Question:

eBay announcement today:   Hi everyone, I’m Julian Green, the new Director   of ProStores, and I

Question:

I must say that I did not find Simple Green very good as a degreaser.  I sprayed it full strength on the chain rings and several areas of the frame with no luck at cutting the grease even after vigorous rubbing.  I even let it sit for a while.  I went back to the citrus degreaser which works great. Mark

I find Simple Green ($7 for a whole gallon at Sam’s Club — and you can dilute it and use it as a general household cleanser) works great in my Vetta Chain Cleaner, but really is not that effective on heavy degreasing jobs, such as cleaning headset bearings in races.  Still, it’s a relative bargain compared to many bicycle-specific products. Ron

Response:

: Does anyone have some experience which cheap degreasers, which do not : include the mtb premium price, i.e. are not primarily made for cycling use. : Try WD40, works great for me. Try Turpentine (Synthetic sort) Costs about

Question:

I am using Azmacort and Serevent regularly and Maxair occasionally.  I have recently developed twitches in my eyelids that are quite annoying.  I have also been having headaches.   Does anyone know whether these are side effects of any of these prescriptions?  The pharmacist and physician both say "no." I don’t care if your name IS Erle Stanley, get your rake out of my petunias!

     I get similar symptoms when I have a sinus infection Patricia

Response:

Drugs such as serevent and maxair (beta agonists) can cause muscle twitching.  I have had several patients that had to stop the use of serevent due to severe tremors.  Do not stop your medication with out talking to your physician.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am using Azmacort and Serevent regularly and Maxair occasionally.  I have recently developed twitches in my eyelids that are quite annoying.  I have also been having headaches.   Does anyone know whether these are side effects of any of these prescriptions?  The pharmacist and physician both say "no." I don’t care if your name IS Erle Stanley, get your rake out of my petunias!     I get similar symptoms when I have a sinus infection Patricia

I just started getting eyelid twitches and am on the same meds. and here my husband thought I was winking at him!!!! Seriously, does anyone else have the same problems??? Peace, Tish are the thoughts,you have hidden in your heart…….

Response:

I am using Azmacort and Serevent regularly and Maxair occasionally.  I have recently developed twitches in my eyelids that are quite annoying.  I have also been having headaches.   Does anyone know whether these are side effects of any of these prescriptions?  The pharmacist and physician both say "no."

Take magnesium supplements for the twitches. Say 400 mg. Take before bedtime and it also will help you sleep sounder (helps the natural melatonin work). For the headaches try a gluten-free or corn-free diet. Don.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am using Azmacort and Serevent regularly and Maxair occasionally.  I have recently developed twitches in my eyelids that are quite annoying.  I have also been having headaches.   Does anyone know whether these are side effects of any of these prescriptions?  The pharmacist and physician both say "no." Any bronchodilator can cause twitching of any nerves, that have a tendancy to twitch. I have a familiar tremor in my hands. When I take alot of ventolin (and in the old days theophyline), my tremors would start up. These were the times one or both of my eyelids would twitch like crazy. —

Have you tried taking minerals, especially potassium?  I’ve found them to be helpful.

Response:

I am using Azmacort and Serevent regularly and Maxair occasionally.  I have recently developed twitches in my eyelids that are quite annoying.  I have also been having headaches.   Does anyone know whether these are side effects of any of these prescriptions?  The pharmacist and physician both say "no." I don’t care if your name IS Erle Stanley, get your rake out of my petunias!

Response:

I am using Azmacort and Serevent regularly and Maxair occasionally.  I have recently developed twitches in my eyelids that are quite annoying.  I have also been having headaches.   Does anyone know whether these are side effects of any of these prescriptions?  The pharmacist and physician both say "no."

Any bronchodilator can cause twitching of any nerves, that have a tendancy to twitch. I have a familiar tremor in my hands. When I take alot of ventolin (and in the old days theophyline), my tremors would start up. These were the times one or both of my eyelids would twitch like crazy. —

Response:

: I am using Azmacort and Serevent regularly and Maxair occasionally.  I : have recently developed twitches in my eyelids that are quite : annoying.  I have also been having headaches.   Does anyone know : whether these are side effects of any of these prescriptions?  The : pharmacist and physician both say "no." I don’t take the precise same medications you do (I’m on Pulmicort and Bricanyl), but although the corticorsteroid (Pulmicort) doesn’t have any recognizable side-effects other than those caused by the turbuhaler, the Bricanyl bronchodilator causes a noticeable hand tremblor and a few twitches that sound similar to yours.  Especially for the first hour or two after I have to hit the bronchodilator. : I don’t care if your name IS Erle Stanley, : get your rake out of my petunias! — Murray Stone, Barrister & Solicitor phone:  (403) 486-5146  fax:  (403) 483-7791 snailmail:  616-21, 10405 Jasper Avenue Edmonton, AB, T5J 3S2 Canada

Response:

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am 33 year old computer programmer.   I was on Paxil for approx 5 years where I was taking in the end 40 mg/ day.  This was not helping with my anxiety symptoms like it had done so in the past.   The fact that I was diagnosed with  Avascular Necorsis (caused my prednisone) and needed a Total Hip Replacement was not adding to my cheer. I went to see my doctor a general practitioner who put me on Short Term Disability while he gave me a wean down schedule for the paxil and then started me on Effexor at 75 mg.  I’ve been on the Effexor for a week and am less then happy with the results. The side affects I have experienced include the following: 1) Dry Eyes 2) Cold Hands and feet 3) At times extremely itchy 4) Ringing in the earsr 5) The most worrisome side affect is the irratablity and anger I feel Today I am supposed to go up to 150 mg and am scheduled to see my doctor next week.  I have read  some real horror stories about this drug and I hope this is not the start of one.

it’s weird that the doc weaned you off paxil before getting you on Effexor, i just cut my Paxil dose in half, and took half a dose of Effexor at the same time for a week, then upped to the full Effexor dose.  i didn’t have any unpleasant side effects when starting, except for mild jitters/anxiety. with this type of med, the side effects usually go away in three to four weeks, so i’d try to wait it out.  as another poster said, you may be suffering from the paxil withdrawal, and your effexor dose might not be high enough to counteract it.  increasing the dose might actually help you. -kelly

Response:

Effexor is an SSRI like Paxil, however it has the capacity to also impact your nor-epinephrine re-uptake as well (this generally, in humans, happens at higher doses, but it’s unpredictable when it will happen, or at what dose amount)  I hated effexor- personally.  However, it may turn out to be a great drug for you.  Some of the side effect stuff is probably related to the lowering of your Paxil dose; you may have to reduce it more slowly. You don’t have to raise the Effexor, nothing bad will happen if you don’t titrate it up at some particular rate, so I’d talk to the doctor first before I did that. Gary

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am 33 year old computer programmer.   I was on Paxil for approx 5 years where I was taking in the end 40 mg/ day.  This was not helping with my anxiety symptoms like it had done so in the past.   The fact that I was diagnosed with  Avascular Necorsis (caused my prednisone) and needed a Total Hip Replacement was not adding to my cheer. I went to see my doctor a general practitioner who put me on Short Term Disability while he gave me a wean down schedule for the paxil and then started me on Effexor at 75 mg.  I’ve been on the Effexor for a week and am less then happy with the results. The side affects I have experienced include the following: 1) Dry Eyes 2) Cold Hands and feet 3) At times extremely itchy 4) Ringing in the earsr 5) The most worrisome side affect is the irratablity and anger I feel Today I am supposed to go up to 150 mg and am scheduled to see my doctor next week.  I have read  some real horror stories about this drug and I hope this is not the start of one. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. THanks in advance,

Response:

I am 33 year old computer programmer.   I was on Paxil for approx 5 years where I was taking in the end 40 mg/ day.  This was not helping with my anxiety symptoms like it had done so in the past.   The fact that I was diagnosed with  Avascular Necorsis (caused my prednisone) and needed a Total Hip Replacement was not adding to my cheer.   I went to see my doctor a general practitioner who put me on Short Term Disability while he gave me a wean down schedule for the paxil and then started me on Effexor at 75 mg.  I’ve been on the Effexor for a week and am less then happy with the results.   The side affects I have experienced include the following: 1) Dry Eyes 2) Cold Hands and feet 3) At times extremely itchy 4) Ringing in the earsr 5) The most worrisome side affect is the irratablity and anger I feel Today I am supposed to go up to 150 mg and am scheduled to see my doctor next week.  I have read  some real horror stories about this drug and I hope this is not the start of one.   Any advice would be greatly appreciated. THanks in advance,

Response:

Question:

Hi, need some quick advise, i took effexor last night, 37.5 mg. I woke up today, in a state of panic, and my pupils were BIG as a watermealon. Is this a normal side effect,and what could i take to counteract this? need advise geno

Response:

Hi, need some quick advise, i took effexor last night, 37.5 mg. I woke up today, in a state of panic, and my pupils were BIG as a watermealon. Is this a normal side effect,and what could i take to counteract this? need advise geno

If I were you, I would, for starters, abstain from anything that contains caffeine or even aspartame.

Response:

geno, big pupils is a normal side effect. no worries ) there’s not much you can do about it. ~*~nwysca~*~ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, need some quick advise, i took effexor last night, 37.5 mg. I woke up today, in a state of panic, and my pupils were BIG as a watermealon. Is this a normal side effect,and what could i take to counteract this? need advise geno If I were you, I would, for starters, abstain from anything that contains caffeine or even aspartame.

Response:

Question:

Amazing.  We switched from DSL to Cable as our internet provider yesterday. I had only seen one reply to my post via DSL, when I logged on using the cable connection, all the rest appeared. Thank you everybody.  For your words of support, and suggestions and for sharing your Serzone experiences.  I dropped my dose down about three days ago from 400mg a day to 300mg.  I have my mind back!  It’s like the fog lifted and I can think again.  I had exceeded a dose that was good for me. That’s all I can assume.  The first couple of days I needed a prn Ativan along toward evening, but didn’t even need that yesterday.  So, I’m feeling hopeful. Again, thank you all so much.  I’m sorry I didn’t respond sooner, but the messages just weren’t there for me to respond to.  Funky DSL. Debbie

Response:

Debbie: My DR put me on Serzone about a month ago (and took me off of it).  I, too, had memory problems (short-term memory), disorientation and confusion.  It was like walking through a thick fog all the time. I can’t offer you the "hang in there" you need, because Serzone didn’t work with me.  All I can offer is the "wait and see" approach or start the med "roulette."  When Prozac quit working for me after 10 years, I, too, was terrified about starting a new med. My first SSRI was Paxil (I was severly depressed at the time) and all I did was sleep .. not a good thing when I really needed to get out of the house and work.  Prozac worked just dandy for me, then in January, I noticed more and more PAs. I rode the Serzone roller coaster (each time the starter kit upped the dose, I got worse, lots of crying, light-headedness, forgetfulness) until I couldn’t even teach, grade, sleep …  The DR switched my to Zoloft, it’s working OK right now, but I’m still wary. The Zoloft dose increases in two days …. who knows what it will do … Do you have a good doctor?  One who listens?  So far, I have a standing appointment with my DR every 2 weeks to see how the new meds are working (always with the option to get in before the 2 week appt). I don’t think I’ve helped you at all, but I hope my experience …. I don’t know … gives you some idea of a path to follow (not that I have a path … ) Let me know how it goes. schel – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, I’ve been a frequent lurker to your group for over five years.  I’ve gained much understand about my Panic Disorder and wealth of information – for which I am very grateful to all of you. I’ve struggled with my PD for six years.  Fought the beast alone for three years with just PRN Xanax, then three years ago, I began daily medication to combat it.  Serzone 150mg BID.  It literally gave me my life back and the full blown PA’s actually stopped for several years.  Last year we increased my PM dose to 200mg due to increased generalized anxiety.  Three weeks ago, PD returned with a vengeance.  I literally ran sobbing from a dinner theater.  The first major, rock your world PA in almost three years.  I went to the doc because I didn’t recover from this easily.  I was tearful and anxious for several days following.  At my insistence, the dose was increased to 200mg BID.  In addition I have always taken 1mg Ativan at night, with the script written for PRN in addition. It’s been over two weeks now – I just can’t seem to get adjusted to this increase.  I am just exhausted all the time and feel so spaced out and air-headed, not to mention it hasn’t done a thing for my overall anxiety. It is the short term memory loss that really has me bothered.  I have felt this as a nagging concern for well over a year now. That I just couldn’t remember things from one minute to the next.  This med increase just brought it screaming to the front of mind because it is even so much worse right now. I have decided, along with my doc over the phone, to go back to a place where I was successful.  150mg BID with the Ativan at night and PRN. She stresses the need to go ahead and use the Ativan PRN stave off the anxiety. I ramble all of this to begin with, because if feels kind of relieving to share it with others who understand, & to ask:  How serious is this memory loss thing regarding Serzone??  Is it a permanent kind of thing, or just chemically induced when taking the med? The memory issues didn’t get much/any press on the web sites I looked at.  Do you think maybe I just tried to exceed my own therapeutic level when I wanted to increase the med? I would literally be scared to death to try another med.  I think I’m in the running for the poster child for "med phobics" <grin  I just wonder if others have used this long term for PD and if so, encountered any of these sorts of experiences.  I read backward in DejaNews for posts on the subject. I found a good many post about the various reason why others stopped taking it, but not so much from the folks who continued.  I guess I just need a good "hang in there".  I  feel like I’m at the bottom of the world right now. Thank you so much for taking the time to wade through this. Debbie, who remembers better days, and is struggling with the current ones. — Problems are only opportunities in work clothes.                            –Henry Kaiser

Response:

Liz, Thanks so much for the moral boost.  I’m hoping reducing the dose will at least clear up fog I have seemed to be living in.  I’ll have to see what happens with the anxiety piece.  I always try to think positive, so I hope this is the trick.  I appreciate your note, Debbie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Debbie, Welcome, Debbie.  I am so sorry you are having more anxiety and the meds don’t seem to be working right.  I will leave the med questions to the experts, but just wanted to send you strength and hope. Take care, Liz

Response:

struggled with PD for six years. began Serzone 150mg BID. increased PM dose to 200mg due to increased generalized anxiety. three weeks ago, PD returned with a vengeance. dose increased to 200mg BID. take 1mg Ativan at night, PRN. can’t adjust to increase after two weeks on new dose. exhausted all the time, spaced out and air-headed does nothing for overall anxiety short term memory loss has increased back to successful dose of 150mg BID with the Ativan at night and PRN.

IMHO, this was a really good move on your part. I’m glad your pdoc agreed. How serious is this memory loss thing regarding Serzone??

Depends. My Dx is panic disorder w/o depression.  Been on Serzone continuously since Sep 2000. Experienced short term memory loss and inability to focus on details 1 wk after dose went beyond 150mg BID. Is it a permanent kind of thing, or just chemically induced when taking the med?

Went as high as 200mg BID. Almost all background thought processing ceased. Although ruminating/runaway thoughts often triggered symptoms, my mind became TOO quiet. Very disturbing.  Pdoc and I agreed to back-off to 100mg BID which is where I am now. Mind ‘thawed-out’ a day or two later and thought processing returned mostly to normal except for short-term memory ‘brown-out’ periods every so often. Get breakthru symptoms (but no full-blown attacks) about once every two weeks at this dose. Have Xanax PRN, but haven’t had the need in over a month now. The memory issues didn’t get much/any press on the web sites I looked at.  Do you think maybe I just tried to exceed my own therapeutic level when I wanted to increase the med?

IMHO, yes. But ya never know until you try. Start low and move slow is a good rule of thumb. I found a good many post about the various reason why others stopped taking it, but not so much from the folks who continued.  I guess I just need a good "hang in there".

I only have 6mo experience with Serzone, so can’t speak to long term side effects. My pdoc and I have agreed to stop around June/July 2001 and see what happens. However, if you feel like you can function within acceptible limits on your current regimen, my suggestion is to hang in there…  

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, I’ve been a frequent lurker to your group for over five years.  I’ve gained much understand about my Panic Disorder and wealth of information – for which I am very grateful to all of you. I’ve struggled with my PD for six years.  Fought the beast alone for three years with just PRN Xanax, then three years ago, I began daily medication to combat it.  Serzone 150mg BID.  It literally gave me my life back and the full blown PA’s actually stopped for several years.  Last year we increased my PM dose to 200mg due to increased generalized anxiety.  Three weeks ago, PD returned with a vengeance.  I literally ran sobbing from a dinner theater.  The first major, rock your world PA in almost three years.  I went to the doc because I didn’t recover from this easily.  I was tearful and anxious for several days following.  At my insistence, the dose was increased to 200mg BID.  In addition I have always taken 1mg Ativan at night, with the script written for PRN in addition. It’s been over two weeks now – I just can’t seem to get adjusted to this increase.  I am just exhausted all the time and feel so spaced out and air-headed, not to mention it hasn’t done a thing for my overall anxiety. It is the short term memory loss that really has me bothered.  I have felt this as a nagging concern for well over a year now. That I just couldn’t remember things from one minute to the next.  This med increase just brought it screaming to the front of mind because it is even so much worse right now. I have decided, along with my doc over the phone, to go back to a place where I was successful.  150mg BID with the Ativan at night and PRN.  She stresses the need to go ahead and use the Ativan PRN stave off the anxiety. I ramble all of this to begin with, because if feels kind of relieving to share it with others who understand, & to ask:  How serious is this memory loss thing regarding Serzone??  Is it a permanent kind of thing, or just chemically induced when taking the med? The memory issues didn’t get much/any press on the web sites I looked at.

The memory loss is temporary, and will go away when (or if) you stop the Serzone. All psychoactive substances can impair cognition (ability to concentrate) and memory. Do you think maybe I just tried to exceed my own therapeutic level when I wanted to increase the

med? Your body couldn’t tolerate the increase, and it told you so. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would literally be scared to death to try another med.  I think I’m in the running for the poster child for "med phobics" <grin  I just wonder if others have used this long term for PD and if so, encountered any of these sorts of experiences.  I read backward in DejaNews for posts on the subject. I found a good many post about the various reason why others stopped taking it, but not so much from the folks who continued.  I guess I just need a good "hang in there".  I  feel like I’m at the bottom of the world right now. Thank you so much for taking the time to wade through this. Debbie, who remembers better days, and is struggling with the current ones.

Since an increase in your anxiety level precipitated the increase in Serzone, I think it advisable to treat the anxiety with a benzo, such as Ativan, taken on a regular (not as needed) basis. Chip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Hi Debbie, Welcome, Debbie.  I am so sorry you are having more anxiety and the meds don’t seem to be working right.  I will leave the med questions to the experts, but just wanted to send you strength and hope.   Take care, Liz – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, I’ve been a frequent lurker to your group for over five years.  I’ve gained much understand about my Panic Disorder and wealth of information – for which I am very grateful to all of you. I’ve struggled with my PD for six years.  Fought the beast alone for three years with just PRN Xanax, then three years ago, I began daily medication to combat it.  Serzone 150mg BID.  It literally gave me my life back and the full blown PA’s actually stopped for several years.  Last year we increased my PM dose to 200mg due to increased generalized anxiety.  Three weeks ago, PD returned with a vengeance.  I literally ran sobbing from a dinner theater.  The first major, rock your world PA in almost three years.  I went to the doc because I didn’t recover from this easily.  I was tearful and anxious for several days following.  At my insistence, the dose was increased to 200mg BID.  In addition I have always taken 1mg Ativan at night, with the script written for PRN in addition. It’s been over two weeks now – I just can’t seem to get adjusted to this increase.  I am just exhausted all the time and feel so spaced out and air-headed, not to mention it hasn’t done a thing for my overall anxiety. It is the short term memory loss that really has me bothered.  I have felt this as a nagging concern for well over a year now. That I just couldn’t remember things from one minute to the next.  This med increase just brought it screaming to the front of mind because it is even so much worse right now. I have decided, along with my doc over the phone, to go back to a place where I was successful.  150mg BID with the Ativan at night and PRN.  She stresses the need to go ahead and use the Ativan PRN stave off the anxiety. I ramble all of this to begin with, because if feels kind of relieving to share it with others who understand, & to ask:  How serious is this memory loss thing regarding Serzone??  Is it a permanent kind of thing, or just chemically induced when taking the med? The memory issues didn’t get much/any press on the web sites I looked at.  Do you think maybe I just tried to exceed my own therapeutic level when I wanted to increase the med? I would literally be scared to death to try another med.  I think I’m in the running for the poster child for "med phobics" <grin  I just wonder if others have used this long term for PD and if so, encountered any of these sorts of experiences.  I read backward in DejaNews for posts on the subject. I found a good many post about the various reason why others stopped taking it, but not so much from the folks who continued.  I guess I just need a good "hang in there".  I  feel like I’m at the bottom of the world right now. Thank you so much for taking the time to wade through this. Debbie, who remembers better days, and is struggling with the current ones.

– Problems are only opportunities in work clothes.                            –Henry Kaiser

Response:

Well Debbie I am not a med expert.  I am sorry you are having a rough time right now.  It does feel pretty unfair and makes you angry, doesn’t it, that IT came back!  I have spent a lot of time pondering why IT attacked me for the first time almost a year ago and I have not been the same since.  I can’t tell you about your meds, but I would encourage you to take your doc’s advice about using the Ativan as needed.  Don’t cheat yourself out of the needed calming it can bring you during this rough time. Jeannie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hello, I’ve been a frequent lurker to your group for over five years.  I’ve gained much understand about my Panic Disorder and wealth of information – for which I am very grateful to all of you. I’ve struggled with my PD for six years.  Fought the beast alone for three years with just PRN Xanax, then three years ago, I began daily medication to combat it.  Serzone 150mg BID.  It literally gave me my life back and the full blown PA’s actually stopped for several years.  Last year we increased my PM dose to 200mg due to increased generalized anxiety.  Three weeks ago, PD returned with a vengeance.  I literally ran sobbing from a dinner theater.  The first major, rock your world PA in almost three years.  I went to the doc because I didn’t recover from this easily.  I was tearful and anxious for several days following.  At my insistence, the dose was increased to 200mg BID.  In addition I have always taken 1mg Ativan at night, with the script written for PRN in addition. It’s been over two weeks now – I just can’t seem to get adjusted to this increase.  I am just exhausted all the time and feel so spaced out and air-headed, not to mention it hasn’t done a thing for my overall anxiety. It is the short term memory loss that really has me bothered.  I have felt this as a nagging concern for well over a year now. That I just couldn’t remember things from one minute to the next.  This med increase just brought it screaming to the front of mind because it is even so much worse right now. I have decided, along with my doc over the phone, to go back to a place where I was successful.  150mg BID with the Ativan at night and PRN.  She stresses the need to go ahead and use the Ativan PRN stave off the anxiety. I ramble all of this to begin with, because if feels kind of relieving to share it with others who understand, & to ask:  How serious is this memory loss thing regarding Serzone??  Is it a permanent kind of thing, or just chemically induced when taking the med? The memory issues didn’t get much/any press on the web sites I looked at.  Do you think maybe I just tried to exceed my own therapeutic level when I wanted to increase the med? I would literally be scared to death to try another med.  I think I’m in the running for the poster child for "med phobics" <grin  I just wonder if others have used this long term for PD and if so, encountered any of these sorts of experiences.  I read backward in DejaNews for posts on the subject. I found a good many post about the various reason why others stopped taking it, but not so much from the folks who continued.  I guess I just need a good "hang in there".  I  feel like I’m at the bottom of the world right now. Thank you so much for taking the time to wade through this. Debbie, who remembers better days, and is struggling with the current ones.

Response:

Hello, I’ve been a frequent lurker to your group for over five years.  I’ve gained much understand about my Panic Disorder and wealth of information – for which I am very grateful to all of you. I’ve struggled with my PD for six years.  Fought the beast alone for three years with just PRN Xanax, then three years ago, I began daily medication to combat it.  Serzone 150mg BID.  It literally gave me my life back and the full blown PA’s actually stopped for several years.  Last year we increased my PM dose to 200mg due to increased generalized anxiety.  Three weeks ago, PD returned with a vengeance.  I literally ran sobbing from a dinner theater.  The first major, rock your world PA in almost three years.  I went to the doc because I didn’t recover from this easily.  I was tearful and anxious for several days following.  At my insistence, the dose was increased to 200mg BID.  In addition I have always taken 1mg Ativan at night, with the script written for PRN in addition. It’s been over two weeks now – I just can’t seem to get adjusted to this increase.  I am just exhausted all the time and feel so spaced out and air-headed, not to mention it hasn’t done a thing for my overall anxiety. It is the short term memory loss that really has me bothered.  I have felt this as a nagging concern for well over a year now. That I just couldn’t remember things from one minute to the next.  This med increase just brought it screaming to the front of mind because it is even so much worse right now. I have decided, along with my doc over the phone, to go back to a place where I was successful.  150mg BID with the Ativan at night and PRN.  She stresses the need to go ahead and use the Ativan PRN stave off the anxiety. I ramble all of this to begin with, because if feels kind of relieving to share it with others who understand, & to ask:  How serious is this memory loss thing regarding Serzone??  Is it a permanent kind of thing, or just chemically induced when taking the med? The memory issues didn’t get much/any press on the web sites I looked at.  Do you think maybe I just tried to exceed my own therapeutic level when I wanted to increase the med? I would literally be scared to death to try another med.  I think I’m in the running for the poster child for "med phobics" <grin  I just wonder if others have used this long term for PD and if so, encountered any of these sorts of experiences.  I read backward in DejaNews for posts on the subject. I found a good many post about the various reason why others stopped taking it, but not so much from the folks who continued.  I guess I just need a good "hang in there".  I  feel like I’m at the bottom of the world right now. Thank you so much for taking the time to wade through this. Debbie, who remembers better days, and is struggling with the current ones.

Response:

Question:

Frank can’t help it folks, poor thing.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I can answer these for you (A) What is a chiropractic subluxation? The potential injury caused by unnecessary spinal manipulation. (B) Can you identify one on a radiograph?  If not, what methods do you use to detect them?  How reliable are these methods? Only after a significant trauma.  Spiral CT scan is a very sensitive for delineating the extent of injury. (C) Can a subluxation cause visceral disease (a la Meric chart)? No (D) Can colic be treated chiropractically? No (E) Can a correcting a subluxation help in childhood ear infections? Not really

Response:

Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.

How can you be certain the sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident. If sham manipulation can be so successful then

why go to a chiropractor and pay good money? Why go to college to study this if anybody can

do it? The issue is knowing were and when to adjust. If the chiropractor understands what he is

doing then he must be able to make a sham treatment. If he doesn’t understand what he is doing then

why go to a chiropractor? Chris Noble

A key is whether or not the subject knows if it is a sham adjustment if one wishes to incorporate a placebo study. Before you buy.

Response:

 A sham could have some different effect that would blow the whole thing. Not very hard to understand.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.   How can you be certain the sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident. If sham manipulation can be so successful then why go to a chiropractor and pay good money? Why go to college to study this if anybody can do it? If the chiropractor understands what he is doing then he must be able to make a sham treatment. If he doesn’t understand what he is doing then why go to a chiropractor? Chris Noble

Response:

Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.   How can you be certain the sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident.

If sham manipulation can be so successful then why go to a chiropractor and pay good money? Why go to college to study this if anybody can do it? If the chiropractor understands what he is doing then he must be able to make a sham treatment. If he doesn’t understand what he is doing then why go to a chiropractor? Chris Noble

Response:

    Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.   How can you be certain the    sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident. If sham manipulation can be so successful then why go to a chiropractor and pay good money? Why go to college to study this if anybody can do it?

Chiro’s have developed techniques that work.   Their patients attest to this. Your sham treatment is neither defined or tested If the chiropractor understands what he is doing then he must be able to make a sham treatment.

 But no-one understands everything about any treatment.   He understands what he is doing works and he understands the basic philosophy behind it.   But he cannot guarantee that his approach is the only one that will work and that your sham treatment cannot possibly work. You want to use a sham treatment?   Prove it is ineffective first. If he doesn’t understand what he is doing then why go to a chiropractor?

Because they have developed successful treatments.   People go through it and say ‘It worked for me’ Until valid studies are done that is all we have to go on. You want a study?   Randomly select patients to consult MD’s or Chiro’s. Blindly evaluate the results.   Which group has a better response? If it’s the MD’s, then I’ll be quite happy to go to an MD first, and if that doesn’t work, go to the Chiro. If it’s the Chiro, then vice versa If it’s the same, then I’ll go to the one with the prettiest receptionist first<g Best wishes — John Bain UK TV Sound Director, magnotherapy user & distributor http://members.aol.com/JBainSI/Magnotherapy.html Surround Sound for Television

Response:

John I have to agree with your post and only wished that I was eloquent enough to have written it. — Dr. Roland R. Hicks Doctor of Chiropractic All good things come from above-down-inside-out Natural Alternative to Celebrex/Vioxx: http://drhicks.joint-pain.com/ Internet Marketing to Win: http://www.aboutimw.com/drhicks.html Nutrition Products and Information: http://freelife.com/Sites/drhicks/redir.cfm?page=/info/welcome/welcom… fm toll free (877) 791-8686

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.   How can you be certain the    sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident. Not really.  Because the intent of the sham arm of the intervention is to essentially keep the parents blinded, and mimic the conditions of the experimental intervention MINUS the part being investigated.  One could in ensure that a real manipulation is not performed, as long as the parents can’t tell. Not at all.   Just because the patients cannot tell the real treatment from the sham does not mean that the sham is ineffective. It’s like running a test on asprin and using paracetamol as a control. The patients might not be able to tell whether they had the treatment or the control, but the control would never be a placebo.     Comparitive studies are the only way to go until you can develop benchmarks    for the treatment. This, too, is not the case.  With a mere comparison study the conclusions that can be drawn are more prone to being erroneous. To determine if an adjustment (rather than just time spent with the patients, expectation bias, etc) is having an effect, a properly designed sham comparison is the only way to go.  Otherwise we are left with essentially useless studies like the one we are discussing now. Your studies are also useless.   Your controls are invalid.   You have no idea what effect the sham treatment might be having. Randomised comparison studies will show which treatment is more effective, as practised, on a random subject.   I don’t care about the mechanism at this stage, I just want to know which treatment is more effective.   This study will tell me.   It needs to be repeated with a range of practitioners to eliminate charismatic effects, but the results are meaningful.   It gives the odds of a successful outcome for any patient attending either of the two treatments. Controlled studies give us much more useful information than comparisons studies. Not when you do not know whether the sham has any effect.   And you don’t. Your anti-sham philosophy is simply yet another attempt to thwart scientific investigation of alternative modalities (like your arguments against sham acupuncture).  Should we now throw out all negative placebo controlled trials because we can never know if the inert placebo is having some magical, homeopathic, or unknown effect? This is essentially what you are saying if you extend your argument. Not in the slightest.   Unless you can say you totally understand how the therapy works, you cannot say whether the sham treatment has any effect. It must contain enough elements of the treatment to fool the subjects. Inert placebos can be varied to see if there is any difference.   Completely different issue. If you wish to use a sham treatment as a placebo, you must first prove it is ineffective.   How are you going to do that?   Try it against another sham treatment and choose the least effective? No, sham treatments have their place, but cannot be used to prove or disprove a therapy.   All it can prove is that the real treatment is not significantly better than the sham.   Now prove that the sham treatment is ineffective and I’ll listen. Best wishes — John Bain UK TV Sound Director, magnotherapy user & distributor http://members.aol.com/JBainSI/Magnotherapy.html Surround Sound for Television

Response:

    Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.   How can you be certain the    sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident. Not really.  Because the intent of the sham arm of the intervention is to essentially keep the parents blinded, and mimic the conditions of the experimental intervention MINUS the part being investigated.  One could in ensure that a real manipulation is not performed, as long as the parents can’t tell.  

Not at all.   Just because the patients cannot tell the real treatment from the sham does not mean that the sham is ineffective. It’s like running a test on asprin and using paracetamol as a control.   The patients might not be able to tell whether they had the treatment or the control, but the control would never be a placebo.     Comparitive studies are the only way to go until you can develop benchmarks    for the treatment. This, too, is not the case.  With a mere comparison study the conclusions that can be drawn are more prone to being erroneous. To determine if an adjustment (rather than just time spent with the patients, expectation bias, etc) is having an effect, a properly designed sham comparison is the only way to go.  Otherwise we are left with essentially useless studies like the one we are discussing now.

Your studies are also useless.   Your controls are invalid.   You have no idea what effect the sham treatment might be having. Randomised comparison studies will show which treatment is more effective, as practised, on a random subject.   I don’t care about the mechanism at this stage, I just want to know which treatment is more effective.   This study will tell me.   It needs to be repeated with a range of practitioners to eliminate charismatic effects, but the results are meaningful.   It gives the odds of a successful outcome for any patient attending either of the two treatments. Controlled studies give us much more useful information than comparisons studies.

Not when you do not know whether the sham has any effect.   And you don’t. Your anti-sham philosophy is simply yet another attempt to thwart scientific investigation of alternative modalities (like your arguments against sham acupuncture).  Should we now throw out all negative placebo controlled trials because we can never know if the inert placebo is having some magical, homeopathic, or unknown effect? This is essentially what you are saying if you extend your argument.

Not in the slightest.   Unless you can say you totally understand how the therapy works, you cannot say whether the sham treatment has any effect.   It must contain enough elements of the treatment to fool the subjects.   Inert placebos can be varied to see if there is any difference.   Completely different issue. If you wish to use a sham treatment as a placebo, you must first prove it is ineffective.   How are you going to do that?   Try it against another sham treatment and choose the least effective? No, sham treatments have their place, but cannot be used to prove or disprove a therapy.   All it can prove is that the real treatment is not significantly better than the sham.   Now prove that the sham treatment is ineffective and I’ll listen. Best wishes — John Bain UK TV Sound Director, magnotherapy user & distributor http://members.aol.com/JBainSI/Magnotherapy.html Surround Sound for Television

Response:

Suppose it is simply the child’s karma to be (eventually) free of Colic.  How can we be sure the adjustment, sham adjustment, or other method is not stealing the credit owed to Karma.

Why Andrew, have you done more reading about Karma and are prepared to discuss it now? Here’s the question you kept avoiding all those months ago. Given 100 subjects for a trial,  can we assume that each carries the same Karmic burden Yes or No. If yes, please give your reasons.  When you answer this we can go onto the next question. Best wishes — John Bain UK TV Sound Director, magnotherapy user & distributor http://members.aol.com/JBainSI/Magnotherapy.html Surround Sound for Television

Response:

I understand the need to control variables and the attempted use of sham adjustments to control those variables AMAP. The question of variables does not just enter the control side but also the treatment side of a study.  For example, are all the patients treated with manipulation going to get the same adjustment or the adjustment that is determined to be necessary to correct the dysfunction(subluxation/fixation/restriction).  The reason I bring up this point is because if there is a rotational fixation of the joint then a lateral flexion impulse may or may not correct the fixation and therefore may skew the results to the side of ineffectiveness of the procedure. When it comes to testing a physical medicine the variables are endless.  Not to say that testing should not be done but there must be a global understanding that there are multiple variables that can not be controlled. — Dr. Roland R. Hicks Doctor of Chiropractic All good things come from above-down-inside-out Natural Alternative to Celebrex/Vioxx: http://drhicks.joint-pain.com/ Internet Marketing to Win: http://www.aboutimw.com/drhicks.html Nutrition Products and Information: http://freelife.com/Sites/drhicks/redir.cfm?page=/info/welcome/welcom… fm toll free (877) 791-8686

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Might not be a bad idea to look at all such trials, and shine today’s knowledge on them. I think one might find many old truths to no longer be so. And some to be so. There is much info out there which strongly suggests that we are effected on many subtle levels. By not taking that into account, we can only have faulty or inaccurate information. Surly someone would try to eliminate as many variables as possible. To not do so would, at best , be not worthy of trust. The problem was that the study design compared chiropractic manipulation to administration of a drug.  This is not a true controlled trial, but rather a comparison trial (although JMPT still referred to it as placebo controlled and single blinded). The investigators should have had a manipulation group and a sham group. Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.   How can you be certain the sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident. Not really.  Because the intent of the sham arm of the intervention is to essentially keep the parents blinded, and mimic the conditions of the experimental intervention MINUS the part being investigated.  One could in ensure that a real manipulation is not performed, as long as the parents can’t tell. Comparitive studies are the only way to go until you can develop benchmarks for the treatment. This, too, is not the case.  With a mere comparison study the conclusions that can be drawn are more prone to being erroneous. To determine if an adjustment (rather than just time spent with the patients, expectation bias, etc) is having an effect, a properly designed sham comparison is the only way to go.  Otherwise we are left with essentially useless studies like the one we are discussing now. Controlled studies give us much more useful information than comparisons studies.  Your anti-sham philosophy is simply yet another attempt to thwart scientific investigation of alternative modalities (like your arguments against sham acupuncture).  Should we now throw out all negative placebo controlled trials because we can never know if the inert placebo is having some magical, homeopathic, or unknown effect? This is essentially what you are saying if you extend your argument. — Kirk Kolas Ontario Veterinary College Class of 2002

Response:

I am not sold on the art of "sham" adjustments.  If there is any joint movement it will have some affect on the joint complex. — Dr. Roland R. Hicks Doctor of Chiropractic All good things come from above-down-inside-out Natural Alternative to Celebrex/Vioxx: http://drhicks.joint-pain.com/ Internet Marketing to Win: http://www.aboutimw.com/drhicks.html Nutrition Products and Information: http://freelife.com/Sites/drhicks/redir.cfm?page=/info/welcome/welcom… fm toll free (877) 791-8686

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "The one study did show that there was a reported improvement but since it was the mothers who reported the improvement the research was not definitive. Who should you ask if a baby’s colic is better?  I think the study is flawed since the measurement is strictly subjective and I hope that they can come up with a more structured study.  Colic is not easily quantified or classified." —- The problem with the design of this study was not really a problem with the measurement of "hours of crying".  This is a reasonable outcome measure, considering "colic" is operationally defined as increased hours of crying. The problem was that the study design compared chiropractic manipulation to administration of a drug.  This is not a true controlled trial, but rather a comparison trial (although JMPT still referred to it as placebo controlled and single blinded). The investigators should have had a manipulation group and a sham group. This way, the parents could be kept in the dark with respect to whether or not their child truly received an adjustment.  By comparing the outcomes of these two groups, the investigators could control for all those other factors that may be at play (e.g. expectation bias, handling of the child, increased time with the parents, etc…) I found it curious that JMPT also referred to the study as single blinded.  In my view it was not even single blinded because the "blinding" referred to the person evaluating the colic diary.  The outcome measure was simply total hours crying, so the diary evaluator, I presume, is simply adding up some numbers.  Blinding this individual is advantageous, but nothing to write home about.  Blinding the evaluators (the parents) is paramount. Nevertheless I have seen this rather poorly designed study touted in some forums.  I’d like to see it done properly with sham manipulation. I have never seen infant adjustments in person, but the couple of instances I have seen it on video, the "adjustments" were so subtle that I fear the investigators would have a hard time devising a convincing "sham" manipulation without actually replicating the adjustment arm of the study. And to end on a completely biased note: most pediatric adjustments look like sham adjustments to me in the first place. — Kirk Kolas Ontario Veterinary College Class of 2002

Response:

The problem was that the study design compared chiropractic manipulation to administration of a drug.  This is not a true controlled trial, but rather a comparison trial (although JMPT still referred to it as placebo controlled and single blinded). The investigators should have had a manipulation group and a sham group. Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.   How can you be certain the sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident.

Not really.  Because the intent of the sham arm of the intervention is to essentially keep the parents blinded, and mimic the conditions of the experimental intervention MINUS the part being investigated.  One could in ensure that a real manipulation is not performed, as long as the parents can’t tell.   Comparitive studies are the only way to go until you can develop benchmarks for the treatment.

This, too, is not the case.  With a mere comparison study the conclusions that can be drawn are more prone to being erroneous. To determine if an adjustment (rather than just time spent with the patients, expectation bias, etc) is having an effect, a properly designed sham comparison is the only way to go.  Otherwise we are left with essentially useless studies like the one we are discussing now. Controlled studies give us much more useful information than comparisons studies.  Your anti-sham philosophy is simply yet another attempt to thwart scientific investigation of alternative modalities (like your arguments against sham acupuncture).  Should we now throw out all negative placebo controlled trials because we can never know if the inert placebo is having some magical, homeopathic, or unknown effect? This is essentially what you are saying if you extend your argument. — Kirk Kolas Ontario Veterinary College Class of 2002

Response:

 Might not be a bad idea to look at all such trials, and shine today’s knowledge on them. I think one might find many old truths to no longer be so. And some to be so. There is much info out there which strongly suggests that we are effected on many subtle levels. By not taking that into account, we can only have faulty or inaccurate information. Surly someone would try to eliminate as many variables as possible. To not do so would, at best , be not worthy of trust.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The problem was that the study design compared chiropractic manipulation to administration of a drug.  This is not a true controlled trial, but rather a comparison trial (although JMPT still referred to it as placebo controlled and single blinded). The investigators should have had a manipulation group and a sham group. Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.   How can you be certain the sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident. Not really.  Because the intent of the sham arm of the intervention is to essentially keep the parents blinded, and mimic the conditions of the experimental intervention MINUS the part being investigated.  One could in ensure that a real manipulation is not performed, as long as the parents can’t tell. Comparitive studies are the only way to go until you can develop benchmarks for the treatment. This, too, is not the case.  With a mere comparison study the conclusions that can be drawn are more prone to being erroneous. To determine if an adjustment (rather than just time spent with the patients, expectation bias, etc) is having an effect, a properly designed sham comparison is the only way to go.  Otherwise we are left with essentially useless studies like the one we are discussing now. Controlled studies give us much more useful information than comparisons studies.  Your anti-sham philosophy is simply yet another attempt to thwart scientific investigation of alternative modalities (like your arguments against sham acupuncture).  Should we now throw out all negative placebo controlled trials because we can never know if the inert placebo is having some magical, homeopathic, or unknown effect? This is essentially what you are saying if you extend your argument. — Kirk Kolas Ontario Veterinary College Class of 2002

Response:

The problem was that the study design compared chiropractic manipulation to administration of a drug.  This is not a true controlled trial, but rather a comparison trial (although JMPT still referred to it as placebo controlled and single blinded).   The investigators should have had a manipulation group and a sham group.

Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.   How can you be certain the sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident. It’s like using a random drug off the shelves as a placebo, you have no idea what its effects will be on the participants in this study. Comparitive studies are the only way to go until you can develop benchmarks for the treatment. Best wishes — John Bain UK TV Sound Director, magnotherapy user & distributor http://members.aol.com/JBainSI/Magnotherapy.html Surround Sound for Television

Response:

John, Suppose it is simply the child’s karma to be (eventually) free of Colic.  How can we be sure the adjustment, sham adjustment, or other method is not stealing the credit owed to Karma. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The problem was that the study design compared chiropractic manipulation to administration of a drug.  This is not a true controlled trial, but rather a comparison trial (although JMPT still referred to it as placebo controlled and single blinded). The investigators should have had a manipulation group and a sham group. Kirk, sham manipulation is fatally flawed.   How can you be certain the sham manipulation is not having an effect by accident. It’s like using a random drug off the shelves as a placebo, you have no idea what its effects will be on the participants in this study. Comparitive studies are the only way to go until you can develop benchmarks for the treatment. Best wishes — John Bain UK TV Sound Director, magnotherapy user & distributor http://members.aol.com/JBainSI/Magnotherapy.html Surround Sound for Television

Before you buy.

Response:

"The one study did show that there was a reported improvement but since it was the mothers who reported the improvement the research was not definitive. Who should you ask if a baby’s colic is better?  I think the study is flawed since the measurement is strictly subjective and I hope that they can come up with a more structured study.  Colic is not easily quantified or classified."   —- The problem with the design of this study was not really a problem with the measurement of "hours of crying".  This is a reasonable outcome measure, considering "colic" is operationally defined as increased hours of crying. The problem was that the study design compared chiropractic manipulation to administration of a drug.  This is not a true controlled trial, but rather a comparison trial (although JMPT still referred to it as placebo controlled and single blinded).   The investigators should have had a manipulation group and a sham group. This way, the parents could be kept in the dark with respect to whether or not their child truly received an adjustment.  By comparing the outcomes of these two groups, the investigators could control for all those other factors that may be at play (e.g. expectation bias, handling of the child, increased time with the parents, etc…) I found it curious that JMPT also referred to the study as single blinded.  In my view it was not even single blinded because the "blinding" referred to the person evaluating the colic diary.  The outcome measure was simply total hours crying, so the diary evaluator, I presume, is simply adding up some numbers.  Blinding this individual is advantageous, but nothing to write home about.  Blinding the evaluators (the parents) is paramount. Nevertheless I have seen this rather poorly designed study touted in some forums.  I’d like to see it done properly with sham manipulation. I have never seen infant adjustments in person, but the couple of instances I have seen it on video, the "adjustments" were so subtle that I fear the investigators would have a hard time devising a convincing "sham" manipulation without actually replicating the adjustment arm of the study. And to end on a completely biased note: most pediatric adjustments look like sham adjustments to me in the first place.   — Kirk Kolas Ontario Veterinary College Class of 2002

Response:

"Chiropractors are nervous system specialists with a focus on orthopedics. In other words, chiropractors are concerned with mechanical stressors on the nervous system. The nervous system controls all of the blood vessels in the body (via the sympathetic division of the autonomic nervous system). Every tissue in the body needs a healthy blood supply (for nourishment and waste removal). This blood supply is predicated upon having blood vessels functioning properly. Sympathetic innervation causes vasoconstriction (narrows arteries and arterioles), and thus diminishes the blood supply to an area. Profound reduction in blood supply results in hypoxia (decreased oxygen supply). This results in an ischemic condition, resulting in cellular death, and possible necrosis of the tissue. And thus, the functional integrity of the tissue is compromised." "A man may be a fool and not know it – but not if he is married." H.L. Mencken http://www.lifehousemusic.com/lh_music.html catchytune. says me.

Response:

– Dr. Roland R. Hicks Doctor of Chiropractic All good things come from above-down-inside-out Natural Alternative to Celebrex/Vioxx: http://drhicks.joint-pain.com/ Internet Marketing to Win: http://www.aboutimw.com/drhicks.html Nutrition Products and Information: http://freelife.com/Sites/drhicks/redir.cfm?page=/info/welcome/welcom… fm toll free (877) 791-8686

Here are some starter questions: (A) What is a chiropractic subluxation?

Atlas gave a good explanation, however I like to use common language to describet a subluxtion.  It is first and foremost the main object of a theory which attempts to explain what a chiropractor treats.  It is not proven for if it was it would not be a theory.  A subluxation in chiropractic terms is an abnormal positon or movement of the spinal bones/joints which cause a change in the function of the nervous system and to the extent that the nervous system is affected so the subjects health is affected.  Simply put a subluxation is anything which can cause negative effects on the nervous system and related to the structure of the body.  As Atlas stated that there are many causes of subluxations from injury, stress, metabolic, ect. (B) Can you identify one on a radiograph?  If not, what methods do you use to detect them?  How reliable are these methods?

There are instances in which the structural facet of a subluxation may be viewed on xray.  Since a subluxation is biomechanical, structural and neurological in origin one can not see the neurological or biomechanical aspects of a subluxation on a xray. Just as one cannot see the funtion of the sciatic nerve on a pelvic xray.  I propose a scenario to better understand the above explanation.  In my practice, I have the opportunity to see patients with disc degeneration on a daily basis.  These people come in with discs that have degenerated and thinned.  When the disc thins the bones(vertebrae) come closer together.  This caused the facet joints in the back of the spine to also come closer together(imburcate).  When these joints come closer together their biomechanics change and they are prone to Jamming upon extension movements or movements which cause an increase in the normal lumbar curve(lordosis).  Can you see these changes in the normal static Xrays?  yes Can you see the biomechanical changes on the xray? no biomechanical findings cannot be seen on a static test. Can you correlate your findings to the history and examination and predict the outcome of care? yes (C) Can a subluxation cause visceral disease (a la Meric chart)?

What is the Meric chart? A person can have a viscerosomatic reflex like having an upset stomach cause overall body weakness and malaise. A person can have a somatovisceral reflex like having hit one’s thumb with a hammer can cause stomach upset. A person can have a psychosomatic reflex in which they think they are sick and therefore they feel general muscle weakness and malaise. A person can have a somatopsychologica reflex in which the are hurt physically and it sets up the flight/fight reaction. This is the long way of answering the question asked.  Yes, a subluxation can be a cause of a visceral disease/condition/symptom.  The reverse is also part of the "subluxation theory" a visceral condition can reflex to the spine and cause pain and subluxation symptoms of the spine.  Ie. gall bladder causing pain in the right intrascapular region.  Cramping and lumbar muscle spasms and pain associated with painful menses in women are good examples of viscerosomatic reflexes.  The nerves travel both ways. (D) Can colic be treated chiropractically?

There is some clinical evidence that spinal manipulation can reduce the severity of colic however I believe the jury is still out on that one and more studies should be performed.  The one study did show that there was a reported improvement but since it was the mothers who reported the improvement the research was not definitive. Who should you ask if a baby’s colic is better?  I think the study is flawed since the measurement is strictly subjective and I hope that they can come up with a more structured study.  Colic is not easily quantified or classified.  Plus those little rug rats can’t comunicate other than crying or not crying.  My boy was diagnosed with a viral syndrome(possibly meningitis) when he was two months old.  We were up all night and went to the ER at 4AM due to his condition.  The only thing that would calm him was gentle motion of his hips and sacrum. Why? GOT ME.  The lumbar puncture was inconclusive.  I was explained by our pediatrician that just because you dip your hand into a barrel of pickles and don’t grab a pickle doesn’t mean that there are not pickles in there. We had to assume that the child had meningitis and treat it as such. (E) Can a correcting a subluxation help in childhood ear infections?

In my clinical experience, I would have to say emphatically YES.  Does it cure infections? NO I have treated approximately 20-30 children with chronic ear infections over the past 10 years and of those treated, in my observation 80-90% showed improvement in their condition.  Was it just the adjustments?  I doubt it.  I make sure that my patients keep on the medicinal regimine recommended by their medical doctor and simply try to improve the function of the cervical spine. I also try to make dietary changes for the child.  Do I understand the exact mechanism? NO  What my treatments are designed to do is increase drainage of the sinuses and aid in the drainage of the eustacian tube.  If there is restriction of motion in the upper neck causing reduce lymphatic drainage then this may be a factor in the condition.  My son has had chronic ear infections since he was one year old.  He has allergies and that plays a big role in his chronic infections.  I do gentle neck adjustments and skull craniopathy to aid in his congestion to clear his sinuses and have him on antibiotics only when an infection is present. The explanations provided are in no way complete and are for the purposes of presenting my experience.  If you have questions about the areas discussed or are unclear of what I was attempting to explain please ask me to clarify those areas. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have heard different chiropractors answer these questions differently.  We all know how a "Straight" chiropractor would answer them.  What do you think? — Kirk Kolas Ontario Veterinary College Class of 2002

Response:

If you have a question about chiropractic ask away.  I am not the ultimate expert but I may be able to help you none the less. If you had been to a chiropractor and had a question about the visit, rumors, theory, testing or even the question that you think others will think you are stupid to ask.  I’m on this newsgroup for enjoyment and if I can help another while I’m having fun then I’ve killed two birds with one stone. — Dr. Roland R. Hicks Doctor of Chiropractic All good things come from above-down-inside-out Natural Alternative to Celebrex/Vioxx: http://drhicks.joint-pain.com/ Internet Marketing to Win: http://www.aboutimw.com/drhicks.html Nutrition Products and Information http://freelife.com/Sites/drhicks/redir.cfm?page=/info/welcome/welcom… fm toll free (877) 791-8686

Response:

If you have a question about chiropractic ask away.  I am not the ultimate expert but I may be able to help you none the less.

Here are some starter questions: (A) What is a chiropractic subluxation? (B) Can you identify one on a radiograph?  If not, what methods do you use to detect them?  How reliable are these methods? (C) Can a subluxation cause visceral disease (a la Meric chart)? (D) Can colic be treated chiropractically? (E) Can a correcting a subluxation help in childhood ear infections? I have heard different chiropractors answer these questions differently.  We all know how a "Straight" chiropractor would answer them.  What do you think? — Kirk Kolas Ontario Veterinary College Class of 2002

Response:

I can answer these for you (A) What is a chiropractic subluxation?

The potential injury caused by unnecessary spinal manipulation. (B) Can you identify one on a radiograph?  If not, what methods do you use to detect them?  How reliable are these methods?

Only after a significant trauma.  Spiral CT scan is a very sensitive for delineating the extent of injury. (C) Can a subluxation cause visceral disease (a la Meric chart)?

No (D) Can colic be treated chiropractically?

No (E) Can a correcting a subluxation help in childhood ear infections?

Not really

Response:

(A) What is a chiropractic subluxation?

If you asked a medical doctor and a chiropractor to define a subluxation, you would get two different answers. The medical profession defines a subluxation as: "A partial or incomplete dislocation."  (From Taber’s Cyclopedic Medical Dictionary).      The Chiropractic profession has a different definition (and thus – meaning) for a subluxation. Specifically, a subluxation is an articular lesion which has the following components: 1. Abnormal movement or position of a bone. (Kinesiopathology). In the spine, this could be at the intersegmental level (meaning one vertebra and the vertebra above and below it). Or it could be at the global level (meaning the posture). 2. Abnormal tissue. (Histopathology):  This includes nerves, muscle, ligaments, tendons, adipose tissue, fascia, lymphatics, blood vessels, etc.      Kinesiopathology is composed of rotations and translations. Histopathology is caused by deformations of the tissues [Davis' Law of soft tissues, Wolff's Law of hard tissues]. What causes a subluxation? Subluxations are caused by one of three things:      1. Trauma (Physical stress)      2. Thoughts (Emotional stress)      3. Toxins (Chemical stress) Is a Subluxation the cause of all disease?      There is no one cause for all disease.  If there was, we would have probably found it by now. There are numerous causes for disease. One thing which needs to be stressed at this point is that the human body was designed to be healthy. The body has an innate ability to repair itself from injury, and to fight off pathogens. We were not designed to have to rely on pills, potions, and powders to resolve the majority of our problems.      Chiropractors are nervous system specialists with a focus on orthopedics. In other words, chiropractors are concerned with mechanical stressors on the nervous system. The nervous system controls all of the blood vessels in the body (via the sympathetic division of the autonomic nervous system). Every tissue in the body needs a healthy blood supply (for nourishment and waste removal). This blood supply is predicated upon having blood vessels functioning properly. Sympathetic innervation causes vasoconstriction (narrows arteries and arterioles), and thus diminishes the blood supply to an area. Profound reduction in blood supply results in hypoxia (decreased oxygen supply). This results in an ischemic condition, resulting in cellular death, and possible necrosis of the tissue. And thus, the functional integrity of the tissue is compromised.      Chiropractors do not treat disease. They find and remove subluxations. However, if the subluxation is the cause of the disease, then by removing the subluxation, you are effectively resolving the problem. (B) Can you identify one on a radiograph?  If not, what methods do you use to detect them?  How reliable are these methods?

        The Chiropractic definition of a subluxation involves mechanical, biochemical, and neurophysiological components. Of these, the mechanical component is visible on an x-ray. The neurological, and physiological components are not visible on an x-ray. Chiropractors study x-ray films with line drawing analysis. And with these, they can take precise measurements to determine if the bone(s) are subluxated.      Your chiropractor will only order an x-ray if he/she feels it is necessary. Precautions are used to ensure that you are exposed to the absolutely minimum possible radioation dose. These include lead shielding, high speed films, collimation, and screens. (C) Can a subluxation cause visceral disease (a la Meric chart)?

        Chiropractic has but one purpose. And that is to find and remove subluxations. If the subluxation is the cause of the dis-ease in the body, then it logically follows that by removing the subluxation (the cause), then you’re going to remove the dis-ease (the effect).      However, the subluxation is not the root of every health care problem. There are many reasons why people get sick. Interestingly enough, Chiropractic could help boost the immune system of the patient, so that their own innate immunity is stronger, and the body is better able to rid itself of the disease process. See: http://www.geocities.com/cbpdoc/neuroimmune.html (D) Can colic be treated chiropractically?

        Only if the colic is caused by vertebral subluxation. (E) Can a correcting a subluxation help in childhood ear infections?

        Only if the ear infections are caused by vertebral subluxation. I have heard different chiropractors answer these questions differently.  We all know how a "Straight" chiropractor would answer them.  What do you think?

        Now you know.

Response:

Question:

Things have been a bit better lately.  I’ve had less to think about, and therefore less stray thoughts, which is nice. Its funny, when I started taking Zoloft, I looked up on the CVS website drug interaction checker whether or not caffiene interacts with it, and it said it didn’t.  However, it was nice enough to inform me that caffeine interacts with food!  DUH!!!  :) Jason

Glad to hear that you’re doing better.  I’m not doing better–my anxiety and agitation levels are still pretty extreme, so I’m going to try decreasing my dose to 100 mg for a few days (though I need to remember to call my psychiatrist tomorrow to tell her what I’ve decided to do ) to see if it makes a difference. persephone — "It’s a common error among mortals active in organized religion to place devotion to historical propositions and to organizations above devotion to life-shaping principles." –Allen R. Barlow Before you buy.

Response:

I haven’t told her yet because it only just recently started increasing to the point where I noticed it, but I meet with her in about a week, and I’ll mention it to her then.  It probably won’t make much of a difference because the Zoloft doesn’t seem to be working too well, and so she’ll probably put me on another AD soon unless it does start working.  Thanks! persephone << question about Zoloft What you describe is an occasional side effect of many AD meds. Have you told your doctor? Be well. Bob

– "It’s a common error among mortals active in organized religion to place devotion to historical propositions and to organizations above devotion to life-shaping principles." –Allen R. Barlow Before you buy.

Response:

Things have been a bit better lately.  I’ve had less to think about, and therefore less stray thoughts, which is nice. Its funny, when I started taking Zoloft, I looked up on the CVS website drug interaction checker whether or not caffiene interacts with it, and it said it didn’t.  However, it was nice enough to inform me that caffeine interacts with food!  DUH!!!  :) Jason – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m sorry.  :(  Maybe you should talk to your pdoc about the agitation. She might be willing to try another med that’s not an SSRI.  If the Zoloft is really working for you, you might want to try to give up the caffiene, though I realize this is much easier said than done.  If I had to give up ice cream, I’m not sure what I would do… persephone Ack! No! I didn’t see the post about caffiene and Zoloft.  If I have to give up my Mt. Dew to have to take this stuff, I’ll be more depressed than I was before I started it! Jason — "It’s a common error among mortals active in organized religion to place devotion to historical propositions and to organizations above devotion to life-shaping principles." –Allen R. Barlow Before you buy.

Response:

<< question about Zoloft What you describe is an occasional side effect of many AD meds. Have you told your doctor? Be well. Bob

Response:

I’m sorry.  :(  Maybe you should talk to your pdoc about the agitation. She might be willing to try another med that’s not an SSRI.  If the Zoloft is really working for you, you might want to try to give up the caffiene, though I realize this is much easier said than done.  If I had to give up ice cream, I’m not sure what I would do… persephone Ack! No! I didn’t see the post about caffiene and Zoloft.  If I have to give up my Mt. Dew to have to take this stuff, I’ll be more depressed than I was before I started it! Jason

– "It’s a common error among mortals active in organized religion to place devotion to historical propositions and to organizations above devotion to life-shaping principles." –Allen R. Barlow Before you buy.

Response:

Ack! No! I didn’t see the post about caffiene and Zoloft.  If I have to give up my Mt. Dew to have to take this stuff, I’ll be more depressed than I was before I started it! Jason – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks for the response, Jason.  Glad to know I’m not alone.  By the way, did you see the thread where ali mentioned that caffiene interacts with SSRIs and increases agitation?  It might be something to keep in mind.  Take care. persephone Hiya, I’m actually on Zoloft right now too, and I have the same problem unfortunately.  It usually happens at night, which makes sleep nigh impossible.  Its been really bothersome.  I’ve started taking it earlier in the day (I used to take it at 5:30pm every day), but it hasn’t seemed to help yet. Jason Okay, I’m going to take the plunge and post again… I have a question about Zoloft.  I’m currently on Zoloft, and since I started taking it, there are periods during the day where I have a lot of agitated, restless energy and my mind does nothing but race.  And, these periods get more frequent every time my medication is upped. Have people experienced this particular side effect on Zoloft, or do you think it’s just part of the depression? (I have a friend with depression who’s not on any medication who gets this way sometimes). Before you buy. — "It

Question:

Hi Robbi!  I have recently started a brand new drug put out by Eli Lily called Zyprexa and am having really good results with it.  It is somewhat similar to Risperdal without the drowsiness.  Costs about $5.00 a pill, but it is once a day dosing.  I have a couple of tendencies to complicate my bipolar disorder and it is especially helping with those

Response:

   While hypo last night, I added a drug information link page to my site. It is up and running for information on many drugs with more to come. Drugs included on the site so far are; Lithium, Depakote, Tegretol, Neurontin, Paxil, Prozac, Zoloft, Effexor, Elavil, Wellbutrin, Pamelor, Ativan, Xanax, Klonapin, Desyrel, Lamictal, Risperdal, and Trilafon.    I also have a general link to other antidepressants. If you can think of a medication that needs to be added to my site, please let me know. I am doing this so we all can gain more knowledge of our treatment. — ~Robbi~  "oo" "There is no great genius without a tincture of madness." John Dryden 1631-1701 http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/7160

Response:

Question:

UGH!!!   I am on Zoloft once again and absolutely hate it!!  Your not kidding when you say it does help w/the obsession with food but I hate feeling no emotions whatsoever.    

I just got put on Prozac. When I was on Zoloft and Lithium I just had no emotion and just gained weight.  Lithium does that.  I don’t even know WHY I was put on lithium. I mean, where were the highs and hyperness? Any way, I’m not happy about being put back on the meds. *hugs* Ne

Response:

UGH!!!   I am on Zoloft once again and absolutely hate it!!  Your not kidding when you say it does help w/the obsession with food but I hate feeling no emotions whatsoever.    By the way,  has your doctor ever mentioned Luvox to you before??  It is a good med for obsess/compuls. disorder which, in a way, goes hand in hand with bing/purg.   It isn’t quite so brutal on the sex drive part(that is if you are disliking that particular side effect of Zoloft…)     If you are not that depressed then you may want to ask about Luvox(I had to switch from Luvox to Zoloft because it wasn’t as effective on the depression stuff).    That’s all.  Just wanted to put my 2 cents in. — For more information about this service, send e-mail to:

Response: