Prozac.  Me, you, Joe Blow. Whats >> the problem? > There isn’t one… unless you’re the people who first developed it, or the > as-yet unsuspecting public on which they intend to prey.  :-) > The problem – simply put – is this: > Prozac might (or might not) be of some very tiny bit of help in CNS > immunomodulation.   If it is… even if it isn’t, but stats can be > produced to show that it is often enough in enough people… it can be > patented, tested, approved and marketed for that purpose, and that grants > the patent-holders another patent lifetime for the same old drug.

No.  Its Generic.  It cant go on patent again.

And near the end of that lifetime, if the stats are at all favourable (or can be made to *appear* favourable,) yet another lifetime of patent protection can be garnered by creating an application-specific re-compounding (such as sustained release tablets).

Its already generic.  So no pharm can make money of it, so it will never be researched again.  A good med, lost.

What it all means in the long run is that patent protection can be maintained for exactly as long as new statistics can be generated.

I guess it does mean that.  But it has nothing to do with the generic drug fluoxetine. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Check out Betaseron, which is a patented interferon-beta, patentable only because of the process used to produce it.   It’s a recombinant-dna product almost identical to one manufactured by every single human body on the planet.   It was first approved for MS use in 1993… but when was the inspirational INFb first patented? It wasn’t and it never could be, under the laws of the day.     I’d have to check, but I think it was around 1963 that it was discovered (interferons were first identified and explored in 1957).   Certainly, it was already being explored as a possible anti-cancer agent long before 1980. Back then, it wasn’t legal to patent a natural compound produced by the human body… it was only possible to patent a process by which such a compound could be compounded after extracting it from people, or a process by which it could be partly or wholly synthesized. Now?   Well, it’s almost legal to patent a *person*.   Certainly, it’s possible (though the law has yet to be tested) to patent a single person’s entire genome. Patent law is becoming – literally – nothing but an extension of our stock and commodity markets.   It’s no longer about "intellectual property" and is now about outright "market-share ownership", instead.

I understand wanting to say all this, but not in regard to prozac.  Its a drug that research shows to be better than anything other than Novantrone, which will never be researched again, due to it being a generic.  Strong testament as to the usefullness of being able to patent a product for new uses.  Now, unless some wealthy benefactor feels like paying for it himself, it will never be studied again.  The MS societies are only in it for money. If they werent theyde be studying prozac.  Even a little study.  No, instead they choose to waste our valuable money on investigating the possible benefits of insects toxins. Rob

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Rob Duncan wrote:

"Michael" <muirh…@haidagwaii.net wrote in message news:BsqdnR-SD-jECsHfRVn-2A@qcislands.net… Rob Duncan wrote: "Michael" <muirh…@haidagwaii.net wrote in message news:7ZednT3zEa76-MbfRVn-gw@qcislands.net… "Rob Duncan" <robdun…@gbronline.com wrote in message news:VrqdnfVWSdUdxMbfRVn-ug@gbronline.com… "Celeste" <celeste…@adelphia.net wrote in message news:hMWdndeR5cWKt8bfRVn-2A@adelphia.com… I guess that one of the reasons I do not trust it is that I dont buy the Freunds adjuvant anymore.  Not since the Glasgow write up 2 years ago which opened –  Just because it is common and popular does not make it right. They proceded to show that EAE was more than likely a rabies model..  That sort of explains the bad results everytime mice are cured but the cure does not work in people. I also dont trust it because Prozac seems to be drug in search of other uses.  I think the makers are looking for a way to get the enitre population of the world on their pill for one reason or another.  It seems like about once a month there is another reason to take the drug. I am very suspicious about the funding and wether ot not it is a marketing ploy from the manufacturer. There is no manufacturer.  Its a generic.  Anyone can make it. Even you. New patents can be issued for new applications and formulations of old products, Rob.   Why bother once its already gone generic? The laws are very specific, Rob. If I’m first to patent a drug for – let’s say – treatment of depression, then when its patent runs out, I’ll have generic competition from others piggybacking on my (old) patent.   Thing is, my patent protection runs for (in Canada) 20 years, but 12 years of that was already taken up in R&D and clinical testing… and I’d really like 20 years’ profits, thank you very much. Solution? All I have to do is either re-patent the drug for treating some other disorder (this is how most MS drugs came to be, but it’s extremely expensive,) or re-*package* the drug in a new delivery vehicle – say, a sustained-release (SR) tablet – and patent the new formulation… a much easier and cheaper method, since all the safety testing and most of the clinical work have already been done. Or can the original company force its generic status to be removed? Not as far as I’m aware… Then Im unsure of your point.  What is it exactly in regard to what we are talking about?  Anybody can make Prozac.  Me, you, Joe Blow. Whats the problem?

There isn’t one… unless you’re the people who first developed it, or the as-yet unsuspecting public on which they intend to prey.  :-) The problem – simply put – is this: Prozac might (or might not) be of some very tiny bit of help in CNS immunomodulation.   If it is… even if it isn’t, but stats can be produced to show that it is often enough in enough people… it can be patented, tested, approved and marketed for that purpose, and that grants the patent-holders another patent lifetime for the same old drug. And near the end of that lifetime, if the stats are at all favourable (or can be made to *appear* favourable,) yet another lifetime of patent protection can be garnered by creating an application-specific re-compounding (such as sustained release tablets). What it all means in the long run is that patent protection can be maintained for exactly as long as new statistics can be generated. Check out Betaseron, which is a patented interferon-beta, patentable only because of the process used to produce it.   It’s a recombinant-dna product almost identical to one manufactured by every single human body on the planet.   It was first approved for MS use in 1993… but when was the inspirational INFb first patented? It wasn’t and it never could be, under the laws of the day.     I’d have to check, but I think it was around 1963 that it was discovered (interferons were first identified and explored in 1957).   Certainly, it was already being explored as a possible anti-cancer agent long before 1980. Back then, it wasn’t legal to patent a natural compound produced by the human body… it was only possible to patent a process by which such a compound could be compounded after extracting it from people, or a process by which it could be partly or wholly synthesized. Now?   Well, it’s almost legal to patent a *person*.   Certainly, it’s possible (though the law has yet to be tested) to patent a single person’s entire genome. Patent law is becoming – literally – nothing but an extension of our stock and commodity markets.   It’s no longer about "intellectual property" and is now about outright "market-share ownership", instead.

Response:

"Michael" <muirh…@haidagwaii.net

wrote in message

news:BsqdnR-SD-jECsHfRVn-2A@qcislands.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Rob Duncan wrote: >> "Michael" <muirh…@haidagwaii.net

wrote in message

>> news:7ZednT3zEa76-MbfRVn-gw@qcislands.net… >>> "Rob Duncan" <robdun…@gbronline.com

wrote in message

>>> news:VrqdnfVWSdUdxMbfRVn-ug@gbronline.com… >>>> "Celeste" <celeste…@adelphia.net

wrote in message

>>>> news:hMWdndeR5cWKt8bfRVn-2A@adelphia.com… >>>>> I guess that one of the reasons I do not trust it is that I dont >>>>> buy the Freunds adjuvant anymore.  Not since the Glasgow write up >>>>> 2 years ago which opened –  Just because it is common and popular >>>>> does not make it right. They proceded to show that EAE was more >>>>> than likely a rabies model..  That sort of explains the bad >>>>> results everytime mice are cured but the cure does not work in >>>>> people. I also dont trust it because Prozac seems to be drug in search >>>>> of >>>>> other uses.  I think the makers are looking for a way to get the >>>>> enitre population of the world on their pill for one reason or >>>>> another.  It seems like about once a month there is another reason >>>>> to take the drug. I am very suspicious about the funding and >>>>> wether ot not it is a marketing ploy from the manufacturer. >>>> There is no manufacturer.  Its a generic.  Anyone can make it. Even >>>> you. >>> New patents can be issued for new applications and formulations of >>> old products, Rob.   >> Why bother once its already gone generic? > The laws are very specific, Rob. > If I’m first to patent a drug for – let’s say – treatment of depression, > then when its patent runs out, I’ll have generic competition from others > piggybacking on my (old) patent.   Thing is, my patent protection runs for > (in Canada) 20 years, but 12 years of that was already taken up in R&D and > clinical testing… and I’d really like 20 years’ profits, thank you very > much. > Solution? > All I have to do is either re-patent the drug for treating some other > disorder (this is how most MS drugs came to be, but it’s extremely > expensive,) or re-*package* the drug in a new delivery vehicle – say, a > sustained-release (SR) tablet – and patent the new formulation… a much > easier and cheaper method, since all the safety testing and most of the > clinical work have already been done. >> Or can the original >> company force its generic status to be removed? > Not as far as I’m aware…

Then Im unsure of your point.  What is it exactly in regard to what we are talking about?  Anybody can make Prozac.  Me, you, Joe Blow.  Whats the problem? Rob

Response:

     To evaluate disease progression, mean values (averages) were determined for all neurologic scores of untreated and treated groups of mice before and after the day treatment was started. Then, the differences between the mean values before and during treatment for the experimental group were calculated.

This sounds like a subjective measurement to me.  Also, there is no indication that this evaluation was done by blinded techs.  Although I would assume so.  The definitve statement would be

     The findings from this animal study show that Fluoxetine can slow down disease progression, reduce the number of inflammatory lesions in the Brain and Spinal Cord, and promote the production of Cytokines such as IL-4 and TGF-

Question:

Selling collection of approximately 3,000 to 3,500 vinyl 12" records. There is a mixture of Rap/Hip Hop, Dance, R&B, Soul, Techno, and Funk from the 80’s and 90’s.   Most are 12" singles, some full albums. Some have picture sleeves, some have generic or label covers. Conditions are mixed, most are in Near Mint condition.  There is no list, sorry.  $1500 bid + shipping.

Response:

Here’s the link: http://page.auctions.yahoo.com/auction/43211597 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Selling collection of approximately 3,000 to 3,500 vinyl 12" records. There is a mixture of Rap/Hip Hop, Dance, R&B, Soul, Techno, and Funk from the 80’s and 90’s.   Most are 12" singles, some full albums. Some have picture sleeves, some have generic or label covers. Conditions are mixed, most are in Near Mint condition.  There is no list, sorry.  $1500 bid + shipping.

Response:

Question:

Hi, Has anyone heard of anxiety being a side effect with Palomar?  I’ve been taking it for a week, and I was so tense today, I couldn’t think.

Response:

Dear  Shwrcurtai      take good care of you Hope someone can help you out. Hold tight things will eventually level out take good care of YOU Always Sunshine Aries

Response:

Do you mean Pamelor (Nortriptyline)? I am also on that, 100mgs per day. I haven’t had anxiety as a side effect though. I think it is actually supposed to calm anxiety. Its has for me anyhow. If you have any other questions, feel free to email me. I’m starting to feel like an expert on the stuff! I can also recommend some sites that are useful too if you are interested. Take care, Suzie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, Has anyone heard of anxiety being a side effect with Palomar?  I’ve been taking it for a week, and I was so tense today, I couldn’t think.

Response:

While I’m on inhaled and now intrnasal steroids, I’m eating a banana a day for breakfast along with other fresh fruits of the season.  A good way to get potassium naturally. Sue M.

Response:

Yes, most fruits are loaded with potassium. For those unfamiliar with it, this website has an immense amount of info on food nutrients and compositions: http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/cgi-bin/nut_search.pl Hope it is of some use. pavane – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – While I’m on inhaled and now intrnasal steroids, I’m eating a banana a day for breakfast along with other fresh fruits of the season.  A good way to get potassium naturally. Sue M.

Response:

These are known side-effects of these meds.  There are other medications which may, or may not, have lesser effects.  If they are enough to bother you, I would have a chat with my doctor about trying something else. Hi I drink a glass of orange juice daily and it keeps the cramping away and also drink it with the Calcium in it too.So when I miss a few days like maybe 4 or 5 I get the cramping back so try the orange juice and see how it works for you.Leona

For all of us who are allergic to oranges . . . the potassium in the OJ is what is helping with the cramping.  Any good source of potassium should help. Chris Owens

Response:

Its common that beta-2-Mimetika in high dosis can reduce the potassium-in blood.  Also someone can react sensitive for Serevent but not for another. Try and error.Ask your physician. Lothar

Response:

I’ve had a lot of problems with cramping too.  In fact today it may have been the worst it has ever been in my feet.  It was unbelievable.  Besides my feet my hands cramp and contort into weird shapes.  My neck cramps and sometime the cramp spreads from one side to the other.  I’ve had blood tests done to find out if I was getting enough minerals.  Everything was fine except my creatine level was high.  I was told by my doctor that I shouldn’t take Potassium because then my level would be too high.  I already take a multivitamin, a calcium pill and an iron pill.  I just wish I could get the cramps to stop.

Response:

I’ve had a lot of problems with cramping too.  In fact today it may have been the worst it has ever been in my feet.  It was unbelievable.  Besides my feet my hands cramp and contort into weird shapes.  My neck cramps and sometime the cramp spreads from one side to the other.  I’ve had blood tests done to find out if I was getting enough minerals.  Everything was fine except my creatine level was high.  I was told by my doctor that I shouldn’t take Potassium because then my level would be too high.  I already take a multivitamin, a calcium pill and an iron pill.  I just wish I could get the cramps to stop.

Please go back to your doctor and get your creatine tested again.  If it is still high, ask him to investigate the possibility that you have muscular dystrophy.  Cramping such as you describe is a common symptom of several of the adult-onset varieties. Chris Owens

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been diagnosed with asthma for almost a year now.  About 7 months ago I was put on Pulmicort and Serevent along with my Albuteral as needed.  I began having strange symtpoms a couple of weeks after begining these medications (i.e. dizziness, headache, muscle cramps, muscle fatgie etc).  I had many tests done with a neurologist, a chiropractor etc. Everything I had done came back normal. I went to see a pulminologist who told me that all my symptoms could be due to the medications I was on. Anyway, the symptoms pretty much lessened over time, except the random cramping and muscle twitches, especially in my feet.  But now they have began again in more frequency.  I currently am getting over bronchitis, and even though I haven’t increased my meds, I am wondering if the body just magnifies these side effects during illness.  Has anyone else experienced these type of side effects with these medications? And if you have, what did you do about it?  I tried Singular to no avail.  It did not help me, so I was put back on the Serevent. I have been on Pulmicort also since the begining.  Thanks These are known side-effects of these meds.  There are other medications which may, or may not, have lesser effects.  If they are enough to bother you, I would have a chat with my doctor about trying something else. Chris Owens

Hi I drink a glass of orange juice daily and it keeps the cramping away and also drink it with the Calcium in it too.So when I miss a few days like maybe 4 or 5 I get the cramping back so try the orange juice and see how it works for you.Leona

Response:

I started using serevent and flovent in January and during the last 2 months have been experiencing severe calf and foot cramps.  I had blood tests done which revealed no abnormalities in my electrolytes(?) which I was told could indicate potassium depletion.    I have also used predisone twice during that period so I have no idea which med is causing the problem.  I started taking potasssium, calcium and vitimen E (my vitimen bible recommends this for cramps) and have had no further problems.  Fingers crossed.  It’s interesting that the "authorities" don’t want to acknowledge that the meds could/can have side affects that they haven’t heard about.  Niasha Vivian wrote I have been diagnosed with asthma for almost a year now. About 7 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – months ago I was put on Pulmicort and Serevent along with my Albuteral as needed.  I began having strange symtpoms a couple of weeks after begining these medications (i.e. dizziness, headache, muscle cramps, muscle fatgie etc).  .

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been diagnosed with asthma for almost a year now.  About 7 months ago I was put on Pulmicort and Serevent along with my Albuteral as needed.  I began having strange symtpoms a couple of weeks after begining these medications (i.e. dizziness, headache, muscle cramps, muscle fatgie etc).  I had many tests done with a neurologist, a chiropractor etc. Everything I had done came back normal. I went to see a pulminologist who told me that all my symptoms could be due to the medications I was on. Anyway, the symptoms pretty much lessened over time, except the random cramping and muscle twitches, especially in my feet.  But now they have began again in more frequency.  I currently am getting over bronchitis, and even though I haven’t increased my meds, I am wondering if the body just magnifies these side effects during illness.  Has anyone else experienced these type of side effects with these medications? And if you have, what did you do about it?  I tried Singular to no avail.  It did not help me, so I was put back on the Serevent. I have been on Pulmicort also since the begining.  Thanks

These are known side-effects of these meds.  There are other medications which may, or may not, have lesser effects.  If they are enough to bother you, I would have a chat with my doctor about trying something else. Chris Owens

Response:

Have to cut the message because of length, but I find this very interesting, and am quite sure the inhaled steroids could cause this. I have never had this muscle stuff until going on inhaled steriods. The few postings I have seen of people who had muscle cramps and think it is related to serevent are usually on inhaled steriods also. I think the headaches and diziness are from serevent, but mixed with the inhaled steroids could cause the cramps perhaps. I am on two puffs twice a day of Pulmicourt, is this a high dose??  I am new to asthma and dont really know how to judge a high dose.  I am going to try the potassium though (got some at the drug store on the way home).  I will let you all know how it works out. Thanks! Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

I have been diagnosed with asthma for almost a year now.  About 7 months ago I was put on Pulmicort and Serevent along with my Albuteral as needed.  I began having strange symtpoms a couple of weeks after begining these medications (i.e. dizziness, headache, muscle cramps, muscle fatgie etc).  I had many tests done with a neurologist, a chiropractor etc. Everything I had done came back normal. I went to see a pulminologist who told me that all my symptoms could be due to the medications I was on. Anyway, the symptoms pretty much lessened over time, except the random cramping and muscle twitches, especially in my feet.  But now they have began again in more frequency.  I currently am getting over bronchitis, and even though I haven’t increased my meds, I am wondering if the body just magnifies these side effects during illness.  Has anyone else experienced these type of side effects with these medications? And if you have, what did you do about it?  I tried Singular to no avail.  It did not help me, so I was put back on the Serevent. I have been on Pulmicort also since the begining.  Thanks Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been diagnosed with asthma for almost a year now.  About 7 months ago I was put on Pulmicort and Serevent along with my Albuteral as needed.  I began having strange symtpoms a couple of weeks after begining these medications (i.e. dizziness, headache, muscle cramps, muscle fatgie etc).  I had many tests done with a neurologist, a chiropractor etc. Everything I had done came back normal. I went to see a pulminologist who told me that all my symptoms could be due to the medications I was on. Anyway, the symptoms pretty much lessened over time, except the random cramping and muscle twitches, especially in my feet.  But now they have began again in more frequency.  I currently am getting over bronchitis, and even though I haven’t increased my meds, I am wondering if the body just magnifies these side effects during illness.  Has anyone else experienced these type of side effects with these medications? And if you have, what did you do about it?  I tried Singular to no avail.  It did not help me, so I was put back on the Serevent. I have been on Pulmicort also since the begining.  Thanks Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

I had terrible problems with leg and foot cramps when on relatively high doses of Flovent and Serevent, after a bad bout of asthma a couple of years ago. I even experinced these cramps while on lower doses, though less frequently.  Interestingly, my husband was diagnosed with asthma last year and he, too, experienced leg and foot cramps after he was put on similar meds. The specialists were clueless about why and kept saying that since the doses were inhaled, we should not experience these cramps. They only happen with the oral doses. After much investigation, I learned that potassium depletion can occur as a result of these meds.  I started taking a potassium supplement (1 per day) with my GP’s approval, and I get no muscle cramps, unless I forget to take my potassium.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been diagnosed with asthma for almost a year now.  About 7 months ago I was put on Pulmicort and Serevent along with my Albuteral as needed.  I began having strange symtpoms a couple of weeks after begining these medications (i.e. dizziness, headache, muscle cramps, muscle fatgie etc).  I had many tests done with a neurologist, a chiropractor etc. Everything I had done came back normal. I went to see a pulminologist who told me that all my symptoms could be due to the medications I was on. Anyway, the symptoms pretty much lessened over time, except the random cramping and muscle twitches, especially in my feet.  But now they have began again in more frequency.  I currently am getting over bronchitis, and even though I haven’t increased my meds, I am wondering if the body just magnifies these side effects during illness.  Has anyone else experienced these type of side effects with these medications? And if you have, what did you do about it?  I tried Singular to no avail.  It did not help me, so I was put back on the Serevent. I have been on Pulmicort also since the begining.  Thanks

Vivian said: I had terrible problems with leg and foot cramps when on relatively high doses of Flovent and Serevent, after a bad bout of asthma a couple of years ago. I even experinced these cramps while on lower doses, though less frequently.  Interestingly, my husband was diagnosed with asthma last year and he, too, experienced leg and foot cramps after he was put on similar meds. The specialists were clueless about why and kept saying that since the doses were inhaled, we should not experience these cramps. They only happen with the oral doses. After much investigation, I learned that potassium depletion can occur as a result of these meds.  I started taking a potassium supplement (1 per day) with my GP’s approval, and I get no muscle cramps, unless I forget to take my potassium.

I’ve been on inhaled corticosteroids for about 7 years now. I’m dependent. But I hardly ever have to use Ventolin, whereas I had to use 2-6 times per day 8 years ago. I can do vigorous aerobic exercise with virtually zero asthmatic symptoms. I do not take this for granted. Sure, the fact of dependency bothers me, but not as much as another aspect: to a certain extent each of us on long-term inhaled corticosteroids is a guinea pig. Let’s face it.  We all know about the potential risk of adrenal suppression. But the thing that gets me is the strong assumption that because the dosages are metered and "non-systemic" (i.e., not like Prednisone) that side effects will probably be negligible. It’s comforting to think that and believe that – and most of the time I do think that (this may be called "denial" borne of a need for psychological self-protection) – yet when sometimes my most rational call-a-spade-a-spade mind realizes that this is a case of long-term wait and see. I include a short article from JAMA from earlier this year about this topic, below. We apparently need to be aware of proximal myopathy… michael    Source:  JAMA, The Journal of the American Medical Association, Jan 6, 1999             v281 i1 p37(1).     Title:  Proximal Myopathy Associated With Inhaled Steroids.(Letter to the             Editor)    Author:  Andrew G. Herzog  Subjects:  Corticosteroids – Adverse and side effects             Muscle diseases – Causes of Full Text COPYRIGHT 1999 American Medical Association. All Rights Reserved. To the Editor. A number of undesirable systemic effects have been reported with the use of inhaled corticosteroids, including cataracts, suppression of the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis, osteoporosis, and possibly glaucoma [(1)(2)]. Report of a Case. A 37-year-old woman who had a seizure disorder that was well controlled with carbamazepine therapy began to use a beclomethasone nasal inhaler, 42 [micro]g of drug per nasal pump unit, 1 to 2 sprays in each nostril twice daily, for the treatment of seasonal allergic rhinitis. Four weeks later, the patient began to experience tightness in her thighs and increased fatigability when she climbed stairs or walked distances that were previously readily tolerated. Findings on a general medical examination were normal. Neurologic evaluation revealed a mild to moderate reduction in strength (4 1/2/5 range) in neck flexion and bilaterally in shoulder abduction and hip flexion. Muscle weakness had not been noted in the past. Findings on the remainder of the neurologic examination, including muscle strength elsewhere, cranial nerve function, and deep tendon reflexes, were within normal limits. Erythrocyte sedimentation rate, thyroid function test results, cortisol and serum creatine kinase levels, and an tinuclear antibody titer were normal. Serum carbamazepine level was in the midtherapeutic range Electromyography (EMG) showed normal resting activity, without fibrillations or trains of myotonic potentials. Voluntary contraction of proximal muscles showed an increased recruitment pattern and diminished average size of units, consistent with myopathy. The possibility of steroid-induced myopathy was considered, and the use of inhaled steroids was discontinued. At the time of follow-up 1 month later, the patient was free of exercise-induced muscle tightness and reported normal exercise tolerance and strength Examination revealed full motor strength, and repeat EMG showed normal unit morphology and recruitment. Without steroids, she has had no recurrence of weakness for 2 years. Comment. Clinicians may need to consider proximal myopathy among the possible undesirable systemic adverse effects that can occur with the use of inhaled corticosteroids. Andrew G Herzog, MD, MSc Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center Boston, Mass 1. Garbe E, Suissa S, LeLorier J Association of inhaled corticosteroid use with cataract extraction in elderly patients JAMA 1998,280 539-543. 2. Cunning RG, Mitchell P, Leeder SR Use of inhaled corticosteroids and the risk of cataracts N Engl J Med 1997,337 8-14.                                 — End —

Response:

This I will try. I wonder if it can cause other symptoms such as twitchs and diziness. Maybe if it is muscle related, i.e. tight muscles. THis is a simple and safe idea. thank you! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been diagnosed with asthma for almost a year now.  About 7 months ago I was put on Pulmicort and Serevent along with my Albuteral as needed.  I began having strange symtpoms a couple of weeks after begining these medications (i.e. dizziness, headache, muscle cramps, muscle fatgie etc).  I had many tests done with a neurologist, a chiropractor etc. Everything I had done came back normal. I went to see a pulminologist who told me that all my symptoms could be due to the medications I was on. Anyway, the symptoms pretty much lessened over time, except the random cramping and muscle twitches, especially in my feet.  But now they have began again in more frequency.  I currently am getting over bronchitis, and even though I haven’t increased my meds, I am wondering if the body just magnifies these side effects during illness.  Has anyone else experienced these type of side effects with these medications? And if you have, what did you do about it?  I tried Singular to no avail.  It did not help me, so I was put back on the Serevent. I have been on Pulmicort also since the begining.  Thanks Share what you know. Learn what you don’t. I had terrible problems with leg and foot cramps when on relatively high doses of Flovent and Serevent, after a bad bout of asthma a couple of years ago. I even experinced these cramps while on lower doses, though less frequently.  Interestingly, my husband was diagnosed with asthma last year and he, too, experienced leg and foot cramps after he was put on similar meds. The specialists were clueless about why and kept saying that since the doses were inhaled, we should not experience these cramps. They only happen with the oral doses. After much investigation, I learned that potassium depletion can occur as a result of these meds.  I started taking a potassium supplement (1 per day) with my GP’s approval, and I get no muscle cramps, unless I forget to take my potassium.

Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Question:

I watched the Primetime report on Paxil. We all know what sensationalist, alarmist crap many of these media reports are, but here’s what I DID get from the report: 1. I suspect, because it was claimed outright, that the makers of antidepressant drugs haven’t much of a clue how they work. The main evidence claimed was that the drug increases brain weight, so it MUST be getting to the brain. [So does a bullet.] 2. 20-40% of patients on Paxil have significant withdrawal symptoms. Over 100 adolescents committed suicide because of it. These numbers were in internal documents but denied to the public because they were "not statistically significant". . 3. Its main target in many adolescents is headaches . . . yet look at the nature of depression and consider the range of effects any drug must have to fight that many symptoms. SURELY any drug that does THAT many things to our MINDS has a strong potential to be much worse than the hot flashes it’s intended to mitigate in HT patients. 4. Some patients require "months" of agony to withdraw from Paxil. Guess what? IAD resumes in "months". The biggest message I came away with? I’m going to do a lot of reading before I even consider an antidepressant drug. And since the only "cure" I’ ve read about yet for hot flashes is antidepressants, and the "cure" is just a 50% reduction, and hot flashes are virtually guaranteed, I’m going to complete that reading before choosing HT. Now multiply that scenario by the number of SEs of HT, and realize that the fix for many of those SEs is another drug . . . with its own SEs, and that no drug company WILLINGLY admits to SEs. I.P. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was just watching GMA whereby they discussed Paxil and how the withdrawal symptoms have been greatly downplayed.  The side effects can vary from headaches to debilitating electrical shock sensations. Apparently the company producing the drug have this repressed data from their own studies although they state that they have made the physicians aware.  They will be presenting this story tonight on Primetime for those interested.

Response:

I was just watching GMA whereby they discussed Paxil and how the withdrawal symptoms have been greatly downplayed.  The side effects can vary from headaches to debilitating electrical shock sensations. Apparently the company producing the drug have this repressed data from their own studies although they state that they have made the physicians aware.  They will be presenting this story tonight on Primetime for those interested. Sandi

Paxil is about the worst to get off because it has a very short half-life. http://www.citypages.com/databank/23/1141/article10788.asp the 2nd page addresses the half-life issues. HTH Lori

Response:

conviction: Now THAT would worry my wife. I’m irritable enough as it is; is Clarence — and will I become — grouchy because of ADT? Or has ADT made Clarence more pleasant than he was pre-PC by suppressing his emotions? I.P.

When I was a kid, I put my hand on the stove. It was HOT! I’m that sort of person who lives outside the edge. As for being pleasant at any time, my wife has called me "Grumpy" for as long as I can remember. Point is, I’m trying to get in a few days work every week to maintain my "Millionaire" status, branded on me by CentreLink, (our learned Welfare Organisation), 4 yrs ago after I’d been ratting trash cans for sustenance for 3 months due to a slight economic downturn. Believe me, if you get on ADT, you can kiss it all goodbye. I’m starting to feel I’ll end up like Jack Nicholson in "One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s Nest". Androcur Tabs 50mg/day plus a shot of Lucrin quarterly. and revert to the ADT for another 12 months. What a blast!! — "if you can see it coming, head it off at the pass, else put the wagons in a circle" — Please reply to this ng as: — my email adress is 100% faked to prevent proliferation of SPAM!! — Regards — Clarence Crow

Response:

I.P. wrote The real message of my personal dilemma for others in this forum is this: PC and its treatment are EXTREMELY complicated stuff . . . far more so than any doctor has time to explain thoroughly. Read. And read. And read. Those two points are possibly the most important of any when dealing with this bastard.

Oh . . . you mean the CANCER. I.P.

Response:

The real message of my personal dilemma for others in this forum is this: PC and its treatment are EXTREMELY complicated stuff . . . far more so than any doctor has time to explain thoroughly. Read. And read. And read.

Those two points are possibly the most important of any when dealing with this bastard. — Prostate Cancer Survivor (so far), not a doctor Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3bN0M0 PSA  .1  .1  .1  .27  .37  .75 PSA  .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 PSA  .07 .05 .06 Lupron (3 mo) 8/03 (48), 12/03, 4/04 (49), 09/04 (50) non Illegitimi carborundum

Response:

Now THAT would worry my wife. I’m irritable enough as it is; is Clarence — and will I become — grouchy because of ADT? Or has ADT made Clarence more pleasant than he was pre-PC by suppressing his emotions? I.P.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – And a hearty ‘Good Morning’ to you too, Clarence. — Prostate Cancer Survivor (so far), not a doctor Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3bN0M0 PSA  .1  .1  .1  .27  .37  .75 PSA  .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 PSA  .07 .05 .06 Lupron (3 mo) 8/03 (48), 12/03, 4/04 (49), 09/04 (50) non Illegitimi carborundum up off the mat and advised with conviction: Antidepressant treats hot flashes in men taking hormonal therapy for prostate cancer, Mayo study finds Paxil (paroxetine) diminishes hot flashes in men who are receiving hormone therapy for prostate cancer. <snip BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH!! There’s just too many REAMS of doubtful INFORMATION being posted here!! Listen up, all you pussies, I’m a grouchy old buzzard currently on ADT Hormones  prior to RAD.

Response:

Hi All Men don’t have hot flashes, they have power surges!! Jamie

Response:

Hi Sandi…. I know all about the withdrawal symptoms of these SSRI drugs simply because my daughter and my sister suffer from seratonin deficiency and are on them. One on Welbutrin (Zyban) and the other on Effexor. Our ditz of a family doctor told my daughter to just cut them out in two days.  She couldn’t get off the couch due to dizzy spells and nausea!!  I phoned the pharmacy and they were horrified.  Thanks to them, she cut them down VERY gradually and was OK.  It would have happened to my sister as well, had I not gone thru this with my daughter, and warned her. Who should we blame??  Doctors who do not read the literature and drug companies who do not disclose all the details.  All of these drugs are Prozac derivatives (some 30 of them, I believe) and they do have major withdrawal problems.  Paxil has been found to cause suicidal tendencies……which it is supposed to be eliminating. These anti-depressants are very powerful drugs, so use them as your pharmacist directs you to…..they seem to know more.  And check to see if there are any cross-medication problems as well. And thanks for the info on Primetime….I will look for it tonight. Heather

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was just watching GMA whereby they discussed Paxil and how the withdrawal symptoms have been greatly downplayed.  The side effects can vary from headaches to debilitating electrical shock sensations. Apparently the company producing the drug have this repressed data from their own studies although they state that they have made the physicians aware.  They will be presenting this story tonight on Primetime for those interested. Sandi

Response:

The effects you list, side or not, are but a very small part of the menu, and don’t address the severity some people encounter with some effects or the relative commonality of various effects. Some effects take months to show up, some take months to disappear after ADT cessation, and some can be permanent. And even the benefits of ADT are debatable, regardless of the SEs. If I become convinced I can try ADT for a month or two and realisticaly assess its impacts without being committed to long-term impacts, I’ll jump on the bandwagon. My research so far doesn’t strongly support that approach. I consider the distinction between intended effects and SEs vital because generally, intended effects address benefit and SEs address harm. If a treatment doesn’t work, SEs are irrelevant because I’m not trying it. And many trials study only the intended effect — prolonged heartbeat — without considering QOL. IMO, that renders some studies almost moot. The real message of my personal dilemma for others in this forum is this: PC and its treatment are EXTREMELY complicated stuff . . . far more so than any doctor has time to explain thoroughly. Read. And read. And read. I took several pages of typewritten questions to each of the several doctors I consulted about my PC. Every doctor was very pleased and impressed at this, and some said they wished every patient would do it. I.P.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 10. I did, and it makes me wonder . . . Do I want to spend my last years obsessed with juggling chemicals and side effects with a chemically impaired brain, or spend maybe fewer — or maybe more — years being I.P. Freely rather than a nut case? I imagine most people relatively recently diagnosed obsess of the issues of ‘life as I knew it’ vs. ‘life as it will be or may be.’ But, what you really need to concern yourself with is the effects of the drugs.  Calling some effects "intended" and the others as "side" effects is, IMHO, a distraction.  Everything you put in your body has effects.  Every place you put your body has effects.  Every position you put your body in and the duration you keep your body in that position has effects.  Every day of your life, you make decisions on thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of permutations that have effects on your body.  It is silly to consider them intended and side effects.  They are just plane effects.  You do this, and that, that and that happens.  Some effects may be positive.  They may be negative.  They may be positive now and negative later.  Or visa versa. They may be positive and negative concurrently. What you really have to do is list the effects and possible effects of ADT. They are; 1. extended life.  2. temporary impotence.  3. temporary disinterest.  They may also be; 1. permanent impotence, 2. emotional instability, 3. bone mass loss, 4. hot flashes. Then, decide if some of the effects are worth it in lieu of the others. But, with ADT, you have this great option.  Try it for 30, 60, 90 days. If you don’t like it, send it back… no questions asked.

Response:

And a hearty ‘Good Morning’ to you too, Clarence. — Prostate Cancer Survivor (so far), not a doctor Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3bN0M0 PSA  .1  .1  .1  .27  .37  .75 PSA  .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 PSA  .07 .05 .06 Lupron (3 mo) 8/03 (48), 12/03, 4/04 (49), 09/04 (50) non Illegitimi carborundum

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – up off the mat and advised with conviction: Antidepressant treats hot flashes in men taking hormonal therapy for prostate cancer, Mayo study finds Paxil (paroxetine) diminishes hot flashes in men who are receiving hormone therapy for prostate cancer. <snip BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH!! There’s just too many REAMS of doubtful INFORMATION being posted here!! Listen up, all you pussies, I’m a grouchy old buzzard currently on ADT Hormones  prior to RAD. The other day I was in a bad mood, so I downed a couple of Amitryptiline (Endep 25) and they damn near killed me. Apart from my being useless for a day and a half, all my Osteo-Arthritis pains magnified, plus a few new ones emerged. I phoned into the Rad Oncology Dept, but was only able to get a nurse, who advised me to CEASE them immediately, and see my GP about some alternative. — "if you can see it coming, head it off at the pass, else put the wagons in a circle" — Please reply to this ng as: — my email adress is 100% faked to prevent proliferation of SPAM!! — Regards — Clarence Crow

Response:

I was just watching GMA whereby they discussed Paxil and how the withdrawal symptoms have been greatly downplayed.

I wonder who is accused of downplaying the withdrawal symptoms.  My wife’s doctor was very frank about the danger of self-unmedicating with it.  To be sure, he called me to tell me, just in case my wife was in a poor state of mind if and when she decided to do it.

Response:

  Each time I’ve seen that yet another antidepressant fixes hot flashes, several thoughts spring to mind: 1. Depression is serious stuff, and antidepressants are serious meds, so any problem requiring antidepressants must be pretty serious.

  (snip) IP is worried about very little. Maybe he should pop a pill The dosage of antidepressant that is required for hot flash control is far less than the therapeutic dosage for depression. Frex, I was prescribed Effexor, an antidepressant, to control the hot flashes caused by Zoladex. The prescription called for a beginning dosage of just 37.5mg. Something similar exists with Proscar, which is used to treat BPH and PCa, and Propecia, which is used to treat male-pattern baldness. Both are finasteride, but the Propecia dosage is far less than Proscar. As it happens, as I reported elsewhere in the NG, I recently switched from Zoladex to Lupron and have far fewer and milder hot flashes so I elected not to proceed with the Effexor. A SE of that decision is that I have saved mucho dinero; Effexor is expensive. Regards, Steve J

Response:

10. I did, and it makes me wonder . . . Do I want to spend my last years obsessed with juggling chemicals and side effects with a chemically impaired brain, or spend maybe fewer — or maybe more — years being I.P. Freely rather than a nut case?

I imagine most people relatively recently diagnosed obsess of the issues of ‘life as I knew it’ vs. ‘life as it will be or may be.’ But, what you really need to concern yourself with is the effects of the drugs.  Calling some effects "intended" and the others as "side" effects is, IMHO, a distraction.  Everything you put in your body has effects.  Every place you put your body has effects.  Every position you put your body in and the duration you keep your body in that position has effects.  Every day of your life, you make decisions on thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of permutations that have effects on your body.  It is silly to consider them intended and side effects.  They are just plane effects.  You do this, and that, that and that happens.  Some effects may be positive.  They may be negative.  They may be positive now and negative later.  Or visa versa. They may be positive and negative concurrently. What you really have to do is list the effects and possible effects of ADT. They are; 1. extended life.  2. temporary impotence.  3. temporary disinterest.  They may also be; 1. permanent impotence, 2. emotional instability, 3. bone mass loss, 4. hot flashes. Then, decide if some of the effects are worth it in lieu of the others. But, with ADT, you have this great option.  Try it for 30, 60, 90 days.  If you don’t like it, send it back… no questions asked.

Response:

I was just watching GMA whereby they discussed Paxil and how the withdrawal symptoms have been greatly downplayed.  The side effects can vary from headaches to debilitating electrical shock sensations. Apparently the company producing the drug have this repressed data from their own studies although they state that they have made the physicians aware.  They will be presenting this story tonight on Primetime for those interested. Sandi

Response:

up off the mat and advised with conviction: Antidepressant treats hot flashes in men taking hormonal therapy for prostate cancer, Mayo study finds Paxil (paroxetine) diminishes hot flashes in men who are receiving hormone therapy for prostate cancer. <snip

BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH!! There’s just too many REAMS of doubtful INFORMATION being posted here!! Listen up, all you pussies, I’m a grouchy old buzzard currently on ADT Hormones  prior to RAD. The other day I was in a bad mood, so I downed a couple of Amitryptiline (Endep 25) and they damn near killed me. Apart from my being useless for a day and a half, all my Osteo-Arthritis pains magnified, plus a few new ones emerged. I phoned into the Rad Oncology Dept, but was only able to get a nurse, who advised me to CEASE them immediately, and see my GP about some alternative. — "if you can see it coming, head it off at the pass, else put the wagons in a circle" — Please reply to this ng as: — my email adress is 100% faked to prevent proliferation of SPAM!! — Regards — Clarence Crow

Response:

Each time I’ve seen that yet another antidepressant fixes hot flashes, several thoughts spring to mind: 1. Depression is serious stuff, and antidepressants are serious meds, so any problem requiring antidepressants must be pretty serious. 2. Any med that can combat a serious problem must have some pretty serious deliberate effects. If their purpose is to reduce depression, then reducing hot flashes is by definition a SE of the antidepressant. Jeez . . . what are its INTENDED effects? i.e., What changes do they make in my body to achieve their INTENDED effect of reducing depression . . . and obsessive-compulsive disorder, panic disorder, generalized anxiety disorder and social anxiety disorder, among others? 3. Do I want to add those intended effects to the SEs of my meds, which, after all, are the reasons I need antidepressants in the first place? 4. What are the other SEs of the antidepressant, besides reducing the number and severity of hot flashes? 5. How many of the antidepressant’s SEs need additional meds to combat THEM? 6. Worse yet, look up the SEs of these antidepressants. Some of the lists run into scores of effects, many of them serious. 7. When do we stop ingesting exponentially increasing numbers of meds and just get on with our lives and hope we beat the statistics? 8. Who sez the statistics aren’t skewed by all the freaking cancatenated SE meds? 9. And in case that list of questions didn’t give me pause, ask Google about the side effects of Paxil/Prozac . . . and stand back. 10. I did, and it makes me wonder . . . Do I want to spend my last years obsessed with juggling chemicals and side effects with a chemically impaired brain, or spend maybe fewer — or maybe more — years being I.P. Freely rather than a nut case? My wife prefers I.P. Freely. That’s why she married him. And I can think of 647 things more fun to do than sitting here researching medications and SEs. But in case I’m overreacting, I’ll keep reading. The problem with THAT plan is that as I expand my search into an exponentially increasing fan of links, I find more support than opposition to my tentative plan . . . such as the end of this Mayo Clinic reference itself. But maybe that’s a good thing, because the confusion factor shrinks with every new report like this one. Following this Mayo Clinic study leads to scores — hundreds? — of related studies . . . most of them spiralling towards the same dilemma: do we want to maximize our heartbeats with the certainty of SEs, or maximize our QOL with the possibility of many SE-free years, then when (IF?) the PC hits the fan we decide an optimal course based on data at that point? Hell, I just spent half an hour on this, when I couldda been actually WATCHING West Wing . . . or maybe making out with my wife. Now multiply that dilemma by a thousand and add 645 other activities. I suspect that many of us would LOSE free time, not gain it, by opting for HT and its complications. I’ve already spent most of a month researching it, and I haven’t even had one shot or one symptom or one SE yet. I.P.

Antidepressant treats hot flashes in men taking hormonal therapy for prostate cancer, Mayo study finds Paxil (paroxetine) diminishes hot flashes in men who are receiving hormone therapy for prostate cancer, Mayo Clinic researchers report.  An antidepressant medication is an effective treatment to reduce hot flashes in men who are taking hormone therapy for prostate cancer, Mayo Clinic researchers report in the October issue of Mayo Clinic Proceedings. The five-week study followed 18 men who completed the therapy, illustrating that their hot flashes decreased from 6.2 per day to 2.5 per day. Hot flash scores, the frequency multiplied by the severity, decreased in the same period from 10.6 per day to 3 per day. "Newer antidepressants have been proven effective in reducing hot flashes in women but have not been studied in men," says Charles Loprinzi, M.D., Mayo Clinic Division of Medical Oncology and the lead author of the study. "Although hot flashes in men with prostate cancer are well documented," he said, "their treatment has not received as much attention." Some doctors treat hot flashes in men receiving hormonal therapy with a short course of a secondary hormone such as Megestrol acetate. But the Mayo team now expresses some "concern" about these secondary treatments (see below). The study looked at men receiving androgen ablation therapy, also known as hormonal deprivation therapy, or hormonal blockade, which is a well-established treatment for various stages of prostate cancer. The antidepressant tested, paroxetine (Paxil), has been used to treat mental depression, obsessive-compulsive disorder, panic disorder, generalized anxiety disorder and social anxiety disorder, among others. A placebo-controlled trial had previously demonstrated that paroxetine reduced hot flashes in women. The study was conducted between August 2001 and October 2003. Men eligible for the study had to have a history of prostate cancer for which they were receiving androgen ablation therapy. Previous Mayo studies suggested that venlafaxine (Effexor) is effective to treat hot flashes in men undergoing hormonal therapy and that citalopram (Celexa) reduces such hot flashes in women. A commoner, older treatment for hot flashes is Megace (Megestrol acetate). Megace is a progestogen, a man-made form of the female hormone progesterone. Megace is sometimes used to treat prostate cancer and when given with newer hormone blockade drugs like Lupron or Zoladex it reduces hot flashes by up to 90 per cent, according to a Mayo study in 2002. But there have been reports of men whose prostate cancer progressed while taking Megace, In  1999 Oliver Sartor M.D. at Louisiana State University Medical Center, reported "a case in which megestrol acetate (20 mg bid) was administered for symptomatic control of hot flashes in a medically castrated patient with prostate cancer. The patient was subsequently noted to have a rising prostate-specific antigen (PSA) level. Megestrol acetate administration was discontinued, and the PSA level declined. These data indicate that even the low doses of megestrol acetate used for control of hot flashes can be associated with PSA increases in some patients with prostate cancer." This may be especially a concern because, as another study points out, patients whose doctors prescribed Megace for hot flashes have been found to stay on this treatment for three years or more. The authors of the current Mayo study say this therapy "may affect prostate cancer growth and/or cause significant side effects." Patients who do not wish to take an antidepressant for hot flashes need not feel like mavericks. Most patients who experience hot flashes are not interested in adding a medication to suppress them. In a presentation at ASCO in 2001, a team from University of Pennsylvania Cancer Center said that although over 70 per cent of prostate cancer patients they studied complained of "a little" to "some" discomfort during hot flashes, "of those not receiving treatment, fewer than 50 per cent would consider taking medication to treat them." Hot flashes are "a significant side-effect of hormonal treatment," this team concluded, and drugs are available to manage the flashes, but "a significant percentage of patients do not find it as an acceptable option. Therefore, alternative support/educational interventions should also be considered to help patients better understand manage and cope with this treatment side effect. " Others who worked with Dr. Loprinzi on the Paxil study are: Debra Barton, R.N., Ph.D.; Lisa Carpenter; Jeff Sloan, Ph.D.; Paul Novotny; Matthew Gettman, M.D.; and Bradley Christensen, all from Mayo Clinic. knowledge is power – growing old is mandatory – growing wise is optional "Many more men die with prostate cancer than of it. Growing old is invariably fatal. Prostate cancer is only sometimes so." http://community.webtv.net/PALMER_ENT/doc

Response:

Antidepressant treats hot flashes in men taking hormonal therapy for prostate cancer, Mayo study finds Paxil (paroxetine) diminishes hot flashes in men who are receiving hormone therapy for prostate cancer, Mayo Clinic researchers report.  An antidepressant medication is an effective treatment to reduce hot flashes in men who are taking hormone therapy for prostate cancer, Mayo Clinic researchers report in the October issue of Mayo Clinic Proceedings. The five-week study followed 18 men who completed the therapy, illustrating that their hot flashes decreased from 6.2 per day to 2.5 per day. Hot flash scores, the frequency multiplied by the severity, decreased in the same period from 10.6 per day to 3 per day. "Newer antidepressants have been proven effective in reducing hot flashes in women but have not been studied in men," says Charles Loprinzi, M.D., Mayo Clinic Division of Medical Oncology and the lead author of the study. "Although hot flashes in men with prostate cancer are well documented," he said, "their treatment has not received as much attention." Some doctors treat hot flashes in men receiving hormonal therapy with a short course of a secondary hormone such as Megestrol acetate. But the Mayo team now expresses some "concern" about these secondary treatments (see below). The study looked at men receiving androgen ablation therapy, also known as hormonal deprivation therapy, or hormonal blockade, which is a well-established treatment for various stages of prostate cancer. The antidepressant tested, paroxetine (Paxil), has been used to treat mental depression, obsessive-compulsive disorder, panic disorder, generalized anxiety disorder and social anxiety disorder, among others. A placebo-controlled trial had previously demonstrated that paroxetine reduced hot flashes in women. The study was conducted between August 2001 and October 2003. Men eligible for the study had to have a history of prostate cancer for which they were receiving androgen ablation therapy. Previous Mayo studies suggested that venlafaxine (Effexor) is effective to treat hot flashes in men undergoing hormonal therapy and that citalopram (Celexa) reduces such hot flashes in women. A commoner, older treatment for hot flashes is Megace (Megestrol acetate). Megace is a progestogen, a man-made form of the female hormone progesterone. Megace is sometimes used to treat prostate cancer and when given with newer hormone blockade drugs like Lupron or Zoladex it reduces hot flashes by up to 90 per cent, according to a Mayo study in 2002. But there have been reports of men whose prostate cancer progressed while taking Megace, In  1999 Oliver Sartor M.D. at Louisiana State University Medical Center, reported "a case in which megestrol acetate (20 mg bid) was administered for symptomatic control of hot flashes in a medically castrated patient with prostate cancer. The patient was subsequently noted to have a rising prostate-specific antigen (PSA) level. Megestrol acetate administration was discontinued, and the PSA level declined. These data indicate that even the low doses of megestrol acetate used for control of hot flashes can be associated with PSA increases in some patients with prostate cancer." This may be especially a concern because, as another study points out, patients whose doctors prescribed Megace for hot flashes have been found to stay on this treatment for three years or more. The authors of the current Mayo study say this therapy "may affect prostate cancer growth and/or cause significant side effects." Patients who do not wish to take an antidepressant for hot flashes need not feel like mavericks. Most patients who experience hot flashes are not interested in adding a medication to suppress them. In a presentation at ASCO in 2001, a team from University of Pennsylvania Cancer Center said that although over 70 per cent of prostate cancer patients they studied complained of "a little" to "some" discomfort during hot flashes, "of those not receiving treatment, fewer than 50 per cent would consider taking medication to treat them." Hot flashes are "a significant side-effect of hormonal treatment," this team concluded, and drugs are available to manage the flashes, but "a significant percentage of patients do not find it as an acceptable option. Therefore, alternative support/educational interventions should also be considered to help patients better understand manage and cope with this treatment side effect. "

Question:

Hey everyone. i was wondering if anyone had any side effects from zoloft?  I’ve been on zoloft for 6 weeks now and after 4 weeks I got terrible diareah and nausea and the wieredest thing is i missed my period.  Any other women have that sort of thing happen to them?  The only reason I’m asking is I’m trying to figure out if i might possibly be pregnant.  So let me know. Joanne

Response:

I take 150 mgs of zoloft daily and had/have absolutely no symptoms at all. It never affected my periods either.  Maybe you’d better get one of those little test kits? td "Joanne Johnson" <za…@worldnet.att.net

wrote in message

news:7K1F7.155058$3d2.5648274@bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Hey everyone. i was wondering if anyone had any side effects from zoloft?  I’ve been on zoloft for 6 weeks now and after 4 weeks I got terrible diareah and nausea and the wieredest thing is i missed my period.  Any other women have that sort of thing happen to them?  The only reason I’m asking is I’m trying to figure out if i might possibly be pregnant.  So let me know. Joanne

Response:

Joanne, Common adverse effects of Zoloft are as follows: Nausea Somnolence Diarrhea Insomnia Constipation Ejaculatory Dysfunction Dyspepsia Agitation Anorexia Impotence Weight gain Your missed period could be a coincidence. The other two symptoms are common side effects of Zoloft. Talk to your doctor if the symptoms are more than a minor inconvenience. Risa Whenever I wake up on top of the mattress, I know I’m getting up on the right side of the bed.

Response:

Sure.  Look at the   Fruits and  Nuts  in  here. KCOM missed his  period  too. Joanne Johnson <za…@worldnet.att.net

wrote in message

news:7K1F7.155058$3d2.5648274@bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Hey everyone. i was wondering if anyone had any side effects from zoloft?  I’ve been on zoloft for 6 weeks now and after 4 weeks I got terrible diareah and nausea and the wieredest thing is i missed my period.  Any other women have that sort of thing happen to them?  The only reason I’m asking is I’m trying to figure out if i might possibly be pregnant.  So let me know. Joanne

Response:

wired me like a coke freak or something. I couldn’t handle the extra anxiety that it gave me. harumph

Response:

I’ve never missed a period while being on it.  But at first, it made me really hyper.  After about 8-9 weeks, that stopped.  I didn’t have any other side effects from it, luckily. kat "Joanne Johnson" <za…@worldnet.att.net

wrote in message

news:7K1F7.155058$3d2.5648274@bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Hey everyone. i was wondering if anyone had any side effects from zoloft?  I’ve been on zoloft for 6 weeks now and after 4 weeks I got terrible diareah and nausea and the wieredest thing is i missed my period.  Any other women have that sort of thing happen to them?  The only reason I’m asking is I’m trying to figure out if i might possibly be pregnant.  So let me know. Joanne

Response:

Had a close friend who experienced hypomania and increased aggressionand "magical speaking dreams" from it .She was unaware of it for some time. She wreaked havoc amongst her work colleagues and pals.She changed meds after the shrink realised (months later) what was up. Helski

Response:

I talk to my Dr and they say that its not from the zoloft.  I’m still testing negative on the home pregnancy tests.  I’ve got to go in and have blood work done to find out for sure.  I’ll let ya all know one way or the other what happens. Joanne

Response:

Hi Joanne, Taking Zoloft (Lustral over here in the UK) was an awful mistake for me. Within hours, I was experiencing a really clamping jaw tension – which my daft doctor stupidly claimed I had always had even though I had never had it before. My eyes went odd and starey, and felt pressured – this settled down after a few days but they were never right while I was on it. I had the awful nausea you mentioned, plus the upset stomach, headaches, and all sorts of other goodies. The nausea stayed after taking it, so did the bad stomach. Oh and I had tremors as well. Boy that stuff loved me. NOT. I suggest you keep an eye on it as it may be that it doesn’t agree with you. I wish I had come off sooner. Maybe have a chat about alternatives if it continues to be a problem. I found these side effects with all SSRI’s I tried (= Prozac and Seroxat). If you get muscle tension that you haven’t had before, like I did in my jaw, then I think that may be a real indication it is wrong for you. That said, you may decide that even this ‘wrong’ is more right for you than being without the benefits of the drug. Everyone is unique, chemically. BFN, Cary Charles ;O) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

"Joanne Johnson" <za…@worldnet.att.net wrote in message news:7K1F7.155058$3d2.5648274@bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… Hey everyone. i was wondering if anyone had any side effects from zoloft?  I’ve been

on

zoloft for 6 weeks now and after 4 weeks I got terrible diareah and

nausea

and the wieredest thing is i missed my period.  Any other women have

that

sort of thing happen to them?  The only reason I’m asking is I’m trying

to

figure out if i might possibly be pregnant.  So let me know. Joanne

Response:

Cary wrote:

Taking Zoloft (Lustral over here in the UK) was an awful mistake for me. Within hours, I was experiencing a really clamping jaw tension … My eyes went odd and starey, and felt pressured…

I’m surprised by your doctor’s attitude about what were obviously some bad side effects. I was inpatient when the treating psychiatrist ordered clonazepam (Klonopin in the U.S.) to slow me down a little bit. I had that same clamping jaw tension and weirdness in my vision. It was diagnosed as a mild allergic reaction. I was immediately given diphenhydramine (Benadryl) by injection. A couple of hours of sleep and I was good to go. No more of that med for me. I now use a program for my Palm pilot called Epocrates. It’s like a portable PDR (Physician’s Desk Reference), which is the 4" thick, 6-8 lb. (3.63 kg) tome that doctor’s in the U.S. use as a medication reference. I can look up any medication in seconds. I KNOW what to expect before I take the med, and I can search through classes of meds for something with less annoying or fewer side effects. That way, I’m as well informed as my doctor. E-mail me if you have more questions. Risa War doesn’t decide who’s right, only who’s left.

Response:

Unless you wish to be pregnant, I’ll pray that you aren’t I guess the diarehia is from the zoloft then… good to know… I wish everything goes well with you and zoloft… i think i’m going to have my pdoc take me off of it… i’ll try it out till the 11th and see… love ya’s! Tia

Response:

"RisaCaitlin" <risacait…@aol.competition

wrote in message

news:20011128071357.04371.00003384@mb-fc.aol.com…

I’m surprised by your doctor’s attitude about what were obviously some bad

side

effects.

So was I and my whole family, but at that time I had only had PTSD for about 18 years and they hadn’t diagnosed it – I ended up researching the problem on the internet and finding out that I had PTSD, then having to convince them, then having an assessment which ended with the guy telling me he had been told to disprove that I had PTSD, but instead was appalled at how I had been treated and that, yes, I definitely had PTSD! How is that for an easy ride? NOT!

I was inpatient when the treating psychiatrist ordered clonazepam

(Klonopin in

the U.S.) to slow me down a little bit. I had that same clamping jaw

tension

and weirdness in my vision. It was diagnosed as a mild allergic reaction. I was immediately given diphenhydramine (Benadryl) by injection. A couple of hours of sleep and I

was

good to go. No more of that med for me.

Well in hindsight I think I may have experienced something similar. I also wonder if it did long-term damage as my digestive system has never been the same since and I still have the awful clamping jaw that I never had before I took the stuff. I wonder if it altered something for the worse. Anyway, Kava Kava helps relax it if it is too bad. I did hear from an accident and emergency nurse though, and she said that she had encountered this muscular tension with SSRI usage, and that it was a sign that it really wasn’t agreeing with a person. Instead of keeping on taking it, they should come off it. Wish I had known that back then, or better still, that my doctor had! Never mind.

I now use a program for my Palm pilot called Epocrates. It’s like a

portable

PDR (Physician’s Desk Reference), which is the 4" thick, 6-8 lb. (3.63 kg)

tome

that doctor’s in the U.S. use as a medication reference. I can look up any medication in seconds. I KNOW what to expect before I take the med, and I

can

search through classes of meds for something with less annoying or fewer

side

effects. That way, I’m as well informed as my doctor.

I think that is a really sensible and responsible approach. I do loads of research before I take anything significant. I have learned the hard way, but it pays to be in the know.

E-mail me if you have more questions.

Thanks for that, and for your reply! BFN, Cary )

Response:

Finaly got into see my ob/gyn and i’m not pregnant but they think my hormones are messed up.  The side effects from the zoloft have gone away. Now I’ll have to have some blood work done to find out which hormores are messed up.  Maybe i will finally get some good help. Joanne UTend2KillMe <queenweasel…@aol.com

wrote in message

news:ef3a60d2.0111281922.502b9234@posting.google.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Unless you wish to be pregnant, I’ll pray that you aren’t I guess the diarehia is from the zoloft then… good to know… I wish everything goes well with you and zoloft… i think i’m going to have my pdoc take me off of it… i’ll try it out till the 11th and see… love ya’s! Tia

Response:

"RisaCaitlin" <risacait…@aol.competition

wrote in message

news:20011128071357.04371.00003384@mb-fc.aol.com…

I was inpatient when the treating psychiatrist ordered clonazepam

(Klonopin in

the U.S.) to slow me down a little bit. I had that same clamping jaw

tension

and weirdness in my vision. <snip

Risa, I am supposed to be taking Klonopin for Restless Leg Syndrome, and it helped a lot for that.  I am having problems with my legs now I’m off of it. I find the muscle problems with Zoloft interesting in that I have fibromyalgia (and I believe Chronic Myofasial Pain Disorder).  Add to that the osteoarthritis (was on Celebrex) and I have muscles and joints hurting literally everywhere.  I am also supposed to be on neurontin.  I’m to the point where I just want my anti-depressant, estrogen, klonopin, celebrex and the ambien.  I am ready to ditch the other four meds I was on, but I think I ended up with them to counteract the side effects of the original meds (swelling in the feet and hands and high blood pressure).  I can never tell which ailment is causing which "feeling!"  No wonder the doctors just throw up their hands.  :-/ *HUGS* Jacque ~**~**~**~**~**~**~**~**~**~**~**~**~**~ Jacque Keller www.tjkeller.net/jkeller/Jacque/ (personal) www.bramblerose.net (business)

Response:

Question:

I have been taking seroxat/paxil for some years now, but it seems to have stopped working, and anyway it messes up my sexual response. I did try Prozac for a short while but it made me manic and insomniac.  Any recommendations would be welcome.

I used seroxat for mere months and besides the sexual sideeffects I also suffered from insomnia. Even so much that Dalmadorm 30 mg did not help. It gave me a shallow restless and short sleep of perhaps 3 to 4 hours. Perhaps prozac would work better for me.

Response:

The best person to ask, obviously, would be your doctor or your psychiatrist. Personally, I was on Paxil for 4 years (if I remember correctly) and then suddenly got very depressed at the beginning of this year. Unfortunatly antidepressants can "poop out" on some people, which is what happened to me, and likely you. My shrink switched me to Zoloft (sertraline) because it is helpful for anxiety as well as depression, like Paxil. I’ve never had sexual problems on either drug so I’m not sure if Zoloft is as bad as Paxil for that, but I’d definitely mention the sexual side-effects when you see your doc. Good luck! Tara – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been taking seroxat/paxil for some years now, but it seems to have stopped working, and anyway it messes up my sexual response. I did try Prozac for a short while but it made me manic and insomniac. Any recommendations would be welcome.

Response:

I have been taking seroxat/paxil for some years now, but it seems to have stopped working, and anyway it messes up my sexual response. I did try Prozac for a short while but it made me manic and insomniac.  Any recommendations would be welcome.

Response:

Question:

Hi, My son & I are both on Paxil.  I think it’s the best drug I’ve ever taken (so far), and it works very well on my son.  For me, it has the least amount of side effects than Zoloft, Buspar & Luvox. Good luck, Mary – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I went to my GP today and he put me on Paxil, I was on prozac before. How have others felt on Paxil, is it any good, is it as good as Prozac, Will it have any adverse side effects. I’m a bit worried to be honest so all help appreciated thanks Smurf

Response:

"Smurf" <Smurf…@btinternet.com

wrote in message

news:8si9ta$k6n$1@neptunium.btinternet.com…

I went to my GP today and he put me on Paxil, I was on prozac before. How have others felt on Paxil, is it any good, is it as good as Prozac, Will

it

have any adverse side effects. I’m a bit worried to be honest so all help appreciated

It’s pretty similar to Prozac in many respects but for some people the *initial* side-effects seem to be a bit more dramatic. It has a much shorter half-life than Prozac which means that a week after you stop taking it, the drug will leave your body – Prozac can stay around for much longer. There isn’t too much difference between the 2 drugs. Gareth.

Response:

http://paxil.bizland.com/ check this out first. it works well but it’s hell on earth to get off it!!!! "Smurf" <Smurf…@btinternet.com

wrote in message

news:8si9ta$k6n$1@neptunium.btinternet.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I went to my GP today and he put me on Paxil, I was on prozac before. How have others felt on Paxil, is it any good, is it as good as Prozac, Will

it

have any adverse side effects. I’m a bit worried to be honest so all help appreciated thanks Smurf

Response:

Paxil helped me a lot more than Prozac ever did. The only bad problem I have ever had with Paxil is when I get a hair up my ass and decide not to take my medicine any more and tried to wean off of it. It is definitely a drug that has to be weaned from slowly. I’ve gotten very dizzy and had these shock like feelings going through my arms if I don’t take it. Ida Smurf <Smurf…@btinternet.com

wrote in message

news:8si9ta$k6n$1@neptunium.btinternet.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I went to my GP today and he put me on Paxil, I was on prozac before. How have others felt on Paxil, is it any good, is it as good as Prozac, Will

it

have any adverse side effects. I’m a bit worried to be honest so all help appreciated thanks Smurf

Response:

Smurf wrote:

I went to my GP today and he put me on Paxil, I was on prozac before. How have others felt on Paxil, is it any good, is it as good as Prozac, Will it have any adverse side effects. I’m a bit worried to be honest so all help appreciated thanks Smurf

I know I’m starting to sound like a walking advertisement for Paxil, but it’s helped me a lot.  I’ve never been on Prozac, so I can’t compare the two.  I did have some side effects, but they faded pretty quickly.  Can I ask why you’re switching from Prozac to Paxil, and what specifically is worrying you about it? Good luck! — Dave Hollinden   david.hollin…@sdrc.com (work) dholl…@iglou.com       (home)

Response:

I went to my GP today and he put me on Paxil, I was on prozac before. How have others felt on Paxil, is it any good, is it as good as Prozac, Will it have any adverse side effects. I’m a bit worried to be honest so all help appreciated thanks Smurf

Response:

Question:

Wait and take the next one when you are suppose. If you missed one dosage it won’t hurt you. You may want to get a pill box and then if you think you have missed a dosage you can look and tell if it missing. Hope your day goes well. K. HAVE A WONDERFULLY FUN FILLED DAY!!!!

Response:

I usually cant remember whether I took my meds or not so I went out and bought one of those cute pill reminder box. Mine is plastic and about 4 in. long and a thumbnail wide.It has 7 little compartments with each one having a snap top and the letter of the week on top. They come in many sizes depending on how many pills a day you have to take. I fill mine once a week. If I am about to run out of a med I see it coming a week in advance. Also if you suffer from OCD it really helps you KNOW that you took that pill, so you wont obsess on that. Or if you just have 10 million things on your plate and cant remeber much of anything anymore, lol, it helps. Chow love Brenda

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have to respond to this having made this mistake myself not long ago. DO NOT take the extra dose!!! I did that and overdosed myself. You will be better off waiting until your next scheduled dose and just going from there. Your body will not miss the zoloft if you’ve been on it awhile. Just don’t make a habit of it, ok? Mary That’s good advice. What happened when you overdosed, Mary? Philip (just curious)

Well Philip, I took 250 mgs instead of 150. I spent the whole day sitting on the couch wondering how I could have been so stupid. I also spent the day on the couch because every muscle in my body was vibrating and I had very little motor control. But I wasn’t depressed. How could I be with that much of an ad in my system? I pormised myself never to do it again. (I was sleepy when I took my meds that morning and couldn’t remember taking the one pill, so I took another) I went to the store the next day and bought myself a pill organizer that holds all your meds for every day of the week. Now I take the correct dose everyday while feeling like an alzheimer’s patient because at the age of 31, I can’t remember to take my meds correctly. Mary – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Well, I have been here and lurking…I try to respond privately when I feel I can help…To be honest, the only reason I haven’t been responding on the newsgroup is because I found deja.com…When I discovered all my messages, I felt my privacy was invaded a bit much…Anyway, I now have a question that needs the newsgroup and can’t be dealt with privately, so here it is… Hi Chuck, I’m sorry I can’t be of much help with Zoloft but I do have a solution for this problem.  There are 2 options. If your reader allows it (Agent does) you can have the line "x-no-archive: yes" (without quotes) added to your header. If you can’t find out how to do this, the other option is to make that same line (x-no-archive: yes) the *very first* line of your post.  I took some sleeping meds last night, and this morning I woke up late and don’t recall if I took my Zoloft in the morning (as I usually do)…I fear I have missed it…I have been doing excellent on Zoloft Ok now, you are not sure, you *fear* you’ve forgotten. I would say, don’t try to catch up the dose. AFAIK, it’s not good to ever try to catch up a forgotten AD dose. Just lleave it for what it is and take your regular dose tomorrow morning. I doubt you’ll have a major setback, maybe you’ll be a little uncomfortable but that’s all I would expect. I’ve forgotten my paxil dose several times but it never caused any problems for me. Bye! Inky (^_-)

Response:

I’d quote but the beginning of this thread is gone (yes I’m on AOL)… If it helps you any, try putting your morning meds (for me it’s an SSRI and a hormone) in a container (I use the top of the Nyquil bottle…hey it’s free) and keep that by the bed. Make it a practice to leave your BOTTLE in the living room and only put your morning meds in there before you go to bed (like a routine). I’ve found I can get them in my system faster, which helps me get to sleep earlier that night, in case I just wake up early, take the meds and feel like going back to sleep instead of getting up completely. Keep a small glass of water and the cup and turn the med cup upside down when you’ve taken them. Sometimes my OCD comes in handy  This method sure beats looking at the label and counting and subtracting, blah blah….BTDT and found this helps. All the best. Miriam

Response:

i use a pill box to keep meds straight.before i go to bed i put the next day meds in the pill box,also my husband takes heart meds.he keeps them in a box.when he takes one he turns the bottle up side down.no more guessing or mistakes .let me share something else with you.at times it is hard to swoller pills.use a straw taking pills .you can’t believe how much easier it is. hope some of this helps. good luck. fanny

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That’s good advice. What happened when you overdosed, Mary? Philip (just curious) Well Philip, I took 250 mgs instead of 150. I spent the whole day sitting on the couch wondering how I could have been so stupid. I also spent the day on the couch because every muscle in my body was vibrating and I had very little motor control. But I wasn’t depressed. How could I be with that much of an ad in my system? I pormised myself never to do it again. (I was sleepy when I took my meds that morning and couldn’t remember taking the one pill, so I took another) I went to the store the next day and bought myself a pill organizer that holds all your meds for every day of the week. Now I take the correct dose everyday while feeling like an alzheimer’s patient because at the age of 31, I can’t remember to take my meds correctly. Mary

I thought it would be somewhat like this. Overdosing on a TCA is worse…. I think in 31 years I have missed a dose twice…and the *idea* brings on panic with me (with a benzo it’s different, I notice that very soon and that’s not just psychological). Many  people need pill organizers or a similar system. We may well all  have Alzheimer’s at ASAP, if that would be the criterion ) Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Well, I have been here and lurking…I try to respond privately when I feel I can help…To be honest, the only reason I haven’t been responding on the newsgroup is because I found deja.com…When I discovered all my messages, I felt my privacy was invaded a bit much…Anyway, I now have a question that needs the newsgroup and can’t be dealt with privately, so here it is… Hi Chuck, I’m sorry I can’t be of much help with Zoloft but I do have a solution for this problem.  There are 2 options. If your reader allows it (Agent does) you can have the line "x-no-archive: yes" (without quotes) added to your header. If you can’t find out how to do this, the other option is to make that same line (x-no-archive: yes) the *very first* line of your post.  I took some sleeping meds last night, and this morning I woke up late and don’t recall if I took my Zoloft in the morning (as I usually do)…I fear I have missed it…I have been doing excellent on Zoloft Ok now, you are not sure, you *fear* you’ve forgotten. I would say, don’t try to catch up the dose. AFAIK, it’s not good to ever try to catch up a forgotten AD dose. Just lleave it for what it is and take your regular dose tomorrow morning. I doubt you’ll have a major setback, maybe you’ll be a little uncomfortable but that’s all I would expect. I’ve forgotten my paxil dose several times but it never caused any problems for me. Bye! Inky (^_-)

Response:

Chuck, I’m one day late on this question, but I’ll give you some advice for the future. Keep a record of whenever you take meds. I have a calender next to my pill bottles and indicate whenever I have taken a med. I started doing this because sometimes I forget what I’ve taken, especially if it’s first thing in the morning and I’m still half asleep. I do lots of crazy stuff in the morning, like making coffee without adding the water. Or putting my shirt on backwards. Or missing the toilet when I pee. In fact, sometimes I sit down to pee. (that way there’s a better chance of hitting the target) One lady at ASAP said she didn’t know why her husband sat down in the AM to pee. She thought he was doing strange things. I didn’t say anything at the time, to keep her in suspence I suppose, or maybe just to keep her on her toes. Chip p.s. missing one day of Zoloft won’t hurt. To all –

Question:

First, you should never ever stop taking your meds "cold turkey"  You must be weened off by your doc. I quit taking zoloft after I was in remission and then I started on a downward spiral. I’m back on thank God. I don’t know how long you took them , but it can take up to several months to feel an effect. Regardless, if it is not working, your doc can help you switch to something else. Lia

Response:

I had no side effects with Dothiepin except cotton-mouth. My friend was on mega-doses of Doxepin as well with no major side effects except for yours but he was able to counter it with a fibre supplement. The *tryptyline drugs are some of the older tricyclics, maybe a newer one would work without the problems. Still, getting a doctor to prescibe it can be an issue. I argued with mine about it but she seems sold on the SSRI’s. The point is moot now as I haven’t had anything for months. Regards, Trevor Ida Kern <clooney…@mindspring.com

wrote in message

news:7if9pn$jv4$1@nntp4.atl.mindspring.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Trevor Lampre <tlam…@camtech.net.au

wrote in message

> > I liked good old Dothiepin for depression but it’s no longer part > > of the in-crowd as it is a tricyclic not an SSRI. I’ve not seen tricyclics

mentioned much in terms of OCD. Me neither. However, one of the best drugs I have ever taken has been Pamelor (Nortriptyline), which is a tricylic. I slept well and ate well and did

not

obsess. Unfortunately, it’s major side effect was that it prevented me from taking

a

healthy constitutional! I tried everything I could think of to stay on

this

medicine but the side effects overwhelmed me and I had to switch to a

SSRI.

They help, but I loved the Pamelor. Ida

Response:

Trevor Lampre <tlam…@camtech.net.au

wrote in message I liked good old Dothiepin for depression but it’s no longer part of the in-crowd as it is a tricyclic not an SSRI. I’ve not seen tricyclics mentioned much in terms of OCD.

Me neither. However, one of the best drugs I have ever taken has been Pamelor (Nortriptyline), which is a tricylic. I slept well and ate well and did not obsess. Unfortunately, it’s major side effect was that it prevented me from taking a healthy constitutional! I tried everything I could think of to stay on this medicine but the side effects overwhelmed me and I had to switch to a SSRI. They help, but I loved the Pamelor. Ida

Response:

hugs wrapped in a hug: ( kbeth (kb…@asan.com) wrote:

: *HUGS* : -kbeth    ) : On Tue, 25 May 1999 01:34:47 GMT, jl…@gte.com wrote: :

:

Well, I quit taking Zoloft last week because I don’t feel like it’s

:

helping me that much (been wondering if I need a different SSRI). I

:

know it takes awhile for it to get out of the system, but I’ve been

:

totally nuts ever since. I quit seeing my therapist about 6 weeks ago,

:

too — I just did not like her at all (she didn’t "care", IMO). I

:

really, really need to find a good therapist — this past weekend had

:

some very, very dark moments.  I feel very depressed for some

:

reason (as opposed to being anxious — which I still am, but the

:

depression seems more overwhelming these days).

:

:

My husband talked me into starting back on the Zoloft today (after I

:

*begged* him this morning not to go to work today (( ).

:

:

Just venting I guess — I know there’s nothing anyone can do.

:

:

Lisa

— —————————————————— some people say I got no patience. I got lots of patience. I can wait all day for someone else to Brew the Coffee….

Response:

In article <374a0b6…@news.camtech.net.au

, "Trevor Lampre"

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<tlam…@camtech.net.au

wrote: Zoloft is an antidepressant so in stopping taking it you have exposed yourself to a downhill slide. The Zoloft might not have been helping with the OCD but it probably was helping the depression. The SSRI’s are strange drugs. They are very selective in how they affect different people, what works for one may not work for another. I confounded my GP with my complaints about the side effects of Zoloft, Luvox and Serzone. I liked good old Dothiepin for depression but it’s no longer part of the in-crowd as it is a tricyclic not an SSRI. I’ve not seen tricyclics mentioned much in terms of OCD. Interactions with doctors are just as problematic. Having a sense of trust and rapport with your therapist is important. I had seen two counselors over the years before my current one. They were as thick as two short planks and I didn’t see them for long. You are quite right to stop seeing one you don’t get on with but please make an effort to find a new one. Don’t cut off your nose to spite your face. If the Zoloft wasn’t worsening your OCD but did help with the depression I’d say to stay on it until you get new medical advice. Go and see a GP (or whoever does this sort of thing where you are) and discuss a change of med. If you still had anxiety you might want to add an anxiolytic such as Xanax to the Zoloft mix or perhaps switch to Luvox but discuss it with a doctor first. Switching meds can be hard. You normally have to wait a week or two depending on your dosage levels to get the old drug out of your system before starting a new one and then it takes a couple of weeks for the new one to have an effect. Regards, Trevor <jl…@gte.com wrote in message news:374bfc28.2519205@news.gte.net… Well, I quit taking Zoloft last week because I don’t feel like it’s helping me that much (been wondering if I need a different SSRI). I know it takes awhile for it to get out of the system, but I’ve been totally nuts ever since. I quit seeing my therapist about 6 weeks ago, too — I just did not like her at all (she didn’t "care", IMO). I really, really need to find a good therapist — this past weekend had some very, very dark moments.  I feel very depressed for some reason (as opposed to being anxious — which I still am, but the depression seems more overwhelming these days). My husband talked me into starting back on the Zoloft today (after I *begged* him this morning not to go to work today (( ). Just venting I guess — I know there’s nothing anyone can do. Lisa

Additionally, it is said that it takes 2-3 months on the SSRI’s to see OCD relief…I don’t know how long you’ve been on it, but it may pay to stay on if the side effects are not bad, as it is helping your depression now and could very well help your OCD later… — Charles Phipps cphi…@roadhog.com

Response:

Hi it doesn’t sound like a too good idea to me to AND quit the therapist AND the meds at the same time. I have no idea how long you’d been on the Zoloft but it takes long time for SSRI’s to be efficient on OCD symptoms, most people mention at least 10 weeks on the proper dosage… Also it might not be the proper SSRI, it took me three trials before actually finding something (Luvox) that seem to be working. I know how very difficult it all is. If you have OCD you should get in touch with the OCD Foundation (they have a Web site with all kind of infos on how to reach them etc…) and ask them for the adress of a trained CBT therapist near you. I don’t know what your symptms are but talk therapy doesn’t do much for OCD. I have been in talk therapy for over 2 years, even though it has given me some insight on some other problems, it didn’t help at all the OCD. Hang in there, it’s tough but you can get better, Cecile – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<jl…@gte.com

wrote in message news:374bfc28.2519205@news.gte.net… Well, I quit taking Zoloft last week because I don’t feel like it’s helping me that much (been wondering if I need a different SSRI). I know it takes awhile for it to get out of the system, but I’ve been totally nuts ever since. I quit seeing my therapist about 6 weeks ago, too — I just did not like her at all (she didn’t "care", IMO). I really, really need to find a good therapist — this past weekend had some very, very dark moments.  I feel very depressed for some reason (as opposed to being anxious — which I still am, but the depression seems more overwhelming these days). My husband talked me into starting back on the Zoloft today (after I *begged* him this morning not to go to work today (( ). Just venting I guess — I know there’s nothing anyone can do. Lisa

Response:

Hi Lisa From my personnal experience I know that it takes about 10 weeks for the medication to start working and I know that it seems like forever. Hang in there.  Yes I think that it is very important to find a good therepist.  Make sure they deal with ocd.  Don’t give up because of one person I know there is someone who can help you.  It helped me to chat in support groups and talk to others dealing with the same problems.  You will feel better!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and when you do, you will get so much more joy out of life than ever before! Take Care

Response:

Zoloft is an antidepressant so in stopping taking it you have exposed yourself to a downhill slide. The Zoloft might not have been helping with the OCD but it probably was helping the depression. The SSRI’s are strange drugs. They are very selective in how they affect different people, what works for one may not work for another. I confounded my GP with my complaints about the side effects of Zoloft, Luvox and Serzone. I liked good old Dothiepin for depression but it’s no longer part of the in-crowd as it is a tricyclic not an SSRI. I’ve not seen tricyclics mentioned much in terms of OCD. Interactions with doctors are just as problematic. Having a sense of trust and rapport with your therapist is important. I had seen two counselors over the years before my current one. They were as thick as two short planks and I didn’t see them for long. You are quite right to stop seeing one you don’t get on with but please make an effort to find a new one. Don’t cut off your nose to spite your face. If the Zoloft wasn’t worsening your OCD but did help with the depression I’d say to stay on it until you get new medical advice. Go and see a GP (or whoever does this sort of thing where you are) and discuss a change of med. If you still had anxiety you might want to add an anxiolytic such as Xanax to the Zoloft mix or perhaps switch to Luvox but discuss it with a doctor first. Switching meds can be hard. You normally have to wait a week or two depending on your dosage levels to get the old drug out of your system before starting a new one and then it takes a couple of weeks for the new one to have an effect. Regards, Trevor – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<jl…@gte.com

wrote in message news:374bfc28.2519205@news.gte.net… Well, I quit taking Zoloft last week because I don’t feel like it’s helping me that much (been wondering if I need a different SSRI). I know it takes awhile for it to get out of the system, but I’ve been totally nuts ever since. I quit seeing my therapist about 6 weeks ago, too — I just did not like her at all (she didn’t "care", IMO). I really, really need to find a good therapist — this past weekend had some very, very dark moments.  I feel very depressed for some reason (as opposed to being anxious — which I still am, but the depression seems more overwhelming these days). My husband talked me into starting back on the Zoloft today (after I *begged* him this morning not to go to work today (( ). Just venting I guess — I know there’s nothing anyone can do. Lisa

Response:

*HUGS* -kbeth – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -On Tue, 25 May 1999 01:34:47 GMT, jl…@gte.com wrote:

Well, I quit taking Zoloft last week because I don’t feel like it’s helping me that much (been wondering if I need a different SSRI). I know it takes awhile for it to get out of the system, but I’ve been totally nuts ever since. I quit seeing my therapist about 6 weeks ago, too — I just did not like her at all (she didn’t "care", IMO). I really, really need to find a good therapist — this past weekend had some very, very dark moments.  I feel very depressed for some reason (as opposed to being anxious — which I still am, but the depression seems more overwhelming these days). My husband talked me into starting back on the Zoloft today (after I *begged* him this morning not to go to work today (( ). Just venting I guess — I know there’s nothing anyone can do. Lisa

Response:

Question:

what your experiencing are panic attacks, i get them quite often.  i take st. johns wart to help me relax.  jamie

Response:

Hi! My name is Tracy and I had my first anxiety attack a few months ago.  I woke up and felt I was having a heart attack: fast heart beat, sweating, numbness in my right arm, so bad I had to keep it elevated (thinking is would help the circulation.  I even went as far as dialing 911 just in case I dropped dead – I figured it would be the last thing I would hit….thinking it was the end.  Well when I woke up the next morning, happy to be alive, I played with fate, was a lucky person. and really believed I fought a heart was on my way home when those "heart attack symptons" reoccured, only in my mind I played with fate once before  and new something was seriously  wrong even thought as far as of going to the hospital, but figured it would pass by to go….where she asked.  and me a person who hates going to the dr. insisted we go to the hospital immediately.  Of coarse getting everyone panicked, we were off to  the hospital which was fifteen minutes away.  I didn’t think i was going to make it.  We arrived at the Hospital and they admitted me immediately and ran an ekg, and took blood, even a cardiologist came and took blood.  While waiting for my results the doctor thought that I was just having an axiety attack (yeah right I thought)  he later confirmed that it was indeed a axiety attack and that I was hyperventilating.  (i disagreed – I did not think I was breathing out of control – I know what hyperventilating is) My carbon dioxide level and oxygen levels were high and low wich gives you that dizzy feeling. The worse that could of happened was that I passed out. He gave me a prescription and that was it – that was about 5 months ago.  3.  I just had my third axiety attack while out was friends on Saturday….once again happy to be alive and still wonder if my doctor is correct – am I really having axiety attacks or am I having heart problems and because I’m only 31 he won’t pursue more detailed testing.  I don’t want to die –  And I know I’m not crazy.  I am glad to know i’m not the only one who gets these attacks. I felt better only when I read other people’s experiences.  So many friends don’t understand what it feels like, so to read someone else’s experience makes me feel not reality this is really really short.

Response:

Hi Tracy, welcome to our NG!! You are definitely not alone, everyone here is battling against an anxiety disorder of some sort. I myself experienced symptoms which mirror those you have described. I thought I had some sort of heart dysfunction or defect that was going to kill me at any instant. I woke up in the night with it, delt with it in social situations and when I was alone…it really was terrifying. After a complete physical and cardiac examination (by the head of the cardiology dept. in the largest hospital in my province) nothing could be found…I was only 21 yrs old. Well, three years later here I am, alive!!! The only thing is that I am trying to live with Panic Disorder!!! My medication allows me to live a fairly normal life, despite the occasional unexplained anxiety, which I guess is normal. Good luck to you and try to participate in the group I have found it very beneficial!!! all the best jason – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi! My name is Tracy and I had my first anxiety attack a few months ago.  I woke up and felt I was having a heart attack: fast heart beat, sweating, numbness in my right arm, so bad I had to keep it elevated (thinking is would help the circulation.  I even went as far as dialing 911 just in case I dropped dead – I figured it would be the last thing I would hit….thinking it was the end.  Well when I woke up the next morning, happy to be alive, I played with fate, was a lucky person. and really believed I fought a heart was on my way home when those "heart attack symptons" reoccured, only in my mind I played with fate once before  and new something was seriously  wrong even thought as far as of going to the hospital, but figured it would pass by to go….where she asked.  and me a person who hates going to the dr. insisted we go to the hospital immediately.  Of coarse getting everyone panicked, we were off to  the hospital which was fifteen minutes away.  I didn’t think i was going to make it.  We arrived at the Hospital and they admitted me immediately and ran an ekg, and took blood, even a cardiologist came and took blood.  While waiting for my results the doctor thought that I was just having an axiety attack (yeah right I thought)  he later confirmed that it was indeed a axiety attack and that I was hyperventilating.  (i disagreed – I did not think I was breathing out of control – I know what hyperventilating is) My carbon dioxide level and oxygen levels were high and low wich gives you that dizzy feeling. The worse that could of happened was that I passed out. He gave me a prescription and that was it – that was about 5 months ago.  3.  I just had my third axiety attack while out was friends on Saturday….once again happy to be alive and still wonder if my doctor is correct – am I really having axiety attacks or am I having heart problems and because I’m only 31 he won’t pursue more detailed testing.  I don’t want to die –  And I know I’m not crazy.  I am glad to know i’m not the only one who gets these attacks. I felt better only when I read other people’s experiences.  So many friends don’t understand what it feels like, so to read someone else’s experience makes me feel not reality this is really really short.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi! My name is Tracy and I had my first anxiety attack a few months ago.  I woke up and felt I was having a heart attack: fast heart beat, sweating, numbness in my right arm, so bad I had to keep it elevated (thinking is would help the circulation.  I even went as far as dialing 911 just in case I dropped dead – I figured it would be the last thing I would hit….thinking it was the end.  Well when I woke up the next morning, happy to be alive, I played with fate, was a lucky person. and really believed I fought a heart was on my way home when those "heart attack symptons" reoccured, only in my mind I played with fate once before  and new something was seriously  wrong even thought as far as of going to the hospital, but figured it would pass by to go….where she asked.  and me a person who hates going to the dr. insisted we go to the hospital immediately.  Of coarse getting everyone panicked, we were off to  the hospital which was fifteen minutes away.  I didn’t think i was going to make it.  We arrived at the Hospital and they admitted me immediately and ran an ekg, and took blood, even a cardiologist came and took blood.  While waiting for my results the doctor thought that I was just having an axiety attack (yeah right I thought)  he later confirmed that it was indeed a axiety attack and that I was hyperventilating.  (i disagreed – I did not think I was breathing out of control – I know what hyperventilating is) My carbon dioxide level and oxygen levels were high and low wich gives you that dizzy feeling. The worse that could of happened was that I passed out. He gave me a prescription and that was it – that was about 5 months ago.  3.  I just had my third axiety attack while out was friends on Saturday….once again happy to be alive and still wonder if my doctor is correct – am I really having axiety attacks or am I having heart problems and because I’m only 31 he won’t pursue more detailed testing.  I don’t want to die –  And I know I’m not crazy.  I am glad to know i’m not the only one who gets these attacks. I felt better only when I read other people’s experiences.  So many friends don’t understand what it feels like, so to read someone else’s experience makes me feel not reality this is really really short.

What you desecribe is the classic beginning of Panic Disorder. Yes, you have panic attacks. The thing to do is see a psychiatrist who is specialized in anxiety disorders (is there a university clinic in your area? often a good bet), get properly diagnosed and prescribed some meds. I’m sorry to welcome you to ASAP, the club nobody wants to belong to but everybody is glad exists ) Philip

Response:

Hi.  I am also a new comer to this group.  Let me tell you a little about what I have gone through.  After my daughter (I was 25 ) was born 23 years ago I started to feel the same way you did, losing my breath, feeling very weird like I was losing my mind and completely out of contro.  So I also went to the doctor and he told me I was having a panic attack and maybe I needed to take some time off work.  I did but the panic attacks were still happening.  I got to a point where I didn’t want to go anywhere (and that is  not me I love to go out and have fun).  So after going to the doctor a million times and to the emergency room because I thought I was having a heart attack or I had some other life threatening disease, I finally read some books and told myself I tired of this and I want it to stop.  So with the help of medication called Tranxene and a lot of hard work on my part I finally felt better.  It took me a long time.  Now 20 years later my attacks have come back. (I’m trying to keep this short) I think the reason is this.  A year and half ago my husband at 46 suffered a massive heart attack.  He is doing fine, but it was the worst thing I have ever gone through.  I held up pretty well until 6 months later.  I started driving to work, my hands and feet got clammy I started to get that weird feeling of losing control and burst into tears.  I was so scared to drive.  I finally called my boss and had him drive me to the doctor.  It was the same thing panic attack!!  He put me on Tranxene (I am not a very good pill taker).  I have been on it since last May.  I stopped taking it about 2 weeks ago and just 3 days ago I started those feelings.  So I am going to take it regularly and get myself back on track.  I have been to a shrink and I got nothing out of it.  I have found that having someone to talk to and keeping myself busy helps.  The problem with me is I worry about everyone and think I can fix the world.  I have been where you are  and I know you will be ok.  It’s just so frightening.  I hope I have helped you in some way and if you every want to talk more e-mail me.  Nothing like this was every available when I first started my panic attacks and being able to talk to someone and knowing they have felt the same way you have does help.  I wish you the best and do know you are ok.  I have to remember to think positive.. Take care…

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi I’m a new comer to this group & was wondering if I could get some explanation as to what a panic attack is. I guess I can start off by saying what I have experienced & go from there. I’ll try to keep it short. About a year ago while driving to work (at night, I work midnights) I started losing my breath, feeling very wierd, my arms were going numb, thoughts of wanting to kill myself (which is definately not me!!) i thought i was having a heart attack (I’m 39 now) I made it to work but was to shakey i couldnt cope, went home but was just dazed & confused. I went to my doctor & she said i had a panic attack. I had one similar several days afterwards but wasnt as bad and i tried hard to control myself, after all both times I was driving!! So that was it, back to the doctor & have been on 50mg of Zoloft since. Now I was supposed to start weening off the zoloft this month & what happens, I have one of these attacks at work. So now i’m still on it. I am going to go see a shrink I guess, i dont want it to get worse, I’m getting to the point where I am almost scared of driving & going to work. I feel very strongly that it is my midnight shift that is doing this to me, because I cant think of anything else that it could be. Is there anyone else out there that works nights that is going through this?? The zoloft is good though & i have been very reassured that it is a safe drug to stay on for many years if needed, but i would like to get off it. If anyone has taken the time to read my long storey get back to me with your storey or thoughts I would appreciate it. Thanks & think positive!!!

Hi Frank, Welcome to ASAP! A panic attack can be a very  individual thing. Your attack does sound like a Panic attack. Mine are different, I get very hot, flushed, dizzy, off-balance, shaky, can`t concentrate and tingling sensations in my fingers. I think I either am going to die or go crazy. I think you should see a Pdoc, one that is knowledgeable in anxiety disorders. CBT therapy is a very good compliment with medication. You might want to give serious thought to increasing your Zoloft dose. You are on a very low therapeutic dose, and you are experiencing alot of discomfort still. You might want to get a script for a benzo to be used on a "as needed" basis. Doing CBT, increasing your Zoloft and getting a benzo, could really get you back on your feet again. Yes, you can stay on Zoloft for a long time. About getting off meds, first you need to get better and be better for awhile, before you think of getting off meds. Some of us need meds for the rest of our lives, others need it on and off, depending on setbacks and remissions, and then there are some that are on meds for awhile, get off the meds, and never need them again. Unfortunately, you won`t know, until you go off I am not sure that the night shift "caused" your anxiety, although it could be a contributing factor. I use to work the graveyard shift in a nursing home, and I didn`t like the way it made me feel. It wasn`t anxiety, I just felt off. After a few months I begged to get off that shift, and I felt much better. If you can, change your hours, maybe a note from your doctor could help with that. Take Care and good luck!! Jackie

Response:

Hi I’m a new comer to this group & was wondering if I could get some explanation as to what a panic attack is. I guess I can start off by saying what I have experienced & go from there. I’ll try to keep it short. About a year ago while driving to work (at night, I work midnights) I started losing my breath, feeling very wierd, my arms were going numb, thoughts of wanting to kill myself (which is definately not me!!) i thought i was having a heart attack (I’m 39 now) I made it to work but was to shakey i couldnt cope, went home but was just dazed & confused. I went to my doctor & she said i had a panic attack. I had one similar several days afterwards but wasnt as bad and i tried hard to control myself, after all both times I was driving!! So that was it, back to the doctor & have been on 50mg of Zoloft since. Now I was supposed to start weening off the zoloft this month & what happens, I have one of these attacks at work. So now i’m still on it. I am going to go see a shrink I guess, i dont want it to get worse, I’m getting to the point where I am almost scared of driving & going to work. I feel very strongly that it is my midnight shift that is doing this to me, because I cant think of anything else that it could be. Is there anyone else out there that works nights that is going through this?? The zoloft is good though & i have been very reassured that it is a safe drug to stay on for many years if needed, but i would like to get off it. If anyone has taken the time to read my long storey get back to me with your storey or thoughts I would appreciate it. Thanks & think positive!!!

Response:

Frank, My first anxiety attack was about 5 1/2 years ago while I was driving. Like you I thought I was having a heart attack.  I didn’t want to kill myself but was sure I must be dying.  I had a lot of stresses in my life at that time so once I realized that it was anxiety attacks I was having  I did go to a therapist. I also take Zoloft.  I started at 50 mg but have decreased it to 25 mg.  I have tried to wean off it several times and each time I have a panic attack.  I don’t like taking meds all the time but I believe it is better than going through the feelings of panic and constant anxiety. So who knows how long I will take this stuff.  I feel pretty good when I am on it. I do have times when I don’t feel as well but everyone has good and bad days whether or not they have PA’s. Do you have any particular stressful things going on in your life?  Or did you when the panic attacks started?  It might be a good idea to find a pdoc who specializes in anxiety who can help you to recognize possible triggers. The one thing about panic attacks is that they seem to strike "out of the blue" and that is the most frustrating part about them.  Because you don’t know when you’ll have one you sometimes start to avoid situations where you had one before. (Like driving, grocery shopping, eating in a restaurant)  It is a vicious (sp?) circle but you know what? You are NOT ALONE.  And you will get through them. Good luck and keep us posted. Nori — Posted via Talkway – http://www.talkway.com Exchange ideas on practically anything ™.

Response:

The zoloft is good though & i have been very reassured that it is a safe drug to stay on for many years if needed, but i would like to get off it.

Frank, Is medication the only way you are managing? Not that I am knocking it! I am using three different meds, myself. But I am also doing something that I did not do the last time I was in remission from panic. I am now making the effort to learn Cognitive Behavioral techniques. A few years ago, the med of my dreams rid me of Panic, General Anxiety and Agoraphobia for just over a year. But it did not last, I started having breakthrough attacks and didn’t have the skills that I have since gained in controlling the symptoms. Changing my thoughts, correcting my breathing, muscular relaxation and slowing my heart beat are things I have become pretty good at, but not perfect. And there are many more symptoms that I must work with. I would just like to suggest that you get yourself some long lasting coping skills before going off of your med. Cognitive Behavioral Therapy has worked for so many. Some without any meds. But I believe combining the two is very powerful. My two cents and wishing you well, Kathryn

Response:

Hi Frank, The following a criteria for panic attacks recently distributed in a brochure to Australian GPs A discrete period of intense fear or discomfort, in which four (or more) of the following symptoms developed abruptly and reached a peak within 10 minutes:     palpitations, pounding heart, or accelerated heart rate     sweating     trembling or shaking     sensations of shortness of breath or smothering     feeling of choking     chest pain or discomfort     nausea or abdominal distress     feeling dizzy, unsteady, lightheaded, or faint     feelings of unreality or being detached from oneself     feelings of losing control or going crazy     fear of dying     paraesthesia (numbness or tingling sensation)     chills or hot flushes I reckon I have experienced each and every one of these! Given that your symptoms are recurring I suggest that you discuss your medication, dosage, with your doctor. It doesn’t sound like a good time to wean off. I am also experiencing a recurrence of some symptoms, in particular situations, so my medication is being reviewed. I guess where lucky that our conditions are treatable. Take care, Meryl

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi I’m a new comer to this group & was wondering if I could get some explanation as to what a panic attack is. I guess I can start off by saying what I have experienced & go from there. I’ll try to keep it short. About a year ago while driving to work (at night, I work midnights) I started losing my breath, feeling very wierd, my arms were going numb, thoughts of wanting to kill myself (which is definately not me!!) i thought i was having a heart attack (I’m 39 now) I made it to work but was to shakey i couldnt cope, went home but was just dazed & confused. I went to my doctor & she said i had a panic attack. I had one similar several days afterwards but wasnt as bad and i tried hard to control myself, after all both times I was driving!! So that was it, back to the doctor & have been on 50mg of Zoloft since. Now I was supposed to start weening off the zoloft this month & what happens, I have one of these attacks at work. So now i’m still on it. I am going to go see a shrink I guess, i dont want it to get worse, I’m getting to the point where I am almost scared of driving & going to work. I feel very strongly that it is my midnight shift that is doing this to me, because I cant think of anything else that it could be. Is there anyone else out there that works nights that is going through this?? The zoloft is good though & i have been very reassured that it is a safe drug to stay on for many years if needed, but i would like to get off it. If anyone has taken the time to read my long storey get back to me with your storey or thoughts I would appreciate it. Thanks & think positive!!!

Response: