Question:

I just switched physicians.  I just got another cold, and I’ve had enough.  The next time I have an appointment with him I’m going to speak to him about switching back to Vanceril.  It’s less convenient (4x/day), but I’d rather not deal with the side effects of Aerobid anymore.  Or the taste of it, for that matter.  :-)

Suggestion:  Pulmicort ™ (brand of budesonide) has been approved by the FDA for use in the United States, although it may not yet be commonly available.  It is quite a bit stronger than Aerobid ™ (brand of flunisolide).  You might try asking your doctor to try you on Pulmicort ™. I’ve been on it for over a year with zero problems. (However, I am adrenally insufficient, and had to have both hips replaced, because of long-term prednisone.  I am currently on hydrocortisone replacement therapy.  Your mileage may vary.)

Response:

I’ve been on Aerobid inhaler (4 puffs in the morning and 4 at night) for two years. I have not suffered an asthma attack since. However, I noticed that often after inhaling Aerobid, I get very nervous, jittery, irritable and begin to tremble. Supposedly, Aerobid, an inhaled steroid, should not

Since stopping with freon propelled inhilators I no longer get the shakes. Also, my asthma is much better to the point that I am convinced that the propellant was aggravating my asthma. I now use Bricanyl and Pulmicort both of which are from ASTRA pharma Inc . in Mississauga, Ontario. These are packaged in "turbuhalers" which are breath activated. That is, by breathing in the medication in powder form is picked up. I will never use inhilators with propellants again.

Response:

(JSterl7511) writes: I’ve been on Aerobid inhaler (4 puffs in the morning and 4 at night) for two years. I have not suffered an asthma attack since. However, I noticed that often after inhaling Aerobid, I get very nervous, jittery, irritable and begin to tremble. Supposedly, Aerobid, an inhaled steroid, should not cause these symptoms which are often associated with injected, oral tablets or other systemic steroids.

False!  While systemic effects are uncommon, they are *not* unheard of. According to the manufacturer’s own package insert that comes with the

Aerobid inhaler: Adverse reactions reported include "nervous system" effects: dizziness, irritability, nervousness, shakiness (incidence 3-9%).  You should ask your doctor or pharmacist for this package insert and read it yourself, or consult the PDR. I use Aerobid inhaler myself–and I’ve had problems too: Ever since I started on Aerobid last year, I’ve had many more colds,

averaging about 1 cold every 8 weeks!  (Before starting Aerobid I used to get only 2-3 colds per year.)  And sure enough, the reported incidence of "cold symptoms" is 15%, and "upper respiratory infection" is 25% !  If this is a side effect of Aerobid, it’s a nasty one for me because those colds all exacerbate my asthma for weeks. I used to be on Vanceril before this.  From my comparison of the package

inserts and other references I’ve consulted, I have concluded that Aerobid seems to have a greater incidence of systemic side effects than Vanceril does. I just switched physicians.  I just got another cold, and I’ve had

enough.  The next time I have an appointment with him I’m going to speak to him about switching back to Vanceril.  It’s less convenient (4x/day), but I’d rather not deal with the side effects of Aerobid anymore.  Or the taste of it, for that matter.  :-) Why does AeroBid list so many side effects [adverse events] in their package insert and the PDR? FACT:  AeroBid was approved by the FDA in 1984, just after the mandate from FDA that ALL adverse events, whether directly associated with the drug or not, be listed. Thus, Vanceril, Beclovent and Azmacort – all approved by FDA prior to the mandate, do not list such occurrences. Flovent (fluticasone), recently approved by FDA, also lists all adverse events in their package insert. Pulmicort (budesonide),  has been submitted to FDA and received an ‘approvable letter’ in June ‘96 but not yet approved, will also list all adverse events. Thus, AeroBid has no greater side effect risk than does Vanceril, Beclovent or Azmacort. The same can be said about Flovent and Pulmicort. A suggestion that may help to reduce or even eliminate systemic related effects of AeroBid (including taste) or any inhaled steroid is to try an AeroChamber. This is a holding chamber (spacer device) that has been shown to reduce the amount of drug that ends up in the mouth and throat by six fold, without impairing the small drug particle availability which actually navigates to the lower airways and provides the topical benefit of inhaled steroid (antiinflammatory) therapy. If you have been on a 2000 mcg (8 puffs daily) dose for 2 years without an asthma attack, try the AeroChamber before changing horses, so to say. Tim Wood

Response:

I’ve been on Aerobid inhaler (4 puffs in the morning and 4 at night) for two years. I have not suffered an asthma attack since. However, I noticed that often after inhaling Aerobid, I get very nervous, jittery, irritable and begin to tremble. Supposedly, Aerobid, an inhaled steroid, should not cause these symptoms which are often associated with injected, oral tablets or other systemic steroids. Anyone else experience these problems with Aerobid? What did you do? Cut down the dosage or move onto another medication. I’d appreciate hearing from someone with similar experience. Thanks. John  Sterling

Response:

I’ve been on Aerobid inhaler (4 puffs in the morning and 4 at night) for two years. I have not suffered an asthma attack since. However, I noticed that often after inhaling Aerobid, I get very nervous, jittery, irritable and begin to tremble. Supposedly, Aerobid, an inhaled steroid, should not cause these symptoms which are often associated with injected, oral tablets or other systemic steroids.

False!  While systemic effects are uncommon, they are *not* unheard of. According to the manufacturer’s own package insert that comes with the Aerobid inhaler: Adverse reactions reported include "nervous system" effects: dizziness, irritability, nervousness, shakiness (incidence 3-9%).  You should ask your doctor or pharmacist for this package insert and read it yourself, or consult the PDR. Anyone else experience these problems with Aerobid? What did you do?

I use Aerobid inhaler myself–and I’ve had problems too: Ever since I started on Aerobid last year, I’ve had many more colds, averaging about 1 cold every 8 weeks!  (Before starting Aerobid I used to get only 2-3 colds per year.)  And sure enough, the reported incidence of "cold symptoms" is 15%, and "upper respiratory infection" is 25% !  If this is a side effect of Aerobid, it’s a nasty one for me because those colds all exacerbate my asthma for weeks. I used to be on Vanceril before this.  From my comparison of the package inserts and other references I’ve consulted, I have concluded that Aerobid seems to have a greater incidence of systemic side effects than Vanceril does. I just switched physicians.  I just got another cold, and I’ve had enough.  The next time I have an appointment with him I’m going to speak to him about switching back to Vanceril.  It’s less convenient (4x/day), but I’d rather not deal with the side effects of Aerobid anymore.  Or the taste of it, for that matter.  :-) — Steven D. Litvintchouk                  "There seems to be no mainframe Disclaimer:  As far as I am aware,       in which we’re living." the opinions expressed herein                 — President Bill Clinton are not those of my employer.

Response:

Question:

Anyway, I have noticed since I have been on the inhalers, intal and azmacort both 2 puffs 3 times a day, I seem to get periods of overheating and sweating.  

I dont know if this is so much an effect of the meds, as it is an effect of the asthma.  After all, you are WORKING at breathing more than a non asthmatic.  I have noticed, though, that my menstrual hot flashes are rather severe, and seem especially bad if I am wheezing. Jennifer

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was recently diagnosed with Asthma (1 month ago).  I had symptoms for approximately 6 months prior and finally went to a doctor when I woke up one night and could barely get a breath. (I used my wife’s proventil inhaler and was able to breathe again – she also has asthma). Anyway, I have noticed since I have been on the inhalers, intal and azmacort both 2 puffs 3 times a day, I seem to get periods of overheating and sweating.  The only relation to exertion is that when I do exert myself, the overheating and sweating increases significantly. My wife has also suffered from these "sweats" for the last couple of years.  She is on azmacort and servent. Is this a side effect of these two medications or one of the medications or is it just one more thing I and my wife have to deal with that goes along with being an asthmatic?  Any thoughts would be appreciated. John The road to wisdom begins somewhere! I tried Flovent and did not like it.  It did not seem to work as well as

Beconase. P. Upchurch

Response:

I was recently diagnosed with Asthma (1 month ago).  I had symptoms for approximately 6 months prior and finally went to a doctor when I woke up one night and could barely get a breath. (I used my wife’s proventil inhaler and was able to breathe again – she also has asthma).   Anyway, I have noticed since I have been on the inhalers, intal and azmacort both 2 puffs 3 times a day, I seem to get periods of overheating and sweating.  The only relation to exertion is that when I do exert myself, the overheating and sweating increases significantly. My wife has also suffered from these "sweats" for the last couple of years.  She is on azmacort and servent. Is this a side effect of these two medications or one of the medications or is it just one more thing I and my wife have to deal with that goes along with being an asthmatic?  Any thoughts would be appreciated. John The road to wisdom begins somewhere!

Response:

Hot flashes do occur in some people using these medicines.  In recent years asthma has been found to be related to the adrenal gland and the release of adrenalin.  It happens to me occassionally but I always attributed it to the Azmacort I use.  Hope this helps.

Response:

Question:

By the manufacturer’s own admission, "discontinuation effects are well-known to occur with anti-depressants".  Mr. Pittasso’s list is a very accurate one, and it’s very unfortunate that your 70 year old father did what he did, I am sure he suffered considerably.  This will happen with all of the SSRI medications if stopped abruptly, particularly after higher doses and long periods of use.  The syndrome WILL end, but not without some degree of torment to the patient. I hope that your Dad does not suffer any permanent injury from having fallen, as is so often the case with elderly people. Gary

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – From http://www.adrugrecall.com/zoloft/effects.html "In addition to the Zoloft side effects that occur while taking the drug, patients who have decided to stop treatment have found that the Zoloft side effects resulting from withdrawal can be even worse. Although all SSRIs carry the risk of withdrawal, with Paxil’s among the worst, Zoloft side effects tend to rank as a close second. Patients who have stopped taking the drug have reported Zoloft side effects from withdrawal that include jolting electric "zaps", dizziness, extreme nausea and vomiting, high fever, abdominal discomfort, flu symptoms, agitation, anxiety, insomnia, aggression, nightmares, tremor, seizure, and confusion. The Zoloft side effects stemming from withdrawal can become so painful that some patients have committed suicide to end their misery. A more common result of Zoloft withdrawal is misinterpretation by the physician and/or patient, with a wrongful diagnosis of regression. " Can someone please tell me the side effects of a fit 70 year old man stopping Zoloft abruptly?  Dad has been taking 100mg of Zoloft for at least 2 years, maybe longer.  He stopped about 2-2 1/2 weeks ago.  Didn’t taper, just stopped.  Yesterday he was taken by ambulance and admitted to the hospital for having fallen off a ladder.  He’s been dizzy, he passed out and vomited.  He’s been sick at his stomach.  In the ER, he started shaking/tremors violently.  Looked like he was convulsing.  After two hours and 2 rounds of Atavan, he stopped.  He thought he was dying  All tests, including CTscan of the head, EKG, blood tests, blood oxygen, chest x-rays were normal.  BP normal except during the convulsions.  I know you shouldn’t stop this medication abruptly but I can’t find on the net WHAT to expect if you do. Thanks, Monica

Response:

Can someone please tell me the side effects of a fit 70 year old man stopping Zoloft abruptly?  Dad has been taking 100mg of Zoloft for at least 2 years, maybe longer.  He stopped about 2-2 1/2 weeks ago.  Didn’t taper, just stopped.  Yesterday he was taken by ambulance and admitted to the hospital for having fallen off a ladder.  He’s been dizzy, he passed out and vomited.  He’s been sick at his stomach.  In the ER, he started shaking/tremors violently.  Looked like he was convulsing.  After two hours and 2 rounds of Atavan, he stopped.  He thought he was dying  All tests, including CTscan of the head, EKG, blood tests, blood oxygen, chest x-rays were normal.  BP normal except during the convulsions.  I know you shouldn’t stop this medication abruptly but I can’t find on the net WHAT to expect if you do. Thanks, Monica

Response:

From http://www.adrugrecall.com/zoloft/effects.html "In addition to the Zoloft side effects that occur while taking the drug, patients who have decided to stop treatment have found that the Zoloft side effects resulting from withdrawal can be even worse. Although all SSRIs carry the risk of withdrawal, with Paxil’s among the worst, Zoloft side effects tend to rank as a close second. Patients who have stopped taking the drug have reported Zoloft side effects from withdrawal that include jolting electric "zaps", dizziness, extreme nausea and vomiting, high fever, abdominal discomfort, flu symptoms, agitation, anxiety, insomnia, aggression, nightmares, tremor, seizure, and confusion. The Zoloft side effects stemming from withdrawal can become so painful that some patients have committed suicide to end their misery. A more common result of Zoloft withdrawal is misinterpretation by the physician and/or patient, with a wrongful diagnosis of regression. "

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Can someone please tell me the side effects of a fit 70 year old man stopping Zoloft abruptly?  Dad has been taking 100mg of Zoloft for at least 2 years, maybe longer.  He stopped about 2-2 1/2 weeks ago.  Didn’t taper, just stopped.  Yesterday he was taken by ambulance and admitted to the hospital for having fallen off a ladder.  He’s been dizzy, he passed out and vomited.  He’s been sick at his stomach.  In the ER, he started shaking/tremors violently.  Looked like he was convulsing.  After two hours and 2 rounds of Atavan, he stopped.  He thought he was dying  All tests, including CTscan of the head, EKG, blood tests, blood oxygen, chest x-rays were normal.  BP normal except during the convulsions.  I know you shouldn’t stop this medication abruptly but I can’t find on the net WHAT to expect if you do. Thanks, Monica

Response:

Can someone please tell me the side effects of a fit 70 year old man stopping Zoloft abruptly?  Dad has been taking 100mg of Zoloft for at least 2 years, maybe longer.  He stopped about 2-2 1/2 weeks ago.  Didn’t taper, just stopped.  Yesterday he was taken by ambulance and admitted to the hospital for having fallen off a ladder.  He’s been dizzy, he passed out and vomited.  He’s been sick at his stomach.  In the ER, he started shaking/tremors violently.  Looked like he was convulsing.  After two hours and 2 rounds of Atavan, he stopped.  He thought he was dying  All tests, including CTscan of the head, EKG, blood tests, blood oxygen, chest x-rays were normal.  BP normal except during the convulsions.  I know you shouldn’t stop this medication abruptly but I can’t find on the net WHAT to expect if you do.

Abrupt cessation of SSRI’s will cause the kind of symptoms your father experienced. A planned taper off  these medications should always be undertaken!! See: http://www.namiscc.org/News/2002/Summer/PaxilWithdrawal.htm

Response:

Thank you both for the information you posted!!  This describes dad’s symptoms exactly. Monica

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Can someone please tell me the side effects of a fit 70 year old man stopping Zoloft abruptly?  Dad has been taking 100mg of Zoloft for at least

Response:

Question:

<Gale.Schu…@risperdal.causes.mania

wrote in message

news:cv50ducnc4u11fr799r6265i8vu3k60t76@4ax.com…

Effexor Withdrawal Causing Crackling Sounds in the Brain Antidepressants  "Thank God for this website." I had a nervous breakdown six years ago and after being on other

anti-depressants without

a problem, my psychiatrist felt that Effexor had less of an effect on the

heart, and so

switched me to Effexor. I have tried unsuccessfully to quit on many

occasions, even though

I only take 37.5 mgs per day. The extreme lethargy I feel when I have

tried to quit, the

tingling in various parts of my body, the weird dreams and most

troublesome of all, the

crackling, electric sounds in my head have caused me too much distress to

ever be

successful.

Hi, I think that you have to think about all these  side effect problems. Maybe they are not side-effect, maybe they are only telling you that you are stressed, and you need to fix your problems, otherwise the side-problems will be forever with you B

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -"barbapic" <barba…@ntlworld.com

wrote in message <news:go%z8.821$8n2.364518@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com… <Gale.Schu…@risperdal.causes.mania wrote in message news:cv50ducnc4u11fr799r6265i8vu3k60t76@4ax.com… Effexor Withdrawal Causing Crackling Sounds in the Brain Antidepressants  "Thank God for this website." I had a nervous breakdown six years ago and after being on other  anti-depressants without a problem, my psychiatrist felt that Effexor had less of an effect on the  heart, and so switched me to Effexor. I have tried unsuccessfully to quit on many  occasions, even though I only take 37.5 mgs per day. The extreme lethargy I feel when I have  tried to quit, the tingling in various parts of my body, the weird dreams and most  troublesome of all, the crackling, electric sounds in my head have caused me too much distress to  ever be successful. Hi, I think that you have to think about all these  side effect problems. Maybe they are not side-effect, maybe they are only telling you that you are stressed, and you need to fix your problems, otherwise the side-problems will be forever with you B

I thought cross-posting to and from different kind of newsgroups was not the reason why they started alt.support.schizofrenia. Btw, is it not forbidden in the FAQ ? Berty

Response:

Question:

Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar).

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources) "(The BNN is published four times a year by an international group of investigators working with patients with bipolar disorder to better understand the long-term course and treatment of the illness. The goal of the Network is to help develop new and more effective treatments for bipolar disorder. http://www.bipolarnetwork.org, email: Genetics 378 genetic markers were examined and a linkage was found "between bipolar illness vulnerability and loci on chromosomes 15q14 and 7q11. Lithium Lithium: The literature was reviewed of patients taking lithium long term to patients that discontinued it. "Suicidal acts rose 22-fold, and fatalities increased 14-fold, within the first year after discontinuing the lithium." There are increased cases of goiter in 100 patients taking lithium that was related to dose and duration. This was prevented by thyroxine. Bipolar Disord 1999 Sep;1(1):5-10 Perspectives on lithium treatment of bipolar disorder: action, efficacy, effect on suicidal behavior. Schou M. The Psychiatric Hospital, Risskov, Denmark In bipolar disorder the choice of prophylactic drug must be based on a weighing of efficacy against tolerability, interactions, ease of management, use during pregnancy and lactation, and expense. Lithium should be the preferred prophylactic drug in patients with typical bipolar disorder and in patients who are at high risk of committing suicide, that is, patients with severe depressions or depressions combined with persistent suicidal ideas or with suicide attempts in the past. Antidepressants Mood stabilizers taken with newer (second generation) antidepressants induce mania less than older antidepressants – tricyclics and MAOI. Bupropion (Wellbutrin), sertraline (Zoloft), and venlafaxine (Effexor) are examined in consumers with the bipolar disorder who experience "break through depression," even though medicated. There is a moderate antidepressant response in 33% and a 12% rate of triggering mania in this study of 100 bipolars. Buproprion (Wellbutrin) vs. Desipramine (Norpramin) were studied. The rate of cycling between mania and hypomania was significantly greater in the Desipramine group (37%). Buproprion (13%,p<0.05). Paxil studied in a randomized, controlled six week trial. It was found to be "equally effective for depression breaking through ongoing mood stabilizer treatment as an addition of a second mood stabilizer, typically valproate to lithium, or vice versa." "…the risk of depressive relapse for 27 bipolar patients after antidepressant discontinuation was 67% versus 39% in the 18 patients who" stayed on their antidepressants. Mood Stabilizers The treatment of combining one or more mood stabilizers with an antidepressant to prevent manic episodes, needs to be explored further. "…using the newer antidepressants earlier to supplement mood stabilizers should be considered." New medication and combining medications can produce remarkable improvement. Lamotrigine (Lamictal) Lamotrigine (Lamictal) has assisted many consumers whose illness has not responded to other treatments. (Frye et al, 2000, J Clin Psychopharmacol, in press; Calabrese et al., 1999, J Clin Psychiatry 60: 79-88). Proceed slowly with Lamictal to reduce risk of rash and other side effects. Lamotrigine (Lamictal) was superior to both gabapentin and placebo in a six-week monotherapy trial for refractory patients. 437 outpatient study, double-blind, placebo-controlled; Lamotrigine is equal to desipramine and superior to placebo in unipolar depression. Gabapentin (Neurontin) Gabapentin (Neurontin) is helpful for residual manic and depressive symptoms, but not rapid cycling. Neurontin has better response with patients who are associated with younger age, shorter duration of illness, and lower initial body weight. Gabapentin failed to exceed placebo in an outpatient study of acute mania. Gabapentin is not an effective medication for acute mania. Study: 10 wk., double-blind, placebo-controlled trial dosed between 900 and 3600 mg/day. Gabapentin was "not superior to the placebo for bipolar I symptoms of hypomania, mania, or mixed states." Gabapentin has also been "effective in some anxiety disorders including social phobia and is widely used for adjunctive treatment in pain syndromes." 218 patient study of Gabapentin in the treatment of bipolar disorder shows that if it is "combined with antidepressants, neuroleptics, lithium, and other anticonvulsants, had a high rate of response in combination (69%) and in monotherapy (42%)." Bipolar Disord 1999 Sep;1(1):61-5 Altshuler LL, Keck PE Jr, McElroy SL, Suppes T, Brown ES, Denicoff K, Frye M, Gitlin M, Hwang S, Goodman R, Leverich G, Nolen W, Kupka R, Post R. UCLA Mood Disorders Research Program, UCLA Medical Plaza, CA 90095-7057, USA Gabapentin appears to have acute anti-manic and anti-depressant properties as an adjunctive agent for refractory bipolar illness. Prospective double-blind studies are needed to further delineate its acute efficacy when used as monotherapy and its prophylactic efficacy as monotherapy or in conjuction with other mood stabilizers. Divalproex (Depakote) Divalproex (Depakote) vs. Lithium were both equally effective in 43 patients. The patients that did not respond to Lithium, responded to Depakote and vice versa. "Depakote monotherapy was notably effective in treating depressive symptoms." Topiramate (Topamax) Topiramate (Topamax) find a 56% much or very much improved response in "16 patients after 6 weeks, four of the 16 had unpleasant sense of touch and two had word finding difficulties," in the treatment of bipolar disorder. All patients lost weight at an average of 10 pounds. "Dr. R. McIntyre and colleagues at the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health, Toronto, compared topiramate (50-300 mg/day) to bupropion SR (Wellbutrin, 100-400 mg/day) for eight weeks as adjuncts to mood stabilizers in 26 bipolar out patients with major depression. Both bupropion SR and topiramate showed a significant reduction in depressive symptoms and were not statistically different from each other. No patients switched into a manic episode on either treatment. These preliminary results suggest that topiramate may have comparable antidepressant activity to bupropion SR, a remarkable finding if replicated." Mexiletine (Mexitil) Mexiletine (Mexitil) has anticonvulsant, antiarrhythmic, and analgesic properties. In a study of 13 treatment resistant bipolars at doses from 200 – 1200 mg/day had a full response in 45% of patients. Another study: 8 out of 26 patients treated with Mexiletine had a positive therapeutic effect. ECT (Electro Convulsive Therapy) "…low dose, right unilateral (one-sided) was ineffective in two different studies of major depression (i.e., 23% improvement or 17% improvement respectively). However, high dose right unilateral ECT was as effective as bilateral (two-sided) ECT, and bilateral ECT clearly produced more lasting amnesia and memory defects. (Sackeim et al, 2000; Arch Gen Psychiatry 57: 425-434). rTMS and ECT are generally equally effective in "patients with nondelusional major depression. ECT superior to patients with delusional depression than rTMS. Bipolar Brains Study of 10 bipolar brains during autopsy compared with "11 nonpsychiatric control subjects. Dr. Rajkowska found decreased density of layer 3 in the dorsolateral pre-frontal cortex (Brodman’s area nine), comprised of a decrease in the numbers of pyramidal cells but not other neuronal elements, a decrease in glial cell density, and an increase in glial size." "…bipolar patients showed: 1) decreased dorsolateral prefrontal cortex NAA bilaterally; 2) decreased prefrontal white matter NAA bilaterally; and, 3) increased thalamic NAA bilaterally. These data thus supplement a growing amount of structural imaging data suggesting alterations in size or chemistry of the prefrontal cortex, amygdala, and hippocampus in bipolar patients compared with controls." Neuroleptics Olanzapine (Zyprexa) Olanzapine (Zyprexa) was statistically significantly superior to placebo in the treatment of rapid cycling Bipolar I patients. Bipolar Disord 2000 Sep;2(3 Pt 1):196-9 Ghaemi SN, Cherry EL, Katzow JA, Goodwin FK. Harvard Bipolar Research Program, Massachusetts General Hospital, Consolidated Department of Psychiatry, Boston 02114, USA. "Olanzapine appears to be moderately effective in open add-on treatment in patients with mainly depressive symptoms. Accumulating evidence suggests that olanzapine, and atypical antipsychotics in general, possess mild to moderate adjunctive antidepressant properties." "Dr. R. Baker and co-workers from Lilly Research Laboratories and Harvard Medical School found that in two inpatient double-blind, randomized trials investigating the efficacy of olanzapine for acute mania, worsening of mania occurred more often on placebo than on olanzapine, in contrast to previous reports in open trials that olanzapine induced or exacerbated mania." "Dr. J. Frazier from Harvard Medical School and colleagues conducted a study of olanzapine monotherapy (2.5-20 mg/day) in 23 juvenile bipolar patients (ages 5-14) with mania or mixed symptoms. Sixty-one percent of patients responded, and 22

… read more »

Response:

I take mine at night as well.  I don’t find it making me sleepy though. Carrie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Gained 5 or 10 pounds, have to take it at night. No, not sleepy at all.  I don’t believe there has been any weight gain from it.  But I’ve not jumped on the scales and only started Zyprexa last week. Any weight gain for you?  That is one side effect that just sucks with some meds! Carrie Does it make you sleepy too? Gain any weight? Works well for me, too.  This is the best I’ve ever felt in 3 years. I take it with Neurontin.  I’m nearly normal and ready to take on the world. Well, some of it.  I’ll leave the thorny parts until I’m at my very best. LOL. Carrie Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar). http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources)

Response:

Does it make you sleepy too? Gain any weight?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Works well for me, too.  This is the best I’ve ever felt in 3 years.  I take it with Neurontin.  I’m nearly normal and ready to take on the world. Well, some of it.  I’ll leave the thorny parts until I’m at my very best.  LOL. Carrie Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar). http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources)

Response:

No, not sleepy at all.  I don’t believe there has been any weight gain from it.  But I’ve not jumped on the scales and only started Zyprexa last week. Any weight gain for you?  That is one side effect that just sucks with some meds! Carrie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does it make you sleepy too? Gain any weight? Works well for me, too.  This is the best I’ve ever felt in 3 years.  I take it with Neurontin.  I’m nearly normal and ready to take on the world. Well, some of it.  I’ll leave the thorny parts until I’m at my very best. LOL. Carrie Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar). http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources)

Response:

Gained 5 or 10 pounds, have to take it at night.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No, not sleepy at all.  I don’t believe there has been any weight gain from it.  But I’ve not jumped on the scales and only started Zyprexa last week. Any weight gain for you?  That is one side effect that just sucks with some meds! Carrie Does it make you sleepy too? Gain any weight? Works well for me, too.  This is the best I’ve ever felt in 3 years. I take it with Neurontin.  I’m nearly normal and ready to take on the world. Well, some of it.  I’ll leave the thorny parts until I’m at my very best. LOL. Carrie Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar). http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources)

Response:

Works well for me, too.  This is the best I’ve ever felt in 3 years.  I take it with Neurontin.  I’m nearly normal and ready to take on the world.  Well, some of it.  I’ll leave the thorny parts until I’m at my very best.  LOL. Carrie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Olanzapine (Zyprexa) works great for me (a formerly rapid cycling bi polar). http://www.mhsanctuary.com/bipolar/network.htm (The Below Bipolar Disorder Research Comes From Bipolar Network News & Various Other Resources) "(The BNN is published four times a year by an international group of investigators working with patients with bipolar disorder to better understand the long-term course and treatment of the illness. The goal of the Network is to help develop new and more effective treatments for bipolar disorder. http://www.bipolarnetwork.org, email: Genetics 378 genetic markers were examined and a linkage was found "between bipolar illness vulnerability and loci on chromosomes 15q14 and 7q11. Lithium Lithium: The literature was reviewed of patients taking lithium long term to patients that discontinued it. "Suicidal acts rose 22-fold, and fatalities increased 14-fold, within the first year after discontinuing the lithium." There are increased cases of goiter in 100 patients taking lithium that was related to dose and duration. This was prevented by thyroxine. Bipolar Disord 1999 Sep;1(1):5-10 Perspectives on lithium treatment of bipolar disorder: action, efficacy, effect on suicidal behavior. Schou M. The Psychiatric Hospital, Risskov, Denmark In bipolar disorder the choice of prophylactic drug must be based on a weighing of efficacy against tolerability, interactions, ease of management, use during pregnancy and lactation, and expense. Lithium should be the preferred prophylactic drug in patients with typical bipolar disorder and in patients who are at high risk of committing suicide, that is, patients with severe depressions or depressions combined with persistent suicidal ideas or with suicide attempts in the past. Antidepressants Mood stabilizers taken with newer (second generation) antidepressants induce mania less than older antidepressants – tricyclics and MAOI. Bupropion (Wellbutrin), sertraline (Zoloft), and venlafaxine (Effexor) are examined in consumers with the bipolar disorder who experience "break through depression," even though medicated. There is a moderate antidepressant response in 33% and a 12% rate of triggering mania in this study of 100 bipolars. Buproprion (Wellbutrin) vs. Desipramine (Norpramin) were studied. The rate of cycling between mania and hypomania was significantly greater in the Desipramine group (37%). Buproprion (13%,p<0.05). Paxil studied in a randomized, controlled six week trial. It was found to be "equally effective for depression breaking through ongoing mood stabilizer treatment as an addition of a second mood stabilizer, typically valproate to lithium, or vice versa." "…the risk of depressive relapse for 27 bipolar patients after antidepressant discontinuation was 67% versus 39% in the 18 patients who" stayed on their antidepressants. Mood Stabilizers The treatment of combining one or more mood stabilizers with an antidepressant to prevent manic episodes, needs to be explored further. "…using the newer antidepressants earlier to supplement mood stabilizers should be considered." New medication and combining medications can produce remarkable improvement. Lamotrigine (Lamictal) Lamotrigine (Lamictal) has assisted many consumers whose illness has not responded to other treatments. (Frye et al, 2000, J Clin Psychopharmacol, in press; Calabrese et al., 1999, J Clin Psychiatry 60: 79-88). Proceed slowly with Lamictal to reduce risk of rash and other side effects. Lamotrigine (Lamictal) was superior to both gabapentin and placebo in a six-week monotherapy trial for refractory patients. 437 outpatient study, double-blind, placebo-controlled; Lamotrigine is equal to desipramine and superior to placebo in unipolar depression. Gabapentin (Neurontin) Gabapentin (Neurontin) is helpful for residual manic and depressive symptoms, but not rapid cycling. Neurontin has better response with patients who are associated with younger age, shorter duration of illness, and lower initial body weight. Gabapentin failed to exceed placebo in an outpatient study of acute mania. Gabapentin is not an effective medication for acute mania. Study: 10 wk., double-blind, placebo-controlled trial dosed between 900 and 3600 mg/day. Gabapentin was "not superior to the placebo for bipolar I symptoms of hypomania, mania, or mixed states." Gabapentin has also been "effective in some anxiety disorders including social phobia and is widely used for adjunctive treatment in pain syndromes." 218 patient study of Gabapentin in the treatment of bipolar disorder shows that if it is "combined with antidepressants, neuroleptics, lithium, and other anticonvulsants, had a high rate of response in combination (69%) and in monotherapy (42%)." Bipolar Disord 1999 Sep;1(1):61-5 Altshuler LL, Keck PE Jr, McElroy SL, Suppes T, Brown ES, Denicoff K, Frye M, Gitlin M, Hwang S, Goodman R, Leverich G, Nolen W, Kupka R, Post R. UCLA Mood Disorders Research Program, UCLA Medical Plaza, CA 90095-7057, USA Gabapentin appears to have acute anti-manic and anti-depressant properties as an adjunctive agent for refractory bipolar illness. Prospective double-blind studies are needed to further delineate its acute efficacy when used as monotherapy and its prophylactic efficacy as monotherapy or in conjuction with other mood stabilizers. Divalproex (Depakote) Divalproex (Depakote) vs. Lithium were both equally effective in 43 patients. The patients that did not respond to Lithium, responded to Depakote and vice versa. "Depakote monotherapy was notably effective in treating depressive symptoms." Topiramate (Topamax) Topiramate (Topamax) find a 56% much or very much improved response in "16 patients after 6 weeks, four of the 16 had unpleasant sense of touch and two had word finding difficulties," in the treatment of bipolar disorder. All patients lost weight at an average of 10 pounds. "Dr. R. McIntyre and colleagues at the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health, Toronto, compared topiramate (50-300 mg/day) to bupropion SR (Wellbutrin, 100-400 mg/day) for eight weeks as adjuncts to mood stabilizers in 26 bipolar out patients with major depression. Both bupropion SR and topiramate showed a significant reduction in depressive symptoms and were not statistically different from each other. No patients switched into a manic episode on either treatment. These preliminary results suggest that topiramate may have comparable antidepressant activity to bupropion SR, a remarkable finding if replicated." Mexiletine (Mexitil) Mexiletine (Mexitil) has anticonvulsant, antiarrhythmic, and analgesic properties. In a study of 13 treatment resistant bipolars at doses from 200 – 1200 mg/day had a full response in 45% of patients. Another study: 8 out of 26 patients treated with Mexiletine had a positive therapeutic effect. ECT (Electro Convulsive Therapy) "…low dose, right unilateral (one-sided) was ineffective in two different studies of major depression (i.e., 23% improvement or 17% improvement respectively). However, high dose right unilateral ECT was as effective as bilateral (two-sided) ECT, and bilateral ECT clearly produced more lasting amnesia and memory defects. (Sackeim et al, 2000; Arch Gen Psychiatry 57: 425-434). rTMS and ECT are generally equally effective in "patients with nondelusional major depression. ECT superior to patients with delusional depression than rTMS. Bipolar Brains Study of 10 bipolar brains during autopsy compared with "11 nonpsychiatric control subjects. Dr. Rajkowska found decreased density of layer 3 in the dorsolateral pre-frontal cortex (Brodman’s area nine), comprised of a decrease in the numbers of pyramidal cells but not other neuronal elements, a decrease in glial cell density, and an increase in glial size." "…bipolar patients showed: 1) decreased dorsolateral prefrontal cortex NAA bilaterally; 2) decreased prefrontal white matter NAA bilaterally; and, 3) increased thalamic NAA bilaterally. These data thus supplement a growing amount of structural imaging data suggesting alterations in size or chemistry of the prefrontal cortex, amygdala, and hippocampus in bipolar patients compared with controls." Neuroleptics Olanzapine (Zyprexa) Olanzapine (Zyprexa) was statistically significantly superior to placebo in the treatment of rapid cycling Bipolar I patients. Bipolar Disord 2000 Sep;2(3 Pt 1):196-9 Ghaemi SN, Cherry EL, Katzow JA, Goodwin FK. Harvard Bipolar Research Program, Massachusetts General Hospital, Consolidated Department of Psychiatry, Boston 02114, USA. "Olanzapine appears to be moderately effective in open add-on treatment in patients with mainly depressive symptoms. Accumulating

… read more »

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Ok, so my doctor agreed to try another SSRI, but she wanted me to wean off Paxil first! Told her I could wean off one and wean onto another at the same time, but she was dubious about that so I asked her to look it up and ask around… now she agrees. She has prescribed Effexor.

Although Effexor technically is not an SSRI it is cross tolerant with SSRI’s so switching this way should be no problem. I’ve been told to take 20 mgs of paxil(instead of 40) and to add 37,5mgs of effexor for the next 3 days, then drop the paxil completely and raise the effexor to 75mgs. Does this sound about right? It seems like a fast changeover to me, but I’d rather deal with any side effects and get this change over with quickly myself anyway.

I agree that this may be a tad fast but I think it can be done if you are prepared to white-knuckle through some possible temporary side effects. My other question; is the target does of 75 mgs of effexor comparible to the 40 mgs of paxil I’ve been taking?

That is impossible to say as our reactions to meds are so personal. 75 mg of Effexor sound OK to me and if after a few weeks you feel it doesn’t work well enough you can always raise the dose a bit more. My xanax has been switched from 2x .5mg per day to 1x 1mg xanax XR per day. Hopefully it will stop me feeling like a yo-yo, I may need to ask for a dose increase I think.

I think so too considering the AD change. I take Xanax XR and IMO it is far preferable to *normal* Xanax. No rollercoatser effect anymore but a comparatively very smooth ride. Any thoughts/comments about this change in meds?

No ) Keep us posted! Philip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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Ok, so my doctor agreed to try another SSRI, but she wanted me to wean off Paxil first! Told her I could wean off one and wean onto another at the same time, but she was dubious about that so I asked her to look it up and ask around… now she agrees. She has prescribed Effexor. I’ve been told to take 20mgs of paxil(instead of 40) and to add 37,5mgs of effexor for the next 3 days, then drop the paxil completely and raise the effexor to 75mgs. Does this sound about right? It seems like a fast changeover to me, but I’d rather deal with any side effects and get this change over with quickly myself anyway. My other question; is the target does of 75 mgs of effexor comparible to the 40 mgs of paxil I’ve been taking? My xanax has been switched from 2x .5mg per day to 1x 1mg xanax XR per day. Hopefully it will stop me feeling like a yo-yo, I may need to ask for a dose increase I think. I’ll soon find out, considering the other med change! : ) Any thoughts/comments about this change in meds? I mean to start the changeover tommorow… Vashti

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From what you say above, and below, Vashti, it doesn’t seem like she has a good grip on these medications, but at least is open minded. Both frustrating and refreshing at the same time!

well could be dangerous to be less savy about things one prescribes Yes, I think it’s far too fast and large a drop in Paxil,

I concur My biggest concern would be that sudden drop of Paxil from 40 to 20, with a "starter" dose of Effexor ( 37.5 mg ) to take the place of 20 mg of Paxil?  I don’t think so!!

nope best off dropping paxil by 5mg a day per week until off Remember, they may be very slight, if much at all. So much depends on how ‘you’ react, not how some others have.

true 150 mg of Effexor to 40 mg of Paxil??

or  more since paxil is up to 17 times more potent at the synapse then prozac effexor hits multiple sites at higher doses and is basicaly serotonergic at lower ones so a sliding conversion may not be too bad-as a phenethylamine compound it excerts reuptake inhibition on serotonin first noradrenaline second and weakly dopaminergic thirdly so in some ways in works like a tca but in reverse where the tca hits adrenergic sites first serotonin sites second. it would be somewhat difficult to make a comparative dose per dose response due to the different pharmacokinetics and individual responses From what I understand, the XR should work out very well.

yes it would bot Rita and Philip use this med with good success You’re not alone..

Microbes are everywhere

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I didn’t respond to Zoloft or Luvox. I’m waiting to see if Prozac helps. I hope. James

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Wellbutrin doesn’t do anything for OCD.  If it did, I would be on it now.  Wellbutrin works on dopamine, and we need something that works on serotonin. There is a novel way to treat OCD, and that’s Zyprexa.  I found it worked for my OCD very well, and it also calmed me down so I could think straight.  Everybody else on this newsgroup will find Zyprexa foreign or the wrong choice for OCD–but they’re not psychiatrists.  Good psychiatrists will know about this treatment, for Zyprexa works on serotonin in a roundabout way. Perhaps you can try a tricyclic antidepressant.  The one with the least side-effects is desipramine.  Tricyclics tend to have the same side-effect profile as Paxil. Have you ever considered an MAOI, like Nardil or Parnate?  These drugs have as much efficacy as any other drug, but with unique precautions. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

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I also think you’re missing out by not taking the Effexor.  It has the least side-effects of any drug I have ever taken.  Withdrawal:  Not everyone gets it, and even if they do, there are remedies for it: From: "Chris" Date: Fri, 28 Jul 1995 14:05:30 +0000 Subject: Diphenhydramine for venlafaxine discontinuation reactions As a patient I found that Benadryl helped me get through the very uncomfortable withdrawals from Effexor. I only took it for a month. I was very surprised at the intensity of the withdrawal. The worst withdrawal effect for me was a sense of my nerves jangling when I moved my eyes and continuous indigestion, sort of a migraine-like feeling without the headache. When the Benedryl finally started to make me sleepy I switched to Dimetapp. The withdrawal took almost six weeks to get through, but I am now drug-free with tolerable levels of [chronic neck and back] pain [which was being treated with the Effexor]. From: "George Nasra" <nas…@penn.com

Date: Mon, 9 Oct 1995 09:33:07 -0400 Subject: Venlafaxine discontinuation reactions I was tapering a patient off Effexor a few weeks ago and he had what I considered a severe withdrawal reaction with nausea and vomiting and flu-like symptoms although he was already started on fluoxetine. A slower tapering worked better. Date: Sun, 22 Oct 1995 20:46:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Judith Lipton <jlip…@forest.net

Subject: Venlafaxine discontinuation reactions Of particular note with venlaxafine is the severe withdrawal syndrome that may occur with dose reduction. Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 18:14:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Ivan Goldberg <psy…@psycom.net

Subject: Venlafaxine discontinuation reactions On Wed, 11 Oct 1995, Charles S Berlin wrote:

     In my experience with Effexor [the] main drawback is that      – like Xanax — it seems easy to get on, but very hard to      get off. Many of my patients on this med start to have some      withdrawal symptoms after missing even a few doses, or      when tapering down. From: "D. Fegg" Date: Tue, 9 Jan 1996 22:12:14 -0500 Subject: Diphenhydramine for venlafaxine discontinuation reactions I want to reply/confirm regarding a listing for Effexor withdrawl symptoms that Benadryl is a great help getting through some of the rougher symptoms — whoda thunkit?! I tapered off my Effexor from 150 mg/day to 75 mg/day for a few wks, then to 37.5 mg/day for 2 wks, and then off. For the first 48 hrs, I had no symptoms, but then I was socked with the "electrical shock" phenomena someone else mentioned — with any movement at all. There were also concentration difficulties and gastrointestinal upset and just general crumminess. About 4 days into this, I read the post about Benadryl and got some, with quick reduction in a lot of the symptoms — enough so that I could return to work. It didn’t eliminate all of the problems, but it did a good job. I took it for about two weeks and then was over virtually all problems. My doctor was not familiar enough with this medication to have advice regarding the type/length of withdrawl symptoms, so I passed on the above info and hope it will help someone else. By the way, I am one of those people who do miss the great dreams I had on Effexor — very detailed vivid and downright interesting dreams — oh well. Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 16:00:29 -0800 From: kerr…@ix.netcom.com (Kerri D. Carter ) Subject: Venlafaxine discontinuation reactions A female patient in her 50s is currently taking Effexor tid in addition to blood pressure medication. She recently had a routine surgery for nasal passage blockage and discontinued her Effexor for approximately 3 days. She states that she experienced ringing in her ears and throbbing in her head that she associates with the absence of the Effexor — and this has been sufficiently severe for her to seriously question continuing to take it. This patient is typically very treatment receptive and compliant. This patient experienced this on one other occasion, when first taking the medication, and decided to continue after reassurance from her doctor of its benefits. The patient has had an excellent response to Effexor. Subject: Venlafaxine discontinuation reactions Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 21:02:45 -0500 (EST) From: "Jeffrey R. Stenzel" <jsten…@polar.Bowdoin.EDU

I have a patient that suffered the symptoms you describe. Both times she discontinued venlafaxine (dose <= 37.5 mg) she described tinnitus and a vertiginous-like experience that lasted up to a week. Both times the symptoms completely resolved. BTW, she liked everything about the antidepressant except decreased libido and anorgasmia, hence the reason for the switches. Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 13:08:32 -0800 From: Ivan Goldberg <Psy…@psycom.net

Subject: Fluoxetine for antidepressant discontinuation reactions When a patient is having a severe discontinuation syndrome following the too rapid discontinuation of paroxetine (Paxil) or venlafaxine (Effexor), the treatment I prefer is fluoxetine (Prozac) 20 mg. q.o.d. until the reaction disappears. It is seldom necessary to give more than 2 or 3 doses, and because of the long t-1/2 of fluoxetine, no additional doses are necessary. From: RMRi…@aol.com (Roberta M. Richardson, M.D.) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:27:49 -0500 Subject: Fluoxetine for antidepressant discontinuation reactions Dr. Sheldon Preskorn has also suggested using fluoxetine to treat paroxetine withdrawal, and I have used it successfully for both paroxetine and venlafaxine withdrawal. As per Dr. Preskorn’s advice, I give the fluoxetine for several consecutive days, then stop it and let the natural taper occur. Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:46:21 -0500 Subject: Fluoxetine for antidepressant discontinuation reactions From: cwolf…@pipeline.com (Cyrus Wolfman) I have found the use of fluoxetine a better approach in treating the so-called "discontinuation" symptoms on withdrawing SSRIs with short half-lives. In the past, I had raised the SSRI dose back up and simply reduced it more slowly, often with the symptoms reappearing on the more gradual withdrawal. Now, I lower the dose a second time, as in the past, but if the symptoms appear, I switch to fluoxetine 20 mg per day. As soon as the symptoms remit (in two or three days) I stop the fluoxetine. So far, no problems. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

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Hello all…  I went to the doctors today and told him outright, that there is NO-WAY I am going to take these Efexor XL tabs he put me on. Jesus, have any of you read all the crap it can do to you, """type in Efexor withdrawal"" into any search engine, and have a read,,there’s thousands of them. I would come of meds altogether before I let any drug mess me up like that. Anyway to the point, I have been on Prozac for about 7 years on and off (never had any withdrawals from this at all, ever) for the last 3 and a half years I’ve been taking 20Mg daily and for the last 6 months I take 40Mg daily, Now my doc and me feel that they are starting to lose their potency and rather than increase them again we have decided to try another drug. First he put me on Paxil, as soon as I started taking it I got the feeling that I had a lump or something else stuck in my throat, also the back of my mouth felt a burning sensation, I’d get this for about five hours after taking the drug then it would pass. I told him I could do without side effects like that, thank you. Next he put me on Efexor XL, I came home and started browsing on here and the web, some of what I read you would not believe, so, it was in the bin for the Efexor. Back to my trusty old Prozac, Now this morning, he say’s what would you like to try today (sarcastic sod) he’s brilliant really. He say’s this time I should give either Luxor or Zoloft a go and to let him know tomorrow which one I would like. (meaning of course, after I have done my research on here) So there you have it, which one do you  think is the best.. ( I told my doc, that if he doesn’t get it right this time to just give me a signed prescription book and I will sort myself out.) :) I look forward to your replies Oh yes!!!!! before I forget, do you know that the doc’s in the UK cannot give welbrutin for depression or as an additional drug with an SSRI. It’s only licensed here for something to do with giving up smoking (weird isn’t it) Also that Efexor*-XL MP/SR is not available in the states,(not licensed) although they reckon the half-life of this new brand of Efexor is almost tenfold that of the regular Efexor thus combating withdrawal effects, I still not going to take them though.:) Smurf

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Lamictal

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Worn_Out,  you seem to be feeling a little better, are you?  hopefully  

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I am doing better.  My wife says I am talking more & I have started kidding with my 24 year old daughter, again.  I think the tofranil is helping & I am on my third week on testosterone injections. I have decided that bi-polar disorder is forever.  I woke up this morning in very bad shape, but have gotten over it.  Somehow we must all manage to survive because the bad times come and go and if things are bad now, they WILL get better. Thanks Worn_Out,  you seem to be feeling a little better, are you? hopefully

Before you buy.

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What % of manic depressives commit suicide?

I have heard that one in five commit suicide, but I wouldn’t swear by it. I hope you find a treatment that works for you. The future brings us the hope of new drugs and new treatments. Web Page at: www.robertpo.com For email replies remove the ****

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What % of manic depressives commit suicide? I have heard that one in five commit suicide, but I wouldn’t swear by it. I hope you find a treatment that works for you. The future brings us the hope of new drugs and new treatments. Web Page at: www.robertpo.com For email replies remove the ****

I’ve seen studies that showed that 1 in 5 bipolars who refused treatment committed suicide. But…these were bipolars sick enough that they had been hospitalized, that’s where they were found for the study. Also, it stands to reason that those who refuse treatment are sicker with more personality problems than average. Also, these were people who were hospitalized in public hospitals, which again indicates that they were sicker…someone in a private hospital probably has been able to work until recently, and hasn’t alienated or shoved away family and friends yet. Still, taking your meds and working with your doctor is the best way to keep from getting worse…and worse can be very, very bad.

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Paxil worked for me. Not to high though-Reached an even – level of comfort. It sounds like you have to find a MD (preferably, a psychopharmacologist) who knows how to mix different combinations of drugs. Don’t lose hope, though.  If you do you start asking questions about suicide, and you might have to live it all again in the next life.  At this point, paying for drugs is a bigger problem for the long haul than taking them.  Any advice? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After 13 years with BiPolar Disorder I have yet to find effective treatment for its depression. What is the most effective treatment for BiPolar Depression? What % of manic depressives commit suicide? Before you buy.

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At this point, paying for drugs is a bigger problem for the long haul than taking them.  Any advice?

I have been started on Tofranil/Imipramine and my pharmacy dispensed it in its generic form.  Instead of paying a copay of $7.00 for the name brand I pay $2.00 for the generic.  The book, "The Essential Guide to Psychiatric Drugs", shows that the name brand would be $.62/pill and the generic would be $.05/pill (the book was published in 1990). If this is still true, a great deal can be saved by buying generic, if possible. The book, "The Essential Guide to Psychiatric Drugs", by Jack M. Gorman, MD. is the best help in this area that I have found.  If you can find a recent edition, I highly reccomend it. Good luck! Before you buy.

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Drop trou Nihil  You know you get a spanking for saying bad stuff like that. Bend over,  ten whacks with the leather strap. 1   *[SMACK]*      ( oouch) 2   *[WACK]*         (stop) 3   *[CRACK]*        ( I take it back,  please stop) Let those warm yer buns a while,  I’ll fix you a few fresh ones in a bit. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – x-no-archive: yes After 13 years with BiPolar Disorder I have yet to find effective treatment for its depression. What is the most effective treatment for BiPolar Depression? Personally, I think that Doctor Kevorkian, whom I consider to be a Saint, has the best treatment.

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Everyone is different.  Tell me what you’ve tried, kay?  Also, let me know what your additional symptoms are, etc.  Have you had partial relief with certain drugs? There may be treatments that are better for BPI and treatments that are better for BPII.  A lot of people take different drug cocktails, as I’m sure you know.  A friend of mine is on lithium AND neurontin, among other things. I’ve been on lots of diff. stuff simultaneously: buspar, trazodone, klonopin, prozac, lithium, depakote, and neurontin are the bulk of the things I’ve been on.  Are you taking an antidepressant and a mood stabilizer? -bpkittycat – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After 13 years with BiPolar Disorder I have yet to find effective treatment for its depression. What is the most effective treatment for BiPolar Depression? What % of manic depressives commit suicide? Before you buy.

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I am now on Tofranil and Lithobid. I have had about 35 ECT treatments (unilateral and bilateral). I have been on: Xanax Elavil Dexedrine Anafranil Welbutrin Buspar Tegretol Librium Valium Effexor Prozac Tofranil Librium Eskalith Ritalin Nardil Serzone Pamelor Parnate Paxil Prozac Risperdal Zoloft Xanax Thyroid Hormone Testosterone I appreciate your interest. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Everyone is different.  Tell me what you’ve tried, kay?  Also, let me know what your additional symptoms are, etc.  Have you had partial relief with certain drugs? There may be treatments that are better for BPI and treatments that are better for BPII.  A lot of people take different drug cocktails, as I’m sure you know.  A friend of mine is on lithium AND neurontin, among other things. I’ve been on lots of diff. stuff simultaneously: buspar, trazodone, klonopin, prozac, lithium, depakote, and neurontin are the bulk of the things I’ve been on.  Are you taking an antidepressant and a mood stabilizer? -bpkittycat

Before you buy.

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Worn Out- I can see why you are frustrated I’ve forgotten what Tofranil is for.  Antipsychotic?  Antidepressant?  MAOI or Tricyclic? What symptoms do you have the most trouble with?  I seem to be depressed a lot, and have had depression for most of my life, and "only" a few major manic episodes.  I suffer from migraines as well, and hope that the neurontin that I’ve just started will help in preventing the attacks (mania and migraine). I am wondering what you have tried and what you know about diet and how it affects mood.  I would suggest, if you are not already doing so, to severely cut down on all carbohydrates, have lots of protein, and consume 3T of flax seed oil every day.  Always use olive oil when you can, too (like in salad dressings, for dipping bread in, etc.). These new drugs for seizures are supposed to work for many treatment-resistant patients.  check out the Neurontin facts posted earlier today if you haven’t already. Good luck, and I hope you get some good advice and new ideas from others… -bpkittycat – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am now on Tofranil and Lithobid. I have had about 35 ECT treatments (unilateral and bilateral). I have been on: Xanax Elavil Dexedrine Anafranil Welbutrin Buspar Tegretol Librium Valium Effexor Prozac Tofranil Librium Eskalith Ritalin Nardil Serzone Pamelor Parnate Paxil Prozac Risperdal Zoloft Xanax Thyroid Hormone Testosterone I appreciate your interest. Everyone is different.  Tell me what you’ve tried, kay?  Also, let me know what your additional symptoms are, etc.  Have you had partial relief with certain drugs? There may be treatments that are better for BPI and treatments that are better for BPII.  A lot of people take different drug cocktails, as I’m sure you know.  A friend of mine is on lithium AND neurontin, among other things. I’ve been on lots of diff. stuff simultaneously: buspar, trazodone, klonopin, prozac, lithium, depakote, and neurontin are the bulk of the things I’ve been on.  Are you taking an antidepressant and a mood stabilizer? -bpkittycat Before you buy.

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After 13 years with BiPolar Disorder I have yet to find effective treatment for its depression. What is the most effective treatment for BiPolar Depression? What % of manic depressives commit suicide? Before you buy.

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re: question #1: that’s the question, all right re: question #2: between 15 & 20% (some confusion, apparently, about whether this means *all* people with bipolar or just the untreated ones). What about the undiagnosed ones, then? I interpolate all this to indicate that the figure refers to all bipolars. — Deep – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After 13 years with BiPolar Disorder I have yet to find effective treatment for its depression. What is the most effective treatment for BiPolar Depression? What % of manic depressives commit suicide? Before you buy.

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: After 13 years with BiPolar Disorder I have yet to find effective : treatment for its depression. : : What is the most effective treatment for BiPolar Depression?    There is no most effective treatment, it varies with the    circumstances and individual.  Passage of time usually    brings with it some relief of symptoms. : : What % of manic depressives commit suicide?   It is higher for untreated sufferers……15-20% if I recall   correctly.   nm : : : Before you buy. :

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have used valerian, esp. before I finally broke down, admitted I had a mood disorder, and was put on depakote, then lamictal (another mood stabilizer with fewer side effects — for me — than the depakote).  The valerian made me sleepy consistently, and I felt physically tired and mentally vague, which perhaps mitigated my mood disorder by making me too sleepy to notice how depressed I was.  It didn’t do anything when I was manic, however.  The mania was far stronger than the relatively mild effects of the valerian (I never took a high dose of it).  On the other hand, I’ve never tried it with effexor or wellbutrin, both of which I now take and both of which are fairly activating so I suppose they would offset the dullness factor.  I see no reason why you shouldn’t try it if your pdoc won’t give you a mood stabilizer and you feel you need one.  Why won’t your pdoc give you one?  or an anti-psychotic?  Does he/she not trust your reporting of symptoms that would indicate a need for them?  Maybe you just need a new, and hopefully better-informed, pdoc.  I’ve had five pdocs since beginning medication and not one of them has ever had any problems with prescribing anti-convulsants as mood stabilizers.  What about lithium?  No question that it’s a mood stabilizer, and nothing else.  Don’t overdose on the valerian, though. Start low and see how it goes.  But if I were in your place I’d find another pdoc. Let us know how it goes for you.  Luck. –Allegra

Thanks for the info Allegra… I was thinking of trying Valerian… since my pdoc thinks that i don’t need any kind of medicataion im kinda on my own… wanted to see if ti would help. Tried a veyr low dose for sleep, but it din’t have any effect – wonder if a much larger one would help… Don’t know about Jame’s pdoc, but mine says that there’s nothing biochemically wrong with me… so theres nothing for a pill to fix… how’s that? a pdoc who DOESN’T want to shove medication down your throat!!! last year I wouild have been thinking WOW, but now i’m not so sure… i mean, this guy saw me on Tuesday when i was about readuy to cut my wrists, and told me that my issues would deal with themselves gfiven time! — Kaji/Karenji – dragon/human Shifter depending on mood… *New Dragon Code COMING (one blue moon or another) *ICQ 55339701 – feel free to message me to chat *http://www.labyrinth.net.au/~gsj/Index.html *Wingsister to Viriatha, Tanith, Hespa and Caitlin/Amberynth *Lover of Chocolate, and Occasional Giver of Chocolate Points *Self-Appointed Guardian of the Southern Spring *Keeper of the Sunnydale Lost and Found

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Hey folks: Well, since my pdoc won’t give me some good mood stabalizers or low dose antopsychotic, I am gonna try my 150mg Effexor XR, with a benzo, and Vallerian Root which I HOPE acts in SOME kind of mood stabalizing way. Ya, I know…far from being anything "medically" correct, but it’s much better than the previous cocktail of benzos and codiene I was taking. One thing I noticed with Effexor though is that it can really mess up your memory and alertness all day long. What I may try and do is beg, beg, beg my family doc to take on my psch meds for now, and ask to give a shot at another mood stabalizer or antipsychotic with Effexor or Welbutrin. My family doc was much more enthusiastic about using a mood stabalizer, he started me on depakote, than using benzos. The pdocs don’t seem to want to use ANYTHING not stricly "labled", as I see there is that whole controversy over using different meds for bp. (I guess even if the anticonvulsants are officially "labled" for use in bp, many pdocs still won’t use them.) Yes, there must be a bit of caution in mix and match pharmacy, but we are only here for a limited time, and I want to live as healthy, happy life like everybody does. I think even pdocs (some..not all) don’t realize how painful a mental disorder is. Yes, it’s "different" than physical pain, put the intensity is just as bad. James

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I have used valerian, esp. before I finally broke down, admitted I had a mood disorder, and was put on depakote, then lamictal (another mood stabilizer with fewer side effects — for me — than the depakote).  The valerian made me sleepy consistently, and I felt physically tired and mentally vague, which perhaps mitigated my mood disorder by making me too sleepy to notice how depressed I was.  It didn’t do anything when I was manic, however.  The mania was far stronger than the relatively mild effects of the valerian (I never took a high dose of it).  On the other hand, I’ve never tried it with effexor or wellbutrin, both of which I now take and both of which are fairly activating so I suppose they would offset the dullness factor.  I see no reason why you shouldn’t try it if your pdoc won’t give you a mood stabilizer and you feel you need one.  Why won’t your pdoc give you one?  or an anti-psychotic?  Does he/she not trust your reporting of symptoms that would indicate a need for them?  Maybe you just need a new, and hopefully better-informed, pdoc.  I’ve had five pdocs since beginning medication and not one of them has ever had any problems with prescribing anti-convulsants as mood stabilizers.  What about lithium?  No question that it’s a mood stabilizer, and nothing else.  Don’t overdose on the valerian, though. Start low and see how it goes.  But if I were in your place I’d find another pdoc. Let us know how it goes for you.  Luck. –Allegra

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey folks: Well, since my pdoc won’t give me some good mood stabalizers or low dose antopsychotic, I am gonna try my 150mg Effexor XR, with a benzo, and Vallerian Root which I HOPE acts in SOME kind of mood stabalizing way. Ya, I know…far from being anything "medically" correct, but it’s much better than the previous cocktail of benzos and codiene I was taking. One thing I noticed with Effexor though is that it can really mess up your memory and alertness all day long. What I may try and do is beg, beg, beg my family doc to take on my psch meds for now, and ask to give a shot at another mood stabalizer or antipsychotic with Effexor or Welbutrin. My family doc was much more enthusiastic about using a mood stabalizer, he started me on depakote, than using benzos. The pdocs don’t seem to want to use ANYTHING not stricly "labled", as I see there is that whole controversy over using different meds for bp. (I guess even if the anticonvulsants are officially "labled" for use in bp, many pdocs still won’t use them.) Yes, there must be a bit of caution in mix and match pharmacy, but we are only here for a limited time, and I want to live as healthy, happy life like everybody does. I think even pdocs (some..not all) don’t realize how painful a mental disorder is. Yes, it’s "different" than physical pain, put the intensity is just as bad. James

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Hi this is Ray  from  Mississippi I too just found out about depression and really ned to vent a little.  as well as I have some questions….

Edward from Florida says …. A real good place to start is Dr Ivan Goldberg’s Depression Central:   http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.html Edward Reid

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Hi Ray I saw your post and wanted to let you know you are reaching me hey it does not matter how old you are to get your life in order hope that you get yourself together and do what is right for you no matter what anyone else thinks take care and good luck

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PLEASE don’t give up on all mood stabilizers! If your diagnosis is correct, an anti-depressant alone could trigger a manic episode.  I too was left dazed and confused by lithium and others. My work as an engineer requires alot of mental concentration and use of math and sciences…stuff I had taken for granted had become increasingly difficult, even the simplest tasks!  I now take Lamictal (300mg) and Effexor(75mg) with Klonepin(.5mg) for sleep.  Welbutrin made me near-anorexic (the very smell of food made me gag) and the closest to suicidal that I have ever been!  I literally had to beg my pdoc to switch me back to Effexor…he kept increasing Welbutrin despite my insistance that it was not working for me…because, he said, it is a "very good" drug.  Well, there are no good drugs/ bad drugs, just ones that work better or worse for an individual!  Too often pdocs loose site of the patient sitting before them. Good luck with whatever you decide, but I’d consider Lamictal if you haven’t already tried it. Desiree’

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Welcome…..feel free to talk away. CJ<telescope down

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Amy, Thanks!  Wonder if that means I’m addicted to the ole B/F  . . .   I’m going to look up that book.   (o: — Kath From here on my branch I can choose to plunge or soar. I think I shall sit a while longer. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There’s a book called "the Craving Brain" (I think, I have a Poor Memory Brain) that explores different activities and how they affect chemicals in the brain.  <snip

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Hey there! Today I decided I wasn’t going to be a victim anymore and feel bad anymore from meds so I could keep a job and have no excuses for excessive absences.  I think I have been misdiagnosed as BPII.  I think I suffer from chronic depression and anxiety just like everyone else in my immediate and extended family. Right now I am depressed, but anyone would be after losing their job AGAIN and this time out of the blue after buying a 2 unit house.  That kind of depression there are no pills for you just get through it and move on. I have stopped taking my tegretol, but keeping my klonopin and periactin so I can sleep at night for now. Seeing my pdoc tomorrow, telling her about my decision and asking for her support to manage my anxiety and sleeping.  I also want her to think about what anit-depressant I may need to use in the future.  Wellbutrin sounds good especially since I have had such a lack of energy and brain power since I’ve been on mood stabilizers.  I hate them because they slowed my brain down and I couldn’t think or do complex tasks or remember anything.  I couldn’t do math or find words or spell.  I used to be so with it.   I hope now I can get better, think better, work better, love better and live better.  I am going to enjoy life!!!!!!  I am going to feel happy for the first time in 8 years. Wish me luck! Lisa – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Kathy, Sounds encouraging! I started on Wellbutrin about a week ago (oops, that reminds me:  I forgot to take my pill this am . . . brb . . . ah, that’s better) at a dose of 2×100mg/day and I’m already feeling somewhat better.  My understanding is that it increases Dopamine levels in the brain. Which leads me to a question for our resident experts: I felt much less depressed this past weekend when I was spending time with my boyfriend.  I find spending time with him enjoyable.  Does enjoyment also increase dopamine levels? I have been meaning to look this up on the net, but haven’t managed to do so yet.  Thanks for your assistance in the meantime. — Kath From here on my branch I can choose to plunge or soar. I think I shall sit a while longer. Well I went to my new pdoc appt. yesterday.  She seems pretty cool. Uses humor alot.  I like that.  Also a little cautious.  She really didn’t want to change anything until she received records from my previous pdoc and my primary care provider.  She did mention about putting me on Wellbutrin.  She said Wellbutrin provides "energy" in her patients and lifts that depression right up".  Well something like that.  Right now since the Zoloft isn’t working she is weening me off of it.  I see her in another two weeks. Well that’s it for now.  Wish I had more to write to all of you.  Love to you all! Kathy

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Hi Ray,       welcome,there’s some good advice here. I’m 51 still don’t have my shit together.                                           Take Care                                                     Caddy

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Welcome Ray from mississippi    I was off of work for 8 weeks late last year,  I dont know what your suspended means?  Is it a leave of absence?  I need more info to answer this better.    Welcome again you will find this group helpful maybe you just posted before on a bad day ..always, Treacha ..as the twig bends…so the tree grows…

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You go girl. Lisa, mom of FF. "Fear can hold you prisoner, hope can set you free." The Shawshank Redemption

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Ray Wilson wrote : Hi this is Ray  from  Mississippi well  dont think i got a responce from my last post  and I would like verry much to join this newsgroup….  I just dont know if you’all see what Im posting  today is the 27th at 5:00  pm   exactly

I see ya, loud and clear, welcome. I too just found out about depression and really ned to vent a little.

YOu are in the right place. < as well as I have some questions….  My job suspended me from work… I’m in my 3rd week..  I cant help but think this is a setp takeing by them to get rid of me ???  Do I have any rights ???  what about the pills I’m on.. anyone have enough experance to tell me about them a little???

Well, I’ll leave all that to the others who are knowledgeable. <  God I feel so lost and alone  almost too embarrased to tell anyone..  I havent even year I guess I feel I should have my shit togeather by now and dont

Well, you know what my mama used to tell me? " Honey, it’s not a sin to get lice, it’s a sin to keep it."  You are headed in the right direction. <…. I reall would like to hear from anyone  just seeing this note  so that i know its going out….   well Im not a big talker  just dont want to spill my guts and find out latter that nobody heard me (again).  this is really new to me….  thanks in advance  - Ray

That’s my story, and I’m stickin’ to it.  Lisa, mom of FF. — "Fear can hold you prisoner, hope can set you free." The Shawshank Redemption snipped all underneath.

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Hi this is Ray  from  Mississippi well  dont think i got a responce from my last post  and I would like verry much to join this newsgroup….  I just dont know if you’all see what Im posting  today is the 27th at 5:00  pm   exactly I too just found out about depression and really ned to vent a little.  as well as I have some questions….  My job suspended me from work… I’m in my 3rd week..  I cant help but think this is a setp takeing by them to get rid of me ???  Do I have any rights ???  what about the pills I’m on.. anyone have enough experance to tell me about them a little???  God I feel so lost and alone  almost too embarrased to tell anyone..  I havent even year I guess I feel I should have my shit togeather by now and dont…. I reall would like to hear from anyone  just seeing this note  so that i know its going out….   well Im not a big talker  just dont want to spill my guts and find out latter that nobody heard me (again).  this is really new to me….  thanks in advance  - Ray – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well I went to my new pdoc appt. yesterday.  She seems pretty cool. Uses humor alot.  I like that.  Also a little cautious.  She really didn’t want to change anything until she received records from my previous pdoc and my primary care provider.  She did mention about putting me on Wellbutrin.  She said Wellbutrin provides "energy" in her patients and lifts that depression right up".  Well something like that.  Right now since the Zoloft isn’t working she is weening me off of it.  I see her in another two weeks. Well that’s it for now.  Wish I had more to write to all of you.  Love to you all! Kathy

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Hello Ray, welcome to the group. (so obviously I see your post ) A lot of people here know a great deal about your rights and about meds, but I think you’ll have to be a bit more specific. What kind of pills are you taking? Sounds like you were recently diagnosed.  This really is the right place to come for information and for support.  Sometimes it just takes a while-there’s SO many posts…… Hang in there and take care, Amy Hi this is Ray  from  Mississippi well  dont think i got a responce from my last post  and I would like verry much to join this newsgroup….  I just dont know if you’all see what Im posting  today is the 27th at 5:00  pm   exactly

snip ….   well Im not a big talker  just dont want to spill my – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -guts and find out latter that nobody heard me (again).  this is really new to me….  thanks in advance  - Ray

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 Yes, you do have job rights. As a first step, check (or better yet, have a friend at work check if you can) what the standard company policy is for sick leave for any illness. For example, you may have 3 months to get back to your existing job, 6 months to get back to an "equivalent" job. It doesn’t matter what the illness is, so your friend doesn’t have to specify he/she is asking on your behalf or about your illness. If your company doesn’t have a written policy (but I bet they do), then you may have to do some further searching for an answer. But, start with the simple question first.  Also, you said "suspended," but I am assuming extended sick leave. Is that what you mean? Hope this helps – I’ve been through this, too, as have a lot of people in this group. Sally – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi this is Ray  from  Mississippi ….  My job suspended me from work… I’m in my 3rd week..  I cant help but think this is a setp takeing by them to get rid of me ???  Do I have any rights ?

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Ray,     1) Be sure to tell your doctor you think they are setting you up at work.     2) Be sure to read the NAMI (National Alliance for the Mentally Ill) homepage (www.NAMI.org ) Read the part about the Americans with Disabilities Act and "reasonable accomodations", in case this applies to your situation.     Good luck and welcome to the newsgroup. — walleye – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi this is Ray  from  Mississippi well  dont think i got a responce from my last post  and I would like verry much to join this newsgroup….  I just dont know if you’all see what Im posting  today is the 27th at 5:00  pm   exactly I too just found out about depression and really ned to vent a little.  as well as I have some questions….  My job suspended me from work… I’m in my 3rd week..  I cant help but think this is a setp takeing by them to get rid of me ???  Do I have any rights ???  what about the pills I’m on.. anyone have enough experance to tell me about them a little???  God I feel so lost and alone  almost too embarrased to tell anyone..  I havent even year I guess I feel I should have my shit togeather by now and dont…. I reall would like to hear from anyone  just seeing this note  so that i know its going out….   well Im not a big talker  just dont want to spill my guts and find out latter that nobody heard me (again).  this is really new to me….  thanks in advance  - Ray Well I went to my new pdoc appt. yesterday.  She seems pretty cool. Uses humor alot.  I like that.  Also a little cautious.  She really didn’t want to change anything until she received records from my previous pdoc and my primary care provider.  She did mention about putting me on Wellbutrin.  She said Wellbutrin provides "energy" in her patients and lifts that depression right up".  Well something like that.  Right now since the Zoloft isn’t working she is weening me off of it.  I see her in another two weeks. Well that’s it for now.  Wish I had more to write to all of you.  Love to you all! Kathy

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Got your post.  Welcome.  This is a great group. Kathy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi this is Ray  from  Mississippi well  dont think i got a responce from my last post  and I would like verry much to join this newsgroup….  I just dont know if you’all see what Im posting  today is the 27th at 5:00  pm   exactly I too just found out about depression and really ned to vent a little.  as well as I have some questions….  My job suspended me from work… I’m in my 3rd week..  I cant help but think this is a setp takeing by them to get rid of me ???  Do I have any rights ???  what about the pills I’m on.. anyone have enough experance to tell me about them a little???  God I feel so lost and alone  almost too embarrased to tell anyone..  I havent even year I guess I feel I should have my shit togeather by now and dont…. I reall would like to hear from anyone  just seeing this note  so that i know its going out….   well Im not a big talker  just dont want to spill my guts and find out latter that nobody heard me (again).  this is really new to me….  thanks in advance  - Ray Well I went to my new pdoc appt. yesterday.  She seems pretty cool. Uses humor alot.  I like that.  Also a little cautious.  She really didn’t want to change anything until she received records from my previous pdoc and my primary care provider.  She did mention about putting me on Wellbutrin.  She said Wellbutrin provides "energy" in her patients and lifts that depression right up".  Well something like that.  Right now since the Zoloft isn’t working she is weening me off of it.  I see her in another two weeks. Well that’s it for now.  Wish I had more to write to all of you.  Love to you all! Kathy

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Well I went to my new pdoc appt. yesterday.  She seems pretty cool. Uses humor alot.  I like that.  Also a little cautious.  She really didn’t want to change anything until she received records from my previous pdoc and my primary care provider.  She did mention about putting me on Wellbutrin.  She said Wellbutrin provides "energy" in her patients and lifts that depression right up".  Well something like that.  Right now since the Zoloft isn’t working she is weening me off of it.  I see her in another two weeks. Well that’s it for now.  Wish I had more to write to all of you.  Love to you all! Kathy

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Kathy,  I hope it works out for you.    Lisa, mom of FF. — "Fear can hold you prisoner, hope can set you free." The Shawshank Redemption – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well I went to my new pdoc appt. yesterday.  She seems pretty cool. Uses humor alot.  I like that.  Also a little cautious.  She really didn’t want to change anything until she received records from my previous pdoc and my primary care provider.  She did mention about putting me on Wellbutrin.  She said Wellbutrin provides "energy" in her patients and lifts that depression right up".  Well something like that.  Right now since the Zoloft isn’t working she is weening me off of it.  I see her in another two weeks. Well that’s it for now.  Wish I had more to write to all of you.  Love to you all! Kathy

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Kathy, Sounds encouraging! I started on Wellbutrin about a week ago (oops, that reminds me:  I forgot to take my pill this am . . . brb . . . ah, that’s better) at a dose of 2×100mg/day and I’m already feeling somewhat better.  My understanding is that it increases Dopamine levels in the brain.   Which leads me to a question for our resident experts: I felt much less depressed this past weekend when I was spending time with my boyfriend.  I find spending time with him enjoyable.  Does enjoyment also increase dopamine levels? I have been meaning to look this up on the net, but haven’t managed to do so yet.  Thanks for your assistance in the meantime. — Kath From here on my branch I can choose to plunge or soar. I think I shall sit a while longer. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well I went to my new pdoc appt. yesterday.  She seems pretty cool. Uses humor alot.  I like that.  Also a little cautious.  She really didn’t want to change anything until she received records from my previous pdoc and my primary care provider.  She did mention about putting me on Wellbutrin.  She said Wellbutrin provides "energy" in her patients and lifts that depression right up".  Well something like that.  Right now since the Zoloft isn’t working she is weening me off of it.  I see her in another two weeks. Well that’s it for now.  Wish I had more to write to all of you.  Love to you all! Kathy

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There’s a book called "the Craving Brain" (I think, I have a Poor Memory Brain) that explores different activities and how they affect chemicals in the brain.  Most of it is about addictions, but there were parts on how being with people helps (and why-chemically) and how even altruistic behavior can have an effect on ….o heck, I WAS doing good there.  It is either dopamine or seratonin.  But both are "feel good" ones, right? Take care, Amy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Kathy, Sounds encouraging! I started on Wellbutrin about a week ago (oops, that reminds me:  I forgot to take my pill this am . . . brb . . . ah, that’s better) at a dose of 2×100mg/day and I’m already feeling somewhat better.  My understanding is that it increases Dopamine levels in the brain. Which leads me to a question for our resident experts: I felt much less depressed this past weekend when I was spending time with my boyfriend.  I find spending time with him enjoyable.  Does enjoyment also increase dopamine levels? I have been meaning to look this up on the net, but haven’t managed to do so yet.  Thanks for your assistance in the meantime. — Kath From here on my branch I can choose to plunge or soar. I think I shall sit a while longer.

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