Question:

eBay announcement today:   Hi everyone, I’m Julian Green, the new Director   of ProStores, and I

Question:

Hey Don, My running partner has asthma and routinely runs Ultra Marathons. If you write me I’ll forward your address with your permission to him. He might

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        Some meds such as Ventolin or sodium chromolyn are often prescriobed to be taken before exercise.  When I do hard runs, I hit the puffer.  On easy days, I usually do not (preference on my part). – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone out there have advice for running with asthma.  I ran in highschool and my best times were around 16:30 for the 5K and 35 for the 10k and continued to run sporadically thru college . I got out of shape later in life and developed asthma, since then I have been running for a year and a half and can’t seem to get in shape or run faster than 7 minute pace, yet I’m only 33.  Mentally I know I’m capable of at least running close to those highschool times as I never really even did any speed work in hs and college, just went for long runs. Any advice please Frustrated runner

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Don, I have asthma and had used Ventolin for years (and Cromolyn and epinephrine and bronkaid and Prednisone and Beclovent and Beclofort and side-stream at the hospital and … on and on and on), since I was 18 (I am now 45), up until last fall. I then consulted another lung specialist. He categorized me as "severely asthmatic" and put me on two new meds; Serevent (2 puffs x 2 daily) and Flovent (2 puffs x 2 daily). Since then, almost 1 year, I have used my Ventolin … once! I used it practically daily up until I started the new meds. I now "never" use Ventolin during my runs (I "always" used it before), my breathing is stronger, my lungs feel stronger and life, overall is that much better. I’ll stop sounding like a shill for pharmaceutical companies now and get on to the … ***SOLICITED ADVICE SECTION*** I’m not saying that these meds will do for you what they do for me … we are all different. What I’m saying is this; There is help out there for asthmatics that wasn’t available even 1 or 2 years ago. Do your homework, see a specialist, get a diagnosis … and get back to running. Geoff *18 days to Seattle Marathon!!* Nash – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone out there have advice for running with asthma

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Does anyone out there have advice for running with asthma.  I ran in highschool and my best times were around 16:30 for the 5K and 35 for the 10k and continued to run sporadically thru college . I got out of shape later in life and developed asthma, since then I have been running for a year and a half and can’t seem to get in shape or run faster than 7 minute pace, yet I’m only 33.  Mentally I know I’m capable of at least running close to those highschool times as I never really even did any speed work in hs and college, just went for long runs. Any advice please Frustrated runner

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Hey there.  There’s another thread here about this same topic, you should check it out.  You didn’t mention being on any medications; there’s some really good ones out there.  For example, there is Ventolin, which is good for stopping your wheezing once you’ve already started.  I can also use it just before easy runs; but it does increase your heart rate so it’s probably not a good idea for those days when you push yourself.  Another really great one is cromolyn, which prevents wheezing in the first place.  Unless it’s cold, what’s probably happening is that your lungs are hypersensitized to pollutants.  Cells in your lungs release nasty stuff that constricts your airways (in case you’re interested); cromolyn stops those cells from ever releasing that stuff. Ventolin opens your airways up afterwards.  Cold weather may be different; I don’t think anybody really knows how that works.  The cromolyn that I’m taking doesn’t really seem to help there.  Ozzie has mentioned breathing through your nose (thanks Ozzie!); I’ve also heard that wrapping a scarf around your mouth helps too. Either way, the air gets warmed before it hits your lungs. Just to be on the safe side, you may want to get your wheezing checked out, just in case it’s heart-related and not lung-related.  It’s much more likely to be asthma than anything else, but I’m quite the hypochrondriac! Good luck! Jo. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone out there have advice for running with asthma.  I ran in highschool and my best times were around 16:30 for the 5K and 35 for the 10k and continued to run sporadically thru college . I got out of shape later in life and developed asthma, since then I have been running for a year and a half and can’t seem to get in shape or run faster than 7 minute pace, yet I’m only 33.  Mentally I know I’m capable of at least running close to those highschool times as I never really even did any speed work in hs and college, just went for long runs. Any advice please Frustrated runner

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All! I posted this question before, but I don’t think it made it so I’ll try again. Sorry if it’s a duplication, but I’m rather desparate for an answer. I have cough evident asthma. At this time of year, the coughing can tend to get a bit much (especially as I earn my living playing the flute). I was wondering if cough supressants are safe for occasional use, or if I should try to ride it out until  my Pulmicort gets things under control. If it is okay to use them, is there a specific kind I should look for? (I live in Canada, if that makes a big difference.) Thanks in advance.< I would say NO.  It was this treatment with hydrocodone that put me in the hospital with plugs in my lungs.  To suppress the cough means you stop the action of keeping the mucous out of your lungs, a very dangerous thing. Sue M.

Hi All,      My Doctor has treated my cough with hydrocodine when it was determined to be from bronchitis and not prouducing any mucous. The continuous coughing without bringing anything up caused me a lot of pain. Just another side of the story. Mike C.

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Oh, and good luck.

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Hi All!

I posted this question before, but I don’t think it made it so I’ll try again. Sorry if it’s a duplication, but I’m rather desparate for an answer. I have cough evident asthma. At this time of year, the coughing can tend to get a bit much (especially as I earn my living playing the flute). I was wondering if cough supressants are safe for occasional use, or if I should try to ride it out until  my Pulmicort gets things under control. If it is okay to use them, is there a specific kind I should look for? (I live in Canada, if that makes a big difference.) Thanks in advance.< I would say NO.  It was this treatment with hydrocodone that put me in the hospital with plugs in my lungs.  To suppress the cough means you stop the action of keeping the mucous out of your lungs, a very dangerous thing. Sue M.

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Don’t know a much technically, but I occasionally use Tussey-Organdin, and it seems to help greatly.

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Over here on the East Coast the pollen count is still quite low, oh to be in lotus land like you. On the more serious side, we used cough medicine (Triaminic) for my young son’s asthma early in his condition and it helped.  I tried it recently when his asthma coughing was much worse and it didn’t even touch it, our **G.P.’s** question when asked was whether it was an antihistamine or not, since antihistamine would impact the underlying problem whether in cough medicine form or separate. It seems the proper cough medicine will give some relief which is good by itself, but, as noted in Wing Lee’s posting, if it’s only suppressing the cough you still have the mucous build up in the lungs.  From that point my wife (who is also asthmatic) and I think that **regular** use of cough suppressant in itself is probably not getting to the route cause. For my son I think he wasn’t moving the mucous, therefore it built up, and finally his coughing kicked in just as hard, but possibly with worse underlying lung function. I believe this type of problem is the reason for the warning for asthmatics on cough medicine bottles (at least the ones I’ve read), i.e.: a) if needed routinely you need may need to consider other management options, and b) the **possibility** of masking more serious attacks.   Once in a while, its probably O.K. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All! I posted this question before, but I don’t think it made it so I’ll try again. Sorry if it’s a duplication, but I’m rather desparate for an answer. I have cough evident asthma. At this time of year, the coughing can tend to get a bit much (especially as I earn my living playing the flute). I was wondering if cough supressants are safe for occasional use, or if I should try to ride it out until  my Pulmicort gets things under control. If it is okay to use them, is there a specific kind I should look for? (I live in Canada, if that makes a big difference.) Thanks in advance.

Response:

Hi   I’ve used Benylin and Delsym for my coughs with no problem along with taking my Pulmicort and Ventolin.I would use it only at night to get some uninterrupted sleep. It is not recommended that asthmatics use cough syrups because they will mask an uncontrolled attack.I would check with your doc with doubling your dose of Pulmicort to get the asthma under control then tapering down to a maintenance dose.I find that the Pulmicort usually kicks in within 2 days, sometimes longer if I’ve let it go a little too long.If it doesn’t kick in and the cough worsens you may be on your way to needing some extra meds. Roseanne – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All! I posted this question before, but I don’t think it made it so I’ll try again. Sorry if it’s a duplication, but I’m rather desparate for an answer. I have cough evident asthma. At this time of year, the coughing can tend to get a bit much (especially as I earn my living playing the flute). I was wondering if cough supressants are safe for occasional use, or if I should try to ride it out until  my Pulmicort gets things under control. If it is okay to use them, is there a specific kind I should look for? (I live in Canada, if that makes a big difference.) Thanks in advance.

Response:

Hi All! I posted this question before, but I don’t think it made it so I’ll try again. Sorry if it’s a duplication, but I’m rather desparate for an answer. I have cough evident asthma. At this time of year, the coughing can tend to get a bit much (especially as I earn my living playing the flute). I was wondering if cough supressants are safe for occasional use, or if I should try to ride it out until  my Pulmicort gets things under control. If it is okay to use them, is there a specific kind I should look for? (I live in Canada, if that makes a big difference.) Thanks in advance.

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Question:

They say that St John’s Wort can cause a bad reaction when taken with some medications, has anyone any idea what this means?  I mean, are we talking sick and headaches or something more serious? I can’t go to my doctor without calling him STOOOOPID after my Paxil experience and the psychiatrist at the hospital refuses to tell me because he hasn’t seen me for so long. Do I dare just risk it? Michelle

Response:

Take it. There can be some interactions yes. But a) they aren’t likely and b) they are likely to be mild if they happen. Interactions aren’t widely known or studied cos SJW isn’t a prescription med in lots of places and theres not much money in doing it. But you won’t die for sure. Personally i wouldn’t bother taking it cos prescription meds are better. If you had a bad run in with paxil i’d suggest trying something else.

Response:

"Quantum Sleep" <post-your-repl…@thanks.net

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Take it. There can be some interactions yes. But a) they aren’t likely and b) they are likely to be mild if they happen. Interactions aren’t widely known or studied cos SJW isn’t a prescription med in lots of places and theres not much money in doing it. But you won’t die for sure. Personally

i

wouldn’t bother taking it cos prescription meds are better. If you had a

bad

run in with paxil i’d suggest trying something else.

I had a bad run in with Paxil, Prozac and Zoloft. What else is there for depression/anxiety? I would like to get hold of Xanax or Valium but they are not allowed in this country.  I could get hold of them on the Internet, but I mean should I?  I have an addictive nature and I can see me taking more and more and more until I wake up one day dead of an overdose seeing as I drink like a fish into the bargain. In some countries St John’s Wort is prescribed OVER AND ABOVE stuff like Prozac.  I’ve seen some good reports on it. Michelle

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"Contact One" <no.cont…@nowhere.com

a

Question:

Hello everyone, I have severe generalized social phobia and I’m 20 years old. Currently, I’m on Zoloft to help with depression. However, it does not do much for my anxiety. I recently started to consider adding a Benzodiazepine like Klonopin (clonazepam) to help with my anxiety. I mentioned this to my physician and he freaked out. He said it is prescribed on a short-term basis to individuals who do not have generalized anxiety. My physician referred me to a psychiatrist… and I’m probably going to make an appointment tomorrow. My problem is this: My physician kind of made me feel like a drug addict or something. I don’t want the same thing to happen with the psychiatrist. Do most doctors feel this way about Benzodiazepines? Is it a good idea to pursue this? I know therapy is an important factor, and I have been through CBT. Obliviously it didn’t work very well. Right now, I can’t afford therapy on a regular basis. -William

Response:

William wrote:

Hello everyone, I have severe generalized social phobia and I’m 20 years old. Currently, I’m on Zoloft to help with depression. However, it does not do much for my anxiety. I recently started to consider adding a Benzodiazepine like Klonopin (clonazepam) to help with my anxiety. I mentioned this to my physician and he freaked out. He said it is prescribed on a short-term basis to individuals who do not have generalized anxiety.

Yeah it’s used for Epilepsy mainly. But of course it also has a use in treating anxiety. As does xanax which you should also look at. And a whole lot of other drugs as well.

My physician referred me to a psychiatrist… and I’m probably going to make an appointment tomorrow. My problem is this: My physician kind of made me feel like a drug addict or something. I don’t want the same thing to happen with the psychiatrist.

Your not a drug addict for requesting a drug that you believe will relieve your anxiety. Are cancer patients drug addicts when they get chemotherapy on the odd chance it might save their life? Are diabetics drug addicts because they stick a needle in their bodies all the time? Do you know how many billions of dollars could be saved if social anxiety was eliminated from the population? Not to mention how many people would be better off. Do most doctors feel this way

about Benzodiazepines? Is it a good idea to pursue this?

It depends on their training and knowledge of your past history. If you had a history of drug dependence or alchohol abuse almost no doctor would provide you with benzo’s. If you don’t then again it depends on their training and most Pychiatrists are better trained in the use of these drugs than Doctors. IMHO it is a good idea for you to pursue any therapy that is safe for you, as long as it helps you. That includes drug therapies as well as others.

I know therapy is an important factor, and I have been through CBT. Obliviously it didn’t work very well. Right now, I can’t afford therapy on a regular basis.

Yeah it can be so expensive. Richard — Registered Lunatic #100347

Response:

On 5 Feb 2002 23:53:33 -0800, willhk…@earthlink.net (William) wrote: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Hello everyone, I have severe generalized social phobia and I’m 20 years old. Currently, I’m on Zoloft to help with depression. However, it does not do much for my anxiety. I recently started to consider adding a Benzodiazepine like Klonopin (clonazepam) to help with my anxiety. I mentioned this to my physician and he freaked out. He said it is prescribed on a short-term basis to individuals who do not have generalized anxiety. My physician referred me to a psychiatrist… and I’m probably going to make an appointment tomorrow. My problem is this: My physician kind of made me feel like a drug addict or something. I don’t want the same thing to happen with the psychiatrist. Do most doctors feel this way about Benzodiazepines? Is it a good idea to pursue this? I know therapy is an important factor, and I have been through CBT. Obliviously it didn’t work very well. Right now, I can’t afford therapy on a regular basis. -William

Hi William, Is Zoloft the only anti depressant you’ve tried?  I know this doesn’t seem logical, but different brands of ssri anti depressants don’t always have the same effect on people.  If Zoloft isn’t working for your anxiety, you could try Paxil or Celexa.  Just a thought.  BTW, what is your current Zoloft dose? Whether you have or haven’t tried other ssri meds, and at a workable dosage level, adding a benzodiazepine is still a common practice.  I base this comment on my own experience, my previous doctor’s revelations, postings to this group and research.  (My new family doctor, a result of moving to a different state in the U.S., reacted similarly to your MD when I told him what meds I took.  A shrink I subsequently saw did not have a problem and I was given a green light to continue my med regimen.) The big deal with benzos is that they are considered addictive and fall into the controlled substances category, although at the bottom of the list.  Apparently they can be difficult to come off of, if you ever decide to take one, then quit  There is also a concern that users will require increasingly larger doses to attain the same calming effect.  I can’t comment re. any difficulties in quitting a benzo because I’ve never done that.  I can say, though, that once I reached an effective dose level of Xanax several years ago, I have NEVER felt the need to take more to achieve the same anxiety relief.  There is also, at least in my case, no euphoric or high feeling associated with taking a benzo (Valium could be an exception because some people do get a buzz from it.)  If you were to compare the potential addictiveness of benzos with, say, alcohol abuse, it’s like day and night.  Benzos help me and others to function and sometimes lead at least a semblance of a normal life.  In spite of their supposed addictiveness, I can drive, I can work, I can talk to people, and look and feel pretty much ok (well as ok as an sp’ic can be anyway).  OTOH, alcohol abuse ALWAYS involves drinking greater quantities over time to reach the desired effect.  And the side effects can be horrific. Drunks can’t effectively handle even simple tasks and their thinking and judgment are clouded to say the least.  You hear about drunk drivers killing people on the highways all the time, yet this drug is an over the counter purchase.  So far I haven’t read or heard anything about someone killing others or himself as a result of taking benzos. Of the benzos, Klonopin is probably the most subtle in its action.  It has a calming effect, but not the "right now" relief you get within an hour or so of taking something like Xanax.  Klonopin also has a relatively long half life, meaning it stays with you for several hours versus a med like Xanax which begins to poop out after anywhere from 3 hours and up.  Here’s an interesting aside too.  Klonopin was developed to control seizures in people.  A normal daily intake, when taken for seizures,  is somewhere around 10 mg give or take.  However, some people need as much as 20 mg to control their seizures.  When used for anxiety, Klonopin doses range from 1 to 4 mg daily.  Some people undoubtedly take a couple of more mg, but you won’t find anyone even near the dose level needed to control seizures. Here’s the bottom line.  It’s your life.  Anxiety is messing it up. Zoloft, and maybe other ssri anti depressants, plus CBT have not helped.  That pretty much leaves maoi’s and benzos as the remaining choices in the prescription med category.  Maoi’s are considered the last choice because they have a lot of restrictions, particularly as relates to what you can safely eat, and significant side effects. Asking for a benzo such as Klonopin is a reasonable request to try to gain some degree of normalcy with your life.  Ask your family doctor which is preferable:  living in anxiety hell forever or taking a benzo to get some relief.   If you don’t get the answer you want, there are other doctors.  And yes, I know how hard it is to see a new doctor and discuss your anxiety disorder, but it could come to that. If you see the psychiatrist, there’s a good probability you’ll get an ok to try Klonopin.  S/he’ll probably want to see you periodically to see if you’re getting relief and to evaluate if dosage should be changed.  Your starting dose might be 1, maybe 2 mg per day, taken in equal amounts spread out over your waking hours.  If that doesn’t cut it, you can always request a higher dose, also to be split up evenly over each day.  One last comment about Klonopin. I didn’t realize this until I started taking it, but unlike Xanax, you don’t gain its full benefit until after you’ve been on it for a week or so.  In spite of this lag, you’ll still probably notice a calming effect the first day of use. You might want to do some research on the web or elsewhere for Klonopin and anxiety so you’ll be somewhat knowledgeable about it when you see the shrink.  Good luck. Doug

Response:

Thanks Doug and Richard for your advice… I feel much better about the whole thing now.

Is Zoloft the only anti depressant you’ve tried?

Actually, I’ve been on Paxil as well. At one point I was on 100mg of Zoloft, but I started to get side-effects with that dosage. I could try other SSRI’s. I’m aware that this could take anywhere up to a couple of months to notice a difference. In my situation, I don’t really have the luxury of time to experiment with all the SSRI’s out there.

If you see the psychiatrist, there’s a good probability you’ll get an ok to try Klonopin.

I made an appointment with a psychiatrist this morning. It’s on Friday. This is the psychiatrist that my physician referred me to. Do you think that my physician can interfere in my choice of medication? Or do you think it’s a better idea to get a psychiatrist who is not connected to my doctor? Thanks, -William

Response:

William, On 6 Feb 2002 12:11:53 -0800, willhk…@earthlink.net (William) wrote:

Thanks Doug and Richard for your advice… I feel much better about the whole thing now. Is Zoloft the only anti depressant you’ve tried? Actually, I’ve been on Paxil as well. At one point I was on 100mg of Zoloft, but I started to get side-effects with that dosage. I could try other SSRI’s. I’m aware that this could take anywhere up to a couple of months to notice a difference. In my situation, I don’t really have the luxury of time to experiment with all the SSRI’s out there.

OK.

If you see the psychiatrist, there’s a good probability you’ll get an ok to try Klonopin. I made an appointment with a psychiatrist this morning. It’s on Friday. This is the psychiatrist that my physician referred me to. Do you think that my physician can interfere in my choice of medication? Or do you think it’s a better idea to get a psychiatrist who is not connected to my doctor?

I saw the psychiatrist that my new family doctor recommended and he okayed my drugs.  Had the shrink said no, I would have sought out another psychiatrist and another till I got what I wanted.  In my case I’ve been taking Xanax for over 15 years so it’s not like I have no experience with it or don’t know about its negatives. If you believe your family MD has your best interests at heart, there’s no harm in seeing whoever he recommends.  I’m inclined to think he’s passing the buck due more to a lack of knowledge than because he’s dead set against your taking Klonopin.  I mean he could have just said no and let that be the end of it, not even recommending that you see a shrink.  One other thing to consider is that the psychiatrist is going to have a lot more familiarity with your illness and meds that can help you than your MD does. Doug – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Thanks, -William

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Question:

— Andy

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Andy, I’ve seen three "shrinks" and all three give me something different to work with. Each one though fizzled out, couldn’t get much more after the first few visits. YMMV and IME Charla Hi Guy’s I’m starting to think that maybe I should find a new shrink. I pretty much have everything sorted out now, I can deal with the PA’s if I have to, and if I don’t have to, or don’t feel like sitting through one I go home….. to easy. I’ve got off the Xanax and Zoloft which was only making me worse and am now on Luvox and serapax, which works great. So everything is pretty cruzzy apart from the odd up and down. The problem I’m stuck with now I guess is best described as mild depression / mild constant background anxiety / mild emotional distress, no big problem, just slightly annoying. The thing is, I go to the Pdoc every week and go "this is how I feel and this is what’s going on ect" , but I don’t seem to be getting any new answers. Its always, take the meds, go to places for exposure and desensitisation of the PA’s, CBT, exercise, meditate and stop yourself as soon as you start getting in to any negative thought patterns. I feel like I talk, he listens, but doesn’t say much and what he does say I already know, and am doing it. Should I be getting more answers, and more response from him? or is that about all there is to it…. just keep going as I am and give things more time? The reason I’m asking is because I don’t want to spend more time and money building a repour with new Pdoc’s if the answers are going to be the same. Thanks. — Andy

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Its always, take the meds, go to places for exposure and desensitisation of the PA’s, CBT, exercise, meditate and stop yourself as soon as you start getting in to any negative thought patterns. I feel like I talk, he listens, but doesn’t say much and what he does say I already know, and am doing it. Should I be getting more answers, and more response from him? or is that about all there is to it…. just keep going as I am and give things more time? The reason I’m asking is because I don’t want to spend more time and money building a repour with new Pdoc’s if the answers are going to be the same. Thanks. — Andy

dump him therapy is a collaborative event that is involving and goal oriented-listening is not productive to getting things done-the goal is to learn coping techniques and various ways to recover. LM

Response:

     Dear Andy,            In my experience  it has always been the same. I went to this one shrink. 12 visits and each time it was the same. I listened to him describe HIS phobias. I’d love to splash his name all over the place, but i won’t. What did help me was group therapy. Have you tried this? If not you may want to check it out Debbie

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Guy’s I’m starting to think that maybe I should find a new shrink. I pretty much have everything sorted out now, I can deal with the PA’s if I have to, and if I don’t have to, or don’t feel like sitting through one I go home….. to easy. I’ve got off the Xanax and Zoloft which was only making me worse and am now on Luvox and serapax, which works great. So everything is pretty cruzzy apart from the odd up and down. The problem I’m stuck with now I guess is best described as mild depression / mild constant background anxiety / mild emotional distress, no big problem, just slightly annoying. The thing is, I go to the Pdoc every week and go "this is how I feel and this is what’s going on ect" , but I don’t seem to be getting any new answers. Its always, take the meds, go to places for exposure and desensitisation of the PA’s, CBT, exercise, meditate and stop yourself as soon as you start getting in to any negative thought patterns. I feel like I talk, he listens, but doesn’t say much and what he does say I already know, and am doing it. Should I be getting more answers, and more response from him? or is that about all there is to it…. just keep going as I am and give things more time? The reason I’m asking is because I don’t want to spend more time and money building a repour with new Pdoc’s if the answers are going to be the same. Thanks. — Andy

I agree with his referral to CBT. It seems just what you need now. I am glad that you

Question:

Good post, man.  Tnx. ALSO tnx for the Michael Moore quote !!!   So TRUE !  The media do such a great job of distorting reality.. Norbi

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Hey folks: Well..it’s been a few days now..but my psychiatrist has me starte on this interesting (but..a bit expensive!!) combo of meds. Besides taking Depakote and Clonazepam 3x a day, he has set me up with a script for 37.5mg of Effexor XR, and 50mg of Zoloft. He was pretty good in explaining his rational, plus he knew that I was pretty knowldegable of medications. Basically, he thought a mild uptake inhibition of dopamine and norepinephrine combined with a bit stronger uptake of serotonin might possibly do the "trick" for me…as these are the only two meds I have EVER responded at least a bit well too. So, the Zoloft is the SRI, of course, and the Effexor provides that mild boost not to just serotonin, but also to norepinephrine and dopamine. The other meds seem to help smooth out the 1)anxiety and 2)insomnia. I know some people on here have been asking about this combo. If you can, and are looking at trying some augmentation of meds due to many past failures, you may want to talk to your doctor and psychiatrist about this. They may find it a bit odd…but as mentioned above, there is A BIT of logic behind it. Of course…monitor yourself very carefully on the first while of the meds..and make sure you get your bloodwork and tests done, as this is still fairly unknown territory. As always..YMMV…IMHO..etc. I was on just Effexor and Clonazepam before, but at no matter what dose of Clonazepam, I had a very hard time with a feeling of "depersonalization", and the Effexor XR just didn’t feel it was working completely right. Now..one other thing, is that my sleep pattern has seemed to fall well into place (except tonight..I just got home from work..heh) But, I sleep like a baby, and wake up feeling very refreshed. I know others have found Welbutrin to be a good combonation with any of the SRI/SNRI’s, but Welbutrin is WAY too stimulating for me. I you would like to email me with any thoughts, questions, etc, I would be more than happy to give M personal account. BUT, please, before embarking on such a med change, make SURE you discuss it thouroughly with you doc or psychiatrist. To help keep costs down…I shop around ALOT for the best prices on the medication. There are some excellent on-line pharmacies (NOT the "illegal ones) but places like Rxlist.com, who offer great prices, and free shipping on your meds. Once you and your psychiatrist figure out what works best (you..most of all,,MUST know..) s/he can usually give you up to months supply of your meds, in which you fax your prescription, or have your pshychiatrist phone it in, and it can save you a REAL bundle: NOT ONLY in the "so-called" dispensing fee’s, but also in the actual cost of the medication. As usual, also, there are free medications for those in need, with a low income. You can find them through any of the search engines. Best of luck..and remember…there is ALWAYS different paths to hope. James MacLachlan — "I’ve used up all my sick days…so I’m calling in dead!" -Anon "I’d like to know where shareholders get their power from?? I am wondering where the hell the word "shareholder" is in the American Consitution?" "Let us pause for a moment to recover from the sad news this week that Dan Quayle will not be running for President next year. Potatoe lovers all over America are feeling a sense of loss and I can only say that with Quayle out of the running, all we have to look forward to now is the day when we get to hear more than a sound bite from George W. Bush and realize he’s even dumber than Quayle. There is a reason you have not heard Bush Jr. speak on television for any length of time. The media knows he’s as dense as oatmeal and because they have been so busy touting him as "the front runner" to actually put him on to speak for ten minutes would reveal how not on top of things they really are." Micheal Moore, "The AWFUL Truth"

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Question:

hello, my son has been diagnosed with bipolar. he is an adult now and living in another state. we have been through alot together, were close but only talk everyother week. he starts college this fall. i worry about the stress hes under. hes 18 just finishing h.s.  i love him and try to give him the distance he ask for, it is quite possible he is in this cafe as it is new to me.  i came to this section in need of help in how i can stay out of his way and still be there when he needs me. what i’v found most interesting here is i have taken effexor before, last year. can my mild depression be a link to my sons manic depression.  i sometimes blame myself- and for no reason. i did’nt know effexor was used for bipolar disorder also.                                 love, tilly

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Hello! My wife keeps switching doctors so she can get different diagnoses so she can try different medicines. I know from previous experience that AD’s without a mood stabilizer makes her manic. I was hoping someone would tell me Effexor would not do this. I am just waiting for the fireworks now. It probably won’t take long from what I am hearing! Once when they put her on Amitryptiline she decided it would be great to take the whole bottle. She almost ended her life that night. So I don’t understand what her newest doc is trying to prove by giving her Effexor w/o a mood stabilizer. Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Daniel Do you know from all the posts you have read that XR Effexor (that’s what I use too) is dangerous for your wife if she is diagnosed bipolar?  I do hope she isn’t bipolar or you’re in for a real treat. Sympathetically, Gandalf |Hi | |Thanks for the story. The doctor now has my wife on 150mg of sustained |release Effexor. But she is not taking any mood stabilizer like Lithium or |anything. I don’t know why. I guess they have changed her diagnoses |or something. I just hope the Effexor doesn’t send her up the wall or |anything. | |Good luck getting off the Effexor! | |Dan | | | Hi Daniel | | Effexor is same as the other AD, possible with bipolar if you are solid on a | mood stabilizer.  My personal situation is that I was unipolar manic until 3 | years ago, when a triple whammy stress threw me into my first clinical | depression.  So doctors fought me for 2 years, resisting any AD.  After being | depressed for 2 years and not being able to work or go to school for 1 year I | insisted on an AD.  My pdoc decided on effexor because of its short half life | (3 days and half of it is out of your system).  My ramped up VERY slowly, 5 | months until full therapeutic dosage.  It did not work for me until I was at | the full dosage.  But once I reached critical AD mass the stuff cleared away | my depression.  I stayed on it for 16 months, just going off it now. | | -Gandalf | | |Hi | | | |What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? | |Would it help or possibly make them more manic? | | | |Dan | | |

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Hi What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? Would it help or possibly make them more manic? Dan

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What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? Would it help or possibly make them more manic?

About any AD can activate mania or hypomania. I’m on both Depakote and Effexor and find the combination quite agreeable. — IMPORTANT: Remove the edible part of the E-mail address before replying.

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I took Effexor for 3 months.  I loved its affects. It was way cool.  Everything was bright and clear. Then I began to get headaches and it bottomed out. So much for that. I don’t remember ever getting really out of hand on Effexor. Then again I don’t remember yesterday. <sigh Becky who is really not much help

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Hi Thanks for the reply to my post. I take it that the Depakote keeps the Effexor from causing mania? Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? Would it help or possibly make them more manic? About any AD can activate mania or hypomania. I’m on both Depakote and Effexor and find the combination quite agreeable. — IMPORTANT: Remove the edible part of the E-mail address before replying.

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Hi My wife just started on Effexor and is having a slight headache so far. Also blurry vision for an hour or so after taking it. And some dizziness. Just wondering if there is anything else that is about to happen! Thanks for the reply! Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I took Effexor for 3 months.  I loved its affects. It was way cool.  Everything was bright and clear. Then I began to get headaches and it bottomed out. So much for that. I don’t remember ever getting really out of hand on Effexor. Then again I don’t remember yesterday. <sigh Becky who is really not much help

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Thanks for the reply to my post. I take it that the Depakote keeps the Effexor from causing mania?

Possibly. Although I can say that I’m definitely worse off without an AD. — IMPORTANT: Remove the edible part of the E-mail address before replying.

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Hi Dan, Welcome to ASDM My wife just started on Effexor and is having a slight headache so far. Also blurry vision for an hour or so after taking it. And some dizziness.

All of these are potential side effects of Effexor. Just wondering if there is anything else that is about to happen!

Effexor can also increase blood pressure, so monitoring  of it is necessary. Alcohol should be avoided while taking Effexor. Report any rash or hives to the doctor immediately I suggest she notify her pdoc and report the headache and blurry vision. This may be dose related and perhaps starting at a lower dose and increasing slowly may help to avoid these unpleasant side effects. Peace, Reach beyond your grasp!

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Thanks for the reply to my post. I take it that the Depakote keeps the Effexor from causing mania? Possibly. Although I can say that I’m definitely worse off without an AD. — IMPORTANT: Remove the edible part of the E-mail address before replying.

I’d have to agree with this completely too. I think some are more suseptable to the "mania", and some more to the "depression", but can easily switch. I think the Depakote adds a "balance" to the a.d. James — "Get some honesty… "Don’t Let The BASTARDS Grind You Down..".Latin Proverb take the best of me And the rest let go… When you’re tired of the Rage, Step outside your cage And let the real fool show.." Tears for Fear’s "Goodnight Song" Remember "Life is A Highway"?? Visit Tom Cochrane’s Official Homepage Http://www.tomcochrane.ca

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Hi Daniel Effexor is same as the other AD, possible with bipolar if you are solid on a mood stabilizer.  My personal situation is that I was unipolar manic until 3 years ago, when a triple whammy stress threw me into my first clinical depression.  So doctors fought me for 2 years, resisting any AD.  After being depressed for 2 years and not being able to work or go to school for 1 year I insisted on an AD.  My pdoc decided on effexor because of its short half life (3 days and half of it is out of your system).  My ramped up VERY slowly, 5 months until full therapeutic dosage.  It did not work for me until I was at the full dosage.  But once I reached critical AD mass the stuff cleared away my depression.  I stayed on it for 16 months, just going off it now. -Gandalf

|Hi | |What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? |Would it help or possibly make them more manic? | |Dan |

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Hi So the Depakote would be a stabilizer and the Effexor helps with the depressive side of things. Ok. I think I am starting to understand! Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks for the reply to my post. I take it that the Depakote keeps the Effexor from causing mania? Possibly. Although I can say that I’m definitely worse off without an AD. — IMPORTANT: Remove the edible part of the E-mail address before replying.

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Hello! My wife was having high blood pressure, dizziness, blurry vision and sleeping problems even before she came out of the hospital. And the prescription she has now is stronger than before. But is a sustained release version (150mg). So hopefully the side effects will not be as bad as they have been. Thanks for the helpful reply! Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Dan, Welcome to ASDM My wife just started on Effexor and is having a slight headache so far. Also blurry vision for an hour or so after taking it. And some dizziness. All of these are potential side effects of Effexor. Just wondering if there is anything else that is about to happen! Effexor can also increase blood pressure, so monitoring  of it is necessary. Alcohol should be avoided while taking Effexor. Report any rash or hives to the doctor immediately I suggest she notify her pdoc and report the headache and blurry vision. This may be dose related and perhaps starting at a lower dose and increasing slowly may help to avoid these unpleasant side effects. Peace, Reach beyond your grasp!

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Hi Thanks for the story. The doctor now has my wife on 150mg of sustained release Effexor. But she is not taking any mood stabilizer like Lithium or anything. I don’t know why. I guess they have changed her diagnoses or something. I just hope the Effexor doesn’t send her up the wall or anything. Good luck getting off the Effexor! Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Daniel Effexor is same as the other AD, possible with bipolar if you are solid on a mood stabilizer.  My personal situation is that I was unipolar manic until 3 years ago, when a triple whammy stress threw me into my first clinical depression.  So doctors fought me for 2 years, resisting any AD.  After being depressed for 2 years and not being able to work or go to school for 1 year I insisted on an AD.  My pdoc decided on effexor because of its short half life (3 days and half of it is out of your system).  My ramped up VERY slowly, 5 months until full therapeutic dosage.  It did not work for me until I was at the full dosage.  But once I reached critical AD mass the stuff cleared away my depression.  I stayed on it for 16 months, just going off it now. -Gandalf |Hi | |What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? |Would it help or possibly make them more manic? | |Dan |

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Daniel Do you know from all the posts you have read that XR Effexor (that’s what I use too) is dangerous for your wife if she is diagnosed bipolar?  I do hope she isn’t bipolar or you’re in for a real treat. Sympathetically, Gandalf

|Hi | |Thanks for the story. The doctor now has my wife on 150mg of sustained |release Effexor. But she is not taking any mood stabilizer like Lithium or |anything. I don’t know why. I guess they have changed her diagnoses |or something. I just hope the Effexor doesn’t send her up the wall or |anything. | |Good luck getting off the Effexor! | |Dan |

| | Hi Daniel | | Effexor is same as the other AD, possible with bipolar if you are solid on a | mood stabilizer.  My personal situation is that I was unipolar manic until 3 | years ago, when a triple whammy stress threw me into my first clinical | depression.  So doctors fought me for 2 years, resisting any AD.  After being | depressed for 2 years and not being able to work or go to school for 1 year I | insisted on an AD.  My pdoc decided on effexor because of its short half life | (3 days and half of it is out of your system).  My ramped up VERY slowly, 5 | months until full therapeutic dosage.  It did not work for me until I was at | the full dosage.  But once I reached critical AD mass the stuff cleared away | my depression.  I stayed on it for 16 months, just going off it now. | | -Gandalf |

| |Hi | | | |What would taking Effexor do to a person who has Bipolar Disorder? | |Would it help or possibly make them more manic? | | | |Dan | | |

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be cautious with effexor, my mother was on it and it caused her to flatline meaning she had no hi’s or lows, no emotion what so ever…also a close friend was on it and had petite mal seizures. be sure to read all info on depakote as well, it has some nasty side effects. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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Question:

It’s KOOL how people let their inners talk here.  I like to read these posts, even though my own inners shall not come out much anymore.

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No, Dante, I don’t think your raggin on me.  I really appreciate how you’ve explained things to me.  I think your really kool.  Don’t worry about the spelling, I understand what you’re trying to get across. Hope your 4th went well. eterniti

cool you aint p*ssed. an cool you can get what Im sayin even if I dont spell so hot. seem like virtual mode is okay with ya. cool she talked with ya an your gettin along. dont know if what I had to say did any thing. but okay. Im cool.   later Dante

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Okay, I see where the whole miscommunication started.  Using exclamation points to me isn’t like I’m yelling.  I use ‘em a lot, random-like.  Like this! doesn’t mean I’m yelling and I am truly truly sorry that he thought that.  I honestly didn’t mean to be seeming like I was yelling.  People can live how they like, I have no place to dictate anything like that.  Thank you very much for explaining it to me, Dante.  I should watch my typing and be more careful because I honestly honestly didn’t mean it that way.

its cool. cool with me any way. gess I see it like this if folks are sayin stuf thats like not raggin those ! dont mean yellin. but if folks are like riled up an upset or somethin an use em like you did its like yellin. gess its a mater of what your talkin bout. like you used em here an it dont look like yellin cuz your not bein sereus an kritikle. did I spell that right? me I dont spell so hot. I dont much care but may be folks dont get what Im sayin. VM:  I don’t think you should stay inside, I think you should come out more often.  I am truly sorry you thought I was yelling at you.  I didn’t mean it to seem that way.  Is there anything I can do to make it up to you? ~a very sorry eterniti

very cool eterniti. hope you dont think Im raggin on you.     Dante – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Be the change you want to see in the world.           -Ghandi

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Okay, I see where the whole miscommunication started.  Using exclamation points to me isn’t like I’m yelling.  I use ‘em a lot, random-like.  Like this! doesn’t mean I’m yelling and I am truly truly sorry that he thought that.  I honestly didn’t mean to be seeming like I was yelling.  People can live how they like, I have no place to dictate anything like that.  Thank you very much for explaining it to me, Dante.  I should watch my typing and be more careful because I honestly honestly didn’t mean it that way.   VM:  I don’t think you should stay inside, I think you should come out more often.  I am truly sorry you thought I was yelling at you.  I didn’t mean it to seem that way.  Is there anything I can do to make it up to you? ~a very sorry eterniti Be the change you want to see in the world.           -Ghandi

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Well, I’m glad I didn’t come off as rude…. If it’s any consollation, I think you are real.  I will listen to you.  I understand your anger.  It just hurts me to hear you say such negative things about someone.

this dont make no sense to me. isnt a consollation some stars in the sky that make a picture? any way its cool you think virtual mode is real an that you will listen. why it hurt you its not bout you? Bunch a z*n freaks. Hey, I’m a Z*n "freak" too thank you.  :)

no ofense spose to spat those words words that gotta do with r*lgions. But if you get sick and tired of seeing her like that, why don’t you do something about it?  cursing and complaining and insulting won’t do a d*mn thing to change anything.

sure it does. it makes folks know they dont like some thing. And no matter what you say, I still think of her as a wonderful peson.

dont think what virtual mode said was bout the person but the body. it you dont like the body you dont like the body. kinda simple like that. But you are as well, in your own rights.  Your emotions are justified!

thats right! Maybe I had no right to say anything to start, but hearing insults is one of my defensive  trigger buttons.

is that how you got hurt? I knew I should have stayed inside.  Now my negatory vibes are gonna make people not like me No, it’s okay to come out.  You can’t keep this tension and anger locked up inside for ever!  I don’t think any less of you, I just think there are other ways than insults.

well may be he dont know any other way to say how p*ssed off he feels an then when he does he gets jumped on for it! dont blame him at all for wantin to shut up now an not be round for folks to know hes round. not cool to open your mouth an then get told you did it it wrong. real drag. this is probly why I aint seen teens round here so much bc they say stuf an then get jumped on. real cr*p thing to do to some body who dont talk very much. get that same sh*t round here to an Im sick of it! Hoping to hear from you, tierra

thatd be a meericle. Dante

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Hey, I like you. Opinions are like ’ssholes everyone’s got one. You certainly have a right to yours. To everything else you said I say "’men sister!" Boy how I can relate! Veronica – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – x-no-archive: yes virtual mode Hey, I know this is gonna sound rude most likely, but why don’t you be a little nicer to her! Well, by my standards, you don’t sound rude at all.  By my standards, I’M the rude one.  I’m rude for a reason.  Because I have very little say so and no one listens to me, why should I be miss nicey nice?  Being ‘nice’ to other people who treat me like I’m not real and having not a sould listen to me is too humilitating.  At least my anger and rudeness allow me to retain my dignity and pride.  Dignity and pride are all I have.  If those two things change, I become, like nothing but dirt under their fingernails.   If she has a weight problem, talking like that will do nothing. If anything, it could make it worse by causing negative feelings. She has enought negative feelings for the whole continuum here.  I dont’ ’cause’ negative feelings, I was CREATED by negative feelings.  And in trying to break away from the mould I was made from, I find that my rebellion is negative.  Everything I touch is somehow connected to something negative. Terra would tell me, ‘don’t say negative, say receptive’.  But that’s a bunch of hokey New Age bullsh*t.  Bunch a zen freaks.  Be supportive.  Encourage her to do healthy things.  But nicely!  It can’t be as bad as you make it sound, and even if it is, what doesitmatter? Because I got to live here too.  I get sick and tired of seeing that big fat gut protruding out in front of me and that big fat *ss sticking out behind. The back HURTS because of all of the fat sticking out everywhere.  And when people look at us with contempt, it doesn’t bother Terra but it does bother me!!  I’m the one who feels the pain.  They sin in haste, while I repent at leisure. She is a wonderful person! Not from where I’m looking.  You should see how the rest of the family walks on eggshells because of the combination of US.  No one ever knows what to expect. I knew I should have stayed inside.  Now my negatory vibes are gonna make people not like me. VM tierra…. hoping I didn’t offend anybody but felt I had to say that                          You yourself, as much as anybody in the                      entire universe, deserve your love and attention                                               -Buddha From the ashes, Phoenix — "Fear is the true enemy, the only enemy." — For more information about this service, send e-mail to:

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Well, I’m glad I didn’t come off as rude…. If it’s any consollation, I think you are real.  I will listen to you.  I understand your anger.  It just hurts me to hear you say such negative things about someone. Bunch a zen freaks.

Hey, I’m a Zen "freak" too thank you.  :) But if you get sick and tired of seeing her like that, why don’t you do something about it?  cursing and complaining and insulting won’t do a d*mn thing to change anything. And no matter what you say, I still think of her as a wonderful peson. But you are as well, in your own rights.  Your emotions are justified!  Maybe I had no right to say anything to start, but hearing insults is one of my defensive  trigger buttons. I knew I should have stayed inside.  Now my negatory vibes are gonna make people not like me

No, it’s okay to come out.  You can’t keep this tension and anger locked up inside for ever!  I don’t think any less of you, I just think there are other ways than insults. Hoping to hear from you, tierra                           You yourself, as much as anybody in the                       entire universe, deserve your love and attention                                                -Buddha

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Question:

All of you seem to have such encourement for those afflicted with this condition.  I know I have felt a lot of support reading the postings.  My husband is going through a very difficult time at the moment.  We have had 2 very emotional days, and usually this is a very strong man.  A month ago he had a heart attack and had angioplasty.  Not that the spasmodic torticollis isn’t bad enough, now he is worried about his heart also even though the cardiologist says there is no relation (I certainly question that with all the stress he has been under for the past 18 months).  He seems to be giving up telling me he can’t fight this thing anymore.  He take Baclofen and Artane and of course gets Botox every three months.  The Botox has not taken the pain away but it has allowed his head to remain in an upright position.  He suffers every waking moment with spasms and we have yet to find the right combination to relieve the pain.  Do any of you have any words of encouragement I can pass on to him.  Some of you have suffered with this for many, many years and seem to have found a way to deal with it even through you are in pain and my heart expecially goes out to the children who have to suffer with this.  Would love to hear from you and I will print the messages out and read to him as he cannot sit at the computer.  BethThanks to all of you. Virginia

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writes: He seems to be giving up telling me he can’t fight this thing anymore.  He take Baclofen and Artane and of course gets Botox every three months. The Botox has not taken the pain away but it has allowed his head to remain in an upright position.  He suffers every waking moment with spasms and we have yet to find the right combination to relieve the pain.  Do any of you have any words of encouragement I can pass on to him.  Some of you have suffered with this for many, many years and seem to have found a way to deal with it even through you are in pain and my heart expecially goes out to the children who have to suffer with this.  

I wish I could think of the right thing to say…its so hard.  I feel so bad for what you and your husband are going through.  Cant they admit him for awhile, like they did Jeremy, break the cycle and try other meds until something works?  I know what you must be going through, its so hard to watch someone you love suffer and feel so helpless.  My son has suffered for his whole 13 years of life and he often asked why I kept trying so hard to find a diagnosis and remedy….he had adjusted to it as a part of his life.  (Children adjust so much better than us adults!)  I told him that I would never give up and he was finally diagnosed about 7 months ago…..after 13 years of mis-diagnosis.  He is going through all the trials of medication and I think we have hit on a good combo now, but who knows how long it will last.   He encourages me more than I do him!  He always says *it will pass, dont worry, I’m fine*….as I bite off all my fingernails.   Since I dont know what to say….I asked for Jeremys input.  He found it hard to come up with something concrete except to say that he will pray for him, not to give up….that there is a light at the end of the tunnel sometimes, if God thought it was his time to go….he would, that he will get his reward in heaven for the suffering he has done on earth (I taught him that years ago….hes hoping heaven has alot of Super Nintendo games…you know kids) and that he has a family that loves him very much. I wish I could do better than this, but I am new at the dystonia diagnosis so I dont know exactly what can be done to find the relief he needs.  I am sure that  the more expercienced people on this newsgroup will have much better responses for you.  I just wanted you and your husband to know that we are praying for you and wishing you better days. Love, Cyndie and Jeremy

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writes: This may be a start in bombarding the networks.  

Lets do it!  And thanks for the info! Cyndie

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I finally found some addresses which I will pass along to all of you. NBC is Http://TVnet.com/tv/NYtv/wNBC.html – FAX 212-456-2290 CBS fax is, 212-975-5656 (did not locate an email address) I found a Donahue but not sure if this is Phil, it was just listed by last start in bombarding the networks.  

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Mary Beth you are wonderful!  You speak from your heart and since you have dealt with this condition for such a long time you can understand what he is going through.  I have mentioned you to Doug several times especially reinterating how long you have suffered with this, have raised a family, and, have such a terrific outlook on life.  This is a terrifying time for both of us, I try to give support and guess I am too much of an optimist. I always feel today isn’t so good, but tomorrow will be better.  Thank you for mentioning the depression after surgery, this may be what is hitting him now.  We have been the "I think I’m going crazy" route but that was due to medication which has now been corrected and he is back to normal. We do have to be careful what is prescribed because he takes so many other meds for his dystonia and the 2 doctors are not in the same group, or same city so I am the intermediary trying to make sure he is not taking drugs that will contridict each other.  I will speak with him regarding the possibility of a phone conversation I know if he could sit at this computer and read the messages posted he would find much support from all.  Thanks again for your concern, support, and very good advice. Fondly, Virginia

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mary Beth you are wonderful!  You speak from your heart and since you have dealt with this condition for such a long time you can understand what he is going through.  I have mentioned you to Doug several times especially reinterating how long you have suffered with this, have raised a family, and, have such a terrific outlook on life.  This is a terrifying time for both of us, I try to give support and guess I am too much of an optimist. I always feel today isn’t so good, but tomorrow will be better.  Thank you for mentioning the depression after surgery, this may be what is hitting him now.  We have been the "I think I’m going crazy" route but that was due to medication which has now been corrected and he is back to normal. We do have to be careful what is prescribed because he takes so many other meds for his dystonia and the 2 doctors are not in the same group, or same city so I am the intermediary trying to make sure he is not taking drugs that will contridict each other.  I will speak with him regarding the possibility of a phone conversation I know if he could sit at this computer and read the messages posted he would find much support from all. Thanks again for your concern, support, and very good advice. Fondly, Virginia

Hi Virginia: I have ST with accompanying essential tremor, I also have panic disorder which causes depression at times for me.  Panic disorder can do a really good job of convincing you that you must be going crazy.  Tell Doug that it’s only the brightest, most brilliant minds that suffer from this kind of depression…….look at me!  <VBG  Having surgery can really knock you down hard, especially if you have other medical conditions that have to be treated properly at the same time.  I hope Doug is well on the way to recovery.  The depression will go, that I know.  No way is he going crazy.  There *will* be a cure for dystonia very soon – I’m convinced of that.  Give him a big hug from me and tell him I’m thinking of  both of you. All the best. Mally  

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Cyndie and Jeremy, Your touching note brought tears to my eyes and I want to thank you for your prayers.  I have pursued this horrible affliction much the same as you but of course not nearly as long.  I have searched for the very best medical Dr.s available and in the beginning, we he wasn’t as bad and was much stronger we would have gone anywhere to get the proper treatment, at least one that would give him relief.  We were lucky in a sense that the first neurologist we saw was familiar with dystonia and put him in touch with a doctor that was a researcher in the field and gave the botox injections.  He has not had any trouble with the blepharospasms after having 4 treatments which was back in October of 1994.  We were so hoping that the Botox would have the same affect on the torticollis, but so far it hasn’t, but we will keep trying.  We live in the Los Angeles area and there are many very fine centers and wonderful doctors here and believe me we have tried them all.  We have even been to the Mayo Clinic in Scottsdale, AZ.  All the doctors we have seen are knowledgable, but they need to come up with the right combination of meds.  My very best to you and many, many kudos to your valiant son. Virginia

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