I am new to the group, and have a family of asthmatics. I am 29-years old and was finally diagnosed with asthma about 2-years ago. I have a just turned 4-year old who has had asthma since he was 6-months old, a 7-year old who was recently diagnosed, and a 5-month old baby who has already contracted RSV and been on albuterol nebulizer treatments. I have had very nasty side effects with Prednisone and Prednisolone oral steroids. I also have a hard time taking Decahedron. The only oral steroid I have been able to tolerate is a Medrol dose pack. Has anyone one had similar problems? I would also appreciate any information available on RSV and its effects. Thank you.
I am new to the group, and have a family of asthmatics. I am 29-years old and was finally diagnosed with asthma about 2-years ago. I have a just turned 4-year old who has had asthma since he was 6-months old, a 7-year old who was recently diagnosed, and a 5-month old baby who has already contracted RSV and been on albuterol nebulizer treatments. I have had very nasty side effects with Prednisone and Prednisolone oral steroids. I also have a hard time taking Decahedron. The only oral steroid I have been able to tolerate is a Medrol dose pack. Has anyone one had similar problems? I would also appreciate any information available on RSV and its effects. Thank you.
The oral steroids commonly used for asthma are prednisone, prednisolone, and methylprednisolone (Medrol). I think the side effects are similar. I think that Decadron (dexamethsone) is not usually used for asthma due to its more severe side effects. The oral steroids are used for ‘burst’ doses for asthma exacerbations, and for very Severe asthmatics. Many asthmatics who formerly took oral steroids for maintenance have been able to switch to the new high-strength steroid inhalers like Flovent and Pulmicort, which results in a much lower total dose of steroid since it goes directly to the lungs. Oral steroids have many side effects including osteoporosis, high BP, psychological effects, etc. Info on RSV at www.rsvinfo.com (drug co. site) http://www.rsvinfo.com/sequelae/sequelae.html "Recurring Respiratory Problems Reactive airway disease and pulmonary function deficits are two conditions known to strike those who have suffered from RSV bronchiolitis in their first year of life, even in children whose initial illness did not require hospitalization.10 Wheezing and asthma have also been identified in children 10 years after suffering an RSV lower respiratory tract infection in infancy. 11 This susceptibility to asthma and wheezing may have been caused by the early infection damaging the growing lung. However, genetics may also play a role in predisposing patients with RSV to the development of recurring respiratory problems.11 Two major hypotheses have been proposed to explain the association between lower respiratory tract infections such as RSV during infancy and subsequent respiratory abnormalities such as asthma and chronic obstructive pulmonary disease.10 These two possibilities, however, while contrasting, are not necessarily mutually exclusive. According to various prospective studies involving children who had experienced RSV infection as infants, the following RSV sequelae have been reported11-21: recurrent wheezing; cough asthma; impaired oxygenation pulmonary dysfunction bronchial reactivity acute respiratory disease hyperinflation variable airways obstruction RSV Risk Factors It is important to note that there is a broad spectrum of RSV infection ranging from mild to severe to fatal, and it is not known whether RSV sequelae follow mild RSV infections, as most prospective studies follow cases of infants who were hospitalized for moderate to severe RSV infection.11-21 In hospitalized patients with moderate to severe cases of RSV bronchiolitis infection, physicians should consider early treatment with an antiviral agent to reduce the risk of long-term sequelae. Those infants and young children most at risk for severe RSV infection include: Those with a history of prematurity Infants less than six weeks of age Those with congenital heart disease Those with chronic lung conditions including bronchopulmonary dysplasia and cystic fibrosis Those who suffer from immunodeficiency (e.g., HIV, AIDS, cancer, transplants) Can Early Treatment Make a Difference? If viral infections early in life cause long-term sequelae, RSV can be considered a prime candidate by virtue of high incidence in early infancy.10 But is there anything that can help decrease the risk of long-term sequelae? Some studies confirm a decreased overall incidence of bronchitis in ribavirin-treated patients but do not maintain that subsequent diagnosis of reactive airway disease is reduced due to such antiviral treatment.22 However, recent prospective and retrospective studies23-25 indicate that aggressive medical intervention and early treatment with a broad-spectrum antiviral may reduce the morbidity from RSV disease. AUTHORS: Fergie et al at Driscoll Children’s Hospital in Corpus Christi, Texas METHODS: Assessed the pulmonary health status at two years following hospital discharge of 30 ribavirin-treated infants with RSV bronchiolitis (1994-1995 RSV season) Compared this status with 28 matched infants whose treatment at the same hospital excluded ribavirin RESULTS: For Full Prescribing Information For VIRAZOLE
Those spacers are good. . .but the neatest thing I have seen is a product called MDI Tutor. It is tiny [barely adds any size to the inhaler] and helps you use your inhaler properly.
My Aerochamber makes a whistleing sound when I inhale too fast. Is that what you’re talking about? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Those spacers are good. . .but the neatest thing I have seen is a product called MDI Tutor. It is tiny [barely adds any size to the inhaler] and helps you use your inhaler properly.
Please email your mailing address. I will send you a complete package of information on what has finally given me drug free relief after thirty years of suffering!!!
I can’t imagine taking inhalers anymore without the Aerochamber. It cuts out that hoarse throat, and just all around seems to be more efficient at getting the medicine where its supposed to go. Before it would land on my upper pallette (sp?) and leave a spot of medicine there. Now I don’t have to pay so much attention to how I’m taking it except for expelling my breath before. Sue M.
I agree with you … Aerochambers are great. There’s a really good one out there called an OptiHaler, made by Healthscan Products. I don’t know if you’ve tried it but I personally like to use it a little better than those clear AeroChamber ones. The OptiHaler is more compact so it’s easier to carry around, and I like how it functions. You can store your medication inside it, too. It’s hard to find though at the pharmacies. 
http://www.europa.com/~bjknotts/
I can’t imagine taking inhalers anymore without the Aerochamber. It cuts out that hoarse throat, and just all around seems to be more efficient at getting the medicine where its supposed to go. Before it would land on my upper pallette (sp?) and leave a spot of medicine there. Now I don’t have to pay so much attention to how I’m taking it except for expelling my breath before. Sue M.
What is an aerochamber? Kathy Anderson fellow-sufferer
What is an aerochamber? Kathy Anderson fellow-sufferer
See the alt.support.asthma FAQ – I wrote a bit on Aerochambers in the FAQ. Briefly, it is a holding chamber that makes inhalers easier and more efficient to use: you spray your medication into it and then inhale the medication from it, at your own comfortable rate. Certainly worth having, since the inhalation speed required for matching the inhaler’s spray speed is difficult for many to achieve (especially during a flare), and since, without one, those who take inhaled steroids are more likely to get thrush. — Mark Feblowitz, GTE Laboratories Inc., 40 Sylvan Rd. Waltham, MA 02254
When I posted my first note about a month ago I got a lot of wonderful advice from people and many asked for an update after I saw the doctor. Here it is! I went to the doctor today and by the time I left I was so elated! What a relief to finally get professional help, I feel so relaxed. He put me on Methylprednisolone tabs for 6 days and I also have Flovent and Serevent that I take two puffs of twice a day. I got Albuterol for when/if I have any problems. He also gave me an AeroChamber and a peak flow meter. Now I’m cooking with gas! :) Thanks for all the concern. Tammy
Here’s where I am — after 10-plus years of sinus problems (which escalated to about 6 infections in the last 8-9 months), my family physician finally sent me to an ENT. ENT sent me for CT scan and allergy testing. CT scans showed cysts (first thought they were polyps, but the report says cysts) filling 2/3 of left maxillary and 1/2 (back half) of the left (largest) sphenoid. There was also thickening in the sphenoid, bottom of left frontal and at the opening (well, where there’s *supposed* to be an opening) to the right maxillary. Ethmoids were mostly clear with just a little cloudiness in some small areas. Dx: chronic sinusitis. Fortunately, I am not in the midst of an acute attack just now. The allergy testing, about which I briefly posted last week, was negative (except for the histamine control). In addition, the IgG/A/M bloodwork that the allergist/immunologist sent me in for has, so far, come up negative — but that’s only the ‘M’ part. The jury is still out on the IgG/A portions — the lab screwed up and forgot to test for these. Had more blood drawn for this early this past week, and I should have the results this week before my visit to the ENT on this coming Thursday to talk about surgery. At the moment I am ‘managing’ the sinus problems with Claritan D (although the ENT says he may have me try a combo decongestant and mucus thinner instead, since the allergy testing was negative and I may not need the antihistamine part, and certainly don’t need the sleepiness it brings). I’m also using Singulair and Nasonex and several OTC things — saline spray, Xlear (sp?), nasal irrigation (still working on the head positioning, Dr. Grossan — thanks for your suggestion!), papaya enzymes, etc., etc. I drink lots of water and actively stay as far from any triggers (to the non-allergenic rhinitis that complicates things) as possible. I do know that when I had to go off the Claritan D before allergy testing that I started with the problems again. Awful headaches — on the right side, and also in back of my eyes and head. And even now, with all this care, I still have headaches at various times. Some days, I still have lots of drainage. I know that the small-to-almost-nonexistant opening into the right maxillary is definitely part of the problem. A couple of weeks ago, the whole side of my face was throbbing — finally I heard a long, drawn-out "sqeeeeeeeeak" (loud — like someone had stepped on a dog toy or something — even my husband heard it) and the headache disappeared. So I know at least a portion of this is the dreaded vacuum effect. Unfortunately, all my manipulations cannot quarantee that I can open it at any given time — even after all my various methods are tried. Once the headache starts, I’m out for the count unless I get lucky. Sometimes it lasts for days (even through the night). I am so tired (fatigue has been my middle name for years), and I am about 95-percent decided on surgery sometime in early October. I’ve done a lot of reading here and other places on the risks and rates of recovery, and I’ve read tons of post-surgery stories (both good and bad) and have spoken with people who have had FESS (and had good outcomes). I’m putting together a list of questions for the ENT appointment. I’ll be taking my husband along so that he can ask questions and listen to the answers as well. I believe that the ENT wants to avoid too much work in the sphenoid since the nerves or arteries or whatever are so close to some of the thickened portion, but at this point he believes that getting rid of the cyst is possible. He would also remove the cyst in the left maxillary and enlarge the opening to the right. Fortunately I have a beautifully straight septum which requires no work whatsoever. Thank heaven for small favors. Is there anything that, in the experience of those here, is important to ask at this meeting to discuss surgery or that you should have asked but didn’t? Also, any suggestions on building up your body/health before surgery? I start back to work in September after five years home with my son — but fortunately I’ll be working with my husband, and he’s pretty lenient (if he knows what’s good for him) about the time I need to take off to recover. I sure would appreciate any input on this.
On 4 Aug 2001 15:32:52 -0700, studio…@net-magic.net (LSM) wrote:
….. Is there anything that, in the experience of those here, is important to ask at this meeting to discuss surgery or that you should have asked but didn’t? Also, any suggestions on building up your body/health before surgery? I start back to work in September after five years home with my son — but fortunately I’ll be working with my husband, and he’s pretty lenient (if he knows what’s good for him) about the time I need to take off to recover. I sure would appreciate any input on this.
I think it is important to evaluate the experience and reputation of the otolaryngologist. I would look for someone whosr primary specialty has been sinus surgery for many years. A University may be one place to look.
OK, first of all, how are you functioning during the daytime, after your 5 hours?
80 % of the time I can function during the day, while feeling tired; 20 % of the time I lay in bed all day. Also, I have chronic Fatigue and I am on long term disability. Anything good happening from this medication after 7 weeks?
Yes, anxiety has become less pronounced, but still need to up the Effexor to better control my anxiety. My fear is if I up the Effexor then I will get no sleep at all. What is it being prescribed for?
Anxiety. Mike – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – G Hello all, I have been taking Effexor XR 37.5 once a day for 7 weeks. The problem is the lack of sleep; I sleep 4 to 5 hours a night. Initially I thought this would go away once I acclimated to the medication, because that’s what happened in the past with other meds. Unfortunately this has not happened. My question is there any medication that would assist with my sleep problem, so I could get a good night sleep. This would probably be on a long term basis. Thank you to those who respond, Mike
OK, first of all, how are you functioning during the daytime, after your 5 hours? Anything good happening from this medication after 7 weeks? What is it being prescribed for? G
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello all, I have been taking Effexor XR 37.5 once a day for 7 weeks. The problem is the lack of sleep; I sleep 4 to 5 hours a night. Initially I thought this would go away once I acclimated to the medication, because that’s what happened in the past with other meds. Unfortunately this has not happened. My question is there any medication that would assist with my sleep problem, so I could get a good night sleep. This would probably be on a long term basis. Thank you to those who respond, Mike
Hello all, I have been taking Effexor XR 37.5 once a day for 7 weeks. The problem is the lack of sleep; I sleep 4 to 5 hours a night. Initially I thought this would go away once I acclimated to the medication, because that’s what happened in the past with other meds. Unfortunately this has not happened. My question is there any medication that would assist with my sleep problem, so I could get a good night sleep. This would probably be on a long term basis. Thank you to those who respond, Mike
talk to the doc who prescribed the Effexor?? that would be my first step. Lobo
Hello all, I have been taking Effexor XR 37.5 once a day for 7 weeks. The problem is the lack of sleep; I sleep 4 to 5 hours a night. Initially I thought this would go away once I acclimated to the medication, because that’s what happened in the past with other meds. Unfortunately this has not happened. My question is there any medication that would assist with my sleep problem, so I could get a good night sleep. This would probably be on a long term basis. Thank you to those who respond, Mike
Do you take Effexor for anxiety/panic, depression? Does it work at this low dose? Good sedating antidepressants that work also for anxiety/panic are amitriptyline (TCA) and Paxil (SSRI). Also Remeron which as a rule is somewhat less effective for anxiety disorders but does help people. Low dose ami and ditto Remeron are succesfully prescribed as sleeping aids. Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
Went fine I think. PDoc recommended Lexpro instead of Celexa – said less side effects I started yesterday and continued today. No bad stuff yet. :) Hope there isn’t any to come….. He said 3-4 days 1/2 lex pill = 5mg. with 1/2 my zoloft dosage Then go up to 10mg. almost 2 days down already! thanks,
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – :I meed with the doc tomorrow. Called this morning and got an appt. – what :luck How did your appt go? I hope well. Tell us about it Jackie ~*~I wanted you to see what real courage is, instead of getting the idea that courage is a man with a gun in his hand. It’s when you know you’re licked before you begin but you begin anyway and you see it through no matter what~*~ ~Harper Lee~ ~~To Kill a Mockingbird~~ — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
– The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
:I started yesterday and continued today. No bad stuff yet. :) Hope there :isn’t any to come….. : :He said 3-4 days 1/2 lex pill = 5mg. with 1/2 my zoloft dosage :Then go up to 10mg. : :almost 2 days down already! Glad it`s going well. Good luck with the lexapro, I hope it works out for you Jackie ~*~Every time you are tempted to react in the same old way, ask if you want to be a prisoner of the past or a pioneer of the future~*~ ~ Deepak Chopra ~ — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
I meed with the doc tomorrow. Called this morning and got an appt. – what luck
Hope the appointment is productive! Let us know how it goes. xxoo Anne — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
:I meed with the doc tomorrow. Called this morning and got an appt. – what :luck How did your appt go? I hope well. Tell us about it Jackie ~*~I wanted you to see what real courage is, instead of getting the idea that courage is a man with a gun in his hand. It’s when you know you’re licked before you begin but you begin anyway and you see it through no matter what~*~ ~Harper Lee~ ~~To Kill a Mockingbird~~ — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
Thanks Anne and Jacqueline for the followups. I meed with the doc tomorrow. Called this morning and got an appt. – what luck Hope you are well.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – :I went to sleep and was startled awake probably 10 times the first hour. I :kept startling MYSELF awake. When my anxiety and panic is really bad, this is what happens to me. Some nights it was so bad that I couldn`t sleep at all. It was like my body just couldn`t relax, it was so use to being tense. :The funny thing is that there really isn’t :anything stressful going on in my life right now. Things are looking up, :got some nice trips planned with my wife. Makes no sense, huh 
I`ve had times in my life where there was no reason to be anxious or panicky, I just was. Then times…. when I should have been paralyzed by anxiety due to lifes stressors, that it didn`t rear it`s ugly head. :It just feels like lately a "grim :reaper" type of feeling keeps pecking at me, ruining all the good times – :making everything difficult. When you get to this point, changes have to be made. No need to suffer like this when something could help. :The doc said that I’d cut my zoloft dose by 50% and take a 50% dose of :celexa for a few weeks and then see what happens. : :Anyone else make this switch and have any comments? I`ve never made a switch like this, but many others have with great success. Good luck and I hope you see some positive changes soon Jackie ~*~Yes there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run, there’s still time to change the road you’re on~*~" — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
– The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
:I went to sleep and was startled awake probably 10 times the first hour. I :kept startling MYSELF awake. When my anxiety and panic is really bad, this is what happens to me. Some nights it was so bad that I couldn`t sleep at all. It was like my body just couldn`t relax, it was so use to being tense. :The funny thing is that there really isn’t :anything stressful going on in my life right now. Things are looking up, :got some nice trips planned with my wife. Makes no sense, huh I`ve had times in my life where there was no reason to be anxious or panicky, I just was. Then times…. when I should have been paralyzed by anxiety due to lifes stressors, that it didn`t rear it`s ugly head. :It just feels like lately a "grim :reaper" type of feeling keeps pecking at me, ruining all the good times – :making everything difficult. When you get to this point, changes have to be made. No need to suffer like this when something could help. :The doc said that I’d cut my zoloft dose by 50% and take a 50% dose of :celexa for a few weeks and then see what happens. : :Anyone else make this switch and have any comments? I`ve never made a switch like this, but many others have with great success. Good luck and I hope you see some positive changes soon Jackie ~*~Yes there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run, there’s still time to change the road you’re on~*~" — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
Hi all, I wrote recently about how I’ve been on zoloft for 8 years and tried to taper off 2 times. Last year I weaned back up to my normal dose of zoloft, but still things don’t seem very good. I am doing ok during the days, but when evening comes, I start to feel the anxiety setting in. Last night I took a xanax to help with it, and it was still pretty bad. I haven’t been sleeping well lately so I’ll take a tylenol pm too. I went to sleep and was startled awake probably 10 times the first hour. I kept startling MYSELF awake. I wake up feeling about 80% ok. the other 20% is that oh-so dark feeling. The funny thing is that there really isn’t anything stressful going on in my life right now. Things are looking up, got some nice trips planned with my wife. It just feels like lately a "grim reaper" type of feeling keeps pecking at me, ruining all the good times – making everything difficult. The doc said that I’d cut my zoloft dose by 50% and take a 50% dose of celexa for a few weeks and then see what happens. Anyone else make this switch and have any comments? thanks, Phil — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
The doc said that I’d cut my zoloft dose by 50% and take a 50% dose of celexa for a few weeks and then see what happens.
I did that with Paxil– Celexa, Phil. I tapered down on the Paxil slowly (Verrrrry slowly!) from 30 mg per day to 10 mg. I began to feel some breakthrough depression then, so my pdoc switched me immediately to 10 mg Celexa (discontinuing the Paxil) and I weaned up to 20 mg Celexa. This worked very well for me. I did have to wait a bit longer for the Celexa to address all my issues (depression in particular) than I had with the Paxil originally, but it was worth it — a great med for me, with almost no side effects. I hope the switch will work for you. It’s definitely better than going cold turkey off the Zoloft. xxoo Anne — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm
<Gale.Schu…@risperdal.causes.mania
wrote in message
news:cv50ducnc4u11fr799r6265i8vu3k60t76@4ax.com…
Effexor Withdrawal Causing Crackling Sounds in the Brain Antidepressants "Thank God for this website." I had a nervous breakdown six years ago and after being on other
anti-depressants without
a problem, my psychiatrist felt that Effexor had less of an effect on the
heart, and so
switched me to Effexor. I have tried unsuccessfully to quit on many
occasions, even though
I only take 37.5 mgs per day. The extreme lethargy I feel when I have
tried to quit, the
tingling in various parts of my body, the weird dreams and most
troublesome of all, the
crackling, electric sounds in my head have caused me too much distress to
ever be
successful.
Hi, I think that you have to think about all these side effect problems. Maybe they are not side-effect, maybe they are only telling you that you are stressed, and you need to fix your problems, otherwise the side-problems will be forever with you B
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -"barbapic" <barba…@ntlworld.com
wrote in message <news:go%z8.821$8n2.364518@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com… <Gale.Schu…@risperdal.causes.mania wrote in message news:cv50ducnc4u11fr799r6265i8vu3k60t76@4ax.com… Effexor Withdrawal Causing Crackling Sounds in the Brain Antidepressants "Thank God for this website." I had a nervous breakdown six years ago and after being on other anti-depressants without a problem, my psychiatrist felt that Effexor had less of an effect on the heart, and so switched me to Effexor. I have tried unsuccessfully to quit on many occasions, even though I only take 37.5 mgs per day. The extreme lethargy I feel when I have tried to quit, the tingling in various parts of my body, the weird dreams and most troublesome of all, the crackling, electric sounds in my head have caused me too much distress to ever be successful. Hi, I think that you have to think about all these side effect problems. Maybe they are not side-effect, maybe they are only telling you that you are stressed, and you need to fix your problems, otherwise the side-problems will be forever with you B
I thought cross-posting to and from different kind of newsgroups was not the reason why they started alt.support.schizofrenia. Btw, is it not forbidden in the FAQ ? Berty
Hi Stan and Teilhard I stopped taking one type of medication because my husband said it didn’t make me better. he said I was better on the previous type. So i stopped for 3 days to switchover. but i didn’t cut down first. that’s where i made the mistake. i’m already in therapy and have been for a year. i don’t know if it helps. i’ve been up and down throughout the year and this time i’m back to where i was when i started the therapy. no perhaps this time i’m worse. this time i want to die. i haven’t felt this bad before. i’ve told my son that i’m very sick and may not get better, so he’s prepared. i can only see this as the way to free the pain. otherwise it will always be with me here. sue
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sounds like the medication has tranquilized you quite a bit. Maybe you need time to get stabilized. What has been happening with you? Why have you stopped the medication? Oh, by the way, welcome to ASD. Stan hi i’m Sue. i’m horribly depressed. the last 3 days i thought would be the end of me. but apparently coming off medication too quickly can have bad effects on you. i’m on different medication now. i feel lifeless,i look around my house and things are not familiar anymore. they look dull. the sky looks dull, my family look dull.all day spent in bed just lying there, not even sleeping, just lying thinking of what? i don’t even know. when does the madness go away. Remove "JUNK" for my valid address.
hi i’m Sue. i’m horribly depressed. the last 3 days i thought would be the end of me. but apparently coming off medication too quickly can have bad effects on you. i’m on different medication now. i feel lifeless,i look around my house and things are not familiar anymore. they look dull. the sky looks dull, my family look dull.all day spent in bed just lying there, not even sleeping, just lying thinking of what? i don’t even know. when does the madness go away.
Welcome to ASD, Sue. The only think I can recommend is looking for professional help. Seems you have seen a pdoc by your reference to medications. Why did you stop taking them? I hope you didn’t do it without supervision, that might be the cause you are feeling bad now. The other thing is therapy, but only you know whether you need it. Good luck to you, and feel free to post anything you like. — Teilhard The Extraterrestrial Eat the sandwich to email.
Sounds like the medication has tranquilized you quite a bit. Maybe you need time to get stabilized. What has been happening with you? Why have you stopped the medication? Oh, by the way, welcome to ASD. Stan hi i’m Sue. i’m horribly depressed. the last 3 days i thought would be the end of me. but apparently coming off medication too quickly can have bad effects on you. i’m on different medication now. i feel lifeless,i look around my house and things are not familiar anymore. they look dull. the sky looks dull, my family look dull.all day spent in bed just lying there, not even sleeping, just lying thinking of what? i don’t even know. when does the madness go away.
Remove "JUNK" for my valid address.
hi i’m Sue. i’m horribly depressed. the last 3 days i thought would be the end of me. but apparently coming off medication too quickly can have bad effects on you. i’m on different medication now. i feel lifeless,i look around my house and things are not familiar anymore. they look dull. the sky looks dull, my family look dull.all day spent in bed just lying there, not even sleeping, just lying thinking of what? i don’t even know. when does the madness go away.
Hi Stan and Teilhard I stopped taking one type of medication because my husband said it didn’t make me better. he said I was better on the previous type. So i stopped for 3 days to switchover. but i didn’t cut down first. that’s where i made the mistake. i’m already in therapy and have been for a year. i don’t know if it helps. i’ve been up and down throughout the year and this time i’m back to where i was when i started the therapy. no perhaps this time i’m worse. this time i want to die. i haven’t felt this bad before. i’ve told my son that i’m very sick and may not get better, so he’s prepared. i can only see this as the way to free the pain. otherwise it will always be with me here. sue
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sounds like the medication has tranquilized you quite a bit. Maybe you need time to get stabilized. What has been happening with you? Why have you stopped the medication? Oh, by the way, welcome to ASD. Stan hi i’m Sue. i’m horribly depressed. the last 3 days i thought would be the end of me. but apparently coming off medication too quickly can have bad effects on you. i’m on different medication now. i feel lifeless,i look around my house and things are not familiar anymore. they look dull. the sky looks dull, my family look dull.all day spent in bed just lying there, not even sleeping, just lying thinking of what? i don’t even know. when does the madness go away. Remove "JUNK" for my valid address.
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Sounds like the medication has tranquilized you quite a bit. Maybe you need time to get stabilized. What has been happening with you? Why have you stopped the medication? Oh, by the way, welcome to ASD. Stan hi i’m Sue. i’m horribly depressed. the last 3 days i thought would be the end of me. but apparently coming off medication too quickly can have bad effects on you. i’m on different medication now. i feel lifeless,i look around my house and things are not familiar anymore. they look dull. the sky looks dull, my family look dull.all day spent in bed just lying there, not even sleeping, just lying thinking of what? i don’t even know. when does the madness go away.
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – inscribed: hi i’m Sue. i’m horribly depressed. the last 3 days i thought would be the end of me. but apparently coming off medication too quickly can have bad effects on you. hi Sue, and welcome to asd. did your doctor tell you to go off the medication? doctors are really the only ones who should be deciding what medication works best for you. sometimes coming off a med too quickly can have pretty rotten side effects. i’m on different medication now. i feel lifeless,i look around my house and things are not familiar anymore. they look dull. the sky looks dull, my family look dull.all day spent in bed just lying there, not even sleeping, just lying thinking of what? i don’t even know. what are you taking? i’m on Zoloft (sertraline), but have been on several different meds. it typically takes about six weeks or so before one notices an effect from the medications and if they’re working or not. sk
Hi SunKitten, are you finding the Zoloft works for you? my son was on zoloft but we have weaned him off it. It’s been 6 weeks now. he goes back to school this week, so this will be the big test to see if he’s going to cope without medication. He’s only 7, so we don’t want him on medication if he can do without it. Sue
hi i’m Sue.
snip Hello Sue; welcome to ASD. Make yourself at home ) — — Whiskers
hi i’m Sue. snip Hello Sue; welcome to ASD. Make yourself at home ) — — Whiskers
Thanks Whiskers
discoursed thusly: I stopped taking one type of medication because my husband said it didn’t make me better. he said I was better on the previous type. So i stopped for 3 days to switchover. but i didn’t cut down first. that’s where i made the mistake. No, Sue, that’s not where you made your mistake. You made your mistake when you let your husband make your medication decisions for you. Is your husband also your medical doctor?
no, but he is right. i can see that now. i have thought back over the last few months while taking a new medication, and i really have been worse than previously. Because if he isn’t, then the only person who should be telling you what medication is helping you, is YOU. I get the feeling that your husband is also the one who taught you to refer to your depression as "madness", as you called it when in your first post you asked when does the madness stop. Depression is not madness, it’s a disease that mingles physiological problems with psychological problems. Most people respond best to a mix of the *right* medication and the *right* therapy. But it has the be the meds and therapist that are right for YOU.
I don’t know if I’ve found the right therapist. I’ve been to so many before, and this is the first one i’ve stuck with. Usually i stop going after a couple of sessions. Have you talked with your medical doctor at all about changing your medication? Have you discussed the different types of medication that are available in Australia, and decided with the advice of your doctor what you should be taking?
yes, my psychiatrist has been in contact with me over the weekend. I’ve tried many different tablets. sometimes they work for awhile but then dont seem as effective. Which meds are you taking, which meds were you taking, and never mind what your husband says makes you better, how did you feel while you were taking them?
I’ve just gone back onto Aropax (Paroxetine). I was on Efexor-xr. Folks in asd will gladly give you all the support and understanding (and information about our own depression experiences) that we can. But if your husband needs depression support, he’ll have to write his own posts, about his own depression issues. We are here to help you with *your* problems. Welcome to asd.
Thank you – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Tara J. Ballance Montreal, Canada
hi i’m Sue. i’m horribly depressed. the last 3 days i thought would be the end of me. but apparently coming off medication too quickly can have bad effects on you. i’m on different medication now. i feel lifeless,i look around my house and things are not familiar anymore. they look dull. the sky looks dull, my family look dull.all day spent in bed just lying there, not even sleeping, just lying thinking of what? i don’t even know. when does the madness go away.
Welcome to ASD, Sue. The only think I can recommend is looking for professional help. Seems you have seen a pdoc by your reference to medications. Why did you stop taking them? I hope you didn’t do it without supervision, that might be the cause you are feeling bad now. The other thing is therapy, but only you know whether you need it. Good luck to you, and feel free to post anything you like. — Teilhard The Extraterrestrial Eat the sandwich to email. X-No-Archive: yes Newsgroups: microsoft.test,alt.flame.niggers,alt.support.depression NNTP-Posting-Host: w088.z064003087.lax-ca.dsl.cnc.net 64.3.87.88 Lines: 1 Path: news.uni-stuttgart.de!rz.uni-karlsruhe.de!news.uni-ulm.de!news.belwue.de!ne ws-stu1.dfn.de!news-koe1.dfn.de!news-was.dfn.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu! news.maxwell.syr.edu!out.nntp.be!propagator-SanJose!in.nntp.be!news-in-sanj ose!sjc-feed.news.verio.net!sea-feed.news.verio.net!news.verio.net!msrnewsc 1!cppssbbsa01.microsoft.com!tkmsftngp01!tkmsftngp04!u&n&a&c&anceller Xref: news.uni-stuttgart.de control:40727072 This message was cancelled from within The Unacanceller’s glorious new software, Lotus 1-2-3 For Rogue Cancellers.
hi i’m Sue. snip Hello Sue; welcome to ASD. Make yourself at home ) — — Whiskers
Thanks Whiskers X-No-Archive: yes Newsgroups: microsoft.test,alt.flame.niggers,alt.support.depression NNTP-Posting-Host: w088.z064003087.lax-ca.dsl.cnc.net 64.3.87.88 Lines: 1 Path: news.uni-stuttgart.de!rz.uni-karlsruhe.de!news.uni-ulm.de!news.belwue.de!ne wsfeed.arcor-online.net!fr.clara.net!heighliner.fr.clara.net!news.stealth.n et!msrtrans1!msrnewsc1!cppssbbsa01.microsoft.com!tkmsftngp01!tkmsftngp03!u& n&a&c&anceller Xref: news.uni-stuttgart.de control:40726147 This message was cancelled from within The Unacanceller’s glorious new software, Lotus 1-2-3 For Rogue Cancellers.
hi i’m Sue.
snip Hello Sue; welcome to ASD. Make yourself at home ) — — Whiskers X-No-Archive: yes Newsgroups: microsoft.test,alt.flame.niggers,alt.support.depression NNTP-Posting-Host: w088.z064003087.lax-ca.dsl.cnc.net 64.3.87.88 Lines: 1 Path: news.uni-stuttgart.de!news.fh-hannover.de!fu-berlin.de!news.maxwell.syr.edu !out.nntp.be!propagator-SanJose!in.nntp.be!news-in-sanjose!sjc-feed.news.ve rio.net!sea-feed.news.verio.net!news.verio.net!msrnewsc1!cppssbbsa01.micros oft.com!tkmsftngp01!tkmsftngp03!u&n&a&c&anceller Xref: news.uni-stuttgart.de control:40719458 This message was cancelled from within The Unacanceller’s glorious new software, Lotus 1-2-3 For Rogue Cancellers.
I’ve just gone back onto Aropax (Paroxetine). I was on Efexor-xr.
Gosh. How long had you been taking Effexor? It is one of the anti-depressants which must be quit with outmost care, AND supervision. It takes about three weeks (or longer) to make you feel better, and I do not know how you should quit, because I am still on it. But one thing you must never forget: *do not do change anything in the way you medicate unless your pdoc says so*, not your husband. — Teilhard The Extraterrestrial Eat the sandwich to email.
I used to have the same side effects. It lasted long, at least a month. I wasn’t working at that time. About an hour after taking 10mg I got pale and sweaty on the face, extremely sleepy and had a terrible headache. Cofee helped me a lot, that I normally don’t drink cause it boosts my anxiety when in stressful situations. I felt better taking Paxil early in the morning or in the night; the worst in the afternoon (It’ still like that). Nowadays (after a year) I get a bit drowsy with a headache after taking Paxil, but not more often than once a week, especially when I take it irregulary. boasss
Well, I guess that I am certainly living proof that side affects don’t "affect" everyone. I’ve been on Paxil for over a year now, and have nothing but positive things about it. It does work, and it does help. If the side effects are too much, that’s one thing, but just because a few people get them doesn’t mean you will! "sssboa" <sss…@goto.hell.pl
wrote in message
news:9hdu8m$slm$1@news.tpi.pl… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
I used to have the same side effects. It lasted long, at least a month. I wasn’t working at that time. About an hour after taking 10mg I got pale
and
sweaty on the face, extremely sleepy and had a terrible headache. Cofee helped me a lot, that I normally don’t drink cause it boosts my anxiety
when
in stressful situations. I felt better taking Paxil early in the morning
or
in the night; the worst in the afternoon (It’ still like that). Nowadays (after a year) I get a bit drowsy with a headache after taking Paxil, but not more often than once a week, especially when I take it irregulary. boasss
I don’t consider my side-effects serious after all. boasss
Man, I just started paxil yesterday and all I have been doing is sleeping. Good thing I had yesterday and today off from work. I am sleeping more now than I did from depression. And when I am sleeping I am OUT. Laid down for a nap tonight at 7:30pm cause I couldn’t keep my eyes open and the next thing I knew it was 11pm. Damn. Anyone else have this side effect? I hope it goes away. I also have a slight headache right at my forehead but I don’t know if that is from too much sleep or the meds.
meow wrote:
Man, I just started paxil yesterday and all I have been doing is sleeping. Good thing I had yesterday and today off from work. I am sleeping more now than I did from depression. And when I am sleeping I am OUT. Laid down for a nap tonight at 7:30pm cause I couldn’t keep my eyes open and the next thing I knew it was 11pm. Damn. Anyone else have this side effect? I hope it goes away. I also have a slight headache right at my forehead but I don’t know if that is from too much sleep or the meds.
The head ache can be a side effect of paxil as well as the sleeping. At what time of the day are you taking the drug? Try to take all your dose before you go to bed. If it doesn’t matter when you take it, i.e. you are sleepy all day then I would try another drug. I used to get sleepy from taking paxil and a headache sometimes. Richard
In article <ncqijtsfejqfv4jp0f616an32tnjpfg…@4ax.com
, meow <nospammeo…@rochester.com writes: Man, I just started paxil yesterday and all I have been doing is sleeping. Good thing I had yesterday and today off from work. I am sleeping more now than I did from depression. And when I am sleeping I am OUT. Laid down for a nap tonight at 7:30pm cause I couldn’t keep my eyes open and the next thing I knew it was 11pm. Damn. Anyone else have this side effect? I hope it goes away. I also have a slight headache right at my forehead but I don’t know if that is from too much sleep or the meds.
Paxil had me so out of it that if I wasn’t sleeping, I had to be flat on my back to avoid getting queezy. Take a good look at the side effects list for paxil. I found that I suffered practically all of them. Worse still was coming off of it. I had become so dependant that standing up became a challenge – I’d suddenly have my equilibrium jolt off one way or another and practically fall over. This happened for MONTHS after getting off of it. If you can at all avoid it, stay away from the stuff and go with something less volatile. I’m on effexir now, and while missing a day leaves me cranky as all get-out, it is night-and-day better than paxil ever was. rOn
Paxil had me so out of it that if I wasn’t sleeping, I had to be flat on my back to avoid getting queezy. Take a good look at the side effects list for paxil. I found that I suffered practically all of them. Worse still was coming off of it. I had become so dependant that standing up became a challenge – I’d suddenly have my equilibrium jolt off one way or another and practically fall over. This happened for MONTHS after getting off of it.
rOn:
If you can at all avoid it, stay away from the stuff and go with something less volatile. I’m on effexir now, and while missing a day leaves me cranky as all get-out, it is night-and-day better than paxil ever was.
I went from Paxil to Effexor, too. I agree, it’s ten times better. Thing is, though (according to my doc), you should never miss an Effexor dose AT ALL.Yah, it will make you cranky. For my kids’ sake, I make sure I refill early. JLeon
David responds: You are lucky that you only felt a little wired! Approximately 25% of people who have used Zoloft and Prozac type meds have experienced some of the MANY side effects listed on the rap sheet available at the pharmacy. Of those 25% I experienced a reaction several hours after taking my first pill; nausea and diarrhea. The next day, after taking my second pill, I plunged headlong into every known side effect listed by the pharmaceutical company and then some. I was not predisposed to expect any; in fact my GP made it sound like this was a miracle drug, cure-all and I couldn’t wait to take it in anticipation of relief from PD. After the second pill I experienced the following violent reactions: -Severe nausea without vomitting -Six substantial bowel discharges of pink water only -Vertigo so severe, that I had to crawl to the toilet -Stabbing pinpoint pain in the back of my head, lower left side -Severe chills while sweating profusely alternating with… -Severe hot flashes, while my skin was contracting into goosebumps -Total body weakness -Body spasms -Upon closing my eyes, pictures of brilliantly coloured (dazzling) mundane objects would rotate through my ‘mind’s eye’, akin to what people have described while on a bad LSD trip. -Uncontrollable shaking and trembling -Inability to sleep for two full nights It took three days to recuperate enough to be able to get up and around again. I checked with my doctor and pharmacist and both claimed that none of these symtoms were unusual but said that most people who do experience side effects, only have one or two at most. However, my supervisor at work had taken Zoloft a year prior to me and had never spoken about his experience till I told him mine. He had suffered the same reactions on the day of his second pill. Just recounting my experience brought him to tears, thinking back to how bad his reaction had been. I was switched to Paxil and then to Manerix (sp??) Both of those drugs caused lesser but totally intolerable side effects mostly in the GI tract. One year after my encounter with Zoloft, a young woman at the office was prescribed the same drug and dosage and she only experienced nausea for the first week and then was perfectly fine. However, three years into her therapy and still on Zoloft, she has not conquered one symptom of PD and is now on long term disability insurance, unable to work and suffering severely from agoraphobia. She considers it a triumph to get out of her flat once a month, with the help of two friends; one on either side of her. Three years of Zoloft and at thirty three she has been reduced to a fearful, agoraphobic, unemployed and suicidal mess. While I agree that different drug therapies and also combinations of therapies are needed based on the individual rather than the disorder, I would tend to agree that benzos are most efficient for PD. My specialist agrees and only uses Paxil or Zoloft if firstly, the patient can tolerate it, and secondly, they have chronic depression as well as PD. He has been treating PD exclusively for 25 years and finds that almost everyone who cannot tolerate Prozac family of drugs for depression, can tolerate Imipramine. Unfortunately one must go through 4-6 weeks of extremely light sleep before tolerating it. This is the reason that Imipramine was prescribed at one time for children who were bed-wetters. It kept them from achieving deep levels of sleep, given in short, periodic doses. I think you will find great success with the benzo route but do not be discouraged if Klonopin is not the one which works for you and your body chemistry. I had miraculous freedom from severe PD in a three stage therapy starting with Xanax (extremely fast acting, short lived), euphoric relief with Lectopam (medium lasting) as my doctor brought me down to Rivotril (very long lasting) which keeps the symtoms at bay but not as effectively as the fast acting benzos. My advice would be that if the Klonopin is not working to your satisfction within ten days, it probably is not the drug you need and you should try a new one. Good luck with your new meds.!! David To other readers; I am not knocking Zoloft as a med. I just feel that people should be aware that they MIGHT be unfortunate enough to experience mild to severe side effects. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I guess Zoloft and I were not a match made in heaven. After just three days I found myself so wired last night, I felt like I had eaten an entire package of No Doz! This was entirely different than the generalized anxiety I often feel. I called the p-doc around 10:30 and he told me to stop taking it. I’m seeing him Friday to talk about what’s next. Probably benzos. Most likely Klonopin. So, all of you Klonopin success stories–I’d love to hear them! Iris —
IMO, we should all become our own doctors as it’s our bodies. No, I don’t mean not to consult an actual doctor; you know what I mean. Love and hugs to the whooooole board. Janie. I entirely agree with you, Janie – that we need to educate ourselves to the maximum about our conditions and then work *with* our doctors
Not that you would ever be encouraged by any doctor to actually do so of course… Job security and all that. Iris —
I’m becoming more convinced of that everyday. Based on what I’ve read here and elsewhere, it seems benzos have the better track record by far. That’s not to discount SSRI’s or any AD, but for dealing with the disabling panic quickly, benzos seem to be the way to go. My thought now is to deal with the panic and anticipatory anxiety which is crippling me right now. Then, if I find some underlying depression, or things still a
Iris, even when I took SSRI’s for Depression, they made me so agitated that I had to take them with Klonopin. this was way before I had PD. So I have strong opinions about treating PD with SSRIs as the first step. Benzos would seem a much wiser way to go. As Cooper said, there is no proven link between Serotonin and PD as there is with Serotonin and Depression. That’s why my Doc back in Boston was adamant about my going on Parnate, an MAO, and sticking with the Benzos. He does nothing but research in psychopharmacology and really knows this stuff backwards and forwards. And he’s been following me from a distance and hooking me up with good docs wherever I move to, for 17 years, even though I’ve been gone from Boston all that time. As us Jews say, this is a real "mensch". This means MAN in Yiddish. As in good, responsible, kind, etc.. Listen, this guy is a genius. his name is Dr. Harrison Pope. He’s at McLean Hospital in Belmont. He does 99% research but he does have one patient. I call it his private private private practice. At the very least he could refer you to someone who knows PD inside and out. He knows everyone in and out of Boston who’s in the field. This may not be covered by insurance but it would be worth it to talk to someone who really cares and really knows his stuff. He was in the Esquire "most promising people under 40" section. Has been on 20/20, etc. Sorry to extoll his virtues ad nauseum but I don’t like or trust many people and he’s one of those few. If you want, e-mail me and I will hook you up with him. He’s a doll and he listens and he cares. I’m sorry I didn’t think of this sooner. I only recently figured out that you live in Boston and that you were only on an AD. I really believe that that Benzos will help you, Iris. You deserve to sleep and have some quality of life. If the doc you have doesn’t listen to you or doesn’t seem knowledgeable, then let me know. All of us in here are praying for you, Iris. all our love, Veronica et al WRITER/CATCH MY TRAIN OF THOUGHT "You can’t have everything. Where would you put it?" (Steven Wright)
David responds: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (Casamiro) writes: own doctor! Iris IMO, we should all become our own doctors as it’s our bodies. No, I don’t mean not to consult an actual doctor; you know what I mean. ME TOO. In fact, my own doctor believes this as well. He thinks people need to read up and be informed of what is going on, as not all doctors do. He also left the option to take xanax as my choice, since he told me it was ‘addictive’ and I would need to be weaned off of it.
My doctor has been treating PD for over twenty-five years and he encourages his patients to participate in their meds therapy. As a responsible and caring doctor, he encourages all patients who are able, to become their own ’specialist’ by providing as much info as possible about PD and about the meds. In his book on PD he lists several pages of treatment therapies based on how the PD is manifesting, by sypmtoms. He also speaks harshly about people (doctors and researchers included) who say that certain meds such as Xanax are "addictive". The analogy is; is insulin addictive given that a diabetic needs it every day and suffers seriously if the drug is withdrawn? The same applies to Xanax, one of the most beneficial drugs in fighting PD. So much bullshit is put on the ‘net about Xanax and people love to recount their horror stories of coming "off" the drug. If someone has an allergic reaction, I can sympathize since I am allergic to many meds including pain killers, but this is a different issue. The problem with Xanax is that it is clean, efficient, fast acting and not only controls PD but eliminates it for the short duration that it stays active in one’s body. The sad part is that most GPs will only prescribe .5 mg. three times per day, when the American Psychiatric Ass. recommends that up to 6-9 mg. may be required to effectively control PD. One of the reasons that doctors try to get patients off Xanax and on a slow acting benzo is simply to eliminate the need to take pills every two to three hours. I feel sorry for those who recount all the terrible withdrawal symptoms and the living hell they went through coming off Xanax, when in fact all that really happened was a reoccurrence of PD symptoms. It’s sad that people with PD can’t recognize the symptoms of their own disorder and try to blame them on drug withdrawal. One more reason that we need to be ‘our own doctors’. Not by securing drugs without the consent of a doctor, but by becoming aware of the nature of PD and each of the many symptoms it creates. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Lee
Hi, Iris. I just tried to send you email but it bounced. Do you have spam-preventing characters in your address, perchance? Thanks — –Kathleen — "Hope is the thing with feathers" — Emily Dickinson Delete * in address to reply by e-mail
(Casamiro) writes: own doctor! Iris
IMO, we should all become our own doctors as it’s our bodies. No, I don’t mean
not to consult an actual doctor; you know what I mean.
ME TOO. In fact, my own doctor believes this as well. He thinks people need to read up and be informed of what is going on, as not all doctors do. He also left the option to take xanax as my choice, since he told me it was ‘addictive’ and I would need to be weaned off of it. Lee A little snogging goes a long way… <EG
I guess Zoloft and I were not a match made in heaven. After just three days I found myself so wired last night, I felt like I had eaten an entire package of No Doz! This was entirely different than the generalized anxiety I often feel. I called the p-doc around 10:30 and he told me to
stop taking it. I’m seeing him Friday to talk about what’s next.
Probably benzos. Most likely Klonopin. So, all of you Klonopin success
stories–I’d love to hear them! Sorry to hear this Iris. But at least now you know you can take medication. That in itself is something to celebrate. Good luck with the next one :):) Lee A little snogging goes a long way… <EG
David responds: You are lucky that you only felt a little wired! Approximately 25% of people who have used Zoloft and Prozac type meds have experienced some of the MANY side effects listed on the rap sheet available at the pharmacy. Of those 25% I experienced a reaction several hours after taking my first pill; nausea and diarrhea. The next day, after taking my second pill, I plunged headlong into every known side effect listed by the pharmaceutical company and then some. I was not predisposed to expect any; in fact my GP made it sound like this was a miracle drug, cure-all and I couldn’t wait to take it in anticipation of relief from PD. After the second pill I experienced the following violent reactions: -Severe nausea without vomitting -Six substantial bowel discharges of pink water only -Vertigo so severe, that I had to crawl to the toilet -Stabbing pinpoint pain in the back of my head, lower left side -Severe chills while sweating profusely alternating with… -Severe hot flashes, while my skin was contracting into goose bumps -Total body weakness -Body spasms -Upon closing my eyes, pictures of brilliantly coloured (dazzling) mundane objects would rotate through my ‘mind’s eye’, akin to what people have described while on a bad LSD trip. -Uncontrollable shaking and trembling -Inability to sleep for two full nights It took three days to recuperate enough to be able to get up and around again. I checked with my doctor and pharmacist and both claimed that none of these symptoms were unusual but said that most people who do experience side effects, only have one or two at most. However, my supervisor at work had taken Zoloft a year prior to me and had never spoken about his experience till I told him mine. He had suffered the same reactions on the day of his second pill. Just recounting my experience brought him to tears, thinking back to how bad his reaction had been. I was switched to Paxil and then to Manerix (sp??) Both of those drugs caused lesser but totally intolerable side effects mostly in the GI tract. One year after my encounter with Zoloft, a young woman at the office was prescribed the same drug and dosage and she only experienced nausea for the first week and then was perfectly fine. However, three years into her therapy and still on Zoloft, she has not conquered one symptom of PD and is now on long term disability insurance, unable to work and suffering severely from agoraphobia. She considers it a triumph to get out of her flat once a month, with the help of two friends; one on either side of her. Three years of Zoloft and at thirty three she has been reduced to a fearful, agoraphobic, unemployed and suicidal mess. While I agree that different drug therapies and also combinations of therapies are needed based on the individual rather than the disorder, I would tend to agree that benzos are most efficient for PD. My specialist agrees and only uses Paxil or Zoloft if firstly, the patient can tolerate it, and secondly, they have chronic depression as well as PD. He has been treating PD exclusively for 25 years and finds that almost everyone who cannot tolerate Prozac family of drugs for depression, can tolerate Imipramine. Unfortunately one must go through 4-6 weeks of extremely light sleep before tolerating it. This is the reason that Imipramine was prescribed at one time for children who were bed-wetters. It kept them from achieving deep levels of sleep, given in short, periodic doses. I think you will find great success with the benzo route but do not be discouraged if Klonopin is not the one which works for you and your body chemistry. I had miraculous freedom from severe PD in a three stage therapy starting with Xanax (extremely fast acting, short lived), euphoric relief with Lectopam (medium lasting) as my doctor brought me down to Rivotril (very long lasting) which keeps the symtoms at bay but not as effectively as the fast acting benzos. My advice would be that if the Klonopin is not working to your satisfaction within ten days, it probably is not the drug you need and you should try a new one. Good luck with your new meds.!! David To other readers; I am not knocking Zoloft as a med. I just feel that people should be aware that they MIGHT be unfortunate enough to experience mild to severe side effects. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I guess Zoloft and I were not a match made in heaven. After just three days I found myself so wired last night, I felt like I had eaten an entire package of No Doz! This was entirely different than the generalized anxiety I often feel. I called the p-doc around 10:30 and he told me to stop taking it. I’m seeing him Friday to talk about what’s next. Probably benzos. Most likely Klonopin. So, all of you Klonopin success stories–I’d love to hear them! Iris —
The doctor put me on zoloft for depression and panic attacks with agorophobia and the result was like magic, at least with respect to the panic attacks: after 24 hours (1 dose!) NO MORE PANIC ATTACKS and no more AGOROPHOBIA! The depression remains and I continue to take the Zoloft for it. The major side effect that I experience is insomnia (can’t get to sleep) but once I get to sleep I sleep better than ever. I just got some Ambien for sleep — I’ll try the first pill tonight. I just hope that it works for my depression. I have read that it takes between 7 and 28 days to see the antidepressant effects of Zoloft. I’m taking only 50 mg a day.
I’m very glad you are able to take the Zoloft with such success. However, I don’t know if it is that effective after just one dose. When I took Zoloft, the big buzz would set in 10-12 hours after I took it. I was taking my dose in the morning, but in retrospect, taking it at night would have been better. If you think about when the drug affects you most and adjust the timing of your dose accordingly, it may help. Sorry I can’t be more optimistic re: Zoloft. I only took it 4 days but I couldn’t stand the way it made me feel. Iris —
doctor! Iris
IMO, we should all become our own doctors as it’s our bodies. No, I don’t mean not to consult an actual doctor; you know what I mean. Love and hugs to the whooooole board. Janie.
I’m becoming more convinced of that everyday. Based on what I’ve read here and elsewhere, it seems benzos have the better track record by far. That’s not to discount SSRI’s or any AD, but for dealing with the disabling panic quickly, benzos seem to be the way to go. My thought now is to deal with the panic and anticipatory anxiety which is crippling me right now. Then, if I find some underlying depression, or things still aren’t "right" I’d consider the AD. In this case, most likely Prozac since I have two family members who have taken it for depression with no side effects (three, if you count our dog!). Also, Prozac can be taken in liquid form, so I could start with as little as 2-5 mg and work my way up.
Actually, that’s a very good point, Iris. A long while ago, the reminder that Prozac is available in liquid form was commonly given on this NG and we’ve rather let that drop of late. It could be the ideal way for people starting Prozac to begin. Sheesh–I"m becoming my own doctor!
Who else would you trust? — Gary Cooper
IMO, we should all become our own doctors as it’s our bodies. No, I don’t mean not to consult an actual doctor; you know what I mean. Love and hugs to the whooooole board. Janie.
I entirely agree with you, Janie – that we need to educate ourselves to the maximum about our conditions and then work *with* our doctors — Gary Cooper
The doctor put me on zoloft for depression and panic attacks with agorophobia and the result was like magic, at least with respect to the panic attacks: after 24 hours (1 dose!) NO MORE PANIC ATTACKS and no more AGOROPHOBIA! The depression remains and I continue to take the Zoloft for it. The major side effect that I experience is insomnia (can’t get to sleep) but once I get to sleep I sleep better than ever. I just got some Ambien for sleep — I’ll try the first pill tonight. I just hope that it works for my depression. I have read that it takes between 7 and 28 days to see the antidepressant effects of Zoloft. I’m taking only 50 mg a day.
Boy, I hope Klonopin has fewer side effects! I’m just now, at 4 pm the next day, starting to feel more "normal" (whatever normal is for a PD sufferer). I’m just realizing how jittery I felt the last few days
Sorry this didn’t work for you, Iris but at least you tried and I know that was a big step for you. I hope you are giving yourself credit for that. I just got a lecture from a friend of mine who was on Xanax and Zoloft for quite some time. She’s off the Xanax now, but still on Zoloft. She told me she thought benzos wouldn’t solve the problem as they don’t affect serotonin levels, etc., etc. I told her she might not have been able to stand the Zoloft if she hadn’t been on Xanax first.
Good response and sounds like someone you might need to tune out a bit in your quest for what works for you. Sigh. I don’t know what the right answer is.
If only it was the same for all of us. I suppose it’s whatever works for me, isn’t it?
Yup, and you will find it. I think you will find the benzos much more…user friendly. Good luck! Gwen
Hi Iris I have a suggestion. My Dr. has discussed using prozac for me eventually. Now he knows of my fear of meds and I have not been able to get on an AD so far. The way he told me we would do it is to take a 10 mg prozac and open it into a 4oz baby bottle of apple juice. That way I can start on a very very low dosage 1/2 oz a day and then 1 oz a day etc… He said I would feel less side effects that way and the meds would build up slowly plus it gives me some control over the med. Maybe you could mention this to your dr. and see if it would be an option for you also. It will take longer to get to a therapeutic dosage but at least it would help with the side effects Blessings, Kelly
Boy, I hope Klonopin has fewer side effects! I’m just now, at 4 pm the next day, starting to feel more "normal" (whatever normal is for a PD sufferer). I’m just realizing how jittery I felt the last few days. By last night I wasn’t even able to think straight. My 7 year old beat me in checkers around 3pm. By 7pm I was climbing the walls. I didn’t sleep all night. I woke up wired. I can’t stand that "buzzed" feeling. I’m hoping for better results with a benzo. My p-doc says he might still want to try an AD on me–perhaps Prozac since my sister was on it with no side effects. Perhaps we’ll see. If Klonopin can do the trick right now, so be it.
Hi, Iris – I’d have thought there’s every chance that Klonopin will do the trick. To be honest, I grow more sceptical by the day about the current policy of resorting to SSRIs first. The worst Klonopin is likely to do is make you drowsy, IMO. I just got a lecture from a friend of mine who was on Xanax and Zoloft for quite some time. She’s off the Xanax now, but still on Zoloft. She told me she thought benzos wouldn’t solve the problem as they don’t affect serotonin levels, etc., etc. I told her she might not have been able to stand the Zoloft if she hadn’t been on Xanax first.
Your friend’s wrong. There is no certainty that serotonin is the implicated chemical in A/PD – it could be one of several, including GABA, which is what benzos work on. This is a case of YMMV and what worked for her simply may not be right for you. Sigh. I don’t know what the right answer is. I suppose it’s whatever works for me, isn’t it?
Cetainly is – good luck! — Gary Cooper
Hi, Iris – I’d have thought there’s every chance that Klonopin will do the trick. To be honest, I grow more sceptical by the day about the current policy of resorting to SSRIs first. The worst Klonopin is likely to do is make you drowsy, IMO.
I’m becoming more convinced of that everyday. Based on what I’ve read here and elsewhere, it seems benzos have the better track record by far. That’s not to discount SSRI’s or any AD, but for dealing with the disabling panic quickly, benzos seem to be the way to go. My thought now is to deal with the panic and anticipatory anxiety which is crippling me right now. Then, if I find some underlying depression, or things still aren’t "right" I’d consider the AD. In this case, most likely Prozac since I have two family members who have taken it for depression with no side effects (three, if you count our dog!). Also, Prozac can be taken in liquid form, so I could start with as little as 2-5 mg and work my way up. Sheesh–I"m becoming my own doctor! Iris I just got a lecture from a friend of mine who was on Xanax and Zoloft for quite some time. She’s off the Xanax now, but still on Zoloft. She told me she thought benzos wouldn’t solve the problem as they don’t affect serotonin levels, etc., etc. I told her she might not have been able to stand the Zoloft if she hadn’t been on Xanax first. Your friend’s wrong. There is no certainty that serotonin is the implicated chemical in A/PD – it could be one of several, including GABA, which is what benzos work on. This is a case of YMMV and what worked for her simply may not be right for you.
She had terrible depression as well, which at this point, I haven’t seen in myself. Iris —
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Iris I have a suggestion. My Dr. has discussed using prozac for me eventually. Now he knows of my fear of meds and I have not been able to get on an AD so far. The way he told me we would do it is to take a 10 mg prozac and open it into a 4oz baby bottle of apple juice. That way I can start on a very very low dosage 1/2 oz a day and then 1 oz a day etc… He said I would feel less side effects that way and the meds would build up slowly plus it gives me some control over the med. Maybe you could mention this to your dr. and see if it would be an option for you also. It will take longer to get to a therapeutic dosage but at least it would help with the side effects Blessings, Kelly
Good suggestion. As I posted earlier in response to Gary’s post, I’m going to get on the benzo first, see how that goes, then review whether or not I need the AD. If so, Prozac may be a good choice for me. Iris —
I guess Zoloft and I were not a match made in heaven. After just three days I found myself so wired last night, I felt like I had eaten an entire package of No Doz! This was entirely different than the generalized anxiety I often feel. I called the p-doc around 10:30 and he told me to stop taking it. I’m seeing him Friday to talk about what’s next. Probably benzos. Most likely Klonopin. So, all of you Klonopin success stories–I’d love to hear them! Iris —
I’ve been maintained on Klonopin for at least 8 years. I was able to start attending college. Hey, I was even able to SIT in the class without running for the nearest door…. I can tell you some stories about speech class! Talk about being shaky, but I made it. Hopefully, it will work for you, too.
I couldnt tolerate Zoloft either. Klonopin has helped anxiety, not a cure by any means, but it helps without any side effects. Good luck PETER
I guess Zoloft and I were not a match made in heaven. After just threedays I
found myself so wired last night, I felt like I had eaten an entirepackage of No Doz! This was entirely different than the generalizedanxiety I often feel. I called the p-doc around 10:30 and he told me tostop taking it. I’m seeing him Friday to talk about what’s next. Probably benzos. Most likely Klonopin. So, all of you Klonopin success stories–I’d love to hear them! Iris Been on Klonopin for about 10 yrs – - currently on .5(1/2mg.) 3 x per day (a
low dose IMO) for panic and generalized anxiety. I’m also on 20 mg Paxil for depression. Doing well on these dosages except when I have to do something out of the ordinary, like today I’m going to a new gym so I know I will have a huge amount of anxiety. My vote’s for Klonopin! Good luck. Love, Janie. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
I guess Zoloft and I were not a match made in heaven. After just three days I found myself so wired last night, I felt like I had eaten an entire package of No Doz! This was entirely different than the generalized anxiety I often feel. I called the p-doc around 10:30 and he told me to stop taking it. I’m seeing him Friday to talk about what’s next. Probably benzos. Most likely Klonopin. So, all of you Klonopin success stories–I’d love to hear them!
Sorry to hear it didn’t work out, Iris 
I’m one of those who also had a lot of problems with Zoloft and had to give it up – I’m sure you’ll be lots better with Klonopin, though as it has very few side effects. Good luck! — Gary Cooper
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I guess Zoloft and I were not a match made in heaven. After just three days I found myself so wired last night, I felt like I had eaten an entire package of No Doz! This was entirely different than the generalized anxiety I often feel. I called the p-doc around 10:30 and he told me to stop taking it. I’m seeing him Friday to talk about what’s next. Probably benzos. Most likely Klonopin. So, all of you Klonopin success stories–I’d love to hear them! Sorry to hear it didn’t work out, Iris I’m one of those who also had a lot of problems with Zoloft and had to give it up – I’m sure you’ll be lots better with Klonopin, though as it has very few side effects. Good luck! — Gary Cooper
Boy, I hope Klonopin has fewer side effects! I’m just now, at 4 pm the next day, starting to feel more "normal" (whatever normal is for a PD sufferer). I’m just realizing how jittery I felt the last few days. By last night I wasn’t even able to think straight. My 7 year old beat me in checkers around 3pm. By 7pm I was climbing the walls. I didn’t sleep all night. I woke up wired. I can’t stand that "buzzed" feeling. I’m hoping for better results with a benzo. My p-doc says he might still want to try an AD on me–perhaps Prozac since my sister was on it with no side effects. Perhaps we’ll see. If Klonopin can do the trick right now, so be it. I just got a lecture from a friend of mine who was on Xanax and Zoloft for quite some time. She’s off the Xanax now, but still on Zoloft. She told me she thought benzos wouldn’t solve the problem as they don’t affect serotonin levels, etc., etc. I told her she might not have been able to stand the Zoloft if she hadn’t been on Xanax first. Sigh. I don’t know what the right answer is. I suppose it’s whatever works for me, isn’t it? Iris —
Sorry to hear it didn’t work out, Iris I’m one of those who also had a lot of problems with Zoloft and had to give it up – I’m sure you’ll be lots better with Klonopin, though as it has very few side effects. Good luck! Gary Cooper Boy, I hope Klonopin has fewer side effects! I’m just now, at 4 pm thenext
day, starting to feel more "normal" (whatever normal is for a PDsufferer). I’m just realizing how jittery I felt the last few days. Bylast night I wasn’t even able to think straight. My 7 year old beat me incheckers around 3pm. By 7pm I was climbing the walls. I didn’t sleep allnight. I woke up wired. I can’t stand that "buzzed" feeling. I’m hopingfor better results with a benzo. My p-doc says he might still want to tryan AD on me–perhaps Prozac since my sister was on it with no sideeffects. Perhaps we’ll see. If Klonopin can do the trick right now, sobe it. I just got a lecture from a friend of mine who was on Xanax and Zoloft
forquite some time. She’s off the Xanax now, but still on Zoloft. She toldme she thought benzos wouldn’t solve the problem as they don’t affectserotonin levels, etc., etc. I told her she might not have been able tostand the Zoloft if she hadn’t been on Xanax first. Sigh. I don’t know what the right answer is. I suppose it’s whateverworks for me, isn’t it? Iris
Iris, I needed the Klonopin to control my GAD and PD. Janie. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
You may wish to refer to an article by Dr. Paul Wenders group at U. Utah:: Reimarr, F et al ,An open trial of L-Tyrosine in the Treatment of Attention Deficit Disorder, Residual Type. AMERICAN JOURNAL OF PSYCHIATRY, 144:8 August 1987, pp 1071-3 This study used doses of 50-150mg/kg in adults with ADD. Eight of twelve patients had a "marked to moderate" response after 2 weeks, but all developed tolerance at 6 weeks. In re the comments about tyrosine not effecting CNS levels of dopamine and norepinephrine (as compared to tryptophane — serotonin) I doubt that its that simple. Why would tyrosine/phenylanaine supplementation have a positive effec in some cases of depression? You may wish to look up some writings by Dr. Richard Wurtman that will correlate amino acid loading with increase in central neurotransmitters. Are you also taking supplements of B vitamine (B6) that will aid the production of dopamine? In closing, you may find as I have that tyrosine used concurrently with a stimulant will have even better results than either alone. Good luck Bob
You may wish to refer to an article by Dr. Paul Wenders group at U. Utah:: Reimarr, F et al ,An open trial of L-Tyrosine in the Treatment of Attention Deficit Disorder, Residual Type. AMERICAN JOURNAL OF PSYCHIATRY, 144:8 August 1987, pp 1071-3 This study used doses of 50-150mg/kg in adults with ADD. Eight of twelve patients had a "marked to moderate" response after 2 weeks, but all developed tolerance at 6 weeks. In re the comments about tyrosine not effecting CNS levels of dopamine and norepinephrine (as compared to tryptophane — serotonin) I doubt that its that simple. Why would tyrosine/phenylanaine supplementation have a positive effec in some cases of depression? You may wish to look up some writings by Dr. Richard Wurtman that will correlate amino acid loading with increase in central neurotransmitters.
Just to let you know where I’m coming from, for what it’s worth, here’s a quote from "The Molecular Foundations of Psychiatry" by S.E.Hyman & E.J. Nestler, pg 71: Tyrosine hydroxylase is the rate limiting enzyme of catecholamine [i.e. dopamine and norepinephrine] synthesis…Because tyrosine hydroxylase exists at relatively low levels, and *under normal conditions* is already supersaturated by the amount of tyrosine found in the brain, it is very difficult to influence brain catecholamine synthesis through variations in dietary tyrosine. Notice the qualification "under normal conditions". There could be exceptions, for example, in persons with abnormal brain chemistry. Stanley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Are you also taking supplements of B vitamine (B6) that will aid the production of dopamine? In closing, you may find as I have that tyrosine used concurrently with a stimulant will have even better results than either alone. Good luck Bob
Which is the reason that L-Dopa is used to treat Parkinson’s disease rather than tyrosine. I beleive that too many people expect too great of results from substances such as amino acids Similarly too many in the medical/scientific community are just as fast to write off any real effect. To simply state that tyrosine hydroxylase is the rate limiting factor may be a simplification. (Does this consider variations depending on time of day?) The Wender writing stated that a period of two weeks passed before an effect was noticed, which he compared to the delayed response found in most antidepressant drugs. (Similarly he found no usefulness beyond 6 weeks, tolerance?) To my understanding, tricyclic antidepressants cause an immediate blockage of reuptake and consequential increase in synaptic transmitter levels but clinical response is delayed 2-6 weeks. Why? This suggests actions beyond the immediate cast of players, be it amino acids, enzymes, neurotransmitters and/or drugs, on an IMMEDIATE basis. I hope to respond to you giving a few other citations later. I invite your comments on a relate issue, ie, the differing actions of d-amphetamine and methylphenidate. As a person with ADD, I had extreme problems (anxiety, dysphoria) with larger doses of Ritalin(40-60mg/dose), which my doctor simply excused to my greater awareness to the world. I have no such problems with ROUGHLY equivalent doses of Dexedrine(15mg). I have read that these two drugs act on different dopamine pools in the brain, and that methylphenidate actually inhibits the actions of amphetamine.(Research I beleive done by a researcher at Duke, McEwen or similar name reported in TIPS mid 80s) Similarly methylphenidate seems to provoke epileptic activity, where amphetamine tends to inhibit it (Dexedrine is marketed as an anticonvulsant in Canada, I doubt this is only for its anti-drowsiness effects re phenobarbital) As a child I experienced nocturnal epilepsy but I have read nothing clinically about the selection of antiADD drugs in epileptics for example. What is the current thinking (theoretically as well as clinically) regarding this diffenence between the actions of thes amphetamine like drugs and the methylphenidate like drugs?. Regards Bob
Tyrosine is a great way to prevent depletion of neurotransmitters as a result of psychostimulant therapy. Phenylalanine competes with tryptophan for entry to the brain and should not even be considered – it made me angry as all hell!! All by itself its probably nowhere near as effective, because the body is good at keeping levels where it thinks they should be. L-Dopa effectively bypasses this mechanism – anyone got any data on it? L-Dopa can [according to a friend] be made by feeding potatoes lots of tyrosine, then eating them [he didnt say whether they were cooked or not] — Its always the same / Im the only one who’s always left to blame / Take what you can take / Hurt is your only idea of a game / To break away / I dont have that within me / And I’m not afraid / So I bite the hand that feeds me… / When all you do is break me / And put me in a cage Front 242, Animal.
Someone posted a message recently about Tyrosine conflicting with antidepressants. Anyone have any details?
: I really hate these kinds of replies. : Why do you bother doing this without getting the facts? Gosh.. You’ve : succeeded in making me angry. : I have probably been diagnosed with ADD more times than you have, Ed. : about 3 or 4. from neurologists and psychiatrists. I have tried every : drug known from stimulants to wellbutrin. : lay off, and find out the facts before you waste your time talking without : knowing. : If you don know, ASK. don’t suggest things that have already been done IN : EXCESS! : Now, if someone could INTELLECTUALLY respond to my message, I would : appreciate it. : I appologize to all reading this, it just makes me upset to have someone : respond to me like this. Jason, you _asked_ for opinions; and that’s what you got. Don’t complain that somebody offered you the best advice that anybody could in response to your description of experimenting with self-treatment for ADD "symptoms". I’ve tried Ritalin, switched to Dexedrine, went back to Ritalin, added Effexor along with Ritalin, and still some of my symptoms persist. However, all through this process (a little over 2 years now) I’ve been seeing a therapist (psychologist) on a regular basis, as well at the less frequent appointments with neurologist, neuropsychologist, and psychiatrist. Oh, can’t forget my general practicioner MD, either. For many people, drugs are not enough–some type of therapy or counselling can help them take control over their life. For some of us it’s the first time ever we’ve felt even close to being in the driver’s seat, and it can be a frightening/frustrating experience–not knowing what we’re supposed to do first, or do next, or do after that, or… Final note: regarding self-prescribed vitamin, mineral, amino acid, "natural" supplements, a biochemical/medical researcher (PhD+) advised me, "I recommend against it; when you start messing with chemical balance in your brain you can really screw things up." _I’d_ recommend taking Ed’s advice: seek professional help and stick with it. (I apologize if the tone of this post started getting hot, but what you’re doing _is_ playing with fire. Be really careful!) "Well, heck. It sounded like a _really_good_idea_, at the time."
I really hate these kinds of replies. Why do you bother doing this without getting the facts? Gosh.. You’ve succeeded in making me angry. I have probably been diagnosed with ADD more times than you have, Ed. about 3 or 4. from neurologists and psychiatrists. I have tried every drug known from stimulants to wellbutrin. lay off, and find out the facts before you waste your time talking without knowing. If you don know, ASK. don’t suggest things that have already been done IN EXCESS! Now, if someone could INTELLECTUALLY respond to my message, I would appreciate it. I appologize to all reading this, it just makes me upset to have someone respond to me like this. Jason —- The fear of the unknown is a response to the excesses of the imagination.